Dick Morris: Bush's Weapon Against Dean

[DrFunkenstein]

I apologize to the Dean supporters, but this is a real cause of alarm for me. I can't handle no 4 more years.

In a Bush-Dean race, the contest would likely hinge on three semantic differences. The way the electorate defines the gay marriage, tax-cut and Iraq issues will spell victory or defeat for the candidates.

Dean will insist that he does not support gay marriage but only the limited concept of civil unions. Bush will say that if it looks like a duck, acts like a duck and walks like a duck, it's a duck. Bush will characterize the Dean bill as a gay marriage act and will challenge Dean to approve of the Defense of Marriage Bill that prohibits homosexual marriage.

The former Vermont governor has also proposed repealing most if not all of Bush's tax cuts. Again, polls indicate that Americans break about 50-50 on this issue. But Bush will say that Dean wants to raise taxes - a 2-to-1 no-no in public-opinion polls.

Early media is the answer. As soon as the Democratic candidate is chosen, before he has time to reload his depleted coffers, Bush must strike aggressively and characterize the issues in his own light and cast them to his advantage...He could win the election in a spring offensive.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,102322,00.html

Honestly, I am surprised that the GOP let Dickie out of the bottle with this one. So far, they've been maintaining radio silence, trying not to spook the Democrats before it's too late.

In any case, here's an article on the anti-gay backlash brewing:

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0332/goldstein.php

Here's an article by Krugman arguing that full repeal of the cuts is a political loser:

http://truthout.org/docs_03/101803I.shtml

And here's a quick preview of what $200 million in ads will look like, only a thousand times nastier, 24-7 throughout 2004:

http://www.gop.org/Newsroom/RNCResearch/TLvideo2.htm

But at least we can trust Dean to keep his cool during the debates...

(PS - Please don't bother telling me this is from Dick Morris. I know. If you disagree, at least try to get past the ad hominem stuff.)

[La_Serpiente]

1. When I saw the ad

It almost scares me what we are up against. We're up against a machine that likes to sugarcoat everything they say but really are speaking out of their asses.

[DrFunkenstein]

3. I Prefer "Talking With Their Second Mouths"

If being an English major taught me anything, it's that Shakespeare knew how to say some nasty stuff very nicely.

[La_Serpiente]

4. I'll remember that

thanks ;-) :bounce:

[DrFunkenstein]

6. It's Good For Kids Too!

It doubles as a useful euphemism for those special occassions...

"No, no - that's just Daddy's second mouth talking," or such. Then you get to wait to see how long it is before the kid incorporates it into use.

[jeter]

2. Why Morris is wrong

Racism works under certain circumstances. Dean has never supported Gay Marriage. If Bush tries to paint his as such, and thereby destroy his argument four years ago that he is a "uniter, not a divider," then it will reflect worse on him. It will be Bob Jones University all over again. Our response, whenever Bush is in a bind he becomes prejudice.

Second, the gay thing doesn't have as much potency as racism or sexism. These latter two issues have an economic dimension to them - this is why working-class people tend to agree with such sentiments.

It's not that they hate blacks. It's that they hate quotas where black people take the jobs/education opportunities of more deserving whites.

Immigration is not just about latinos...but foreign workers in general coming in and taking "white" or "American" jobs at lower wages.

But what possible justification could Bush have by attacking gays? Other than being a complete asshole?

Third, such rhetoric may work in some southern states (where Bush is certain to win anyway), but not the west. Which Republicans NEED to win more than the south. Western states have a more libertarian attitude about such issues. They don't like such talk. States like Arizona, Colorado, Nevada and others may swing Democratic just on this issue alone - against Bush.

The gay thing, often mentioned around here as the number one reason why Dean can't win, is a bullshit issue. Let the GOP think this. We'll come fighting back.

[DrFunkenstein]

5. It's A Lethal Combination

Massive social change very quickly, brought about by angry protest and pessimism. Plus he's taking away their magic tax-cut pittance (God forbid!).

Throw in a ton of research they have on his flip flops, and the fact that he only Governed about 630,000 people - which is less than some mayors.

If there is even the slightest hint that Dean or his wife had anything to do with abortions, it is all over. Seriously, it would be over.

Damn, I also forgot that Dean has a whole litany of gaffes and phrases that will sound particularly damning.

Here's a recent one for the record books: "The only difference between me and McGovern is we're going to be in the White House."

http://slate.msn.com/id/2090856/

Hey man, I didn't put those words in his mouth!

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[lcordero]

9. that's not true

McGovern was a veteran:D

[bridge]

13. Uh-oh...are we going to start posting "Dean-isms?"

methinks there are quite a few floating around out there...

[Classical_Liberal]

51. You act as if any of the other candidates have no gaffs or flip flops

.

[polpilot]

15. Dean will destroy Bush's career as he has Kerry's by his brilliance &

integrity. Bush will throw everything he has at Dean and will lose as Kerry & Gep have. Dean will demolish Bush. Anyone scared of Rove v. Dean needs to reflect a bit on the political race thus far in '03. Dean will crush the opposition as he has with the demo opposition.

Dean '04...

[AP]

18. To quote mbali...

Remember the classic film in which Peter Sellers plays Chauncey Gardner (Chance the Gardner), a complete imbecile who makes clueless and moronic comments that everyone else thinks demonstrate his vast brilliance and insight into politics and society?

Howard Dean is starting to remind me of Chauncey. While I don't think that Dean is a moron - not even close, he's obviously a very smart man - the "Being There" dynamic infuses these discussions. Dean supporters always seem to interpret every comment he makes - regardless how casual and shallow - as evidence of his brilliance, depth and insight.

When Dean makes a simple and poorly thought-out comment about welcoming Confederate flag decal sporting white folks into the fold in the context of the NRA and gun control, his supporters turn that into some sort of insightful discussion on race.

When questions are raised about his comments, Dean supporters recite a litany of thought-provoking insights that he REALLY MEANT when he spoke, even though he didn't even come close to saying any such thing.

When he is criticized for insensitivity, we are told that this shows that he is SUPER sensitive to the issue and the very fact that we are complaining about his comments is evidence of his absolute genius.

When questions are raised about why he would make such a reckless comment, Dean supporters scream that he MEANT to stir up controversy, that he is purposely trying to provoke dialogue in a forward-thinking effort to force Democrats to finally, at long last, to address this issue.

I have no doubt that if Howard Dean held a press conference tomorrow to announce that the sky was green, Deanies would fall all over themselves proclaiming that "Dr. Dean is once again demonstrating that he is his own man and will not allow himself to be restrained by the laws of nature and science in his interpretation of the color of the sky."

It's amusing to see numerous attempts to characterize Dean's comments as further evidence of his brilliance and infallibility when the logical explanation is simply that Howard Dean said something stupid.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=668593#669823

[chimpymustgo]

31. AP you always have thoughtful posts, but this is the most trenchant truth

I've seen in a long time around here.

This deserves its own thread.

[AP]

35. mbali wrote that. I agree with you. It's one of the best posts

I've read here. Everyone should read it.

[bread_and_roses]

55. This is what I see

and it disturbs me almost more than Dean's cluelessness about race and class issues.

[Skwmom]

38. Integrity and Dean do not belong in the same sentence. e/o/m

[OHdem10]

28. I wish it were not true but-- there is always Arnold(GOP)

The most serious thing any campaign can do is ignore the GOP's ability to pull out and use cultural issues at th e right moment.
Example. 2000 election. MCCain had won NH to Bush's Dismay. Bush knew he had to take MCCain out in SC or it was over. While Bush was kept on Camera flags waving and giving that Compassionate Conservative Drivel--His underlings including the Pat Robertson Crowd were busy . You have to realize that cultural conservatism is big in some southern states. Telephone calls and flyers were going out constantly"McCain will suppport gay rights--this means the gays will feel free to lure your children into the Gay Lifestyle" Gays will be molesting your children". Think of every bad thing you ever heard about gays and the message was out there.

The McCains have an adoped daughter from India(who Mother Thers ask them to adopft for gosh sakes). The Messages and flyers''John CCain has issues of integrity and charcter--He fathered a black child."
This is just a sample. You get the picture.

This is not openly discussed as issues in the campaign--It is conducted alsmost "underground'. Unfortunately it works.

On this board, people can quote a lie they read and how many of us gullibly believe it.

Now that Bush has openly embraced Arnold into the GOP Fold and
you Guilianni and few other prominents who support Gay Rights and Arnold Civil Unions--he will have more trouble trying to make the case openly. Moral Values however is code for doing away with the Gay Agenda, Pro Life, not approving the Gay lifestyle. Did anyone happen to see Bush when he was in Mississppi congratulating Haley
Barbour. Haley is a man o high "moral values ""--then he gives this knowing look in his eyes as he glances around the room. If Morris is saying Bush will come out and attack Dean on these issues I will be surprised. They have better ways.

I am not saying it is futile for Dean to run--i am saying every candidate has to be prepared. All of our candidates support Gay Rights None Gay Marriage. The Republicans if they play in the open will morph Civil unions into Gay Marraige leaving the
unsuspecting public confused into to thinking they are one and the same. Some we have to head them off at the pass.

The Religious Right and the Cultural Conservativeshave announced that they are putting Homosexual Issues and Gay Marrgiage into the GOP Platform and this is the biggest issue for them in the Next Election. These are formidible groups in the Republican Party
and Bush cannot ignore them. Forewarned is forarmed.

The can and will hit each of our candidates on this issue.

[KittyWampus]

46. It Won't Be BUSH Attacking Gay Marriage

It will be his Fundie Flying Monkeys doing it for him.

Dean hates family values.
Dean wants to destroy American Families.

I can hear Pat Roberstson now. :(

[Classical_Liberal]

52. They will do that with any of the dem candidates.

. Count on it.

[lastliberalintexas]

61. Um, Edwards

supports civil unions. As do all of our candidates. But you're right, this will be an effective strategy used by the repubs against Dean and only Dean.

My God! How has the man gotten this far? I mean all of these attack that the right wing will use against Dean, and they don't work against the others as well? Yep- only Dean (and Max Cleland) is weak on defense. Only Dean (and any other Dem in the RW's minds) supposedly wants to raise taxes. Only Dean (oh, and the other 8 people running) supports civil unions. Only Dean (and 60% of the American public) opposed an invasion of Iraq without the UN.

Only Dean. And we know that no man can be an island unto himself. He's screwed. And so is any other Dem. That does it. I'll just vote for Shrub.

/sarcasm/


Don't you people understand that the people on whom this kind of rhetoric works ALREADY think this about every single, solitary Dem? And not just our elected officials- you and me and everyone evil enough to vote for a Dem. But you continue to use this as an excuse for why anyone other than your candidate will lose. I am a Dean supporter, but I think he and several others have a very good chance to beat Shrub. And the same lame, bigoted, prejudiced ads will run against them all. Shrub and his guys probably already have the scripts for the ads ready. They are just waiting to see which name must be inserted.

on edit- This last part was not directed at any particular poster. i was using the generic "you"- just wanted to make that clear!

[lcordero]

7. Bush* is in the closet

I wonder what would happen if Dean "outs" him by saying something like "that's a fine thing you are doing attacking your own kind":evilgrin:

The fundie types will jump ship in a hurry

[formactv]

10. A more mature way to express that...

I know you are but what am I?

[xchrom]

11. the dem candidate has to make the bushco lies

the number one issue.
whether anyone likes it or not -- the lies told by this admin must be given the madison ave treament -- turned into soundbites and repeated adnauseum as biblical truth.
bushco has to be chained like marleys ghost. never on the offense -- always, always on the defence.
from the deficits to the ''war'' to the halls of montezuma.

[Zynx]

12. About the $200 million in ads...

allow me to be contrarian. When Bush begins his massive ad offensive, I think all of the coverage of "Bush opens his massive coffers" and things like that will actually hurt him and make him look like a tool of the special interests. The fact that he is using $200 million will probably get much more attention than his ads and may well backfire.

[blm]

14. You're depending on the corporate media to focus on THAT?

Good luck.

[KaraokeKarlton]

16. If it becomes a battle over gay rights, Dean WILL easily win

Dean won't run from that debate and there is NO ONE, and I mean NO ONE who can beat him on this issue. Anyone who watched the Civil Unions backlash play out in Vermont knows that Dean has no problem winning people over on this issue. I haven't seen anyone silence critics of gay rights in the way Dean can. In fact, he makes them look idiotic for even questioning gay rights and civil unions, and there is NO arguing the points he makes because he ties it in with patriotism, heroism and human decency. Even the majority of conservatives don't care about homosexuality anymore. The only ones who do are the zealously religious right wingers. Those votes are already lost over abortion. What a lot of people don't realize is that the Vermont battle over Civil Unions attracted the usual religious zealots to come up here and embark on a disgusting hate campaign against homosexuality. It backfired, disgusted voters and damn near everyone in the state was more angry over the hate campaign than they had been over the signing of that bill. This was a very, very ugly election season. The ones who were voted out were the moderate Republicans who voted in favor of civil unions because they didn't have the support of their party. Try as they might, they couldn't beat Dean, even though the Vermont Progressive Party is pretty influential here in Vermont. There is nothing Bush and the GOP can do or say that Dean hasn't already successfully countered and dealt with on this issue. It doesn't matter who the nominee is, this is going to be brought up by the right just because of a few small victories coming for the gay community. I'll tell you right now, the ONLY one who can survive what is coming is Howard Dean. Not only will he survive that fight, he will win it. Seriously, have you noticed how almost no reporter even brings this issue up anymore when talking to Dean? That's because those who have tried have been silenced by him and the way he talks about it makes people feel okay about civil unions.

It is true that for typical candidates, the tax issue would hurt them. It's different with Dean because of the way he frames it. He makes it very easy for people to associate the tax cuts with rising property taxes, cuts in services, education, social programs and tuition for college. He also talks about changing the tax system so that the burden doesn't fall on the middle and lower classes. Because of the way he frames the issue, it's a winner. Under normal circumstances, it wouldn't be, though. It will work this time. I'm normally all for lower taxes, but I'm really opposed to the cuts when there is a deficit like the one we have and states are suffering. Most people who make the connection want the cuts repealed.

Dean has proven that nothing thrown at him slows him down or hurts him. Kerry supporters are still upset over the whole "Bush-Lite" thing because it stuck to Kerry like glue and his supporters feel it has prevented people from supporting Kerry. Now look at all the crap hurled at Dean. Everytime his opponents and their supporters think they came up with something to sink his campaign it only boosts him up more.

Now, which candidate stands the best chance against Bush, one who has already lost supporters because the label of "Bush Lite" stuck to them, or one who has been attacked from all sides and just gotten stronger from it? I'll stick with the guy who has already proven himself to be able to easily deflect and gain strength from the attacks, thank you very much.

[xchrom]

17. never under estimate

americas appetite to disenfranchise a minority group.
there's way too much history of americans willingness to bite hate bait.
combine that with right's message of ''tax and spend socialists'' with ''special'' gay rights and you have powerful weapons for a vry motivated base.
leftists must learn -- go on the offensive -- and don't go off. it will sound extreme -- but those willing to show up at the polls must be convinced that nothing short of extreme criminal behavior has happened on their watch.

[mitchum]

27. Your's is a very wise post,, xchrom

[KaraokeKarlton]

40. Have you watched this battle play out anywhere before?

I have seen it first hand. The battle will get ugly, very ugly...but it will be the hatred, not gay rights that turn voters off. Keep in mind that almost 70% of Vermont opposed Civil Unions and were upset about the bill being signed. By the time the election came (6 months later) about 70% of the state supported Civil Unions. Dean is great at talking about the subject and anyone whose heard him defend Civil Unions knows full well he is the best voice to speak on the issue. He can silence criticism and make even the strongest critic look like a complete idiot.

[AP]

19. Dean's MOV in VT decreased every year, and he almost lost in 2000 after

the CU thing. And that's liberal, green VT that had a problem with it. Also, notice that VT has a Republican governor today.

Reporters are not bringing up the issue now because they want to save it for after he gets nominated. (They don't want to jeopardize the chance of nominating him.)

[Larkspur]

20. The reason his MOV decreased had to do with the hot topic items

he was forced to deal with. Unlike Kerry et al, Dean did not shrink from defending the postitions on hot topics, like school funding and civil unions. Yes, they were forced upon Dean, but after the legislature passed bills to deal with them, Dean owned the issue and fought for them, despite public outcry. Guess what, those measures that were passed are still there despite a Republican governor.

Dean should have lost in 2000 after the civil unions bill was signed. The Right wing funded Ruth Dwyer's campaign very well, but she lost because Dean fought back and fought back hard and caused Dwyer to make mistakes, costly mistakes.

[AP]

25. I'm not sure whether you're saying CU was or wasn't a problem in 2000

That it was so easy to manipulate in VT, a liberal state, to reduce a long-serving, once popular governor's MOV to the point it was should be a pretty good indication of how that issue will play in the rest of the country.

And I'm going to guess that Bush is going to have better RW funding than even Ruth Dwyer.

[KaraokeKarlton]

42. Ruth Dwyer got help from national RW figures

Some of them even came up here to campaign for her.

Civil Unions wasn't a problem for Dean in 2000, or the other Democrats. The ones it was a real problem for were the incumbent Republicans who supported Civil Unions. If Pollina had not have run, Dean would have gotten between 60% and 70% of the votes, closer to 70%. In a 3 way race he still got over 50%.

[AP]

64. Why'd she get help? Because Republicans saw CU as winnable issue

They don't throw good money after bad in politics.

[Larkspur]

72. Yes, Republicans do squander money

Rove did it for Bush in 2000 when he spent $12.4 million and still lost California to Gore by double digits. Gore hardly spent anything in California.

The Repukes thought that they could beat Dean in his last re-election bid over civil unions and Act 60, but they underestimated his fighting spirit. And I think that Dean learned in that election that when Dems fight back against the Reichwing smear machine, Dems can cause Repuke candidates to falter and stumble during the campaign and lose voter's support. I think that lesson is what is carrying Dean through his current drive to the Presidency and it's working.

[snoochie]

22. Now THAT'S a scary thought.

"Reporters are not bringing up the issue now because they want to save it for after he gets nominated. (They don't want to jeopardize the chance of nominating him.)"

:scared:

[KaraokeKarlton]

43. It would be if it were true, but it's not

All you have to do is listen to any old interview where he talks about it once to be confident that he can deal with the issue brilliantly. He honestly does. Okay Dean archivists...does anyone have an old transcript or interview on a media file to show people just how great Dean deals with the Civil Unions issue? I'll look around too.

[KaraokeKarlton]

41. That had nothing to do with Civil Unions

It was mostly over Act 60, the education funding and the growth of the Vermont Progressive Party in the state.

We have a very good Republican governor. Jim Douglas is about the same as Jim Jeffords. He wouldn't have won if Anthony Pollina from the VT Progressive Party hadn't of run. He lost it for Doug Racine, basically. Con Hogan also ran as an Independent. Jim Douglas, Doug Racine and Con Hogan all worked very closely with Dean.

Early on before Dean caught on, reporters brought it up every time he was interviewed. He effectively silenced them. He does such a great job on the issue that they won't ask him about it anymore.

[bread_and_roses]

56. You know, in NY

we put together a coaltion that managed to associate rising property taxes, cuts in services/education/health care, and rising college tuition with tax cuts to the RICH, not to ordinary working people. Dean could do that too, if he had a clue about working class/working poor issues.

[w4rma]

21. DrFunkenstein, you can write something similar about ANYONE who goes

up against $200 million in corporate cash. Focus on Dean and you lose the big picture on this issue.

[Mz Pip]

30. This is so true

The Morrises of this Administration are collecting crap on all of the viable candidates. Dean, Clark, Kerry, or whoever the nominee is will have to be prepared for it.

They're testing the waters with this Morris stuff. IF it appears to stick then it will be magnified big time for the General ELection. THe same stuff is happening with Clark and the "innuendos" by Shelton and Schwartzkovf. See if it sticks then ahmmer on it later.

MzPip
:dem:

[RevolutionStartsNow]

23. Please tell us

how it will be any different if Kerry or someone else in the nominee.

Kerry is extremely strong on gay rights as well, as has been pointed out here many times.

Kerry in fact has been described as a "champion" of gay rights.

This is going to be used again all of the candidates.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/954157.asp
All they will have to say about Kerry is that he wants to lift the ban on gays in the military.

The reason Dick Morris has prepared these ads against Dean is because he is the Dem that they most expect to face.

By the way, these kinds of attacks by Morris are why we are going to opt out of public financing.

[virtualobserver]

24. If Kerry can't beat Dean, he can't beat Bush.

And I have yet to see an analysis from Morris that proved to be correct. He is full of sh*t.

[blm]

26. John Glenn had Reagan beat by the numbers in 84. He didn't beat Mondale

in the primary, though.

[LuminousX]

29. So the system doesn't work, cancel the primaries, give the nomination to

whoever is 'polling' better than Bush.

[blm]

57. no...but we're supposed to LEARN from history

and not repeat it.

Why reach for hyperbole to make a point, anyway? I notice that alot around here.

[displacedvermoter]

74. I noticed how quickly you jumped into the Heinz-Kerry Pre-Nup Thread

from Slate, and you didn't seem to like it. Don't blame you, the thread was stupid, kinda like this one. I notice a lot around here, and, as I'e said before, it is frightening how much mutual slash and burn we engage in.

[dsc]

32. Back when Glen was running

Reagan was still beatable. Mondale was also winning head to head polls. It was only early to mid 84 that Reagan took off in the polls and that was after Glenn withdrew.

[dsc]

33. ad wise there is little to no difference

between this "The former Vermont governor has also proposed repealing most if not all of Bush's tax cuts. Again, polls indicate that Americans break about 50-50 on this issue. But Bush will say that Dean wants to raise taxes - a 2-to-1 no-no in public-opinion polls." and what could be run against Kerry.

Here is the ad that I would run if I were the REpublicans

When I can to Washington I told you I would give your money back. And I did. Taxpayers, on average, got (fill in the average figure). Now Dean want's to take that back. Tell him you want your (fill in the average figure).

When I came to Washington I told you I would give your money back. And I did. Taxpayers, on average, got (fill in the average figure). Now Kerry wants to take (fill in the average figure minus the middle class cuts) back. Tell him you want your (second figure).

The big difference will be Dean can actually run ads refuting it since he would be abiding by funding limits. And since he didn't use the same misleading rhetoric in regards to taxes in the primaries (like Kerry is now) he won't sound like a hypocrite when he does so. Bush will run those ads into the ground and Kerry won't get his message out at all.

The same thing will happen in regards to gays.

Again here is the ad.

Picture of a gay pride parade with some of the more bizarre elements. Howard Dean says he wants these people to serve in the military. He is proud he signed a bill letting them have the benefits of marriage. He wants employers to protect them from good Christians using their God given right to hire who they want. What is next (picture of two guys in tuxes kissing) gay marriage.

Replace Dean with Kerry and you have my anti Kerry ad.

Not one iota of difference. And remember there are no pics of a signing ceremony so those can't be used.

[sandnsea]

34. tax hikes & Iraq

They won't even need to bring in gay marriage. These two issues, Howard's gaffes, particularly terrorists are soliders, a couple of flip-flops and that's it for Howard. It's going to be so easy for Rove to defeat Howard, the writing is on the wall.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

67. Really, CU isn't anywhere on my anti-Dean radar

His tax ideas and weakness on foreign policy are more than enough to sink him. CU is just a bonus issue the GOP can smear him with in a "whisper" campaign of innuendo.
Dean is so ripe for skewering by the conservative/moderate agenda.

[Hawkeye-X]

73. NYFM

It's time that you read something else.

Read http://www.deandefense.org and you'll be AMAZED on how much of a broad foreign policy he has. His tax idea is sound because he wants to roll back to Clinton era tax base, and re-cut the taxes to appropriate levels for everyone involved, including the poor, middle class, and wealthy that works for everyone.

Hawkeye-X

[burr]

36. Dick Morris a weapon??

I think Dick Morris is more of a vulnerability, an extreme defect for shrub's 2004 election campaign.

I would love to see Carville go up against Morris anytime!!! :spank:

[polpilot]

53. Anyone concerned about anything Morris says is disturbed & misled.

Dean '04...

[burr]

65. I couldn't of stated it more directly...

nicely put! :thumbsup:

[Skwmom]

37. They will also paint Dean as an unstable serial liar

which really is not going to be hard to do. By doing so they will nullify any hopes that a VP choice could shore up Dean's weak points (for example his draft dodging).

[LuminousX]

39. Seeing he didn't dodge the draft it isn't an issue

[Skwmom]

44. Let me see. He goes to the draft board, takes his own x-rays, gets

a medical exemption and then hits the ski slopes and does construction work (plus lets not forget about the partying Dean admitted to). Somehow this doesn't pass the smell test. Sounds like evading the draft to me and I think many people will conclude the same thing.

[burr]

47. let me guess...

you're also a draft-dodger-Billary-loathing, Carter caused stagflation and world terrorism, book of virtues, hippie killing, pro-life, anti-nationalized-universalized healthcare, family sharing, Reno hates Oklahoma City kinda christian lovin patriot.

AND GOD BLESS U BROTHER!!! :yourock:

[Sean Reynolds]

45. Doc, you do know Kerry and Gephardt are also in that GOP ad?

So why is this only an attack on Dean? Because he's pissed? Well I A LOT of America is pissed at this point, and I'm sure more will be come 2004.

[DrFunkenstein]

68. Dean Is More Than Pissed In The Ad

He is spooky. And even Dean supporters can't tell me otherwise. Who the hell says "Thank you very, very much" like that?

You are right about Gep and Kerry. Kerry's comment was a political mistake, and will haunt him in the general election. But it is an isolated incident. You have Dean saying the he "supposes" Saddam gone is a good thing - let alone his sons (another gaffe). Dean is quoted joking that Bush would put burqas on schoolgirls - a direct comparison to the Taliban. It sounds fine to us, but we are not average Americans.

Gep's "miserable failure" tirades will also haunt him, although they may have something to do with his lead in Iowa.

And while many Americans are upset at the situation in Iraq, that doesn't make them any more willing to take up someone who seems like Jake LaMotta on a bad day. Not too many people like to confuse their President for Raging Bull. It makes them kinda edgy and stuff.

[gardenista]

48. Based on Morris' previous performance, I'd say it's better

to have him used against you as a weapon than to have him on your side.

Dick Morris is an idiot and a turncoat and a GD shoe-licker.

Ok, I had to get that out of my system!

He has been wrong about just about everything lately. Glad to see he's making dire predictions about Dean. I consider it a good sign.

[Zynx]

54. I like it when Morris predicts our demise.

He thought the Republicans would lose Congress last year and that Gore would lose NJ. Go Dick! What ever he says, the opposite will happen!

[xchrom]

49. whether it's dean or anyone else

the dem candidate must make bushco's criminality the issue.
the repukes will use hate bait -- and the dem base must be ready for it.
but the dem candidate must never, ever go off the issue that bushco committed HUGELY illeagal acts to benefit bushco cronies.
it has been a regime of special interest politics in the extreme.
the dem base will have to get the back of any dem candidate on the hate bait issues -- and that base will have to be as fierce as a right -wing fundie.

[helleborient]

50. Just remembering the Repub attemtps to create a culture war...

Against Bill Clinton's campaign.

"A place called Hope" and "A bridge to the 21st Century" were quite powerful.

Also, remember, Walter Mondale tried to propel a negative image against "Morning in America."

It's not easy, Republican or not, to fight surging tides of optimism!

[killbotfactory]

58. How is Dean's position on civil unions significantly different,,,

Than Kerry's?

Do you really think the repubs will care that Kerry wants to keep middle class tax cuts? No. It will be "Kerry wants to increase your taxes!"

Dean will at least have the experience from his past fights on civil unions to draw on, and buttloads of cash and supporters to fight the bush machine.

[blm]

59. Kerry fought the battle for gays for 18 years.

You think he's inexperienced on that issue?

Dean is the one acting as if HE is the one who spearheaded gay issues all by himself. The fact that Kerry did it first, for longer, and more often seems to be lost.

[dsc]

60. No his point was that

Kerry is inexperienced in being challenged on it. Kerry's only tight race was against the most pro gay Republican in the nation. Dean faced the full force of the Religious Right.

[blm]

62. Kerry faced it in a CONGRESS that was hostile to gays

and legislation that advocated for gay issues. You think it was easy to do that back then? You think it was a cakewalk to consistently do so for so long? Kerry faced MILITARY backlash along with congressional backlash when he said gays must be allowed to serve openly in the military.

Kerry helped CLEAR that path that later politicians could more easily maneuver. Shame that self-interest for other political agendas fail to note his yeoman's work on that issue.

[killbotfactory]

63. There is nothing wrong with Kerry on gay rights issues.

But has he ever faced a movement like "take back vermont"? It's probably a good indication of what he'll be up against in the 2004 election.

[blm]

66. No...he only faced the CIA< FBI, and the entire Dem and GOP powerstructure

over the most intense years for any truthseeking Democrat...BCCI, IranContra and CIA drugrunning investigations went on for years, and all the while Kerry was being attacked daily in the press as a conspiracy theory nut and having his every move followed.

All that WHILE putting forth gay friendly legislation. He was one very unpopular Senator and even within his own party who did not want the boat rocked so severely.

[Octafish]

69. Dick Morris left some stuff out.

Dean was governor of a teeny tiny state. Bush was governor of a big state before he was selected to occupy the White House.

For new readers: Texas big. Dean small.

The other thing: The GOP owns the mass media.

Priceless.

[peaceandjustice]

70. how else do Texas and Vermont compare?

So Texas is big and Vermont is small...

and Texas has the highest homicide rate in the nation. Vermont has the lowest. Vermont is near the top in median income, Texas near the bottom. Texas is near the bottom in quailty of schools...I'm not sure about Vermont on this one but I'm confident it's at lest above the middle.

[Fleshdancer]

71. gay marriage issue...

I think it would be wise for Democrats to push this issue with Cheney since he and Dean agree on civil unions.