Fellow I know talked to Gert Clark the other day, Clark will not be VP

[Phelan]

This fellow does some work for the Clark campaign and is somebody I have met personally before, so I believe him without any reservations.
but here is his report:
PoliticalLefty on Clark as VP

Edit:
Fixed the Link

[BlueEyedSon]

1. Bad link?

[David Zephyr]

2. Dean Will Need Clark....And Clark Will Need Dean.

n/t

[Julien Sorel]

3. What on earth would Clark need Dean for?

[joeybee12]

4. He'd need Dean to ask him to be his VP!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But according to an interview on Salon, Clark said he wouldn't be VP for Dean--I didn't read it--just the heading.

[Capn Sunshine]

44. remember, lack of asking and one phone call made Clark a D instead of R

according to the apocrapha

[dobak]

5. true

Clark gains nothing with Dean as VP. Clark already has great organization and $$$.

He needs someone who can help him win a few more of those "battleground" states.

[Ediacara]

6. Clark needs Dean's army

Clark doesn't have what Dean built, and he needs it if he hopes to win.

[Phelan]

9. a lot of people keep on saying that...but I think its one of those things

its been reported so often that now its considered to be true...
I think people under estimate the other grassroots movements, and I think in the near future we will see more of them as most non-Dean grassroots people are severly ticked off about Gore's remarks on grassroots, I know I was.

[KittyWampus]

12. Dean Only Has About 15-20% of Base. So WHAT Army?

and Labor sounded like it preferred Clark but went with Dean cause Clark had to forgo Iowa due to his late start.

[angee_is_mad]

15. will they sit at home?

If Dean wasn't to win the nomination, would his supporters just seat at home? Or would they put all of their awesome energy and anger toward getting Bush out of office even if it wasn't their candidate?

[roguevalley]

32. I think he's going to do what is right either way. This is a principled

stand. Anyone asking me or mine if I would 'settle' while I was running a campaign for something else would receive the same words from me and mine.

The convention will tell. We all know what is at stake, none better
than Clark and Dean. I think they will do what is right, telling anyone sooner be damned.

Of course, his wife would say no. She's part of his team and to say
something that might impign his momentum and effort would be a bad
idea. That doesn't mean later cannot change.

The only ones who never change are the repugs.

[TorchTheWitch]

33. huh?

Clark doesn't have what Dean built, and he needs it if he hopes to win.

So you're saying that if Clark got the nomination Dean's army will vote Green or Repub?

[David Zephyr]

10. Being Gracious...

Howard Dean will enter the Democratic National Convention in Boston with at least 40 to 50% of the delegates...probably more.

While I believe that Dean will be the nominee, I will grant you, without reservation, that it is Clark, not Gephardt, that will arrive in the city of Samuel Adams, John Hancock and John Adams next summer with a motherlode of delegates himself.

Still, Howard Dean will have at least 40% of the delegates. Even if Clark can pull it all off --- and I do not deny for one second that his popularity is growing --- the Party will have to be united in Boston, not divided.

These two candidates compliment each other perfectly.

[AntiCoup2K4]

20. This party can't wait until Boston to be united

March is about the latest. We gotta have a solid 6 months of a united front against the Bush Criminal Empire. At that point we won't have the luxury of candidates and their supporters ripping each other apart.

[jumptheshadow]

7. I hear Gert is a straight talker

And she's not afraid to say what her hubby is thinking. :)

[KittyWampus]

8. Clark Is Very Well Qualified To Be Commander In Chief

and Head of State. He already has experience doing these things.

Dean, on the other hand does not. He is, at most, qualified to be President of the Senate. Although, considering the disrepectful comments Dean has made about Congresspeople and the Democrats who serve in Washington, I don't think he'd be all that great in that capacity either.

Since Dean has "grown" or switched stances on so many core Liberal Issues since entering the Presidential race, frankly I think he should run for the Senate or Congress. Then he can work on developing his own personal Progressive core.

[9119495]

11. Of course he says that now--he has to. They all do. Clark would need

Dean because Dean has a tremendous grassroots following that would follow him as a VP. He has the organization to raise the cash needed to fund the ads Clark can't pay for. Clark opted into matching funds so he will run out of cash. Dean's organization will be putting up bats for moveon, and any other group that can run an add.

Dean also pulls in new voters like no other candidate. In a close election, that can be the difference. Thus, Dean adds much in a contest for battleground states.

[KittyWampus]

14. Clark's Matching Funds Are For The Primary

and he is raising a helluva lot of money from what I gather.

Clark is not obligated to spending limits in the General IIRC.

And to say that Dean pulls in new voters discounts the fact that Clark pulls in Independents, Moderate GOP and Southerners.

[Texas_Dem]

13. no VP

Clark does not want to be VP. He is not running for VP.

Wes Clark is going to be the next President Of The United States.

[otohara]

16. Oh That's Just Peachy

pass up an opportunity to be Vice President from a guy who has not served in any political office, because......of his ego perhaps. He's young, serve as VP, then go on to become Prez. What's wrong with paying some dues first?

Why, I don't get it.

[Julien Sorel]

17. Why should he agree to be the

candidate for VP for a guy who's almost certain to lose? He gains nothing, and if Dean is shameless enough to try to run in 08 after getting thumped in 04, it makes it extremely difficult for Clark to run in 08. The whole VP thing is a losing proposition for Clark personally, and the country in the long run. If Clark gets thumped along with Dean, it might hurt him in 08 even if Dean doesn't run.

I also think Clark is one of the logical people to have on the sidelines to help put things back together after we lose the presidency and more seats in the Senate. He's been involved in turnarounds his entire career (including one of the greatest this country has seen, overhauling the Army in the wake of Vietnam), he's an outsider, he's extremely bright, and he's respected as trustworthy by all except the party nutjobs. If he's involved as second banana in the campaign that is seen as being responsible for the damage, it would hurt his ability to effect change in the future.

[AntiCoup2K4]

23. Billy, an honest question...

When was the last time a President was elected without any prior political experience?

Eisenhower, I believe. Another General, but one whose military command was a little more famous than Kosovo.

It's obvious you believe in Wesley Clark. Nothing wrong with that. I believe he will play some role in the new administration myself. I just don't see him winning the top job in the current fear driven climate with a lie driven media - controlled by a power mad Karl Rove.

The moron in thief's experience will be ridiculously amplified while exploiting the "danger" of putting an inexperienced man in office "in these serious times".

Do you really think that Clark, on his own, can convince the sheeple that he's best qualified for the job, under these conditions?

[Julien Sorel]

25. It's up to the 'sheeple, ' as you describe them, to decide.

I certainly believe that Clark has what it takes to make his case, and that he has what it takes to be an effective president. In three months of campaigning, he has grown to become in my view the best candidate in the field -- the best speaker except Sharpton, and Kerry when he's on; in the middle of the pack as most knowledgeable about the issues, with CMB, Kerry, Gep, and probably Edwards coming in ahead of him, but after only three months his ability to discuss a wide range of issues in-depth is nothing short of phenomenal; he's the second fastest thinker on his feet (Sharpton), he knows how to work a room (big learning step), he's mastering the difficult art of spin and deflection -- he's come a very long way, and shows no signs of reaching a plateau. He's still working on being able to present a condensed message, but he's almost got that down, I think. In three to six months, I think he would be a monster.

Of course, everything is a choice, and choice involves opportunity cost, and I don't see the cost as being all that high in this case (that's a slam on the other candidates, all of whom I like except Dean, and sometimes Gephardt and Lieberman, by the way). I also don't think that whom we select to be the candidate should be predicated entirely on winning or losing against Bush, but also on the congressional races, and should be a part of some kind of strategy designed to make the party's image more attractive to a broad spectrum of voters. So in part, we're making our decisions on a different set of criteria.

[Phelan]

29. and the last time a candidate from New England was elected was Kennedy

Your point?

(A democratic candidate that is)

[otohara]

34. Let's See - Advantages of Having a SOUTHERN former GENERAL

would be very good for our ticket.

It's called balance, it's called serving, it's called taking a chance - it's called experience in campaigning for the top job.

How odd that you describe the whole scenerio for Clark as being a "losing proposition personally" -

This isn't about Clark new career path, it's about taking back our country from this demonic bunch in power now.

If Clark can't look past his personal ambition and help out the ticket if Dean wins, then I'm not sure what to think of Clark or any other politican who would say infatically NO to Vice President -

Wesley Clark as VP would be hard to beat, it's about choice - Wesley Clark or Dick Cheney?

[opihimoimoi]

18. There seems to be no shortage of lunaresque egos these daze.

It should be what is best for the CAUSE not whats best for MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE


HELLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO??

[Julien Sorel]

22. You mean like Dean leaking his 'offer'

of the VP slot to Clark to hurt Clark's chances in the primary? That kind of selfishness?

Dean forced this step on Clark with his little leak, and now you people whine about it? Had Dean not been the dishonest, backstabbing person that he is, Clark wouldn't have been forced to deal with the VP issue at all, so I think it's time to stop trying to spin this as Clark seflishness, and see it for what it is: Clark responding to some of Dean's dirty tricks. Dean must have forgotten he is an honest straight shooter the day he came up with that little trick, and now it's robbing him of his potential crutch. Poetic justice.

[opihimoimoi]

35. It may have been a GOP inititive re the "leak". In these daze, I don beli

eve nuthin/

[otohara]

36. Can You Prove This "Leak" You Speak Of?

"Clark wouldn't have been forced to deal with VP issue at all" -

If Clark is unable to deal with...God forbid - being considered as a VP candidate. What are you saying?

Put 2 + 2 together BillyB - Dean makes several calls to Clark - everyone speculates WHY. Doesn't ake a fricking brain surgeon to figure out what's being considered.

Did you ever consider that if Clark hadn't taken so long to throw in his hat, he might very well be ahead of Dean now.

His waffling was tiring - his holding back on whether he was a democrat, republican, or independent was maddening.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

27. You're WAY Off Base

You're assuming Clark won't be Dean's VP due to ego. That assumption is false.

DTH

[otohara]

38. Lots of WAY, WAY Off Base

remarks are made on DU - I'm just trying to figure out why Clark would not take a VP slot.

Ego, fear of losing, won't play second banana to anybody, pay is not as good, VP house is too small???

Tell me why anyone who is committed to serving his country would turn down the opportunity that would make a HUGE impact in getting Bush/Cheney & the rest of these horrible people out of power?

[DoveTurnedHawk]

39. It's From a Personal Conversation

And while the main proposition is obviously out there judging from the blog entry, I'm not sure if the motive is appropriate for me to disclose without permission.

I can tell you 100% however that the reason Clark will not be Dean's VP has nothing to do with Clark's ego. You may choose to believe that, or not.

DTH

[Barbara917]

40. Clark paid dues for 35 years

[w4rma]

19. I'm sorry but this makes him less of a candidate in my book.

VP is beneath him? Or is it that he doesn't want to work directly under a Democratic President? Or is it that his ego is too big for the country. Maybe he's running because of his ego.

He won't win the top spot either, anyway. :shrug:

[LoneStarLiberal]

21. Not A Matter of Being "Beneath"

I don't think it would be beneath him by his reasoning; I think he realizes there would be better candidates out there for the position. His talents would be better spent in a Cabinet position if he is not in the White House.

He just doesn't fit the bill as a VP; now as National Security Advisor, Secretary of State, or Secretary of Defense, yes, I believe he would have a better fit.

[w4rma]

24. I hope that, or something similar, is his reasoning.

And none of the posibilities I listed are.

[DoveTurnedHawk]

28. You're Way Off Base, Too

Is this "ego" thing some kind of Dean talking point?

DTH

[DoveTurnedHawk]

26. I Confirm This Story

Clark will not be Dean's VP.

DTH

[imhotep]

30. thank god

.

[GalleryGod]

31. WHY would Wes embarass himself?

He's SERVED his nation, enough.

[BigBigBear]

37. Every day

I get the sense that Dean's got the best organization, and Clark has the only chance to beat Bush.

I said it in August, and only feel stronger about it today.

I appreciate the Dean supporters and their vigor, but I'm getting a bad feeling on this - sort of like walking off a cliff.

[otohara]

41. This Thread isn't About Dean

it's about Wesley Clark - refusing to accept the VP slot if Dean wins the nomination -

Don't you think a Dean/Clark ticket would be a winning ticket?

Dean/Clark or Bush/Cheney

Clark would make a fine president - but he may not win the nomination - who would be the perfect running mate? Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that one out.

[ResistTheCoup]

42. Yes, it is

Why do the Dean people feel the need to leech onto Clark as a VP to Dean? Does Dean so desperately need him? Don't you think he could win on his own? I don't think so many people are worried that Clark is not going to try to help the Democratic party, but that he's not willing to help their candidate win the nomination.

And all this handwringing (as I've said in another thread) is both presumptuous and duplicitous. Has Dean announced his intention to run as Clark's VP? Of course not. He's running for President - just like the General.

Is it Dean's ego that keeps him from admitting he'd run as Clark's VP? Is he a craven politician? :eyes:

No, he's running for President and he would be foolish to announce that he'd be just as happy to serve as VP.

On another thread when I suggested that Dean announce his intention to serve as Clark's VP if asked, I got a very snippy, "You've got to be kidding. When Clark gets out of 4th place then we'll talk" answer. See what I mean about presumptuous and duplicitous?

Let's wait until the primary is over before we start picking out shoes for the inaugural and VP's.

:-)

[otohara]

43. No, No - It Isn't

Fellow I know talked to Gert Clark the other day, Clark will not be VP

Edited on Mon Dec-15-03 09:45 PM by Phelan
This fellow does some work for the Clark campaign and is somebody I have met personally before, so I believe him without any reservations.
but here is his report:

Fine - Wesley Clark won't serve as VP - I still think if Clark hadn't taken so long to jump in - he would be the front runner.

It's too bad that Clark has already refused the VP spot if it's offered to him. I think he'd make a fine VP as well as a fine president -

Al Gore ran for president a couple of times - lost, still accepted the slot as VP. Nothing wrong with being the VP, unless you're Dick Cheney - then the whole country suffers.