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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:15 AM
Original message
can there be unconditional love at a personal level in any form?
Edited on Sat Apr-07-07 04:17 AM by wildhorses
doesn't personal boundries by definition exclude the chance for it :shrug:

and yes, this is the kind of stuff that wakes me up in the middle of the night :eyes:
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Omphaloskepsis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:19 AM
Response to Original message
1. No, I wish I could expand on that.
I need a smoke. Maybe later.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:25 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. somehow i think you captured the essence of what i was trying
to say quite succintly :rofl:
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fizzgig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:28 AM
Response to Original message
3. i think so
with animals, absolutely...i love my kitties without question or hesitation

with people, i also say absolutely...there are people in my life i will love no matter what, provided they don't kill me or someone else i love (or some such other dark extreme). ok, maybe not unconditionally, but pretty damn close :shrug:
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:36 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. somehow i never thought of animals
Edited on Sat Apr-07-07 04:37 AM by wildhorses
in the context of this question

they are just beyond the human experience, their natural instinct for love is much farther advanced than ours. i am just glad they have the patience waiting for us to catch up.

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fizzgig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:42 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. eloquently put
i always think of them as furry people, but, as you so beautifully stated, they are so much more evolved than us when it comes to love
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:47 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. thanks--
:blush:

:hug:
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Dastard Stepchild Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:28 AM
Response to Original message
4. Toward my cats and dogs, yes...
Because they are incapable of profoundly disappointing and/or hurting me in the ways that a human could.

Toward people? I find it doubtful that I could experience unconditional love. There are certain things that, were they to be done to me by another person, would inspire me to withdraw my feelings of love. I aspire to this form of love, to some degree, but recognize the challenges in achieving it.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:38 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. funny, how we turn to the animals to show us the way
there is something to this :think:

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blogslut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:41 AM
Response to Original message
7. My love for my child is unconditional
n/t
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:47 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. i don't think my parents showed me this
i always had to do something to gain their attention...to just be was not good enough :shrug:
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fizzgig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:49 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. ...
:hug:
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:53 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. aww---
:hug:

they are real go-getters, me, not so much ;)
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blogslut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:52 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. That is unfortunate
I hope you find unconditional love. It does happen and it can happen to you.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 05:07 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. its a nice thought
but, so far...hasn't happened

i truly doubt the existence of it
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boston bean Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 08:40 AM
Response to Reply #16
23. do you have any children? when I had mine, it changed my whole
life. I never thought I could love so much. And that in turn gave me great hope and love in return.

Now, I'm not saying to run out and have a baby. Sometimes in life we have to just accept who we are and where we came from and where we are and use that as a building block to move forward and then things start to fall into place. Atleast that is how it was with me.

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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #9
51. I also get curious about people complaining of attention deficits
Sometimes it would be nice to not have a parent watching you, ready to say 'what the fu$% are you doing?' I think at least 75% of the time we siblings did our own thing. Heck, for me, 50% of the time I was just either sitting there with a book, or riding my bike or shooting baskets.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #51
65. huh?
you lost me here :dunce:
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trof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #7
30. yep
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tblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:55 AM
Response to Original message
14. For my child. I love him unconditionally.
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tblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 04:55 AM
Response to Original message
15. delete
Edited on Sat Apr-07-07 04:55 AM by tblue
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 06:07 AM
Response to Original message
17. Yes.
It explains why some people stay married to their lovers who cheat or do other mean things to them.

(I never thought of that perspective until now. It doesn't make doing those awful things right, but it does explain a lot of things and a lot of people in this world too. The cheaters and other miscreants should be grateful, IMHO.)
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #17
39. so you think that because they stay with them that it means
they 'love' the person? doesn't have anything to do with finances or other mundane factors and constraints :shrug:
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skygazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. As someone who stayed with an abusive spouse
I can attest that in my case anyway love - unconditional or otherwise - had nothing to do with it. It was pure fear - fear of worse punishment if I tried to leave, fear of what would happen to my kids if the worst happened, fear of being alone with three kids, no income and incredible debt if I did manage to get away (which was exactly what happened).

There is a warped and tortured part of your psyche that makes you mistake the dependence you feel on those people as love. For a while. With any luck, you eventually realize that you're clinging to the very thing that is destroying you.

I now have to go rinse my brain with Clorox for even delving into those memories. :scared:
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. sorry--
:hug:

see my post #36 in this thread.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 06:14 AM
Response to Original message
18. perfection of any state -- is an ideal.
the purpose of conceiving it -- is to move THROUGH time and space towards that state -- and hopefully review progress or lack of progress as you go.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #18
31. i agree and while the parent/child association is a strong
argument i still think condtions are demanded from both sides.

a child 'expects' (just by virture of the fact of being)to be taken care of and a parent 'expects' that child to grow and learn to the best of their capabilities.

the human body 'enforces' some aspect of boundries as a given.
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QMPMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 07:07 AM
Response to Original message
19. I love my husband, kids, parents and sister unconditionally. n/t
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BuelahWitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 07:17 AM
Response to Original message
20. I think SOME people can love others unconditionally
Most cannot, not even family.
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Guava Jelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
21. Only if you want it to.
Love is tricky word.
Love isn't spared by time or change.It is living and grows
and that it is living it can also die if not taken care of.
But I'll let better educated minds take this one

John Powell
The only love worthy of a name is unconditional.

unknown
You have to believe love is unconditional before you can actually start meeting its conditions.

Harold J. Duarte-Bernhardt
True love is always unconditional. Healthy, loving relationships are never unconditional

Duke Ellington
Love is supreme and unconditional; like is nice but limited

Martin Luther King, Jr
I believe that unarmed truth and unconditional love will have the final word in reality. This is why right, temporarily defeated, is stronger than evil triumphant.

Brian Tracy
The greatest gift that you can give to others is the gift of unconditional love and acceptance.


:shrug:










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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #21
32. i love the paradox of this one---
unknown
You have to believe love is unconditional before you can actually start meeting its conditions.


it states perfectly what i am trying to wrap my brain around :thumbsup:

thanks for these :hug:

:hi:
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Guava Jelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #32
58. you are welcome
:)
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boston bean Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 08:35 AM
Response to Original message
22. I think that the only uncoditional love is a parent for a child. This is not always the case
but it is the only place you will find it, that is my belief.

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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
24. dogs
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #24
41. dogs are better than persons
ever noticed how dog spelled backwards is god ;)
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hippiechick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 03:13 PM
Response to Reply #24
61. I was going to post the very same thing.
:hi:
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MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
25. Unconditional love does not rule out boundaries
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #25
40. care to expound on that thought...?
as it is said is as it will be!
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MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #40
55. To love someone, to have that feeling, is an unconditional state
meaning, you can't will yourself out of it even if the beloved somehow violates your values or abuses you somehow. Consider the number of children who love their parents despite abusive behavior or the spouses who are terrorized yet somehow still feel a sense of love for their abuser.

To set boundaries can be an act of love or of self preservation. Its like saying, I may well love you but I will not permit you own me.

To love someone unconditionally does not mean that one must submit to whatever one's beloved says or does. We all have choices about our actions or our reactions to others. One cannot be said to be loved if all that one has done is give oneself away. What then is left to love?
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MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #40
56. Delete/dupe
Edited on Sat Apr-07-07 02:50 PM by MichiganVote
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hippywife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 09:25 AM
Response to Original message
26. I know there is.
My husband and I were just talking and he walked up and kissed me. Then I looked in the mirror. I'm doing housework and haven't done a thing with my appearance since I rolled out of bed this morning. It always amazes me that when I look this bad, he can even think about loving me without ever stopping to ask why. LOL
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WritingIsMyReligion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 09:30 AM
Response to Original message
27. Hey, I think about that stuff, too.
Edited on Sat Apr-07-07 09:33 AM by WritingIsMyReligion
Often in the middle of the night. :crazy:

I say there could be, but it's exceptionally rare. Only my animals do I love unconditionally.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. yes, animals are way more advanced in this area
glad to know i am not the only nut that wakes up thinking this stuff :silly:

:hi:
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #29
50. I see people saying that they love their animals unconditionally
not the reverse. My dogs are happy to see me, and follow me around, and sometimes mourn and whine when I am not there, but alot of that is their expectation that I will play with them, feed them, and take them places. They don't spend alot of time thinking about my needs or desires.
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Nikia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. My dog almost always hangs out with my husband and I
When my husband is home, even when we are pretty much doing our own thing and ignoring him. When my husband is gone, he sits at the top of the stairs, looking out the window and barking at anything that he hears or sees. He is always concerned if my husband or I get emotionally or physically hurt. He is a creature of base desires though. He will always try to get food, even if my husband and I are eating it at the time. I don't know how he would act if we stopped feeing him and ignored him when he barked at us and tossed around his food dish.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #50
63. yes, i think in order to fit the definition of unciodtional it has to
go both ways...otherwise there have been conditions, right? :crazy:
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
28. i love my brother pretty unconditionally.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:40 AM
Response to Reply #28
33. yes, and i mine
although i notice we both qualify the statement with the word 'pretty'

i like to think i love all my family unconditionally but, how can i when sometimes i don't even like them :P

:hi:
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #33
35. there are times when i dont like him, but i always love him
:hi:
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skygazer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
34. I think it's possible
I have 3 children who I love unconditionally. Even if one of them did something completely heinous, I would continue to love them, though I would abhor what they did and would not protect them from the consequences (I would probably project any hatred toward myself, taking on part of the guilt - it's what moms do). But I can't imagine not loving them.

I think it's more problematical for others in our lives. I think it's certainly possible for some people to love their spouse or family unconditionally but not for others. I've been let down badly a number of times by both lovers and family so I don't think I could let go of those fears enough to do it.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. yes, i think fear is at the base of it all
fear is the opposite of love, i think :shrug:

:hi:
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buddhamama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
37. define love
for me unconditional love-love in any form-is independent of the other person.

it is something we feel, not something we are 'made' to me feel.

what is love. the problem in imo, are the expectations we place on the word love.

i love my son, my family and my friends unconditionally.

they need not do anything for me to love them, it just is.

if i went the rest of my life without speaking to them again, the love in my heart would remain.

we all love inspite of ourselves and eachother- unconditional love. :hug:
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. love is a verb
and action word

i guess in your sense then a feeling is an action

:hug:

perhaps to show love is a better way to phrase it?

i have been told that i think too much :P

feel free to tell me to STFU :dunce:
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Guava Jelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #37
60. ...
:loveya: M'friend :)
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gemdem Donating Member (975 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
42. To love without conditions
is the only way that I know how to love. To apply conditions, that is "I'll love you if..." is something that I'm not able to understand or do. Loving unconditionally means that I sometimes am hurt, but I'm hurt far less than often than I have the love that I give returned.

:-)
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Radical Activist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
44. There can be
but it would ultimately be unhealthy and self destructive.
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SPKrazy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
46. Nope
just an ideal

it's all conditional though, right?

anyone love someone no matter what?

doesn't seem to happen.

:shrug:
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SPKrazy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #46
53. clarify further-for kids yes i agree
Edited on Sat Apr-07-07 03:00 PM by Southpawkicker
perhaps one may still feel love... but actions may speak otherwise?

I don't know, i feel i would and will always love my son, so perhaps that is unconditional.

other love, for other people, changes happen, things happen.

:shrug:

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enigmatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:29 PM
Response to Original message
47. Of course
I think the problem is alot of people mistake unconditional love for a "don't criticize them/defend them at all costs, even when they are horribly wrong", and that's has nothing to do w/ loving unconditionally..
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Left Is Write Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
48. There are absolutely no conditions on my love for my children.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:03 PM
Response to Original message
49. I have always seen unconditional love as kinda stupid or crazy
It means you will love somebody who treats you like crap or who acts like an a$$hole/bully/moran/liar/thief/etc. I am not gonna feel bad for being either unable or unwilling to do so. Fu$% that. It's not like I would keep score or a balance sheet or something, but there has to be a little quid pro quo in a relationship.
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wildhorses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #49
64. agape love is the only thing i can think of that fits the definition
parents have the condition that their children grow up
and children have the condition that they are cared for until they grow up

it just is...
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:49 PM
Response to Original message
54. Yes.
Pets give unconditional love. Oh, you meant people? Not sure. Very good question you posted here. I would think no, but the closest you can get is from parents who care about you. As far as people you meet along the way, maybe you can get somewhat close, but it would still never be the same you'd get from pets. Only they give true unconditional love, IMHO.
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Nikia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
57. I think so but it is important to establish boundaries
So that one doesn't get too hurt in that love. I'm still working on it myself.
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RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
59. For children, yes.
I love my kids unconditionally.

There are always conditions for love between two adults. And humans will always disappoint.

Color me cynical...

RL
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-07-07 03:26 PM
Response to Original message
62. No but conditions can be negotiable and also temporary.
:)
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