Egypt may cut citizenship to those who marry Israelis

[UndertheOcean]

SNIP :

An Egyptian court ordered the government on Saturday to consider revoking the citizenship of Egyptians married to Israelis if the marriage posed a threat to Egypt's national security.

The High Administrative court's ruling, which had been timetabled before the outcry over Israel's lethal raid on an aid flotilla heading to Gaza, comes in response to an appeal by the Interior Ministry over an earlier lawsuit in a lower court.


"The court asks the Ministry of Interior to present all the marriages to the cabinet to examine ... Each case should be investigated separately and with consideration to personal freedoms and the nation's security," Judge Mohamed al-Husseinay said.

In the earlier lawsuit, a lawyer argued that Egyptians married to Israelis were a risk to national security because they could be spying on Egypt for Israel.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/international/egypt-may-cut-citizenship-to-those-who-marry-israelis-1.294350


it really feels like one step ahead 20 steps back. sigh.

[aquart]

1. And if they marry Palestinians?

Have fun.

[UndertheOcean]

2. I don't understand your question ?

[aquart]

10. Egypt is extremely reluctant to allow free flowing intercourse with Gaza.

Maybe it's because, as DU insists, America owns them. But I recall that the last time the Palestinians breached the wall and spilled into Egypt, the Egyptians (I'm going by the Palestinian complaints)saw it as an opportunity to sell the Palestinians the shoddiest most defective goods they had at top dollar. That doesn't sound like an open arms welcome.

So it occurred to me that if Egyptians are marrying Israelis, some of them are probably marrying Palestinians and I wondered whether people were being given grief over it.

[UndertheOcean]

11. I wouldn't be surprised if they were , but I don't know.

and : "free flowing intercourse" , what an odd way of describing marriage !

[aquart]

13. I was just thinking of shopping, going to school, but okay.

Relationships thru walls and gates are tough, even with the internet. One of my neighbors growing up was an interracial couple who got married during World II when God knows what pressures or danger they had to endure to be together. When I hear about this kind of thing, they're the ones my mind goes to.

[azurnoir]

3. well you seem to know something so inform us with link

but keep in mind Debka is not allowed here

[aquart]

6. I have no idea. That's why I asked a question instead of making a statement.

And I'm pretty sure the only time I have ever read Debka was when it was linked at DU. It was a very good source, IIRC, about troops and materiel massing at Iraq's borders before our country actually admitted we were going to war.

What do you use it for?

[azurnoir]

8. I do not but it seemed a site thatwould have some appeal to you n/t

[aquart]

18. I see. You were attempting an oblique insult.

Better luck next time.

[UndertheOcean]

4. BTW , there are 30,000 Egyptians married to Israelis (90% of them to Israeli Jews )

so if this goes through , it is going to affect the lives of a lot of people.

[EFerrari]

5. This sh!t is going to be settled by inter marriage.

Not by @ssholes in government. It's going to be done a family at a time.

[aquart]

19. I'm just going to mention that the Hutus and the Tutsis were heavily intermarried.

But don't let that dim your hopes.

[EFerrari]

25. Well, that's depressing. That's right, I'd forgotten. n/t

[aquart]

7. Life's a lot busier and more intimate in the MidEast than it looks from here.

If citizenship is retracted, and there's an interesting court battle other groups may want to join because they could be next, what happens to taxes, residency, property? Jobs?

Citizenship is getting frighteningly impermanent. Jordan just removed citizenship from Palestinians BORN in Jordan. I have no idea how many of them there are or what's happening to them because of this.

[azurnoir]

9. BTW seeing as how you keep brining that up

how many Palestinians in Jordan lost citizenship vs how many gained citizenship?

[aquart]

12. No idea. Is that an issue there?

My horror was that any country removed the citizenship of somebody BORN there. It's being debated in America which shocks me and it stunned me that there was a country that actually went through with it. Are they naturalizing lots of Palestinians while ...I don't even know if there's a word for it...revoking the citizenship of Palestinian descent Arabs born in Jordan?

If so, what would be their reason for ...no, it makes no sense to me. Can you explain it?

[azurnoir]

14. yes I'm sure your horror knows no bounds but take heart

Following the disengagement, Jordan issued yellow cards to Palestinians in Jordan and the diaspora holding Jordanian passports, which entitled these individuals to the full rights of Jordanian citizenship.

Palestinians in the West Bank who had family living in Jordan were issued green cards, which entitled them to temporary Jordanian passports to facilitate travel but did not grant them citizenship rights.

Palestinians with yellow cards who return to Palestine and receive recognition as nationals under either Israeli or Palestinian law revoke their right to a yellow card and are issued a green card when they renew their passports. Conversely, Palestinians with green cards may be granted yellow cards in certain circumstances, such as when their parents reside in Jordan and hold yellow cards.

According to figures cited by the deputy, authorities replaced 190 yellow cards with green ones and 5,130 green cards with yellow ones in the period between March 1 and June 30, 2009, compared to replacing 204 yellow cards with green and 4,139 green with yellow in the same period in 2008.

The figures also show that 244 people were issued green cards, while 2,696 were issued yellow cards in the same period of 2007.

http://www.jordantimes.com/?news=18480&searchFor=citize...

[aquart]

16. Do all Jordanians have a colored card? Is the card yellow?

The article is TITLED "House panel backs ministry procedures on ‘citizenship revocation’".

REVOCATION.

"Chairperson of the House Freedoms Committee Fakhri Daoud said the committee received many complaints from people saying that authorities withdrew their Jordanian passports without cause.

“We summoned the minister of interior to clarify this issue, and found that what was said is not true,” Daoud told the press following the meeting with the minister.

“Authorities were only implementing the 1989 administrative and legal disengagement between Jordan and the West Bank,” Daoud said, adding that figures provided by the ministry this year are almost similar to the previous years."

1989?????? 1989????? But people are only screaming to the high heavens so much that the government has to issue a statement to the press NOW???? ELEVEN YEARS LATER?????

What part of "authorities withdrew their Jordanian passports without cause" did you miss? Or do you just not believe a word a Palestinian says?

[azurnoir]

20. Stll does not explain 4 times as many Palestinians gtting citizenship

in Jordan as not BTW how many Palestinians did Israel grant citizenship?

[Recursion]

22. Hashemites have neither card, IIRC

Though my time in Amman was a while ago.

[shaayecanaan]

28. "Hashemites"???

I assume you are attempting to refer to East Bankers (original Jordanians of non-Palestinian descent)?

The term "Hashemites" doesn't really refer to anyone these days, except for the royal family of Jordan perhaps, and even that has more to do with the British trying to lend authenticity to a puppet regime than anything else.

But to answer your question, about 90% of Palestinians in Jordan hold full Jordanian citizenship. Only about 10% are yellow/green card holders or stateless, and these were by and large card holders when Jordan instituted its policy in 1988 after renouncing any claim to the West Bank.

The rest of the 2 million Palestinian refugees in Jordan hold citizenship and qualify for full health benefits etc.

[aquart]

32. So what was the yelling about?

It was loud enough to make the international press or I wouldn't have heard it. It was Palestinians yelling (complaining) because nobody else was having a problem. It was a 1989 policy but the screaming didn't start till 2010 which is why the government made a statement in 2010. So if there was no problem, WHAT WAS THE PROBLEM THEY WERE YELLING ABOUT?

And I am no more prepared to buy that official statement from Jordan than I am from any government issuing a CYA.

[shaayecanaan]

33. Well, I guess Arabs just breed too much...

Indeed, I think you issued some sort of statement to that effect recently.

Part of the problem is that Israel has been failing or refusing ID cards to Palestinians. If Palestinians do not have an ID Card, they are unable to get any further green or yellow card, which means that they become stateless, if they are in Jordan at the time, and indeed even if they were born there.

[aquart]

34. I ask a question about Jordan and you answer with ISRAEL?

How can what Jordan does about Jordanian citizenship have anything to do with Israel?

The Palestinians who were yelling about revocation WERE NOT YELLING TO ISRAEL. They were yelling to Jordan. WHY were they yelling if nothing had happened? It is a straight, honest question and you gave a corkscrew answer.

And let's remember that Jordan was created from the rest of the Palestine Mandate. All the Jordanians are Palestinians. Except for some reason they are making a cruel and heartless distinction between themselves and their brothers.

WHY WERE THE PALESTINIANS YELLING ABOUT REVOCATION TO THE JORDANIANS? WHY DID JORDAN FEEL THE NEED TO ISSUE A STATEMENT ABOUT SOMETHING THEY SWEAR IS 11 YEARS OLD NEWS?

[shaayecanaan]

35. I was giving your question an honest answer...

In order to obtain a further yellow card, it is generally necessary to hold an ID card issued by Israel to residents of the West Bank. If Israel refuses to grant an ID card, it will make it difficult for an applicant to gain a yellow card/green card.

"The Palestinians who were yelling about revocation WERE NOT YELLING TO ISRAEL. They were yelling to Jordan."

I suspect that has something to do with Israel not really giving a shit if the Palestinians are yelling to them. Whereas Jordan, being a majority-Palestinian country, is required to at least give lip service.

[shaayecanaan]

26. Shock horror!

"My horror was that any country removed the citizenship of somebody BORN there."

There are 180,000 Arabs alive today who were born in Israel, lived in Israel, fled from Israel in 1948 and when they attempted to return to their lands and farms were thenceforth shot dead in Israel, at the rate of about 400 a year up until the 60s.

Are you horrified that they don't have citizenship?

[47of74]

15. I hope all those right wing nutjobs down in Arizona don't see this...

...because they'd probably get it in their heads that doing something like that here would be a good idea.

[aquart]

17. Ever seen a play called The Jewish Wife?

Really short. About a woman packing to go away for "a few weeks" in the summer but she's packing her winter coat. Because she has a German husband.

So this has happened before.

[azurnoir]

24. Are you insinuating that the Egyptian spouses of Jews

will co-operate in sending away to camps as the German husband did in the play?

For the record I believe this a horrible enough as it is but your invoking the Holocaust in this case is gratuitous and only cheapens the memory

[aquart]

31. I was invoking a play about a government that moved to separate couples.

For ethnic differences. In my memory, that husband was getting his wife out of town. Haven't seen it in a long time. He was surrendering her to a camp? I had a different impression.

Well, I don't suspect anybody in Egypt of doing that. BUT all it takes is for Egypt to reject Jewish marriage partners and then Israel to retaliate about Egyptians..........and then where do they go?

Hutus murdered Tutsi family members. Things were adorable in Sarajevo, too.

[IndianaGreen]

21. And Israel is doing likewise for those that marry non-Jews

I think there is a pattern of intolerance in here!

[henank]

23. No, Israel is not doing the same.

There is no revocation of citizenship if someone marries a non-Jew. Where did you get that idea from?

[proteus_lives]

29. From her irrational hatred of Israel and Israelis.

She always sticks to the script.

[LakeSamish706]

27. I'm sorry but Hosni Mubarak is every bit as culpable of this disaster as is Israel!

By blocking their borders to Gaza they share responsibility for these deaths.

[proteus_lives]

30. How unsurprising.

:puke: