I want to be optimistic, but

[central scrutinizer]

I wish I could be optimistic. Consider:

1. Overwhelming evidence that Bushco dodged the Vietnam War by enlisting in the champagne unit, with help from his father, then goes AWOL when they institute drug testing.

Response from the MSM and general public: ZZZZZZZZZZZZ and Bushco is considered as stronger on national defense
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

2. Add to #1, most members of the administration are chickenhawks who had “other priorities” than putting their asses on the line in Vietnam.

Response from the MSM and general public: ZZZZZZZZZZZZ and the Repukes are considered as stronger supporter of the troops.
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

3. Overwhelming evidence that Bushco violated SEC rules with insider trading in the Harken Energy stock scam.

Response from the MSM and general public: ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

4. Overwhelming evidence of disenfranchisement, vote fraud, intimidation, judicial activism in the 2000 election.

Response from MSM and general public: Let's move on. ….. ZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

5. Overwhelming evidence that Enron manipulated energy markets, ripped off California rate payers by billions and that Bushco were active aiders and abettors in this theft. When it all hit the fan, Bushco denied even knowing Key Lay despite the fact that Kenny Boy was on the short list for Treasury Secretary.

Response from the MSM and general public: ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ snort ZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

6. Being asleep at the wheel on September 11 (I don't buy into either LIHOP or MIHOP, but certainly do buy into EISOP, exploited it shamelessly on purpose), then blocked every investigation, promoted every incompetent, fired every critic, bullied the press and Congress, etc.

Response from the MSM and general public: Cheers, Huzzahs, Great anointed leader, let's put Bushco and Raygun on Mt. Rushmore, blah blah blah.
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

7. Raising the threat level every time there was unpleasant news to drown out

Response from the MSM and general public: ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

8. Cutting veteran's benefits, combat pay, sending them off with no armor, not enough troops, guarding the Oil Ministry in Baghdad instead of the munitions depots, Mission Accomplished, “Bring Them On”, etc.

Response from the MSM and general public: ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ Bushco supports the troops while the Democrats are giving aid and comfort to terrorists.
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

9. Downing Street minutes

Response from the MSM and general public: ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ snort scratch fart drool ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

My fingers are tired so I will leave out numbers 10 through n.

n + 1. Now Turdgate.

Response at DU: drip, drip, drip, smoking gun, drip, drip, drip

Why should I be optimistic this time when all of the rest of these scandals have bounced harmlessly off Bushco's Teflon® ?

[Catch22Dem]

1. EXACTLY

I've been saying same shit since the whole Harken shit "broke" on DU and people claimed it was the beginning of the end. I stopped getting hopeful a long time ago.

[jsamuel]

12. always good to see people so hopeful :D

[Catch22Dem]

17. Oh, I'm plenty hopeful

But realistic at the same time.

[earth mom]

2. I hate to say it but I'm feeling the same way. eom

[elfin]

3. Because they lied to the PRESS

Big difference - they routinely lie to the world and America - and the press carries their dirty water. But this time - one of "their own" (even if it is the snake Miller) is in jail over this and the administration sent Scotty out to LIE to the PRESS about this in the beginning. They do not care about us or the truth- but they do care about themselves.

So they will keep it up despite supreme court, terrorism etc,

[Zomby Woof]

10. The press is so corrupt and unreliable

They have no shame or ethics. Do not expect they can change their tune for long before the profit motive kicks in and overrides their judgment to do what is right.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

4. I had plenty of optimism going into NOV 2004. The "result" crushed that

optimism. I envy those who feel confident that shrubco is going down. I wish I felt or knew the same way.

[barb162]

7. About a week before the election I thought Kerry would win..

When he lost, all was lost and for good. No way this country can recover with another 3 years of Bush.

[Lecky]

22. Jesus Christ you have got to be kidding me.

:nopity: :nopity: :nopity:

unbelievable

[barb162]

23. the current economic policies are killing this country

and that's just for starters

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

5. I have to agree with you.

When I was in college during Vietnam we did class disruptions forcing the class to talk about the slaughter.

One sympathetic Political Sciene professor said, "The war will stop when enough bodybags come home and the average citizen has to open his wallet to pay for it."

He was right. I think average Americans look upon this whole affair as "politics as usual". At best, we can expect a couple of heads to roll and a bit of embarrassment to ShruBoob. Covered up with a constipated expression and a lot of southern fried platitudes.

In the meantime...the "failed insurgency" is turning into a civil war, the country is running up huge debt "supporting the troops", the rest of the world hates us, and the infrastructure of the country is detiorating.

But, we still have ESPN and credit cards.

[AX10]

6. There is alot more than this too.

[Zomby Woof]

8. Great post, and I have expressed the same sentiments

Often.

Just watch for the defensive posts which accuse you of trying to "shut us up" and "not to care anymore", when you have made no such claim or request. Those speak volumes on the fantasist/hopeful yet paranoid mindset of the accuser.

Just watch. :-)

It is best after history has proven you right repeatedly, to hope for the best, but expect the worst.

[central scrutinizer]

15. I haven't given up

I have had an LTTE published on DSM a couple of weeks ago and keep trying to bring up the facts of these scandals. I have coughed up money to DU, MoveOn, National Democratic Party, Democratic Party of Oregon, and to my Congressional Rep, Peter DeFazio. Optimism and pessimism are both paralyzing - you tend to do nothing because you are confident in the outcome. I try to keep active.

[Zomby Woof]

18. Yes, I know where you are coming from

Hope for the best, as I said, and you ARE working for it.

When I have posted similar things, I always say "I hope I am wrong, and I will admit it when I am."

But nowhere do I advocate giving up. Just being steeled for whatever may happen, good or ill. But at least by being involved, you aren't responsible for an ill outcome.

[Lecky]

26. Ever wonder why?

because they are annoying and add nothing. The only reason you guys feel like nothing will come out of this is because you are all so used to being dissapointed and don't want to give your hopes up. That is the only reason! It's not based on any logic or evidence just the "we always lose" mentality.

[Old and In the Way]

9. It has been a frustrating journey.

But each of your examples have made a few more people decide that this administration is unAmerican. More and more people are coming to this realization. The media is beginning to report the facts with less fear of WH consequences. I liken it to a chemical process of adding chemicals suspended in solution. The solution might absorb more and more chemical additive up to a critical threshold. When that point is reached, the suspended additives titrate out of the solution, separating completely. I think that is what we will experience with this administration. We'll reach a point when the next added expose will finally be the titration point and we will see the wheels of justice finally begin to move.

[wakemeupwhenitsover]

11. the idea that dumbya will be impeached

is ludicrous, I agree. I can't see it. But, he could be so politically damaged that the rest of his agenda is off the table.

The public understands national security. They also get dirty tricks.

The press was lied to & one of their own is in the can. They're not letting this one go. The only thing that could bump it off the front burner is a supreme pick. Which, dumbya at the behest of kkkarl will probably do asap.

[Sapphire Blue]

13. Optimistic inspiration...

Adapted from the introduction to Paul Loeb's new book, The Impossible Will Take a Little While

The Impossible Will Take a Little While: Hope in a Time of Fear

Paul Rogat Loeb

How do we learn to keep on in this difficult political time, and keep on with courage and vision? A few years ago, I heard Archbishop Desmond Tutu speak at a Los Angeles benefit for a South African project. He’d been fighting prostate cancer, was tired that evening, and had taken a nap before his talk. But when Tutu addressed the audience he became animated, expressing amazement that his long-oppressed country had provided the world with an unforgettable lesson in reconciliation and hope. Afterward, a few other people spoke, and then a band from East L.A. took the stage and launched into an irresistibly rhythmic tune. People started dancing. Suddenly I noticed Tutu, boogying away in the middle of the crowd. I’d never seen a Nobel Peace Prize winner, still less one with a potentially fatal illness, move with such joy and abandonment. Tutu, I realized, knows how to have a good time. Indeed, it dawned on me that his ability to recognize and embrace life’s pleasures helps him face its cruelties and disappointments, be they personal or political.

Few of us will match Tutu’s achievements, but in a political time that’s hard and likely to get harder, we’d do well to learn from someone who’s spent years challenging abuses of human dignity from apartheid’s brutal system to Bush’s Iraq war, yet has remained light-hearted and free of bitterness. Because Tutu embodies a defiant, resilient, persistent hope, where we act no matter what the seeming odds, both to be true to our deepest moral values, and to open up new possibilities. As Jim Wallis, editor of the evangelical social justice magazine Sojourners, writes, “Hope is believing in spite of the evidence, then watching the evidence change.”

<snip>

Even in a seemingly losing cause, one person may unknowingly inspire another, and that person yet a third, who could go on to change the world, or at least a small corner of it. Rosa Parks’s husband Raymond convinced her to attend her first NAACP meeting, the initial step on a 12-year path that brought her to that fateful day on the bus in Montgomery. But who got Raymond Parks involved? And why did that person take the trouble to do so? What experiences shaped their outlook, forged their convictions? The links in any chain of influence are too numerous, too complex to trace. But it helps to know that such chains exist, that we can choose to join them, and that lasting change doesn’t occur in their absence. A primary way to sustain hope, especially when our actions seem too insignificant to amount to anything, is to see ourselves as links on such a chain.

<snip>

As the Polish activists discovered, we gain something profound when we stand up for our beliefs, just as part of us dies when we know that something is wrong, yet do nothing. We could call this radical dignity. We don’t have to tackle every issue, but if we remain silent in the face of cruelty, injustice, and oppression, we sacrifice part of our soul. In this sense, we keep on acting because by doing so we affirm our humanity—the core of who we are, and what we hold in common with others. We need to do this more than ever in the current time.

http://www.soulofacitizen.org/articles/impossible.htm

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lecky]

16. If you are not optimistic by now then there is no convincing you

I don't understand the intent of all the gloom and doom posts.

Even if nothing happens, there has already been political damage done here. Its been building up for a while...

I hope something comes out of this and I think there is a good chance there will be indictments, but if not...oh well. We can't solely depend on republican failures to boost us.

The defeatist attitude posts add nothing.

[Zomby Woof]

20. How is assessing the realistic in any way defeatist?

Well, I warned the OP this would happen. It's shameful that his realistic assessment of the situation is derided as defeatist, when so far nothing he has said is refutable.

He has studied his history (DU's and otherwise), and is being cautious about what to expect. But as he told me, he is OUT THERE WORKING FOR A GOOD OUTCOME.

[Lecky]

25. I'm new around here but have already noticed it's always the same people

who continue to sing the same sad song.

You can claim to be a "realist" all you want but how come you guys don't see the positive in ANYTHING? We are still in the first year of Bush's second term and it has steadily been crumbling in front of our faces.

I consider myself a realist too and I think there is a chance for indictments, but if there are none (there is always that chance) I'm not going to let it crush my spirits and cry that all hope is lost.

No one is 100% sure what is going to happen, how can you not tell the difference between this case and all those things the OP listed? There is a difference between being cautious and being negative. What is the point of it? Does it help in any way? If you don't have hope then you have nothing. We are resilient, we've already suffered through 5 years with this mildly retarded cheerleading maniac frat boy in office. I just figure it can't get any worse...

The Debbie Downers of DU are in full effect tonight.

[mmonk]

19. Shows the importance

on an independent broadcast media. If we had one, this administration would have been gone by now.

[Zomby Woof]

21. If we had one

He would have never been enthroned in the first place. He would be a footnote ex-governor of Texas, and that is IT.

[Taylor Mason Powell]

24. Sadly, I agree.

I've been at DU on and off for about four years now, and if I had a dollar for every time the board got excited about some scandal that was FINALLY going to bring Bush down, I'd be a wealthy man. It becomes self-parodying after a while.

Sometimes I get hopeful that maybe this will be The Big One, but then I think about all the other shit this administration has gotten away with completely scot-free. Why should this be any different? Because they lied to the PRESS? I'm not buying it. So what if the press gets all up in the administration's face (finally)? Really, so what? Bush goes down a few points in the polls? It's not like he cares what people think, and the Republicans in Congress aren't going to impeach him even if his numbers go below 30. Come on.

Maybe Rove will go down. Maybe even Libby. I don't know, hell, maybe CHENEY! But when the smoke clears, Bush will be bruised but still standing, and the slaughter in Iraq will continue and so will all the environmental and constitutional abuses. The only way we get rid of Bush is in 2007, with a majority-Dem Congress.

Go ahead, call me a pessimist and accuse me of trying to destroy everyone's morale. I readily admit that I am pessimistic, although my intent is not to destroy morale. This is JMHO, and I really do hope that I'm wrong here, but I don't think I am. I'll keep hoping against hope, but I'll believe it when I see it.