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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 01:50 PM
Original message
Just how bad is Canadian Health Care when Palm Beach resident,
Edited on Sat Mar-26-05 01:52 PM by Hoping4Change
and one-time conservative Thatcheresque Prime Minister of Canada checks in to a publicly-funded Montreal hospital to have thoracoscopic surgery to remove a benign lesion from his lung and receive treatment for Pancreatitis?


Mulroney certainly has the funds to seek healthcare in the US which <<sarcasm on>> as we all know is far superior to anything available in Canada. <<sarcasm off>>


Just how wealthy is Mulroney?


After leaving politics, Mr. Mulroney, now 65, returned to practicing law; he's a senior partner in corporate practice at Ogilvy Renault of Montreal. He also is a director of

- Archer Daniels Midland

- Barrick Gold

- Quebecor

- Trizec Properties

Mr. Mulroney, who has homes in Montreal and in Palm Beach, FL, readily acknowledges that he enjoys his celebrity during his frequent visits to the Unites States. Ever since he delivered a eulogy last year at Ronald Reagans funeral, I cant go anywhere without people coming up and saying something nice, he said.



Mulroney moved to this $1.7-million renovated house in Westmount, Quebec, after he left politics in 1993. He spent more than $1-million on renovations.

http://www.steviecameron.com/last/photos/brianshouse.ht...



In March, 1997, Mulroney bought a new house in Palm Beach, Florida, for $1.45-million (Can.).

http://www.steviecameron.com/last/photos/beachhouse.htm...


So whadda think? Just how bad is healthcare in Soviet Canuckistan when a Palm Beach millionaire checks in to one of its hospitals?



:freak:
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otohara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
1. nevermind
Edited on Sat Mar-26-05 02:13 PM by otohara
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oscar111 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Otohara, very unclear post : can you edit?
Edited on Sat Mar-26-05 02:10 PM by oscar111
most dont follow movies.

where is the hero living?

where is the original hosp?

what is your post's message? It seems to slam canada, but I cant figure it out for sure.

thanks.
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siliconefreak Donating Member (619 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. I watch an American "movie" every day
Homeless people all over the streets of San Francisco, begging for money and food.

Step into any emergency room in America, and you'll see another American "movie" - uninsured people who have no choice but to go to the emergency room when they're sick or injured.

We'll always hear about the Canadian stories of people who need specialized treatment and go to the U.S. for it, but what about the millions of Americans who need basic health care every day and can't get it? Which is the bigger problem? I think it's obvious.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. And where do you hear the stories about Canadians going to the
Edited on Sat Mar-26-05 02:14 PM by Hoping4Change
US for healthcare? Could it be you're hearing it from corporate media? The American news media that is just doing a stellar job reporting the facts on Terri, the Iraq war, 9-11. Is it from these sources that you're getting this infomation?
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siliconefreak Donating Member (619 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #6
21. of course
Yes, of course some of them are from the corporate media. My point (since I think you missed it) is that we have MUCH bigger problems with the U.S. healthcare system to worry about than the occasional Canadian who needs a special procedure and travels to the U.S. for it.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Ooops
My bad :spank:
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Good grief are you relying on a movie to form an opinion????
Brian Mulroney has the money to go to any hospital in the world. If Canadian healthcare is so terrible why did he check into a Canadian publically financed hospital? :wtf:
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oscar111 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Otohara: 24 nations outlive the americans
bottom line is that.

We were number 21 some years back, now bush has sunk us to number 25.

WHO ranks our healthcare system at no. 37, and the health of our population at no. 72. Seventy two is not a typo.

WORLD HEALTH REPORT is their document for a google phrase.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #4
12. Yep, the astroturf spreaders don't give up and the gullible
Murikans believe them. Ferchrissakes, if you want to know what the Canadian system is really like, go ask a Canadian. Just an ancedote here. A Canadian friend of mine was complaining to me about having to wait a couple of months for an elective surgery.

She sighed saying, "But we're stuck with this government health system not like you guys in the USA."

When I pointed out to her that she would have to pay for the surgery in the USA and how much it would cost, as well as the fact that the wait would be the same, all she could do was gasp.

"But surely you have a program for people who can't pay that?" she said.

I told her what the options were and that a middle class home owner like herself and her husband, with a retirement income and money in the bank, would have to pony up for increasingly expensive insurance or pay out of pocket until they were old enough to qualify for Medicare that only pays some of the medical expenses, not all.

See even the propagandists are going after the Canadians to destroy their system so they can sell them worthless health care.
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lastliberalintexas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Yep, the Canadians better watch their back
Insurance and pharma are doing everything they can to undermine their wonderful system. I think they're in for a little surprise though, since the average Canadian is far more informed than the average American. Fox News hasn't got a stranglehold on them- yet.
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Faux snooze has no effect here...
the few Canadians who may watch it do so with the same attitude as Survivor, faux reality show, lol.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. We have our share of the uninformed up here with absolutely
no idea of how good we have it. However thanks to bushco and the kerfuffle about Americans importing drugs from Canada, more Candaians are becoming aware of the situation in the US where the lack of government intervention in the marketplace hits regular people in the pocketbook.
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fasttense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #12
24. People are always saying you will have long waits with
Nationalized health care. Let me see. It took me three months to get to see my new Primary Care Manager for a check up. Hmmm, long waits, I guess may family and I are the only ones who have to wait.
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xpat Donating Member (295 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 03:37 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. In communist France
I get housecalls. When's the last time a doctor visited you at home in the US? My grandfather was doing housecalls in rural Illinois in the 50s.

Also, I know an American couple with a handicapped child. They were told by an American specialist to stay in France if they didn't want to go bankrupt.

Also, I know an American banker who decided not to move bank to the States for a promotion when he checked into health insurance for his family.

Also, I had an asthma attack and went to the emergency room for treatment. They kept me for three days. Cost, about $12.

Of course, you understand that this is just hearsay, and that really people are dying in hectombs because of national health care in France. ;-)
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-05 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. I think stories like these should be at the forefront of campaigns
to have universal healthcare in the US. When bankers and millionaires opt to be cared for in a country that has universal healthcare what can argument can be raised to rebut these testimonies.

BTW it must be rough to be living in a communist country especially in France especially in the Springtime. Gee some people have the roughest luck. :P
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. Well maybe its that you guys have quality wait time. You wait
rest assured that as you wait your healthcare is being directed by the invisible hand of the market-place which through supply and demand is establishing the cost of your healthcare.
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xpat Donating Member (295 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #28
34. What they never tell you about the invisible hand is
that it is giving you the finger. LOL!
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-29-05 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #34
37. That deserves to be a bumper sticker!!!! LOLOLOL
:bounce:
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. The movie is fiction, the setting was as it was to emphasize
the story, nothing more.

I hope you are not trying to say that a fictional movie should be taken as anything other than exactly that fictional entertainment?

I don't understand how this movie relates in any way to the OP.

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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. It's a shame
Only those with money have the privilege of living, just a damned shame. I don't know what the point of your post is either, but there's an Amerian story where people never see the inside of a hospital until they're dying. Nobody's bothered to make that movie.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. The point is that Canada has publically funded healthcare so
Mulroney didn't pay squat for his healthcare. Are you not aware that the US healthcare industry and bushco dis Canadian publically funded healthcare spreading lies about the quality of care Canadians receive? Are you not aware that as a Canadian I can call up any doctor for an appointment and pay nothing? A homeless person gets the same service that a former PM gets. That is the point.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #10
29. responding to otohara
Who has removed the post. I completely understand YOUR post, which was the same point as in my post.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-05 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. Ooops. All is clear to me now.
:spank: my bad
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #31
33. Oh come now
Self-flagellation over an oopsie post is a bit extreme, don't you think?

(Unless you secretly enjoy it, that's it, isn't it? }( )
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-29-05 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #33
38. Yikes. What have I done? You might be on to something.
Namely I don't deserve the :spank: but you do. :spank:

:P
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Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. I watched an American movie that saddened me.
Sandra Bulloch was driving a bus that couldn't drop below a certain speed, or else it would explode.

The movie...
The Bus that Couldn't Slow Down.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. LOL
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hnsez Donating Member (430 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #1
17. Canadian Health System - Really so? NO!
From IMDB about that movie http://imdb.com/title/tt0338135/board/nest/10145876

Canadian Health System - Really so?
by - dan888 (Sat Jul 17 2004 03:06:35 ) Ignore this User | Report Abuse


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I simply adored this movie, but was shocked to see its depiction of the Canadian health system. I am not familiar with the subject, as I am not North American, so I would be happy if a Canadian could explain this to me: Do hospitals in Montreal and elsewhere really look like post-earthquake homeless shelters? Is there really such a major problem with modern equipment for radiotherapy?
I read something about a heatlth-system nationalization gone wrong or something, and it's metnioned in the movie, could anyone please elaborate?
Re: Canadian Health System - Really so?
by - olrik666 (Sun Jul 18 2004 22:09:18 ) Ignore this User | Report Abuse


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

LOL!

It was a movie, trying to make a point. I live in Montreal, and hospitals are modern and very well equiped. Personnel (doctors and nurses) are quite competent and devoted.

The biggest problem we have is the wait in the emergency ward. Triage is very quick, but if your emergency does not warrant immediate treatment (like you took a bullet in the head and you're not dead yet), you can wait a couple of hours. Also, to get some tests done can be long.

Oh, yeah, the point of the movie is that getting really sick (like having cancer) and having to depend on others, losing dignity and independance is a shitty situation, and no matter what treatment you get, especially if you're a baby boomer suddenly confronted to your mortality, *everything* is lousy.

Also, the heroine bit in the film is stupid. Doctors here have no problem giving you as much morphine as you need to stop the pain.

BTW, I'm not in the medical profession, and I write from observations and descriptions given by friends and family.

I hope this helps.
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lastliberalintexas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
11. Oh, the Canadian system sucks!
I know a fairly well off upper middle class person who lives in Texas but has retained Canadian citizenship, travels to Canada 5 or 6 times a year for treatment and meds for a non-fatal recurring illness. This person is *forced* to go to that hellhole of a system because he can't get the proper treatment here. Because, you know, Houston doesn't have any world class hospitals or anything. It really has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that those Houston hospitals would charge him an arm and leg for each visit. Really.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. You guys down in Texas may lack healthcare but you don't lack
wit. I love your subject line because at first read it had me steaming. Then the "oh I get it" response kicked in. You and Molly Ivins seem to have the same sense of humour and I'm lovin it. :toast:
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lastliberalintexas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. Well, there's a saying in Tennessee
Edited on Sat Mar-26-05 03:10 PM by lastliberalintexas
I know we have it in Texas. Maybe y'all of the frozen tundra have also heard it- "Tis better to laugh than cry."


We Texans learned long ago that we'd kill ourselves if we didn't learn to laugh at the world. But I would never dare to compare my paltry attempts at humor to the wit of Molly Ivins (or Ann Richards for that matter). I'm just sarcastic and caustic by nature, and every now and then it may come across as funny! :)


and on edit- I really hate running into you Canucks on this board. I'm so incredibly jealous of the country in which you live! Can you do us a favor and please, please arrange an invasion of our country? I'd really love to become a citizen of one of those oh so hated socialist countries like they have in Old Europe. Pretty please? :)
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:28 PM
Response to Original message
15. Funny thing.....
Most Canadian's I talk to are really proud of their healthcare system and support it. Wish I could say the same for the system in place here.
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-27-05 07:29 PM
Response to Reply #15
32. That is so true. You know I've never heard "I love HMO's"
:freak:
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:32 PM
Response to Original message
18. I think 45 million Americans with no health care would love your
system, despite the flaws. You heard the story about the guy with a 3" long nail in his head and the doc said take two aspirin?
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Hoping4Change Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. LOL No I didn't hear that story. It may be cruel to laugh but you
Edited on Sat Mar-26-05 02:41 PM by Hoping4Change
have me snorting my coffee with your line about the 2 aspirins.
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-26-05 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #20
26. I am glad someone else snorts their drinks.
The MD did tell this to the man after the man saw the MD as he was suddenly having bad headaches. Finally the head pain got so bad he went to his wife's employer, a dentist, thinking it might be dental related. The dentist took X-rays and whoa, nelly. The nail was vertically in the front of his head.It happened last year.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #26
35. Only 1 nail? Check out this poor guy...
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Mich Otter Donating Member (887 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-28-05 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
36. Canadian Health Care
I believe Canadians vote in higher percentages than Americans do and if their health care system is so bad, Why aren't they voting for a copy of our system?
Canadians are obviously concerned with seeing that all Canadians are insured. Sure, they keep trying to fix parts of their system but, aren't we also trying to improve every part of our government?
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