Who is the biggest hag to serve as First Lady?

[WI_DEM]

Poll question: Who is the biggest hag to serve as First Lady?

I did favorite FL, and now to be fair...

[amazona]

1. it isn't even a contest is it NT

The conservation movement is a breeding ground of communists
and other subversives. We intend to clean them out,
even if it means rounding up every birdwatcher in the country.
--John Mitchell, US Attorney General 1969-72

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

2. No contest.-- it's "Mama Caligula"

a/k/a Barbara Bush, the Mother of all Assclowns.

[MrModerate]

5. More like Ma Barker . . .

Caligula had more class. And isn't he the one who made his horse a senator? Today's senators turn THEMSELVES into horses (horses' asses any way) without divine intervention.

[Valerie5555]

9. How about aka The Wicked Witch Of The West Wing

eom

[barb162]

14. Ol' Bar is the winner, hands down

She married a jerk and she bred jerks

[Slyder]

78. Caligula's mother

would be Agrippina, wife of Germanicus, and grandaughter of Augustus. Germanicus was a real Roman hero and was poisoned for being too perfect. The Emperor Tiberius exiled Agrippina to a small island where she starved to death. Talk about a dysfunctional family! Nah, we haven't even come close to this kind of mess in the modern era. You can carry historical parallels too far!

[saltpoint]

3. Nancy Reagan Nancy Reagan Nancy Reagan Nancy Reagan

Nancy Reagan Nancy Reagan Nancy Reagan Nancy Reagan

[tyedyeto]

49. During her time as 1st Lady.....yes, but

lately she seems to have mellowed when she has stated she supports stem cell research for Alzheimer's and other diseases.

[saltpoint]

65. True. It may have doomed her chances at doing well --

-- in this poll!

It looks as if Barbara Bush is going to win in a comlte landslide.

And I hope Nancy Reagan keeps jamming thorns in Bush's side over stem cell research.

[geniph]

60. I've always referred to her as Livia

(I, Claudius fans will get the reference)

[ryan_cats]

71. Works as a Sopranos reference!

Tony's mom. Nasty nasty person.

[ryan_cats]

70. Ding ding ding!!

Of course my brother would call her Saint Nancy-puke!

[saltpoint]

106. Yes. There's something deeply mean-spirited about her.

Joan Didion has several passages in her essay collections about Saint Nancy.

Nancy doesn't come off too well in the Didion pieces. She's shown as superficial, scheming, off-topic, and not very bright.

[Fenris]

4. Clobbersaurus

aka Barbara Bush.

[Synnical]

6. Eww - The First Lady has no official duties, is not elected

Why are you doing this? I'm appalled.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

22. Because she spawned the Shrub, and for that, we cannot forgive the bear.

[Isere]

100. Me, too!

This is truly out of bounds and highly tasteless.
Would you like it if Eleanor Roosevelt were similarly trashed on a conservative site?

[ComerPerro]

7. No contest. The one with the "Beautiful Mind"

[JI7]

8. barracuda babs is what we call her

although i can't say for sure whether she is worse than Laura Bush.

[barb162]

11. Laura isn't old enough

[Spencer10]

12. Barbara!

In keeping with today's theme, the Rottweiller of First Ladies.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

23. LOL! n/t

[smirkymonkey]

67. Here's a lovely photo of the former first canine:

[ailsagirl]

13. Laura is a stepford wife... a robot... we can't call her a hag really

[LiberallyInclined]

68. I thought that it was 'popeye'...

:evilgrin:

[ailsagirl]

10. Babs is the one

I remember on SNL, whenever they had a skit with Babs in it, they'd use Phil Hartman complete with white wig and dress.

Perfect likeness only Phil was prettier.

I miss Phil-- he was a brilliant comic.

[carpetbagger]

15. "There's a woman who knows how to hate!"

Richard Nixon, speaking of Barbara Bush.

I suppose that's why our local Barbara Bush Middle School teams are the "Barbara Bush Bulldogs"

[signmike]

16. Pat was no sweetheart.

:scared: They all give Halloween a bad name

[BringEmOn]

17. Ma Bush

[Spider Jerusalem]

18. Mary Todd Lincoln.

She was a raving lunatic. Prone to violent outbursts, fits of jealousy, abusing her husband's position to engage in profligate and ruinous spending on credit, and much else besides. She makes all the others on the list, even Barbara Bush and Nancy Reagan, look like paragons in comparison.

[saltpoint]

33. Fond tidings, Spider Jerusalem.

I considered Mary Todd Lincoln but held back because I'm inclined to think she was mentally ill. She's all you said she was and probably not much help to her husband while he devised strategies to hold the union together, etc., but I didn't vote for her because I think she was blood-and-bones bonkers.

I voted for Nancy Reagan because she was mean-spirited just by nature.

I love films. Why hasn't a really gifted director not made a film of Mary Todd Lincoln? What a role that would be for an actress.

[Spider Jerusalem]

34. Yes, she seems to've been mentally ill...

and I've actually seen a theory put forward that suggests her madness was due to syphilis (possibly acquired by her husband in a youthful dalliance with a prostitute).

And the life of Mary Todd Lincoln WOULD seem to make for an amazing film, if properly cast...it would take a latter-day Hepburn, Crawford or Davis to do the role justice, though.

[saltpoint]

35. Yes -- the woman who plays Mary Todd Lincoln would --

-- have to be wildly talented.

Maybe Ellen Burstyn?

[Spider Jerusalem]

36. Quite possibly.

I was VERY impressed with the range and depth she displayed in "Requiem For A Dream".

[saltpoint]

38. Ok, then. We've got a nominee for the lead.

Who directs?

Altman?

[Spider Jerusalem]

43. Altman would be good.

He can be very subtle (the brilliant scene in "Short Cuts" with Matthew Modine and Julianne Moore, for instance).

Coppola might manage to do it justice, though.

And it would be interesting to see what Woody Allen would do with the film (bit of a genre shift for him, but I think he might handle the interpersonal relationships and neurosis quite well).

[Wizard777]

94. No, Would have to be totally freakin nutz

Courtney Love

[seventythree]

81. She was manic depressive,

pretty classic. Hers is a very sad tale with her kid trying to institutionalize her. People with bi-polar disorder are often highly intelligent and creative. How much her illness was contained before the loss of her child and husband, I don't know, but she was a woman who deserves our sympathy, imo.

[tishaLA]

90. When I was in High School

a friend and I started The Mary Todd Lincoln Fan Club because we thought someone as batty as ol' MTL deserved some respect. She's right up there with Courtney Love, Imelda Marcos, and Winnie Mandela.

[Quixote1818]

19. The Evil even more anoying version of Aunt B

Should have been called the "First Bitch" with an ugly mind.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

20. Barbara Bush has always looked like a bear, even when she was young.

And she had the nerve to say she didn't like thinking about the wars her hubby started because she didn't want to "disturb her beautiful mind" about it. Now, if pretty is as pretty does, Barbara Bush and her mind both look like a bear's ass.

[Jack_DeLeon]

21. Yeah this is going to piss people off, Hillary...

I dont think she was a very good first lady, she certainly didnt keep her Husband entertained.

If she had done a better job we wouldnt have had the whole Lewinsky scandel.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

24. The Lewinsky scandel? Surely you jest? A blow job as compared with

the total destruction of our surplus, economy, job base, democracy, civil liberties, social security, healthcare, and the murder of a hundred thousand for war profits? You are still thinking a blow job was important?

[Jack_DeLeon]

25. I dont think its important....

but apparently the media, and lots of other Americans did.

Also the First Lady is pretty much just a ceremonial figurehead, and I dont think Hillary was very good at that. She might be a good Senator, but I dont think she was a good First Lady.

I think Laura Bush is doing a good job as being First Lady, which in the figurehead role means she just sits there, does nothing, and looks pretty.

However I think President Bush himself could fill that role too, since he does alot of just sitting there and doing nothing.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

26. Barf! If you think Laura looks pretty you are too easy to please! Yuk!

Pretty is as pretty does, and that makes Laura UGLY all day and in caps. She is a horrible person, who by privilage escaped prosecution for running her former boyfriend over with her car and killing him, she is a horrible mother, and a horrible first lady, presiding beside an unintelligent, illegitimate, greed crazed, war profiteer. Any woman who partners with Shrub has to be totally without morals, and to prove it, she spawned The Drunken Shrub Twins, whom also prove the part about her being a horrible mother. You noticed that she didn't send the Drunken Shrub Twins off to serve their country in Iraq, right? So, I guess you could say, she is a horrible American. She is a horrible former librarian who performed only a couple of years of employment in her entire career and still didn't have the ovaries to stand up in public and tell her jerk of a husband that libraians are not agents of the "Men in Black". You are judged by the company you keep, and if Laura chooses to keep such bad company all the years of her life, you would do well to revise your measure of beauty. Any other questions?

[sandnsea]

27. Are you serious?

The First Lady can accomplish an enormous amount, look at Eleanor. Rosalind did alot of work on mental health, and even though "just say no" was stupid, Nancy really was trying to help on drug abuse. I even appreciated Barbara's reading campaign, at least it was something. Laura is the biggest bump on a log of a woman I've ever seen. To have that sort of world stage and do nothing with it is just sinful.

[Placebo]

31. EXACTLY.

Way to try and turn the role of spouse into a purely decorative & ceremonial position. :eyes:

WHATEVER!!!

[Placebo]

28. YOU CAN'T BE SERIOUS!!!

What is this, the 5th century? You're blaming Hillary for Bill's faults because she didn't perform her wifely duties? What a crock! Get real! How do you know that even if she did keep him "entertained" as best she could, that Bill still wouldn't have gone elsewhere? OMFG.

The RW has gotten you to totally buy into their lies!

Worse than Laura?!?! Worse than Babs?!?!?! Worse than Nancy?!?!?!?! :nuke:

[Is It Fascism Yet]

29. Right. What he said. N/T

[Is It Fascism Yet]

30. Tell the truth, Jack, are you a freeper plant sent by KKK Rove?

Because, you never know, and, I have to doubt anybody who thinks anything positive about anyone who would have any kind of a partnership with the Shrub. That's like a partnership with the devil. So, who exactly sent you?

[TorchTheWitch]

40. WHAT???

"I dont think she was a very good first lady, she certainly didnt keep her Husband entertained.

If she had done a better job we wouldnt have had the whole Lewinsky scandel."

What is this "blame the wife when the husband cheats" BULLSHIT???

I seriously cannot believe I just read this on a Democratic forum. :grr:

[CBGLuthier]

64. Wel to be honest

I can't believe there is even a thread like this on a democratic forum.

Which first lady was the biggest hag indeed. Ugly.

[LeftyMom]

51. Do you really think that's why Bill cheated?

Ultimately he's responsible for his actions. Shifting the blame to Hillary on the supposition that maybe she wasn't meeting his sexual needs seems a very antiquated idea.

He wasn't some horny teenager, after all. The man is more than old enough to understand the consequences of his actions. Unless the first lady had rigged his zipper to a remote control and dosed his morning coffee with viagra I fail to see how one could blame her for his infidelities.

[CBGLuthier]

63. You need to learn something about guys who screw around

I absolutely don't mean this as a Clinton slam but a man who likes to screw around can be getting it 3 times a night from their partner and still screw around. Do NOT blame Hilary Clinton for not being able to keep her husband "entertained".

[Book Lover]

73. *shaking head* So many RW lies....

A) If it weren't the Lewinsky scandal, the RW would have found something else to blow up the Clinton presidency. Their job was destruction and obfuscation, nothing else.

B) How about laying the responsibility where it belongs - on the unfaithful spouse?

C) The First Lady's job is to make the White House a sociable and pleasant place to visit; to occasionally represent the President in his role as head of state; and to do visible charity work. You will note these tasks have nothing to do with her relationship with her spouse.

[seventythree]

80. PUKE!!!!

"If she had done a better job we wouldnt have had the whole Lewinsky scandel." About as sexist a thing as I have heard.

[enki23]

32. Iä! Shub-Niggurath! The Black Goat of the Woods with a Thousand Young!

er... barbara bush.

[htuttle]

58. LOL! I call her the same thing!

[devilgrrl]

37. Barbara "Livia Soprano" Bush

[Spock_is_Skeptical]

39. It's Babs in a hag-slide!

[blue neen]

91. LOL!

That's perfect. A hag-slide.

She's meaner than a junkyard dog.

[texanwitch]

41. I have seen her in person

I have seen Babs in person, at early voting.

The picture above makes her look real good.:puke:

[Zenlitened]

42. Other: Dick Cheney, - n/t

[PlanetBev]

47. Ah, Zenliltened

I see you've displayed a picture of my hero, Carl Sagan. Why did this great thinker and humanitarian have to die at 63 while Dick Cheney is still walking around?

[Zenlitened]

53. Sad, isn't it? Dr. Sagan gave so much to the world in his lifetime...

... while cheney exists only to take take take.

I've learned so much from reading Sagan's works -- I wish he'd have lived for another 63 years, he had that much insight to share.

:cry:

[TorchTheWitch]

44. define "hag"

is this supposed to mean physical appearance, temperment, wardrobe... what?

[omega minimo]

48. Short for "haggis"

Big bloated smooth skin tight load of organ meat taut with blood and bits



:bounce::bounce:
....:wow:




Oh, the answer is Dan Quayle

[TorchTheWitch]

45. define "hag"

is this supposed to mean physical appearance, temperment, wardrobe... what?

[Spider Jerusalem]

46. Temperament...see also "shrew" (n/t)

[MsConduct]

50. Nancy was the biggest self promoter of the "Me Generation" it

was all about HER you know. ;-)

[BlueIris]

57. Sure was. All About Her...before and above ANYONE else.

Points for honesty, yet...shudder.

[MsConduct]

104. Shudder, for sure. What a waste of public funds those two were. n/t

[enid602]

52. babs

Nostradamus predicted that the next antichrist will be names Mabus. Mabus . . . Mabus(h) . . MaBush . . . Ma Bush!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[0007]

54. Thank you for letting me vote!

Of course who wouldn't vote for Barbara Bush?

[seventythree]

82. Me -- I voted for Wilson

Here she is -- in charge,literally for I forgot how long since her husband stroked out -- and women are being thrown in jail, beaten and literally hung by their wrists for PEACEFUL, silent, vigils outside the WH for the right to vote and this &%^$ does NOTHING!!!!

[lukasahero]

55. "Hag"?

:eyes:

Good grief.

[0007]

56. Barbara Bush is the biggest blister that ever ever lived in the WH

[info being]

59. Which First Lady takes the most Prozac?

[Stephanie]

61. Since this thread is back I have to say how incredibly offensive it is

Sexist, demeaning, uncalled for, not worthy of DU.

[omega minimo]

66. Why don't some DU'ers get that? What about "respect," DU Rules and

words/action integrated, or at least consistent, with Democratic values?

Why is sexist crap okay on DU?

[theboss]

62. Hag? I mean, Eleanor Roosevelt wasn't exactly a beauty queen

But this is a really ugly question.

[omega minimo]

72. Hence the haggis

[New Dealer]

69. From my knowledge of history, I have to say Mary Todd Lincoln

She was actually crazy. I don't think any of the others were/are.

[seventythree]

83. define crazy

[New Dealer]

84. She was commited to an insane asylum

Wikipedia has some minor information.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Todd_Lincoln

[seventythree]

103. I believe she was released

after an interesting trial -- her son put her away. I read about it, the trial, a very long time ago. She was bi-polar -- lavish spending is a trait.

[WI_DEM]

74. OPEN APOLOGY TO THOSE OFFENDED BY THIS THREAD

On the night I posted this, it was a heck of a bad night on DU with all kinds of Pope squabbles, so I thought I would post a "fun" thread--first on favorite first ladies and then later this one--on hags. When posting it I had in mind one "hag" in particular, Barbara Bush--I've never liked her since she said that Geraldine Ferraro was a bitch. But that is beyond the point, while most of the respondents did indeed pick Mrs. B. Bush--I can see the points of some of you offended by the wording--perhaps I should have said, "least favorite First lady."

So my apologies to those offended.

[Sapphire Blue]

85. When it comes to Barbara Bush, the term 'hag' is kind.

So many other terms would be much more fitting.

If it wasn't for her, we wouldn't have been cursed with 8 years of Junior.

[blue neen]

92. I'm not offended.

I took the term "hag" to mean someone who is really mean. I guess it is used more often to refer to women, but men can be hags, too.
Dick Cheney immediately comes to mind.

BTW, I voted for Barbara Bush of the "beautiful mind." She's meaner than a junkyard dog.

[CTLawGuy]

107. some people forget that

women are infallible deities, and any insinuation that implies a condition anything short of that is unpardonable.


Men on the other hand are people, and are therefore subject to flaws and criticism.


:eyes:

[omega minimo]

113. Now its clear how much tried to understand

Kinda doubt anyone would say:

"some people forget that (blacks) are infallible deities, and any insinuation that implies a condition anything short of that is unpardonable.
(Whites) on the other hand are people, and are therefore subject to flaws and criticism."

With or without the :sarcasm:

Bringing women up doesn't mean putting men down.

[CTLawGuy]

115. women are people

and people are imperfect.

Some women (people) are imperfect in that they are old, angry, and menacing, hence the term "hag". This does not refer to all women, just a certain subset deterimined by personality and age. Now while one can't control their age, one can change one's personality to become a "sweet old lady."

You have the right to be offended by "hag" and I feel sorry if you do.

But it is not sexist.

[omega minimo]

118. Words are powerful

Attempts here to cut through denial, defensiveness and righteousness (!) about the use of derogatory terms for females meet just the sort of resistance you express.

IMHO the goals of the Democratic Party and DU wil be supported by respect extended to all concerned, even if it stretches the comfort zones and vocabulary lists of some Democrats.

Good luck!
:bounce:

[KamaAina]

75. Babs all the way. "Black's not a color, stupid.", was her response

to a nine-year-old boy in Houston.

"What's your favorite color?", asked Babs.

The boy, who is African American, replied, his chest no doubt swelling with pride, 'Black!"

There it came: "Black's not a color, stupid!"

Evil and dumb. Gee, I hope she didn't have any children. Imagine what they'd be like... oh crikey.. :nuke:

[Wizard777]

76. Babs or Laura?

Laura has those deep furrows around her lips. They would be enough to scare the hell out Monica Lewinsky. See what'll happen if you keep doing that! But I think Babs takes the cake and a pork chop to hang around her neck.

[LTR]

77. George W. Bush

Well, he IS kind of a hag.

Guess I'd have to go with Babs. What a bitter old hag! Though my first thought was Nancy Reagan, but I am sympathetic to the loss of her husband, and I thought she handled herself with the utmost class, and is a big promoter of the stem cell cause, while still maintaining her privacy.

Since I missed the last poll, my favorite first lady would likely to be Hillary. I like women who take a stand and get tough. Women shouldn't take a backseat to anyone and be obediant robots (like the current one). I like her feistiness.

[demokatgurrl]

79. Can't we just get rid of that stupid "position"? n/t

[Swamp Rat]

86. I can't make up my mind!

:D

[Clark2008]

87. I looked up "hag" in the dictionary

and old Beautiful Mind Barb's picture was next to it.

[UTUSN]

88. Lynne CHEENEE. De Facto n/t

[CBHagman]

89. I don't like your doing this, WI_DEM.

And it's not just because of my surname. I don't like lining a bunch of women up to be called hags. It sounds so much like Freeperville or perhaps the nastier aspects of middle school.

[Wizard777]

93. Yes, but on the brighterside

We haven't insulted any of our allies or Mary Cheney. So give us a break. We're just living up to Bush's standards and expectations. His Momma must be so proud of him.

[omega minimo]

95. The "brighter side" for the Repugs

is Democrats alienating women voters at their peril.









:kick:

[Wizard777]

97. Nah

Women do the same thing except with Presidents. I still don't believe democrats are in as much trouble as the republicans say we are. What's wrong with this picture? The Republicans are violating international law, commiting war crimes, atrocities, and the democrats are in trouble. Well if not committing international crimes, war crimes, and atrocities is trouble. Then I like trouble. My God Bush is passing laws just to violate them and the democrats are in trouble?

[CTLawGuy]

108. a bunch of people on an internet

message boards talking about "hags" is going to sway an election? :shrug:

[omega minimo]

109. On an internet board with specific Democratic Party goals & Rules based on

R-E-S-P-E-C-T the frequent, casual and self-righteous use of bigoted language is counterproductive.

So what? Coming to a self-selected board with the above stated guidelines, it is a distraction, a shock and a pain in the ass to be reminded on a daily basis that bigotry against women permeates the culture so thoroughly, that people on a "respectful" Democratic board don't understand the impacts of sexism.

Especially when so many are hot on "reframing" and the power of language. Especially when Democrats need to energize and motivate grassroots voters-- alienating women is a mistake. Language and attitudes that demean and exclude women, girls and men who "get it," only serves to limit discussion and limit creative solutions.

Refraining from used of harmful language encourages more creative and openminded thinking-- a good exercise on a board with DU's stated goals.

"Hag" is a powerful, strong, shorthand derogatory word for old woman, associated with witches. "Witches" who were burned for 300 years were frequently traditional healers and community leaders (but that's another thread). "Hag" is far more powerfully charged than the OP's alternative "least favorite first lady."

Folks who want to try to "get it" need only relate sexist bigotry to racist bigotry. No difference between using racially offensive terms and derogatory sexist terms.

However, bigotry against women permeates the culture so thoroughly, that people on a "respectful" Democratic board don't understand the impacts of sexism.

Some women will say "I'm not offended." Percentage wise, Democrats can't afford the gamble on alienating women voters.

:evilgrin:

[CTLawGuy]

110. I'm sure 99.9% of women voters are not offended by "hag"

but thanks for your concern.

I also don't understand how "hag" is sexist.

it is not used to refer to women as a whole, it is used to refer to crotchety old women.

in the same way, "dick" does not refer to all men, just men who are inconsiderate of others' feelings.

[omega minimo]

111. Sure you're sure

When this comes up, male DU'ers reply, miss the point, and are dismissive and/or condescending.

It's not clear how much they even try to understand.

:kick:

[Book Lover]

112. Have you asked 99.9% of us?

I myself am not offended by the use of "hag" in the context of this thread, but for you to say, "Look, every woman but you is OK with this; trust me, I know," is condescending, whether you are male or female.

[CTLawGuy]

114. obviously I don't have studies in front of me

but I don't usually see a lot of outrage over it, when the word is used (actually this is the first time anyone's complained)

Just a hunch, but I think most people are ok with it.

[Dervill Crow]

120. If the word was witch or crone, I'd be upset with it.

I was a little surprised to see the question, but I cast my vote for Mrs. Bush the elder. She's just plain mean-spirited.

[omega minimo]

121. Historic "Hag" has been hijacked and hatefulized

Look, I made a word!

Hi Blue in Portland. Your point is well taken. Though the hijacking of the words "hag," "crone" and "witch" reflects the historic reversal and subversion of Woman's power.

To all: This is not only about the word "hag." This is about the regular use of language on DU that is derogatory to women.
BTW-- this thread is about women's power, isn't it? As close as any woman has ever come to the most powerful office on the planet.

When we peruse a page of threads and xx% of them contain sexist language in the OP thread title, what does that tell us? That it's okay here? That women should just deal with it? That if it's "just a hunch," as someone stated above, that "most people" are okay with it, then it's okay?

No. There are a lot of women at DU who DO object, but have given up trying to educate the perpetuators. Everything is okay if women shut up and disappear?

No. THAT IS THE PROBLEM for DU and the Democrats as I suggested previously. (My first answer to this thread attempted humor-- haggis is always funny). Language that alienates or excludes women limits the dialogue and limits the potential solutions available. Refraining from disrespectful habits of thought and speech has the potential to engender CREATIVE PROBLEM-SOLVING. DU Rules emphasize RESPECT.

Oh, yeah, and Dems need the votes.

I didn't come to DU for this to be my issue. I have posted on it several times, attempting humor, communication and/or consciousness raising because I KNOW there are plenty of women who are affected by this on DU and are withholding their protests. They think it is condoned here. They give up and/or go away.

When we scan a page of threads to select from, why do we have to scrape through a veneer of sexist muck to get to the subjects?

:evilgrin: :kick:

Greek root: hagios: holy
Anglo Saxon: haegtes: witch

So, at least since the marauding Anglo Saxon Hordes (talk about Framing!) holy women have been witches have been hatefulized to hag.

http://courses.lib.edu/engl/jbing/cp7.html

Wise Woman or Holy Woman = Hag
<“When Mary Daly defines the word hag, she stipulates that she is using the original meaning of "Holy Woman" or "wise woman" and rejecting the popular meaning of "witch" or "evil or frightening spirit" or nightmare, asking "'Evil' by whose definition? 'Frightening' to whom? Whose nightmare?">

Re: Bias in Definitions
<“Many people underestimate the potential of definition; for them definition means "look it up in the dictionary; they are unaware of the fact that there are many different approaches to definition, that definitions sometimes reflect the biases of the people who write them, and that serious matters of life and death sometimes depend on definition.”>

Stereotypes reinforced in "neutral" words
<“In discussing the stentences used to illustrate definitions in the 1966 version of the Random House Dictionary, Gershuny showed how stereotyped and negative the majority of sentences referring to women were.  A few examples (in which the often neutral word being defined is in parentheses).
    She gave us (overdone) steak.
    She never has the sense to hold her (tongue) at the right rime.
    The new bride was in (tears) over her unsucessful dinner.
    Her constant complaining just sticks in my (craw).
    Her greatest (trouble) is over-sensitivity.
    She burst into (tears) upon hearing of his death but it was only a grandstand play.
    She made his life a (hell) on earth.”>

[Dervill Crow]

122. Excellent points.

Wise Woman or Holy Woman = Hag
<“When Mary Daly defines the word hag, she stipulates that she is using the original meaning of "Holy Woman" or "wise woman" and rejecting the popular meaning of "witch" or "evil or frightening spirit" or nightmare, asking "'Evil' by whose definition? 'Frightening' to whom? Whose nightmare?">

Words are powerful. I tend to try to be like a duck and let things roll off of me, but we probably should be more aware of the way language is used to sublty disparage others, whether it's women or some other group.

Hi back atcha, and thanks for the food for thought!

[Liberal_Dog]

96. Definitely Barbara Bu$h

Somehow, she always gave me the creeps.

[lonestarnot]

99. Bug-eyed freak...

[DemonFighterLives]

98. I don't see how anyone could be offended

Babs is a hag in every sense of the word.
Her playing good granny to our nation is fraudulent.
Demon incarnate.

[last_texas_dem]

101. Barb, but

Laura Bush gets on my nerves more. Just 'cause she seems like a totally vapid Stepford wife and gets credit for being nonpartisan and a "proper" First Lady by Independents and even some Democrats, who should know better. Anyone who equates the Swift Boat Liars' attacks on Kerry with "lib'ruls" attacking Shrub's record as President is either mind-boggle-ingly stupid or blatantly partisan.

[Terran]

102. I used to think it was La Nancita, but

ever since I heard about the "Beautiful Mind" comment, it's Babs, hands down.

[superconnected]

105. I chose babara bush but it was tough, I mean nancy regan is on

that list. I really could't stand her.

[LWolf]

116. What, exactly, is a "haq" or "hag?"

A woman past youthful bloom?

A woman who doesn't fit common notions of physical attractiveness?

A woman who is a witch, a crone, or some other term used to denigrate and devalue women past child-bearing?

A woman who has too much personal power?

A woman you don't agree with?

[LostinVA]

117. I find this kinda offensive, actually

"Hag" is a nasty term specifically derogatory to women, and there is sometimes just a bit too much of that on DU. I'm sure I'll get flamed for posting this, I've seen it happen hundreds of times. But many people just don't seem to get it.

Couldn't a different word have been used?

[thebigidea]

119. what would you suggest? "Very nasty and disagreeable person of some kind?"