Buying a new computer - need brand advice

[mvd]

I am not going to buy another Dell! Really angry at their politics. Am looking at Sony's Vaio and Gateway. Macs might be out of my price range, but you can suggest them.

No computer wars please - I appreciate any advice. :hi:

[WindRavenX]

1. Gateway is very bad

Speaking from personal experience.
I am quite happy with my HP notebook, and would recommend HP :hi:

[mvd]

3. Looking for a desktop

But thanks!

[Jilly Beans]

28. Cheap monitors.

Expect your monitor to die within several months. Also, plan on little to no customer support after the purchase.

Even though you don't like Dell's politics, at least their products are better than Gateway's. Our history department uses nothing but Dell desktops because they are so reliable.

[democracyindanger]

2. build your own

It really, truly, isn't that hard.

I'm sure there'll be plenty of "Buy the Mac Mini" posts soon, too...

[mvd]

5. I need one quickly

So I really want to buy.

[democracyindanger]

8. Well, I like Sony, but it's expensive

Before I started building my desktops I went to micronpc.com. Good stuff, lots of options and great customer service.

[okieinpain]

12. yes, build your own, it's really not that hard, and you end up with

the same warranty. AMD chips are really good, and lower priced then intel, but that is up to you. gigabyte, asus, msi, are really good motherboards, western digital for the hard drive, and I really really suggest that you get kingston valueram, there are lower priced memory sticks but I've had problems with them. lite-on is a decent cdrom drive, and I would highly suggest you get a dvd burner.

get a motherboard that has everything on it (video, network, and audio), even if you intend to get a better video, or sound card. if you upgrade the system you can still sell the unit and pull your good cards.

if you don't think you can do the build your own, then dell is great, if you're into taking chances, apple is great. when I say take chances I don't mean the hardware, I mean finding software and tech help. the hard ware is rock solid, it's just hard finding someone to loan :~) you stuff unless you've got some friends that have macs.

dell has the best tech support, then compaq. if you're going to get a laptop, the sony vaio is great, but their tech support sucks.

good luck.

[mvd]

15. It would take me a little while to learn how

There's a deal on a Sony at Comp USA for $1,000. 3 GHz, 512 MB RAM, 200 GB hard drive. DVD/CD-R&RW drive. 17-inch flat screen.

[okieinpain]

48. that's a good deal, you would be hard pressed to beat it.

[cleofus1]

64. damn that does sound good...

what is the power supply? home many dimm slots does it have? how big is the FSB? does it have memory card slots and multiple ubs inputs?
how many fans does it have? is the DVD-RW a duel layer device?

[KitchenWitch]

4. I have a Sony Vaio laptop and love it

I also have a Gateway desktop that is a few years old, has worked well for me...have modified the desktop to add firewire and USB 2.0 ports and all is still well.

Sony, I believe is a blue company, am not sure about Gateway.

[zann725]

23. I have a Sony laptop, and love it too.

They are more pricey than other brands. I went with a Dell for my desktop. But for the laptop, I chose the Sony. To heck with the budget!

[KitchenWitch]

29. When I bought it, it was bundled with some great software

made the extra cost worth it in my eyes...

[Dez]

6. I love my Hewlett Packard! n/t

[AndyP]

13. the new HPs are pretty nice

I personally think the dells are kinda crappy. Sony Viao would be my choice if I had to buy instead of build- but they are pretty pricey.

[Digit]

7. There is a Computer Group on DU,...go to DU Groups and ask.

I had an HP once, and trashed it.
It has it's "own" version of windows and was so proprietary.
The modem they used was the Rockwell chipset, so I had very slow connections to the internet.
Nothing I could do.
Ever since then, I have built my own, but it is not for everybody.
The people in that group are quite active, and they will help you out.

[MrScorpio]

9. Get a Mac

You'll never look back

[Floogeldy]

10. They all suck

Throw a dart and pick the cheapest one.

B-)

[Jamastiene]

37. OMG

When I read that I busted out laughing. It's true in a big big way. I gotta get a new one too, before I go deaf, or more deaf I should say. My fan on my old antique is rattling so bad right now, I could throw the whole thing out the door and not even think twice about it. I need earplugs. Enjoyed your post. I'm leaning toward Gateway myself, but after reading your reply, I may just do that instead.

[DulceDecorum]

11. If you ever decide to get a Mac

Buy it directly from Apple.
Via mail.
Do not ever purchase one out of ANY store
no matter WHAT the salesperson says.

Learn from my mistake.

[Melynn]

54. What about the Apple Store?

I am thinking of buying a Mac later on this year and there is a Apple store in my area.

[DulceDecorum]

65. Buying a Mac out of an Apple Store is how I got screwed.

Turns out they sold me a machine that was
A) a floor model
B) had a previous owner that had returned it as defective
C) told me it was brand new in the box.

Three years later, Apple is still arguing with them
and I am out over $1,000
despite the fact that that the store
A) took the machine back
B) offered $1,000 worth of remedial classes to make up for not returning a penny or coughing up another NEW Machine.

So I told my friends and they all laughed at me and told me I was stupid for going to
A) that particular Apple store -- which APPLE ITSELF RECOMMENDED
B) buying anything out of ANY Apple store and not direct from Apple itself via UPS and a credit card with a serious fraud/consumer complaints department.

Learn from my mistake.

[Melynn]

66. Wow, thanks for the heads up

I trusted the Apple store before that story.

[DulceDecorum]

69. The worst part is

I LOVE Macs,
but I am still pissed off at Apple for leading me to the slaughter.
Plus my PC is tolerable.
Gateway has a very decent consumer service dept.
God knows they need it.
But they are very nice and they DO do whatever it is they promised,
(including sending a new 'puter after the fourth time you have to send it in for service,)
which is far more than I can say for some other companies.

[Deja Q]

62. Why?

Having stores with Macs in them causes nice price wars that in turn lower the price.

The Mac will still be the same regardless, it's not the store's fault for the quality of the equipment people buy.
(the above is a slam againsty ALL PC makers since ALL people will find something to gripe about ALL of them. That's why I home-build and now use Linux too.)

[cleofus1]

63. can you play games on your PC?

can you play doom III...or diablo II...or warcraft III?
i built my own too, and really looked hard at a Linux based system...but it's my mindless love of gaming that sent me back into the arms of uncle bill...and i do find that windows xp is the most viable platform that Microsoft has put out to date...

Macs are for elitists with cash to burn...

get down with the proletariat and build your own...

[unsavedtrash]

14. I would trust buying the tower and parts and building one before I bought

a brand name. We had to quickly throw my partner's HP outside AFTER IT CAUGHT TO FIRE. We have not bought name brand since. However, if you do go brand name do not buy a Gateway.

[mvd]

16. My uncle had lots of problems with Gateway

Granted, he was not very computer literate, but the support was terrible..

[Neshanic]

17. Sony Vaio...mine runs AutoCad, Photoshop, Illustrator, Acrobat...

and Office professional. It's a workhorse. Is my main work computer, the Toshiba Laptop is durable too.

[Floogeldy]

18. Don't buy a Mac if you are just a general consumer using a computer

They are good for some specialties, like graphic arts, etc. . . . .

Otherwise, it is just plain stupid.

B-)

[aePrime]

20. On the contrary

You should buy a Mac if you are just a general consumer using a computer.

They're much easier to use than Windows, they're more stable, and more secure.

And if you're a power user, you should still buy a Mac, because it's Unix underneath, but with a really pretty interface. But you never have to see Unix if you don't want to.

I have a BS in computer science. I'm a computer science graduate student. The only person to whom I would not recommend a Mac is perhaps somebody who is really into games, but there are still some good games on the Mac (I played a bit of Lord of the Rings on mine today!)

I have two Linux boxen (one of which is my server, and the other my main computer), but I have a Powerbook that is my wife's main computer. She wasn't thrilled about getting a Mac at first, but now she wouldn't go back to Windows for the world.

Of course, the basic Mac mini is only $500! You'd have to have a monitor though (which you probably do, since you're online), and buy a keyboard and mouse. Maybe a little extra $$$ for some more memory.

[Floogeldy]

21. Ha ha ha!

Good one!

B-)

[aePrime]

22. Good rebuttal

Yes, it's difficult to argue with the strong facts you have presented. I will now to sulk in the corner.

[caledesi]

31. When was the last time u used a Mac? Maybe 1984?

Times have changed my friend. It's not your father's Mac. The argument you use is old....very old.

Macs are not JUST for graphics anymore..ask NASA.

[progressor]

33. This is a myth.

However, as an avid PC user, I recommend a Mac for general users.

Why? Well, the reasons were outlined by the above Computer Science BS holder, so I won't go back into that.

What I must comment on is the "Macs are best for graphic arts".

As a web designer, this is nonsense. It's true that Macs used to be geared to graphic arts - 15-20 years ago. Today, there is no viable excuse to support that myth. Yes, Mac monitors are generally better than those that come with PCs, but not that much - and the flat cinematic monitors are in the $1000 range. In fact, for powerful hardware and processing power, PCs are the way to go.

But for the general user, Macs are better for reasons mentioned above.

But they're not better for graphic arts - in any way whatsoever.

[Ladyhawk]

19. Do you live close enough for a "Ladyhawk"? :D

I could build you a custom job. :) Probably it would cost you more these days, though...darn. :(

[saltpoint]

24. I use both PC and Mac platforms and would recommend --

-- Mac's operating system, hands down.

I've had many fewer crashes and problems on the Mac than on anything Bill Gates' people have put forth.

[Awsi Dooger]

52. I thought I had a mouse freeze on Panther last night

For about 30 seconds. It was absolutely shocking.

Finally I remembered I had Classic open including one old video fixing application. I force quit that app and my cursor reappeared.

[kariatari]

25. Gateway support is terrible.

Not that I have had any experience with tech support from other computer companies, but they've all got to be better than Gateway.

I've used Gateway computers pretty much all of my life, and have never been completely happy with them. I've never actually been really happy with Microsoft OS at all.

Because the English and Education departments at my university use mostly Macs, I've grown familiar with them and have actually come to like them a lot.

[4morewars]

26. Here's an alternative to the "name" brands

http://www.unionbuiltpc.com/home.php#

They are competitive as far as price goes, and they are built here.
I always build my own, but that may not be the way to go if you have no experience. There are many things that can go wrong. If you've never replaced a HDD, or an OS, then i strongly suggest against going that route.

[Jilly Beans]

27. I am on my Gateway laptop right now. DO NOT BUY GATEWAY.

Mine had been in the shop more frequently than it's been in my lap. Everytime I have to send it in, even though it's under warranty, it costs $40 to send it. The first time I sent it in, the sent me back someone else's computer! I had to fight them for three weeks to get MY computer back.

I bought my son a Gateway desktop, because it was a good price. Three months later, the monitor went out, and they claimed that it was not under warranty. I went to Circuit City and bought a new monitor rather than haggle with them.

Do not, repeat DO NOT buy from gateway. The customer service is excellent when you are making the purchase, but it SUCKS after the computer is sitting in your home.

I have dealt with people who were smart asses and who even hung up on me because I was insistent that they honor the warranty on the monitor. I was overcharged for my laptop, and it took over two months to get the overcharge taken off my credit card.

I am telling you, do not waste your time or money at gateway. Worst products, worst support ever.

[queenjane]

46. Ditto!!!!

Only buy Gateway if you're a masochist and just adore having tech support yell at you for daring to call them after your credit card has been charged for the purchase.

We have Dells at work. They're fabulous. And be sure to get the flat panel. My screen-related headaches are gone.

[cleofus1]

30. i bought and built my own from this site

check it out...really go here and check it...you should click on this link because it is a very cool site...i swear to you...

http://www.xtechnology.com/

[tjwmason]

32. They are painful

I mean that's part of the point. If they're hot enough to burn your flesh, they're hot enough to hurt.

Oh, you mean brands of computer...can't really help much there.

[progressor]

34. If you're just a general user...

buy a Mac. They're more stable, secure, and better built than any major PC company. It'll take a little bit to get used to the OS, but the learning curve is small.

If you must have a PC, build your own or find someone to do it for you. It's what I've done since I got my first computer (that was 'my own') in '99.

[LynneSin]

35. Buy Blue: Buy Sony

Sony is a major blue company and they have great computers to boot.

Buy a Sony!!

[VOX]

51. Agreed! I've had two Sony PCs, and they're great!

The fact that it's a blue company is just icing on the cake. :thumbsup:

[Jamastiene]

36. There's more than one reason to be upset with Dell

in my opinion. I did my work study in the computer room at the college I go to and they had nothing but 1/2 Gateways and 1/2 Dells (a little over 30 computers in all). The Dells all had stickers on them saying things like "the floppy drive is bad in this one" "the monitor is blurry and cannot be adjusted" and "this computer cuts off in the middle of your work without warning, you WILL lose your unsaved work on this computer". That accounted, I would say, for about 1/3 of the Dells in there. The Gateways did have a single sign on one of them, but it was a warning telling people not to use it to download porn, because of where it was and how hard it was to watch people back in that section.

I'm not trying to start a computer war or anything, but in my opinion, and I am going to get a new computer within the next month myself, I'm leaning heavily toward Gateway. I don't know what your computing needs are, but my personal pick would be a Gateway if I was to go for it right now.

[progressor]

38. I'd be careful...

Gateways, as evidenced above and other places, are lousy. Dell's are better, even if they aren't that great.

Dell laptops are really crappy, though. I know 3 people who have them and all three have had hard disk failures within 1 year of owning the computer. That's totally unacceptable.

[Sgent]

40. I've dealth with all of them

at one time or another...

Gateway -- used to be the "techie" computer, but has gone downhill. DO NOT BUY

Dell -- good computer, good support

HP -- good computer, good support (excellent if you get the upgraded support)

Apple -- Good computer, probably recommended if no games

Sony -- This is my main computer. EXCELLENT monitors, but you can also get them separately. Apple uses rebranded Sony monitors. good computer, crappy support and website

ABS -- my personal favorite right now for PCs. Good computer, Excellent pricing, excellent support

Note with Dell and HP they have two systems -- home based and office based (for instance with dell its the diminsion and optiplex). The office based computers have a lot going for them in terms of stability and support, and I would recommend at least pricing the difference.

[Jamastiene]

41. The one Gateway I was looking at would run less

than $1500 with shipping, taxes and tons of modifications. Are the Sony comuters more expensive as a rule? A couple of things I know I want will be at least 512 mb Ram and a soundblaster. I'd like a tv tuner card if I can get it. The main thing for me will be games and music creation. I need the music creation part to be an option with whatever I get. I need the price to be less than 1500 altogether more though. I want a floppy drive too. I don't understand why they quit putting those on standard. Not everyone can afford the newfangled fancy media thingamabobs. You can tell I've no idea about anything newer than rewritable cd's. I just haven't been able to keep up like I'd like to.

[progressor]

42. If you're playing games and making music...

I wouldn't buy a manufactured computer at all. Depending on which games you want, you may want a beast of a video card - mine has a $400 Nvidia GeForce 6800GT w/256MB RAM (sorry to brag ;-) ). Runs Half-Life 2 at 1280x1024, high detail everything - and no framerate loss.

Also, you might look into Creative's Audigy soundcards - especially the Platinums. They're about $200 a pop, but they're amazing - MUCH better than the SoundBlaster Live! line - which are great general sound cards.

[Jamastiene]

70. I'm jealous...

I really wish I could build my own, because whatever I try to buy, either I get it exactly how I want it to begin with or I void whatever warranty I have if I add cards to it. I'm beginning to think the advice about the computers all being crap, just throw a dart and buy the cheapest one is the one I will use. For the amount of money I have to work with and the situation I am in, I may have to do that anyhow. I appreciate your advice too though. You are definitely right about the sounds cards too. That gateway I had custom built on the web site while I was dreaming one night had the option to add an audigy. I checked that out on the actually creative labs web site and was pleased with what it would do. The games would have to come second though. I see them as a pastime and the music as my main passion.

[fujiyama]

39. Sony, HP...for name brands

and check out some deals on www.newegg.com www.pricewatch.com www.resellerratings.com

All three sites give ya some links to stores, though with pricewatch I'd check the store's ratings on reseller ratings before going with a site there.

I personally build them, but on newegg or elsewhere you might find some nice non brand name barebones or pre built computer...All you might have to install is a hard drive or so.

[progressor]

43. I love NewEgg...

I use them for every system I build. Everything I've ever ordered from them has arrived in 3 days (exactly) with standard shipping.

Amazing service and great prices!

[Sgent]

44. I usually price out the system with pricewatch

and Newegg has always managed to meet it -- if not beat it if I call them up and negotiate.

[Aiptasia]

45. I like my Sony.. it didn't break immediately

I replaced two PC's over the past year, and I bought them at Best Buy. I first tried to replace the office PC system with a Gateway computer (I've owned mail order gateways in the past and they used to be solidly built machines), but I tried to install two different Gateway machines and they were both DOA right off the Best Buy shelf.

I then went with a high end Sony Viao machine, and it's worked perfectly since day one.

Then, my home PC went out, and I tried to cheap out and buy a HP computer. It was also DOA right off the shelf. So, I sprang for another Sony Viao machine for the house. Bam, works fine.

Both Gateway and HP have gone way way down hill since they've outsourced their assembly to Mexico and Asia. I'm just glad Best Buy has a geek squad tech desk where I could test out each machine (past the first one) to see if it worked before leaving the store.

[flvegan]

47. I bought my HP not too long ago, and I love it.

AMD 64, more memory than I can use now, etc.

I called tech support once. Very helpful, but located in Bombay or something, which is a downside.

[Robeson]

49. Have you ever thought about having one built for you??...

...Places like Computer Renaissance will do it to any specifications you want, and you can usually get a better price.

[pauliedangerously]

50. Forget about "brand names"

Go to an independent dealer. It's all the same crap inside with a different label on the outside.

Is there something specific you want it geared toward? Recording? Gaming? Check out General Nanosystems online. They're local to Minneapolis and you could get some ideas there, but I would recommend using a dealer in your area.

You first need to assess you needs. Retrobox (online) sells decent used computers if you're just looking for another box. If you're looking for something kick-assed, get one custom built by a local.

[cleofus1]

53. watch my lips...

build your own computer on line...it's cheap it's fun and you have complete control...buying any brand computer at full price is for neophytes...go to x-technology and play around for a couple of hours....you will be hooked...i still go there every once in a while just to build a cheap machine and then a dream machine...you can't go wrong if you build it yourself;-)

http://www.xtechnology.com

[Iterate]

55. Name brands usually mean trouble

I can't begin to say the number of times I've either had to bail out someone with a name brand PC, or worse yet, tell them their PC can't be fixed or upgraded. Why?

I'm not fond of sweeping generalizations, but in general, the cheaper you get the more likely these pitfalls:
They use proprietary parts and configurations that lock you into their brands and support.
They use 'obsolete', non-standard, or excess production that no one else wants.
They cut corners on the case and power supply (which doesn't show in the 'specs'). A good case will allow plenty of room for expansion, cooling, and will last for 2-3 replacements of the internals =ten years++.
Support is on another continent, except for Apple? and IBM.

Best option? Build, or find a local shop you can trust (they might even be blue). Tell them what you want, how you want to use it. Stress high quality, reliable, standard parts. It won't be more expensive.

[Robeson]

67. Excellent advice.....

...I found a local shop that is reliable, and had them build for me according to MY specs. I even got a cool housing for it. Its the way to go.

[khashka]

56. I would suggest a Mac

Theyre a little pricey but easy to use, and intuitive (though not so much as they used to be, since the OS is Unix based now).

There are, at my latest check, NO viruses that affect Macs. That will probably change at some point, but Macs have never had the virus problems, security problems, hard disk crash problems that seem so common to Windows users.

It's true that almost all software comes out Windows first and Mac later -anywhere from a few weeks to many months. I've been using the same Mac for fifteen years and only recently upgraded. There are emulation programs that allow you to run PC software on Macs. They work much better, in my experience, than the other way round.

The biggest complaint is you can't program on a Mac - which is total bullshit. Having used both - I found it easier on a Mac.

My advice... get a Mac, even if you have to go without for a while so you can save up the money. Sad but true, you do get what you pay for. There is a reason why Mac users are fanatical about their machines....


khash.

[cleofus1]

57. why pay top dollar for a Mac

look into my eyes....build your own computer...

Macs are cool, but lets face it...you can get a lot more bang for your buck if you build a pc...

you got a shitload of cash...buy a Mac...otherwise...

[khashka]

59. Uh huh

True, you can get the bang for your buck if you build a PC. And I'll agree, it's a shitload of fun. Give me a few wires and a screwdriver and I'm in hog heaven. I may be a faggot but tinkering with machinery is my idea of a great Saturday night.


But what you are suggesting is to use a rather coarse metaphore: a really great bang. And trust me, I like really great bangs, in all senses of the word.

But your'e suggesting a really fun one nightstand. But for a long term relationship - get a Mac.

Khash.
p.s. But if you ever wanna hook up, have a couple overpriced drinks and start tinkering in a sleazy motel room, I'm up for it.

[aePrime]

68. OS X programming

The biggest complaint is you can't program on a Mac

Really? I haven't heard that much, but it's easy to refute.

OS X comes with GCC (a C and C++ (and more) compiler), Perl, Java, etc... . Windows comes with none of this. And what's even better -- OS X comes with a free IDE! OS X comes with a free profiler! You can shell out a couple of hundred bucks for Visual Studio on Windows.

Of course, you can download Eclipse on both platforms.

I don't care though, give me gcc and vi. I also can't program without Bash, grep, and all of those fun GNU tools. If I have to program on Windows, I also have to install Gvim and Cygwin.

Also, interestingly, you can write OS X applications in Objective C.

[psychopomp]

58. I like my Dreamsys

Not sure if you can get it in the states, tho. Cost me about 500 bucks w/o monitor (had one). 1.5 Ghz/256/200Gb/SD port/Compact Flash port/Smart Media port/ IEEE fiber optic port,etc.






Panel on front for easy access to card drives, ports.





It is very fast and, after about a year, trouble-free!

[cleofus1]

60. build it and you will come...

to understand pc is the way to go....



1 Year Limited Warranty
Integrated 10/100 Mbps LAN ethernet card
Windows XP Home Edition CD ver.
Cooling Fan CPU Socket 478
BLACK Optical Mouse
BLACK PS2 Enhanced Keyboard
512Mb PC3200 - 400MHz DDR Memory
3.0 GHz 800MHz Intel Pentium 4 HT 512K
MAXTOR 120GB SATA HDD 7200rpm 8MB
INTEL D865PERLX P4 865PE (800D4UAL) Motherboard
GeForce FX5200 256MB 8X DVI&TV
Lian-Li PC61 Black Aluminum Case
NSpire 450W Power Supply
7 in 1 Media Drive : Black FDD + Memory Card Reader
LITEON Black SOHW-1633S 16x Double Layer DVDRW
Creative Labs Sound Blaster Live! PCI 24bit 5.1 VARPak 1

no monitor....1100.00 on line built it myself...had it since october and not one crash...not one problem...

[cleofus1]

61. here's my baby...

but build your own...to your own taste and financial needs...
you'll love it like a puppy...