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No Conspiracy Theory. Its a Fact: Bush is a NAZI

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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 04:48 PM
Original message
Conspiracies exist. Take a look at the family of George Walker Bush. Their treachery turns up everywhere from arming Hitler through the Eisenhower (Nixon)-CIA backed Bay of Pigs invasion to the assassination of President John F. Kennedy through the escalation of Vietnam and crookedly on through to the present outrage, the pretzeldunce.

Here are facts, not theory, part of the historical record -- things we can see with our own eyes and feel with our own hands:

Business as Usual, Redemption

The American Axis: Henry Ford, Charles Lindbergh, and the Rise of the Third Reich


If Edsel Ford violated federal laws by continuing to do business with the Nazis after Pearl Harbor, he was not alone. In a small box housed among the U.S. National Archives Trading With the Enemy files sits an explosive series of documents implicating another prominent American family in this serious crime. On October 20, 1942, ten months after the United States entered the Second World War, the U.S. Alien Property Custodian, Leo T Crowley, issued Vesting Order 248 under the Trading With the Enemy Act, seizing all assets of the Union Banking Corporation of New York, which was being operated as a front for "enemy nationals." According to a federal government investigation, Union Banking was not a bank at all, but a cloak operation, laundering money for Germany's powerful Thyssen family. The Thyssens were instrumental in financing Hitler's rise to power and had supplied the Nazi regime with much of the steel it needed to prosecute the war.

One of the partners of the Union Banking Corporation, the man who oversaw all investments on behalf of the Nazi-affiliated owners, happened to be Prescott Bush, grandfather of the American president George W Bush. Through the connections of his father-in-law, Bert Walker (George W's maternal great-grandfather), who has been described by a U.S. Justice Department investigator as "one of Hitler's most powerful financial supporters in the United States. Prescott Bush specialized in managing the investments for a number of German companies, many with extensive Nazi ties. These included the North American operations of another Nazi front, the Hamburg-Amerika Line, which was directly linked to a network set up by IG Farben to smuggle agents, money and propaganda for Germany.' According to a 1934 Congressional investigation, the Hamburg-Amerika line "subsidized a wide range of pro-Nazi propaganda efforts both in Germany and the United States." Both Walker and Bush were directors of a holding company, the Harriman Fifteen Corporation, that directly financed the line.

Shortly before the government seized the assets of the Union Banking Corporation, in fact, it had also seized American-held assets of the Hamburg-Amerika Line under the Trading With the Enemy Act. A few weeks after the government seized Bush's shares in Union Banking, it seized the assets of three other Nazi front companies whose investments were handled by Bush-the Holland-American Trading Corporation, the Seamless Steel Equipment Corporation, and the Silesian-American Corporation. The paper trail indicated that the bulk of Prescott Bush's financial empire was being operated on behalf of Nazi Germany.

According to former United States Justice Department Nazi war crimes investigator John Loftus, who has investigated the Bush family's considerable ties to the Third Reich, Prescott Bush's investment prowess helped make millions of dollars for various Nazi-front holding companies, and he was well paid for his efforts. "The Bush family fortune that helped put two members of the family in the White House can be traced directly to the Third Reich," says Loftus, who is currently president of the Florida Holocaust museum.

In his own investigation, Loftus discovered a disturbing trail connecting the Bush family's money laundering efforts to the Thyssens and their role in building up the Nazi war machine. He believes these connections deserve more scrutiny: "There are six million skeletons in the Thyssen family closet, and a myriad of criminal and historical questions to be answered about the Bush family's complicity."



Business as Usual,

excerpted from the book

The American Axis
Henry Ford, Charles Lindbergh, and the Rise of the Third Reich

by Max Wallace
St. Martin's Griffin, 2003, paper
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. Who cares about granpappy. Bush uses the tools of sociopath - he
patterns like Hitler. Nuff said. No conspiracy to it whatsoever.

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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. I care. Too few know that the crazy monkey descends from NAZI scum.
George Walker Bush is a much, much lower turd than whale dung. Here's a bit more solid proof for those who wonder how Smirko got to be the most powerful coke-whore on the planet:

CIA, Nazis & the Republican Party

A Fresh Look

by Carla Binion

Investigative reporter Christopher Simpson says in BLOWBACK that after World War II, Nazi migrs were given CIA subsidies to build a far-right-wing power base in the U.S. These Nazis assumed prominent positions in the Republican Party's "ethnic outreach committees." Simpson documents the fact that these Nazis did not come to America as individuals but as part of organized groups with fascist political agendas.

The Nazi agenda did not die along with Adolf Hitler. It moved toAmerica (or a part of it did) and joined the far right of the Republican Party. Simpson shows how the State Department and the CIA put high-ranking Nazis on the intelligence payroll "for their expertise in propaganda and psychological warfare," among other purposes...

Journalist Russ Bellant (OLD NAZIS, THE NEW RIGHT, AND THE REPUBLICAN PARTY) shows that Laszlo Pasztor, a convicted Nazi war collaborator, built the Republican migr network. Pasztor, who served as adviser to Republican Paul Weyrich, belonged to the Hungarian Arrow Cross, a group that helped liquidate Hungary's Jews. Pasztor was founding chairman of the Republican Heritage Groups Council. Two months before the November 1988 presidential election, a small newspaper, Washington Jewish Week, disclosed that a coalition for the Bush campaign included a number of outspoken Nazis and anti-Semites. The article prompted six leaders of Bush's coalition to resign.

According to Russ Bellant, Nazi collaborators involved in the Republican Party included:

* Radi Slavoff, GOP Heritage Council's executive director, and head of "Bulgarians for Bush." Slavoff was a member of a Bulgarian fascist group, and he put together an event in Washington honoring Holocaust denier, Austin App.

* Florian Galdau, director of GOP outreach efforts among Romanians, and head of "Romanians for Bush." Galdau was once an Iron Guard recruiter, and he defended convicted Nazi war criminal Valerian Trifa.

* Nicholas Nazarenko, leader of a Cossack GOP ethnic unit. Nazarenko was an ex-Waffen SS officer.

* Method Balco, GOP activist. Balco organized yearly memorials for a Nazi puppet regime.

* Walter Melianovich, head of the GOP's Byelorussian unit. Melianovich worked closely with many Nazi groups.

* Bohdan Fedorak, leader of "Ukrainians for Bush." Fedorak headed a Nazi group involved in anti-Jewish wartime pogroms.

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DuaneBidoux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #5
19. You have to be careful however not to hold the son accountable for the
sins of the father. If you look too carefully you'll find some rather questionable parentage from all sides of the political spectrum. I think Shrub has earned his own place in the history of fascism, and I'm not willing to give his family any credit whatsoever. It is his lone achievement.
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Eloriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #19
57. But it's more than a little silly to disconnect him from an OBVIOUS
lineage of fascists and Nazi sympathizers, including his own father. Why WOULD you want to divorce him from the historical reality? Serves no purpose.
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DuaneBidoux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #57
59. It gives him an excuse....
It's like "well I come from a broken home where my father beat me and my mom was an alcoholic." Big shit. Grow up. He has no excuse.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 06:21 AM
Response to Reply #19
77. You give the *dauphin
MUCH too much credit. LOL!
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charles_nys Donating Member (48 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #1
71. Bush suffers from malignant egophrenia as did Hitler ...see my post .....
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BuyingThyme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
2. You are correct.
Don't let the don't-say-Nazi crowd keep you from spreading the truth.

You are one among many, yet far too few.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 06:01 AM
Response to Reply #2
33. The Nazification of America - Phase IV
The folks at Hermes-Press have pegged these turds for what they are. Here's a summary of their excellent essay:

Nazification of America

Phase I: Seizure of Power
Hitler appointed chancellor.
Bush appointed president.

Phase II: An Atrocity to Subdue the People
Reichstag (parliament) fire.
The 9-11 terrorist attacks.

Phase III: The Leader Destroys Elections and Appoints Himself Dictator.
The Enabling Act.
The Homeland Security Act.

Phase IV: Criminal Cabal Steals 2004 Election and sets up system to steal all future elections.

SOURCE w/explanatory text and links:

PS: We can ask "Where are the Democrats?" all day long. It may not matter. The regime is working to have them neutralized - and not just at the ballot box.

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LSparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:01 PM
Response to Original message
3. The connection to Bay of Pigs and JFK
assassination is absolutely chilling. There's talk that they may have also been involved in JFK Jr.'s plane crash. Pathological hatred of Kennedys runs in that family and this isn't the first time a prominent Dem died in a small plane mishap ...
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. The late Mae Brussell pegged the turds...
...Would that she had lived to see today where we have a more complete picture.

The Nazi Connection to the John F. Kennedy Assassination

Evidence of link between Nazis still in operation after World War II to the still unsolved murder of John F. Kennedy

by Mae Brussell

1940-1945: The Nazi Connection to Dallas:
General Reinhard Gehlen

The sparrow-faced man in the battle uniform of an American general clambered down the steps of the U.S. Army transport plane upon its arrival at Washington National Airport. It was August 24, 1945, two weeks after the surrender of Japan, three months after the German capitulation. The general was hustled into a van with no windows and whisked to Fort Hunt outside the capital. There he was attended by white-jacketed orderlies and, the next morning, fitted with a dark-grey business suit from one of Washington's swankiest men's stores. General Reinhard Gehlen was ready to cut a deal.

Reinhard Gehlen had been, up until the recent capitulation, Adolph Hitler's chief intelligence officer against the Soviet Union. His American captors had decked him out in one of their uniforms to deceive the Russians, who were hunting him as a war criminal. Now U.S. intelligence was going to deploy Gehlen and his network of spies against the Russians. The Cold War was on.

This is a story of how key nazis, even as the Wehrmacht was still on the offensive, anticipated military disaster and laid plans to transplant nazism, intact but disguised, in havens in the West. It is the story of how honorable men, and some not so honorable, were so blinded by the Red menace that they fell into lockstep with nazi designs. It is the story of the Odd Couple Plus One: the mob, the CIA and fanatical exiles, each with its own reason for gunning for Kennedy. It is a story that climaxes in Dallas on November 22, 1963 when John Kennedy was struck down. And it is a story with an aftermath -- America's slide to the brink of fascism. As William L. Shirer, author of The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, put it in speaking of the excesses of the Nixon administration, "We could become the first country to go fascist through free elections."

Even Robert Ludlum would have been hard put to invent a more improbable espionage yam. In the eyes of the CIA Reinhard Gehlen was an "asset" of staggering potential. He was a professional spymaster, violently anti-Communist and, best of all, the controller of a vast underground network still in place inside Russian frontiers. His checkered past mattered not. "He's on our side and that's all that matters," chuckled Allen Dulles, a U.S. intelligence officer during the war who later headed the CIA. "Besides, one need not ask a Gehlen to one's club."

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Sugarbleus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 02:42 AM
Response to Reply #11
22. Wow, haven't heard any one mention Mae Brussell for
YEARS. The saga goes one; was she murdered you think?
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 06:11 AM
Response to Reply #22
34. Mae died of a broken heart. Her daughter was a "hit and run" victim.
Mae Brussell succumbed to cancer, but felt her daughter's death (under suspicious circumstances) had to do with her own work investigating the various treasons of the ruling class. From the web site devoted to her work:

Occasionally Mae's research produced predictions with stunning accuracy:

*On May 28, 1968 Mae confronted Rose Kennedy at the Monterey Peninsula Airport and handed her what she said was a poem, but actually a note telling her Robert Kennedy would soon be assassinated. A week later Senator Kennedy was shot to death at The Ambassador Hotel in Los Angeles.

*A month before Ted Kennedy's Chappaquiddick incident Mae warned his office of "the nest of rattlesnakes" that surrounded him and his upcoming bid for the White House.

*Two weeks before the SLA kidnapped Patty Hearst, she told a Syracuse University audience that the SLA shooting of black school superintendent Marcus Foster was just the beginning of what would be terror and psychological sabotage in the same vein Germany had been subjected to in the 1930s.

*In August 1977 (broadcast #282) Mae discussed Jim Jones and the Peoples Temple move to Guyana. She speculated that this might be a training camp for assassination teams -- this was one full year before 913 members of the church were massacred.

*But Mae's most shocking crystal ball research was probably her March 29, 1981 evening broadcast when she spent much of the hour listing the reasons she believed the Reagan White House were at war with one another and asked who will kill off their team members first. The following morning President Reagan was shot in Washington D.C.

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Sugarbleus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #34
60. Thank you so much .....
I remembered there was something being called suspicious surrounding Mae....

OMG, I remember the SLA/Patty Hearst era so well--especially out here in Cali. That was a time almost MORE freaky than now, in terms of propoganda, survellience, and the resistance movement. :scared:

Ahh, that was a nice PARANOID trip down memory lane for me. LOL

(thanks for her weblink too)
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mopaul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
4. the N word is apt when applied to certain actions by bush & Hitler
and the N word fits w like a glove. boast of a master race. make your 'enemies' seem subhuman, blame a terror attack on them, round them up without trials or lawyers or family visits, invade nations that did not attack us and kill over 100,000 people, (bush in Iraq),
use the military for conquest, glorify war, ignore all other nations, rob the treasury, sell influence to giant corporations, finance fascism, promote propaganda in all the media, don't get me started
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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. What do Hemp and Hitler have in common?
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 05:15 PM by manna
this article says it all. It is a must read

Ties it all together


Du Pont's anti-Semitism "matched that of Hitler" and, in 1933, the Du Ponts "began financing native fascist groups in America . . ." one of which Higham identifies as the American Liberty League: "a Nazi organization whipping up hatred of blacks and Jews," and the "love of Hitler.

"Financed . . . to the tune of $500,000 the first year, the Liberty League had a lavish thirty-one-room office in New York, branches in twenty-six colleges, and fifteen subsidiary organizations nationwide that distributed fifty million copies of its Nazi pamphlets. . . .
"The Du Ponts' fascistic behavior was seen in 1936, when Irenee du Pont used General Motors money to finance the notorious Black Legion. This terrorist organization had as its purpose the prevention of automobile workers from unionizing. The members wore hoods and black robes, with skulls and crossbones. They fire-bombed union meetings, murdered union organizers, often by beating them to death, and dedicated their lives to destroying Jews and communists. They linked to the Ku Klux Klan. . . . It was brought out that at least fifty people, many of them blacks, had been butchered by the Legion." (5)
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #8
18. Hi manna!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:27 AM
Response to Reply #8
39. Says a lot between-the-lines, too.
To speed the genocide, the greedheads of the war party gave the Native Americans blankets infected with smallpox and alcohol. When they realized it could create friends, they took away the peace pipe. Of course, since then they've learned to make money through its prohibition.

Most importantly: A hearty welcome to DU, manna! Bread from heaven, indeed!
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KlatooBNikto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
17. What is amazing to me is that many jews in this country and in Israel who
should know better are making common cause with these Nazi wannabes.Is their historic memory that short? And it is even more amazing that they are making common cause with the Christian Fundamentalists who are waiting for the right opportunity to toss the jews into eternal purgatory.

The ironies of history seem to know no bounds.
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UncleSepp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:08 PM
Response to Original message
6. Nazi isn't an inherited quality, nor is it permanent
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 05:10 PM by AuntJen
It may be true that some of GW Bush's ancestors failed to fight, helped, or were Nazis, but that doesn't mean Bush is one. Only a few of the surviving children and grandchildren of Nazis you would know - people with famous names, people of rank - followed their ancestors' ideologies. Certainly every descendant of every man of the Totenkopfverbaende hasn't turned out to be a Nazi, nor every child of every political officer, nor SA-Mann on the street. Even people who were themselves Nazis as young men were not Nazis as old men. I don't mean those who were ordinary soldiers, I mean SS-men who were right next to the hand of power to the end.

Here's a nice story for you. It hasn't got anything to do with Bush, it has to do with what can happen within a family and within a person's heart.

If you want to trash Bush for being like a Nazi, fine - he's got it coming. Trashing him for being related to people who did business with Nazis is irrelevant. He's got no more control over who he's related to than any of us has.
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Desertrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. true....but if those Nazi connections are still intact
and he is still doing business with them and their descendants...what is the difference?

The neo-con/fascists are very much alive & strong disguised as so called "Christians" and are taking ( have taken) control of our gov't, media and financial world. If you don't see that then please, put the cup of Kool-aid down for awhile.

Here's an incredible link if you have time to read it all- it should wake you up.

"After several months of in-depth research and, at first, seemingly unrelated conversations with former high-level intelligence officials, lawyers, politicians, religious figures, other investigative journalists, and researchers, I can now report on a criminal conspiracy so vast and monstrous it defies imagination. Using Christian groups as tax-exempt and cleverly camouflaged covers, wealthy right-wing businessmen and clergy have now assumed firm control over the biggest prize of all the government of the United States of America. First, some housekeeping is in order. My use of the term Christian is merely to clearly identify the criminal conspirators who have chosen to misuse their self-avowed devotion to Jesus Christ to advance a very un-Christian agenda. The term Christian Mafia is what several Washington politicians have termed the major conspirators and it is not intended to debase Christians or infer that they are criminals . I will also use the term Nazi not for shock value but to properly tag the political affiliations of the early founders of the so-called Christian power cult called the Fellowship. The most important element of this story is that a destructive religious movement has now achieved almost total control over the machinery of government of the United States its executive, its legislature, several state governments, and soon, the federal judiciary, including the U.S. Supreme Court."
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UncleSepp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. If he is doing something with those connections, that's valid
The difference is in criticizing the man for who he is related to rather than for what he does. We all have relatives who've done things we would not do ourselves.
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Desertrose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 02:16 AM
Response to Reply #14
21. I am criticizing the man for what he is and what he is doing...
its pretty damn clear where * is taking this country.

I don't see how anyone can defend any of his actions. They are all based on what is good for the rich & powerhungry. Screw the rest of humanity.

We may all have relatives who have done things we wouldn't do, but I bet we don't all have relatives who are/were fascists and who have done the stuff his family has. Why should he get a pass and why can't people see what this man really is??
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UncleSepp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #21
41. He should get no pass at all
but the point should be made clearly about what he is doing now, and leave out the stuff about what his relatives did. The actions of his relatives and ancestors are a distraction. Thus far what has been written has muddled together a history of his family's relations with Nazis and sympathizers with his own actions that parallel the Nazis.

If I might make a further point, his actions now in restricting civil liberties, pushing an illegal war, and fanning hatred to satisfy political means are not bad because they are like the Nazis, they are bad because they are bad. That's another way we go wrong with the Nazi comparison - it removes from us the moral responsibility of judging for ourselves, and puts the Nazis in the position of our teachers. These things are bad because they cause suffering and pain. Opposing war, torture, bigotry, and tyranny on those grounds encourages compassionate thinking. Opposing them because they are like things an old enemy did encourages division and warlike mentality.

It's not that I don't believe you, Desertrose. I read Wiedenfeld and Nicolson, Berlet and Sklar back in undergrad in the early 90s. During that time I was doing heavy research into the resurgence of the radical right, national socialism, and neofascism in Europe and in the US. I have corresponded with several of the people on the NRHGC list posted here in the course of that research. My friends used to tease me about having the world's scariest address book ;-) the NRHGC was nothing. I took a terrible grade in a class on cultural diversity in America for writing my paper on the NRHGC - I wanted to explain how the Republican party organization viewed cultural diversity and what use the party made of it, and also it was a good excuse to keep doing the research I'd been doing anyway.

I've done the same research in Russia, in '93, and saw how strong neofascism and national socialism were becoming. I've seen the connections between Russian groups and American ones right in front of my face. (This wasn't the in the library kind of research, either. This was the walking around Moscow interviewing a guy wearing a swastika on his lapel kind of research.) Everybody, my advisors, faculty, everybody who supposedly knew anything told me "these people are never going anywhere." Well since then, I've been watching this whole takeover unfold, seeing names of people and parties I remember from those years come back again. Zhirinovsky rose and then sank out of the headlines, but is still active. Jorg Haider, who would have thunk it? Gianfranco Fini, Umberto Bossi. Jean Marie Le Pen isn't going anywhere, but he isn't going away, either. He's forced mainstream politicians to hum his tune to keep him from rising further.

Nobody believed it would happen then, as nobody believes it's happening now. Telling people that politicians with Nazi connections are taking over parses as comic book plot, like Cobra or the Red Skull or something - no matter how true it might be! People hear the N word and their minds shut down. If you want to win, if you want to keep people's minds open and get them to oppose these terrible policies, talk about the policies. For safety, appeal to the better instincts of the people, to compassion and love - throwing the N bomb appeals to fear, and you know what happens when you do that.

Eeek! I'm 40 minutes late getting ready for work! :-O Take care, Desertrose.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. I've met soldiers from both sides of World War II.
Some are in my (wife's) family. Almost all I've met are honorable. On both sides, there are many good men who once did what they now know is wrong.

Thank you also for the article. The family's story is a great reminder of how the future can be for us all. As you and the story of the rabbi and the "Aryan" children noted: The good can change.

Please know I try not to blame the sins of the father on the son. In the case of the Bush family, though, the apple has not fallen far from the tree.

Like his father and forefathers, Bush has not grown or evolved or learned anything other than "might makes right." That's the same as Hitler believed.

Please consider the foreign policy of the United States under the two presidents Bush:

In Gulf War 1 of 1991, Bush Senior ordered the Army to attack Iraq'a defeated army after it abandoned Kuwait. The slaughter cost the lives of tens of thousands of conscripts -- not the Iraqi dictator who only a few years earlier was the beneficiary of Bush largesse in the form of billions of dollars in U.S. aid and arms. That's evidence of sociopathy.

In the recent Iraq War, Bush Junior ordered the Army to attack and invade a country that was not a threat to the United States -- physically or otherwise. Tens of thousands are known dead in a war started over false pretenses: non-existent weapons of mass destruction and a phony connection to 9-11. And before the war, W told the Iraqi people to leave the oil facilities alone. That's evidence of sociopathy. And greed.
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UncleSepp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:53 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Evidence of sociopathy and greed
Go with both barrels after him for acting like a greedy sociopath, then.

The risk, I think, in using his descent from Nazi sympathizers as a rhetorical weapon against him is that someone may agree with you for the wrong reasons. That theoretical person - Mr. Straw Man :-) - may then attack your own family members who are German WW2 vets or their children using the weapon you gave them. That bit of advice, though, is worth precisely what you paid for it ;-)
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Charon Donating Member (321 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #13
37. Gulf I
Do you have a documented source for the statement that President Bush specifically ordered the destruction of the Iraqi column evacuating
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #37
55. Here's a start.
At the time of the war, I was a newspaper reporter. One soldier who participated phoned me and said he was part of the action. He said that he would have considered the action a war crime. -- Octafish

Here's a bit of what I can find today:

The Massacre of Withdrawing Soldiers on "The Highway of Death"

by Joyce Chediac

I want to give testimony on what are called the "highways of death." These are the two Kuwaiti roadways, littered with remains of 2,000 mangled Iraqi military vehicles, and the charred and dismembered bodies of tens of thousands of Iraqi soldiers, who were withdrawing from Kuwait on February 26th and 27th 1991 in compliance with UN resolutions.

U.S. planes trapped the long convoys by disabling vehicles in the front, and at the rear, and then pounded the resulting traffic jams for hours. "It was like shooting fish in a barrel," said one U.S. pilot. The horror is still there to see.

On the inland highway to Basra is mile after mile of burned, smashed, shattered vehicles of every description - tanks, armored cars, trucks, autos, fire trucks, according to the March 18, 1991, Time magazine. On the sixty miles of coastal highway, Iraqi military units sit in gruesome repose, scorched skeletons of vehicles and men alike, black and awful under the sun, says the Los Angeles Times of March 11, 1991. While 450 people survived the inland road bombing to surrender, this was not the case with the 60 miles of the coastal road. There for 60 miles every vehicle was strafed or bombed, every windshield is shattered, every tank is burned, every truck is riddled with shell fragments. No survivors are known or likely. The cabs of trucks were bombed so much that they were pushed into the ground, and it's impossible to see if they contain drivers or not. Windshields were melted away, and huge tanks were reduced to shrapnel.

"Even in Vietnam I didn't see anything like this. It's pathetic," said Major Bob Nugent, an Army intelligence officer. This one-sided carnage, this racist mass murder of Arab people, occurred while White House spokesman Marlin Fitzwater promised that the U.S. and its coalition partners would not attack Iraqi forces leaving Kuwait. This is surely one of the most heinous war crimes in contemporary history.

The Iraqi troops were not being driven out of Kuwait by U.S. troops as the Bush administration maintains. They were not retreating in order to regroup and fight again. In fact, they were withdrawing, they were going home, responding to orders issued by Baghdad, announcing that it was complying with Resolution 660 and leaving Kuwait. At 5:35 p.m. (Eastern standard Time) Baghdad radio announced that Iraq's Foreign Minister had accepted the Soviet cease-fire proposal and had issued the order for all Iraqi troops to withdraw to postions held before August 2, 1990 in compliance with UN Resolution 660. President Bush responded immediately from the White House saying (through spokesman Marlin Fitzwater) that "there was no evidence to suggest the Iraqi army is withdrawing. In fact, Iraqi units are continuing to fight. . . We continue to prosecute the war." On the next day, February 26, 1991, Saddam Hussein announced on Baghdad radio that Iraqi troops had, indeed, begun to withdraw from Kuwait and that the withdrawal would be complete that day. Again, Bush reacted, calling Hussein's announcement "an outrage" and "a cruel hoax."


Ramsey Clark makes a better case than I. (Please know there are some grisly photographs associated with the next link).


A Report on United States War Crimes Against Iraq to the Commission of Inquiry for the International War Crimes Tribunal


CBC has a program available online on the subject:
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:30 AM
Response to Reply #13
40. Always good words to chew on from The Octafish
:smoke: :smoke: :smoke: :smoke: :smoke: :smoke:
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 04:06 AM
Response to Reply #6
30. The Bush family is a corporate/political empire
These kind of families are all about securing their bloodline, continuing their heritage.
It is not by default, but it does stand to reason to expect a continuation of their behaviour, across generations of that family - and just look at what this Bush is doing.

What *can* happen "within a family and within a person's heart" doesn't say much about what is actually happening in the Bush family and in W's heart.
Like i said: "just look at what this Bush is doing".
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BuyingThyme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:11 PM
Response to Original message
7. If you're in the mood for posting articles...
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 05:13 PM by BuyingThyme
Dig up that one from a couple weeks ago where GWB is refusing to release CIA documents relating to post-WWII Nazi recruitment.

That's where the goods are.
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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Some more corporate ties
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 05:19 PM by manna

"On February 27, 1942," according to Higham, "Arnold, with documents stuffed under his arms, . . . strode into the lion's den of Standard at 30 Rockefeller Plaza. Just behind him were Secretary of the Navy Franklin Knox and Secretary of the Army Henry L. Stimson." They confronted Standard official William Farish and "Arnold sharply laid down his charges" that "by continuing to favor Hitler in rubber deal and patent arrangements," Standard Oil "had acted against the interests of the American government . . . suggested a fine of $1.5 million and a consent decree whereby Standard would turn over for the duration all the patents" in question.

"Farish rejected the proposal on the spot. He pointed out that Standard" was also selling the U.S. a "high percentage" of the fuel being used by the Army, Navy, and Air Force "making it possible for America to win the war. Where would America be without it?"
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. C.I.A. Said to Rebuff Congress on Nazi Files
Is this the one, BuyingThyme?

C.I.A. Said to Rebuff Congress on Nazi Files

By Douglas Jehl
The New York Times
Sunday 30 January 2005

WASHINGTON - The Central Intelligence Agency is refusing to provide hundreds of thousands of pages of documents sought by a government working group under a 1998 law that requires full disclosure of classified records related to Nazi war criminals, say Congressional officials from both parties.

Under the law, the C.I.A. has already provided more than 1.2 million pages of documents, the vast majority of them from the archives of its World War II predecessor, the Office of Strategic Services. Many documents have been declassified, and some made public last year showed a closer relationship between the United States government and Nazi war criminals than had previously been understood, including the C.I.A.'s recruitment of war criminal suspects or Nazi collaborators.

For nearly three years, the C.I.A. has interpreted the 1998 law narrowly and rebuffed requests for additional records, say Congressional officials and some members of the working group, who also contend that that stance seems to violate the law.

These officials say the agency has sometimes agreed to provide information about former Nazis, but not about the extent of the agency's dealings with them after World War II. In other cases, it has refused to provide information about individuals and their conduct during the war unless the working group can first provide evidence that they were complicit in war crimes.


Thank goodness and Pitt's TruthOut for fair use.

BTW: I'm ALWAYS in the mood to share articles. They represent our biggest and best weapon -- The Truth.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #7
43. Documents reveal CIA recruited five of Eichmann's associates
Recent news continues to show that CIA has a lot of explaining to do. This Operation PAPERCLIP appears a good place to start...

Documents reveal CIA recruited five of Eichmann's associates

By Yossi Melman, Haaretz Correspondent

Five of Adolph Eichmann's Nazi assistants were recruited and employed by the Central Intelligence Agency after World War II, according to recently declassified intelligence documents.

The information came to light after a lengthy battle waged by the non-profit group, The National Security Archive, whose goal is to expose government documents under the framework of the Freedom of Information Act.

The newly-revealed documents are based on internal investigations in the CIA's history department. The agency has steadfastly refused to make the documents public for fear they would cause embarassment.

The revelations cast a negative light not only on American intelligence activity but also the U.S. Army's conduct in Germany at the conclusion of the war. The military made efforts to recruit members of the SS and the Gestapo into its ranks despite simultaenously waging a campaign of de-Nazification over vanquished Germany, a process which included arresting and trying Nazi war criminals.

The documents also reveal in great detail CIA efforts to recruit Reinhard Gehlen, who was the Wermacht's chief intelligence officer for the eastern front during the war.


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BuyingThyme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
16. The forbidden truth: War is money
Edited on Thu Feb-24-05 06:06 PM by BuyingThyme
The Nazi armies were defeated.

The Nazis who created the Nazi armies are still with us.

It's not that they share philosophies; it's that they are the same fucking people.

But this is just too uncomplicated for people to understand.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 05:03 AM
Response to Reply #16
31. Bingo!!!
We have a WINNER!!! :toast:

Clearest explanation, fewest words!
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 10:10 PM
Response to Reply #16
70. YES: Same Fucking People AND most are US citizens.
That is what is difficult for most to grasp. They think of 'fascism' and 'Nazism' as something that came from 'over there'; when the whole point is that many of Hitler's most prominent backers came from the US. Indeed, the Nazi armies were defeated but many of the elite American families and their corporations who supported and funded him, wanted him to win. Hitler was their answer to the rise of Communism and Socialism.
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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-24-05 10:52 PM
Response to Original message
20.  A kick for a gem of a thread. Lots of great link/information.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #20
44. Thanks, oasis! Hey! Didja hear 'bout Diebold, e-voting & the VRWC?
These are some spooky people who mix church and state and Chimpageddon.

What's really scary is I remember reading they count about two-thirds of the nation's votes.

Diebold, electronic voting and the vast right-wing conspiracy

By Bob Fitrakis
Reprinted from The Free Press


Many of Tafts and President George W. Bushs major donors, like Diebolds current CEO Walden Wally ODell, reside in Columbus northwest suburb Upper Arlington. ODell is on record stating that he is committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president this year. On September 26, 2003, he hosted an Ohio Republican Party fundraiser for Bushs election at his Cotswold Manor mansion. Tickets to the fundraiser cost $1,000 per couple, but ODells fundraising letter urged those attending to Donate or raise $10,000 for the Ohio Republican Party.

According to the Columbus Dispatch: Last year, ODell and his wife Patricia campaigned for passage of two liquor options that made their portion of Tremont Road wet.

On November 5, Upper Arlington residents narrowly passed measures that allowed fundraising parties to offer more than beer, even though his 10,800-square-foot home is a residence, a permit is required because alcohol is included in the price of fundraising tickets. ODell is also allowed to serve beer, wine and mixed drinks at Sunday fundraisers.


Voter Fraud

A joint study by the California and Massachusetts Institutes of Technology, following the 2000 election, determined that between 1.5 and 2 million votes were not counted due to confusing paper ballots or faulty equipment. The federal governments solution to the problem was to pass the Help America Vote Act (HAVA) of 2002.

One of the laws stated goals was Replacement of punch card and lever voting machines. The new voting machines would be high-tech touch screen computers, but if theres no paper trail, how do you know if theres been a computer glitch? How can the results be trusted? And how do you recount to see if the actual votes match the computers tally?


Understanding that you know all about these traitors, but posted in the hopes that the information contained above is spread to those who find it newsworthy.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #20
45. Something to put the CON in Context: Christian Fascism
Rev. Rich Lang:

'George Bush and the rise of Christian Fascism'

Date: Monday, March 08 @ 10:10:27 EST

Topic: The Religious Right

By Rev. Rich Lang

The Imperial Presidency

The men who wrote the Constitution of the United States knew that if power accrued into the hands of an elite the experiment of democracy (power spread out into the realm of the people) would be over. So they created a system of checks and balances which blocked access to any one person, or any one special interest or elite gaining too much power over others. Thus our executive, legislative and judicial branches of government "balanced" each other. The media was yet another "check" on the accrual of too much power, as was the Bill of Rights, and to some extent the Church (or churches). The system wasn't perfect but it kept alive the possibility of true democracy. It kept alive the dream that one day "we the people" could live in a peaceful commonwealth where every person has what they need to survive and thrive.

That dream died in December 2000 when the checks and balances of our Constitution collapsed and George Bush was inserted into the Presidency of the United States. September 11, 2001 furthered the atrophying of democracy handing the country into the hands of an emerging Corporate (and I say Christian) Fascism.

Fascism meaning the collapse of diverse spheres of power into one. Since that time we have witnessed, and have been unable to prevent, the emergence of an Imperial Presidency that has the unrestricted power to declare war against any country it chooses. The Imperial Presidency has brought to end the Constitutional mandate that 'ONLY CONGRESS' has the authority to declare war. It has furthered weakened international law and undermined the potential of the United Nations to spread democracy throughout the earth.

The Imperial Presidency has also gained unrestricted potential to round up American citizens incarcerating them in military brigs or concentration camps for unlimited amounts of time. The presidency can keep the accused from ever again communicating with friends, families, and attorneys, simply on the certification that the incarcerated are "terrorists," as he has done with Jose Padilla and Yaser Esam Hamdi. The Presidency may also now kill American citizens abroad solely on the basis of naming the one killed "a terrorist". Just ask the family and friends of Ahmed Hijazi, anAmerican killed with a U.S.-fired missile in Yemen. This nullifies the Constitutional right: "no person shall be denied life, liberty or property without due process of law."

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mockingbich Donating Member (69 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 02:55 AM
Response to Original message
23. Not a Nazi - a new world order capitalist
Nazism is a very serious political ideaology based on eugenics and balance of socialism and capitalism....

Bush is not a nazi...BUT....

Look at all the decisions bush makes. Each one is based on opening markets and access to capital. He believes he can create peace in the world by creating ONE HUGE FREE MARKET.

Each country he identifies as an enemy also has the designation of a closed market economy

BUt, I fear the consequences of Bush's actions will lead to a resurgence of Nazism in Europe. Remember, Hitler rose to power because Germany was surrounded by free market capitalists to the west and communists to the East. Hating Jews was only part of Hitler's message. What brought him to power was fear of communists and western free market capitalism ripping Germany apart
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 03:05 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. Balance of socialism and capitalism?
Capitalism under the veil of socialism, i'd say. Where the socialism went no further then the name of the Party.

I'd also say, the politics and eugenics involved in Nazism where merely a means to an end. In the same way that *'s wars, anti-gay stance, pandering to reli-fundies, anti-citizens rights etc, etc, are a means to an end.
The end was/is despotism; the totalitarian rule by a small super wealthy elite. They can establish such rule because they are super wealthy to begin with, and they can get wealthier and more powerful still once they do rule in the way that they want.
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mockingbich Donating Member (69 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 03:18 AM
Response to Reply #25
26. Yep - you're exactly right
Nazism is pure totalitarianism...but it is a very serious political philosophy that should be understood better.

Modern ignorance of history has turned Nazism into a cartoon. Bush = Hitler and funny little moustaches. But it is a VERY DANGEROUS ideaology that I fear will make a comeback

For example, the eugenics aspect. There are many liberals who are all too quick to reject and destroy the idea of creationism. But be careful what you wish for, cuz if the theory of evolution and sciences trumps Judeo Christian philosophy then people will be vulnerable to ideaology based on eugenics. Ideaologies like nazism fit in perfectly

I'm not arguing for me... but I wish that the Nazi term wasn't thrown around so lightly...

Nazism only has to catch on in Europe... we already see it happening with nationalist right wing groups forming in defiance to muslim immigration

Bush isn't a nazi - he's a conduit - the Nazi's will come to clean up his mess
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 03:57 AM
Response to Reply #26
28. I see your point,
So we're still 'pre-1933' (or when was it that Hitler really came to power). In spite of the 9-11 Reichstag fire (either lihop, mihop or just a blessing in disguise), we aren't there yet. There's still some political opposition, dissent isn't cracked down on as hard as it could be, the propaganda isn't fully complete yet.
Still, it isn't that far-fetched to say that the nazi conduit is nazi-like, is it? Many of the neocon's ideas seem to be based on decidedly Machiavellian/Straussian philosophy, that isn't exactly strange to nazism and fascism.
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K-W Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #26
42. Nazism is not a serious political philosophy.
It is a series of myths meant to produce certain emotions and opinions that were used by the Nazi party to grab power. Grabbing power isnt a serious political philosophy and niether were the insane myths.

The only philosophy was control by any means neccessary and lie to make it work.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #23
56. Much obliged for your input. Lots of similarities AND differences.
Thank you for a most astute analysis of Bush's military-economic policies. The thing, to me, is that he employs the tactics of the Third Reich. He invaded a nation that was at peace with the United States and posed no threat to the United States.

Bush continues an occupation of said nation, even though there is no threat against the United States. His actions have cost the lives of tens of thousands of innocent people and almost 1,500 American service men and women.

What's more, Bush puts property above all, including human life. Then he ranks some humans as more worthy than others, principally upon net worth, place of birth and family ties. And while he is "president," he still serves only those who have what he doesn't have -- money and power.

That's all NAZI. Thus, my belief and the evidence I present to support the idea that Bush is a NAZI.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 02:55 AM
Response to Original message
24. But don't you know? It'll make us look bad,
in the eyes of * supporters. And we care so much about what they think about us.
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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 03:56 AM
Response to Reply #24
27. Bush I'm sorry- your fired
"Beware the false patriots who would usurp the applause of the people, while at the same time betraying their values."
George Washington's farewell address to the American Congress in 1796

I helped make Mexico, especially Tampico, safe for American oil interests in 1914. I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in. I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefits of Wall Street. The record of racketeering is long. I helped purify Nicaragua for the international banking house of Brown Brothers in 1909-1912 (where have I heard that name before?). I brought light to the Dominican Republic for American sugar interests in 1916. In China I helped to see to it that Standard Oil went its way unmolested.

During those years, I had, as the boys in the back room would say, a swell racket. Looking back on it, I feel that I could have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.

-- Excerpt from a speech delivered in 1933, by Major General Smedley Butler, USMC.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 03:58 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. thanks for the Butler quote
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Gabi Hayes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 05:19 AM
Response to Reply #29
32. one of the great, unsung American heroes
"War is a racket"

can't put it any better, or more succinctly, than that

If you haven't read the story of his role in preventing a very real coup against FDR, you should make a point of it

can't believe nobody's made a movie out of it, though it's said that 7 Days in May is based on it.

couple of good books on Butler; well worth reading
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #32
38. Butler Busted the 'Coup Against FDR'
Some of America's richest bastards were so threatened by the thought of having to sacrifice some of their wealth to help the less fortunate they became traitors. Gen. Butler, twice awarded the Medal of Honor, stopped them. He deserves a third.

The Attempted Coup Against FDR

By Barbara LaMonica

The John F. Kennedy assassination represents a theme in our political history. The causes, even the inevitability, of the assassination were born out of the power struggles among the ruling elite which are consistent throughout the American story. These struggles revolve around questions of what is the proper role of government vis a vis the business communitys pursuit of its own self-interest. Is the governments role minimal or laissez-faire? Should government only provide a stable environment of "law and order", through increased police powers, conducive to the maximization of profits and the minimization of workers wages and benefits? Or does the government have a higher purpose? Is it responsible for the common good? Is it the one entity capable of implementing justice, equality, and a partial redistribution of wealth through the regulation and taxation of corporations in order to provide a cushion against the more egregious effects of the free market? Should it ensure the workers share in the profits they helped to create?

At various times factions of what has become known as "corporate America" have argued over which role of government is ultimately more advantageous to their own ends. Generally speaking, banking and Wall Street favor less government. Retail, light manufacturing and small to medium size corporations are more tolerant of an activist government which might put more money in the hands of their consumers, and protect small businesses against the unfair competitive practices of larger corporations.

The stock market crash of 1929 and the ensuing Great Depression dramatically thrust the question of governments role to the forefront of American political and corporate life. The election of Franklin Delano Roosevelt represented a revolutionary realignment of political power: the ascendancy of the Democratic party facilitated by new voting coalitions of rural south and industrialized north which dislodged the Republican Partys nearly seventy-year dominance, signaling the abandonment of laissez-faire economics in favor of state regulation. The losers in this political process coalesced into right-wing Republicanism, and the next sixty years of American history is, in part, the story of their attempt to regain power, reinstitute Lassiez-faire policies, and dismantle the New Deal.1 I would like to suggest that the forces behind the assassination of President Kennedy were born in the furies which the Great Depression unleashed between these competing sectors of American political and economic life.

I believe that in 1934 there was a foreshadowing of the JFK assassination. A conspiracy was uncovered in which right-wing elements of big business, namely the DuPont family and the Morgan banking interests, planned to finance and arm a veterans army to march on the White House and hold President Roosevelt captive.2 The conspiracy was reported by two- time Congressional Medal of Honor winner Marine Corps Major General Smedley Darlington Butler. Although the House Committee to Investigate Un-American Activities found his allegations credible, it failed to call major conspirators to testify, and the Committee deleted crucial testimony from its final report to the public. The press relegated the story to the back pages, and discredited those, including Major Butler, who tried to alert the public to the threat against republican government. No prosecutions were forthcoming from the Justice Department, in part because the main witness who would have substantiated Butlers claims died suddenly from pneumonia at the age of 37. In short, there was a cover-up, maybe worse.


Butler's book is available online.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #27
36. I was a Gangster for Capitalism

There are only two reasons to go to war, Butler said: 1) the defense of our homes; 2) defense of Bill of Rights: Every other reason for the murder of young men is a racket, pure and simple.

An Amendment For Peace

Butler proposed an Amendment to the Constitution:

1) Complete prohibition against removing land forces from Continental limits of US and Panama Canal Zone.

2) Navy vessels must stay within 500 miles of the US coastline, except on missions of mercy. 3) Military aircraft must stay within 750 miles of coastline.

If the US homeland is attacked, all would rise to defend it regardless of race, color or creed. The US should let all territories and dependencies go. This means Puerto Rico, Virginia Islands, Guam, American Samoa, Wake and Midway Islands.

Hawaiian Island and Alaska would be defended by economic sanctions. Armed forces should be withdrawn.

Laws to take profit out of war or supporting neutrality, or creating a referendum on war or implementing total disarmament can easily be removed from the statute books. All these measures can be evaded. Even participants in a limited plebiscite could be persuaded by propaganda to vote against their own interests.

Smedley Butlers answers was a Constitutional Amendment For Peace. This would take a long time to repeal, giving the nation time to come to its senses.

The Corporate Fascist Putsch

In 1931, General MacArthur routed and dispersed the WWI veterans who came to Washington and set up crude encampments called Hoovervilles . These vets were asking for the bonuses promised for their services in WWI.

Also in 1931, Smedley Butler was imprisoned for telling a story about Benito Mussolini that the fascist dictator denied. Butler was to be court-martialed but strong public reaction to his trial caused the charge to be dropped entirely.

The fascism of both Mussolini and Hitler was much admired in pre-WW II America especially by the elite leadership in business, industry and the government.

The Fascists were very effective at suppressing labour and socialist demands for better wages and relief from the devastation brought on by the breakdown of capitalism.

Certain Wall Street banking houses such as J.P. Morgan and National City Bank, along with the Duponts, approached Smedley Butler in 1934 and asked him to lead the American Liberty League. This was a fascist offshoot of the American Legion. The proposal was to raise and arm a 500,000-man force of veterans to march on Washington in order to overthrow the government or at least force Roosevelt to back down on his New Deal program.

Smedley Butler exposed this plot in Congressional testimony before the McCormack-Dickstein Committee.

:hi: manna
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #24
46. Propaganda Due -- P2 -- NAZI as all hell.
Would that all of Bush's "Christian base" knew of his ties to Berlusconi, the Mafia and the CIA. An interesting article, filled with names, times, places and crimes...


Neo-Nazism is perhaps ill-named as it implies that the original Nazi movement at some point ended or disappeared. In fact, the Nazis were only part of a much broader white supremacist movement to restore Feudalism and the Holy Roman Empire in Europe.

Before the beginning of World War II Hitler and the Nazis were funded in large part by American industrialists who were comfortable investing in a country were the workforce was extremely controlled and the union movement was outlawed. Mussolini's fascist Italy also attracted huge investments at a time when America's trade union movement was at its most rebellious.

This unprecedented shift in capital from America to Italy and Nazi Germany was a major contributing factor to the Great Depression of 1929 to 1941. Corporations such as Rockefeller's Standard Oil, Alfred P. Sloan's General Motors, Henry Ford II's Ford Motor Company, and others financed Hitler's industrial war machine, and indeed directly profited from the slave labor of the war years, as recent law suits have proven. It has been documented that Henry Ford gave Hitler personal birthday gifts of up to $30,000 prior to the war. When leading journalists of the day such as George Seldes attempted to inform the American public of this unholy alliance and its implications to American freedoms, they were promptly silenced by the Press barons who openly supported the Fascist movement in their numerous journals. In fact, according to a recent biography, William Randoph Hearst had Hitler and Mussolini on his payroll as columnists, and racist articles written by Hitler have been recovered. Multi-millionare Hearst believed Hitler could be "a great world leader". Ironically, one of Hollywood's founding fathers Charlie Chaplin was promptly deported from America following the release of his classic film "The Great Dictator", which mocked and ridiculed Hitler.

When Hitler's attempt to create a Third Empire (Third Reich) failed, many leading Nazis escaped through the Knights of Malta and Vatican "Rat Run" to the Americas. Far from disappearing, the Nazi movement and its racist ideology became a force both at grass roots and elite levels. Street level neo-Nazism is particularly interesting for its overt use of Christian and Biblical rhetoric. However, this is hardly surprising when the most powerful of neo-Nazi elite secret societies are directly linked to the Holy Roman Catholic Church. Specifically, the Knights of Malta, Italian Masonic lodge "P2", and Holy Roman Empire restorationists "The Priory of Sion" have all been proven to be linked to the hierarchy of the Vatican. Global members of these fascist groups participate at the highest levels of the military, international politics, and finance.

"P2" (Propaganda 2) are perhaps the most visable, and are named after the propaganda machine of Nazi Joseph Goebbels, that effectively mind controlled the German people into believing their Rosicrucian racist ideology that led to the Holocaust.

P2 has been linked to the Mafia, and directly implicated in the death of Pope John Paul I in 1978, as revealed by the acclaimed book "In God's Name" by respected journalist David Yallop.

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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. Can't leave behind GLADIO

by Arthur E. Rowse


Although many European intelligence agencies have admitted participating, the CIA has denied any connection with Gladio. But enough information has emerged to show that the CIA sponsored and financed a large portion of the terrorism and disruption that plagued Italy for nearly half a century. Among other things, the U.S. government:

* Forged secret alliances with the Mafia and right-wing elements of the Vatican to prevent the left from playing any role in government;

* Recruited Mussolini's ex-police into paramilitary bands secretly financed and trained by the CIA, ostensibly to fight Soviets, but really to conduct terror attacks blamed on the left;

* Employed the gamut of psychological warfare tactics, including paying millions in slush funds to political parties, journalists, and other influential contacts to tilt parliamentary elections against the left;

* Created a secret service and a parallel government structure linked to the CIA whose ``assets'' attempted several times to overthrow the elected government; and

* Targeted Prime Minister Aldo Moro, who was later kidnapped and murdered under mysterious circumstances after offering to bring communists into the Cabinet.


The North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) provided international cover for Washington's postwar operations in Italy. A secret clause in the initial NATO agreement in 1949 required that before a nation could join, it must have already established a national security authority to fight communism through clandestine citizen cadres. This ``Stay Behind'' clause grew out of a secret committee set up at U.S. insistence in the Atlantic Pact, the forerunner of NATO. Each NATO member was also required to send delegates to semiannual meetings on the subject. 4

U.S. authority for such moves flowed in a steady stream of presidential directives transmitted through the National Security Council (NSC). In December 1950, the council gave the armed forces carte blanche to use ``appropriate'' military force even if the communists merely ``gain participation'' in government by legal means or ``threaten to achieve control...or the government ceases to evidence a determination to oppose communist internal or external threats.'' 5

The CIA helped the Italian police set up secret squadrons staffed in many cases with veterans of Mussolini's secret police. 6 The squadrons were trained for intensive espionage and counter-espionage, against communists and other perceived enemies of the status quo. The plan to use ``exceptional means'' was patterned after the highly militarized French intelligence service, the Suret Nationale, which was reportedly so tough on communists that many fled to other countries. 7

The newly organized intelligence agency, SIFAR, began operations in September 1949, under the supervision of an undercover American, Carmel Offie, nicknamed ``godfather'' by the Italians. 8 Interior Minister Mario Scelba headed the operation. At the same time, Scelba was directing a brutal repression, murdering hundreds of workers and peasants who sought improved conditions after the war. 9

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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. Yellow Cake and Black Shirts

We should have been paying attention all along, but particularly since the sadly unsurprising revelation that Italian military intelligence looks to have served as a linchpin in the Niger "Yellow Cake" caper, we would do well to brush up on the strange case of Michael Ledeen

You know Ledeen: arguably Washington's most influential neoconservative. He's resident scholar of the senior neoconservative think tank the American Enterprise Institute, and regarded widely as one of the world's leading authorities on intelligence, counter-intelligence and international affairs. From the beginning, and before the beginning, Ledeen has been one of the loudest cheerleaders for the "War on Terror."

Now, do you know of Italy's "Strategy of Tension"? It was a campaign of false-flag terror in the late 1970s, waged by outright fascists who enjoyed the patronage of the CIA, the Mafia and far right elements of the Italian State. These were the Gladio Brigades and Licio Gelli's P2 Lodge, and they intended to discredit the increasingly popular Communist Party, and to ensure it would not take power, by staging terrorist acts in the name of the Left. Their campaign culminated in the Bologna train station bombing of 1980.

Now, do you know where Michael Ledeen was during these years, what he was doing, and with whom he was doing it?


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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #48
54. That's my favorite blog.
Covert Action
the Roots of Terrorism

edited by Ellen Ray and William H. Schaap


The campaign for world economic and political domination gathered momentum during the final years of the Cold War, including the decade-long Iran-lraq War of the 1980s (in which the United States sold arms to both sides) and the "clandestine" wars against Nicaragua's Sandinista Government and the revolutionary movements in El Salvador, Guatemala Angola, South Africa and elsewhere. What became known as the IranContra scandal-clandestine U.S. arms sales to Iran, facilitated by Israeli intelligence guidance, with the huge profits used to fund the terrorist war of the contras against the revolutionary government of Nicaragua-was a major part of these operations. Both ends of the operation were ostensibly prohibited by U.S. Iaw and the secret sales to Iraq were not even part of the publicly known equation.

The psychological operations, or "psyops" apparatus, institutionalized today, which have virtually eliminated public media debate while severely damaging civil and constitutional rights, began in earnest during the Reagan and Bush I administrations. And the forces shaping administration policies and consequently government propaganda, include familiar faces from those years: Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Colin Powell, Richard Armitage, Eliot Abrams and Michael Ledeen, among many others.

During the Reagan years, the State Department ran an Office of Public Diplomacy, which was little more than a separate disinformation office. And it was riddled with Iran-Contra figures like Lt. Col. Oliver North and Adm. John Poindexter. With the "war on terrorism" as its justification, the current Bush Administration tried to establish a formal international disinformation agency, a shadowy Pentagon operation called the Office of Strategic Influence, directed to "conduct covert operations aimed at influencing public opinion and policymakers in friendly and neutral nations." Even the mainstream press found the open espousal of disinformation too much and Congress refused to fund the program. Of course, the secret operations continue, as they always have. Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld was unusually frank and openly cynical about it. After announcing that the exposure of their plans had forced the Pentagon to shut down this operation, he defiantly told reporters, "fine I'll give you the corpse..., you can have the name, but I'm gonna keep doing every single thing that needs to be done and I have."

More successfully, the Pentagon established the Total Information Awareness Program, to collect and collate all available electronic information on U.S. citizens, compiling credit-card, travel, medical, school, banking and other data. Brought in to head this agency was Adm. John Poindexter, despite his conviction in Iran-Contra on five felony counts of Iying to Congress (later overturned because he was deemed to have been granted immunity). This, too, was a bit much for the Congress and Poindexter's appointment was rejected.

The compelling international issues today, those which will shape the future, are most importantly the Middle and Far East-Israel, Iraq, China, North Korea. Preeminent is Israel, for it is the Israel lobby (sometimes called the Israel firsters), broadly defined, which is setting the entire, immediate, agenda. Traditional lobbying of Congress is still dominated by the American-lsrael Political Action Committee, but its power base today is the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board, chaired by Richard Perle, a Reagan Defense Department veteran. Perle was a co-founder of the Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs (JINSA), which maintains that there is no difference between Israel's national security interests and America's. It calls for "regime change" not just in Iraq, but in Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia and the Palestinian Authority. "Total war," JINSA co-founder and pundit Michael Ledeen (another Iran-Contra figure) calls it. Two other JINSA board members are on the policy board, Adm. David Jeremiah and former CIA Director James Woolsey.


BTW: If that fig leaf's covering a man, he's got some explaining to do.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #47
49. dupe
Edited on Fri Feb-25-05 01:45 PM by seemslikeadream
must have a little indigestion, please excuse me.
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
35. Businessmen Often Deal with Everyone They Make Money From
Witness American arms dealers' involvement with the Bolsheviks and Halliburton's dealings with Iran. Business are more often pragmatic and short-sighted than ideological.

There ARE famous business ideologues. Henry Ford was one in his uneducated way. I don't know if Prescott Bush was or not.
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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #35
50. It would be interesting to see
which monied interests paid for the 2 Bush campains. Are they the same ones who traded with the Nazi's in ww2?
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #35
61. Kangas: 'The Origins of the Overclass'
You're spot-on regarding the business minded War Party. This fellow pegged the satanic bastids for what they are: Those whom the NAZIs worked for -- and the BFEE continues to serve.

BTW: Kangas was found "suicided" outside the offices of Richard Mellon Scaife, the funder of the Arkansas Project.

The Origins of the Overclass

By Steve Kangas

The wealthy have always used many methods to accumulate wealth, but it was not until the mid-1970s that these methods coalesced into a superbly organized, cohesive and efficient machine. After 1975, it became greater than the sum of its parts, a smooth flowing organization of advocacy groups, lobbyists, think tanks, conservative foundations, and PR firms that hurtled the richest 1 percent into the stratosphere.

The origins of this machine, interestingly enough, can be traced back to the CIA. This is not to say the machine is a formal CIA operation, complete with code name and signed documents. (Although such evidence may yet surface and previously unthinkable domestic operations such as MK-ULTRA, CHAOS and MOCKINGBIRD show this to be a distinct possibility.) But what we do know already indicts the CIA strongly enough. Its principle creators were Irving Kristol, Paul Weyrich, William Simon, Richard Mellon Scaife, Frank Shakespeare, William F. Buckley, Jr., the Rockefeller family, and more. Almost all the machine's creators had CIA backgrounds.

During the 1970s, these men would take the propaganda and operational techniques they had learned in the Cold War and apply them to the Class War. Therefore it is no surprise that the American version of the machine bears an uncanny resemblance to the foreign versions designed to fight communism. The CIA's expert and comprehensive organization of the business class would succeed beyond their wildest dreams. In 1975, the richest 1 percent owned 22 percent of Americas wealth. By 1992, they would nearly double that, to 42 percent the highest level of inequality in the 20th century.

How did this alliance start? The CIA has always recruited the nations elite: millionaire businessmen, Wall Street brokers, members of the national news media, and Ivy League scholars. During World War II, General "Wild Bill" Donovan became chief of the Office of Strategic Services (OSS), the forerunner of the CIA. Donovan recruited so exclusively from the nations rich and powerful that members eventually came to joke that "OSS" stood for "Oh, so social!"

Another early elite was Allen Dulles, who served as Director of the CIA from 1953 to 1961. Dulles was a senior partner at the Wall Street firm of Sullivan and Cromwell, which represented the Rockefeller empire and other mammoth trusts, corporations and cartels. He was also a board member of the J. Henry Schroeder Bank, with offices in Wall Street, London, Zurich and Hamburg. His financial interests across the world would become a conflict of interest when he became head of the CIA. Like Donavan, he would recruit exclusively from societys elite.

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natrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
51. oh yea?
then why is big dog rollin with herby?
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. Dunno why Bill would hang with Poppy (other than money and power)...
OTOH, they DO have a lot in common, Jackson Stephens, f'r instance.

The Strange Saga of BCCI

"The Bank of Crooks and Criminals International"

Sightings from The Catbird Seat

From The Outlaw Bank, by Jonathan Beaty & S.C. Gwynne:


"Mr. Bond, power is sovereignty. Clausewitz's first principle was to have a secure base. From there proceeds freedom of action. Together, that is sovereignty. I have secured these things and much besides. . . . These things can only be secured in privacy. You talk of kings and presidents. How much power do they possess? As much as their people will allow them . . . And how do I possess that power, that sovereignty? Through privacy. Through the fact that nobody knows. Through the fact that I have to account to no one."
-- Ian Fleming, Dr. No

Dr. No, the island monarch with thin, cruel lips and immost designs on the fate of the Western world, would have been fascinated by the scandal that blossomed around the Bank of Credit and Commerce International (BCCI) in the summer of 1991. It was a conspiratorialist's conspiracy, a plot so byzantine, so thoroughly corrupt, so exquisitely private, reaching so deeply into the political and intelligence establishments of so many countries, that it seemed to have its only precedent in the more hallucinogenic fiction of Ian Fleming, Kurt Vonnegut, or Thomas Pynchon.

As tales of its global predations were spattered across headlines all over the world, its apparent influence reached almost absurd proportions. This was a bank that had taken the popular notion of a "global electronic village" and made a mockery of it, a bank that was at once everywhere and nowhere, whose dirtiest secrets were hidden deep in the impossible tangles of its offshore networks.

BCCI suddenly bloomed as sort of supermetaphor for the 1980s, the decade that celebrated the likes of Robert Maxwell, Ivan Boesky, and Michael Milken and unleashed upon the United States a horde of freebooters in the banking and thrift business. But nothing in the history of financial scandals even approaches the $20-billion-plus heist at BCCI, which sixty-two countries shuttered forever in July 1991 in a paroxysm of regulatory vengeance. No single scandal had ever involved such vast amounts of money.

Superlatives were quickly exhausted. BCCI was the largest criminal corporate enterprise ever, the biggest Ponzi scheme, the most pervasive money-laundering operation in history, the only bank - so far as anyone knows - that ran a brisk sideline business in both conventional and nuclear weapons, gold, drugs, turnkey mercenary armies, intelligence and counterintelligence, shipping, and commodities from cement in the Middle East to Honduran coffee to Vietnamese beans.

Though it was fundamentally a financial fraud, BCCI itself was not a bank in any conventional sense. Or, more precisely, banking was only a part of the global organism, the ingeniously constructed platform from which its other lines of business were launched....

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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 04:38 PM
Response to Original message
53. Wow,I'm finding lot's more info on this thread. Will bookmark for weekend
reading. Thanks to Octafish, Manna and the other contributors. :hi:
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 08:30 AM
Response to Reply #53
65. Who Profits from War?

Bush's 'priceless' war

By David Isenberg

WASHINGTON - Although the exact cost of the Iraq invasion to the American taxpayer is not known, recent figures suggest it is a lot more than has been publicly suggested and will grow considerably higher. Part of the problem in estimating costs is that the war is obviously not over; it just keeps going, and going, and going.

According to a report on the cost of the war in Iraq released last week by the Democratic staff of the House Budget Committee, the war and ongoing insurgency could cost the United States between US$461 billion and $646 billion by 2015, depending on the scope and duration of operations.

The difference between the low and high-end estimates depends on potential costs in 2006 and beyond. The lower figure is based on a US withdrawal of forces within four years, per Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld's prediction that all US troops could be withdrawn from Iraq by the end of 2008. The second estimate reduces US forces to 40,000 by 2010, per a previously released Congressional Budget Office model.

The Budget Committee report estimates are higher than previous estimates for several reasons: the war is lasting longer and is more intense, and the cost to keepUS troops in the theater of operations is proving to be greater, than anyone anticipated.

Those estimates are also far higher than anyone had predicted earlier, including Lawrence Lindsey, President George W Bush's former chief economic adviser. In 2002 he predicted that the cost of a war with Iraq could range between $100 billion and $200 billion at best. The administration dismissed the figure, and Lindsey was soon fired.

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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #65
66. Uncle Sugar Billie Bush
Edited on Sat Feb-26-05 11:04 AM by seemslikeadream

William H.T. Bush
Bush O'Donnell & Co.

William H.T. Bush, is chairman of the St. Louis-based investment firm, Bush O'Donnell & Co., which he founded in 1986. Previously, he was president and CEO of Boatmen's National Bank of St. Louis and began his career with the Hartford National Bank and Trust Co. in Connecticut. Bush has been a Director of the Company since 2000 and serves as a director of Mississippi Valley Bancshares, Inc., Maritz, Inc., RightChoice Managed Care, Inc., DT Industries, Inc. and The Lord Abbett family of Mutual Funds.

How the WMD Scam Put Money in the Bush Family's Pockets

But last year, Papa retired from the firm, heading off into the sunset to wallow in the government swag that Junior had pumped Carlyle's way--$2.1 billion in 2003 alone. While he doubtless still has "interests" in a number of Carlyle's shady deals, the old man is through with the higher hustlerdom. No, today we're dealing with Pop's brother, William, uncle of the current president.

William Bush is a director of Engineered Support Systems Inc. (ESSI), a supplier of high-tech military goods to--well, to the highest bidder. Just last year they sold $13 million worth of advanced radar gear to upgrade Communist China's fleet of fighter jets--you know, the kind that force down U.S. spy planes with such aplomb. This is just par for the family course, however; William's brother, Prescott Jr., is head of the America-China Chamber of Commerce, while Pretzel's brother Neil is in bed with the son of former Communist chieftain Jiang Zemin.

But helping arm a dictatorial regime that tyrannizes its own people, invades its neighbors and actually possesses large stockpiles of WMD is just a sideline for Uncle Bill. (Although, again, it's a family tradition--after all, it's what Papa George did for years with his special little friend, Saddam.) Mostly, Bill's ESSI does boffo box office with nephew Georgie's Pentagon and that new family investment opportunity, the Department of Homeland Security. And this is where those phantom Iraqi WMDs--so maniacally hyped by Junior--come in, investigator Margie Burns reports in the Prince George's Journal.

Among its many wares for the "warfighter" (the firm follows current Pentagon usage in replacing the ancient and honorable name of "soldier" with this nerdy adolescent jargon), ESSI markets a "Chemical Biological Protected Shelter System" unit--a mobile shed that can provide a non-contaminated area for command centers or field hospitals during a WMD attack. In the very first week of George's war, with the TV generals warning every hour of impending bioterror doom hurtling toward the troops, Uncle Bill's boys raked in $19 million for a shipment of CBP units, an ESSI press release reports. This was on top of $44 million worth of the anti-WMD units ordered during Pretzel's panic-mongering before the war.

Now what would have happened to Uncle Bill's bottom line if George had told the truth?

ESSI is also profiting from panic-mongering on the home front. Last summer, while Georgie bounced the "threat level" up and down, ESSI bagged a fat Homeland Security contract to begin developing a fleet of mobile emergency communication centers for use in the event of a biochemical terrorist attack by the CIA's old Afghan jihad employees--now better known as al Qaeda. As long as George keeps those colored lights going--and the ex-CIA gang do their duty with the occasional bit of ooga-booga here and there -- Uncle Bill will keep gulping that "threat level" gravy.


Published on Monday, February 23, 2004 by the Prince George's County Journal /Maryland
All in the (Profiteering, First) Family
by Margie Burns

Close relatives of President George W. Bush continue to benefit financially from the Iraq invasion, as revealed by sources including regulatory filings.

St. Louis, Mo.-based Engineered Support Systems (EASI), where William H. T. Bush, an uncle of George W. Bush, joined the board of directors in 2000, is a major military contractor. William H. T. Bush is a Bush ``Pioneer," a contributor raising more than $100,000, in the 2000 and 2004 elections. Following the 2000 election and Sept. 11, 2001, the company's federal contracts, revenues and stock price have increased. The company declined to comment for this article.

EASI received contracts from all branches of the armed forces in 2003. The Defense Department listed EASI in its top 100 contractors in 2001, with $330 million in contracts; and in 2002, with $380 million in contracts Estimates for 2003 are over $380 million.

As luck would have it, company products include ``Field Deployable Environmental Control Units" to deal with weapons of mass destruction.

On Jan. 17, 2003, the company announced orders from the Air Force and the Marines for these units, complete with Nuclear Biological Chemical Kits, in preparation for secret arsenals of WMDs hidden, the White House insisted, by Saddam Hussein.

On Jan. 22, 2003, President Bush delivered one of several speeches in St. Louis. On Jan. 28, 2003, he delivered his State of the Union address, including the famous accusations linking Saddam's Iraq to WMDs and illicit nuclear material.

Engineered Support Systems, Inc. (EASI:NASDAQ)
Current Releases | Archived Releases
Date Press Release
11/26/2003 To Present at Jefferies Quarterdeck Aerospace/Defense Conference in NYC
11/18/2003 Receives $3.66 Million in Logistics Support Contracts With U.S. Army
11/13/2003 Receives $58 Million Contract for Air Force Base Security System
11/12/2003 Receives $16 Million in Orders for Environmental Control Units From U.S. Military
11/06/2003 Receives $14.2 Million for Online Logistical Support From U.S. Army
10/31/2003 Receives $3.7 Million Engineering Services
10/08/2003 Receives $7.3 Million Contract for U.S. Army Reserve Command Facility Upgrades
10/06/2003 Announces Business Development Appointment
10/06/2003 Receives $8.1 Million Subcontract for Electronic Test Equipment
10/02/2003 Receives $2.1 Million Security System Contract From U.A.E.
09/30/2003 Wins Top Technology/Growth Award; 2nd Year In Succession
09/24/2003 Receives $8.0 Million Contract From U.S. Air Force
09/16/2003 Receives Contract for Special Operations Forces
09/09/2003 Receives $2.1 Million Contract for Electronic Test Equipment
08/15/2003 Receives $3.4 Million Engineering Services Contract From U.S. Army
08/11/2003 Receives U.S. Air Force Order for Base and Perimeter Security Equipment
08/05/2003 Receives $9.4 Million Subcontract to Support U.S. Army Contract
07/31/2003 Receives $13 Million Radar System Contract For Republic of China
07/24/2003 Receives $1 Million Commercial Coil Contract
07/15/2003 Receives $11.7 Million In Orders From U.S. Air Force
07/02/2003 Signs Pact: Receives $2.5 Million Defense Contract
06/12/2003 Receives Homeland Defense Contract
06/10/2003 Receives $44.2 Million Contract for Special Forces Radar System From U.S. Air Force
06/06/2003 Receives $12.9 Million Contract From U.S. Military
05/30/2003 Receives $3.6 Million for U.S. Navy LHD-8 Amphibious Assault Ship Program
05/21/2003 Receives $11.1 Million in Orders for U.S. Navy LPD-17 Assault Ships
05/13/2003 Receives $26.1 Million Contract Order From Saudi Arabian Military
05/09/2003 Implements New Communications Systems for U.S. Army ...

Engineered Support Rec $16.3 M Cont for Up-Armoring of Military
PR Newswire - Tuesday, March 02, 2004

ST. LOUIS, Mar 2, 2004 /PRNewswire-FirstCall via COMTEX/ -- Radian Inc. (Radian), a subsidiary of Engineered Support Systems, Inc. (Nasdaq: EASI), has been awarded a $16.3 million, firm-fixed-price redetermination contract to provide 272 armor protection kits for the U.S. Army's Family of Medium Tactical Vehicles (FMTV). The U.S. Army Program Executive Office, Combat Support and Combat Services Support (PEO, CS&CSS) awarded the contract through the Tank-automotive and Armaments Command (TACOM) in Warren, Michigan, for Operational Unit Force Protection.

These armor kits will immediately be transferred to Army units operating in Iraq. The major design benefits of the armor protection kits include substantial protection for the FMTV's crew and key components; simple bolt-on/bolt-off application to fit over the existing cab; and incorporation of an environmental control system for air conditioning these 'buttoned-up' cabs. Once in country, these armored vehicles will immediately begin to help save soldiers' lives by significantly reducing injuries currently being caused by small arms fire, landmines, and improvised explosive devices penetrating the crew compartments of the vehicles, according to Jerry Daniels, Vice Chairman and CEO of Engineered Support.

Beginning in April 2003, Radian completed their evaluation, redesign, prototype fabrication and developmental testing over a period of just five months; and was subsequently tasked to finalize the design and provide operational test kits in October 2003. Operational performance and live ordnance testing were completed in December 2003 at Aberdeen Proving Grounds, Maryland, at which time the kit design received a U.S. Army safety certification. To accelerate the design process, Radian engineers developed computer-generated solid models of the necessary armor components. These models facilitated the primary redesign work and integration of the entire package and also enabled all engineering and finite element analyses to be conducted in parallel with the design effort. Prior to fabricating a prototype kit, Radian performed a series of computer simulations to determine the potential effects of the additional weight on the vehicle chassis/suspension and overall vehicle performance such as braking, handling, turning, and lane changing. The end result was a protection kit that did not impair vehicle performance and passed live-fire testing the first time. ...
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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #66
67. There it is in black and white, blatant nepotism. Wake up America.
Edited on Sat Feb-26-05 11:30 AM by oasis
There's going to be an accounting.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #66
68. What goes around comes around...Ch-Ch-Chalabi.
I'm glad you're on our side, seemslikeadream!

Here's a bit o' history for those interested in the subject:

War Profiteering and You

by Christopher Hayes


Reducing the Iraq war and subsequent occupation to a business opportunity is disconcerting enough, but far more bizarre was the subtle yet consistent message that Iraqi reconstruction constitutes a comprehensive domestic economic policy agenda. Were all looking for what are those 21st Century jobs, Rea told the crowd. Youre sitting in a room where theyre going to unfold by the thousands.

Reas righttheres an awfully large potential for profit. Both the conquest and occupation of Iraq have been the most heavily privatized military ventures in U.S. history. Thanks to an initiative implemented in the early 90s by then-Secretary of Defense Dick Cheney, the U.S. military now contracts out almost every possible aspect of its work, from food preparation to janitorial services to camp design and construction.

Now this very same approach is being applied to reconstruction, as the government bids out contracts on everything from school construction to power plant design to water treatment.

In the last round of contracts alone, $18.6 billion was awarded to about two dozen companies, the majority of which are American mega-firmsgiven only companies from coalition member nations are allowed to bid.

But the Bush administration is committed to spreading around the wealth. It requires that all subcontractors partner with Iraqi firms for work on the ground. And the policy seems to be working. Newsday recently reported that firms associated with Ahmed Chalabi, an Iraqi exile whos the administrations bag man in Baghdad, have raked in $400 million in contracts.


There are more important things in life than money. One is the Truth.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #65
78. It's not just people -- Corporations Love War.
It's good for business -- some businesses more than others. Some businesses, one might say, were made for war:

Halliburton Could Get $1.5bn More Iraq Work

Saturday 26 February 2005

Halliburton, under scrutiny for its contracts in Iraq, would receive an extra $1.5 billion as part of the Bush administration's additional war spending proposal for fiscal 2005, a senior US Army budget official said.

Halliburton, once led by Vice-President Dick Cheney, is the largest corporate contractor in Iraq and has drawn fire for its no-bid contracts there, with auditors charging its Kellogg Brown and Root (KBR) unit overcharged for some work.

The Army's portion of a $81.9 billion supplemental spending package earmarked the extra funding for KBR under its LOGCAP (Logistics Civil Augmentation Programme) contract to provide a wide range of services to US troops in Iraq, the official said. The contract covers food and laundry services, trash collection, mail delivery and other support services.

If approved by Congress, that would bring the total spending under KBR's LOGCAP contract to about $6 billion in fiscal year 2005, about the same amount spent a year earlier, said the offical.

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chlamor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
58. No Theory
Just conspiracy. Wicked men in powerful positions do get together in the same room and specifically plan on ways to further their own agendas and consolidate their power in order to manifest their greedy impulses. Attempts will be made to remove any and all bumps in the road. Those who seek dignity and sovereignty shall always fight for their freedom.

Awesome post-Nominate.

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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-25-05 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #58
62. Kick
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #62
72. Thanks, Cleita! Hey, SW reminds us of COINTELPRO, serious NAZI stuff!
DUer scarletwoman brought up COINTELPRO. That's some serious NAZI stuff there, especially considering how "Liberal" is a dirty word to so many nowadays. Ironic how "Liberal" also was anathema to the NAZIs in Germany.


COINTELPRO is an acronym for a series of FBI counterintelligence programs designed to neutralize political dissidents. Although covert operations have been employed throughout FBI history, the formal COINTELPRO's of 1956-1971 were broadly targeted against radical political organizations. In the early 1950s, the Communist Party was illegal in the United States. The Senate and House of Representatives each set up investigating committees to prosecute communists and publicly expose them. (The House Committee on Un-American Activities and the Senate Internal Security Subcommittee, led by Senator Joseph McCarthy). When a series of Supreme Court rulings in 1956 and 1957 challenged these committees and questioned the constitutionality of Smith Act prosecutions and Subversive Activities Control Board hearings, the FBI's response was COINTELPRO, a program designed to "neutralize" those who could no longer be prosecuted. Over the years, similar programs were created to neutralize civil rights, anti-war, and many other groups, all said to be "communist front organizations." As J. Edgar Hoover, longtime Director of the FBI, put it

The forces which are most anxious to weaken our internal security are not always easy to identify. Communists have been trained in deceit and secretly work toward the day when they hope to replace our American way of life with a Communist dictatorship. They utilize cleverly camouflaged movements, such as peace groups and civil rights groups to achieve their sinister purposes. While they as individuals are difficult to identify, the Communist party line is clear. Its first concern is the advancement of Soviet Russia and the godless Communist cause. It is important to learn to know the enemies of the American way of life.

The FBI conducted more than 2000 COINTELPRO operations before the the programs were officially discontinued in April of 1971, after public exposure, in order to "afford additional security to sensitive techniques and operations."

SOURCE w/LINK CITY inc. Church Committee Books...
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #58
63. The Octopus
Fine photograph of the public face of this pox of treason called the Bush madministration. Outstanding assessment of the situation as well as their future places in history and hell.

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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 05:57 AM
Response to Reply #63
64. Kick!
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #64
73. Domo arigato, Karenina! Hey! Don't Forget POLAND!
More on Bush-NAZI Connection

William Bowles


"On Wednesday, November 19, 2003 John Buchanan wrote:

A Call To Action For An Important Journalistic-Historical Project

On September 17, I became the first journalist in U.S. history to independently confirm and report in a reputable newspaper -- The New Hampshire Gazette, founded in 1756 and the oldest paper in America -- the Nazi past of the Bush family, via its 27-year business relationship with Nazi industrialist Fritz Thyssen from 1924 until 1951. Both Prescott Bush, the grandfather of George W. Bush, and George Herbert Walker, his maternal great-grandfather, were part of the partnership, under the banner of the private bank Brown Brothers Harriman.

Beginning in August 1942, those Nazi-front business assets were seized by the U.S. government under The Trading with the Enemy Act. The seizures continued until 1951, when Thyssen, the financial architect of The Third Reich, died in Argentina. It was the liquidation of those Nazi assets after Thyssen's death that were the foundation of the Bush family fortune.

Last March, Newsweek Polska, the magazine s Polish edition, published a brief but shocking story that linked the Bush fortune directly to slave labor at Auschwitz. The U.S. edition, as I reported in my first NHG story on October 10: ... spiked the story for reasons that have never been accounted for by Newsweek.

Since my discovery of the actual documents, many of which were only declassified and approved for public release on September 14 (four days before I got to the archives) virtually every major news organization in the U.S. has refused to investigate the Bush-Nazi story or even examine the documents. The list includes The New York Times, ABC News, Washington Post, Knight-Ridder Newspapers, Miami Herald, CNN, The Wall Street Journal and USA Today.

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rhite5 Donating Member (510 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-26-05 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
69. Thank you for starting this thread!

I've got to say, this thread contains an extremely worthwhile collection of material and links. I thought I pretty much knew the outlines of the story -- from Smedley Butler's exposure of treason in 1934 to today's total media control and war profiteering, but I learned a number of newer things.

Good collection of fascist history in Italy that ties in to "yellow cake". (as well as Vatican fascist history in the 20th Century).

Best collection I have seen of what is known about Smedley Butler.

Excellent commentary by some of the better DU writers.

Thank you for starting this thread!
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 12:10 AM
Response to Reply #69
74. You're welcome, rhite5! Hey, Didja hear 'bout the Bush-Auschwitz ties?
A presidential visit to Auschwitz

The Holocaust and the Bush family fortune

By Bill Vann
5 June 2003


Fascism is the continuation of capitalism, an attempt to perpetuate its existence by the most bestial and monstrous measures, wrote Leon Trotsky on the eve of his assassination in 1940. Capitalism obtained an opportunity to resort to fascism only because the proletariat did not accomplish the socialist revolution in time.


In the immediate aftermath of the war, the US occupation authorities found themselves obliged to recognize the culpability of German big business in the crimes carried out by the Nazi regime. Gen. Telford Taylor, one of the principal prosecutors in the Nuremberg war crimes trials, pressed for the conviction of some of the top German industrialists. One of these was Friedrich Flick, the co-owner of the German Steel Trust with Fritz Thyssen. From 1932 on, he was one of the main financial contributors to the Nazis and the SS.

Taylor declared in his summation to the court: We are dealing with men so bent on the attainment of power and wealth that all else took second place. I do not know whether or not Flick and his associates hated the Jews; it is quite possible that he never gave the matter much thought until it became a question of practical importance, and not their inner feelings and sentiments.

He continued: The defendants were men of wealth; many mines and factories were their private property. They will certainly tell you that they believed in the sanctity of private property, and perhaps they will say that they supported Hitler because German communism threatened that concept. But the factories of Rombach and Riga belonged to someone else.

So, one might well add, did the oil wells of Iraq.

The description given by General Taylor of the German ruling elite could, with little alteration, be applied to the predatory layer of multi-millionaires that constitutes the principal base of the Bush administration.


Now I don't like the commies anymore than the NAZIs, but darned if they're not standing on opposite ends of a circle.

Most importantly: Really appreciate the kind words, rhite5! Please feel free to add on or start your own thread. Spreading the Truth about these traitoreous NAZI scum is the only way we're going to beat them.

For some it might be history. For most, it will be news.
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Dangerman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 12:14 AM
Response to Original message
75. I KNEW IT!
As my sig always say...
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #75
80. Now THAT's a GIF! History shows: It's UN-AMERICAN to be a NAZI.
Americans believe all people are created equal. NAZIs don't.

Americans believe all people have the right to be free to think and say and worship like they want. NAZIs don't.

Americans believe all people have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. NAZIs don't.

Gee. All that being American sounds so... Liberal.

Do you think this guy was willing to give his life to make the world safe for General Electric, IBM, Ford Motor Company?

I don't. I think he was willing to be there to protect his country, family and way of life.

Here are metrics from World War II:

US Battle Deaths: 291,557
Other deaths in service (nontheater): 113,842

My grandfather's best friend was machine-gunned to death by the NAZIs in France, a few days after Normandy. The guy was a company commander.

I really hate this thread because we shouldn't have to fight this fight again. It seems too many have forgotten our history. Remembering is the least we can do. We owe it to the men and women who've given their lives for our nation and so we can be free.

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kk897 Donating Member (829 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 01:05 AM
Response to Original message
76. you guys...


(and can people please be a *little* concerned that The Right controls Lexis Nexis? just a wee bit?)
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-27-05 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #76
79. Even REPUBLICANS call them 'Brownshirts'
The writer was an Assistant Secretary of the Treasury under Pruneface and Wall Street Journal editorial page honcho.

Conservative Sycophants Lose Credibility

by Paul Craig Roberts


Conservative journalists and Republican politicians not only lie through their teeth, but also seek to destroy everyone who utters a word of dissent or truth.

For example, Tom Frank of The New Republic (once considered to be part of the hated "liberal press") recently expressed his thoughts in that unfortunate magazine. Frank wrote that dissenters from Bush's gratuitous war should be beaten and even killed. He expressed his wish that Arnold Schwarzenegger would punch Stan Goff in the face. He wrote that seeing Arundhati Roy taken out with a "bunker buster" would be a satisfying experience. As for Sherry Wolf and other dissenters, "I wanted John Ashcroft to come busting through the wall with a submachine gun to round everyone up for an immediate trip to Gitmo, with Charles Graner on hand for interrogation."

What have Stan Goff, Arundhati Roy, and Sherry Wolf done to inspire Tom Frank to reveal his brownshirted inner self?


Conservatives regard dissent as a serious offense, but they think it is treasonous to give the public real information, as contrasted with Fox "News" propaganda. Former Newt Gingrich operative and current Washington Times editorial page editor Tony Blankley believes America's premier investigative journalist, Seymour Hersh, should be arrested for treason and perhaps shot for warning Americans about the Bush administration's plans to start a war with Iran.

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