Ahnolds hero is Hitler!!!

[Renew Deal]

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/wnt/Politics/arnold031002_past.html

I Admired Hitler’

Yet even as he tried to put out that fire, another broke out.

ABCNEWS obtained a copy of an unpublished book proposal with quotes from a verbatim transcript of an interview Schwarzenegger gave in 1975 while making the film Pumping Iron.

Asked who his heroes are, he answered, "I admired Hitler, for instance, because he came from being a little man with almost no formal education, up to power. I admire him for being such a good public speaker and for what he did with it."

He is quoted as saying he wished he could have an experience, "like Hitler in the Nuremberg stadium. And have all those people scream at you and just being total agreement whatever you say."

The author of the book proposal, Pumping Iron's director, George Butler, told ABCNEWS today that the quotes needed to be seen in context, and that Arnold never said anything anti-Semitic.

"I cannot remember any of these," Schwarzenegger told ABCNEWS. "All I can tell you is that I despise everything Hitler stood for. I despise everything the Nazis stood for, everything the Third Reich stood for."

In the final days of his campaign, Schwarzenegger may be battling yet another opponent: his own past.

[E_Zapata]

1. He's so full of it!

I remember exactly what my attitudes were about WW2, Hitler, the Nazis and the oratory skills of Hitler and what he "used them for" from 1975 - and I am younger than Arnold.

I would easily be able to tell any person on the face of the earth with risk of public hanging that I did NOT ever say anything like what that transcripts says that Arnold said.

He doesn't deny it.

Just more: I don't recall.

Scary bastard.

Oh Oprah, you have done a wonderful service to the people of California. They oughta run you right out of Sta. Barbara.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

7. My Mother does not watch Oprah anymore!

She and I could not believe how she overlooked his perverted past!

This was the same woman who attacked Bill Clinton for having a consensual affair!!!

MediaWhoresOnline.com should add her to their "A-List" Roster of Media Whores!

[ElementaryPenguin]

2. Just saw itt!!! Ah-nulled is so FUCKED NOW!! NAZI-gate!!!

eom

[David Zephyr]

67. Nazi Gate!

Thank you my blessed EP.

[blkgrl]

81. Arnold's not finished, a repub said its OK

just as long as Arnold never admired Clinton.

[Renew Deal]

83. Is this a joke? n/t

[Classical_Liberal]

3. Dupe

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=458417&mesg_id=458417

[bloom]

4. "for what he did with it."

How he is even a contender is beyond belief.

[Classical_Liberal]

6. He said he admired his political skills

Most historians acknowledge that hitler was a skilled orator. I really don't think this type of campaigning is effective. Why not talk about the fact that Pete Wilson the author of deregulation is his campaign manager?

[janekat]

11. Well look at the President we have.... I STILL can't believe that one...

[w4rma]

5. Here's the reason the GOP leadership likes Arnold so much. (n/t)

[tom_paine]

8. Guess he's having his Nuremburgs now

Lucky guy...

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

[Former Republican]

9. This sort of petty argumentation is nauseating

So what if he admired Hitler? Hitler was an astute politician. Schwarzenegger said nothing anti-Semitic in that interview. Is there something wrong with admiring Hitler for "being a little man with no formal education, up to power"? Who wouldn't want to have millions and millions of people shout your name in utter devotion?

I would attack Schwarzenegger for being another Repuke (as they are called here) and for his PROPOSED POLICIES.

This is just an insult to American politics. Schwarzenegger never said "The Holocaust is a minor detail" (what Le Pen said). He just expresses admiration for a cruel but powerful historical figure. Give him a break.

[Classical_Liberal]

10. more specifically for his politicall skills

not for his cruelty.

[Former Republican]

12. exactly that's what I meant. My English sometimes comes out muddled

because of my French mother tongue.

[w4rma]

13. "I admire him … for what he did with it."

Asked who his heroes are, he answered, "I admired Hitler, for instance, because he came from being a little man with almost no formal education, up to power. I admire him for being such a good public speaker and for what he did with it."

[PROGRESSIVE1]

14. To Former Repubican: READ WHAT w4rma SAID ABOUT....

ARNIE: "I admire him for being such a good public speaker and for what he did with it."

You are very aware Former Republican what Hitler did with "it"!!!


:eyes:

[Classical_Liberal]

19. a number of things many evil and some innocuous

He became a popular politician with it would be the more innocuous interpretation.

[Former Republican]

21. English isn't his first language...

As my colleague on this thread already pointed out, he could have meant the political power Hitler attained using his speaking skills (Which Arnold lacks).

[Classical_Liberal]

24. "Arnold lacks speaking skills." is an understatement

. Although, he speaks much better english than I do German.

[dfong63]

29. if nothing else, this shows lack of the sophistication

... that should be necessary for high office. we shouldn't have to go around making excuses for what pops out of our governor's pie hole.

[Classical_Liberal]

33. Well you won't elect any normal humans then

.

[Classical_Liberal]

15. What did he do with it?

Well it could mean he killed millions, but I am doubtful

It could mean he became politically popular with it which is more probable. English isn't Arnold's first language you know.

[Lefty48197]

54. What kind of moron would...

answer HITLER when asked who his heroes are? I suppose it's just a conicidence that Arnold's dad was an Austrian army officer who served during the nazi occupation.

[Classical_Liberal]

70. I think so

The position that hitler was a great public speaker isn't all that controversial, as presented here. It sounds like he was being ironic actually.

[neomonkey]

16. Point is

Surely there are some POSITIVE German role models who he might have chosen? You know, there are good people who have prospered after rising from humble origins as well. Hitler didn't have a monopoly on that.

[Toby109]

18. Hitler was merely CRUEL?

Are you f*cking joking me? Hitler was murdering scum. That is how he came to power and that is how he kept it. Is that to be admired?

[Classical_Liberal]

20. murdering scum are cruel

do you have a problem with this idea? Most people think nitpickers are jerks and won't be persuaded by them.

[Former Republican]

25. No. Hitler did not come to power by murdering people.

He came to power through a sharp political strategy.

[Toby109]

34. I suggest you do some research on that

and get back to me.

[Former Republican]

37. well I read Ian Kershaw's book

It doesn't say Hitler came to power through murder. Would you please provide a specific example?

[w4rma]

73. Did you watch the CBS two-part movie series "Hitler"?

Hitler has his loyal SS commander jailed and murdered for disagreeing him. He has many many dissedents killed in the streets by his people. Constant clashes with the Communists. Raided Jewish buisnesses and synogoges. He has the main character (a newspaper journalist) of the story imprisoned and killed after killing the mole who was informing him.

No, Hitler killed many people in his rise. In fact he ochestrated a (failed) military coup years before his political party built it's popularity in the polls.

[w4rma]

77. The White Rose Society

http://www.jlrweb.com/whiterose/leaflets.html
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=342240

[Classical_Liberal]

38. He used murder and intimidation too

.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

39. Hey, Former Republican, I have a link for you....

Night of the Long Knives
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
<http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_Long_Knives>

"The Night of the Long Knives (in German: Nacht der langen Messer, 29--30 June, 1934) was the Nazi purge of the Sturmabteilung (S.A.) leadership, and Hitler's political opponents; between 77 (official) and 400 people are believed to have been murdered.

The purge was the result of the political struggle between the Nazi leaders subordinate to Hitler: Hermann Göring, Joseph Goebbels, Heinrich Himmler and Reinhard Heydrich, on the one hand - and Röhm's, the leader of the S.A., on the other. Hitler encouraged political infighting amongst his subordinates, and the power of Röhm and his violent organization scared his rivals. Himmler had evidence manufactured to defame Röhm and presented it to Hitler -- fuelling his suspicion that Röhm intended to use the S.A. to launch a putsch against him.

While Hitler had been personally rather fond of Röhm he was under pressure to reduce his influence. German military leaders were unhappy with Röhm's proposal that the German army be absorbed into the larger S.A., and the industrialists that supported Hitler were concerned over Röhm's socialist leanings. Members of the Nazi party also viewed Röhm and some other S.A. leaders with distaste because they were homosexuals."

[joshcryer]

44. Heh...

C'mon... you can't believe that.

[not systems]

45. Wrong

You have never heard about the SA?

They systematically intimidated and terrorized political opponents.

I really hope that you are ignorant and not admiring
the campaign of terror and murder that paved Hitlers
road to power.

Sharp political strategy my ass.

Please.

Do you know what you are saying?

[Former Republican]

50. We are not on the same page

I am speaking about Hitler's election and what it took for his party to be nominated by the people.

[not systems]

58. I think we are

What I am saying is Hitlers rise to power was
paved by murder and intimidation.

He would have never gotten to the big election
without shuting down opposition parties and
press. With fire bombings and violence.

[Andromeda]

65. Hitler came to power

because he turned people against Jews and other groups of people he considered inferior to the Aryan prototype and made the false claim that the Jews were responsible for everything bad in the world. The German people at that time were vulnerable to that type of propaganda because they wanted someone to blame for the bad economy and economic distress they were going through.

In a warped way, Hitler provided an excuse for their hatred for Jews, Jehovah's Witness, Gypsies and other "impure" ethnic groups.

Hitler layed the groundwork and build support for the separation of Jews and others he considered lesser human beings to a Polish ghetto.

Ultimately he ordered the mass extermination of all Jews and they were herded out in boxcars to Auscwhitz. Hitler was an evil murdering scum who was responsible for crimes against humanity and you call that "sharp political strategy."

[Karenina]

22. Petty argumentation?

I'm reposting my reply to you from Hedda's thread where you so nobly defended Arnold, wie ein Ritter ohne Furcht und Tadeln...

Perhaps you'll check back in.

"what's wrong with wanting the adulation that Hitler received? That doesn't necessarily mean that you want to slaughter Jews."

The reality is that Hitler used his skills to appeal to the LOWEST common denominator of an economically stressed people. The adulation he received was a result of dumbing down the citizens, state controlled media, contrived attacks and then offering them a scapegoat upon whom they could vent their frustrations with impunity, all the while feeding them messages of their "superiority." If you can look at this process clearly, and perhaps read the PNAC documents, you will see that it has, in the bigger picture, nothing to do with "Jews" per se. What it's REALLY about is a corrupt authoritarian CONTROL.

Arnie has done a marvelous job of "smearing" himself all by himself. He is a control freak. Look at pictures of Maria Shriver 15 years ago and then check out a current one. THEN read her comments to the rape victim she interviewed and tell me your nose does not pick up the stench...

Please see my post above. Do you think for a moment that if you are raised in a family that has entrenched attitudes about the "other" that you will emerge untouched by those attitudes?

Arnold can say he's pro this and that, without ANY backup, voting record or track record other than his racist comments to other bodybuilders, friendships and relationships to BONA-FIDE NAZIS, a well-documented disrespect for women, marriage ties and coterie of right-wing assholes whose histories any infomed person knows well. He has NO QUALIFICATIONS for public office. Not even class president in high school.

WHITE AFFIRMATIVE ACTION, ANYONE?????

[Classical_Liberal]

27. That is guilt by association. It doesn't work with me.

The observation that he pandered ignorance like a republican was a good one.

[Former Republican]

30. Wow. Arnold is a Nazi sympathizer. Arnold is a rapist. Arnold is a druggie

I could not care less. It's his threat to the Democratic majority of California that irks me, not what his personal life is like.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

26. Maybe you need to look a little closer...

Arnold's thoughts on Hitler:

"I admire him for being such a good public speaker and for what he did with it."

What did Hitler do with his speaking skills, Former Republican?

[Classical_Liberal]

32. I am not former republican

. He became a popular political leader with them among other things. he didn't specify and that is the point.

[Clete]

31. Well, suppose someone thought the same of Stalin,

would you admire him? Stalin, after all, outsmarted Hitler. Arnold's own mouth brands him as a fascist when he stated at the beginning of his campaign that (paraphrasing here) people need to be told what to do by a leader. Fuerher means leader in German and do we really need to be told what to do? I was under the impression elected officials are the servants of the people, not the other way around. Apparently no one has told Arnold this either.

[Former Republican]

35. This is getting ridiculous

I would not very much care if someone admired Stalin. My grandparents were Communists so I do not think Stalin was as bad as Hitler.

I don't think someone's personal beliefs regarding history should be used against them unless they excuse genocide.

[Clete]

41. Stalin was no more a communist than Hitler was

a socialist. They were both totalitarian, fascist dictators. Stalin was the smarter of the two, who managed to die in his bed unlike most dictators who sieze power by deception or force.

[Former Republican]

47. I am afraid I do not understand

Stalin was a Communist.

Hitler was a National Socialist.

I don't see how you can put the two together.

[Classical_Liberal]

51. Aparently you admire Stalin for being smart

and dying in his bed. Should I hold it against you and claim you a Stalinist?

[Clete]

55. Oh stop the weird parsing of word. I never claimed to admire him like

Arnold claimed to admire Hitler. I stated that he was smarter than Hitler. That's all!

Right now I am so pissed off with this election, don't cross me with meaningless crap.

[Classical_Liberal]

64. I am not crossing you with meaningless crap

One can be opposed to Arnold without feeling a need to think him Hitler.

[Clete]

72. Well, he's performing like Hitler.

If he becomes Governor, he will have done it with less votes than even Hitler got to become chancellor. Everything Hitler did was by the book, taking advantage of situations and loopholes that he could to gain power but he was never elected in an honest election. So I think Arnold has studied his mentor very well.

[Former Republican]

56. I am not a Stalinist

Stalinist first of all does not mean much to me. As I said my grandparents were Communists so I guess I wasn't brought up with this hatred for Stalin. Stalin is just another Communist leader to me. I would certainly not compare him to the atrocity of Adolf Hitler.

[Clete]

59. Well, why don't you look up his atrocities.

They were every much as vicious as Hitler's. A clue is, that Saddam Hussein admired Stalin and it wasn't for his communist ideals and philosophy.

[Former Republican]

61. That's absurd.

Stalin did not systematically put people in gas chambers because they were born a certain race. What you're saying is silly.

Saddam admired Stalin partly because of Stalin's ideology. Scientific socialism isn't compatible with Islamic societies, so Saddam did the best he could to make his country as close to communism as possible without being officially a Marxist.

[Clete]

66. Well, live in your little fantasy world if you want.

Stalin was right up there with the worst humanity had to offer in national leaders, a cruel horrible man if there ever was one. Look up the Gulags and see what you come up with, or talk to anyone still alive who is from East Germany who and survived WWII.

[Toby109]

69. The Stalin purges in the 30s

killed close to 20 million people.

[Classical_Liberal]

36. Fuerher means father in German

He never used the term Fuerer. That was a dumb statement actually, but probably just that. I just hate nitpicking as a campaign style, and I think it will backfire to those who employ it.

I like real issues.

[Clete]

43. Vater is father in German.

Fuehrer is leader.

[Classical_Liberal]

49. We have more than one word implying father

Dad, Daddy, Pop.

[Clete]

57. None of those words mean leader, do they now, hmmm??

eom

[Classical_Liberal]

62. German isn't English

and for all we know that word could have a dual meaning. I had always heard it meant father.

[Clete]

68. Maybe in some dialect, like yo daddy in English.

In Hitler's time it meant leader, no more no less. Also, the point is that Arnold said leader in English and that was what he meant, not father.

[Karenina]

78. Once again you are sadly misinformed

The word is Führer (der) and it means leader, guide, commander, captain, driver, pilot, operator.

[efhmc]

46. Why should we give a person who is running for a position of power in

a very powerful state a "break" when he says that he admires as a man of power, someone who used power in the most hideous, horrible way and who caused 9 million deaths because of his use of that power.

[Clete]

60. We shouldn't and Arnold should be made to

explain all these things if he becomes governor. No fascists in American government please.

[Solomon]

53. Yeah. And when Louis Farakhan said the same thing

people went nuts. Let's not be concerned when a real nazi says it.

[Classical_Liberal]

63. Do you seriously believe Arnold is a Nazi

?

[teryang]

71. His political skills including rioting, insurrection, murder, ...

...torture, compiling endless lists of friends and foes alike to blackmail, torture and murder at a more propitious time, careful skill in the selection of pathological liars, murderers and schemers for his bloody climb to total power, creating phony threats to state security, destroying democracy, fabricating reasons to embark on agressive wars killing millions, carrying out genocide on an unprecented scale. Oh yes, admiring Hitler is commendable. WTF?

"Poland has attacked Germany for the last time!"

[oasis]

75. The only person who personified "the American Dream" was Adolf Hitler?

[GOPisEvil]

17. Hey Arnold - Mussolini got the trains to run on time...

...got any admiration for him?

How can ANYONE take this SOB a gubernatorial candidate? Sheesh. I wouldn't elect him dogcatcher.

[angka]

23. he would pronounce it hit-lah

this is pure GOLD

[Selwynn]

28. I think he was probably so drugged out of his mind....

At the time of that interview. That is not an excuse. Not at all. But I doubt the man is really a Nazi sympathizer - I imagine he was just stoned off his butt with no idea what an idiot moron he was being. Again, not an excuse. I'm glad this came out to public attention - but not because I think he is secretly a nazi, but because I think it shows what a totally incompetent irresponsible perosn he has been and is.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

76. Unfortately you are very wrong...

That's the REAL problem with Arnie -- he is NOT incompetent and irresponsible. When you look at his history and careers, you see a man who is UTTERLY dedicated to reaching whatever goal it is he seeks. He has shown himself to be calculating and somewhat ruthless. Nothing stops in his way when he sets himself a goal.

I said here on DU when he first made noises about winning that this is a man whose ambition knows no bounds, even to the point of marrying to Maria Shriver to position himself with one of the most politically powerful family in the country. Running for political office (President, if he had the chance) has been the one long-term goal of his that he had yet to accomplish.

THAT is one reason he is so scary, and his admissions that he admires Hitler. That kind of ambition coupled with a certain moral fluidity scares the crap out of me.

[in_cog_ni_to]

40. OMG!

if that man wins Ca. SOMETHING is WRONG!

[Clete]

52. Yes and it won't be with the voters but with what happens after

the votes are cast. One disturbing thing in the LA Times today besides the groping story was the fact that Arnold is swaggering around like his election is a done deal. He is already setting up his government and planning the first hundred days.

I remember George Bush doing the same thing as if he knew his selection was a done deal.

[kentuck]

42. No big deal...his hero was Hitler...

:mad:

[warrior1]

48. This just got played on the nightly news

a couple channels and no link so don't ask. o;)

[Q]

74. Sounds like Ahnuld admires Hitler...

...and much of that probably comes from his (Nazi) father.

- This guy is disgusting...with his admiration of Hitler and groping of women. He would have fit in rather nicely with the SS.

[chascarrillo]

79. "California über alles" just took on a new meaning

Goodness gracious, those Dead Kennedys were prescient.

[phrenzy]

80. I have similar feelings - but don't think they make me an evil person.

I understand the interesting elements of certain parts of Hitler's "underdog" story. Also, the complete (twisted) vision he had is something to behold. I am sure this is the context that ahh-nuld meant. And I also believe that his speech about 'what Hitler did with it' - was more about the messianic high (trance) Hitler no doubt experienced at events like the Nuremberg rallies.

David Bowie also said he admired Hitler - calling Hitler "The original Rockstar" - which is probably true.

I put this in the same league as people that kind of 'admire' people like Al Capone, Genghis Kahn or other Ruthless but effective Roman Emperors.

It is however a FACT that Hitler operated with violence and intimidation to get anywhere NEAR power. The minute he hooked up w/ the Brownshirts he started having them terrorize communists and everybody else that might get in their way.

This carried on in traditional 'mafia' form up until the 'Night of the Long Knives' at which point it just became standard government policy to crush any semblance of opposition. So, to say he got to power by political savvy is naive. He got there by crushing any potentially worthy adversary. And even then - his party was on the decline when he was 'appointed' (sound familiar) to power.

Hitler WAS however SELF-MADE - in the most brutal of ways. And I think many of us can't help but to kind of respect that in some weird way.

But, hey, I'm not running for Governor.

[Classical_Liberal]

82. Don't try and talk reason with them

They are like titanic survivers having been dumped in the icey water right now.

[Minstrel Boy]

84. It's all about power

Parse what the man said.

Schwarzenegger isn't saying - as I've seen some defenders elsewhere tonight argue - that he simply admires Hitler's elocution. And I also think it's wrong to draw the conclusion that he tacitly approves of Hitler's atrocities. Rather, it's all about power.

"I admired Hitler, for instance, because he came from being a little man with almost no formal education, up to power. I admire him for being such a good public speaker and for what he did with it."

Okay: what did Hitler do with his speeches? Manipulate and dominate masses of people.

He wanted an experience "like Hitler in the Nuremberg stadium. And have all those people scream at you and just being total agreement whatever you say."

He's yearning for the control Hitler exercised over crowds.

It's not that he's approving of the holocaust, but he is speaking approvingly of the totalitarian control which made it possible. I can almost hear Arnie explain himself: "Ya, dat Hitlah, he vas eveel. But I vill use my total powah fo' good!"

This isn't just a stupid thing to say. It ought to be a huge red flag.

[hooligan]

85. In fairness

That was a stupid thing for him to say, but let's acknowledge the following as well:

Arnold Schwarzenegger has donated nearly $750,000 to the (Simon Wiesenthal) center, raised millions more, and helped the organization fight anti-Semitism. Born two years after World War II ended, he long ago distanced himself from his late father's views and in 1991 he received the Wiesenthal Center's National Leadership Award.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,1282,-3065735,00.html

[not systems]

86. buying an indulgence

That what this looks like to me.

[Jolene]

87. Looks like he doesn't like blacks and Jews, either

That is, unless they can do something for him financially, career-wise, or politically.

From a book Arnold wanted buried so badly that he allegedly forced reporters who wanted to interview him at the Cannes Film Festival to sign agreements stating that they wouldn't ask him about the book:

All through his grueling training, Arnold kept the image of Sergio Olivia in front of him. Black bodybuilder Dave DuPre, who would appear with Arnold years later in Pumping Iron, says Arnold declared one time while working out at Gold's, "Serge is your only black hope to beat me. Black people are inferior. You are not capable of achieving the success of white people. Black people are stupid." Black people weren't the only target of his venom, for as usual he was completely democratic in his heckling. According to DuPre, "He would make fun of Jews. If anybody looked Jewish, he would point it out and tell them that they were inferior. I would remind him that it was a Jew who had brought him to America. Then he would shut up."

In DuPre's view, "He was always upset that all the black guys were able to go out with all the white girls. He couldn't stand that." And he did his best to reverse the situation. Once, having dinner at a New York restaurant with Rick Wayne and Joe Weider, Arnold noticed a beautiful black hatcheck girl. He began talking to her, then asked Joe to lend him his car. Joe complied, and Arnold left with the girl. Rich recalls that the next day Arnold made a point of telling them, "You know, the girl said I was better than any black guy she had ever had."

An Unauthorized Biography, Arnold, by Wendy Leigh pp101-102

"It is as satisfying to me as coming is--you know, as having sex with a woman and coming. So can you believe how much I am in heaven? I am like getting the feeling of coming in the gym. I'm getting the feeling of coming at home. I'm getting the feeling of coming backstage when I pump up. When I pose out in front of five thousand people--I get the same feeling. So I'm coming day and night."

pg. 140

"There are, nevertheless, witnesses over the years who have seen Arnold break into the "Sieg Heil" salute and play his records of Hitler's speeches.

Arnold responded to this issue during a 1989 Penthouse interview with journalist Sharon Churcher. According to Churcher, a former associate of Arnold's during the seventies had heard from a mutual acquaintance that Arnold had Nazi paraphernalia in his apartment. According to the associate, Arnold's reaction at that time was to claim, through Pumping Iron producer, George Butler, that his interest "was only that of a student." Butler, professing to have forgotten the above exchange, says that he had never seen any Nazi peraphernalia at Arnold's house."

Arnold goes on to say that he hates the Nazi era.

pg 89