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GabysPoppy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-07-04 11:08 PM
Original message
The BBC is listening
Making the case for Israel should, in theory, be easy.

Its achievements are vast and have no parallel in any other country of comparable size or age. They have been reached against an unremitting threat of violence, war, terror and delegitimation that might have defeated any lesser people.

In almost every sphere economic development, technology, integration of immigrants and the maintenance of democracy Israel should today be internationally heralded as a model for others to emulate.

Above all, Israel has pursued peace. In a mere 10 years it made a cognitive leap for which it would be hard to find a precedent. In 1990 the PLO was a proscribed terrorist organization with whom it was forbidden to make contact.

By 2000 the Israeli prime minister had offered its leader a Palestinian state in the whole of Gaza and 97 per cent of the West Bank, with east Jerusalem as its capital.


http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/J...
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tinnypriv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 12:09 AM
Response to Original message
1. Proof positive
Edited on Sun Feb-08-04 12:16 AM by tinnypriv

Sacks has lost it.

While aluding to making a "Case For Israel" (an interesting totalitarian strain), he declares Alan Dershowitz to be too harsh a critic of Barak's "offer".

The reason being, Sacks says Barak offered "97" percent, whereas Dershowitz says "95" in his book.

:dunce:

This kind of idiocy could only be published in a journal dedicated to distortion (noted previously) directed (primarily) at an American audience.
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Gimel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Just my comment
The difference in the percent of the Barak offer is quite likely due to what was put on paper and what was offered orally.

Interesting critique about the British ear:

But influencing public opinion has ground rules, and they are different in each country. In Britain they require a certain tone of voice: subtlety, the use of nuance and an absence of stridency. This is not always understood by Israelis or members of the Jewish community who sometimes feel that the purpose of a media intervention is to make Jews feel better rather than to persuade the unpersuaded. Shreying gevalt may be good therapy, but it is poor hasbara.
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tinnypriv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Of course
Nothing was put on paper, nor was it offered orally.

The first is literally true, the second is my interpretation of the available evidence.
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brainshrub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
3. Israel would have been wiped into the sea decades ago
without the direct involvement & aid from the United States. This article ignores this fact completely. If you had a rich big brother that subsidized all your activities, you can be sure that you would achieve a lot as well.

This is why I fear for Israel: I am concerned that one day the United States will find some other regional power to be the attack-dog; When that day comes Israel will have to fend for herself...and the results won't be pretty.
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Muddleoftheroad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Which time would that have been?
In 1948, 1956, 1967, 1973?

Israel won those wars, not its Arab neighbors.

Further, if anyone tries pushing Israel into the sea, I expect they will find it is a lose/lose proposition.
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brainshrub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Since Israel has nukes
and her enemies don't (yet), you'd be correct.

In 1948 how many tank-factories did Israel have? (Where do you suppose they came from?) If it wasn't for superior fire-power provided by the West, they would have never won in 1948.

In 1956 who provided the training and equipment? In 1967 who ignored an attack on it's own ships? In 1973 who provided resupplies and money?

No doubt that the people of Israel are resourceful and hard-working, but they got this far only with the support of the West. (Especially Britain and the United States.) There wouldn't even be an Israel without European support!

http://www.csmonitor.com/2001/1026/p1s1-uspo.html

I do suppose "wiped into the sea" is a bit strong.
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Darranar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. So what's the need for US aid, then?
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Ahava Donating Member (12 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Where?
Egypt?

Europe?

I know you couldn't have been referring to Israel because we get back much more in assistance than the aid we give to Israel.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-08-04 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
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