Who elected Bush President in 2000: FAUX News or the Supreme Court?

[VoteClark]

Many people contend that Bush won in 2000 because the Supreme Court stopped the ballot counting in Florida. I contend that this was not why Bush was elected. I think he was elected because of the botched false report by FAUX News that Gore won Florida. Why? I will explain:

New Hampshire has 4 electoral votes. Bush won with 271 needing 270 to win. Had New Hampshire voted in favor of Gore he would have won. So what is my point?

When FAUX News, in its' rush to be the first in inaccurancy and false information, declared Gore the winner, every political pundit said that Bush could not electorally win the election. And frankly, anyone that could add knew this as well. So in effect, all the Nader Supporters trying to get Nader to the magical number of 5% to get federal funding to the Green Party felt safe that Bush was gone and could vote Nader.

As a result, Nader got good votes in Hew Hampshire. If just 1/3 of Nader voters would have voted for Gore, he would have been president. This was also evident in Oregon. Nader got 4% of the vote in New Hampshire to his 2.74% average across the nation. Percentage wise that is pretty high in comparison.

Nader voters are not stupid, in fact they are very politically intelligent. I would think at least 1 out of 3 of them would have voted for Gore had they not falsly thought that Gore was a sure win.

On the other hand, let us look at what happened in Florida. When the state was called, all of the liberal and Democratic counties were polls were just about closed. But not the Northern and Western districts because they were in a different time zone. These conservative districts tied between Gore and Bush that were favored to go to Bush and the voter turnout was low.

So had FAUX News not reported Gore won, New Hampshire Nader voters would have voted for Gore and Western Florida Conservatives would have shown up and voted. As a result, Bush would have won Florida and Gore would have won New Hampshire, and Gore would have won Oregon by a larger margin then 7,000 votes.

What are your thoughts?


:kick:
J4Clark

[liberalmuse]

1. According to the book I'm reading...

it was Faux that really f*cked it up by having Bush's cousin call the election before the votes were counted. It set the tone for the next 36 days and embedded the 'Bush won' lie into millions of numb skulls.

[catzies]

8. I thought that Bush cousin worked at NBC, not Faux?

Are you reading Alterman's "What Liberal Media?" perchance?

[SyracuseDemocrat]

15. Bush's cousin was manning

the FNC Desk on election night.

[unfrigginreal]

2. My thoughts

Many people contend that Bush won in 2000 because the Supreme Court stopped the ballot counting in Florida.

Bush didn't win

I contend that this was not why Bush was elected.

Bush wasn't elected

So had FAUX News not reported Gore won, New Hampshire Nader voters would have voted for Gore and Western Florida Conservatives would have shown up and voted.

No, your conservative base would not have carried the day in Florida based on anything reported on the news. Bush lost Florida.

[sandnsea]

3. My husband just wants to wake up from his nightmare

He went to bed and Gore was President, sweet dreams. The next morning he woke up and.. WHAT THE FUCK???? It's like the election brought to you by Freddy Kruger.

Fox announcing was a horrible mistake and I don't think that one was an accident either. As to Oregon, we have mail-in ballots so I don't think Florida had any affect here at all. Our Nader-voters were pretty hardcore. I could be wrong and I sure don't know anything about New Hampshire.

[Skarbrowe]

4. Gore won Florida overwhelmingly.

Jeb Bush was elected Governor of Florida in 1998. From that moment on the fix was in. Katherine Harris under orders from Jeb Bush hired a Database Company to build a felon's list to keep as many African Americans and anyone else for that matter from being able to vote. When Database Co. told the Jeb Bush administration this list could not be used because they had asked for way to reaching guidelines..say your name in John Henry. Anyone in the country that had committed a felony at any time would be put on this list. No cross checking to see if you have the correct John Henry from Florida. I have read that possibly over 190,000 people might have been on this erroneous felon's list. When told by Database to NOT USE THIS INACCURATE INFORMATION, Katherine Harris said, oh we can use it, we will let each precinct straightened out who should or should not be on their list. The precincts were swamped and had no way of dealing with the phone calls that came in on election day. To the credit of some precincts, they refused to use the list, but, I know of people PERSONALLY who were not allowed to vote who had never been arrested for anything in their lives.

There was also in the infamous butterfly ballot that to older people as some not so older was very confusing when you were being rushed to vote because of extremely long lines behind you. What nutcase would put Pat Buchanan second on the ballot?? Teresa Lapore. She designed the butterfly ballot. Republicans kept yelling, well she is a Democrat. Truth is, she had filed Independent in the weeks before the election. There was a deeply, devious plot in this state from the moment Jeb Bush was elected to disenfranchise as many Democratic votes as possible.

Also, remember when all the networks called Florida for Gore right before 8PM, meaning a FEW people in the northwest part of the state might have been discouraged to vote, something I've never seen happened before blew me away. George W. Bush with his whole damn family goes on all the news stations saying...wait a minute..I don't think Gore has Florida. Because his baby brother had promised to deliver Florida to him by any means possible. All the exit polls had shown that people in Florida were voting for Gore. What we didn't know is that most of these votes were not being counted for all the devious reasons cooked up by Jeb Bush and Katherine Harris. This put the first DOUBT in the minds of the big Networks. Faux news KNEW they had to do something the way the counts were waffling back and forth so sometime in the middle of the next morning..what was it 2:20AM or so, Bush's cousin who was or is the head of Faux News decided to call the state of Florida for Bush. He did this, again, on erroneous and incomplete information. But, that was the start of the Bush Propaganda Juggernaut. Sad thing is, that the other spineless, you can't beat me that far ahead to the punch major news organizations jumped on the Faux News bandwagon and for purely CHILDISH reasons agreed with Faux News. From then on is was SORE/LOSERMAN because Faux News had appointed Bush president before the Supreme Court did 30 somthing days later. IF the count had been continued there is no real doubt in anyone's mind, who cares to think that is, that Gore had thousands of more voters in Florida than Bush.

I've read several books on the subject and was also down here picketing in front of the Broward County Courthouse when the Republican Brownshirts were storming the Miami/Dade Courthouse shutting down their manual count. It was the most horrifying time in my life concerning the direction of my country. I am still not over the shock.

We DO NOT live in anything close to a Democracy today. I know there has always been political shenanigans with elections. Not sure Kennedy got in without some unsavory help, but what I saw in Florida in 2000 will haunt me forever.

Oh, and you're comments about New Hampshire was it? Sorry. That could be part of it also. But, the state they needed was Florida and they knew it. Jeb made sure they got it. Now, I don't trust the voting machines being placed all over the country by rich Republican investors.

One last comment about Gore losing his own state of Tennessee. If anyone had followed Gore's voting record for the last several years of his political career, he had grown much more progressive than his state, which I consider a good thing, and it was no surprise to me that he lost it. He didn't need it.

Now we have the worst president and administration in the history of the United States.

Do you think we can change this in 2004?

Skarbrowe

[miamiheath1]

7. No Winners

You are so correct with your info. The corporations own both parties. There will be no change in '04, unless the whole system is gutted and started over. It's all a hypocrisy.

[VoteClark]

11. It doesn't matter who really wins Florida the votes will always go to Bush

No matter what the vote is, the State Legislature can also override the popular vote and select the electors anyway. We can't get Florida. The nice thing is we can do the same for California if they want to play dirty.

:kick:
J4Clark

[janx]

13. Oh my. Oh dear.

"I've read several books on the subject and was also down here picketing in front of the Broward County Courthouse when the Republican Brownshirts were storming the Miami/Dade Courthouse shutting down their manual count. It was the most horrifying time in my life concerning the direction of my country. I am still not over the shock."

I don't know exactly what I would have done if I had been in your place. I know I have been depressed and upset ever since, but I don't know how you coped after an experience like that.

There are a couple of pictures of this on the web, but only a couple that I know of. How many people would you say were in the brownshirt crowd?

The reason I ask is that I think it is inevitable that something like this will happen again, and perhaps not only in Florida.

[DrFunkenstein]

14. I Watched The Whole Thing From Brazil

And, coincidentally, I also witnesses the 9/11 attacks from Brazil, as well. Thousands of people died as result of each.

[Cassandra]

5. What time did Faux call Florida for Gore?

Were the polls still open in New Hampshire?

[Skarbrowe]

6. ?

I can't remember when Faux News called for Gore if they ever did. I was watching NBC when they called the state of Florida for Gore about 7:50 PM. New Hampshire must be on Eastern Time so I would assume the polls were closed in New Hampshire. I was so excited that NBC had called the state for Gore than I didn't check to see what Faux News had done. I don't go anywhere near that channel. :) I was celebrating when they brought the Bushie family on air to quite so obviously discount the call because of what they KNEW.

Yes, I guess Nader pulling the amount of votes that he did had the end result of hurting Gore. But, it was the fiasco in Florida that lost Gore the election..oh..and maybe the fact that he didn't have a campaign worth crap. Sorry, but I liked Gore and he turned me off everytime he did a speech. The debates were a disaster. Gore is so intelligent but he has this ridiculous way of talking. God, how anyone could make an idiot like Bush even come close to winning a debate. grrrr

Oh well, rotten history. Nothing can be done now. I'm not even sure voting will help anymore. I will vote though. Always.

Skarbrowe

[VoteClark]

10. FAUX was first so the others followed in line

See, what one channel does effects the others. They compete to say the first to report breaking news. If FAUX reports that Flordia who won first, then people turn to that station. Nobody wants news last. So they compete with eachother. FAUX reported first, so then ABC did right after that, then CNN. CNN couldn't get the numbers to prove with confidence that Gore won, so they just said so because FAUX did. Florida was effected because the polls were not closed. NH the polls were still open for another hour.


:kick:
J4Clark

[BarbariansAtTheGate]

9. I thought Gore

lost his home state of Tennesse and that's why it fell onto Florida's shoulders.... *shrugs*

[sabbat hunter]

12. i agree

about the real key being gore losing tennessee and not florida/
if he had managed to carry his own home state, the fiasco in florida wouldnt of mattered.

i went back and checked. no president in recent history has won an election, but lost his home state.

peace
david
:hippie:

[SyracuseDemocrat]

16. Both

n/t.

[BarbariansAtTheGate]

17. Did you actually have an argument?

what does n/t stand for? Not true? Well, prove it then.