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“A License To Not Quite Kill” New Taser for military to use in crowd control etc.

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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-08 11:47 AM
Original message
“A License To Not Quite Kill” New Taser for military to use in crowd control etc.
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A License To Not Quite Kill
Sitting idle, the Taser Shockwave looks like a waist-high rack of square green teeth. But press a button, and those teeth--six electrified cartridges tethered by 25-foot wires--shoot out in a 20-degree arc. Inch-long probes emitting 50,000 volts of electricity pierce through clothing and skin. If a human being is in their path, his or her muscles immediately flex and lock involuntarily.

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

Shockwave, set to be deployed sometime in 2009, is one of several powerful new "less-lethal" devices coming closer to being used in the real world, as opposed to just test situations. And it's not the only experimental toy soon to be sold by Phoenix-based Taser International (nasdaq: TASR - news - people ). Other products being tested by the company include a taser shell that can be fired from any shotgun and a taser laminate film that can electrify the surface of a traditional riot shield.

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Taser International, of course, isn't the only one developing new, controversial less-lethal weapons. The military's Joint Non-Lethal Weapons Program (JNLWP) is testing a variety of new ways to stun and incapacitate enemy combatants including "flash-bang" grenades that create noise and light to disorient targets, as well as a two-foot diameter laser that can temporarily blind a vehicle's driver at around 600 feet. The so-called Active Denial System, a heat ray that can make targets feel as if their skin is catching fire without actually inflicting damage, is also under development.

But even the military, which has used traditional tasers in the field since 2004, has doubts about Taser International's new toys. "We're doing a lot of testing to make sure they don't kill people," says John Keenan, the JNLWP's director of science and technology. "We have to understand the health effects associated with them. If we're calling something a non-lethal weapon, we have to make sure it's not lethal."

Brigade homeland tours start Oct. 1
But this new mission marks the first time an active unit has been given a dedicated assignment to NorthCom, a joint command established in 2002 to provide command and control for federal homeland defense efforts and coordinate defense support of civil authorities.

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“Right now, the response force requirement will be an enduring mission. How the {Defense Department} chooses to source that and whether or not they continue to assign them to NorthCom, that could change in the future,” said Army Col. Louis Vogler, chief of NorthCom future operations. “Now, the plan is to assign a force every year.”

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

They may be called upon to help with civil unrest and crowd control or to deal with potentially horrific scenarios such as massive poisoning and chaos in response to a chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear or high-yield explosive, or CBRNE, attack.

* * * * * * * * * * * * *

Correction:
A non-lethal crowd control package fielded to 1st Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division, described in the original version of this story, is intended for use on deployments to the war zone, not in the U.S., as previously stated.

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benEzra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-08 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. What makes me think...
The military's Joint Non-Lethal Weapons Program (JNLWP) is testing a variety of new ways to stun and incapacitate enemy combatants including "flash-bang" grenades that create noise and light to disorient targets, as well as a two-foot diameter laser that can temporarily blind a vehicle's driver at around 600 feet. The so-called Active Denial System, a heat ray that can make targets feel as if their skin is catching fire without actually inflicting damage, is also under development.

What makes me think that this is less about "enemy combatants" than unruly crowds?

If someone is a lethal threat (i.e., an actual armed combatant), I don't see this as being an appropriate level of force. This looks more like crowd control to me, but maybe I'm just being cynical.
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tburnsten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-08 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. One of the problems our soldiers run into
are large gatherings of Iraqis, where a single or small number of aggressors will use the crowd as cover to take potshots at U.S. troops, knowing that unless our soldiers can safely pick the individual out from the crowd and neutralize the threat without endangering others, they will not fire. Weddings are a huge problem, since they typically involve hundreds or thousands of people, many of them firing into the air, so an aggressor can use those crowds quite effectively. Right now the only real tactic we have to disperse a crowd safely is to have them buzzed by air support like F16s or Cobra gunships, that usually works but it would be nice to have an effective way for soldiers to actively push a more or less peaceable crowd back without calling in help from the air.
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-08 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. It would be nice if the crowd was on our troops side rather than at best being neutral. n/t
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old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-09-08 05:16 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Maybe if our soldiers weren't there, it would not be a problem. nt
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-09-08 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. My thoughts also. n/t
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tburnsten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-09-08 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. I can't wait till the Iraqis are capable
of maintaining stability in their own nation, we will have some presence there forever, that's just the way the world works, but the sooner and more effectively they can control their own territory and prevent violence from running rampant, the sooner we can scale back our operations there to the level of minor support.
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jody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-09-08 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. IMO the Iraqis can take over law enforcement and ground activities now with the US providing air
and logistic support from bases away from the volatile urban areas. That will be necessary for a decade or more but should reduce the risk to our troops and cost of military operations.

IMO we should not have invaded Iraq but given that we are there, we have a moral duty to let Iraq find solutions to its problems and a moral duty to reduce the risk to our troops.

As for Afghanistan, we are going to leave as losers just as Russia did and other would be conquerors over the past millenniums.

In the meantime we have created a powder keg in Pakistan and forced the Pashtuns from both Pakistan and Afghanistan to unite against the infidels. The Pashtuns make up the majority of the Taliban.
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biermeister Donating Member (425 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-08-08 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. coming soon to a neighbor near you (and me)
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