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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 09:35 AM
Original message
Our beloved dog bit a little girl this morning
I'm in shock but I know what has to be done. Why do they make us wait 10 days? I know the reasons but it just kills me that it has to be drawn out that long.

The little girl is ok. She has the red marks on her nose..god he could have hurt her so bad. I can't believe he did that...it was awful.
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Beausoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 09:54 AM
Response to Original message
1. I am so very sorry.
What a sad situation for everyone.

As a dog owner and dog lover, I can imagine how sad and shocked you are.

I am glad the little girl is ok.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I'm glad she's ok too.
I can't imagine the emotional trauma she experienced. Her Mom asked what she did to the dog and acted like it was no big deal. She said the girl just doesn't have luck with dogs that she's been bitten before by other dogs. She seemed shocked when I told her we would put the dog down.

I'm just so sad..we love him dearly. He's always been a sweetheart and he's always loved to play with kids.

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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #3
32. I think you're being a bit premature.
Why would you put the dog down for one incident??? Especially as she's caused other dogs to bite her. Evidently she's doing the provoking. Why punish the dog????

Don't let her play with your dog. Ever. She may have pulled it's ears, poked it in the eye or something else to hurt it and you canNOT blame the dog for biting someone that is deliberately (or even inadvertently) hurting it!


PLEASE - DO NOT PUT YOUR DOG DOWN. If you absolutely feel you can no longer have the dog in your house, please contact a local rescue group to see if someone will adopt him!

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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #32
34. Have you not read what I've posted..the child did nothing to cause it
the dog was walking away and suddenly growled and snarled while turning and leaping at her face. I saw it happen.

By the way..not all children who get bit provoke. My youngest son..now 27 was bitten..attacked at a toddler age by a neighbor's loose dog while he was sitting at a picnic table. The dog ran, jumped and bit through his eyelid. Luckily, his eye wasn't damaged. Another time my in-laws dog came running and reached up and bit his wrist and all he was doing was toddling down the sidewalk with his aunt.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. if the girl's been bitten before
she's doing something (maybe she did something on the last visit?) Maybe she stepped on his tail or paw and you guys didn't see it. (Maybe she's a reincarnated cat!)

And even *if* it's "unprovoked" - you don't kill a dog for ONE incident.

First: Take him to the vet for for a check up and make sure he's healthy.

If you still don't want him around, find him a home without kids.

Dogs are not disposable.

I was bit at age four in the face for bending down to pet a dog. I didn't "provoke" it either - meaing I didn't HURT it or anything, but the woman had told me he didn't like being petted and I did it anyway.


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zonkers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. I am with you. Stand by your dog! Now you know it s a problem, keep int on leash and
away from kids. The dog probably has been hassled by other kids and just judged from the kids size that she was the enemy. My little shihtzu never liked any kids -- just because they always ran after her thinking she was stuffed animal or something. I just managed the problem.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #37
40. My dog was in my kitchen..my 7 yr old granddaugher lives here, the dog
plays with kids all the time. This was totally bizarre vicious behavior from him.
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zonkers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #40
81. Hmmm. Your dog might be sick or not feeling well.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #35
55. Now that I think about it, she was doing something to the cat yesterday morning
and the cat was pissed. She was leaving for school, so she had her gloves on when kitty tried to scratch and bite her. I had to quick grab the cat..the cat was really mad. I didn't see what happened to cause it, I was helping my granddaughter get her coat and bookbag.

One thing the vet told me..that in particular, yellow labs are very protective of every person and animal in their house. This was over another incident a neighbor told me about..he would always reach over the fence and pet our dog. Then suddenly last winter, our dog began to growl & bark whenever he'd see the guy through our window seat windows. In early summer, the same neighbor told me he came to pet the dog during the winter time and the dog grabbed his glove in his mouth really hard. At that time, the vet didn't take it seriously..saying he felt the dog was probably trying to play with the glove. BUT, he also asked if my granddaughter had been outside at the time. That's when he told me about yellows being very protective and the dog could have been protecting her from what the dog perceived as a threat.

We didn't know what to think about the glove incident since we weren't informed right away. We have another yellow lab that comes to stay for a few days and to play occasionally and it has a glove issue..will take them right off your hand..so we weren't really sure whether it was our dog or the visiting dog.





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lukasahero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #55
89. So the little girl was tormenting the cat
Edited on Thu Jan-11-07 10:59 AM by lukasahero
and the neighbor likely reached over your fence and into your yard to try and pet a barking and growling dog but you are not seeing this as a problem with the behavior of people rather than the behavior of pets?
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #89
92. I didn't say that. Both times I knew it wasn't the cat or dog's fault.
I wasn't even sure if it was my dog since we keep another yellow lab occasionally but I assumed it was, since my dog clearly took a different attitude towards him during the winter months when he said it happened. The vet even questioned why it took my neighbor 6 months to tell me about it. Previously he and the dog had been fence buddies. I sometimes wonder if the guy did something to him but I'll never know. After that, the dog did become protective about all neighbors(I have numerous properties that surround my yard) and he doesn't like anyone getting too close to the fence now.

Yesterday's situation was clearly nothing the girl did. We both saw the same thing..the girl didn't do anything.
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zanne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #32
53. I agree; PLEASE DON'T KILL THE DOG.
If you put him up for adoption, he has a chance. All shelters will specify whether the dog should be with a family with small children or not. There are plenty of adults out there who would love to have your dog, I'm sure. Just give him a chance, PLEASE? It's nothing against you; it's just a plea for a dog's life.
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:01 PM
Response to Reply #32
54. Most shelters and rescue groups will not place aggressive dogs.
And for good reason, unfortunately. Nobody likes what the likely solution will be, but if the dog has become aggressive and unpredictable for whatever reason, it's incredibly irresponsible NOT to euthanize.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #54
56. the problem here is the
"whatever" - until you KNOW what is going on - don't you think it "premature" to kill the dog over one incident?

Maybe he's sick or injured. Maybe the kid did something to provoke it. And some rescue groups will place an otherwise "good dog" that has particular restrictions - like NO KIDS. . .

I think it's worth looking into and exhausting all other possibilities before killing the animal. He didn't do it for NO reason. There's *A* reason - even if we don't know what it is. And even if it's not the "dog's fault" (read, the dog doing it entirely unprovoked and without anything like health or triggers contributing) - I still think there are better solutions than to a knee jerk reaction of killing a perfectly good dog.
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #56
61. I would assume, and th OP has made very clear....
...that she intends to have the dog fully checked out before making the ultimate decision. Aggression testing is very easy to do (once any health reasons are ruled out).

If you read her description of what happened, the child did not do anything to provoke the attack. And if a dog will attack a child without provocation, it'll also attack an adult.

Please don't assume that I was suggesting she should just take the dog right out and have it euthanized. I was merely pointing out that if the dog ultimately is found to be aggressive, then it's unwise and irresponsible to place it in ANY other home, and most shelters and rescue groups will not do so.
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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #3
50. Deleting because I hadn't read all of your descriptions of what happened. Sorry.
Edited on Wed Jan-10-07 04:33 PM by sinkingfeeling
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Bunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 09:54 AM
Response to Original message
2. I'm sorry that happened.
It's good that the little girl is okay. How old is your dog? Will you have him put down, then?
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. Thank you Bunny,
Buddy's about 2 1/2. We got him at 9-12 months..a stray dog that was rescued. He's a yellow lab, a big normally sweet guy. What I witnessed today scared me to death. He had just greeted them at the door(they have a yellow lab too, so he always checks them out) Anyway, he had turned to walk away when he just turned around snarled and leaped at her face.

Yes, I have to have him put down. I have a granddaughter that lives here and two more grandchildren, much younger than 7 that come here too.
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Bunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. Well, as hard as this must be, you're making the right decision.
:hug:
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DrDan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #4
12. wow - this is sad
but your are to be commended for doing the right, responsible thing

too bad other dog owners are not as responsible as you
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. I don't see any other way
He lives for little kids to play with..and if he can't be around them I know he wouldn't be happy. I can't see any quality of life for him if he's kept in a kennel away from what he seems to really love.
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zonkers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #14
38. Glad I'm not your dog.
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jilln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #14
49. Get him a muzzle already.
Saying he wouldn't be happy without little kids to play with is like people who want their animals put down when they die because "they wouldn't be happy with anyone else."

If you really love your dog, do not kill him. There are so many solutions - new home, TRAINING, a MUZZLE... if one of the kids does something horrible do you immediately make arrangements to have THEM put down??
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Shell Beau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #49
57. You can't really compare dogs to kids!
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jilln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #57
58. Sure you can, in many ways.
Just because you personally don't see it that way doesn't mean it's not true. They are dependent on you like kids, you make a commitment to take care of them like kids.

I don't subscribe to the idea that animals are disposable. I don't think the original poster does either, and I think she'll work the problem out.
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Shell Beau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #58
60. Well I certainly don't think animals are disposable either, but
to compare putting down a dog who bites kids to kids misbehaving is silly. I hope she does find the perfect solution, but if this dog were to have really injured this child, she would have been held liable.
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jilln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #60
64. OK, I'm silly if that makes you happy.
I didn't say "kids misbehaving," I said if they did something horrible. Like presumably hurt someone else. Do you believe in the death penalty? Do you believe in the death penalty for assaults in which no one is injured?

Did you just want to assert your belief in human superiority, or do you actually have a problem with one of the remedies I suggested: training, rehoming or a muzzle?

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Shell Beau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #64
66. I do think the human race is superior. And no I don't typically
believe in the death penalty. She said she was going to consult with her vet. I think that euthanasia should always be a last resort. But I also know that some dogs are prone to bite even with training, etc. And I think it is far more cruel to keep a dog muzzled every time a person comes around. She said the dog did this out of the blue. It wasn't expected which means she would have to keep it muzzled all of the time practically. I hope she finds another option, I really do. I have 3 wonderful dogs of my own and would be devastated if I were in her shoes. But after weighing all options, if the dog is an aggressive dog, it may have to be euthanized. I think her vet will tell her what the best option for the dog is.
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jilln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #66
67. Another option: rehome to somewhere without kids
or do you think THAT'S too cruel too, and death is preferable?

You might remember that option from my previous posts.
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Shell Beau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #67
69. She said she didn't feel comfortable doing that.
Edited on Wed Jan-10-07 06:08 PM by Shell Beau
You are assuming it is just kids that make the dog bite. And muzzling is cruel to dogs if it is done a lot. My vet flat out refuses to muzzle dogs and so do I. If the dog is so viscious it might bite anyone, that should speak volumes.

On edit, I did say is should be a last resort which means all other options have been exhausted.
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jilln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #69
93. so now you've labeled the dog vicious...
no point in continuing
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #57
77. Of course someone can, even if you don't agree
My eldest cat IS like a child to me.
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Little Wing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
5. Every kid gets nipped on the nose once in their life
Including me, it's no biggie
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Hugin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
6. *sigh* That is bad news...
We think we know our pets, but, sometimes we don't.

Even my little Precious has taken a few snaps at people and she's bit my Dad's hand once.

Most of the time she's very loving and placid. But, I have to warn people constantly not
to touch her bone or food. Especially, if she doesn't know you. It has only been very recently
that I can without a fuss.

Keep vigilant.

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tinfoilinfor2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
7. My granddaughter was bitten by the beloved family dog when
she was six. Her sixteen year old brother was in the room at the time and saw the whole thing, and trust me, had it been his sister's fault through teasing the dog or something like that, he would have been the first to rat her out. But he said that the dog just simply turned on her and bit her in the face. Also a yellow lab and up to that point, very loving with both the kids. She needed stitches, and still has a scar in her cheek. They live on a farm, and the story was that the dog was given to a neighborhood farmer as a yard dog. But I have my suspicions that the dad disposed of him, because he was very angry and upset at the time.

Since you have little ones that come to your home, you really can't trust the dog not to bite again, so of course you are making the right decision. Nevertheless, still a painful one for you.
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cwydro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
9. Is there no other choice?
Couldn't you try to place the dog in a home with no children?

I had a dog who was rescued (RIP Magee) years ago, and she hated children...but since I never came into contact with any - it was no problem. She lived to ripe old age.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. I would be very afraid to place him elsewhere.
He normally loves children..he knows what time my granddaughter gets off school and waits for her to come home. The minute he sees her, his tail goes crazy and his body wiggles with excitement.

I don't know..this is a dog that my granddaughter dresses up with sweaters or puts on his raincoat to go outside. They run, play, wrestle, share snacks etc. He's showed no behavior towards children like this before. I'd be very afraid that someone might think like I did, that he's good with kids and then have him bite another child.

I have thought about what you are suggesting..I'd only do it as long as I'm assured he'd never be around a child.
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cwydro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. Well, it's certainly worth a try.
There are plenty of us curmudgeons who really have no contact with kids. . :D

Even now, with my current dogs...when children approach I simply say they are not friendly, rather than take a chance. I'm often amazed how many kids just come up quickly and ready to reach out. That is terrifying to me; how easy it would be for the dog to attack, just out of fear or being startled. My dogs are very sweet, but both rescued, so I really don't know their history with children. Better safe than sorry.

I do hope you find a way to save him. I have frequently seen shelter ads for dogs that specifically say "For a home with no children". So it's not unheard of.

I'm very glad the child is OK.
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ruiner4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #11
18. Well...give petfinder.com a look
just do a general dog search for your zip code, and on the right some dogs who have special needs have icons <a small kid with a slash over it>.. A good rescue org in your area will make sure it goes to an interested owner who understand in no certain terms that the dog can not be around children..

I got my GSD from a rescue in my area that lists on petfinder and they did a home inspection and wanted references.. They take it as seriously as adopting a child... And a good rescue will not euthanize if they cant find a home.
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philosophie_en_rose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #11
20. Is there a reason that the dog bit the little girl?
My childhood dog (RIP Penguin the dachshund) bit a little kid on the nose, after he head-butted Penguin a few times. His dumbass parents watched the whole thing, but - fortunately - realized they were in the wrong.

Just yesterday, one of my Yorkies snapped at me, because I roughly dried him off and didn't notice a bad cut on his foot. :( He didn't actually bite me, but only because he missed.

I would highly suggest consulting with a vet or another professional. Just because a dog has bitten someone, does not mean it's a bad dog.


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auntAgonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. So often the animal is blamed for the
stupidity of us humans. :(

There had to be a reason WHY the dog bit.
I hope there can be a way to save this animal. This girl has issues with dogs in the past according to the OP.

aA
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FedUpWithIt All Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. I agree,
our dog nipped at my ex husb once and we did not know until later that he had a problem with his hip. The dog "thought" my husband had hurt him.

The dog is now 10 years old and in the 7 yeras that followed he never did anything like it again.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #20
27. As far as I could see, she did nothing.
He'd greeted her by sitting upright on his two hind legs in a begging position like he usually does. She patted him and he dropped down and sniffed her like he does and then he turned to go into the other room. Her mom was still standing immediately beside her. He suddenly snarled, growled, turned and lunged at her face. It happened so fast that by the time I said NO which stopped him immediately, he'd already made contact.

I'm thinking a vet visit may be in order. Our other lab, now deceased once snapped at my granddaughter when she was a tot for just touching his back and we found out he has a massive tumor..but he was also elderly too.

This was different..vicious sounds along with the bite.
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Phx_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #27
91. Given that you adopted this dog
you don't know how well it was socialized. One thing that comes to mind is smell, your dog may have smelled another dog on the girl and responded to a percieved threat.
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ruiner4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. I agree...
I got my rescue dog from a place that lists if a dog has issues with children..

I can imagine how you feel though... its a terrible feeling not being able to trust your pet
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grace0418 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #9
28. That's what I was thinking. Surely there are people out there who could
keep the dog from interacting with children. I know you don't want to take chances but I don't think killing the dog is the answer.
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
42. With a record of even one bite on a child
rehoming the dog will be next to impossible. Unfortunately. With a record of one bite on a child, the OP will be lucky to keep her homeowner's insurance if she keeps the dog and she will be the target of every idiot looking for an easy payday.

It hurts to hear that this has happened and even more that the dog will pay the price. Unfortunately, it is probably the only safe solution.

It's also the reason that I just go up a wall when I hear people say 'my dog doesn't bite'. Because you just never know what might happen.
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Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:05 PM
Response to Reply #42
72. It's not necessarily true that the homeowners insurance will increase.
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #72
75. Yeah, right. We've never had a problem with our dogs
and we got the notice that we were being cancelled just for having them at all. (Bouviers, large dogs) The company finally relented, allowed us coverage at a 15% rate hike and a rider stating they would NOT cover any incidents of injury caused by the dogs.

My neighbors have lost theirs completely because they have a rottweiler (one so chickenshit he runs from the cat). You can't get coverage at all here if you own a pitbull, Staffordshire, boxer or English bull. With a bite on the record, the insurance WILL go up if not be cancelled outright. Count on it.
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Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #75
78. I'm sorry that has been your experience. We've had quite the opposite.
I'm sure everyone could present stories saying one thing or the other.

I would suggest the OP look into this for their particular situation.
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Danger Mouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #75
83. Homeowner's insurance fucking sucks...
I could tell you about our insurance woes but I would be here all night. The companies are unrelenting, unsympathetic, and NEVER on your side.
Their first instinct is to screw you hard and screw you royally.
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #83
87. Yep. They're taking their cue from health insurance.
We haven't had a claim in over 20 years. This year we got notified that our insurance was increasing from $900 to $1700. No change in the property, no change in coverage. If we didn't have the mortgage, I'd say the hell with it and start my own 'insurance' account at the bank. But the mortgage company says 'no insurance, no loan' and we can't afford to pay it all off at the moment.

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BarenakedLady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
10. Oh no!
I'm so sorry.

:hug:
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auntAgonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
16. OVC-Ohio, .. I'm so glad the child is alright ..
Edited on Wed Jan-10-07 11:26 AM by auntAgonist
There must be some other way to deal with this though? Is this something the law says you have to do? I'm so sorry for all of the people concerned. I just cannot get my mind around the fact that the dog has to be put to sleep though!

Please try to find another solution :hug:

my heart goes out to you.

aA
kesha

PS. If this child has had problems with other dogs in the past, I have to ask WHY? ? ? Are you SURE the dog was at fault?

this is so sad :cry:
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #16
30. I know aA, I don't want to do it, as the day wears on I don't know what to do..
I have to wonder why some people are bit more than others. I was surprised when her Mom said this wasn't the first time..there have been other dogs and that she just doesn't have luck around dogs. I really in all honesty, don't think the girl did anything to him though.





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Phillycat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
17. Oh gosh, I'm so sorry.
You could potentially list him on petfinder or some such website with a very strong disclaimer that he's bitten a child and CANNOT be around them. It's unlikely, but you might find someone who has no children in his/her life and is willing to take the chance. It might be worth the shot since the alternative is putting him down.

You are an extremely responsible pet owner and my heart aches for what you're going through. :hug:
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AngryAmish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
19. I feel awful for you
However you are doing the right thing.

Most states have a "one bite" rule on civil liability for dogs. Once you are aware of a biting dog you are on the hook for all the other dogs as long as the dog is in your home almost no matter what.

Maybe giving him to an owner that will keep him from children it would be a good idea.

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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
22. Was it a bite or a puppy nip?
Is training a possible alternative?
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #22
31. see my post #27. It sounded vicious too..not like a quick snap.
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Lowell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
23. Even dogs have a bad day now and then
I wouldn't jump to conclusions and put the dog down if this is the first time. Let the ten day quarantine be a time to mull it over and reconsider. I would also have the creature stay in the yard or another room when this girl visits again if you are concerned.
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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
24. I hope you can find a way to keep from putting her down
I really think/hope there is another solution.
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noonwitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
26. I'm glad that my sister doesn't freak out when my dog bites her kid
Of course, it's hard to blame the dog when the 4 year old sticks her fingers in the dog's mouth!

Actually, my dog loves that kid, but sometimes nips at her when she gets too grabby and scares her. Otherwise, the dog follows the kid around, probably because the child is the youngest one in the family and thus is most likely to drop food on the floor.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. His behavior came out of no where..growling, snarling too.
He's an 85# dog..he could have seriously injured her.
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JoDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #33
46. You mentioned he was a rescue dog
Is is possible that he was abused in this previous home, and something about the girl (her smell, the smells that sank into her clothing over the process of the day, the pitch of a sound someone made) may have triggered his response?

My friends have several rescue dogs in their home, and one, Jack, has a couple of triggers from his abused past. For instance, as a puppy he was left outside in an awful storm, and a decade later he still freaks out at the sound of rain. If he thinks any male in the house is threatening any female in any way, he growls and barks and tries to get in between the two people. Not when men are threatened, not if it is two women, just a man and a woman. Jack is a sweet, wonderful dog--a shepard/rot/chow mix, but if any guy is standing next to a woman and gestures with his arm, he can become a formidable beast.

I'm going to chime in that you consult with your vet before you make a final decision. Unfortunately, dogs can't tell us when they're in pain or when something's bugging them. Also, contact the rescue group that the dog came from and see if they have any additional info on his background. You may be able to prevent any other incidents from happening.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #46
73. We do wonder if he had been abused,
It took quite a while for me to be able to sweep the floor with a broom without him running and hiding. He also has separation anxiety. We have been working with him on leaving him alone for short periods gated in. He's broken out of his kennel by banging his head to bend the door.


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Midlodemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
29. I'm so sorry.
I think you are doing the right thing, as hard as it is. :hug:
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LisaM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 02:55 PM
Response to Original message
36. Maybe she's got a funny smell or something
A friend of mine had a Great Dane who once bit a little girl, though in that case the little girl had been trying to steal his bone. She did NOT put her dog down. She just kept him apart from kids. And, she owns a daycare center. Up till then, the dog had been around the kids. We had to keep him at our house for a number of months, but she eventually got him back.

I agree with those who say that something might have triggered it, even if you didn't see it. If he was a stray, perhaps she reminded him of something bad that happened. I'd take him to a training class before I put him down.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #36
44. We did find out that he can't be around a certain detergent,
Occasionally, my daughter brings home clothing for my granddaughter from another lady at work. The first time the dog went nuts, growling, barking and his eyes looking weird. He'd put his nose in the air, stare at the ceiling and growl and bark. He refused to go into the dining room where she'd laid the outfit and that's how we finally figured out it was the clothing. It wasn't until the 2nd time my daughter brought home clothes from the same lady and the dog reacted the same way, that we asked what kind of detergent she used. He's fine once the clothing is re-washed. Now anything brought home from that lady is taken immediately to the washer.

You've got me thinking now..I'll have to ask the Mom what type of laundry detergent she uses.
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LisaM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #44
47. Our dog who was a stray has some triggers
She has never bitten anyone but there are certain things she just doesn't like - in particular, some other kinds of dogs. For no real reason, she doesn't like Airedales or Schnauzers. I figure she had a bad experience with one at some point.

Maybe the laundry detergent (or other smell he doesn't like) triggered a bad memory.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
39. Thank you everyone for your suggestions and kindness,
As I said up thread, as the day goes on it's getting harder to think about having him put down. I have to do something though..I can't trust him around little ones. My granddaughter's heartbroken, Buddy's her big baby and best friend. The day we got him from the people who rescued him, he was a dirty smelly sad old-looking starving dog. The dog rescue people actually thought he was around 4 due to his looks and demeanor. Then when he saw my granddaughter, his eyes lit up, his face lifted and he became the 9-12 month old lab that our vet later confirmed that he was.

I promised him a home forever..and I take my promises seriously. I'm going to take him to the vet to see if anything is medically wrong that could cause what happened. I just can't risk having my grandchildren or any other children around him now. If there's no medical reason, I will speak with the vet and the dog people about finding a home for him only with the promise he won't be around kids.
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qanda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #39
43. I'm so sorry
I know this is a very difficult decision to make. One of my dogs bit one of the children in our neighborhood a few years ago. It had to be one of the scariest days of my life. We ended up keeping the dog (she passed away last year), but we never let her around children she was unfamiliar with. However, she was perfectly fine with my children for the remainder of her life.

I know it's a difficult decision to make and I'm sure you'll do what's best for your family.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. Thank you qanda,
I've cried all day..so have my daughter and granddaughter. I just looked and they are both laying on the bed cuddled up to him sleeping. He's a big part of our family..I don't want to lose him.

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Hell Hath No Fury Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #45
48. A SOLUTION!
Edited on Wed Jan-10-07 04:25 PM by Hell Hath No Fury
If you have exhausted all medical/behaivoral possibilities and still feel uncomfortable having your dog interact with children -- get a muzzle restraint.

http://www.jefferspet.com/ssc/products.asp?CID=0&mscssi...

This way he can safely spend time with children and be of NO danger to them!! You may need to spend some time/patience getting him used to it, but I think it is better than the alternative. A restraint will allow him to pant, eat, and drink without the chance of him biting anyone. I see dogs with these types of muzzle protection all the time here in SF at the parks -- they run around, playing with other dogs and strangers as if there were nothing bothering them.

I THINK THIS IS A WINNER!
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #48
52. I myself was wondering why we never do a little dentistry on dogs.
There must be a way to make it possible for them to function without being a hazard. I will be looking at the muzzle. I always have the vet use one when Jack goes in for a visit. It would be a way to ensure that he's safe when we have visitors.
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Hell Hath No Fury Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #52
76. I think it's an obvious choice...
for a situation where you are worried your dog might be involved with biting. I really, REALLY hope the OP considers this before doing something rash.
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BarenakedLady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #39
68. I'm so glad
You are seeking other options.

Best of luck to you. :hug:
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mvd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #39
71. I feel relieved - it would have been way too hasty to..
put your dog down. He might still have issues from his puppyhood, or maybe the girl provoked him. I had a Scottish Terrier named Benji who bit quite a few kids - even me when I was a kid. But he loved me, and as he grew older, even he mellowed. Hoping for a nice ending to your story.
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Hell Hath No Fury Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
41. There is NO need for you to put your dog down at this point....
Edited on Wed Jan-10-07 03:21 PM by Hell Hath No Fury
He does not have a history of this behavior, and as ugly as this incident was, there was no serious damage done (thankfully) to the little girl.

He needs a vet check to see if there is anything wrong with him. If there is -- that could explain what was going on. If there isn't anything obviously wrong with him, I still think that I would hold off to see if it was just something that disturbed the dog in the moment - the girl's body language, eye contact, or smell.

You don't mention how old he is or what type of breed -- those are two importnat bits of information that could explain much.

Until you determine if this was just a momentary lapse on his part, I would keep him away from other children -- if any come to your home I would make sure that he is locked in another room.

He sounds like a wonderful dog -- it is far to early to give up on him.
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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
51. Damn, I'm sorry you have to go through that.
Redstone
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Shell Beau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
59. That is so awful. What a tough decision to have to make,
But at least you are trying to be a responsible pet owner. A lot of people out there aren't. You know your dog best and know what will be best for him. I would also ask the vet's advice on this situation. If he had really hurt her badly, you would be liable. I really hope all works out for the best. Good luck! And sorry! :hug:
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
62. I read your post #39, and I'm glad your promise will go unbroken.
You might ask your vet if he/she has a behaviorist on staff. If there's nothing medically wrong, that might be worth looking into.

I'll also suggest, this...I know it'll be difficult if not impossible to trust the dog around children, however what the dog did sounds not like an act of aggression. An act of aggression would've put the child in the ER, a nip is a warning of some kind, for some reason (not blaming the kid, so please don't read this that way).
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LeftPeopleFinishFirst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
63. So sorry to hear this.
I hope you can find a safe alternative to putting him to sleep. It must be tough, I can't imagine either of my two dogs doing anything out of character like that. =(
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hatredisnotavalue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 05:53 PM
Response to Original message
65. I had a very overprotective lab
I never had a problem with him, but I know the owners of one of his brothers (my SIL) had to put their dog to sleep because of almost biting the chin off of a kid. I never let Buffett get in a situation where he could bite a kid after that, but truth be told, I never quite trusted him. So if kids came over to play with my kids, I put him in the garage. If there was any fast action, like tag or running with my kids, I kept him in the house. He was a great dog, but I never trusted him with little kids. I bought him at 8 MO, and I believe there was probably a bit of abuse from the owner up to that point. But boy was he a great watch dog!

In another incident, we got a stray older Golden Retriever, who we had to put down after he attacked three people in separate incidents. He was just too overprotective of his family. After these two incidents, I vowed I would never ever get a stray older dog, purchased or from a shelter, ever again.

I think they feel threatened by smaller things and are so appreciative of their families that they bite when their overall existence is threatened.

If I were you, I would keep your dog, but keep him away from children if that is possible. Good luck.

As an aside, I now have a Golden bought as a puppy at 7 weeks. I have never ever had a dog without emotional baggage. This dog is just a joy. He gets in the UPS truck, cubbles with a newborn and I don't have any fear of him hurting anyone. Of course, he sucks as a watchdog.!
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Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:03 PM
Response to Original message
70. Surly you can find an alternative to putting the dog down.
People get bit all the time and animals aren't necessarily put to sleep because of it.

Please look into the alternatives. There is no need to inflict even more pain on yourself. And if I were the kid and found out someone put a dog down because I was bit, I'd feel guilty over it- very guilty. Please reconsider. You really need to reconsider this decision.
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Lady President Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 06:38 PM
Response to Original message
74. I'm so sorry
What a horrible position for you! Have you talked to your vet about adoption options? The vet should be able to give you a better idea whether that is a realistic possibility. If nothing else, you'll know you've done all you can.

When I read through the thread, I noticed that you adopted him when he was a little older. Despite the report they give on older animals, it's impossible to know everything about his past. He might just be overprotective of his house. Unfortunately with kids in the house, that isn't workable.

I remember once when I was 7 or 8 being over at my next door neighbors, and their dog walked calmly over to me and bit me. She was a sweet collie. I was a their house constantly. It was a good dog that bit a bit a kid without provocation. After a couple stitches I was fine, but they did put the dog down. (Still makes me sad.)

Anyway, I'm sending good thoughts your way.

:hug:
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NC_Nurse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 08:20 PM
Response to Original message
79. I'm so sorry this happened.
I would certainly not allow this dog around young children again.
I hope there is some way to adopt him out to a home without young children so that you don't have to put him down.

Maybe the Dog Whisperer has a website with some alternatives...I watch his show sometimes. He works
with lots of dogs who have aggression problems.
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NC_Nurse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #79
80. Here's the link:
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Dastard Stepchild Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
82. I know it isn't the cheapest option...
But does your local humane society have a behaviorist on staff? They are sometimes willing to do temperament testing and maybe a few key training sessions for a reasonable amount.

And as you mentioned above, getting a physical is a good idea. There may be some underlying medical condition.

I'm sorry to hear this. My pooch has tried to act the part of an aggressor in the past. I had to learn how to show her that in NO uncertain terms, I was the alpha and she was to obey me. If I was cool with a person, I expected her to be as well. Took some work... a lot of work, actually, but it has paid off.

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Danger Mouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-10-07 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
84. Our dog, a standard poodle, was a rescue...
at first she was very nervous around men, and would nip. She's still very territorial, and barks a LOT, which is strange, since poodles are supposedly not barking dogs. I wish someone would tell Madeline that, she never shuts up :/
I agree with the other posters that putting the dog down is probably not the best option...that muzzle that another poster sounds like an excellent idea...seems very humane.
The detergent idea sounds like a good one too.
Good luck, and keep us updated. I love labs, absolutely love them, my first dog was a chocolate lab named Coco, we were kids togehter, grew up together, and she died when I was 14...about 11 years ago...and i still miss her...
hang in there... :hug:
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Lyric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 12:00 AM
Response to Original message
85. On a legal note:
If you take your dog to the Vet, be sure that you find out first what the Vet's legal responsibility is in the situation like that. There are many places where Vets are legally required to call animal control and report every single dog bite incident that they're told about, especially if it involved a child.

I'm not saying that you should break the law, if your local laws require all dog bites to be reported. I'm just giving you a heads-up about something that could happen. It would be wise to "sound out" your Vet and make sure that telling him about the bite won't force him to get the authorities involved.

Was your dog completely up-to-date on his shots--especially rabies? So long as it hasn't been over a year since his last rabies vaccination, you'll probably be okay. If it's been longer than a year, you could have a far more serious legal dilemma on your hands.

:hug: I pray that everything turns out okay for you.
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madeline_con Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 12:02 AM
Response to Original message
86. What did the kid do?
Dogs don't just bite out of the blue. Not sweet little well-behaved ones, anyway.
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Corgigal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
88. The little girl, who has been bitten
a few times is putting off a scent that dogs can smell. Yes, we do release a scent when we are fearful. While the child believes she wasn't scared of the dog, her body responded differently. One of a bunch of links below:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retri...

http://www.nel.edu/23_2/NEL230202R01_Grammer.htm

Keep the dog away from that child, and the dog will probably be okay. Of course, from now on when any child comes over, or anyone who has been bitten by a dog come by, the dog is on leash with you inside the house.
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Blue Diadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-11-07 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #88
90. Thank you for the links. n/t
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