Which is more important... gay rights or gun rights?

[-..__...]

I ask this because...

One: I happen to live in MA and have no problem with gay marriage, activities or lifestyle.

Two: I'm a firm believer in the right to keep and bear arms (very little or no compromise).

Three: MA easily has the most obscene/restrictive/confusing anti-gun laws around.

Four: Two of the most vocal supporters (both former and present), for anti-gun legislation are openly gay (Cheryl Jacques and Jarret Barrios... Google if you must).

Five: There is no guarantee (or mention of), WRT to gay marriage in the BOR. At a minimum, at least the right to keep and bear arms is alluded to and open for debate... your interpretation might vary.

Six: As a long time gun owner and law abiding citizen, why shouldn't I do everything I can to prevent these type of hypocritical asshats from reaching pubic office?

Seven: The best friend of MA gun owners is a Dem... Rep. Stephen M. Brewer as well as many other MA Dems.

Eight: Pretty simple decision for me... gun rights is > than gay rights.

Nine: Flame away.

:smoke:

[tocqueville]

1. when you guys talking about gun rights use them

to make a revolution in the US, I'll change my mind

ALL other democratic western countries don't have those rights, they take down their governments by going out on the streets WITHOUT GUNS and otherwise the violent crime rate is far, far lower than in the US...

I'm not talking about hunting

but normally you don't go hunting with a revolver or an assault rifle
unless you are a freeper

[uppityperson]

2. Depends on what is more important for you.

The right to own guns or the right of people to equal rights. You can probably tell which I chose.

[Yuugal]

3. No flame from me

I support both gay rights and the right to bear arms. We are either a party that supports personal freedoms and responsibility or we are not.

[lastknowngood]

4. How about Gay Gun rights! Works for me

n/t

[buddysmellgood]

17. I agree, only gay people should be allowed guns.

[Roon]

18. Here you go

Armed gays don't get bashed.
http://www.pinkpistols.com/

[Gildor Inglorion]

5. I'm a gay man, a Vietnam veteran, and I couldn't imagine not having a gun.

do I have to choose? I'm sorry you feel it's necessary to make such a choice. Maybe being a Southerner makes a difference for me. We learn to shoot right after we learn to walk, usually.

[billbuckhead]

6. NeoconRifle Asses trying to turn the US into a third world nation

Being forced to walk around armed because everyone else is armed is the very definition of a third world nation. Damn RBKAextremists to hell.

[proud2BlibKansan]

7. I'll go with gay rights

But I am pretty anti-gun.

[alarimer]

12. I'll second that

I am pretty anti-gun as well. Well actually I think reasonable gun control is what we need. Close loopholes at gun shows, waiting periods and background checks, etc. But in any case, I think human rights are way more important.

[wli]

8. very hard to say these days

It seems we need gun rights now more than ever, but gay rights are morally further up the food chain.

[tocqueville]

11. why that ?

are you going to retake the constitution at gun point ?

[wli]

13. no, strictly a matter of self-defense n/t

[Mythsaje]

9. I think everyone

has a right to protect themselves by whatever means are at their disposal. If that means a gun, so be it.

I don't think either is more important, personally. It's like asking if healthcare or education is more important.

[DanCa]

10. Gays are human beings .a living thinking breathing feeling person

A gun is an inanimate object designed by man to kill another another man. A gay person is created by god and has the same rights as any other tax payer under the constitution. To me it's a non contest am going with the right of the human being all the time.

[buddysmellgood]

25. What's more important, the rights of short, fat people or the idea that

we somehow have to right to own as many of, and whatever kind of gun we choose to own?

[U4ikLefty]

14. Gun rights!!! How you gonna shoot them gays??? Yeeee-Haw!!!

I know, I know, it was a pathetic attempt at sarcasm...so sue me!!!

[buddysmellgood]

27. You could have said "so shoot me." :O

[DanCa]

32. Batman dont need no gun neither do I

They should go to the gym hit the weights step between the ropes and get their insecuriteis out that way.

[Conservativesux]

35. Whatever would the homophobe crackers do without their guns?

This is really a dumb question, however.

[DanCa]

41. It's a catch 44 twice as bad as catch 22

[hnsez]

15. gay rights = equal rights for all

And I have no agenda, no gays in my family, no gay friends.

Look at all the gun rights we have and the Government was still stolen from us by Diebold.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal"

It is the 1st line of the Declaration of Independence which came before US Constitution & Amendments.

[PatriotGames]

16. I thought the two were mutually exclusive ideals. But, what do I know?

I am for both.

[hnsez]

19. 1st line of the Declaration of Independence! Came b4 gun rights!

[Greyhound]

20. Like others, I don't see it as an either or issue

I also believe the government has no business being involved in marriage at all, and there should be no distinctions between people period. Man, woman, gay, straight, black, white, or shades of brown, the majority are pretty much all assholes anyway.
As for guns I don't think they should have rights as they aren't people.
I do believe, however, that the framers listed the RTKandBA number two for a reason. Power does flow from the barrel of a gun and they wanted to ensure that power remained with us, not the government. :hide:

[DanCa]

33. My bottom line on guns is this.

I have no right not to tell someone to buy or own a gun. But I'll personally never own one. Trust me with my tremors balance problems and shakes it's not a good idea. The safest place to stand is where I shoot :D

[Telly Savalas]

37. Well, if that's the purpose of the 2nd Amendment, we're pretty well fucked

cause the government has F16s, tanks, and nuclear weapons versus hunting rifles and what not owned by private citizens.

[DanCa]

42. see theres no way to win this gun arguement

your really damned if you do damned if you dont. Where's Henry Clay when you need him?

[buddysmellgood]

21. Does the BOR guarantee (or mention) straight marriage?

[TheFriendlyAnarchist]

22. Its not an either or matter

gay rights are very important, but so is my right to go buy an F-16 fighter jet, RPG, and AK-101 assault rifle. but in a nutshell, they should both be enforced because the two of them are both constitutional matters that both deal with the rights of citizens.

[WillyT]

23. Only People Have Rights (Or Don't), Not Inanimate Objects !!!

So I'll go with fighting for Gay rights, thankyouverymuch!!!

I don't think the 2nd Amendment is going away anytime soon, do you?

:shrug:

[foreigncorrespondent]

26. Willy...

...you are my hero! :)

[foreigncorrespondent]

24. Why ask such a ridiculous question in the first place?

One: Gay rights is about rights for people. Gun ownership does not affect your life.

Two: Being gay is NOT a lifestyle. When did YOUR life become a lifestyle?

That's all!

On edit: typo and to add, was this a hit and run thread? Why have you not responded to anyone?

[Sgent]

28. I'm not entirely sure

why the choice.

On the other hand, gun rights are paramount in protecting every other freedom (hence the 2nd ammendment). Gay rights, like women's sufferage, is all dependent on establishing a free country. One of the major reasons that the equal protection clause and women's sufferage clause are adopted much later.

[-..__...]

29. Kick...

Some interesting responses here, but it's late, I'm working tomorrow and
I need to go to bed.

For now, I should add that so far, there are no reasoned responses here
that address my complaints... why should I support the agenda of those who care for their own rights, but care nothing for mine (and by "care nothing", I mean over-the-top extreme bullshit)?

[Telly Savalas]

31. I hear ya, man.

There's all these liberal women whining about reproductive rights, but refuse to stand up to my 2nd amendment right to bear nuclear weapons.

[foreigncorrespondent]

44. Telly...

...you are my hero too!

Thanks for the good ole' belly laugh! :)

[foreigncorrespondent]

43. Oh please!

why should I support the agenda of those who care for their own rights, but care nothing for mine

How absurd!

You are talking about a multitude of rights (for if you are heterosexual, already have) against one right!

Right now, you have the right to gun ownership. There is no way gun ownership in the U.S. will end in the next 20 plus years. But there are gay people who have suffered a life time through not having certain alienable rights.

There is a huge difference between the two subjects you have chosen here.

BTW, just so you know, I might not be American, but I do support the right to gun ownership, as does my American born partner. What a shame you cannot give us the same dignity in return.

[Swamp Rat]

30. False dichotomy n/t

[titoresque]

34. I'm gay

have been fighting the Federal Marriage Amendment here in Az. Took part in a "3 point action" last year and was a passenger on the bus that went all over Phx metro area from court house to court house demanding marriage licenses, next day got "married" with 64 (?) other couples, two days later marched with a couple hundred people to Main court house with "Clergy for Justice" to demand that licenses (ones signed by clergy, made by clergy) were filed. I could go on and on as to my credentials regarding my fight for gay rights......

I am a firm believer in MY OWN RIGHTS...if you're not gay you call it "Gay rights" if you ARE gay you call it "Equal rights"

That being said.....with the current situation, i.e....these bastard murdering son-of-a-bitches at full speed ahead quickly forcing us into virtual martial law....if I had to choose tomorrow, guns? or gay rights? I choose guns.

[Warren DeMontague]

36. I think making sure all citizens have equal civil rights is more important

than whether or not people can have assault weapons or other firearms in their homes.

That said, I have a few right-wing individuals in my life who, knowing I am a "liberal", constantly try to pick fights with me on gun control. Really, I don't give much of a fuck about gun control. I would prefer it if some nutjob not shoot me or my family, I will admit that the brash displays of massive firepower combined with obvious double-digit IQs on sites like werenotsorry.com last year made me nervous, but I'm a realist when it comes to this country- it's WAY more realistic and likely that Rick Santorum is going to take away everyone's right to use birth control than it is that Ted Kennedy is going to take away anybody's hot, hard, steel penis substitute.. Oh, sorry, did I say that out loud? Really, I meant "gun".

Now, I don't know what it's like in MA, but most places in this country it's not terribly difficult to buy and own a gun. There is NOWHERE in this country that gay people can legally get married and have it recognized. I just am not convinced that it's more important to worry about 'protecting' a 'right' -gun ownership- that is already pretty much there and isn't in any real danger of going anywhere, than it is to stop treating the percentage of our population that is gay or lesbian as second class citizens.

My 2 cents.

[Telly Savalas]

38. Good post.

Would you mind terribly if I were to respond with a bunch of abrasive nonsense such that this stupid fucking thread can escalate into a flamewar and rightly get locked?

[Warren DeMontague]

39. I'm sorry, the thing about the penis substitute was a joke

I really didn't think it was that abrasive. I guess my abrase-o-meter needs to be recalibrated.

[Kitka]

40. I'm very opposed to guns and the "right" to them <m>

so yeah, gay rights are more important to me than gun rights.

No flames, just don't understand this belief that deadly weapons should be put on a pedestal society - above equal rights for our fellow humans, no less!

[mixedview]

45. "We hold these truths to be self evident.."

They are all the same rights, IMO.

People are created equal. People are entitled to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness.

Which means equal protection under the law for all (including gays), AND the right to self defense/bear arms.

Some disagree, but as a libertarian, I view self defense to be an essential human right.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

46. Are people born with an orientation towards owning firearms?

We don't get to choose what race or gender we're born, nor can we choose not to be born disabled mentally or physically. Likewise, I believe that our sexual orientation is not a conscious choice, though what we do with it is. That's why gay rights are more essential than gun rights. But I don't see why gay rights should preclude gun rights, or why your argument seems set up to make the two mutually exclusive.

[Fescue4u]

47. Why choose?

If you have to choose between two civil rights, there you have the wrong politician.

[Moderator]

48. Locking

Intentional flamebait. And civil rights shouldn't be considered negotiable under any circumstances.

DU Moderator