Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login

Know your BFEE: Corrupt Craftsmen Hoover and Dulles

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-20-05 11:58 PM
Original message
Know your BFEE: Corrupt Craftsmen Hoover and Dulles
Two big stone turds in their cesspool for a foundation are not individuals, but institutions: The FBI. The CIA.

Both were patterned on the lives of individuals -- J Edgar Hoover and Allen Dulles, disrespectfully. These two men, IMFO, established, not the original institution, but their own perverted vision for a mobbed-up blackmail corps and a fascist-protecting secret police.

Most unfortunately for us today: Both corrupted sufficient numbers of men that today their organizations maintain their original disgusting images, degenerate ideology and corroded souls as ghoulish as any who have ever lived.

Identify this spawn of the BFEE*

J. Edgar Hoover
FBI Director

Organized crime, the American Mafia and the national crime syndicate were chartered in the 1920s, concurrent with the establishment of J. Edgar Hoover's Federal Bureau of Investigation. Both groups - according to former FBI agent Neil J. Welch and ex-U.S. attorney David W. Marston, in their book Inside Hoover's FBI - matured in the 1930s. "Although they were presumptive enemies," the authors suggest, "during their first four decades they competed primarily for newspaper space."

J. Edgar Hoover was the best FBI director organized crime could ever have wanted; it was difficult for syndicate members to be antagonized by a law enforcement official who claimed neither organized crime nor a Mafia existed in the United States. Without a man like Hoover heading the FBI it is inconceivable that organized crime and the Mafia could ever have reached the heights of power, wealth and administrative organization.

Prohibition gave new life to the criminal gangs of an earlier era that had started to collapse just prior to World War I. Bootlegging brought about the reconstruction of the gangs.' Suddenly they became so wealthy and powerful that, instead of being the puppets of the political machines, they pulled the strings. Illiterate punks became the great robber barons of the 20th century, and it was these men who provided the muscle to create organized crime in America (in its truest meaning of a syndicate with interlocking relationships with other mobs around the country).


In place of fighting organized crime, Hoover lay special emphasis on relatively easy targets, with a highly publicized war on so-called public enemies - Dillinger, Ma Barker (who never was charged with any crime), Pretty Boy Floyd, Machine Gun Kelly (who never fired his gun at anyone in anger) and other targets more easily hit than the Mafia. "The whole of the FBI's main thrust," said Sullivan, "was not investigation but public relations and propaganda to glorify its director."


The FBI didn't care for Black Americans Civil Rights in 1963, nor for their White supporters. How do they treat Liberals today?

Mississippi & Freedom Summer

"This is Mississippi, the middle of the iceberg."
-- Bob Moses


Other protests by blacks were met with violence. At sit-ins which began on May 28, 1963, participants were sprayed with paint and had pepper thrown in their eyes. Students who sang movement songs during lunch after the bombing of NAACP field director Medgar Evers' home were beaten. Evers himself was the most visible target for violence. He was a native of Mississippi and World War II veteran who was greeted by a mob of gun-wielding whites when he attempted to register after the war in his hometown of Decatur. He later said, "We fought during the war for America, Mississippi included. Now, after the Germans and Japanese hadn't killed us, it looked as though the white Mississippians would." After he was denied admission to the University of Mississippi law school, he went to work for the NAACP. By 1963, Evers was aware that, in the words of his wife Myrlie Evers,

. . . Medgar was a target because he was the leader. The whole mood of white Mississippi was that if Medgar Evers were eliminated, the problem would be solved. . . . And we came to realize, in those last few days, last few months, that our time was short; it was simply in the air. You knew that something was going to happen, and the logical person for it to happen to was Medgar.

At an NAACP rally on June 7, Medgar Evers told the crowd, "Freedom has never been free . . . I love my children and I love my wife with all my heart. And I would die, and die gladly, if that would make a better life for them." <44> Five days later, he was shot and killed as he returned home around midnight. Byron de la Beckwith, a member of the Citizens' Council, was arrested for Evers' murder, but he was set free after two trials ended in hung juries. He later ran for lieutenant governor.


On June 21, the day after the first 200 recruits left for Mississippi from Ohio, three workers, including one volunteer, disappeared. Michael Schwerner, Andrew Goodman, and James Chaney had been taken to jail for speeding charges but were later released. What happened next is not known. Local police were called when the men failed to perform a required check-in with Freedom Summer headquarters, but Sheriff Lawrence Rainey was convinced the men were hiding to gain publicity. The FBI did not get involved for a full day. During the search for the missing workers, the FBI uncovered the bodies of three lynched blacks who had been missing for some time. The black community noted wryly that these murders received nowhere near the same nationwide media attention as the murders of the three workers, two of whom were white.


Of course, the FBI sat on evidence for the above and other, even more heinous crimes, that wouldve led to evidentiary trail to the klan and the conservative monied turds of the South. Big Oily turds, like Hoovers friends, some of whom were friends with Allen Dulles.

Allen Dulles, the NAZIs, and the CIA

Supreme Court Justice Arthur Goldberg once stated that "The Dulles brothers were traitors." Some historians believe that Allen Dulles became head of the newly formed CIA in large part to cover up his treasonous behavior and that of his clients.

-- Christian Dewar, Making a Killing

Just before his death, James Jesus Angleton, the legendary chief of counterintelligence at the Central Intelligence Agency, was a bitter man. He felt betrayed by the people he had worked for all his life. In the end, he had come to realize that they were never really interested in American ideals of "freedom" and "democracy." They really only wanted "absolute power."

Angleton told author Joseph Trento that the reason he had gotten the counterintelligence job in the first place was by agreeing not to submit "sixty of Allen Dulles' closest friends" to a polygraph test concerning their business deals with the Nazis. In his end-of-life despair, Angleton assumed that he would see all his old companions again "in hell."

-- Michael Hasty, Paranoid Shift


Allen Welsh Dulles was born to privilege and a tradition of public service. He was the grandson of one secretary of state and the nephew of another. But by the time he graduated from Princeton in 1914, the robber baron era of American history was coming to an an end, ushered out by the Sherman Anti-Trust Act -- which had been used in 1911 to break up Standard Oil -- and by the institution of the progressive income tax in 1913. The ruling elite was starting to view government less as their own private preserve and more as an unwanted intrusion on their ability to conduct business as usual. That shift of loyalties in itself may account for many of the paradoxical aspects of Dulles's career.

Dulles entered the diplomatic service after college and served as a State Department delegate to the Paris Peace Conference of 1919, which brought a formal end to World War I. The Versailles Treaty which came out of this conference included a provision making it illegal to sell arms to Germany. This displeased the powerful DuPont family, and they put pressure on the delegates to allow them to opt out. It was Allen Dulles who finally gave them the assurances they wanted that their transactions with Germany would be "winked at."

Dulles remained a diplomat through the early 1920's, spending part of that time in Berlin. However, he left government service in 1926 for the greener pastures of private business, becoming a Wall Street lawyer with the same firm as his older brother, John Foster Dulles.

By the middle 20's, Germany had started recovering from the effects of the war and its postwar economic collapse, and the great German industrial firms were looking like attractive investment opportunities for wealthy Americans. W.A. Harriman & Co., formed in 1919 by Averell Harriman (son of railroad baron E.H. Hariman) and George Herbert Walker, had led the way in directing American money to German companies and had opened a Berlin branch as early as 1922, when Germany was still in chaos. At that time, Averell Harriman traveled to Europe and made contact with the powerful Thyssen family of steel magnates. It was to be a long-lasting and fateful partnership.


Of course, he went on to become a most powerful sub-stooge of the nation and planets superwealthiest people.

After the Bay of Pigs Thing, I wonder how he liked working for the son of Joseph Kennedy?

Nazis in the attic, part 6

By Randy Davis


...Like Nixon, George Bush was deeply involved with supporting the Nazis in the Republican's closet. In fact, support for the Nazis was a Bush family tradition which goes back more than six decades and, once again, to Allen Dulles.

Loftus and Aarons write: "The real story of George Bush starts well before he launched his own career. It goes back to the 1920s, when the Dulles brothers and the other pirates of Wall Street were making their deals with the Nazis. . . ."



"Sullivan & Cromwell was not the only firm engaged in funding Germany. According to 'The Splendid Blond Beast,' Christopher Simpson's seminal history of the politics of genocide and profit, Brown Brothers, Harriman was another bank that specialized in investments in Germany. The key figure was Averill Harriman, a dominating figure in the American establishment. . . .

"The firm originally was known as W. A. Harriman & Company. The link between Harriman & Company's American investors and Thyssen started in the 1920s, through the Union Banking Corporation, which began trading in 1924. In just one three-year period, the Harriman firm sold more than $50 million of German bonds to American investors. 'Bert' Walker was Union Banking's president, and the firm was located in the offices of Averill Harriman's company at 39 Broadway in New York.

"In 1926 Bert Walker did a favor for his new son-in-law, Prescott Bush. It was the sort of favor families do to help their children make a start in life, but Prescott came to regret it bitterly. Walker made Prescott vice president of W. A. Harriman. The problem was that Walker's specialty was companies that traded with Germany. As Thyssen and the other German industrialists consolidated Hitler's political power in the 1930s, an American financial connection was needed. According to our sources, Union Banking became an out-and-out Nazi money-laundering machine. . . .


". . . In a November 1935 article in Common Sense, retired marine general Smedley D. Butler blamed Brown Brothers, Harriman for having the U.S. marines act like 'racketeers' and 'gangsters' in order to exploit financially the peasants of Nicaragua. . . .


So. Thats a little bit of why I say these two Orgs (theres that word, again!) are as dirty as the turds that spawned them. The same gene pool gave us Adolf Hilter and the current crazy monkey.

* Please, no peeking at URLs.
Use your gut instinct as to whos whizzing around
aboard a bumper car.
Pretty darn symbolic. Or would that be ominous?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 12:11 AM
Response to Original message
1. professor fish..up again ..way too late
have you not given up on this foolish dream of saving the USA.

Special laff for you

I just communicated with the ghosts of 2 of my uncles..both waiting for permission to begin the long road to heaven..
Both say hitler has more of a chance of going to heaven now that the bush criminals have finally revealed themselves for what they really are

Satanic elites!!

'Secrets of the Tomb' by Alexandra Robbins reveals much of the occult secret society known as S.& B....But I know its just a harmless college havin big know rich people..kinda eccentric but just fun..

Not take the red tablet and back to sleep!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #1
10. Being "Against the War" is now categorised as a "terrorist act"
Hey, dbeach! Good to read ya! Heh heh. I'm a big fan of Hepburns and Bogart.

So, yes. There's no chance of me quitting until these turds are behind bars.

At risk of preaching to one of the leading voices in the choir:

Being "Against the War" is now categorised as a "terrorist act"

FBI Targets Anti-War Activists

23 November 2003

Faced with growing opposition to the war and occupation of Iraq, the Bush Administration has unleashed the FBI against its political opponents. Ten days before the October 25 demonstration that drew 100,000 people in Washington DC marching under the slogan, "Bring the Troops Home Now!" the FBI circulated an internal bureau memorandum documenting a far reaching campaign against anti-war organizations and leaders who have been involved in mobilizing large and legal mass actions.

"Under Bush and Ashcroft the exercise of First Amendment rights has become synonymous with terrorism. Today's front page report in the New York Times revealing that the FBI was targeting the recent national anti-war demonstrations in Washington and San Francisco must be understood as the tip of the iceberg," said Mara Verheyden-Hilliard attorney with the Partnership for Civil Justice and the National Lawyers Guild. The Partnership for Civil Justice and the NLG are litigating First Amendment cases against the FBI, Secret Service and Washington DC police as well as other law enforcement authorities for their unconstitutional disruption actions against political demonstrators.

"Under the banner of the war on terrorism, Bush and Ashcroft are resorting to J. Edgar Hoover's COINTELPRO tactics of the 1950's and 1960's against the rising anti-war movement of today," stated Brian Becker of the A.N.S.W.E.R. Coalition, the initiator and co-sponsor of the October 25 demonstration. "This is the domestic parallel of Bush's doctrine of endless war. Internationally, the administration has carried out war, invasion and occupation of Afghanistan and Iraq. On the homefront the government has cynically manipulated its so-called war on terrorism to illegally use the FBI as a tool aimed at stifling dissent. The movement will defend its rights, and will never be intimidated by the FBI's illegal targeting campaigns. Confronted with a rising tide of opposition, the Bush Administration is using its secret police against the people of the United States," Becker continued

"The FBI's so-called anti-terrorism efforts have intensely focused on political dissent since the resurgence of the U.S. social justice and peace movement. The big lie being foisted on the public is that these are post-September 11 counter-measures, when in fact we have uncovered in litigation that the FBI's Joint Terrorism Task Force as well as the District of Columbia police department have been conducting illegal domestic spying operations against political groups and activists since well before September 11, 2001," stated Verheyden-Hilliard. "This has nothing to do with terrorism and everything to do with using the repressive apparatus of the state as a political tool," she said.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #1
19. What's up is down. What isn't, is.

They said what's up is down, they said what isn't, is.
They put ideas in his head that he thought were his
- Bob Dylan, "Clean Cut Kid"

You may have heard of Hasan Sabbah, the 11th Century "Old Man of the Mountains," who led a secret society of militant Ismaili Muslims in what is now northern Iran. Members of the sect called themselves fedayeen, but as often happens in history, the name their opponents coined is the one with which they're stuck: Hashshashin, or assassins, after the hashish Sabbah plied them with to provide visions of the "garden of earthly delights" that would follow upon a martyr's death.

Now here's something about Sabbah and his followers I didn't know until recently, from Mandelbaum's The Psychic Battlefield:

Through the various degrees of initiation into the assassins, the followers were force-fed dogma, until they reached the ninth degree of initiation, where they learned that the prior teachings were false. "Prophets and teacher, heaven and hell were all nothing, future bliss and misery were idle dreams." Small wonder that the majority of the actual killers of the assassins were those who themselves had never undergone initiation.

It is from the assassin's secret doctrines that we have the expression "Nothing is true, and everything is permitted."

This appears to be an important and not uncommon dynamic of secret societies at the highest grades of initation. (Or at least so far as the uninitiated can tell, given their secrecy.) The hidden knowledge reserved for the final degrees seems often to stand the earlier teaching on its head. God can turn out to be the devil, and the devil your elder brother Lucifer. You thought you were illuminated? Here's your illumination for ya, right here.

The significance of this secret moral inversion could be found in the question begged by the case for an elite paedophilic cult: How could something so incredible be so pervasive, and operate internationally with the protection of professionals, judiciary and government officials? Perhaps because the bottom-heavy pyramid structure of secret societies provides numerous lower-order cadres who serve ends which are the absolute inverse of those they suppose. Just perhaps.

We can't know which of the charges against the Templars were legitimate, and which manufactured to destroy the Order, but knights of the highest rank were accused of secret doctrines which entailed devil worship and black magick. Similar charges have been levelled for years against the Templars' heirs in speculative Freemasonry. And regardless of the charges validity, there do appear to be inversions of values in the higher degrees. In Inside the Brotherhood, Martin Short has this to say about the order of the Holy Royal Arch, "Freemasonry's self-styled 'Supreme Degree'":

To join...a Mason must already have reached the third degree in the Craft, but if he goes no further he is no ther Mason's inferior. His Master Mason's ritual tells him he knows all the fundamental secrets....Safe within its 'Chapters', the Royal Arch dismisses the Craft's third degree as incomplete and its secrets as sham.... All the rest are unaware that there tongues might have been torn out and throats cut across just for betraying 'secrets' which are bogus, even by Masonic standards.

One of the Royal Arch's secrets is the "Grand Omniforic Royal Arch Word," Jahbulon, which is inscribed upon three sides of a triangle on Royal Arch altars, and appears to be the "Sacred and Mysterious Name" of God. The name is a contraction of Jehovah, Baal and On, or Heliopolis, the centre of Egyptian sun worship. The word cannot be spoken outside the temple, on pain, it is said, of having one's brains exposed to the sun.

Short also tells how, when England's two Grand Masonic Lodges were united in 1816, the rituals were revised to eliminate overtly Christian references, except for the phrase "the morning star," which is said to be derived from a reference to Jesus in Revelation 22:16. But the most common biblical meaning of "Morning Star" is as a synonym for Lucifer:

Is it possible that the Morning Star remained in the rituals, not by mistake, but as a deliberate but cryptic Masonic reference to Lucifer? If so, this would invert the meaning of a crucial section of the third-degree ritual: '...the Lord of Life will enable us to trample the King of Terror beneath our feet, and lift our eyes to that bright Morning Star, whose rising brings peace and salvation to the faithful and obedient of the human race.' To the men who drew up this ritual in 1816, who was the Lord of Life and who the King of Terror? Could God be Lucifer, and Lucifer God? Might they be sitting in each other's seats? Are Masons today inadvertently worshipping the devil instead of a benign God?

On July 14, 1889, Albert Pike, the "Grand Commander, Sovereign Pontiff" of Scottish Rite Freemasonry in the United States allegedly issued these instructions to 23 Scottish Rite Supreme Councils throughout the world (again from Short):

That which we must say to the crowd is - we worship a God, but it is the God that one adores without superstition. To you, Sovereign Grand Inspectors General, we say this, that you may repeat it to the Brethren of the 32nd, 31st and 30th degrees - the Masonic Religion should be, by all of us initiates in the high degrees, maintained in the purity of the Luciferian Doctrine.
Thus the doctrine of Satanism is a heresy; and the true and pure philosophical religion is the belief in Lucifer, the equal of Adonay; but Lucifer, God of Light and God of Good is struggling for humanity against Adonay, the God of Darkness and Evil.

Now consider the Ordo Templi Orientis, which was founded in the late 19th Century as a hermetic branch of Freemasonry, which goes the Royal Arch one - and perhaps many more - better. At least according to The Secret Rituals of the O.T.O., edited and introduced by Francis King (a zip file of the book can be downloaded by right-clicking here), and the "Song of the Perfect Initiate":

How the Simple Mason plies
Tool to Temple, See it rise!
Princes of Jerusalem,
How we mock and scoff at them!

Boaz broken,
Jachin gone,
Freely spoken
All above
Is overthrown
For the love
Of Babalon.

Lend a hand, my trusty brother!
While there stand upon another
Of their Temple still a stone
Give the grip of Abaddon!

Split the skull! On guard the sword!
Earth be null and heaven abhorred!
Alls a lie, although divine
Give annihilations Sign!

There's the bottom-heavy pyramid, celebrated in song, by those who regard themselves as near the capstone.

Finally, let's look at Opus Dei, the flagellate lay Catholic cult. Members are expected to mortify the flesh with devices such as the cilice, a "spiked chain worn around the upper thigh for two hours each day," to whip themselves to the point of drawing blood, to sleep on the floor once a week, and perform various other practices of physical and mental self-abuse. But consider what former member John Roche says in "Whips, Spiked Garters and Bloodshed - My Terrifying Life in Ruth Kelly's Religious Sect", which first appeared in The Mail on Sunday January 23 (Ruth Kelly is the UK's new education secretary): "Many members are upright Christians but the ethos of its higher levels is deeply secretive, often dishonest, oppressive and psychologically damaging to its members and families."

Justice Antonin Scalia, you may recall, is Opus Dei. How does the mortification of the flesh jibe with his bizarre message last Fall to an audience at Harvard University: "I even take the position that sexual orgies eliminate social tensions and ought to be encouraged"? In other words, could Opus Dei be another secret society in which those who have attained the highest degree are privy to a secret wisdom, which inverts the teachings of the lower orders?

After having progressed through flagellation and mortification - which without a supposed spiritual purpose resembles nothing so much as simple sexual masochism - could the final lesson of Opus Dei be, like that of the Hashshashin, Nothing is true, and everything is permitted?

Hiding in plain sight has never been so good.

permission to post from author

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #19
47. A: Sneer
Here's the guy who was driving the bumper car in the OP, the gangster in the middle.

"Evil is real," all right.

Cheney at Auschwitz:
an insult to the memory of Nazisms victims

By Bill Van Auken
28 January 2005

Auschwitz reminds us that evil is real, US Vice President Dick Cheney declared in addressing a ceremony marking the 60th anniversary of the Nazi death camps liberation by troops of the Soviet Red Army.

Men without conscience are capable of any cruelty the human mind can imagine, the US vice president said at the commemoration. And in every generation, free nations must maintain the will, the foresight and the strength to fight tyranny and spread the freedom that leads to peace.

It is not necessary to invoke the horrors of Auschwitz to remind us that evil is real. But Cheneys presence at the site of the greatest crime of the 20th century gave this platitude a chilling significance.

In Europe in general, and Poland in particular, Bushs failure to attend the commemoration himself was taken as a significant slight. An even more glaring expression of Washingtons indifference apparently went unnoticedat least by the pliant media. Sections of Cheneys speech were lifted virtually unchanged from an address given by Bush when the US president and his wife made a quick tour of the camp a year-and-a-half ago (see: A presidential visit to Auschwitz: The Holocaust and the Bush family fortune).

Cheney, like Bush before him, came to Auschwitz with one purpose in mind: to twist and exploit the atrocities of Hitlerite fascism to justify Washingtons own acts of aggression and inhumanity.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. At least he left his big foam finger in the car...

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
DemInDistress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 12:56 AM
Response to Original message
2. thank you Octafish
These are just the kind of stories that lift my spirits..Trading with the enemy seems to be a staple of the bush crime family..please keep this research up,your work is greatly appreciated by me..

this buds for you, :toast: :hi: :dem: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. Poor Dick Nixon comes in about here.
Hey! You're welcome, DemInDistress!

In reality, I stand on the shoulders of giants. Here's one of the biggest...

How Nixon Actually Got Into Power

by Mae Brussell
(from The Realist, August 1972)


The rise of Richard Nixon in the United States was carefully planned.

An illegal attitude towards the Versailles Treaty allowed American financiers to feed and support Germany's illegal rearmament. An illegal attitude toward the Geneva Accord was also approved by Dwight Eisenhower for Indochina in 1945.(2)

A study of our State department and espionage establishment reveals that we had clandestine, secret armies functioning both abroad and in the United States.(3)

Hundreds of political assassinations related to minority races, labor leaders, spokesman against Fascism have taken place in the U.S. since World War II. In 1963 the political assassination of President John Kennedy in Dallas became necessary for our own hidden, clandestine government to maintain control. The candidate for President in 1968, Robert Kennedy, was murdered by the same people on the night of his victory in election primaries.

United States law courts, plus the Supreme Court, have supported this clandestine government and military regime by lending their name to the concealment of the conspiracies to murder our leaders. They refuse to examine documents that exist, allow truth to remain locked in the National Archives on the basis of the lie, "national security."

Richard Nixon, front man and leader of this illegal government, mistaken for comical by the intellectuals, was administered the oath of president of the United States on January 20, 1969.


PS: A most hearty welcome to DU, DemInDistress! Please know that I am at your service when it comes to getting rid of this scourge from upon our country.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #11
35. "About Mae"
1922 - 1988
Born in Beverly Hills 1922, Mae Brussell was the daughter of prominent Wilshire Boulevard Temple Rabbi Edgar Magnin and great-granddaughter of Isaac Magnin, founder of the I. Magnin clothing stores.
By the time President Kennedy was assassinated in 1963 Mae was married with five kids and living in Southern California. Like many Americans, she wasn't convinced that Lee Harvey Oswald had acted alone in the assassination, so she bought the 26-volume Warren Commission Hearings and began reading, filing, and cross-indexing. With the massive addition of books, articles, and government documents, Mae not only found connections to the CIA and Germany, but began to see relationships to many other current and past events throughout the world.
Mae began to realize that the international terrorist network that made up the Axis powers during World War II had effectively gone underground and continued their worldwide fascist campaign even before the War had officially ended; As one country after another changed hands, Mae recognized many of the same familiar names, methods, and tactics that were used to swallow up Germany in the 1920s and 1930s.
Unfortunately this growing list of countries does not exclude the United States; Most anything Americana is being infiltrated, raped, murdered, infected, poisoned, or deregulated. As Mae stated at the University of California in Santa Cruz: "What is happening to us is a classical case of totally destroying us. And by the same people who've been at the top doing it since World War Two."
In June of 1971, after seven years of research and now living in Carmel, California, Mae appeared as a guest on KLRB, a local FM radio station independently owned by Mr. and Mrs. Bob and Gloria Baron. Mae discussed her views on political assassinations and the New York Times release of the Pentagon Papers. The response was so good she became a regular weekly guest and before too long had her own show Dialogue: Conspiracy. (She later changed the name to World Watchers International hoping it would spread like Weight Watchers did.) Almost every week for seventeen years Mae shared with her audience her voluminous daily research in her rapid-fire, no-holds-barred style.
Occasionally Mae's research produced predictions with stunning accuracy:

*On May 28, 1968 Mae confronted Rose Kennedy at the Monterey Peninsula Airport and handed her what she said was a poem, but actually a note telling her Robert Kennedy would soon be assassinated. A week later Senator Kennedy was shot to death at The Ambassador Hotel in Los Angeles.

*A month before Ted Kennedy's Chappaquiddick incident Mae warned his office of "the nest of rattlesnakes" that surrounded him and his upcoming bid for the White House.

*Two weeks before the SLA kidnapped Patty Hearst she told a Syracuse University audience that the SLA shooting of black school superintendent Marcus Foster was just the beginning of what would be terror and psychological sabotage in the same vein Germany had been subjected to in the 1930s.

*In August 1977 (broadcast #282) Mae discussed Jim Jones and the Peoples Temple move to Guyana. She speculated that this might be a training camp for assassination teams this was more than a year before 913 members of the church were massacred.

*But Mae's most shocking crystal ball research was probably her March 29, 1981 evening broadcast when she spent much of the hour listing the reasons she believed the Reagan White House were at war with one another and asked who will kill off their team members first. The following morning President Reagan was shot in Washington D.C.

In addition to Mae's close friends and weekly listeners, she corresponded and networked with such people as Jim Garrison, Col. L. Fletcher Prouty, and Larry Flynt. Her first published article in Paul Krassner's The Realist was actually financed by John Lennon. And Frank Zappa once gave her a computer for filing and cross-indexing her research (but she never used it).
There were times when death threats drove Mae off the air: once by Charles Manson family member Sandra Good in September 1975. Sometimes Mae resorted to recording her shows at home on her small cassette tape recorder and privately mailed out copies to her subscribers.
Many of the articles Mae wrote tackled subjects that to this day remain unparalleled by anyone in the United States. The epitome of Mae's journalism "The Nazi Connection to the John F. Kennedy Assassination" appeared in Larry Flynt's premier issue of The Rebel magazine in November 1983.
Her countless list of German and White Russian fascist fingerprints to President Kennedy's assassination reached its peak in May of 1988 when she discovered the name "Adolf H. Schicklgruber" handwritten in Marina Oswald's notebook of poetry in the Warren Commission exhibits.
In 1983 Mae's show was picked up by listener-sponsored KAZU FM in nearby Pacific Grove. Five years later she was forced off the air, for the last time, from death threats but continued sending out her weekly tapes to subscribers until June 13, 1988 (tape #862).
Mae died of cancer on October 3rd of that year. She was 66.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #35
48. "Only the educated are free." -- Epictetus
Thank God for Mae Brussell and brave souls like hers who gave their all to shine light on Truth.

Thank you very much for the bio, RUMMYisFROSTED.

BTW: It's great to read ya!



There are existing documents to prove the CIA-FBI was planning the murder of Richard Nixon in 1972. Conservative George Wallace was eliminated from the 1972 elections because of a near assassination.

I want to know who is killing Republicans or Conservatives as much as I want to know who is killing President John F. Kennedy, Sen. Robert Kennedy, Malcolm X, Rev. Martin Luther King, or hundreds of others less known: witnesses to these murders or near murders.

Everyone doesn't know what Mae Brussell is against. If I tell you what I am against, you can deduce or know what I am for. I am against the planned political assassinations by our Intelligence and Defense agents. The CIA-FBI-DIA and DISC, Defense Industry Security Command were set up originally to protect citizens of the USA. They became their own judges and juries, private servants of corporations with investments at home and abroad.

I am against the constant destruction of evidence in criminal matters and political assassinations. Prime witnesses are murdered before orafter testifying. Diaries are forged and planted in obvious places. Doubles are created to confuse. The Police Departments manipulate facts in cooperation with conspirators. I am outraged that our judicial system since 1947 has been patterned after Nazi Germany. Patsies are dead or locked away. The assassins walk the streets or leave the country, "home free." I am against using the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, Earl Warren, to cover up the assassination of President Kennedy. When the highest court is corrupt, there is no hope at local levels. I am against allowing the CIA to spend $25,000,000 since 1947 for the express purpose, as stated before, to alter our behavior. Is the State supreme over individuals? Who owns or controls our minds? Why was CIA Director Allen Dulles allowed to order 100,000,000 LSD tablets? Were one half the U.S. population going to receive their doses? What gives the CIA and Pentagon the right to define normal, or to determine what is National Security? Are we being drugged through food, water, and supplied with chemicals so we become slaves and robots? Where is all the cancer coming from? Why the preoccupation with death?

Why is the U.S. Government in the business of creating a "Psyche-civilized" world? Who is ordering the ultrasonic waves to lower brain waves of cities' populations to an alpha state, leaving citizens susceptible to mass propaganda and hypnotic suggestion? These facts have been confirmed by researcher Walter Bowart in 1977. I learned about the project years ago.

I am against the mass media, CBS, ABC, NBC, UPI, and AP being used by Washington D.C. since WWI, and by the CIA since WWII as pure propaganda tools. The so-called liberal New York Times and Washington Post would make Adolf Hitler proud. Notice that in all the Washington Post accolades about Watergate exposures, they never delved into the massive evidence surrounding the murder of Mary Jo Kopechne, the shooting of George Wallace, the Howard Hughes connections, or the murder of J. Edgar Hoover, the planned riots for Miami in 1972, the assassination plans for Richard Nixon through both the San Diego Secret Army Organization and the Andrew Topping arrest in New York. The media are cover-up artists. They allow assassins or would-be-assassins to fade away. One thing is certain about all these matters. The laws of nature are such that certain truths are going to come out. It is only a matter of time.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 01:01 AM
Response to Original message
3. Symbolic and ominous

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #3
12. How Nixon got his first job "after the war."
Poor Ike. He must've thought he was surrounded by patriots.

How Nixon Actually Got Into Power

by Mae Brussell
(from The Realist, August 1972)


In August, 1945, a Committee of One Hundred Men located in California placed an advertisement in 26 newspapers:

WANTED -- Congressman candidate with no previous political experience to defeat a man who has represented the district in the House for ten years. Any young man, resident of district, preferably a veteran, fair education, no political strings or obligations and possessor of a few ideas for betterment of country at large may apply for the job. Applicants will be reviewed by 100 interested citizens who will guarantee support but will not obligate the candidate in any way. (26)

That ad was typical, a covert method of pretending this was an open contest for office. Richard Nixon, located in Maryland, still in the Navy, received a telephone call from Herman Perry. "Are you a republican and are you available?" were the two questions asked of Nixon.(27)

Herman Perry was vice president of Bank of America (28) -- which was soon on its way to becoming the largest private bank in the world. By 1960, one hundred top corporations were spending $21-billion for military goods. In California alone, fully half of all jobs related directly or indirectly on the continuance of the arms race.(29)


"When the President does it, that means that it's not illegal."

And to think, some wonder where Bush gets it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 01:11 AM
Response to Original message
4. Another one of your educational and fascinating posts Octafish! Always
enjoy them.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #4
20. When the Internets were new, "Hoover + Murchison + Costello" returned ...
... seemingly more hits, if memory serves. Anyway, there are still some important nuggets to pan out and display for consideration as pure gold, pyrite or just yellow flakes.

Speaking of flakes, here's a bit more on the subject of the dust-dry turd himself:

"This fellow (J. Edgar) Hoover is the worst curse to have come to this government in years." -- Speaker of the House Sam Rayburn


7. Exporting Division

We were the ones, says former Assistant FBI Director William Sullivan, who made the McCarthy hearings possible. We fed McCarthy all the material he was using. I knewI worked on it myself. At the same time, we were telling the public we had nothing to do with it. In addition, McCarthys chief investigator and other key staff members were former FBI agents.

Prescott Bush cashes in his share of stock from the Nazi front Union Banking Co. He uses a portion of this profit to fund his Senate race; the rest is placed in trust.

J. Edgar Hoovers friend, oilman Clint Murchison, promises Joe McCarthy support till the bitter end.

The second wave of HUAC hearings begins with McCarthy leading the charge. Over the next three years, McCarthy is considered an American hero and a mainstay in the public eye; he subpoenas some of the most prominent entertainers of the era- Orson Welles, Lucille Ball, Dashielle Hammett- demanding the naming of names. Hell win re-election in 1952.

While some float the idea of Hoover himself running for President, the FBI Director joins himself to a clique of fabulously wealthy Americans now pushing Dwight Eisenhower and Richard Nixon toward the White House. Edgar hosts a high-dollar Nixon fundraiser at the California resort Del Charro- near Del Mar, where the horse-racing Texans love to gamble, betting on horses being illegal in Texas. Although the fundraiser is a small, private affair, those reported in attendance include oilmen Clint Murchison, wildcatter Sid Richardson and Prescott Bush, whos also running for political office. The Murchison milieu is infested with organized crime figures as well, but J. Edgar Hoover always claims him, one of my closest friends.
Prescott Bush will later brag that hes responsible for bring Nixon into politics, and for creating the winning Eisenhower-Nixon ticket in '52. What is known is that the Texans put their money on Eisenhower and pressure him for a year to run for President. Eisenhower will plot strategy with Hoover and Murchison and announce his candidacy in August of 53- a mere three months before the election.

PS: Thank you, lonestarnot! Much obliged. Please feel free to add on in any direction, pro-con or neutral. he more that gets posted on these threads, the more of a case can be built against the BFEE. Intelligent readers will let the facts decide the case.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 01:18 AM
Response to Original message
5. awesome
nazis in the attic..

Anyone ever stop to think why a flag goes up when one uses that word?
Way too close to home.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 04:31 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. And spot-on.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
22. Feel Strong, Fast with this Elixer...

Either that, or have DU Friends who provide encouragement, direction and counsel -- PLUS!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #5
21. Just got back from rain-shortened Little League...
...My son's coach -- a nice fellah -- is a rabid Flush Limpnut listener and a semi-vapid Smirk supporter. "Would've voted for Kerry, except his wife...yadayada."

So we're talking a couple of days ago and I tell him Bush is a crook and he tells me: "So. If you were driving by and you saw someone beating up a little old lady, you wouldn't stop to help?" I said "What does that have to do with anything? Bush invaded a country that was at peace with us?"

He walks away. So today, we get a chance to talk and his 13-year-old nephew comes up. Smart, good-looking kid, asking questions about all sorts of things. When the kid goes back to whatever he was doing, I say to my friend "Better keep him away from Rumsfeld."

Boy, that got him hot. "He's a good Republican," is what he replied. As if somehow being a good Republican (which we do need more of) would protect him from these NAZI bastards.

I think he realizes the truth about the BFEE. Still, he'll be sore surprised to discover that even being a NAZI is no protection from their evil. His own son is 8 years of age. His eyes showed he understood what I meant.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
G_j Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #21
27. I have thought of my mother more than a few times recently
she was a Republican who stuck by Nixon almost to the end.
But when she finally realized Tricky Dick had sent his own daughter out to lie for him, she turned on him big time.
At least some people have their 'last straws'. It is hard to fathom how that 'last straw' hasn't occurred for people like your son's couch, but maybe it will come.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 02:49 AM
Response to Original message
6. Dulles and Wehrmacht Gehlen
Edited on Tue Jun-21-05 03:10 AM by DrDebug

The Nazi Connection to the John F. Kennedy Assassination

Evidence of link between Nazis still in operation after World War II to the still unsolved murder of John F. Kennedy

by Mae Brussell
(from the short-lived Larry Flynt publication The Rebel, January 1984)

This is a story of how key nazis, even as the Wehrmacht was still on the offensive, anticipated military disaster and laid plans to transplant nazism, intact but disguised, in havens in the West. It is the story of how honorable men, and some not so honorable, were so blinded by the Red menace that they fell into lockstep with nazi designs. It is the story of the Odd Couple Plus One: the mob, the CIA and fanatical exiles, each with its own reason for gunning for Kennedy. It is a story that climaxes in Dallas on November 22, 1963 when John Kennedy was struck down. And it is a story with an aftermath -- America's slide to the brink of fascism. As William L. Shirer, author of The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, put it in speaking of the excesses of the Nixon administration, "We could become the first country to go fascist through free elections."


The deal Gehlen struck with the Americans was not, for obvious reasons, released to the Washington Post. As Heinz Hohne and Hermann Zolling phrased it in The General Was A Spy, the German general took his entire apparatus, "<[b>unpurged and without interruption, into the service of the American superpower." There is no evidence that he ever renounced the Third Reich's postwar plan, advanced by his own family's publishing house, to colonize vast regions of Eastern Russia, create a huge famine for 40,000,000, and treat the remaining 50,000,000 "racially inferior Slavs as slaves."

Allen Dulles may not have invited such a man to his club, but he did the next best thing: he funneled an aggregate of $200 million in CIA funds to the Gehlen Organization as it became known. Directing operations from a fortress-like nerve center in Bavaria, Gehlen reactivated his network inside Russia. Soon, news of the first Russian jet fighter, the MiG-15, was channeled back to the West. In 1949 the general scored an espionage coup when he turned up Soviet plans for the remilitarization of East Germany.

When Dulles spoke, Gehlen listened. The CIA chief was convinced, along with his brother, Secretary of State John Foster Dulles, that the "captive nations" of the Soviet bloc would rise up if given sufficient encouragement. At his behest, Gehlen recruited and trained an exile mercenary force ready to rush in without involving American units. Also at Dulles' direction, Gehlen tapped the ranks of his wartime Russian collaborators for a cadre of spies to be parachuted into the Soviet Union. Some of these spies were schooled at the CIA's clandestine base at Atsugi, Japan, where, in 1957, a young Marine named Lee Harvey Oswald was posted to the U-2 spy plane operation there.

And much more interesting reading at:

Including this guy:

But he looks a lot better in a dress

P.S. ;)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #6
26. What do Reinhard Gehlen and Ahmed Chalabi Have in Common?
Conspiracies in Action or Capitalism's Invisible Army.

Either way, they're compromised.

FWIW: I prefer the former.

Werther Report: What do Reinhard Gehlen and
Ahmed Chalabi Have in Common???

February 23, 2005

The Poisoned Well

by Werther*

"The past is not dead. In fact, it's not even past."
- William Faulkner**

*Werther is the pen name of a Northern Virginia-based defense analyst and a frequent contributor to the Blaster. This essay also appeared in today's edition of Counterpunch, see
**Requiem for a Nun

The Misuses of History

Since the attacks of 11 September 2001, the American public has endured an astounding avalanche of official lies, half truths, pseudo-events <1> and sheer balderdash that will surely enter the Guinness Book of Records. Among the most persistent and infuriating lies of government, to those who have imbibed their knowledge of the past from the crystalline springs of Gibbon and von Ranke, is the misleading historical analogy. Its purpose is twofold: to relativize whatever current disaster the governing class has waltzed the hapless populace into; and to kill any usable past. The technique also has the added benefit of making government placemen sound learned - at least in the estimation of an audience which gains its knowledge of the world through Fox News and other State media.

Iraq is a fruitful field for detecting such historical fables. It was during the summer of 2003, as it first became evident that the natives of Mesopotamia were less than entirely enthusiastic about their liberation, that the American apparat swung into action with historical comparisons between Iraq and the occupation of Germany.

Then-National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice took to the hustings to tell the Veterans of Foreign Wars, in her characteristic school-marmish fashion, that occupied Iraq was no more of a problem than occupied Nazi Germany - and look what a rousing success that turned out to be: "There is an understandable tendency to look back on America's experience in postwar Germany and see only the successes, but as some of you here today surely remember, the road we traveled was very difficult. 1945 through 1947 was an especially challenging period. Germany was not immediately stable or prosperous. SS officers-called 'werewolves'-engaged in sabotage and attacked both coalition forces and those locals cooperating with them-much like today's Baathist and Fedayeen remnants." <2>

Whereupon the irrepressible Secretary Rumsfeld immediately chimed in with his own historical tour d'horizon: "One group of those dead-enders was known as 'werewolves.' They and other Nazi regime remnants targeted Allied soldiers, and they targeted Germans who cooperated with the Allied forces. Mayors were assassinated including the American-appointed mayor of Aachen, the first major German city to be liberated. Children as young as 10 were used as snipers, radio broadcasts, and leaflets warned Germans not to collaborate with the Allies. They plotted sabotage of factories, power plants, rail lines. They blew up police stations and government buildings, and they destroyed stocks of art and antiques that were stored by the Berlin Museum. Does this sound familiar?" <3>

Frankfurt Was Not Fallujah

One wonders which community college-educated speech writer activated the larynxes of our senior government officials. As history, this was bunk, although it sounded plausible to the half-educated mind. American forces took Aachen in October 1944 - well before the largest battle ever fought by the U.S. Army, the Battle of the Bulge, and fully six months before the 8 May 1945 "end of major conflict" in the European Theater. The assassination of Aachen's mayor and the capers of the Werewolves were distinctly small beer, because they occurred in the midst of the bloodiest land battles in world history. The Werewolves, Rumsfeld's proto-Baathists, only existed as a viable force as an adjunct to a still-functioning German government holding territory between the Rhine and the Oder-Neisse; a government that could put, even at that late date, 8 million men into the field. As explained in an earlier report, 4th Generation Warfare operations were at the time distinctly subsidiary to conventional military campaigns. <4>


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
evolvenow Donating Member (800 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 04:41 AM
Response to Original message
8. More Brilliance, Thanks! Keep Kicking the Mock out O Demockracy!!!
Excellent work, as always Octafish, you are the best and brightest!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #8
33. More often I'm like... "Dulles and Other Dullards" ... I'm no better than anyone else. My difference -- and yours and most of DU, evolvenow -- is a clear understanding of right and wrong. For the uneducated, ignorance is strength.

Now THIS feller can write and reason. And I wouldn't be surprised if Werther's wife's a CIA agent:

Werther Report:

What do Reinhard Gehlen and
Ahmed Chalabi Have in Common???

February 23, 2005

The Poisoned Well

by Werther*


Dulles and Other Dullards

In 1945, when Walter Bedell Smith, Alan Dulles, and their coat holders fell for Gehlen's pitch, they were in possession of a priceless insight into the spying abilities of their wartime foe - the Ultra secret.

Beginning in 1940, the British were able to read the ciphers transmitted by what the Germans believed to be their unbreakable Enigma code machine. Intermittently at first, the British (with their American allies looking over their shoulder) succeeded with increasing speed and accuracy to crack first the sloppy Luftwaffe code, then the Army's, and finally the Kriegsmarine's. The allies not only knew what the Germans knew and planned, but perhaps more critically what they did not know about allied operations.

And in fact, strategic intelligence about the allies was a blank spot for Germany. Tactically and operationally very proficient (perhaps the best in the world), the Germans were amateurish in divining what B.H. Liddel Hart would have called what was happening "on the other side of the hill." What else would explain the fact that MI 5 turned or executed every single agent the Germans attempted to insert into Britain? What else would explain the Germans' falling for the elementary ruse of the fake "Army Group Patton" in the buildup to D-Day? What else would explain the Germans' horrendous failure at Kursk, in contrast to the Russians' accurate divination of the Wehrmacht's plans to attack the Kursk salient?

Given their access to this information, why did the American authorities nevertheless assume that Reinhard Gehlen had something valuable to offer them - at extortionate terms? Foreign Armies East may have been more or less accurate in providing rough order-of-battle estimates of Red Army strength, as long as there was a copious supply of Red Army POWs, but why did the Americans assume, against all evidence, that Gehlen had the slightest clue about strategic matters: what Stalin was planning, the general thrust of Soviet policy?

Ordinary human experience suggests that the wish was father to the thought: American intelligence believed because it wanted to believe. Far from being righteous and wise pillars of the American Century, Allen Dulles and his comperes were merely corrupt and incompetent scions of rich establishment families; in Dulles's case, he elbowed his way into intelligence work in order to provide hot tips to his investment banking friends.

Dulles's post-World War II partiality towards Nazi war criminals was merely a continuation of his pre-war activities as a partner of Sullivan and Cromwell, a firm which facilitated transnational business agreements with the German cartels. Dulles's performance in the Bay of Pigs invasion does not suggest a penetrating strategic mind. His primitive thinking more likely went along the following lines: If Meyer Lansky could replace Castro as the ruler of Cuba it would signify a victory for private investment, just as Gehlen or Alfred Krupp was preferable to some German Social Democrat who had spent the war in Buchenwald.


Most important: You truly are most kind, evolvenow. I appreciate it and will try my damndest to see our goals reality.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 07:46 AM
Response to Original message
9. A thanks and a tip of the hat to Octafish for putting this info together.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #9
34. Things are getting weird, oasis.
Too, too weird.


MKULTRA Documents

1977 Senate MKULTRA Hearing

In June 1977, a rare cache of MKULTRA documents were discovered, which had escaped destruction by the CIA. The Senate Select Committee on Intelligence held a hearing on August 3, 1977, to question CIA officials on the newly-discovered documents. The complete 171-page record is included here, including testimony and dozens of MKULTRA documents on various subprojects.

MKULTRA Subproject No. 83

This declassified CIA memo was written on April 18, 1958 by Dr. Sidney Gottlieb, chief of the Chemical Division of the agency's Technical Services Staff. Gottlieb, who oversaw many of the

MKULTRA projects, reviewed covert CIA support for research studies of "controversial and misunderstood" areas of psychology such as hypnosis, truth drugs, psychic powers and subliminal persuasion.

MKULTRA Hypnosis Experiments

This memo, written by the CIA's Sidney Gottlieb, is one of the earliest records available from the MKULTRA project. One month after CIA Director Allen Dulles authorized the program, Gottlieb writes of a "planned series of five major experiments" which are to examine "hypnotically induced anxieties," the "relationship of personality to hypnosis," and other matters of the hypnotized mind.


This June 1953 document records Dr. Sidney Gottlieb's approval of an early CIA acid test. "This project will include a continuation of a study of the biochemical, neurophysiological, sociological, and clinical psychiatric aspects of L.S.D.," the CIA scientist writes.

MKULTRA Trickery

This document reveals the CIA's concern with covert means of administering the mind- and behavior-altering substances researched in MKULTRA projects. In 1953, the Agency commissioned a "manual on trickery," to be authored by a prominent magician, who described ways to conduct "tricks with pills" and other substances.
MKULTRA Materials and Methods

This 1955 CIA document reviews the Agency's research and development of a shocking list of mind-altering substances and methods, including "materials which will render the indication of hypnosis easier or otherwise enhance its usefulness," and "physical methods of producing shock and confusion over extended periods of time and capable of surreptitious use."



Most important: You're welcome, oasis! The pace of weird change is accelerating. Let's give it another blast of the old accelerant.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Jara sang Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
13. The Catholic connection.
Hey Octafish, great post. A correlation that is noteworthy is the Mafia cozying up to both the FBI and the CIA. Both organizations felt as if they could trust the Mob because of their deep Catholic roots. The early history of the O.S.S. and CIA has them recruiting from Catholic Universities(Notre Dame, Loyola) and Northeastern establishmentarian universities(Yale). Catholics were notoriously anti-communist and could therefore be trusted.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #13
36. When it comes to sharing certain values, some groups do come in first.
Now I understand. The question of how it was possible that they got together frees my mind to ask: "Why did these three Orgs go after those they targeted?"

The answer: Property. Real Property. Private Property.

Wow. Thanks, Jara sang!

Here are a few of my favorite "believers," the members of Propaganda Due, the infamous P-2 Lodge of anti-communists. These turds conspired with their counterparts in the USA to keep up the fight against the commies. Still, in the event of Soviet takeover, they vowed to continue the fight through GLADIO:

Operation Gladio

by David Guyatt

When on the morning of 17 June 1982, the body of Roberto Calvi was found hanging beneath London's Blackfriars bridge, it was to speed a process that prised open a series of events spanning four decades. The circumstances of Calvi's death led knowledgeable observers to darkly whisper of a Masonic ritual slaying. With his hands tied behind his back and a brick thrust into his coat pocket, Calvi had been strangled, apparently by the rope that had been noosed around his neck. Moreover, the location itself was believed to be symbolic. Blackfriars bridge sits astride the border that connects the Masonically named "Square Mile" of the City of London to the rest of the Capital city.

The initial inquest into his death returned a verdict of suicide. Appealing against what they believed to be prejudice on the part of the Coroner - and suspicious of the Masonic affiliations of the City police - Calvi's family called for a second, more thorough inquest, which belatedly returned an open verdict. Meanwhile, Banco Ambrosiano, Calvi's massive, privately-owned bank, collapsed on the news of his death, revealing a huge "black hole" in the balance sheet amounting to $1.3 billion. A large proportion of the missing money was later located in accounts owned by the Vatican bank. The connections that unfolded in the wake of the Calvi "affair" were to link Masons with Mafiosi, Monks with Murder and Spies with wanted Nazi war criminals.

World War Two had barely ground to a final halt when, in 1947, Allied strategists set about planning for World War Three. Even as British and US intelligence officials scoured Europe seeking to apprehend Nazi's wanted on war crimes charges, other more secretive US and British intelligence units were actively engaged in helping those same Nazi's to escape.
Europe's "Stay Behind" Units

The means of escape were the Vatican run "Ratlines." Operated with the knowledge and blessing of highly placed US and British government officials, the Ratlines guided 30,000 wanted Nazi's to sanctuary. Safe haven locations included the US, Britain, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and the favourite bolt hole of them all: South America.

Those who reached safety in this manner read like a "Who's Who" of the most wanted Nazi war criminals. Klaus Barbie, the cruel Gestapo officer known as the "Butcher of Lyons;" Franz Stangl, Commandant of the notorious Treblinka extermination camp; Gustav Wagner Commandant of Sorbibor extermination camp; Alois Brunner, a brutal official in the Jewish deportation programme. Of the most famous to escape along the ratlines were Adolf Eichmann, the chief architect of the "Holoucast" and Dr Joseph Mengele, the "White Angel" of Auschwitz concentration camp. Not least was Deputy Fuhrer Martin Bormann. Incredibly, an entire Waffen SS division - the notorious "Galician Division" - consisting of 8000 men were smuggled to England and given "free settler" status.


(The Real Left Behinds)

Italy was not alone in having covert "stay behind" units in operation. The operation encompassed all of western Europe. In France the unit was called "Glaive" - again named after a Gladiatorial sword. Austria's unit was named "Schwert," also meaning sword. In Turkey the unit was named "Red Sheepskin" and in Greece "Sheepskin." Sweden's unit was called "Sveaborg." In Switzerland it went by the title P26. Other units in Holland, Belgium, Spain, Portugal, Germany, Norway, Luxembourg, Denmark and Holland remain unnamed. Not least, the United Kingdom's unit was simply known as "Stay Behind."


We need our own Propaganda DU! Ha ha ha ha!!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-23-05 02:58 AM
Response to Reply #36
37. P2 and Berlusconi
Edited on Thu Jun-23-05 03:29 AM by DrDebug

When people are talking about the Iraqi War, they are always talking about Bush and Blair and tend to forget about Italy. In Italy a man has come to power which makes Bush an absolute beginner. Berlusconi owns the media. Berlusconi is the president and he even made an attempt to pass a law for 'total immunity from prosecution for the president' because he has been tied up in many scandals.

Notably, in 1981 a scandal arose on the discovery by the police of Licio Gelli's secret freemasonry lodge (Propaganda Due, or P2) aiming to move the Italian political system in an authoritarian direction to oppose communism. A list of names was found of adherents of P2, which included members of the secret services and some prominent personalities from the political, industrial, military and press elite, among which Silvio Berlusconi, who was just starting to gain popularity as the founder and owner of "Canale 5" TV network.

The P2 lodge was dissolved by the Italian parliament in december 1981 and a law was passed declaring similar organizations illegal, but no specific crimes were alleged to individual members of P2. Berlusconi later (1989) sued for libel three journalists who had written an article hinting at his involvement in financiary crimes and in this occasion he declared in court that he had joined the P2 lodge "only a very short time before the scandal broke" and "he had not even paid the entry fee". Such statements, however, conflicted with the findings of the parliamentary commission appointed to investigate the lodge's activity, with material evidence, and even with previous testimony of Berlusconi, all of which showing that he had actually been a member of P2 since 1978 and had indeed paid a 100,000 Italian liras entry fee. Because of this he was indicted for perjury, but the crime was extinguished by the 1989 amnesty.


Garrick had once considered putting an illustration of Saint George on the back of the Kaya jacket, and in the original full-color draft on the Confrontation cover the dragon had a miter, a liturgical headdress worn by the Pope, on its head. Chris Blackwell vetoed that allegorical detail, fearing it might alienate the Catholics among Bob's admirers.

Had the image of the papacy as slain Satan been allowed to prevail as album art, it would have struck a dread chord in devout Rasta precincts, since settlements throughout Jamaica had been abuzz since 1981 with the sinister Vatican-related events making global headlines.

The P2 Scandal in Italy
The four-party coalition government of Italian prime minister Arnaldo Forlani had been toppled after June 1981 by disclosures that 953 respected members of the Italian establishment-including several of Forlani's cabinet-were members of the ultra secret Masonic lodge known as P2. The scandal centered on the charge that these Masons were involved in an intricate plot to undo the country's parliamentary system and form "a state within a state."

Since 1947, Italian civil servants have been forbidden to belong to any secret society, yet many of the P2 figures were linked to evil doings in the Vatican Bank that included alleged diversion of the Church's funds to the CIA and Mafia by Sicilian financier Michele Sindona - a man who served simultaneously as P2's financier and the Vatican's investment counselor.

Learned Rasta elders regarded Ancient and Accepted Rite Freemasons (of the thirty-three degrees unknown to common members) as fierce pagans whose occult gospel stems from their belief that Solomon drew his powers not from God but from Hiram Abiff, the murdered master builder of the Temple of Jerusalem, who was said to have renounced the Almighty in favor of a Dark Trinity centered on Baal, deity of the Semites. In many Rastas' eyes, it was Hiram Abiff's arrogant conjury, rather than any sin of Solomon's, that caused God to destroy the Temple, just as He once toppled the Masons-erected tower of Babel.

(...) /

And while we are talking about musicians

"Good going, stranger!"

Freemasons using classifieds in newspapers. And some think she is just a stupid bitch ;)

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
gandalf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 09:25 AM
Response to Original message
14. Hi Octafish
I put one article more on the blog yesterday.

If you send me the word file containing this post, I will move it to the blog as well.

Thanks for your research!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-23-05 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #14
39. Hey, Gandalf! Here's the work of a real giant,
I kind of suspect you are Spartacus. Now that is a bang-up overview on both Orgs:

A snip on The FBI:


The FBI under J. Edgar Hoover collected information on all America's leading politicians. Known as Hoover's secret files, this material was used to influence their actions. It was later claimed that Hoover used this incriminating material to make sure that the eight presidents that he served under, would be too frightened to sack him as director of the FBI. This strategy worked and Hoover was still in office when he died, aged seventy-seven, on 2nd May, 1972. Clyde Tolson arranged for the destruction of all Hoover's private files.

In its final report, issued in April 1976, the Select Committee to Study Governmental Operations with Respect to Intelligence Activities concluded: Domestic intelligence activity has threatened and undermined the Constitutional rights of Americans to free speech, association and privacy. It has done so primarily because the Constitutional system for checking abuse of power has not been applied.

William Sullivan was shot dead near his home in Sugar Hill, New Hampshire, on 9th November, 1977. An inquest decided that he had been shot accidentally by fellow hunter, Robert Daniels, who was fined $500 and lost his hunting license for 10 years.

Sullivan had been scheduled to testify before the House Select Committee on Assassinations. Sullivan was one of six top FBI officials who died in a six month period in 1977. Others who were due to appear before the committee who died included Louis Nicholas, special assistant to J. Edgar Hoover and his liaison with the Warren Commission; Alan H. Belmont, special assistant to Hoover; James Cadigan, document expert with access to documents that related to death of John F. Kennedy; J. M. English, former head of FBI Forensic Sciences Laboratory where Oswald's rifle and pistol were tested; Donald Kaylor, FBI fingerprint chemist who examined prints found at the assassination scene.


These spooks may've been compromised from within and without and from over here and there:

Good, bad and CIA


Rear Admiral Sidney W. Souers, who was the Deputy Chief of Naval Intelligence, was appointed the first Director of Central Intelligence. Walter Bedell Smith took over the post in 1950 and held it until being replaced by Allen W. Dulles in 1953.

Richard Bissell joined the CIA and was placed in charge of the Directorate for Plans, an organization instructed to conduct covert anti-Communist operations around the world. His deputy was Richard Helms, who had successfully mounted a mount a massive convert campaign against the Communist Party during the post-war elections in Italy.

The Directorate for Plans was responsible for what became known as the CIA's Black Operations. This involved a policy that was later to become known as Executive Action (a plan to remove unfriendly foreign leaders from power). This including a coup d'tat that overthrew the Guatemalan government of Jacobo Arbenz in 1954 after he introduced land reforms and nationalized the United Fruit Company.

Other political leaders deposed by Executive Action included Patrice Lumumba of the Congo, the Dominican Republic dictator Rafael Trujillo, General Abd al-Karim Kassem of Iraq and Ngo Dinh Diem, the leader of South Vietnam. However, his main target was Fidel Castro who had established a socialist government in Cuba.

In January 1959 General Fulgencio Batista was ousted by Fidel Castro. In its first hundred days in office Castro's government passed several new laws. Rents were cut by up to 50 per cent for low wage earners; property owned by Batista and his ministers was confiscated; the telephone company was nationalized and the rates were reduced by 50 per cent; land was redistributed amongst the peasants (including the land owned by the Castro family); separate facilities for blacks and whites (swimming pools, beaches, hotels, cemeteries etc.) were abolished.


Q: If these turds are willing to kill and depose and disrupt democracies abroad, what's to keep them from doing so at home?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
gandalf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-23-05 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. Very interesting...
will be moved to the blog (don't overestimate my abilities...)

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
15. Another nice one for you.GM and Ford building US / German and Soviet tanks
A perfect example on how to work on three sides simultaneously to make some more bucks. I was looking for our friends I.G. Farben (Allen Dulles, John J. McCloy, George Herbert Walker) but this this part was interesting as well...


John S. Torell


I.G. Farben would never have come into being had it not been backed or financed by Wall Street financiers in New York City. German bankers worked hand in hand with American workers to find the money to make it possible. One of the bankers in Germany was also one of the directors of I.G. Farben; he was the Hamburg banker, Max Warburg. (The Warburg family is Jewish and during World War I, Max was chief of the German Secret Police.) Max worked closely with his brother Paul Warburg, who lived in the United States, and was the founder and first chairman of the Federal Reserve System of the United States.


Here is the connection between American businesses, banks and the factories that produced for the Nazi war machine. Finance, research and general control were directed by these four American business entities. There were other major American business players in Germany, who eagerly built the German war machine. General Electric operated both in the Soviet Union and in Germany. Ford Motor Corporation was not only involved with I.G. Farben, but built auto and truck factories in Germany, as well as in the Soviet Union. General Motors purchased the Opel Factories of Germany in the late 1920's, which today are still in the G.M. family. I.T.T. (international Telephone and Telegraph) was heavily involved in Germany and owned the factory which produced the Focke-Wolfe fighters that shot down many American and British bombers during the war. I.T.T. also produced communication equipment for the German Navy and its submarine force, which was used to sink American ships. At the same time I.T.T. factories in the United Stated produced direction finders for the U.S. Navy in its fight against the German U-boats.

It is a sad commentary that General Motors and Ford Motor Corporation were the major producers of tanks and trucks for the U.S. Army, while G.M. Opel and the German Ford factories produced the bulk of the German tanks and trucks; and the Soviet tanks and trucks were produced by the Soviet Ford factories. We can never explain this to the men who died at the battle front.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #15
28. Hitler greatly admired Henry Ford and Hitler awarded Ford the highest
civilian award in Nazi Germany, the Order of the German Eagle.

Henry Ford's strongly anti-semitic views were published in a pre-WWII Detroit newspaper that he founded.

In 1998 allegations that Ford's German subsidiary, Ford-Werke, used forced labor from Auschwitz to produce armored vehicles for Nazis led to a very quiet settlement.

Ford Motor Company agreed to payment of $13,000,000 into a compensation fund for Nazi era slave laborers and put $4,000,000 into promotion of human rights projects.

Great series of threads, Octafish :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Sinister Forces: Peter Levenda
Edited on Wed Jun-22-05 01:14 PM by seemslikeadream

The roots of coincidence and conspiracy in American politics, crime, and culture
are examined in this book, exposing new connections between religion, political
conspiracy, and occultism. Readers are taken from ancient American civilization
and the mysterious mound builder culture to the Salem witch trials, the birth of
Mormonism during a ritual of ceremonial magic by Joseph Smith, Jr., and Operations
Paperclip and Bluebird. Not a work of speculative history, this expos is
founded on primary source material and historical documents. Fascinating details
are revealed, including the bizarre world of "wandering bishops" who appear
throughout the Kennedy assassinations; a CIA mind control program run amok in
the United States and Canada; a famous American spiritual leader who had ties to
Lee Harvey Oswald in the weeks and months leading up to the assassination of
President Kennedy; and the "Manson secret."

Here's a quote.

"This is a book about evil. Evil ordinary and extraordinary. Evil vigilant. Evil militant. Evil triumphant. Evil anciet and modern, violent and discrete, beautiful and obscene. Evil in the face of God, of men and women, of children. The evil of vainglorius men and their hollow minions. Evil unseen and fierce. The evil of bodybags and spent cartridges. Of mass graves and crematoria. Of crimes against nature and against heaven. The evil death and derangement, of murder and madness, of suicide and satanism. This is the evil we can't grasp, cannot punish, cannot destroy. The evil that contaminates souls as well as bodies, nations as well as people. This is a book about the evil spirits that haunt America. About the sinister forces that rule the world of our dreams, our nightmares, and our sober trembling, waking reality".

Sinister ForcesA Warm Gun
A Grimoire of American Political Witchcraft

Peter Levenda, Foreword by Dick Russell

A shocking alternative to the conventional views of American history

The roots of coincidence and conspiracy in American politics, crime, and culture are investigated in this analysis that exposes new connections between religion, political conspiracy, terrorism, and occultism. Readers are provided with strange parallels between supernatural forces such as shaminism, ritual magic, and cult practices, and contemporary interrogation techniques such as those used by the CIA under the general rubric of MK-ULTRA. Not a work of speculative history, this expos is founded on primary source material and historical documents. Fascinating details on Nixon and the "Dark Tower," the Assassin cult and more recent Islamic terrorism, and the bizarre themes that run through American history from its discovery by Columbus to the political assassinations of the 1960s are revealed.

Peter Levenda has researched the material for this book over the course of 25 years, visiting more than 40 countries and gaining access to temples, prisons, military installations, and government documents. He is the author of Sinister ForcesThe Nine and Unholy Alliance. He lives in Miami, Florida. Dick Russell is the author of Black Genius: And the American Experience, Eye of the Whale, and The Man Who Knew Too Much. He is a former staff writer at the Hollywood Bureau of TV Guide Magazine and a former staff reporter for Sports Illustrated. His articles have appeared in numerous publications, including Family Health and The Village Voice. He lives in Los Angeles.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #28
50. Henry Ford: From Slaughterhouse to Death Camp

That's some medal, there, Henry. Most inspiring.

Excerpt from Chapter 3 of

Eternal Treblinka: Our Treatment of Animals and the Holocaust

by Charles Patterson, Ph.D.
(New York: Lantern Books, 2002) 2002 Charles Patterson

"Henry Ford, who was so impressed by the efficient way meat packers killed animals in Chicago, made his own special contribution to the slaughter of people in Europe. Not only did he develop the assembly-line method the Germans used to kill Jews, but he launched a vicious anti-Semitic campaign that helped the Holocaust happen." Charles Patterson, Ph.D.
Since this chapter began with the contention that the road to Auschwitz begins at the slaughterhouse, it is fitting that it close with the story of the automobile manufacturer Henry Ford, whose impact on the twentieth century began, metaphorically speaking, at an American slaughterhouse and ended at Auschwitz.

In his autobiography, My Life and Work (1922), Ford revealed that his inspiration for assembly-line production came from a visit he made as a young man to a Chicago slaughterhouse. "I believe that this was the first moving line ever installed," he wrote. "The idea came in a general way from the overhead trolley that the Chicago packers use in dressing beef."1


As the twentieth century would demonstrate, it was but one step from the industrialized killing of American slaughterhouses to Nazi Germany's assembly-line mass murder. As noted earlier, it was the German Jew Theodor Adorno who declared that Auschwitz began at the slaughterhouse with people thinking, "They're just animals." In J. M. Coetzee's novel, The Lives of Animals, the protagonist Elizabeth Costello tells her audience: "Chicago showed us the way; it was from the Chicago stockyards that the Nazis learned how to process bodies."4

Most people are unaware of the central role of the slaughterhouse in the history of American industry. "While most economic historians have been drawn to the steel and automobile industry for clues to America's early industrial genius," writes Rifkin, "it was in the slaughterhouse that many of the most salient innovations in industrial design were first used....It's no wonder historians of a later period were more comfortable extolling the virtues of the assembly line and mass production in the automotive industry."5 Still, the mental deadening of assembly-line workers, though unsettling, was very far removed from the blood-letting on the "kill floor." Rifkin writes that in the newly mechanized slaughterhouses of Chicago, "the stench of death, the clanking of chains overhead, and the whirr of disemboweled creatures passing by in an endless procession overwhelmed the senses and dampened the enthusiasm of even the most ardent supporters of the new production values."6


Hitler regarded Ford as a comrade-in-arms and kept a life-sized portrait of him on the wall next to his desk in his office at the Nazi Party headquarters in Munich. Hitler spoke of Ford in glowing terms to his followers and frequently bragged to them about Ford's financial support.17 In 1923, when he heard that Ford might run for President of the United States, Hitler told an American reporter that he wanted to help. "I wish that I could send some of my shock troops to Chicago and other big American cities to help in the elections," he said. "We look to Heinrich Ford as the leader of the growing Fascist movement in America. We have just had his anti-Jewish articles translated and published. The book is being circulated in millions throughout Germany."18

Hitler praised Ford in Mein Kampf, the only American to be singled out. The reference had to do with the struggle in America against Jewish bankers and unionists: "It is Jews who govern the stock exchange forces of the American Union. Every year makes them more and more the controlling masters of the producers in a nation of one hundred and twenty millions; only a single great man, Ford, to their fury, still maintains full independence."19 In 1931, when a Detriot News reporter asked Hitler what Ford's portrait on the wall meant to him, Hitler said, "I regard Henry Ford as my inspiration."20


Thank you, bobthedrummer! I learned how from you...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-23-05 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #15
41. "In the eyes of empire builders men are not men but instruments."
-- Napoleon Bonaparte

Heck of a post, there, DrDebug. The old line WASPs vs. the international bankers has a lot of truth in it. So does the its opposite: Both monied classes work together. Just as long as someone else does the dying, they'll continue to make a killing.

Reminds me of Sergio Leone's "Fistful of Dollars." The Rojos were big gun runners who ran one side of town. The Baxters, who sold liquor to the Natives, ran the other. In the middle was the man with no name, who observed "There's money to be made in a town like this." He proceeded to set up the circumstances where both sides killed each other off.

Regulated Resistance: Pt. 2 - The Gatekeepers of the So-Called Left

Tuesday, May 03, 2005 - 12:48 PM

BY CHARLES SHAW - Last February United for Peace and Justice, the largest representative coalition within the American "anti-war movement", emerged from their second annual Assembly with a 2005 "action plan" that effectively caged the "anti-war" debate exclusively within the Iraq conflict to achieve partisan ends on behalf of the pro-war Democratic Party and their Neoliberal corporate benefactors. Their "action plan" refused to address any of the core issues of US Foreign and Defense policy, which are the root causes of a pervading culture of war and militarism that has taken over the nation in the years since WWII.

These decisions are part of a larger pattern of "regulated resistance", a system by which dissent is carefully managed and constrained by self, overt, or covert censorship; denial-based-psychology; fear of personal or professional criticism and reprisal; and pressure from powers above including elected officials and those establishment foundations which flood millions into the not-for-profit activist sector.

This establishment money, and the access it grants, has caused many ostensible resistance leaders to suddenly and dramatically abandon long-held ideological positions and shift their behavior towards doing what can clearly be seen as the bidding of those in power whose views and values are in direct contravention to the established mores of peace and justice movements throughout history.

These "resistance leaders" of the "Left" act as "Gatekeepers"influential "progressive" figures who use their resources and visibility to regulate the debate, tactics, and rhetoric of the "anti-war" and other "progressive" movements.


The crazy bell-ringer was right.
There's money to be made in a town like this.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 02:58 AM
Response to Reply #41
42. Good article. I continues with disinformation tactics. Edgar Eugene Bradle
Edited on Fri Jun-24-05 03:23 AM by DrDebug
A lot of posts here have been about the work of Mae Brussell and it found her reading fascinating. In the story she briefly mentioned a plot to kill Kennedy in the 1960s.

So I tried to find verfication of that story and I arrived at Jim Garrison, the District Attorney which became famous in the Oliver Stone movie JFK. Jim is often regarded as disinformation because he focused on the CIA-Cubans/mafia connections and didn't touch the Texas Oil / corporate connections (George De Mohrenschildt / George H.W. Bush etc.) nor the top guys (E. Howard Hunt / Dulles / LBJ) which were the brains and the money while the Cubans/mafia were the hired goons. I've dismissed Jim Garrison as somewhat of a disinformation attempt. And then I read in your article:

This well-worn tactic known as the "straw man argument" is used by detractors to attack and undermine the weakest part of an alternative theory in order to dismiss it and alienate the public from the larger issue.

Back to the story, because this is a fascinating piece of discovery by Jim Garrison which has been dismissed by many investigators however Mae Brussell points to him as well. We arrive at a preacher called Edgar Eugene Bradley...

(Note for moderators: This story has been created by me from 5 different sources.)

Edgar Eugene Bradley

Before the election of 1960, a group within the Christian Right plotted to kill John Kennedy in Van Nuys, California while he was still a candidate. (3)

During the Jim Garrison investigation into the John F. Kennedy assassination a letter was discovered by Bill Turner in September, 1967 .This letter had been sent to Mike Karmazin on April 10, 1967, by Thomas L. Thornhill. "My information concerns a man named Edgar Eugene Bradley," Thornhill wrote. "One of my witnesses will testify to the fact that Mr Bradley tried to hire him to assassinate Mr Kennedy during his 1961 campaign in California" (4)


A Fort Worth Star-Telegram photograph showing two men in front of the School Book Depository apparently under arrest following the assassination was shown to Mrs Carol Aydelotte. According to Turner, "without hesitation, she pointed to the lead man and said: That's Gene Bradley.' " (4)

On December 22 1967, Roger Craig learned from Jim Garrison that the secret service man's name was Edgar Eugene Bradley, a right wing preacher from North Hollywood, California (1) and a member of the Christian Defense League (CDL) (3), a hate group with connections to the Minutemen and the Ku Klux Klan.

Roger Craig

Roger Craig was named the Dallas Sheriff's Department "Officer of the Year" in 1960 by the Dallas Traffic Commission. He received four promotions while he was deputy Sheriff. Among the most important events he witnessed on November 22, 1963:

  • at approximately 12:40 p.m., deputy Craig was standing on the south side of Elm Street when he heard a shrill whistle coming from the north side of Elm and turned to see a man--wearing faded blue trousers and a long sleeved work shirt made of some type of grainy material--come running down the grassy knoll from the direction of the TSBD. He saw a light green Rambler station wagon coming slowly west on Elm Street, pull over to the north curb and pick up the man coming down the hill. By this time the traffic was too heavy for him to be able to reach them before the car drove away going west on Elm.

  • after witnessing the above scene, deputy Craig ran to the command post at Elm and Houston to report the incident to the authorities. When he got there and asked who was involved in the investigation, a man turned to him and said "I'm with the Secret Service." Craig recounted what he had just seen. This "Secret Service" man showed little interest in Craig's description of the people leaving, but seemed extremely interested in the description of the Rambler to the degree this was the only part of the recounting that he wrote down. (1,2)


Then-governor Ronald Reagan refused to grant the extradition request from Garrison for the indictment of Bradley during the New Orleans Probe without reason. The Edgar Eugene Bradley extradition request was handled for Reagan by then Reagan legal advisor, legal counsellor Edwin A. Meese, who later, became Attorney General of the United States and who also was a highly ranked intelligence officer with the Army reserve, both then and now.

Later the original letter denied as belonging to Edgar Eugene Bradley since it was written by another Edgar Eugene Bradley.

Similar story:

Sources and External links


The Christian Defense League still exists and even has a website. I briefly glanced over it, but it's really disgusting and very much KKK, neo nazi stuff. So that group is still active.

There's a very detailed post about the CDL here:

It contains all kinds of crazy connections like the MLK assassination and many key figures within the JFK story. Sadly this part of the investigation was side tracked
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
dmr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
16. Things are never as they seem ...
This all makes me think about Robert Kennedy going after organized crime as AG. Perhaps the mob's anger wasn't just feelings of betrayal for their alleged help in the 1960 polls, but because Bobby dug painfully deeper than anyone else in justice. No one likes when their status quo is messed with.

I'm going to be very busy reading today. I'm always happy to see your posts, Octafish. Thanks!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #16
44. Hoover never warned RFK about threats to President Kennedy
In his book, "Act of Treason," Texas attorney Mark North pegged Hoover's role in the assassination of President John F. Kennedy. One of the things I find most chilling is Hoover never informed his boss, Attorney General Robert F. Kennedy, about the threats on JFK.

Act of Treason


In September 1962, as a result of data obtained through covert surveillance programs against the Mafia, then FBI director J. Edgar Hoover learned that a subcomponent of that organization, the Marcello family in New Orleans, Louisiana, had, in order to prevent its own destruction (through prosecutorial pressure resulting from the administrations war on organized crime) put out a contract on the life of John Kennedy. Despite specific statutory requirement, and his duty as an American citizen, Hoover did not inform his superiors within the Justice Department, or warn the Secret Service (a minuscule organization by comparison, which relied heavily upon the FBI for raw data concerning threats against the President). He withheld the data in part because he felt Kennedy was an indecisive, immoral liberal who, if left in place, would destroy the nation. But most important, he did this because JFK had made it known that he intended, by the end of his first term in office, to retire the Director and replace him with a man of his own, more liberal political philosophy. An integral part of Hoovers decision to aid the assassination of the President stemmed from the fact that by the fall of 1962 he held sufficient information to control then Vice President Lyndon Johnson, a longtime friend, were he to become President. Through data gleaned (and withheld from the Justice Department) from investigations of the Billie Sol Estes and soon-to-break Bobby Baker/Mafia scandals, Hoover had hopelessly compromised the Vice President. Johnson, a man then tremendously dissatisfied with his position in government, knew this.

As a result of Hoovers traitorous act, President Kennedy was assassinated, Johnson became president, and the Director obtained an Executive Order on May 8, 1964, waiving his compulsory retirement.

The Warren Commission, consisting of longtime political insiders handpicked by Johnson to satisfy themselves that the truth is known as far as it can be discovered, was made up of intelligent, knowledgeable men. Instructed by Johnson to look to Hoover as chief investigator, however, they were quickly stymied. From the outset, the Director refused to send representatives to Commission meetings, would not provide the raw data the event compelled them to examine, and repeatedly leaked to the press investigative conclusions supporting only the lone-nut thesis. On December 5, 1963, he formally, publicly, concluded that Oswald and Ruby had acted alone, independently of each other, and then demanded that the Commission issue a public statement agreeing with him. The members in turn, became deeply suspicious of his motivations. Like many Beltway officials, they had known of Hoover and JFKs hatred for each other long before the assassination, as well as of Kennedys plan to retire the aging Director.

Forcing Johnsons hand with a public demand for raw FBI investigative rports on December 16, 1963, their suspicions concerning Hoover were confirmed by March 1964. To complicate matters, evidence pointing to Mafia complicity raised ominous questions with regard to Johnson himself. Through involvement with Sentate aide Bobby Baker in the late 1950s and early 1960s, LBJ had effectively associated himself with some of the same people then deeply involved with Mafiosi like Meyer Lansky, Santos Traficante, and Carlos Marcello. Mafiosi such as Edward Levinson and Benjamin Sigelbaum, and lobbyist Fred Black, along with Bobby Baker, were, by early 1964 themselves under Senate investigation. One Warren Commission member, Senator John Sherman Cooper, actually served concurrently on the Baker panel. The political reality of Hoovers act and Johnsons vulnerability came home.

Struck by the gravity of this truth, and pressured by Hoover and Johnson, the controlling faction within the Commission made the tragic decision to accept Hoovers lone-nut thesis and conceal the conspiracy from the public. Its chief counsel, J. Lee Rankin, a compromise choice of the Commission not known for any hard-line position on the Mafia, was prevented from exposing the Director. In all likelihood, reservation of institutional credibility was the paramount concern. Consider what the short-term public reaction would have been had it been revealed that the Director of the FBI, an ultraright figure of messianic bent and hero to many, had allowed the President, a highly popular man of the middle and left, to be assassinated primarily for personal gain.

SOURCE: Mark North, Act of Treason. Pp 13-15.. Carroll & Graff. 1991

PS: Thank you for the kind words, dmr! Much appreciated. And please feel free to pile on here or any other time we can amass a bit of light on the BFEE, their sub-stooges and their own secret and satanic masters.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
17. Prescott Bush recrited the "Trickster"??
If thats true then the Bush family criminals have controlled this govt since the 1950s...most likely have had some kind of control over thew govt since Prescott Bush began collaborating with the Germans after WW I . Remember that Sam Bush was war profiteering with the Kaiser.

I don't agree with all of John Loftus views BUT he has some great pts!

"Former Federal Prosecutor John Loftus confirms the Bush-Nazi scandal
Copyright October 31. 2003
Some of our most famous American families, including the Bushes, made their fortunes from the Holocaust. Before I tell this awful story, I have to admit that I am a Democrat, but I quite like this President. He is not the sharpest tool in the shed, but he has a good heart, and the good sense not to follow in his father's footsteps. "W" has some good people around him who keep a firewall in the White House against his father's oil cronies. In terms of Republican politics, "W" is a rebel.

It is quite possible that "W" (and his boyhood friend William Stamps Farrish, now US Ambassador to Britain) have tilted towards Israel perhaps because they wished to atone for the sins of their fathers. (Farrish's father committed suicide over his father's connections to the Bush-Nazi scandal.) Whatever the reason for the rebellion of the grandchildren, this Bush is quite a different man than his forbears. I like him and wish him well. But liking this Bush does not excuse my duty as a historian to tell the truth and let the chips fall where they may.

There was a great deal of skepticism ten years ago when I first wrote about the Bush-Nazi scandal in my book, "The Secret War Against the Jews." Its historical validity has now been confirmed by the ground breaking work of reporter John Buchanan. In October 2003, Buchanan unearthed the recently released Bush-Thyssen files in the US National Archives.

These long buried US government files demonstrate that the Bush family stayed on the corporate boards of Nazi front groups even after they knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that they were helping the financial cause of the Third Reich. It was all about the money. Nazi Germany is where the Bush family fortune came from, and where the Harrimans, and the Rockefellers increased their fortunes to obscene proportions. "


Now take the red tablet and back to sleep!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. OOPS... Bush recruited Nixon
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #18
45. Prescott was something.
A most important chapter in U.S. history lies forgotten by most...

Treason with Dick and George.

George W. Bush, The Neocons, & The Nazis: Ties That Bind

Glen Yeadon | August 23 2004

Numerous writers have compared the Bush tactics with those used by Hitler, while others have documented the connection between Prescott Bush and the Nazis. However, there is much more to what has lead the Bush regime to transform the United Stated into a fascist police state. Few people are aware that it is the Republican Party which paid for Nazi broadcasts in the 1930s or that the GOP employed Nazis in election campaigns. Fewer are aware that Herbert Hoover conspired with top Nazi officials in Berlin to unseat Roosevelt in the 1940 election. Others have forgotten that George Bush senior as chairman of the Republican Party set up the ethnic heritage groups of the party as havens for former Nazis or that he employed known Nazi war criminals on his campaign staff.


Following the war, Allan Dulles faced an investigation for treason. While Dulles was crafty enough to escape the charges, one of those aiding him in covering up his crimes was Richard Nixon. While still serving in the navy, Nixon was given some captured documents to review. The contents would have revealed Allan Dulles as a traitor. In exchange for burying the documents Dulles agreed to fund Nixon's first political campaign. Nixon's campaign benefited from large contributions from a large New York bank connected with Brown Brothers and Harriman.

Captured Nazi documents reveal they had a comeback plan. Their plan to regain power after the war revolved around using their friends or other fascist sympathizers in other countries --and particularly in the United States-- to do their bidding while rebuilding Germany. The documents note that, as late as 1944, the Nazis were hoping for a Republican victory in the presidential election because they would get an easier peace. The second part of their plan aimed at provoking a war between the U.S. and the Soviet Union, which would allow the Nazis to retake power in Germany without U.S. intervention.

Politically, Eisenhower had a tin ear, and he was politically nave. When John Foster Dulles approached him in Europe to run for election in 1948, Eisenhower had no foreign policy concept formulated. He was easily swayed by Dulles' idea of massive nuclear retaliation, which led to the appointment of Dulles as secretary of state. While Eisenhower was no Nazi and expressed his hatred of Nazis and Germans in his letters to his wife, he allowed the American Nazis like the Dulles brothers to gain a great deal of control over his administration. Eisenhower appointed Allan Dulles as CIA Director, and Prescott Bush and John Lovett were Eisenhower's close golfing buddies. Prescott Bush was also the driving force in selecting Richard Nixon as Eisenhower's running mate. Nelson Rockefeller was appointed to head the Psychological Strategy Board. Numerous employees of Sullivan and Cromwell, the two Wall Street firms most involved with the Nazis, held important positions within the administration.


While the American Nazis succeeded in gaining partial control of the Eisenhower administration and were able to stoke the fires of the Cold War, they failed to secure total control. Although these American Nazis managed to dupe the tired old general, they never succeeded in completely tricking him. Even after suffering a debilitating heart attack the old general refused to turn over the reins of power to Nixon, a man he loathed. Before leaving office, Eisenhower realized he had been duped and left us his rather cryptic warning about the military-industrial complex, suggesting the dangers of corporate rule.

Since 1960, Eisenhower's warning has gone largely unheeded. Beginning with the rise of fascism and the elitism within the Reagan administration, the military keeps taking up a bigger portion of the budget, social welfare has been largely eliminated --just as it was eliminated in Nazi Germany. Today, under the regime of George W. Bush, it is clear that the corporations within the military-industrial complex are in control of the country. It allows Dick Cheney to pad his retirement account at Halliburton with millions of dollars of Halliburton overcharges for services not delivered in the Iraq War. Meanwhile, many of the soldiers are sent into combat without body armor.


This stuff gives me the creeps. Worse still, these turds gave America NAZI creeps.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 05:28 AM
Response to Reply #17
24. That's what happens
when you start connecting the dots... :hide:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Project_Willow Donating Member (80 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-21-05 11:44 PM
Response to Original message
23. ahhh
a breath of fresh air.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #23
46. FBI and CIA are corrupt organizations.
* Anti-Democratic
* Anti-Civil Rights
* Anti-Progress


We should run a RICO warrant on both. The computer would turn up:
* Murder
* Racketeering
* Treason

For both Orgs.

chicago outfit and satellite regimes, c.1981-83, 1998
graphite on paper
50 x 80 inches
Mark Lombardi

PS: A most hearty welcome to DU, Project_Willow! Welcome home!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 06:59 AM
Response to Original message
25. In my opinion, in order to
understand the 1960s and early '70s, and what Hoover represented, it is vital to read the March 4, 1968 memo from "the Director" regarding his goal of "maximum effectiveness of the Counterintelligence Program." J Edgar was intent upon "prevent(ing) the coalition of militant black nationalist groups. In unity there is strength; a truism that is no less valid for all its triteness. An effective coalition of black nationalist groups might be the first step toward a real 'Mau' in America, the beginning of a true black revolution."

Hoover then focuses on the need to "prevent the rise of a 'messiah' who could unify, and electrify, the militant black nationalist movement. Malcolm X might have been such a 'messiah'; he is the martyr of the movement today." He goes on to identify Stokely Carmichael, Elijah Mohammad, and Martin Luther King, Jr as posing the greatest threats to unify black "militants." He shows a particular hatred for Martin, who he believes has "abandon(ed) his supposed 'obedience' to 'white, liberal doctrines' ... and embrace(d) black nationalism."

A couple books are worth reading for a fuller understanding of this. "Malcolm X: The FBI File," by Clayborne Carson is fascinating. The introduction to the book, by Spike Lee, should be required reading for all progressive democrats.

"Agents of Repression: The FBI's Secret Wars Against the Black Panther Party and the American Indian Movement," by Ward Churchill and Jim Vander Wall, is an important book. I think if people were to read it, they might understand some of the reasons why Ward became a target of the right wing in recent months. It doesn't matter if one agrees with his opinions or not; the book is very well documented.

The third book I would suggest is Peter Matthiessen's "In the Spirit of Crazy Horse." The book was "kept off the shelves" for eight years, as a result of one of the "most protracted and bitterly fought legal cases in publishing history." Any time the government goes to court to keep you from reading a book by a respected author, I say read that book!

Together, these three books show the very negative potential that Hoover set as the agencies' goal. He was a vicious man, who was willing to punish anyone who opposed him .... including those in government and in the FBI.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
DrDebug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. And Martin Luther King said the exact opposite
He actively persued cooperation with Whites and especially White Churchleaders and Jewish Rabbis because they had a common belief.

From one of the greatest letters ever written. Nobody should take political action without reading this document in full IMHO...


I must make two honest confessions to you, my Christian and Jewish brothers. First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.

I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that law and order exist for the purpose of establishing justice and that when they fan in this purpose they become the dangerously structured dams that block the flow of social progress. I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that the present tension in the South is a necessary phase of the transition from an obnoxious negative peace, in which the Negro passively accepted his unjust plight, to a substantive and positive peace, in which all men will respect the dignity and worth of human personality. Actually, we who engage in nonviolent direct action are not the creators of tension. We merely bring to the surface the hidden tension that is already alive. We bring it out in the open, where it can be seen and dealt with. Like a boil that can never be cured so long as it is covered up but must be opened with an its ugliness to the natural medicines of air and light, injustice must be exposed, with all the tension its exposure creates, to the light of human conscience and the air of national opinion before it can be cured.

In your statement you assert that our actions, even though peaceful, must be condemned because they precipitate violence. But is this a logical assertion? Isn't this like condemning a robbed man because his possession of money precipitated the evil act of robbery? Isn't this like condemning Socrates because his unswerving commitment to truth and his philosophical inquiries precipitated the act by the misguided populace in which they made him drink hemlock? Isn't this like condemning Jesus because his unique God-consciousness and never-ceasing devotion to God's will precipitated the evil act of crucifixion? We must come to see that, as the federal courts have consistently affirmed, it is wrong to urge an individual to cease his efforts to gain his basic constitutional rights because the quest may precipitate violence. Society must protect the robbed and punish the robber.

I had also hoped that the white moderate would reject the myth concerning time in relation to the struggle for freedom. I have just received a letter from a white brother in Texas. He writes: "An Christians know that the colored people will receive equal rights eventually, but it is possible that you are in too great a religious hurry. It has taken Christianity almost two thousand years to accomplish what it has. The teachings of Christ take time to come to earth." Such an attitude stems from a tragic misconception of time, from the strangely rational notion that there is something in the very flow of time that will inevitably cure all ills. Actually, time itself is neutral; it can be used either destructively or constructively. More and more I feel that the people of ill will have used time much more effectively than have the people of good will. We will have to repent in this generation not merely for the hateful words and actions of the bad people but for the appalling silence of the good people. Human progress never rolls in on wheels of inevitability; it comes through the tireless efforts of men willing to be co-workers with God, and without this 'hard work, time itself becomes an ally of the forces of social stagnation. We must use time creatively, in the knowledge that the time is always ripe to do right. Now is the time to make real the promise of democracy and transform our pending national elegy into a creative psalm of brotherhood. Now is the time to lift our national policy from the quicksand of racial injustice to 6e solid rock of human dignity.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #25
51. Wow! Peter Mathiessen "In the Spirit of Crazy Horse"
Thanks for the heads-up, Water Being!

I went after COINTELPRO but I came up with this spiritual stuff about The Big Man, Rugaru.

Pre-Columbian and Early American Legends of Bigfoot-like Beings

(From : Traditional Attitudes Toward Bigfoot in Many North American Cultures, By Gayle Highpine)

"Here in the Northwest, and west of the Rockies generally, Indian people regard Bigfoot with great respect. He is seen as a special kind of being, because of his obvious close relationship with humans. Some elders regard him as standing on the "border" between animal-style consciousness and human-style consciousness, which gives him a special kind of power. (It is not that Bigfoot's relationship to make him "superior" to other animals; in Indian culture, unlike western culture, animals are not regarded as "inferior" to humans but rather as "elder brothers" and "teachers" of humans. But tribal cultures everywhere are based on relationship and kinship; the closer the kinship, the stronger the bond. Man Indian elders in the Northwest refuse to eat bear meat because of the bear's similarity to humans, and Bigfoot is obviously much more similar to humans than is the bear. As beings who blend the "natural knowledge" of animals with something of the distinctive type of consciousness called "intelligence" that humans have, Bigfoot is regarded as a special type of being."

"But, special being as he is, I have never heard anyone from a Northwestern tribe suggest that Bigfoot is anything other than a physical being, living in the same physical dimensions as humans and other animals. He eats, he sleeps, he poops, he cares for his family members. However, among many Indians elsewhere in North America... as widely separated at the Hopi, the Sioux, the Iroquois, and the Northern Athabascan -- Bigfoot is seen more as a sort of supernatural or spirit being, whose appearance to humans is always meant to convey some kind of message."

"The Lakota, or western Sioux, call Bigfoot Chiye-tanka (Chiha-tanka in Dakota or eastern Sioux); "chiye" means "elder brother" and "tanka" means "great" or "big". In English, though, the Sioux usually call him "the big man". In his book "In the Spirit of Crazy Horse," (Viking, 1980), a non-fiction account of the events dramatized by the excellent recent movie "Thunderheart", author Peter Mathiessen recorded some comments about Bigfoot made by traditional Sioux people and some members of other Indian nations. Joe Flying By, a Hunkpapa Lakota, told Mathiessen, "I think the Big Man is a kind of husband of Unk-ksa, the earth, who is wise in the way of anything with its own natural wisdom. Sometimes we say that this One is a kind of reptile from the ancient times who can take a big hairy form; I also think he can change into a coyote. Some of the people who saw him did not respect what they were seeing, and they are already gone."

"There is your Big man standing there, ever waiting, ever present, like the coming of a new day," Oglala Lakota Medicine Man Pete Catches km told Mathiessen. "He is both spirit and real being, but he can also glide through the forest, like a moose with big antlers, as though the trees weren't there... I know him as my brother... I want him to touch me, just a touch, a blessing, something I could bring home to my sons and grandchildren, that I was there, that I approached him, and he touched me."


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
31. Thanks "Octafish." A great reminder and good info for those
who don't remember them. :scared:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-27-05 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #31
53. Operation GEMSTONE
On behalf of his Fhrer, G. Gordon Liddy planned to circumvent the Constitution, to put it nicely.

Forgotten History - Tuesday, February 13, 2001

"Little known facts and overlooked history"

Operation Gemstone

Gordon Liddy had been hired by the White House to run their
intelligence squad. At first, they were called the "Plumbers"
and one of their first actions was to break into the office
of psychiatrist Daniel Ellsberg. Now, as Gordon Liddy walked
through the Justice Department building, he was about to
submit his plan to Attorney General John Mitchell. The plan,
which was unquestionably criminal, was known as "Operation

Gemstone outlined the methods to be used on demonstrators at
the Republican National Convention in Miami. These demonstrators
were to be captured, drugged and held hostage in Mexico. Those
people carrying out the plan included professional killers who
had accounted for maybe twenty-two deaths between them so far.
They came from the ranks of organized crime and could be
trusted to do the job. Gordon Liddy presented this plan to the
chief law enforcement officer of the United States.

Other plans included bugging airplanes and the leasing of a
large barge which would serve as headquarters for the President's
lawbreakers. One of the bedrooms on the barge would
be used to house local prostitutes whose job it would be "to
go out and to seduce into the barge high campaign officials."
Liddy said they were searching for high class women who would
be seduced by the power of the Democratic staffers. Liddy also
spoke of agent provocateur tactics that would discredit the

Liddy's tactics included destroying property, such as wrecking
air-conditioning units in the hotels that Democrats were
staying, which would in turn make conditions for the Democrats
difficult. Amazingly John Mitchell, who was the Attorney
General at the time, didn't fire Liddy but told him to come up
with something more feasible. While Liddy went back to the
drawing board, John Dean, who was present at the meeting,
suggested to White House chief of staff H.R. Halderman that
the administration have nothing to due with the lawless Liddy.

Liddy now started up on his plans to break into the Democratic
headquarters. What were they looking for? They were looking
for the financial records of Lawrence O'Brien. O'Brien had
been kept on a retainer by Howard Hughes and Nixon wanted to
find out the information and thereby discredit O'Brien. To do
this, and other illegal activities, Liddy and former CIA
operative E. Howard Hunt hired several anti-Castro Cubans to
be their muscle.


Most important: You're welcome, KoKo01! The reason for these reminders is to keep history fresh, show how the past treasons past tie to treasons present; and bring this history alive for a new generation -- as well as those who haven't seen much about it in Corporate McPravda, which is the majority of Americans, sad to write.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-22-05 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
32. Bushco & neoCON company HATE democracy and freedom,...
,...'cause "giving" usurps the power of tyranny.

God forbid these bastards live somewhere near,...the rest of us. They couldn't handle it, as a "common" human being. They are too weak weak WEAK.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-27-05 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #32
54. Cocaine Importation Agency -- Officially A-OK
Sometimes I gotta use my own peeps to believe these perps:


So, if you don't work for the CIA and the CIA sees you breaking drug laws, that's OK. They don't have to report you. So, no one works for the CIA who's doing work on behalf of CIA. That's some Catch, that CIA-Catch-22.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
gandalf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-23-05 06:17 AM
Response to Original message
38. Published on the BFEE blog as well
in order to make this material accessible to a wide audience...

The Blog can be found here.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-24-05 04:16 AM
Response to Reply #38
43. Kick!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
gandalf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-26-05 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #43
52. kick
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-27-05 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #52
55. Chalabi-gate: Neocons behind bars? Sounds good to me.
Vielen dank for giving a damn, Karenina und gandalf!

From Raimondo's

Chalabi-gate: None Dare Call It Treason

Neocons behind bars? Sounds good to me.

by Justin Raimondo
May 28, 2004

The fallout from Chalabi-gate continues to rain down on the heads of the War Party, opening up the exciting prospect that some neocons might well wind up behind bars.

The charge? Espionage, as Sidney Blumenthal informs us:

"At a well-appointed conservative think tank in downtown Washington and across the Potomac River at the Pentagon, FBI agents have begun paying quiet calls on prominent neoconservatives, who are being interviewed in an investigation of potential espionage, according to intelligence sources. Who gave Ahmed Chalabi classified information about the plans of the U.S. government and military?"

This information, says Vince Cannistraro, formerly at the CIA and the Pentagon, was so "very, very sensitive" that only a few U.S. government officials had access to it:

"The evidence has pointed quite clearly, not only the fact that Chalabi might be an agent of influence of the Iranian government and that may be a paid agent of the Iranian intelligence service, but it is shown that there is a leak of classified information from the United States to Iran through Chalabi and Karim and that is the particular point that the FBI is investigating. In other words, some U.S. officials are under investigation on suspicion of providing classified information to these people that ended up in Iran."

Blumenthal has more:

"A former staff member of the Office of Special Plans and a currently serving defense official, two of those said to be questioned by the FBI, are considered witnesses, at least for now. Higher figures are under suspicion. Were they witting or unwitting? If those who are being questioned turn out to be misleading, they can be charged ultimately with perjury and obstruction of justice. For them, the Watergate principle applies: It's not the crime, it's the coverup."


As for those who wonder why this conspiracy stuff is worth a bother, please understand that most people seldom get a shot at Truth. That's why DU's so important.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun Aug 18th 2019, 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC