Assault Weapons Ban Sunset Thread- Post Predictions Here!

[funkyflathead]

It sunsets on 9/14/04 if not renewed by then.


Here is what I see happening.

The GOP and Bush- to strike a deal and get S 659 (the NRA's pet bill) passed- will tack on S 1034 (the current AWB renewal bill) by Dianne Feinstein.

Feinstein et al won't fillbuster and both the Brady Campaign and the NRA can claim victory and defeat- energizing their members.

Bush can then claim victory on two fronts- he supported S 659 and S 1034.

[slackmaster]

1. The ban will die with great weeping and wailing

S.659 has enough support to pass as it is in today's Congress. No fillibuster will occur, and no deals will be cut.

S.1034 will die in committee.

The AWB will sunset on schedule.

[Superfly]

2. Concur

the AWB will sunset, much to the chagrin of the antis. Expect future legislation from Feinstein et al.

[Township75]

3. My prediction

The AWB will sunset as the anti's howl like a bunch of horned up dogs.

The S 659 will pass with no help from Fienstein. Repubs know guns can help them as it did in 2k. They would love for some prominent Dems to cry about the need to renew the AWB and to prevent municipalities from suing gun dealers. This will make the Dems look like the gun grabbing / gun control party, which is exactly what Bush and the Repubs want in the 04 elections.

[MrBenchley]

4. I predict

that the sunset will be supported by only the scummiest characters in public life, like Tom DeLay, Trent Lott, John AshKKKroft, the Bush crime family...

Wait, that's already true!

[slackmaster]

5. The sunset was supported by a Democratically controlled Congress

And signed into law (therefore supported) by President Bill Clinton.

[Superfly]

6. You mean the sunset provision was supported by those people

right?

[slackmaster]

7. Without the sunset provision, the bill would not have passed

The Democratic sponsors and handlers of the bill, and President Clinton, all knew that there was not enough support for a permanent ban, therefore they all supported (although perhaps grudgingly) the sunset clause.

[Superfly]

9. Heh...that's politics.

And I, for one, am glad that the sunset provision was included, soon to be exercised.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MrBenchley]

8. Who are you trying to kid, slack?

The sunset was part of the compromise reached with the Republicans,, who fought the bill tooth and nail.

Are you trying to pretend that Clinton supports the sunset?

[slackmaster]

10. And compromise is often the only way things get done in politics

Are you trying to pretend that Clinton supports the sunset?

He signed the bill, therefore he supported it at the time.

BTW - It was not just Republicans fighting for the sunset clause. Go back and review the record for yourself.

[Township75]

13. What an awful way to attack Democrats.

"that the sunset will be supported by only the scummiest characters in public life, like Tom DeLay, Trent Lott, John AshKKKroft, the Bush crime family...

Wait, that's already true!"

When people like Clinton and Fienstien supported the AWB with a sunset, some here have to attack that. I can't remember who that poster is that always notes how some people here attack those who support democratic bills, and then align themselves with Lott, Delay, ect...but I hope you get to meet him Bench.

You would call Clinton scum and Fienstein scum...just so you know, Lott, Delay and Ashcroft did NOT support the AWB and thus the sunset...unlike those such as Clinton, Fienstein, and all the other Dems (we controlled the senate then, so it must have been alot) that you would call "the scummiest characters in public life".

(snicker)

[MrBenchley]

14. Who the hell are you trying to kid?

"just so you know, Lott, Delay and Ashcroft did NOT support the AWB"
No shit, sherlock. And they're doing all they can to block the renewal...

Frankly there's no reason the ban shouldn't be permanent.

[Township75]

15. HAHAHAHAHA...I'm not kidding anyone, I just told you what you said.

You attacked those that supported the sunset in the ban...that would include the Dems in the then democratically controlled senate, and the Dem president that signed the bill.

You called the scum.

And BTW, Asscrack, Delay, and Lott didn't support the AWB bill or its sunset...sounds like you.

[MrBenchley]

16. No extreme too silly for the RKBA crowd I guess...

Now they're reduced to pretending that Democrats are responsible for the sunset...and don't support renewing and strngthening it....

[slackmaster]

18. If Democrats had not supported the sunset, the bill would have failed

MrBenchley, would you feel better if supporters of a permanent ban had stood their ground and the ban had never passed as a result of their recalcitrance?

The purpose of the sunset clause was to give the AWB some accountability - The experiment has failed, and the ban should be allowed to go away.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[slackmaster]

44. People who claim to speak on behalf of sanity

Are usually unjustified in doing so.

Say nutcases like...

People who classify groups of people with terms like "<noun phrase OR adjective> like" tend to be bigots.

[the_acid_one]

45. Neat how...

A certain someone always seems to throw out a slightly more advanced "hey, whats that behind you!?" tactic. When they have nothing else to go on.

[Township75]

50. Is that all the faster you could change the subject?*

*

[MrBenchley]

63. Gee, township....

That was all the time that was needed to show what a steaming pantload your subject was....

[Township75]

65. You show what a pantload is by changing the subject?

So Bench, what's the weather like in your area?

[slackmaster]

17. MrBenchley has overlooked one obvious problem with the AWB

Frankly there's no reason the ban shouldn't be permanent.

Here's the only reason that should matter to any sane person:

The ban has restricted the choices of honest citizens without providing any measurable offsetting benefit in public safety.

In a free society, pointless restrictions are always bad law.

[MrBenchley]

25. Too frigging funny....

"The ban has restricted the choices of honest citizens"
Too frigging funny...

[slackmaster]

46. I'm honestly trying to parse MrB's post

But it really makes no sense whatsoever. What I wrote was perfectly true and seems unassailably logical to me.

MrBenchley, if you disagree please explain HOW and WHY you feel differently. Your petty attempts at ridicule adds no substance to the discussion. It's as if you are assuming that everyone who might read this thread (or every "sane" or "sensibie" person) will see it the same way you do.

Dream on.

[the_acid_one]

20. Frankly there's no reason the ban shouldn't be permanent.

Why does Big Brother trust me to own a Full-Auto uzi, but cant trust me to strap a knife on the end of my gun?

Considering I can buy all sorts of goodies legally already, why is this ban such a big deal?

If i felt inclined I could own a grenade launcher and grenades to go with it. Just have to pay the taxes. But I cant own a gun with threads on the barrel?

I can own a silencer for my uzi, or for my pistol, but not a flash hider for my rifle, oh no.


I can own an AR-15 based AOW, that will accept 30 round magazines, and fit neatly under my jacket. But I cant put a folding stock on my full sized AR-15?


You have to wonder, with all the things we can already legally own, why are the little things such a big deal?

Criminals dont care about threaded barrels, they dont care about flash hiders, they dont care about bayonets.

Collectors care about these things. Things that make a firearm no more lethal then a firearm without them. Things that have more basis in ergonomics and cosmetcs then they do in functionality.

For all intents and purposes, even the ATF doesnt care about these things. If you want to rig up a post ban gun like a preban, the ATF doesnt give a shit. They're more concerned about machine guns and explosives. Not whether redneck tapes a knife to the end of their gun or has a stock that can be shortened for when his wife wants to shoot it to.

So, Not only is the law dumb, it's not even really enforced. Go ahead, renew the ban. As if this pipedream called the Assault Weapon Ban hasnt cost our party enough.

[slackmaster]

21. One small caveat

If you want to rig up a post ban gun like a preban, the ATF doesnt give a shit....

...unless you try to sell it.

[the_acid_one]

23. Eh, mehaps...

But, There are stories of guys that have been selling post bans in preban config for years at gun shows and never had a problem.

In fact, I dont think anyone has ever been busted on an AW violation alone. It's almost always an add-on charge to something else.

Kind of like getting busted for speeding, and vehicular manslaughter all in the same breath.

While I do not recommend breaking the law (how would you like to be the first, last and only person to go down for illegal AW's?) I really dont think the ATF cares as long as it doesnt go bang more then once. Once again, there are stories of agents jokingly admitting that fact.

But you're probably right, it would be a good idea to exercise caution and not sell any post-bans configured as pre-bans...just in case.

[MrBenchley]

26. Too frigging funny...

Yeah, that's the only people who ever buy assault weapons....collectors...

And Wayne LaPierre is queen of the may...

No argument is TOO absurd for the RKBA crowd, is it?

[the_acid_one]

27. Didnt say only...now did i?

I said that the only people who care about the features the AWB banned, are collectors. Criminals often cant even be bothered to load the right caliber in their guns most times.

As evidenced by this thread which is Police Officers discussing firearms they've taken off of criminals:

http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=202639


I Hardly think that you can call guns that are used in 1% of crimes (DoJ numbers) the "criminals weapons of choice".

I think we all know where the absurd arguments are coming from and it starts with "V", ends with "PC" or starts with "B" and ends with "rady".

Afterall...when proof doesnt back up your stance, it's easier to just lie isnt it?

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Superfly]

29. Afterall....

when you have no proof, just resort to personal attacks, eh Bench? Seems to be your most common tactic.

[MrBenchley]

30. Too too funny, fly...

I didn't put that racist filth on acid's whacked-out website....nor did I prevent any pro-gun liberal there from complaining about it (surprise...there wasn't one--guess it was just hunky-dory to all the gun nuts there).

[the_acid_one]

33. Not my website.

Also, not a thread that I posted. I posted a legit thread with a serious topic being discussed.

And would a redneck equivilent of that rhyme, done in an outrageously exagerated southernish accent still be filthy, or would that actually be funny to you?

Dont bother answering, it's a rhetorical question, and we all know the answer ;)

[MrBenchley]

37. "a redneck equivilent"

That IS the redneck rhyme, right there....

"I posted a legit thread"
And I showed what other sort of threads were floating around that site. Now go snivel about how unfair that is to someone who gives a steaming crap.

[the_acid_one]

39. So, one poster...

.....posts something in bad taste, and now all the sudden everyone is guilty?

Typical blanket statement of the anti-gun crowd.

"So and so used this type of weapon, therefore everyone with this type of weapon is bad!"

Hey, some anti-gunner posted something on this board that was just incredibly assanine yesterday. I guess if we use the Benchly Broad Brush method of painting, then the whole anti-crowd crap out of their mouths.

But, no, thats not how it works.

You cant take one post by one poster and use it to discredit everyone. So sorry.

[MrBenchley]

40. Too frigging funny, acid

You dredged up this source...and now you're sore that I noticed what else was on it?

"you cant take one post by one poster and use it to discredit everyone."
Besides, just look at all the non-racist gun nuts who spoke right up to condemnn this racist bit of filth...oh yeah, there weren't any. Funny how that works.

[the_acid_one]

43. I'm not sore.

I just dont care what else is on it. It's not relevant to the discussion at hand. That poster wasnt even posting on the thread I referanced. I think the real problem is, you dont have a real response so you need to find some distraction ;)

[the_acid_one]

31. Not just your normal gun owner...

That thread is exclusively police officers.

Now, I wonder, why would police officers be on a pro-gun board?

OH OH! I know, because police officers frequently own their own guns, and would like to keep it that way.

You never answered my other question Bench, How come I can own a full auto uzi (which I just bought) but I cant stick a knife on my other gun?

How does that make sense?

[MrBenchley]

32. Too funny...

"because police officers frequently own their own guns, and would like to keep it that way."
Gee, has there EVER been a suggestion anywhere that police officers be disarmed?

No argument is too dishonest or absurd for the RKBA crowd, is it? In this thread alone, we've got "Dianne Feinstein and Bill Clinton support the sunset" and now "gun control will disarm police."

[the_acid_one]

34. Keep your words out of my mouth.

Police officers are civilians with a job to do. Many of them collect firearms outside of their duty issued guns,and once again, that thread had nothing whatsoever to do with disarming the police. It had to do with police disarming criminals and telling what kind of weapons they found.

Why arent they reporting more assault weapons Bench? I could have sworn that the VPC makes it sound like every gangbanger has a micro-uzi tucked in his pants.

[MrBenchley]

36. Too frrigging funny...

"Why arent they reporting more assault weapons Bench?"
Gee, guess that horseshit about the ban not working is just so much horseshit....

[the_acid_one]

38. Great, then the ban is effective.

And if it's so effective, how come I have a ban compliant weapon with the same killing power sitting in my closet?

And if it's so effective, then whats up with the push to "strengthen it"?

And if it's so effective. Then why have assault type weapons never been used in anything but a negligeable number of crimes even before the ban?

[MrBenchley]

41. Next ask me...

what I think about someone who boasts that they own an assault weapon...or frets publicly about "killing power."

[the_acid_one]

42. Using the terms of the laymen.

Would you rather I would have said same "terminal ballistics"?


So you could whine over technical jargain meant to imply that people who "dont know the terms are unworthy to talk about guns"?


(Addendum): I also would like to know why it's ok for anti's to say "killing power" in their emotionally charged rants about preban vs postban. But if I say it, it's suddenly not ok?

Hipocrisy is alive and well and has found a friend with Mr B.

[kbelzner]

74. he ducks, he weaves, he avoids the question

Mr.B. will do anything to avoid answering simple pointed questions. Instead of answering, he falls back to ad hominem. Instead of engaging in debate, he offers personal insults. Clearly he is operating from a space of pain and anger, and appears incapable of sustained rational discourse. He is so foaming-at-the-mouth that it's as if he is some NRA caricature of what an anti-gun person should be.

It makes ms think that he has probably lost a loved one to gunfire, and that the pain of that loss has permanently affected his style of "debate."

[MrBenchley]

75. I gave it the answer it deserves

"He is so foaming-at-the-mouth"
No, I'm mostly laughing my ass off......

[kbelzner]

78. you still havent defined

what you mean when you use the term "assault weapon." We're left wondering.

[MrBenchley]

77. Next

ask me if I care what you want.

[beevul]

35. Ouch

Talk about your "open mouth - insert foot"

chuckle

[the_acid_one]

12. Ms Cleo told me....

....that S-659 is gonna pass, without any riders whatsoever, and that the AWB is goin down.

When that happens I am going to mount a bayonet on my Post-Ban rifle, just cause I can.

The NRA has said they will kill S-659 if Fiendstein tries to tack on then AWB poison pill.

It's good to see the NRA taking a stand, finally.

[slackmaster]

19. Good choice for your 223'd post, the_acid_one

When that happens I am going to mount a bayonet on my Post-Ban rifle, just cause I can.

Me too. All registered California AWs will be reconfigurable in any NFA-legal pre-ban or post-ban configuration.

[the_acid_one]

22. Didnt even notice that was #223

I guess that means I should go fire a few rounds of .223 out of my post-ban "circumvention of the law" AR-15 rifle in celebration.

Since I dont post to terribly much, maybe by the time I reach #556 I'll be sporting a knife on the end of that rifle.

[MrBenchley]

47. So to sum up...

If you predicted that the RKBA crowd would try to blame the AWB sunset (which they are in favor of) on Bill Clinton and Dianne Feinstein (whom they oppose) and that in support of their position they'd post a link to a gun nut website with racist crap on it (and then fly into a rage when it was pointed out that it was yet another gun nut website with racist crap on it), you win the pool.

[the_acid_one]

48. Poof, smoke bomb!

Your distractions arent gonna get you anywhere Mr.B

[MrBenchley]

49. Too frigging funny...

Geeze acid, it sure as hell wasn't me in this thread trying to distract from the FACT that only asswipes like DeLay and AshKKKroft are supporting this sunset...

or the FACT that the overwhelming majority of voters do nnot want assault weapons on the street...

or the FACT that this is a helluva great issue to bash Republican extremism with...

[the_acid_one]

51. Indeed it is.

On the flip side of the coin, The only people that are supporting extension are asswipes like Fiendstien and Chuckie Schumer who thinks that they banned "stocks that hold more then 10 bullets".

Doesnt it bother you that most prolific supporters of your position often dont have any idea what they're talking about?

You know, I dont agree with the republicans on a lot of things, or hardly anything at all, in fact. But even a blind squirrel finds an acorn sometimes. I think the Repubs found theirs.


The overwhelming majority of voters also believe that the Second Ammendment refers to individual rights. Need proof? Conduct an impromptu survey like I did. Ask 10 random people what the second ammendment means. I did, every one of them said something along the lines of "Thats the one that says people can own guns right?".
Not "Thats the one that says the national guard can have guns".

If you ask Joe Public what an "assault weapon is". I'll wager he wont mention bayonet lugs or folding stocks, simply because the uninformed public cannot be counted on to make an informed decision

Thats why we live in a republic, not a democracy.

[MrBenchley]

53. Gee, the RKBA crowd bashing Democrats

Who would have thought that?

[the_acid_one]

57. I dont have to like...

everyone with a D beside their name. Especially when they support ill informed legislation without even knowing that a magazine is what feeds ammunition, not a stock.

[MrBenchley]

61. Yeah, it's always great to see

the RKBA crowd sticking up for Tom deLay's pet projects and calling respected Democrats asswipes...

But real;ly, who expects anything different?

[the_acid_one]

62. Stupid is stupid.

And subscribes to no political party. You'll find a lot of stupid in all of them

[MrBenchley]

64. Yeah, and the gun rights bunch fits the bill

Now you stand over there with venal racist morons like Tom DeLay and John AshKKKroft and I'll proudly keep standing with progressive decent Democrats like Shumer and Feinstein.

[the_acid_one]

66. Your guilt by association tactics....

...are weak.

It's the equivilent of the shit I used to do in 3rd grade, where you pick the ugliest person in school and accuse someone of "liking them". Or Sing the K-I-S-S-I-N-G song about them.

Thankfully, I matured out of that shit around the time I stopped accusing people of having "cooties".

Furthermore. I don't need anyone to stand with. I stand by myself, I support my positions myself. I have my own beliefs, and I dont need my political philosophy spoon fed to me by people who cant be bothered to learn about the very things they so desperately seek to ban


I'll wager your Holy Trio of Fienstein, Schumer, and Mccarthy could be convinced to ban DiHydrogen Monoxide aswell.

http://www.dhmo.org/

[MrBenchley]

72. If you don't like your playmates

don't blame me...

You're the one chose to line up with "geniuses" like Ted Nugent and Larry Pratt.

[the_acid_one]

73. "Benchley and Fienstein sittin' in a tree"

Get a new schtick Mister B, this one's getting old ;)

[MrBenchley]

76. You stand over there with Ted Nugent and Tom DeLay then...

If you don't like your scummy playmates, don't blame me....

[MrBenchley]

56. By the way...

There's 114 sane progressive Democrats co-sponsoring the assault weapons ban in Congress....guess that "nobody but" is another bit of RKBA horseshit.

[selector_switch]

58. Is that number from

the house or the senate or is it a combination of both? How does the whole co-sponsor thing work?

[the_acid_one]

59. Great, there will be....

114 dissapointed Democrats in congess when the ban goes away next year and 80 million rejoicing gun owners. So sorry :)

[Name removed]

69. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[selector_switch]

52. When you say on the street...........

"or the FACT that the overwhelming majority of voters do nnot want assault weapons on the street..."

do you literally mean on the street as in the case of gangs and street thugs or do you mean all together even for law-abiding citizens?

[MrBenchley]

54. I mean

they do not want assault weapons offered for sale to anybody...

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[beevul]

60. I predict humor and hipocracy

I predict that the freedom hating gun grabber crowd will accuse the freedom hateing anti-abortion crowd of being pro-gun yet again.

I predict that only freedom hateing asswipes like those that believe the B as in B, S as in S that the brady/vpc put out will oppose the sunset.

I predict that the freedom hateing gungrabbing asswipes will have no clue what voters want where firearms are concerned.

I predict the the freedom hateing gun grabber crowd will do anything, even bashing other freedom haters to bolster thier corrupt agenda.

Chuckle

[1a2b3c]

67. Do you have a link to the S 659 text? nt

[the_acid_one]

70. Link

http://www.heritagefund.org/common/legal/docs/S659.pdf


BTW, I wanna be in the gungeon gallery to please :)

[1a2b3c]

71. Email me your picture and your name with it

I am keeping them until i set up a new server.

[solinvictus]

68. AWB

The ban is out of here!!! It is a non-issue in this election cycle as gun control has become a losing issue for the Democrats and after a decade of losses, they've finally realized it.