Again Nascar is ripped here...

[catnhatnh]

this time in a post supposedly about Neil Bush...The abuser has something about a cat in their name...we are not morons and while these races may not be your bag,why would you denigrate a sport watched by millions (including we two or three democrats) and lump us in with "reality TV" and "American Idol"...???Don't Like it??? Don't watch...But you have lumped me in a company I neither like or respect...AND I for one resent this...

[okieinpain]

1. yeah, I agree and I don't even like nascar. but I am a horse power

nut...

[arcane1]

2. you cannot possibly be serious

all 3 of those programmes are lumped together in that post SPECIFICALLY because they are things that many people watch. I saw no denigration whatsoever of the viewers of such programming... if anything, the post was denigrating the media in general

:eyes:

[catnhatnh]

4. AND my watching preferences...

I assure you I do not watch the latter-the implication was that I am a moron and a droid...they named three specific tv venues and denigrated all watchers as equally confused..I reject the premise and conclusion...

[arcane1]

8. the implication...

was that those 3 programmes generate millions of dollars in ad revenue, much more than a story about Neil Bush

please post the exact quote where it was implied that you are a moron or droid, and the exact text where the watchers were denigrated as confused

some people try too hard to proclaim victimhood

[fudge stripe cookays]

3. Sorry, some of us can't stand NASCAR.

So what if millions of Americans like it. I can't stand football either, but at least it doesn't pollute the environment or waste petroleum by-products.

I don't care what kind of fuel they use. I think it's wasteful and stupid to watch cars drive around and around in circles.

If you don't like it, start your own progressive forum for NASCAR fans. We're all free to our opinions here.

[sendero]

I'm into cars..

... but I could never find that sort of racing all that interesting.

That said, I'm not about to criticize someone for their choice of entertainment. (Well, maybe if it is "wrestling" :)).

But sometimes I think that if there were suddenly a lot of black drivers in NASCAR, the popularity of the "sport" would drop precipitously.

Just my humble opinion.

[arcane1]

6. text of the allegedly "denigrating" post:

"Methinks the truth (about Neil Bush) would get in the way of Nascar/Reality TV/American Idol."

in response to the question:

"How about some human interest stories, corporate media?"

:eyes:

[catnhatnh]

9. Really....

43 cars times 5 miles per gallon times 500 miles....ain't that big a deal as opposed to the 100k cars parked for 6 hours or more...I'm betting there are quite a few Nascar fans here which will however challenge conventional wisdom...I think that hockey is a worthless boring Canadian sport...but I seldom post about it...

[jmowreader]

76. More like 800 miles per car

Add practice and qualifying to the race distance...plus caution laps aren't counted, and at some tracks--Bristol and Martinsville come to mind--caution laps are a substantial portion of the race distance.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

29. I need to ask if you

have ever been to a NASCAR race. There is a world of difference in person and on tv. The noise of the engines in person is amazing, and you can really see and appreciate the speed.

I agree it is boring on TV. Not as boring as golf, though!

[catnhatnh]

64. Yep...in three places,,,,

NH. Long Pond Daytona Ive been to several what is the question...

[fudge stripe cookays]

89. No, because to do that....

I'd have to have to be around the fans. I'd honestly rather blow my brains out. It's not just about classifying them all as potential, ignorant GOP-voting Gomers from outer podunkville. I know they're not all like that.

It's just that I have better things to do with my time than watch cars drive around in a circle, or stick a big number 8 decal on the back of my car, attempting to emulate my hero (another guy who drives cars around in a circle. Wow!), sitting in the sun sweating my ass off, or breathing buttloads of exhaust fumes. Especially with the shape our environment is in, and peak oil looming.

I don't like regular race car driving either. Why would I want to subject myself to something I hate?

[Bzzzz]

63. AMAN!!!!! n/t

[Fox Mulder]

67. Amen to that!

[northzax]

5. er, why are you bothered with the association with reality TV or

American Idol? both are watched by tens of millions of Americans, are they not? NASCAR wishes it had American Idol's numbers, I'd take that as a compliment, or did you mean to denigrate the people who watch American Idol?

[catnhatnh]

26. OK the post got moved...

Think "meritricious" which is a Bill Buckley term meaning "tawdry but alluring", like a cheap painted whore...the poster ties together three separate genres and hopes the pastiche holds together...Suppose that HUAC, the KKK and ACLU where mentioned in the same breath-does that give them equivelence...I think not-each member is responsible for their posts and opinions...and if you attack someone elses leisure time activity you should be correct..

[leftofthedial]

7. you'd think with all those left turns

that all NASCAR fans would be progressives

[fudge stripe cookays]

11. Ba DOOM. Chhhhhhhh!

:D

[LostinVA]

19. giggle

[Old and In the Way]

10. I don't watch it.

I don't particularly find cars going around in circles entertaining to watch I guess. I don't like Ice Fishing either...for slightly different reasons.

But I also have a philosophical problem with the winning values on HP and speed. Conceptually, I'd be far more interested if the premium was placed on fuel efficiency. The idea being to encourage technology to optimize every drop of gas. True, NASCAR does that to a degree...but, really, what do these vehicles get per gallon? We are glorifing the wrong aspects of our love with car-entertainment.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

12. i think it's fair to say that Nascar is predominantly a XXXXXXXX affair

I feel pretty comfortable with that assertion.

[GOPisEvil]

13. I think it's fair to say that this is one of the more condescending things

I've read here in a while.

I feel pretty comfortable with this assertion as well.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

you're probably right.

But that doesn't make Nascar not predominated by ignorant caucasoid Republican fascists.

[GOPisEvil]

15. I'm sure something you like sucks, too.

For the record I'm not a NASCAR fan, but I feel no need to slam those that are.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

18. certainly.

A lot of what I like is sucky in other people's opinion. That's absolutely true.

[GOPisEvil]

20. Well then...no one likes to be insulted for their preferences, correct?

This is my only point.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

31. you are correct. no one likes to be insulted for their preferences.

point taken.

[Maddy McCall]

24. I hate the "white trash" label being applied to anyone.

Some people I know who use it are also guilty of dropping the N bomb once in awhile, or of paralleling African Americans and White Trash. It's a way of placing people on a hierarchy for whatever reason--race or class. And, to me, classism is just as obnoxious as racism.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

30. fair enough.

i never make the above mentioned parallels, but the point is a good one.

anglo-american garbage. caucasoid rubbish.

just kidding;)

[RebelOne]

74. The term "white trash" annoys the hell out of me.

Whenever anyone mentions mobile home park dwellers, which I am one of, the words white trash are usually included. I have come down pretty hard on a few DUers who have done this. Most mobile home park residents are not beer-swilling, foul-mouthed ignorant rednecks.

[Maddy McCall]

17. I know people from all walks of life who love Nascar.

And, gasp!, some of them are black. And some are even well-established professionals. What's your definition of "white trash?"

It's no longer a Southern thing, as there are well attended tracks all across the US. It's no longer a "white trash" thing (although its origins may have been) because people of all "classes" attend races. And it's no longer "white only" because it's pulling in fans of all races.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

25. i did qualify it with "predominantly"

i didn't say everybody that likes nascar is an ignorant caucasoid Republican fascist.

[Maddy McCall]

32. Define "white trash."

I'm curious.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

35. from dictionary.com

white trash
n. Offensive Slang
Used as a disparaging term for a poor white person or poor white people.
Used as a disparaging term for a white person or white people perceived as being lazy and ignorant.

from: http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=white%20trash

hahahahah! oh come on. You're right ok. I'm sorry

[Maddy McCall]

40. And your definition is...

What's your definition?

:shrug:

Which do you find so offensive? The poor part or the lazy part? :shrug:

[SlavesandBulldozers]

41. the ignorant part..

that's my definition.

[Left Is Write]

43. So do I. My father is one of them.

He is an educated man, a Democrat, and retired from a 40+ year white collar job.

[Maddy McCall]

50. But is he "white trash?"

:D :hi:

[Left Is Write]

51. Hmmmmm....

I think I'll say "no" on that one. ;)

[SlavesandBulldozers]

54. ok, Maddy. You've made you're point. I've apologized. Alright?

I'm sorry to all the Nascar fans out there. Nascar is a bastion of tolerance and deep-thinking. Nascar embraces all of life's diversity!! NASCAR fans are a amattering of all different colors and creeds coming together in fucking harmony! Nascar is right up there with the ACLU for Christ-sakes!! I LOVE NASCAR!!!!!!

[ragin_acadian]

68. don't forget,

the cars go in circles, representing the wheel of life.

:rofl:

seriously, SB, some people get worked up about the damnedest things!

[SlavesandBulldozers]

72. oh yes, cars in circles. that was part of the cosmic symbology

inherent to Nascar that slipped my mind. Wheel of life BAHAHAHAHA>

[ragin_acadian]

78. "Nascar: Wheel of Life" is sponsored by:

Mountain Dew, Chase Mastercard, Reebok, Pfizer, and "Puncture Wound to the Face, Repeatedy, Before Multiple Gunshot Wounds at Close Range, in an Inner City Area Suburban White Kids Would Never Frequent" available only on Xbox (Cue Logo).

this Nascar thing....shit. i vowed not to post about it ever again, since i "stepped" in the last thread about it. But you are THE MAN for braving this on a thread. i humbly bow.

[gizmo1979]

88. I like racing

I like the stragedy the speed the wrecks.This is not your fathers NASCAR.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

33. You couldn't be more wrong

white trash can't afford to go to races. They are very, very pricey.

But I also have to tell you I don't like the words "white trash." The history of the term comes from the Old South when it was assumed all Blacks were, by definition, trash. Therefore when you encountered white folks who were not quality you had to differentiate and call them white trash. It is both reverse racism and "primary" racism at the same time.

I prefer "trailer trash" and I can say it, having spent plenty of time in mobile homes.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

36. but I've known some amazing people who live in trailers.

how could you possibly be so condescending!

;) I knew what I was getting into when I said that Nascar is predominated by white trash. What I should have said was that Nascar events are predominantly attended, and watched, by ignorant caucasoid Republican fascists.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

42. Yeah, and I'm one!

Remember the South was a democratic bastion and THEY startedf the sport, not the white collar GOP types. Recently the parties have switched roles.

I go to NASCAR races and was at Daytona when Dale E. died. And guess what? I LOVE monster trucks! And I have a whole lotta college degrees!

[SlavesandBulldozers]

45. look, i live right down the street from Daytona ok. I'm white. I'm poor.

I have a college degree. I honestly didn't think that I was causing so much turmoil when I started talking smack about Nascar. Can we just drop it, cause I'm beginning to make a whole lot of DU enemies over FUCKING NASCAR.

PEACE.

[Maddy McCall]

52. The Nascar topic isn't offensive, but calling people "white trash" is.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

56. right.

I've admitted it. It was offensive. I'm sorry.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

57. No enemy here.

Daytona is a nice town.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

58. whew.

I live in Orlando, but yeah, Daytona is pretty cool.

[catnhatnh]

60. yep ....we can make peace...

but you must admit you were wrong....I love all posters here but you must admit your fault as in Nascar gents, make good sence....

[SlavesandBulldozers]

61. admit my fault as in Nascar gents? good sence?

i don't follow, I'm sorry.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

38. i've edited my posts to reflect a more class-neutral tack.

sorry to all the white-trash nascar lovers i've offended.

JUST KIDDING!

[Maddy McCall]

14. I like watching it. My son is a big Jeff Gordon (24) fan...

and he's wrangled me into watching with him. Jesus god it's just so inconsequential, I have never understood why it hits such a nerve with people who "hate" it.

Some people like theatre, some people like rock concerts, some people like nascar. :shrug:

[LostinVA]

21. I tutored Richard Petty's daughter her firsts semester in college

No, really. And, I worked with his cousin at the City of Greensboro. Really.

But, I loathe NASCAR... zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...

[Dave Reynolds]

22. But one thing,

some people are condescending, stuffy assholes. They make themselves feel good by denigrating others.

[Maddy McCall]

28. Yes.

Couldn't agree more.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

44. condescending, certainly.

stuffy? no.

Jesus, i sit here day after day while Florida is put through the wringer and I laugh at all the condescending Florida jokes. Who would have thought that everybody on DU has such thin skin when it comes to Nascar?

[Dave Reynolds]

47. Who would know

that I actually consider myself to *be* white trash. Not everyone can laugh at themselves, however.

I really was not referring to you specifically. I see it any time there is a thread about trucks, cars, SUVs, hunting, and so on.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

49. okay good.

because I really didn't mean to offend anyone. i was just joking around. that's no excuse but I'm only human, and I have a special place in my heart for disparaging nascar. It's my problem.

[Dave Reynolds]

53. We all have hobbies,

not a problem at all. :toast:

[SlavesandBulldozers]

59. :)

:toast:

[ContraBass Black]

80. But can you take a Daytona, Florida joke?

;)

[SlavesandBulldozers]

85. Daytona's a joke unto itself.

;)

[LostinVA]

16. Well, I watch American Idol, and I resent being lumped in

with NASCAR. At least Simon Cowell doesn't wave the Battle Flag, although I have seen Paula Abdul with big hair...

And, ZILLIONS of people watch AI.

What a damned silly thread.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

46. yeah but there is one black person in a Nascar crowd.

and he isn't waving a battle flag. Stop being so damned condescending.

:spank:

[LostinVA]

70. Liar! Once I saw TWO!

[SlavesandBulldozers]

71. you're bad.

and uh, trust me, you don't want to attract the ire of DU's burgeoning Nascar hordes. Thay are a true force to be reckoned with.

Imagine being called a racist by a nascar fan.


Yeah, it's that bizarre.

[LostinVA]

73. I know they are a "true force" -- that's why I'm doing it!

Yup, I've seen the racism charges by the NASCAR fans.....!

[johnnie]

23. It happens a lot

This is a big place and sometimes people say things we don't like. I have seen many people say things about things I like and it's best to just let it go.

Chances are more people are thinking about Nascar now, than before you posted this. Most people here probably didn't even read the posts you are talking about.

If everyone liked everything I liked I would be bored silly.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

27. Yeah and don't rip Idol, either

I LOVE IT. I have never watched Survivor or any other reality show, but I like Idol. The auditions are pathetic and funny and pitiful and almost a damned morality play or something. And the actual competition is fun watching kids get better every week. I'm not into pop, but the personalities and the growth are fascinating.

[LostinVA]

34. My Bojangles Growly Beardy Bear Bo Bice should have won

I know for a fact Carrie had an affair with Paula... well, I just made that up.

[maxsolomon]

37. those 3 things were lumped together

because they are DISTRACTIONS from our duties as citizens. they occupy our "leisure" & replace authentic culture.

the latin phrase is 'Pane e Circenses'; bread & circuses - the chief interests of the roman plebian class. are you a plebe? do you enjoy plebian spectacles? i bet GWB thinks you are (more likely his puppetmasters do), as do this country's real elites.

Television, ANYTHING on television, is a waste of your life, and no one knows that as well as the oligarchy that program the Spectacle. Going to a professional sporting event is MARGINALLY better than watching it on TV, but it is still as waste of time compared to, say, PARTICIPATING in a sport. is it better to LISTEN to a CD or MAKE MUSIC? which is more edifying?

and yes, i watch TV.

[AlCzervik]

39. i have no interest in Nascar or Ai, but no interest in bashing either one.

i have a mac, i'm also not into bashing any other computers.

[catnhatnh]

48. And so for fun I will tell a real story...

and why Nascar is important to me...In the 80's My brother had two kids dieing of MD....the Jerry's kids thing worked as did make a wish...but in the early eighties before it was funny...these guys actually responded....Chris died after a ride on the Daytona track with Darrell Waltrip...Charles met his heroes...the funniest story may heve been the part of Chris rejecting Dale Earnhardts Cap....Chr9is said-I don't like you..aand Dale was Off to other things,....They were better than they had to be...for two dead kids thet were heroes....

[Maddy McCall]

55. Yes, and many of them have their own foundations to help...

children, whether they be sick or underprivileged. The benevolence of some of the racers rivals that of the stars of other sports.

Look at Jeff Gordon's foundation, for example.

[Orsino]

62. I wouldn't conflate it with reality TV...

...but I'll feel free to denigrate it. :-)

Only because I don't get it. I don't understand the thrill of a sport that consists mainly of turning left, and is a garish display of conspicuous consumption.

But I'm willing to concede that there is skill involved, and excitement that merely escapes me.

[ContraBass Black]

79. I think it's driving fast and close together without electronic

stability systems that makes it fun.

And the noise.

[dr.zoidberg]

65. I feel ya, brother...

try being a boxing fan around here. Well, outside of the sports forum of course. We seem to be able to escape the bashing you see elsewhere here.

[Indy_Dem_Defender]

66. I'd don't care for nascar

Not because of the "White trash" or "Trailer Trash" audiences that some DU mmembers don't want to be associated with, It's I'm into Indy Car. Minus Tony Stewart I don't care for anything nascar. It's to commerical, to PC, to many cookie cutter drivers, really not much difference in car models as people make it out to be.

[jakefrep]

69. I'm not really a fan of Indy car racing...

...but I agree with you completely about NASCAR. It's gotten too big and homogenized for its own good.

Give me a weekend at Mid-OHio over any NASCAR race.

[LSdemocrat]

75. Some of us have tried to watch and still hate NASCAR

Give me American Idol or "decent" reality TV, i.e. not something like Fear Factor or Who Wants to Marry X, anyday.

[Blue_Tires]

77. sorry, NASCAR just isn't real racing

and I'm a huge race fan....

carburetors, live rear axle suspensions, restrictor plates, cars that are nothing like their 'stock' counterparts anymore, and it's biggest sin is that NONE of the racing 'technology' (and i use that loosely) trickles down to the marketplace, which has been motorsports' reason for being for decades....NASCAR turned into a spec racing series a long time ago, so it is a wonder that automakers spend tens of millions to be involved in it, when there are much better things to invest in (like better product).

[no name no slogan]

81. Sorry, only bareknuckle boxing Marquis of Queensbury rules for me

Anything else is just not a sport

[Gold Metal Flake]

82. I remember NASCAR (RIP)

[Warren DeMontague]

83. Is it okay to talk shit about those stupid trucks with the giant tires?

I don't know why, but it seems like every low IQ twentysomething with a shaved head around here has one, usually with Calvin pissing on something or other on the back windshield.

[jakefrep]

84. NASCAR -

Where The Family That Gives Jeff Gordon The Finger Together, Stays Together. (right after the obligatory pre-race prayer and "patriotic" fireworks display, of course)

[Taverner]

86. I never got why such derision against NASCAR

I mean, it's not my bag but neither is Tennis. I don't think that either sport shows any lack of character - I just hope all those who watch NASCAR wear plenty of Sunscreen at the events.

[kick-ass-bob]

87. Well, it's that people sit in the stands, watch a bunch of guys with

a bunch of equipment surrounding them, go back and forth (or around) in front of them, while drinking beer and eating ungodly amounts of food. And whoever crosses the line wins.


Oh, wait, that sounds like the NFL.

:think:


PS - I hate, hate, HATE to watch car racing.