Poll: partial-birth abortion efficient?

[usregimechange]

Should the partial-birth abortion procedure be banned?

Definitely, it is cruel and inhumane.
No, it is efficient.
Undecided.

http://www.joplinglobe.com/

What do you guys think about this poll?

[beam me up scottie]

1. I think it's nobody's business.

It's between a woman and her doctor.

[usregimechange]

2. No, I mean the poll, biased or what? i.e. efficient.

[beam me up scottie]

3. Oh.

Hell Yes!

Aren't most of them?:mad:

Feeds into the myth that a woman would carry a fetus up to her third trimester and then decide to have an abortion because she changed her mind.

[DaveColorado]

4. push poll

[beam me up scottie]

7. Yep.

Like the old "When did you stop beating your wife?" bit.

[Hekate]

9. And nasty flame-bait

NO ONE wakes up one morning in her eighth month and goes, "Oops, think I'll off the kid today."

NO ONE

NO ONE

NO ONE

It is a dangerous procedure FOR THE MOTHER.

There are a vanishingly tiny number of late-term abortions performed in this or any country.

Pro-life women and their husbands testified before Congress about their VERY MUCH WANTED BABIES who had to be aborted for terrifyingly real MEDICAL REASONS. THEY WEPT as they testified.

They wanted our asshole president to get it through his thick skull that THIS MEDICAL PROCEDURE should be left to a woman and her doctor and should NOT be outlawed.

So stop with the flame-bait push-poll.

Hekate

[Maddy McCall]

8. Definitely biased. Even by calling the procedure a...

"partial birth abortion" the poll writers express their bias.

[SidDithers]

28. That was my first thought too...

"Partial-Birth" abortion is what the right wing calls it. The medical community, I'm sure, has a different name for the procedure.

Sid

[Suich]

5. IMHO? Definitely biased in favor of pro-lifers.

It's actually a 3rd term abortion and is a decision that is reached by the woman and her doctor...it is not the government's business. "Live-birth abortion" is a term coined by the pro-lifers.
My understanding is that it's only performed in extreme cases, like if the fetus has no brain stem and is not viable outside the womb.

[Maddy McCall]

6. There is no such procedure. That's a right-wingnut created term.

[DanCa]

10. I agree 100 percent. Just like the supposed breast cancer scare

No truth in thate either just scare tactics.

[cloud_chaser1]

12. Maddy, I hate to say this but

there is such a procedure and it is not a frivolous thing. I'll explain a little further down.

[Maddy McCall]

16. No, it's not. There's no medical term called "partial birth abortion"

The medical term is Dilation and Extraction.

[Baconfoot]

20. Not quite: Actually it doesn't refer to ANYparticular procedure whatsoever

Click hear to read the Supreme Court case where they explain why partial birth abortion cannot be read as meaning just D&X and instead extends also to other procedures

[Maddy McCall]

21. I don't give a whit what the Supreme Court thinks about a medical term.

I trust women's physicians on this one, and women's physicians say that there is NO SUCH PROCEDURE as partial birth abortion.

The procedure that teminates late term pregnancies is medically known as Dilation and Extraction.

Additionally, I don't have hours to read that court brief. IF you have a point to make, why not copy and paste the relevent part of the brief in this thread, isntead of posting just a cryptic link.

[cloud_chaser1]

27. Maddy, still wrong.

You dilation definition is also used in connection with the aftermath of a miscarriage, "Dilation and curetage". The name of the procedure is not the issue....the procedure itself is. You could call it a MacDonalds Big Mac Attack but the procedure would still be the same. A late term abortion is just that, one performed in the third trimester.....all the semantics in the book wont change that fact.

[Baconfoot]

18. Note: You say you will explain further down. Instead you reiterate...

and provide no justification whatsoever for you claim that "partial birth abortion" is a medical term.

This is unsurprising, since had you either been to medical school or read up on court cases which discuss the term, you would have known that it indeed is not a medical term and nor is it "just another name" for a medical procedure more commonly known as something else.

I refer you to STENBERG v. CARHART 99-830
Click Here for Stenberg v. Carhart

You need to read up on this.

[Maddy McCall]

22. And you need to post the relevant part of that case as it...

relates to this thread.

[cloud_chaser1]

29. Maddy, the relevcant part was lost.

I connected that the option in that poll, that late term abortions are efficient is not the issue. The issue is....are they needed. Thats why the poll was bogus.

Thats like having a poll in which the main question is:

Which is a better way to travel?
1. planes
2, I love bananas.
3. Yes.

Is that a bogus poll? Bananas were not relevent. Neither was efficiency.

[LittleClarkie]

23. It's called a D & E, isn't it?

And as far as I've ever been able to figure out, it's used when the baby has a certain condition that makes it's head too large to give birth vaginally. The child does not survive the condition, and making the mother go through a C-Section to give birth to a child who will not survive doesn't seem to be in the best interest of the mother.

So they Dilate and Evacuate.

Pro-lifers make it sound like all of a sudden the mother, after carrying the bagy lo these many months, suddenly decides she doesn't want it, so the cruel doctor pulls it out half way, kills it while it's till in the process so that it can be called an abortion and not murder, and voila, that selfish mother no longer has to worry about that nasty little baby.

What kind of nut believes a thing like that?

No. Don't tell me. Let me guess.

It's a procedure with a specific need attached to it. That's why it can't be banned. It's needed for certain situations. But it appears that pro-lifers have built up some sort of mythology around the thing. Rock, meet hard place.

This is the situation as far as I know, but I'd be happy to be corrected if I've got a misconception in there somewhere. Please, educate me. I would prefer to have all the facts.

[radwriter0555]

25. HEY, if a DOC wrote about it in morbid detail, it must exist, right?

For years I've challenged someone to tell me the name of someone who's had that procedure.

To date, no one ever has.

(Right there with ya, sister...)

[cloud_chaser1]

11. Its a really stupid poll.

The issue is not efficiency....its necessity. The type of abortion in question is the least frequent of all the various types and it is only used in the direst of circumstances. Since it is used late in the pregnancy, its obvious, the pregnant woman wanted the baby or she would have terminated it earlier. These late term abortions are used only when a medical crisis occures, a crisis for either the mother or fetus or both.

There is much too muck emotion involved in this issue and thats why polls are absolutely the worst way to settle such issues. This is strictly a matter between women, her family and her doctor and no one else. And no poll is going to change that.

[radwriter0555]

13. Well, considering the 'procedure' has never been actually used, at least

not as documented in any place, by anyone, anywhere... I supposed it could be efficient if it were to be used.

But how can you ban something that doesn't exist? So, therefore, by all means, ban it!

[Suich]

14. Is that sarcasm?

Sorry, I'm new here.

[beam me up scottie]

19. I'm pretty sure it is.

Welcome.
:hi:

[radwriter0555]

24. Nothing sarcastic about it. I've never come across any information that

states the procedure has ever been used.

If you can show me where it's been used, I'll stand corrected.

Just because some doc wrote about it in detail, doesn't mean it's ever been done.

[Warren DeMontague]

15. "efficient"? What the fuck does that mean?

Rightwing crackheads think women are running around pregnant for eight months and deciding to get abortions at the last minute because they 'look fat'. Just like there are all these welfare queens who eat bon bons and take limos from the welfare office to the liquor store to buy expensive vodka.

Baloney. I trust doctors and women to know what's right far more than I do fuckin' televangelists, fundy nutcases, and far right political hacks.

[Maddy McCall]

17. Anyone who wants to understand how the right has manipulated...

public perception of the medical procedure know as dilaton and exraction should read this article.

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2003/oct2003/abor-o24.shtml

[LandOLincoln]

26. There is no such thing as "partial birth abortion." If you're

convinced otherwise by lying Rove talking points, go to your nearest university Ob/Gyn department and take a poll.

[slackmaster]

30. Sometimes cruel, inhumane actions are better than available alternatives

I voted undecided. The word "efficient" put me off because it reminded me of some of the efficient means used to deal with societal conflicts in the 20th Century.

I personally think abortion is an ugly, unpleasant matter that should be undertaken at the earliest possible moment in any given case. I'm pro-choice because I oppose one-size-fits-none solutions, and I don't believe it's a proper role for government to dictate moral decisions in a society where peoples' beliefs cover a wide spectrum.

I've never been a party to an abortion, never asked or encouraged a woman to have one, never even driven a woman to a clinic for that purpose. At this stage in my life (age 47, divorced, in good health physically and financially), if I happen to get a woman pregnant unintentionally I think I'm prepared to be a father. I'd take full responsibility for whatever decision that woman might make. In all cases where difficult choices arise you have to look at the consequences of your options.

Every case where that procedure is used must be a difficult situation for all individuals involved, and my heart goes out to every woman and every couple that faces that particular decision. My preference is to leave difficult, life-changing personal decisions to each individual whenever possible. Leave government out of it. OTOH late-term fetuses deserve some protection. I can't predict every possible situation that might arise in the future. So I have disqualified myself from making the decision for others.

[noonwitch]

31. I trust the individual women involved to be able to make the right choice

I really don't think that this procedure is used unless the situation is a tragic one. Few women would undergo this procedure to end an unwanted pregnancy. It is used to save women's lives.