Both of these stories have been posted -- but look at them side by side

[Bleacher Creature]

It pretty much sums up everything that is wrong with these people.

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http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20050721/pl_nm/arms_congress_dc_4

White House threatens veto on detainee policies

By Vicki Allen Thu Jul 21, 7:45 PM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The White House on Thursday threatened to veto a massive Senate bill for $442 billion in next year's defense programs if it moves to regulate the Pentagon's treatment of detainees or sets up a commission to investigate operations at Guantanamo Bay prison and elsewhere.

The Bush administration, under fire for the indefinite detention of enemy combatants at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba and questions over whether its policies led to horrendous abuses at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq, put lawmakers on notice it did not want them legislating on the matter.
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http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000990590

Pentagon Blocks Release of Abu Ghraib Images: Here's Why
By Greg Mitchell

Published: July 23, 2005 6:00 PM ET

NEW YORK So what is shown on the 87 photographs and four videos from Abu Ghraib prison that the Pentagon, in an eleventh hour move, blocked from release this weekend? One clue: Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld told Congress last year, after viewing a large cache of unreleased images: "I mean, I looked at them last night, and they're hard to believe.” They show acts "that can only be described as blatantly sadistic, cruel and inhumane," he added.

A Republican Senator suggested the same day they contained scenes of “rape and murder.” No wonder Rumsfeld commented then, "If these are released to the public, obviously it's going to make matters worse."

<SNIP>

“Basically what happened is that those women who were arrested with young boys/children in cases that have been recorded. The boys were sodomized with the cameras rolling. The worst about all of them is the soundtrack of the boys shrieking that your government has. They are in total terror it's going to come out.”

[lildreamer316]

1. Yeah; I caught that.

It's F----ed. Sorry, this kind of thing calls for that kind of language.

Edit: oops.I'm blonde; sorry.

[annabanana]

2. GO for it lildreamer..

It's FUCKED.. Yes it is.
Make sure any Republicans you know get the blame they deserve!

[lildreamer316]

6. You know what's really bad..

Back in Oct. we had a couple that were freinds of mine staying here at the house. They were both Bush supporters and he is a recruiter for the Army.(she's a republican wiccan; if you've ever heard of such a thing!!) He and I had a quick discussion about Bush and he was talking about the "liberal media" and supporting FAUX; etc.. I did what I could but did not make a great case; having only been on DU a few months and not having sourced my argument well.
He was supposed to come by tonight and hang out/stay over. I am dying to hear if his opinions have changed; and you bet your ass I will not let up. I don't want to lose a friend but he has got to see the light SOMETIME. We'll see.

[leesa]

26. Be prepared to cut him loose. If he's still a Bush supporter at this

point, it's probably hopeless...his tax refund was probably just too big.

[electron_blue]

3. is that really true about the children?

omg, if it is, all hell will break loose when this is released. Sounds like it's already being made public. How much do we need to see to believe it?

Also - notice that Rummy and a Republican Senator are both appalled. More evidence of Republicans coming around, for lack of a better phrase.

Who was it who pointed out that Nixon was only really brought down once his own party turned against him?

[walldude]

21. Seymore Hersch claims to have seen the tapes

I believe this is him being quoted:

“Basically what happened is that those women who were arrested with young boys/children in cases that have been recorded. The boys were sodomized with the cameras rolling. The worst about all of them is the soundtrack of the boys shrieking that your government has. They are in total terror it's going to come out.”

He has always been a straight shooter in the past, there is no reason not to believe him. I seem to remember hearing stories of Congressmen and Women running out of the room puking after seeing what's on those tapes.

[electron_blue]

27. I never heard of Hersch

I think it says a lot that Congress isn't all over him denouncing him and accusing him of lying.

This is just the last straw.

[Fly by night]

30. You never heard of Seymour Hersh? Where you been?

Try this link -- Hersh has been one of this nation's premier investigative journalists for the past four decades. Read and remember (or learn) that:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seymour_Hersh

[electron_blue]

31. Thanks for the link

I know, I know, how embarrassing for me. Now that I read that link, I realize that I know of his work.

[LibertyorDeath]

33. Go to 1:12:50 in the Video for Hersh's remarks about Torture

Real Player Dialup
http://stream.realimpact.net/?file=clients/aclu/conf2004/20040707_aclu_AmericaAtACrossroads_56_edit.rm

Real Player Broadband
http://stream.realimpact.net/?file=clients/aclu/conf2004/20040707_aclu_AmericaAtACrossroads_300_edit.rm

Windows Media Player Dialup

http://stream.realimpact.net/?file=clients/aclu/conf2004/20040707_aclu_AmericaAtACrossroads_56_edit.wmv

Windows Media Player Broadband

http://stream.realimpact.net/?file=clients/aclu/conf2004/20040707_aclu_AmericaAtACrossroads_300_edit.wmv

[Freedomfried]

28. Were the young boys the womans Sons?

You mean to tell me American troops were ass raping little boys in front of their OWN MOTHERS? Is that what this is saying??

WHAT? WHAT?

[Placebo]

4. They better release this material.

The world has a right to know what our government has done. And if it incites violence, so be it. Maybe if our fellow citizens see this stuff it will allow more of them to realize what we've done in this "moral" war on terra'

[fooj]

13. RECOMMEND!

:kick:

[kentuck]

5. Where is the Congressional oversight ?

Where is one Senator with some balls? !

[burrowowl]

7. Go here and click on link

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4176178

[Straight Shooter]

8. E&P is a titan in reporting news. Yahoo can't match their credentials.

From the Editor & Publisher web site:

Editor & Publisher is the authoritative journal covering all aspects of the North American newspaper industry, including business, newsroom, advertising, circulation, marketing, technology, online and syndicates.

Based in New York City, the magazine dates back to 1884, when The Journalist, a weekly, was founded. E&P was launched in 1901 and merged with The Journalist in 1907. E&P later acquired Newspaperdom, a trade journal for the newspaper industry that started in 1892. In 1927, E&P merged with another trade paper, The Fourth Estate.

In 1999, E&P was purchased by BPI Communications, a division of VNU Business Media. E&P is owned by VNU Business Publications, and is part of the company's Marketing/Media & Arts Group.

In January 2004, E&P switched from weekly to monthly publication, while revamping its Web site to offer more breaking news and content on a daily basis.

[Gronk Groks]

9. Kick this to the top please...

...don't like what it means but it needs to be said.
:kick:

[fooj]

15. Welcome, Gronk Groks! Will do!

:kick:

[jojo54]

10. Seems about the right time for another leak.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed. If these pics were to get released, then the next one you'd see would be the mob with pitchforks storming the WH, wanting blood.

[fooj]

11. This is beyond sickening! I am totally ashamed and disgusted.

Accountability. I demand accountability. Valerie Plame and this all in a week...it makes me sick to my stomach.

The bottom line here is what's wrong is wrong. Period. No getting around it. I am so sick of the RW sanctimonious BS...the lying ratbastards can rot in hell as far as I'm concerned. They have put EVERY AMERICAN in jeopardy by their divisive, partisan bullshit. Let's just throw TORTURE in for good measure. I've had just about enough! They (all republicans) must shoulder the responsibility of sitting back, DOING NOTHING and silently watching as their party sold out to the imposters that run The White House. Our House. They are not fit to call themselves Americans, IMO.

This isn't just about the politics in DC. This is about Americans who aided and abetted these evil, maniacal monsters. I don't believe that their participation in all of this horrific madness should bear no consequence. Actions have consequences. Every spineless Repub in this country owns this bullshit. That's right. Ownership. They own this evil. Now what are THEY going to do about it?

I demand accountability. NOW.

Peace.

[rodeodance]

17. "This isn't just about the politics in DC"--true, but many have bought the

RNC that it is just a partison skimish.

[shraby]

12. Where are all the churches? The pastors, priests and

ministers should be yelling to the high heavens about this. Granted there are some who wouldn't but I believe they are far outnumbered by the ones who would. Where are they????

[fooj]

14. We must hold these people accountable, shraby.

Peace.

[rodeodance]

16. good, let him veto it-let the defence dept without $$.

[Bleacher Creature]

20. Hey -- just so long as gay people don't get married.

Anything goes.

[Nothing Without Hope]

18. Yes, they don't want these photos seen because they don't want limits

on what they see as the President's dictatorial powers to do absolutely anything. The mad-dog neocons like Cheney see the President's wishes as being beyond the law, not only checks by the legislative or judicial branches but also signed treaties such as the Geneva Conventions. Their excuse is that they claim (contrary to evidence, let alone any kind of ethics, religious or otherwise) that torture is important for getting information on terrorism. Sodomizing children can't be justified even by this lie and would doubtless upset some of their religious base, so the photos must be suppressed. Standard protocol for the mad-dog neocons: if the truth is inconvenient, suppress it. Besides, I suspect that some of these creeps, like Cheney, LIKE the idea of torture - it's the ultimate power trip.

This thread has the WaPo article with Cheney's amazing statements that torture is important for preventing terrorist attacks and that it can't be limited because it would threaten the President's powers. The man is bugnuts INSANE - when is someone going to notice?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4173538
Thread title: White House says they want to continue torture

[pretzel4gore]

19. 'Nothing fails like success when working for the devil'

lol
it was all we had, after they killed president kennedy, and the chickens are finally coming home to roost...
lol

[Burried News]

24. Yes they are, and if not today - someday - some shiny day.

[enough]

22. Yes, thanks for this, and let's remember Judge ROBERT's role

in assuring that the "President" has the power to put anyone he wants into this black hole of American hell.

[southernleftylady]

23. "For me anyways this is old news"

coming from a military wife i know...
wow.. i told her I'm sorry she can dismiss rape , sodomy and murder so easily from our military

[Athame]

25. Finally, the flap about the Newsweek article makes sense

If they can say that just a few lines of text in an article could cause deathly riots, then they can argue that these pictures must not be released for fear of causing much more violence.

Now, we know that the Newsweek article did NOT cause the riots in Afghanistan, but most people do not know that. I'm afraid the general public will buy the argument against the pictures (and at the same time ignore the White House moves to prevent regulation of torture.)

[SpiralHawk]

29. The truth will come out eventually

Alas, the neo-con Republican party has sunk so low that it now neither knows nor respects this basic spiritual law.

[LibertyorDeath]

32. Revealed: grim world of new Iraqi torture camps

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,6903,1520136,00.html

Secret torture chambers, the brutal interrogation of prisoners, murders by paramilitaries with links to powerful ministries... Foreign affairs editor Peter Beaumont in Baghdad uncovers a grim trail of abuse carried out by forces loyal to the new Iraqi government

Sunday July 3, 2005
The Observer

The video camera pans across Hassan an-Ni'ami's body as it is washed in the mosque for burial. In life he was a slender, good-looking man, usually dressed in a dark robe and white turban, Imam at a mosque in Baghdad's Adhimiya district and a senior official of the Muslim Clerics Association.
When I first interviewed him a year ago he was suspected of contacts with the insurgency. Certainly he supported resistance to US forces.

More recently, an-Ni'ami had dropped out of sight. Then, a little over a month ago, relatives say, paramilitary police commandos from 'Rapid Intrusion' found him at a family home in the Sha'ab neighbourhood of northern Baghdad. His capture was reported on television as that of a senior 'terrorist commander'. Twelve hours later his body turned up in the morgue.

[NMMNG]

34. The Bush Administration - Restoring Dignity and Morality to America

Like bloody hell! These bastards are raping and killing Iraq while bleeding America dry. They care nothing for humanity, only their twisted personal agendas. Nobody is safe with these megalomaniacs in power--nobody.

[EC]

35. Time to get pro-active..

Everyone going to chruch tomorrow, print out the article or this thread, show it to your clergyman and ask them to help do something about it...

[rucky]

36. The descriptions are horrific enough...

and once they get out on the mainstream, who knows what the outcry will be.

if you still need to see the pictures after that, I have the number for a great shrink. Even if they do get released, I don't think I want/need to see them.

Not to apologize for the cover-up attempt, but it does sound like this story has legs with or without photos.