Shame On You All

[drdon326]

A heavily pregnant Israeli woman and her four innocent little daughters were murdered by Palestinian gunmen, each one of them shot dead in cold blood, killed by a bullet through the head.

What happened, gentleman - not gruesome enough for you to speak out?

Where were you Mr. Annan? Never a slow mover when it comes to quoting your usual "malignant metaphor" of asking for both sides to end the cycle of violence, especially if, G-d forbid, just one demonic stone-throwing Palestinian child in Jenin has been accidentally killed by Israeli soldiers. This usually brings you racing out of the rotting woodwork of the United Nations building faster than five Palestinian bullets could kill four little Israeli girls and their pregnant mother.

Where were you Mr. Patten? Still too busy looking through reports of Palestinian spending, conveniently finding no sign of monies being diverted for terrorism. Yet, you never demanded to know how such a degree of poverty, recently compared to sub Saharan Africa, allowed two youths to have guns and bullets to kill four little Israeli girls and their pregnant mother.

snip

Not one of you has, or had, the moral conscience to come out and condemn this horrendous and despicable act. It was carried out by people trained and heavily brainwashed in barbarism. The same people that you think deserve millions of dollars in aid and their own state.

These five people died a senseless and horrendous death. Four little girls had to watch their mother callously murdered before these same dehumanized ghouls turned their bullets on these petrified and innocent little girls. Not a single word of horror or condemnation came out of any of your biased and bigoted mouths.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com/article.php3?id=3657
...................................................................

speaks for me.

[CharlesGroce]

1. There are murdering criminals...

and there are murdering armies. We have jails for criminals, and apparently in this case propaganda for armies.

Whomever shall kill a child is despicable, or a mother, or anybody, but this neither nullifies nor defeats the debate that the Israeli occupation constitutes a breach of international laws and that subjugating a PEOPLE to prison with that wall is a war crime.

They are different debates. One doesn't cancel the legitimacy of the other.

[Gimel]

13. So a fence

to save the lives of women and children is not acceptable to you, despite the promising introduction? Mass murder is acceptable if carried out by a minor? Or a woman with children?

[Classical_Liberal]

20. The women and children should be moved back to Israel

that would make them much safer than a fence where it doesn't belong.

[Gimel]

55. Housekeeping

I suppose the groups that claimed responsibility are proud of their actions. Cleaning out those Jews from their areas is top priority. Don't wait around for Ariel Sharon to remove all settlements. Take the initiate and clean them out. Murder is the fastest way, they're only rodents, after all. All the more for glory to Allah!
</sarcasm-in case anyone is in doubt>

[Violet_Crumble]

58. What did that have to do with the post you were replying to?

It's certainly not the view of any regular in this forum. Is there some reason you couldn't address the point CL made? Y'know, pointing out that the settlements should be dismantled and settlers sent packing back to Israel doesn't equate to what you posted. You do understand that these settlements aren't just some benign neighbourhoods trying to live peaceably amongst their 'neighbours'. This has been explained to you many times, but they're all illegal under international law. If the govt of Israel cared more for the safety of Israeli citizens than about grabbing land, it'd dismantle the settlements and move all the settlers to Israel, instead of encouraging illegal settlement activity in occupied territory and pursuing such racist things as bypass roads only for Israelis and settlements only for Israelis, the protection of Israeli law for the settlers, while inflicting military law on the Palestinians who have the misfortune to live in what some lunatic extremists claim is part of Eretz Israel...

Violet...

[Gimel]

65. Everything

They want to "clean out the Jews".

I am of an opposing viewpoint. Perhaps you could recognize that. There are legitimate differences in definitions.

[Classical_Liberal]

61. 46 % of Israelis support transfer of muslims from the west bank

60% from Israel proper. There is alot of this thinking on both sides.

As for the Palestinian part of it, Sharon has never expressed a desire or inclination to get them out of the west bank, or to let them be Palestinian citizens.

TRANSFER MEANS PEACE

by Boris Shusteff

The verdict is in. An unprecedented majority of Israelis supports transfer for the purpose of achieving peace between the Arabs and the Jews. In case you missed them, let us briefly recapture the highlights of the events that must inevitably bring us to this conclusion. Polls conducted in February 2002 in Israel demonstrated that 46% of respondents supported the transfer of Arabs from Judea, Samaria and Gaza while 60% were inclined towards the transfer of Arabs from Israel proper.

http://www.freeman.org/m_online/dec03/shusteff1.htm

[Gimel]

66. Not hard to guess

After 250 suicide - homicide attacks on Israeli citizens, and hundreds more prevented. However, this poll was conducted by telephone (from what has been posted before) and prior to the fence/wall construction. Israel's are willing to let Palestinians have their homeland, but not at the expense of Jewish lives and Jewish culture.

[Classical_Liberal]

68. The Palestinians feel the way the do, because Israel has never

allowed them to have a real homeland, not even during peace.

[Gimel]

71. Got any more

tall tales?

[Classical_Liberal]

72. Not following

There was peace through out the 90s and the settlements only expanded.

[Gimel]

73. Shouldn't matter

Israel has more than 20% Muslims. What's the big deal?

[liberalhistorian]

74. But the destruction of Palestinian

lives and culture is perfectly okay, then? Okay, got it now.:eyes: :eyes: :eyes:

[liberalhistorian]

63. Well, that appears to be the attitude

that far too many Israelis have toward the muslims and palestinians who are IN THEIR OWN LAND AND have as much right to be there as the Israelis claim THEY do! And they don't even realize just how hypocritical that is, considering their own suffering for the past two millenia at the hands of those who made the same statements about them that they make about the palestinians and arabs in general.

And when you have a major influential Israeli rabbi claiming that Jewish lives are more important than non-Jewish lives, and that it's acceptable to kill non-Jews in order to save even one Jew, and when you have far too many Israelis agreeing with him, what else are we supposed to think?

The oppressed are becoming the oppressors, and they either don't even realize it or, even worse, they don't care. And as one who's more than familiar with the details of Jewish history, that is beyond depressing.

[CharlesGroce]

2. and OH

the tone of that author. What a prick.

[sundancekid]

3. unfounded generalizations are applicable to noone ... get it?

[PragMantisT]

4. These five people died a senseless and horrendous death.

Thousands upon thousands, both israeli and palestinian have died. Old and young. Innocent and guilty.

Can it stop with these five now?

Only those involved can do that. Not Mr.'s Annan, Straw, Solana, or Patten. You do something about it! Stop expecting someone to help and then ignoring them.

[CharlesGroce]

5. "just one demonic stone-throwing Palestinian child in Jenin"

Palestinian children are demonic, but Israeli children are innocent and little. Sounds like SOMEBODY put their BIGOT-ASSHOLE pants on this morning.

Oh it's always nice to come here and get a taste now and again, to sample the the freshest propoganda available is indeed an invigorating experience.

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[liberalhistorian]

28. Thank you, I was just about

to point out the horrendous hypocritical racism of that statement myself.

And we all know that stones are equal to guns, too, don't we?:eyes: :eyes:

[Classical_Liberal]

6. bias and bigotry

In fact Annan did denounce it. Now, given the fact that your posts are always used to prove that Palestinians are too inhumane to have a country and nobody who advocates for their rights makes the same claim about Israelis when some of them do monstrous things, just spare me the outrage. The fact is anyone who made the same claim about Israelis is immediately tombstoned. You on the other hand are still here.

[minkyboodle]

10. yep

seems to be the law of the land unfortunately.

[primavera]

7. Sure, but how do you plan to stop it?

Retaliate with greater violence? That's a cyclical strategy: violence begets violence and will continue to do so until somebody decides to step off the merry-go-round. If atrocity A serves as your justification for commiting atrocity B, then B will just as surely be used as the justification for atrocity C. After a million exchanged atrocities, who even remembers anymore who committed the first one? And what would it matter anymore anyway? So I've committed 500,000 atrocities and you've only comitted 499,999; does that give you the moral justification to commit one more to achieve parity? Or two more to achieve parity plus punative retribution? Don't you see, taking a tit for tat approach of who's done what to whom becomes morally meaningless after a while and, more importantly, it becomes an inescapable cycle of violence. The only hope for putting an end to it is to stop trying to resolve violence with more violence and start taking a look at the root causes underlying the conflict and start trying to resolve those; don't just try to cure the symptoms, but the disease itself.

[sushi]

12. Exactly my view.

:thumbsup:

[tinnypriv]

8. "speaks for me"

Then you're in the company of an idiot.

EU condemns the killing of Israeli family - http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1083561530143

[newyorican]

9. Now you've done it...

gone and killed the thread...

[Djinn]

11. Apart from this article being crap

and factually wrong - I can't remember the last time the good doctor condemned the killing of Palestinians - I remember being told firing into crowds was "arousing" I remember when kids get shot getting told that they "shouldn't have been there" - maybe I'm getting fuzzy in my old age

[Vladimir]

14. Thank you!!

I spent a while looking for that info yesterday but couldn't find it...

[drdon326]

15. **yawn**

"The killing of children does not serve any legitimate cause and degrades any purpose which it purports to advance," said Irish Foreign Minister Brian Cowen, speaking for the 25-nation bloc."

some pathetic denounciation...."does not serve any legitimate cause"

not that its inhuman.
not that its barbaric.
not that its immoral.

just doesn't serve the interests.

Now Solana really stepped up to the plate with this...

"I condemn in the strongest terms the heinous attack perpetrated yesterday in the Gaza Strip against innocent civilians ... targeting a woman and her children, it was particularly despicable," said Javier Solana, the EU's foreign policy representative."

I hope he didnt strain himself ....but fortunately i'm sure he was
able to forget about it quickly.

Maybe he might be more useful if he examined just how much EU
money bought weapons for the terrorists.

looks like the company of idiots is getting bigger.

[Blayde Starrfyre]

21. Give it up, Doc

Please. This desperate attempt at justification is no different than Bush's shifting explanation for the Iraq war. "It's WMD's! Oops, that's wrong. It's terrorism! Wrong too. It's liberation!" This is a clear-cut case of propoganda, misrepresentation, and outright lies. Your author states that "Not one of you has, or had, the moral conscience to come out and condemn this horrendous and despicable act." This is, in fact, a lie, as concisely proven by Mr. tinnypriv. You could have easily found this out, had you been interested in the truth of the situation. Now you dance around, saying "Oh, well sure they SAID they condemned it . . . but they didn't do it strongly! And that other guy didn't mean it!" How embarrassing. Just admit you cited a terrible, uninformed article, an article which I might add dances as closely to racism as possible, if it does not in fact step over the line, dust yourself off, and consider coming at the situation from a balanced, unbiased perspective.

[liberalhistorian]

29. Couldn't have said it better

myself!!!

[Violet_Crumble]

22. "speaks for me" II

He's also in the company of an outright racist. Being a nice and sometimes completely gullible poppet, I'll make the completely unsustainable assumption that drdon clearly didn't read the bit of the article he posted where it referred to Palestinian children who throw stones as 'demonic' ;)

Violet...

[Jack Rabbit]

16. I am tempted to dub this the Inhofe-Zarqawi defense

This is where an atrocity is committed and all one does is is scream "Where's the outrage? Look at what they do to us!" and procede to use the atrocity to justify one's own atrocities.

This is what Senator Inhofe was doing earlier in the week by citing all the atrocities against US personnel as a justification for the torture at Abu Ghraib. The Senator's tu quoque justification ingored the fact that the ICRC reports that between 70 and 90% of those detained by US forces are not "murderers" as he said, but were taken into custody by error. It also ignores the fact it is the US that invaded Iraq for no good reason and is presuming to tell them how their country is to be governed.

These facts and the torture at Abu Ghraib are used by Mr. al-Zarqari to justify the brutal killing of Nick Berg. "Ah ha!" the defenders of the occupation said. "You see! This proves we have the moral high road!"

Horsepucky to all. The murder of Nick Berg was brutal and unjustified. It does not excuse the torture of inmates -- even guilty ones -- at Abu Ghraib and it does not justify the colonial occupation of Iraq by the Bushies. It does not put anybody on a "moral high road."

Likewise, not all the suicide bombings and other war crimes that have taken place or will take place justifies the racist Israeli settlement program. Not all the settlements or demolitions of Palestinians home justify what happened to the Hateul family; not even the fact that the Hateuls took advantage of and supported Israel's settlement program justifies the spilling of their blood. Mrs. Hatuel and her children deserved to live a long and prosperous life in Haifa or Tel Aviv or some other community inside Israel.

There is no moral high ground to be had. One atrocity does not justifiy another. To attempt to use one to justify the other is grotesque sophistry.

The racism of the author of this article is on display when he refers to Palestinian children as demonic. His agenda is simple: defend Israel's atrocities towards "demonic" Palestinians and demand outrage at Palestinian atrocities against "innocent" Israelis. Like Senator Inhofe and the other the right wing morons in this country taking much the same line over Abu Ghraib, the reight wing morons in the Yesha councils and their in Israel simply have no defense for their own atrocities. They are left to pound the table with a very smelly red herring.

[JohnLocke]

17. You're making sense, Jack. That's not allowed in the I/P Forum!

:D

[drdon326]

24. Oh.....horsesplit....

Ivory tower Syndrome ,Jack??

This is a woman who had to experience the death of 4 of her country's
children AND their pregnant mother.

One word "demonic" to express outrage over the events of this atrocity and the continuing violence against innocent israelis and
you want to immediatly slap the word "racist" all over the place.

Would you use the word "demonic" to express your outrage over al-queda's actions in 9/11??

Perhaps you outrage might be better aimed at the persons who committed vile outrage rather than take on the authors obvious grief
and sadness.

Perhaps you can focus on the "DEMONIC" (yes I will use that) scum that sends 14,13, and 12 year olds to deliver suicide bombs to kill
the kids and anyone around them.

AND if you are so intent on flailing that word "racist" everywhere
perhaps you can focus on PA tv and radio that I have posted too many damn times to count.

Sorry,Jack...I respectfully disagree.


(lithos...in no way should my post or disagreement with Jack be viewed as any personal attack)

[Darranar]

25. Throwing rocks is equivalent to slamming planes...

into buildings?

Throwing rocks makes someone "demonic"?

[Violet_Crumble]

26. Racism...

AND if you are so intent on flailing that word "racist" everywhere
perhaps you can focus on PA tv and radio that I have posted too many damn times to count.

There's no disputing that the article that you claim speaks for you contained racism aimed at Palestinian children. But seeing as how you say yr so concerned about racism, can you explain how you don't see that as racist and see it as flailing, why would the same words aimed at Israelis be seen by you as racism? I think any reasonable person would agree that both instances would be clear-cut cases of racism...

Violet...

[Jack Rabbit]

30. More red herrings, Doc?

First, I don't regard your post as a personal attack.

Second, I have used many adjectives to describe the September 11 attacks. I don't think demonic was one of them, but I agree it is appropriate. As you know, I have used a few similar words to describe those who send forth suicide bombers, regardless of their age and gender. They are war criminals.

Having said that, that a horrible crime was committed against a family of Israeli settlers can in no way justify the Israeli settlement program.

True, the PA TV and radio programming we have often seen described on this forum are racist. Does that mean that the Israeli settlement program is not? No, it doesn't. It is.

Furthermore, the word demonic in Ms. Bertz' piece was not applied to anything as demonic as Osama's hijackers or a suicide bombers. It was applied to a "stone-throwing Palestinian child". Is throwing a rock at those who bulldoze your family's homes or your neighbor's home really in the same league as al Qaida or Hamas? Demonic, indeed. Ms. Bertz should be ashamed of herself.

[Lithos]

31. What applies?

Tu Quoque or ex concessis? Or both? I think the latter.

[Jack Rabbit]

32. I think both

One recently banned poster used to get annoyed with me when I accused him of tu quoque arguments, once suggesting that I was a snob for using Latin. Unfortunately, tu quoque doesn't have a good, commonly used English equivalent. The term translates to "You as well." In this case, Senator Inhofe is guilty of the fallacy by saying that because it is wrong for Arabs kill Americans brutally, it right for Americans to treat Arabs brutally. As noted in the link, the tu quoque fallacy is related to the saying two wrongs don't make a right.

Ex concessis, on the other hand, translates nicely to "Guilt by association". It should be noted that one of the examples of of this fallacy given in the link is one often seen on this board (although here is often works in both directions).

[Lithos]

33. The terms are correct forensic definitions

And not high brow in the slightest. I would highly suggest people follow through on the links you provided.

And Inhofe's remarks make it a good example of an ad hominem tu quoque

L-

[Violet_Crumble]

35. Palestinian children...

While we're on the subject, I found a site where people can sponsor a Palestinian child. It's a great cause that everyone should support regardless of their views on the politics of the I/P conflict...

http://www.pcwf.org/childrenfun.htm

And for drdon, there's some photos of some very cute Palestinian kids that *shock* don't look the slightest bit demonic. I hope you think about these kids if ever yr to say an article that contains racist sentiment against Palestinian children speaks for you. Oh, and I couldn't resist posting the pics as the little girl with the beanie and the blue jumper on is the spitting image of one of my nieces....

http://www.pcwf.org/children/list8.htm

Violet...

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[liberalhistorian]

27. Maybe people will listen to you

when you and the rest of the Israel-is-always-right-and-can-never-do-any-wrong crowd quit lumping ALL Palestinians is with those who commit atrocities such as this and quit demonizing ALL Palestinians, including women and even small children, for the actions of SOME of their people.

You become furious when people lump ALL Israelis in with the actions of SOME, and are quick to say that any atrocities committed by Israelis do not represent the nation and its people as a whole, yet have no problem doing the same damn thing to Palestinians. I realize you and the others consider Israeli lives to be far more important than any Palestinian life, including children, but it's just a tad bit racist to generalize and demonize an ENTIRE GROUP for the actions of SOME.

Oh, what the hell is the use, I might as well be beating my head against a brick wall. I shouldn't have even bothered to enter this forum; I haven't been here for weeks and I see it hasn't changed at all.

[Djinn]

34. denial - not just a river in Egypt

"I condemn in the strongest terms the heinous attack perpetrated yesterday in the Gaza Strip against innocent civilians ... targeting a woman and her children, it was particularly despicable," said Javier Solana, the EU's foreign policy representative."

I condemn in the strongest possible terms sure sounds a hell of a lot better and more sincere than "stop it I'm getting aroused"

[rebellious woman]

36. And pray tell what is your excuse?

[newyorican]

37. Hey Doc...seen the news??

Got wood?

[Forkboy]

38. "speaks for me."

Yes,we know.

[liberalhistorian]

39. We do indeed, as you'll note

the deafening silence coming from him regarding the sickening murders of Palestinian children today by the IDF, who are doing their usual "they were all terrorists and the Ay-rabs must have set bombs around the perimeter to kill their own people and blame it on us" spin.

Anyone who sees that video of dead, bloodied and mangled children, some very young (and one of whom was decapitated) and doesn't condemn it for the outright murder it is must have ice instead of blood running through their veins.

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[liberalhistorian]

41. Oh, my!

Sure wish I'd seen that post before it was deleted!

[Gimel]

42. They should not have been

Demonstrating in a war zone.

They should be in a safe place. The same note of "condemnation" you gave for the Jewish woman and her four daughters, killed as they drove from their home.

[liberalhistorian]

47. They were in a REFUGEE CAMP!

In the world the Palestinians are forced to live in, EVERYWHERE is a war zone!! THERE IS NO SAFE PLACE! Jesus H. Christ, why is that so hard for you Israel-is-always-right-and-can-do-no-wrong people to understand? A REFUGEE CAMP FOR GOD'S SAKE! The looks of panic and horror and fear on the faces of those children and even their parents was just unbelievable.

Where do you expect that "safe place" to be when the IDF is destroying their homes, their villages, their lives? When the IDF bulldozes their homes and every other structure, just where in the holy goddamn hell is this "safe place" supposed to be? Of course, I know, little kids who've lost their parents and siblings can just go out and build themselves another house. Yeah, that's it, make those 3-year-olds just go out and build new homes themselves!

Of course, every single Palestinian, man, woman, child, baby, is a "terrorist", and they all have total control over what their other millions of fellow Palestinians are doing, so I suppose in your eyes the murder of Palestinian children and civilians is always and forever justified.

And the IDF has only changed its story about fifty times since yesterday, but that's okay, because we all know that they ALWAYS tell the truth and NEVER spin it to make themselves look like the poor victims!

And one more time, although I really shouldn't have to say this over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, but here goes yet AGAIN: Expressions of anger and horror and sympathy over the murders of Palestinians DOES NOT INDICATE LACK OF ANGER, HORROR AND SYMPATHY OVER THE MURDERS OF ISRAELIS. AND CRITICISM OF THE ACTIONS OF THE IDF AND ISRAELI LEADERS AND POLICIES DOES NOT EXTEND TO ALL ISRAELI CITIZENS. YOU might lump ALL Palestinians together and condemn them all equally, but that doesn't mean that we do the same with Israelis.

And for the record, this might be be a hard concept for you to grasp, but the lives of Palestinian children and civilians are just as worthy and important as the lives of Israeli children and civilians. The brutal murder of ANY Palestinian or Israeli by ANY side must be met with the strongest condemnation and anger.

[Gimel]

52. My previous comment

You have misunderstood the intent of my comment, which was to contrast the two responses.

The value of every life is a universal law. There are no exceptions, as far as I'm concerned. Everyone should have the freedom of movement from place to place. The Jewish family was living in Gaza, an enclave of Jews, in a Muslim neighborhood, and their neighbors murder them. Is this acceptable by you and the others posting against Israel on this board?

The IDF says it was investigating. Is that so hard for you to understand?

The lie of the 20 deaths has been uncovered. Just waiting to hear the real truth of what happened. I don't think anyone of the pro-Pals here will accept it, because they have already made up their minds.

[Violet_Crumble]

59. If every life is equally valuable...

Why is it that you focus so heavily on whether someone is Jewish or Muslim?

I think you should stop continously suggesting that anyone here finds the murder of innocent civilians acceptable. Many folk here find the murder of civilians abhorrent, no matter what ethnic group or religion they are. You won't find them making excuses for the deaths of members of one group, telling people they have to wait till the IDF gets it's story straight before they might possibly condemn the deaths of innocent civilians, and you won't find them acting as though ten dead civilians is a good thing and that early and confused reporting is a big, fat LiE....

Those people are dead, Gimel. They were killed by the IDF. That much is blatantly clear to most people who aren't way too interested in absolving the IDF of any blame for anything at all...

Violet...

[liberalhistorian]

64. No, I'm afraid there's no mistaking

what you meant. You clearly said that they shouldn't have been there, that they should have been in a "safe zone" (I repeat, where the hell IS such a "safe zone" in the world of the palestinians, especially those in refugee camps-it just doesn't exist, there IS no safe place for them), and I heard no condemnation whatsoever.

By your logic, those in the settlements "deserve" what they get because they CHOSE to be in the settlements knowing full well the dangers, (particularly when such settlements are stealing palestinian land, bulldozing their houses, stealing their water supplies, taking their very livlihoods, etc., etc.). While they did, indeed, choose to be there knowing the dangers, and they do not, frankly, have any right to be there, there is no justification for this cold-blooded murder, just like there's no justification for the murder of palestinian civilians and children as well.

And also by your logic, anti-war protestors in the U.S. "shouldn't be protesting", as you say about the palestinians, and, therefore, should expect whatever law enforcement and the government want to give them because they're just asking for it. I think my sig line shows just how well that kind of thinking works.

[Djinn]

so what about the people who build settlements in them

in it THEIR fault that they get shot?

[Gimel]

53. From your comments

one would think so.

[Djinn]

56. I'm assuming you meant to post this in reply to me

and not drdon's original post.

Can I ask you which comments of mine would lead "one" to think that at all?

I actually take offense at the slur I think you'er trying to make here - care to back it up with any facts?

[liberalhistorian]

62. I think he meant that,

because you don't seem to care about the Pal. victims since, as you say, they "shouldn't have been protesting, they should have been in a safe zone" (as if there is such a thing in the world the Palestinians live in), then, by that same logic, we shouldn't care about those in the settlements who are murdered because, frankly, they have no business being there either.

Murder is murder, whether people "belong there" or not, and no matter which side they're on. But from your postings, it appears that only group of victims really matter and that the lives of the other group aren't really all that important. It's that particular double standard that is so infuriating.

[Djinn]

50. so what about the people who build settlements in them

in it THEIR fault that they get shot?

[Forkboy]

51. And girls who get raped had it coming

for wearing short skirts :puke:

[Djinn]

54. or at the very least deserve to be photographed

according to a thread elsewhere here today - DU seems to be having a wee bit of a reactionary day today

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Forkboy]

45. Have fun with the Repubs

they'll treat you nice :eyes:

[liberalhistorian]

48. Israel is doing a fine job of

destroying itself, frankly. And there is no "anti-Jewish flavor" on this board, there are attempts to get people to recognize the value of lives on BOTH sides, which is a concept certain people here seem to have trouble grasping. Criticism of Israeli leaders and policies is NOT anti-semitism, anymore than our criticism of Bush and his policies is anti-American.

[Classical_Liberal]

49. Maybe you'll say something meaningful, with specific examples

at some point. This is just flamebait, and piping off.

[truthspeaker]

44. our tax dollars didn't pay for the bullets in the act you mentioned

I am outraged by acts of terrorism from all sides, but my tax dollars are only subsidizing one of those sides.

[Gimel]

57. A surprise for you

The US does send aid to the PA:

http://www.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/04/17/bush.plo.waiver/

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/706642/posts
http://www.heritage.org/Research/MiddleEast/em490.cfm
http://www.jewishaz.com/jewishnews/970530/congress.shtml

[Violet_Crumble]

60. The PA didn't commit those murders...

And linking to free republic?? What next?


Violet...

[Gimel]

67. The PA funds terrorist n/t

[Classical_Liberal]

69. Sharon has been involved in two massecres.

.

[Gimel]

70. Red herring/ n.t.

[liberalhistorian]

75. Oh, really?

And just why is that? Seems to me that if the crimes of the PA are all fair game, then so are the crimes of Israel's leaders as well. Sharon has far too much blood on his hands to ever have any "moral authority" whatsoever. Oh, but I forgot. The crimes of Israel's leaders don't matter, it's only the sins of the PA that really matter. And Sharon's massacres were against them there Ay-rabs, (never mind that they were in a REFUGEE CAMP and far too many were women and children), so it REALLY doesn't matter in that case.

[bloom]

46. 10 die as Israelis fire on children's march

The Israelis are "winning". It's all bad.