Former Green Beret (Bo Gritz) intends to "arrest" M.Schiavo and judge

[kskiska]

Former Green Beret colonel James "Bo" Gritz, a well-known militia leader, says he is in Pinellas County to serve Michael Schiavo and Judge George Greer with "citizens arrest warrants."

In the 1980s, Gritz, now 66, staged several unsuccessful commando-style missions into Laos to rescue U.S. prisoners of war. In 1992 he persuaded survivalist Randy Weaver to abandon Ruby Ridge after a showdown with federal authorities.

According to a news release on the American Voice newspaper Web site, Gritz and his wife, who live in Nevada, arrived in Pinellas on Wednesday. The Web site says the "arrest warrant" provides another option to prevent the removal of Terri Schiavo's feeding tube. It was unclear if Gritz intends to try to physically arrest Greer or Michael Schiavo.

Mac McMullen, a spokesman with the Sheriff's Office, which is in charge of courthouse security, said "appropriate action" has been taken to protect Greer.

more (scroll down)…
http://www.sptimes.com/2005/03/18/Tampabay/Postcards_offend_some.shtml

[seabeyond]

1. when is all this suppose to happen

with the feeding tubes. just sick the way this is going on for days and days, all the crazies coming out of woodwork. like festering to explode

[gratuitous]

2. Alternate headline

"Nutjob publicity whore seeks spotlight; SP Times obliges"

[Dr.Phool]

4. The SP Times has really gone downhill

over the last year since they changed editors.

I canceled my subscription.

[Dr.Phool]

3. I hope Michael Shiavo kicks his ass

All the way back to Nevada.

[liberal N proud]

5. I received an email from a Church member yesterday

wanting help to save Terri Schiavo.
I replied with a simple message.

"Is this in God's will?"

[UTUSN]

6. These Effing, Repulsive Wingnut Cockroaches n/t

[AzDar]

7. Didn't that guy (Gritz) commit SUICIDE in the 90's??? (seriously!) n/t

On edit: Guess not since he has a website (upon searching)..Must've been some other self-righteous "patriot"...they all look alike to me!!

[ohio_liberal]

18. I saw it

Did you notice he calls Terri Schiavo "paralized" and "not in a coma". Ok, so we all know she's not in a coma. She's PVS. This guy is a nutjob, big time.

[johncoby2]

8. Gritz will be the first to fill his pants when challenged.

He is a nut.

[Zuni]

9. this guy should be pre-emptively arrested

this guy is a violent crime waiting to happen

[Jack Rabbit]

10. If he's going to make a show for the network news . . .

If he's going to make a show for the network news, then he should take on real criminals like Bush and Rumsfeld.

[sui generis]

11. for the record, I think it's wrong to remove her feeding tube

if it's going to take her two weeks to die.

I'm not a rightwing republican cockroach.

[Walt Starr]

12. She has no brain

She's dead, Jim.

I once removed the brain of a frog while in a biology class. The heart beat on its own for a week and a half with no sustenance. The frog was dead. The corpse kept kicking.

[sui generis]

45. fine, let's remove her brain along with the feeding tube

Again - it's not the act of killing her, it's the duration that bothers me.

[Walt Starr]

52. Why? She's incapable of feeling pain. She's incapable of feeling hunger

she's incapable of felling anything. She's an animated corpse. Why would removing a feeding tube from an animated corpse bother anybody? It's done all the time!

It's pretty ghoulish to get all in uproar over removing feeding tubes from animated corpses when it occurs every day!

[sui generis]

55. I am neither ghoulish nor in an uproar

quite frankly I just distrust the motives of both sides in this argument, ESPECIALLY, when as a veteran DU poster I can't have an opinion that differs from the übermind here.

I have stated my case. I haven't called anyone names. I haven't told them they were stupid or ghoulish or hysterical. I am clearly not the one who is in an uproar, judging from the dozens of new posts spinning by on the Latest.

My comments weren't on the Schiavo case so much as on appropriate forms of euthanasia. I'm not whining, I'm just saying don't attack me for having my views, it's just not very mature.

[sui generis]

56. also, on that argument

if it were legal to stone her to death rather than remove her feeding tube and it was okay just because she wouldn't feel anything anyway, and removing feeding tubes and giving a lethal dose of morphine were both illegal, it would be equally disturbing to me to see everyone here happy to support having her stoned to death rather than administer a lethal dose of morphine.

[mondo joe]

13. So no right to die?

People have to live on life support for decades because otherwise it would take a few weeks to die a natural death?

[sui generis]

27. no right to euthanize

let's call it what it is.

Anyway, sticking by my comments - if "mercy" is the objective, then please let's give her an overdose of happy juice instead of letting her linger on for weeks.

I am pro euthanasia. I am anti slow euthanasia.

[mondo joe]

34. Allowing someone to die naturally is not euthenization

Which is actually just what you;ve called for.

Allowing someone to pass away when their body can no longer function is not euthenasia.

[Bouncy Ball]

16. She doesn't have the part of her brain

that can sense pain or discomfort at all. She is not going to suffer. And they will be giving her a sedative drip, too, just in case.

It's not going to take her two weeks to die. She will die of dehydration before that.

[sui generis]

24. so why don't we just give her a shot and be done with it?

that's the problem I have. This passive bullshit is despiccable. The "just in case" scenario is absurd. If there is any doubt at all, we shouldn't be doing it.

I believe she is a vegetable. I also believe it would be appropriate to put her down. I do not believe the method of choice is the right choice.

[ohio_liberal]

25. Because unfortunately

giving her a shot and being done with it is illegal.

[sui generis]

29. then we're not ready to do this.

"unfortunately" we're not ready. Sorry guys, I am not in lockstep with you on this.

[ohio_liberal]

32. What do you think happened 30 years ago

before this became such a huge issue? People died peacefully, like Terri Schiavo will, without the controversy.

[sui generis]

37. so we've had 30 years to pull our heads out of our asses?

and we're still pulling feeding tubes instead of dealing with this like adults.

Maybe a little controversy is just what we need.

[mondo joe]

33. And yet life support is removed - or never started - every day.

We ARE ready to allow people to die peaceful natural deaths, even without euthenizing them.

[sui generis]

36. removing ventilation and cardiac stimulation results in death

nearly immediately. Let's not confuse the two.

[mondo joe]

39. So your issue is with the duration?

It is still life support.

[ohio_liberal]

41. But surgically implanted feeding tubes and ventilators

are both considered extraordinary measures by law in Florida.

[sui generis]

43. gents, we disagree - just stating my opinion. /nt

[mondo joe]

46. Your opinion (appears to be) that this option is one of suffering

over several weeks.

But accounts of the process indicate that it is NOT one of suffering.

A DU member posted just yesterday about his mother (I believe) who had feeding tubes removed and what a peaceful and natural sequence of events followed.

[sui generis]

49. ah mondo - the only people suffering are the survivors

and I am not one of them. My house is in order and won't take a visit to court to determine my wishes (which are for a speedy end).

I personally don't care how people die - the end result is the same. I just find it distasteful that we so happily accept death by starvation (no pain) over death by morphine (no pain). The same peaceful and natural sequence of events will follow, regardless.

I just dislike this particular form of passive euthanasia, and I don't think I'm being any more or less rational than people who think it's okay.

[mondo joe]

50. Point of clarification please - if it's not the perceived suffering

resulting from removal of a feeding tube, what is your issue with it?

You've suggested elsewhere that you find it different from removal of other forms of life support.

[sui generis]

51. here's my core issue with it

if I knew that someone was going to starve my brain dead child to death, I'm not sure I could be responsible for what I would do to change that situation.

I can't make any clearer that I think we are immature in our idea that removal of a feeding tube and passive death over several days or weeks is more benign than administering a lethal dose and having it happen immediately.

I know it doesn't impact the brain dead one way or another. It impacts the living. Personally, and I have said this before, I could care less if you donked her in the head with an iron skillet, but it just disturbs me that she would have to languish for days or weeks because we weren't mature enough to say let's not be passive about this.

You will not at any rate get me to see your light on this topic, whatever it is; I fundamentally disagree with any passive action that results in an protracted death, period, and I'm not asking you to agree with me or trying to change your mind either.

[mondo joe]

60. Okay, so it's the duration. And I'm glad to disagree, but I must

point out that she will be dying a natural death that by most accounts is peaceful. And IF there are signs of discomfort morphine can be administered.

I'm not clear on why that's so much more horrible in your eyes than getting a lethal injection, or dying because a respirator is removed.

But we don't need to agree.

[ohio_liberal]

47. I'm ok with agreeing to disagree

I think it's important though for people to understand that this happens every single day in end-stage Alzheimer dementia patients and it is not considered cruel or inhumane.

[mondo joe]

26. Because that's not an option right now

But you might also look into what cases like this in which a feeding tube is removed are LIKE.

The patient doesn't lie there thrashing and screaming. It's actually quite peaceful.

[sui generis]

35. I already have "looked into" this

and that is precisely why I can say I think that starving someone to death is wrong. The argument is ridiculous anyway -- she also won't feel a thing if you hit her over the head with a frying pan right now. She won't feel a thing if we slowly press her to death with the feeding tube attached right now.

My personal belief is that faster is better. She's going to die, this week or five years from now, and I personally don't care. What I care about is that we think that it's okay to be passive about it and remove a feeding tube rather than address the situation at hand in a practical way, not just for her case but for future cases like it.

Just because it's illegal to give her morphine but legal to starve her to death doesn't make it more desirable in my mind to starve her to death. That's my objection.

[mondo joe]

38. Well, I'm sorry you're opposed to removal of life support

Especially since I believe in the right of self determination.

I've requested to not be kept alive on life support in such a situation - I don't know why it's anyone else's business to oppose such choices.

[sui generis]

42. you misunderstand me

I believe in self determination too. I also believe that if she was old enough to take out a life insurance plan she was old enough to put her end of life care in writing.

I'm not opposed to removal of life support - provided it ends in death rather quickly. I thought I'd made it clear I am for humane end of life treatment. In my mind, allowing someone to starve to death over a week or two is not humane, whether they can feel it or not.

And as long as there is a question about her wishes, it IS someone else's business. We're able to determine that we want to be organ donors on our driver's licenses, yet we can't make a decision about what to do with our vegetative bodies?

[mondo joe]

44. But she expressed her wishes and there were witnesses

The court finds no substantive questions about her wishes.

Her chosen legal guardian does not.

I don't see any reason to penalize her for being young enough to not have signed a living will.

[Bouncy Ball]

28. Oh I agree.

If it were up to me, they'd simply give her an overdose of morphine. It's fast, it's peaceful, it's more humane.

But apparently also illegal.

:shrug:

Go figure.

[Lerkfish]

48. my two cents are that we should not continue to make it illegal

to allow doctors to humanely end a life that should be ended. I realize the sticking point in that sentence is "should be", and that would have to argued case by case, but the OPTION to humanely pull a Kevorkian SHOULD be there, for those cases so deemed

IMHO.

This is separate from the shiavo case. I just think there should be the option in extreme cases to let people die with dignity if they so choose. Having sad deathbedside with too many close relatives who suffered greatly and lingeringly, who begged to die, I have a personal reason for stating this.

[Walt Starr]

14. The religiously insane are a problem worldwide

The religiously insane in the middle east make it seem okay to blow yourself up for Allah.

These religiously insane people want to keep a corpse kicking.

There's a word for these people. Necrophiles!

[LiberallyInclined]

59. religiously insane is redundant.

[KharmaTrain]

15. A Circus Macabre

I'm seeing this hack lawyer saying this poor lady is "disabled". Sheesh...how trivial, how inhuman.

Even here on DU there are so many who don't have a clue to what this lady's condition is and are attempting to play god in their own way. Let the games begin.

[northzax]

22. which is precisely why

I believe the people who are the closest to the situation, the ones with the best information, her doctors, and the judges who have actually heard the case argued.

[KharmaTrain]

23. Reasonable People Agree

Now just how many of those are there in this country anymore.

This isn't being generated by the courts, it's being manipulated by the politicians.

[datasuspect]

17. with all this judge killing

he comes out to "arrest" a judge. what a fucking idiot.

i bet they collect him as soon as possible.

[Bouncy Ball]

19. WTF??????

Jeez LOUISE, just let her GO already. Haven't they kept her corpse alive long enough?

It's like some kind of sick experiment in a 50s horror flick to keep someone's body alive when 80% of their brain is gone and all they can do are involuntary things.

But, heck, we've got a few people right here on DU who seem to think she can just re-grow her brain.

Yeah, and amputees can just re-grow their limbs, too. :eyes:

I really feel for Michael Schiavo. More and more all the time. All he wants to do is set his wife free, and she isn't even THERE anymore, hasn't been in a long time and she's not coming back, and he's had to go through all this hell meanwhile.

The tube removal is scheduled for 1 pm eastern time today.

I hope it goes smoothly.

[ohio_liberal]

20. I feel for him too

What a remarkable man to keep fighting for all these years.

[snippy]

21. Bush and the republican party have created a lot of danger for judges.

The demonizing of judges by Bush and the republican party is going to have an effect on some people who are dangerously unbalanced such as Tim McVeigh, Ann Coulter, and Tom DeLay. Democrats should introduce some bills in Congress to increase the security for judges and their families to protect against the increased risks created by the groups who are demonizing judges.

[FSogol]

31. You made my day by

mentioning nutjobs: McVeigh, Coulter, and Delay together. Thanks. :-)

[snippy]

40. Glad to be of service. Welcome to DU. n/t

[Malva Zebrina]

30. Here is a history of this guy, Gritz

from Orcinus--contains a lot of information about his sleazy background

http://www.dneiwert.blogspot.com/

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

53. Bo Gritz? It looks like she's starting to attract flies.

Last I heard of this moran he was peddling land to the camouflage dungaree types in Idaho or somewhere to set up fortifications for the Y2K Bug monster.

[ironflange]

54. He ran for President in 1992

I remember checking out his booth at the county fair in Helena, Montana. I wish I had kept the brochure as a souvenir, it was pretty crazy. His solution to Poppy's big deficit: print lots and lots more money!

[Cleita]

57. Is that jackass still running around loose?

He should be in jail for breaking oh so many laws. I see Idaho finally got rid of him at least.

[maveric]

58. Gritz is a well-known supporter of white supremecists and neo-nazi

organizations. And a fucking nut to boot!

[ohio_liberal]

61. I'm guessing old Bo

didn't have much success today. What an asshat.