after reading what i've just read in GD, i can longer in good conscience

[KG]

recommend DU to progressives that i meet. there is no longer anything remotely 'underground' about DU anymore.

sickening.

it makes me sad. DU used to be such a cool place. :(

[Taverner]

1. What did you read?

Just wondering....

[warrens]

2. Gloating over the Tookster, no doubt

There are some sick units over there.

[WilliamPitt]

3. There's a party going on

because someone is about to be executed in California.

I don't know if the party is because people feel like they are jacking the looming execution up the asses of people they've been arguing with, or if there is a party going on because people are genuinely excited that the man is going to die.

Either way, it's pretty foul.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

6. I think it's more of the former.

The clemency issue has been so long in raging over there that those who were against clemency are gloating over the "victory." A pretty sour victory, if you ask me.

:puke:

[johnnie]

10. There are 5-6 people who are happy Tookie is being executed

The rest are either totally against it, saddened by it or not too affected by it. I don't know why people think that a handful of people represent everyone at DU. :shrug:

[Misunderestimator]

19. 5-6 and how many of their sockpuppets?

please... 5-6.... ha

[johnnie]

22. I didn't see as many as everyone is saying there are

With the hundreds of people who post here daily, the ones that are happy about this seem to be a very small number of people. Unfortunately they get their talking point across because they get more threads about them than people who actually read their posts.

[Misunderestimator]

26. Same thing seems to have happened with people thinking LOTS

of people care about the freaking neon naked lady. You know how things get exaggerated here. From my perspective however, the JOYFULNESS that I see is from a LOT more than 5 or 6 people. I won't take the time to prove it however, because I don't want to read anymore of it.

[johnnie]

32. Well, you don't have to prove it

I read a few who seemed to think it's just peachy that he is going to be executed, but a large majority didn't seem to be jumping for joy.

I understand that there are people who support the death penalty, and even though I don't get freaked out by them. What freaks me out is when people get giddy about it. I'll never forget when they put Bundy to death and there were actually people cheering outside the prison. They were even selling fucking tee-shirts. Back then I was sickened by those actions and I still feel the same way today.

Having the joy of seeing someone put to death is as sick as killing someone yourself. It's murder by proxy... plain and simple.

[Misunderestimator]

36. Exactly... it's the giddiness. So we agree.

(I'm not as tolerant of those who support the death penalty as you are, but at least we agree that the giddiness is horrible.)

[Midlodemocrat]

4. It is pretty upsetting. I think even I were in the 'yeah, he's gonna

fry' category, which I definitely am not, I would keep it to myself. Sometimes discretion is the better part of valor.

DU is still a cool place. Things just ebb and flow, I guess.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

7. "Sometimes discretion is the better part of valor."

Wonderfully put.

:D :D :dem: :thumbsup:

[WritingIsMyReligion]

5. I just fled the battle zone, too.

I got so sick of the "war" going on right now over Williams.

Example:

"Well, good! He deserves justice!"
"HOW can you kill a man? HOW can you stand for state-sponsored murder?"
"Well, how can you defend a monster?"
"Who said I was defending a monster???"

It's flame city over there right now, even more so than usual.

[Midlodemocrat]

12. I'm trying not to flame anyone, because that isn't my style

anyway, but some of the stuff posted is downright heartwrenching. You wonder how someone could have so much hatred for a stranger. It is very disheartening.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

13. Yup.

:scared:

[bicentennial_baby]

8. ....

:hug: i feel ya, my I list has grown by leaps and bounds today, it's so sickening... x(

but for you, :loveya:

[Misunderestimator]

9. It's extremely disheartening... this should be a fundamental principle

of our party... especially from people who pretend to be progressive. I really, really wish that the US was a progressive country.

[KG]

14. lots of 'democrats' on DU. not many true progressives left, tho.

been here for 4years, but it's got to where i don't even bother to post in GD much anymore. :(

[Misunderestimator]

16. That's true... unfortunately...

I came here because it was a progressive site... and I'll stay because of the progressive that are here... but damn. It's almost like there are SO many people who hate Bush now that even conservatives are posting in GD now. This really sucks.

[LSdemocrat]

24. The bigger problem: the quality of debate has declined at DU over time

Back when I came here late 2002/early 2003, people would have genuine, well-reasoned debates about all sorts of issues. There were always conservative/moderate Democrats here, but everyone pretty much respected everyone else (yes, even including DLCers and DLC detractors). DU was more of a marketplace of ideas, instead of a bunch of threads that were reactionary, absolutist, and/or flame wars. It all started to go downhill once the primaries started and DU has never really recovered.

I really hope the proposed changes to GD will help reverse this decline.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

29. I occasionally lurked at that time! You are so right! When the Primaries

hit OMG!! Everything changed!

[Capn Sunshine]

11. Any man's death diminishes me

Tell me what we have in common with each other?

[NoPasaran]

15. Just imagine

What it would be like if they were executing the founder of the DLC---jeez!

The flamewar to end all flamewars!

[WritingIsMyReligion]

17. Too fucking true.

nt

[graywarrior]

18. It's a fish bowl of what's out there in America

2/3 of the population approve the death penalty. My guess is that they have "strong" opinions about "frying" someone. Not my thing and it's hard to read it here.

[KG]

20. i'll never understand why the pro-death people thing they're so different

from 'monsters' they decry.

[graywarrior]

23. I don't get it either.

It's as bad, if not worse, than killing someone coz they pissed you off. I see a lot of palm rubbing, gleeful awaiting of someone's death. It's gruesome.

[DS1]

21. I stopped some time in 2003

:shrug:

[WindRavenX]

25. it's fucking disgusting

People are cackling to themselves at the prospect of Tookie going "straight to hell"

My. God. :cry:

[TallahasseeGrannie]

27. I think the readership has changed

I used to get flamed WAY more for saying moderate things. Where's the angst and anger? It's why I came here!

(and actually I'm serious..I am so mellow I need a fire once in a while)

[henslee]

28. Why are you so shocked? Have you ever discovered a great restaurant only

to watch it slowly get discovered by others.... and then the character of the place changes... the patrons are diff., the owners attitude changes. the quality of the experience is altered. As far as Tookie goes, I am not for killing him but after seeing the photos of his victims, I can see why the loved ones of his victims would want to beat the fucker to a pulp.

[KG]

31. not shocked at all. been watching a sad decline for a couple years now

this just seems to be a new low.

[Capn Sunshine]

33. Not to worry KG

They'll be others, I'm sure.

[henslee]

34. I think it is a consequence of DU getting too big. I also think posting

in less obvious, less traveled threads is often more rewarding and good way to avoid such rabble. I often look for the posts of a few certain posters and they usually lead me to a worthwhile discussion... as opposed to an emotional flame fest.

on edit.... I find myself reading more posts than posting these days.

[calico1]

30. I may stay over here from now on too.

If I wanted to read Freeperish posts I'd be at FR. Regardless of how people feel about Tookie, I find it sickening that people are overjoyed about it. So much like Freepers!

[tyedyeto]

35. For the first time ever, I put people on my ignore list.

The gloating and almost happiness over the fact that a person will be murdered by state early tomorrow morning finally led me to use that feature. As another poster said in one of the GD threads earlier today...after a while, an eye for an eye mentality leaves EVERYONE blind (paraphrasing since there are so many threads and I didn't want to go back to find it)

Sad day for DU :cry:

[The empressof all]

37. I'm going to lock this now

Look, I know this is an emotional issue that provokes a great deal of rage on both sides. I'm of the opinion that an eye for an eye leaves two people blinded.

It's hard to not feel upset I agree... Lets try to keep the discourse civil and to not bring it from one thread to another.

There will always be others who take the opposite side but lets not start new threads to trash each other.