Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Terrifying Read: Our hidden WMD program, Bush and his Nukes

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 08:49 PM
Original message
Terrifying Read: Our hidden WMD program, Bush and his Nukes
Edited on Mon Apr-26-04 08:50 PM by Mari333
The budget is busted; American soldiers need more armor; they're running out of supplies. Yet the Department of Energy is spending an astonishing $6.5 billion on nuclear weapons this year, and President Bush is requesting $6.8 billion more for next year and a total of $30 billion over the following four years. This does not include his much-cherished missile-defense program, by the way. This is simply for the maintenance, modernization, development, and production of nuclear bombs and warheads.

Measured in "real dollars" (that is, adjusting for inflation), this year's spending on nuclear activities is equal to what Ronald Reagan spent at the height of the U.S.-Soviet standoff. It exceeds by over 50 percent the average annual sum ($4.2 billion) that the United States spent—again, in real dollars—throughout the four and a half decades of the Cold War.






http://slate.msn.com/id/2099425
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
maggrwaggr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 08:58 PM
Response to Original message
1. and people think I'm paranoid that I worry Bush is gonna nuke somebody
It's disgusting and, like a broken record "I can't believe the media isn't covering this".

This is why the world fears America more than it fears terrorism.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Snoggera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
2. Money has no value to these people
It is not something to be earned, or saved, or appreciated, because it's NOT THEIR MONEY.

The only money that matters is what they have and what they can do with it to obtain more.

I've read some of your posts, and wish you and your family the best.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 09:11 PM
Response to Original message
3. Rationalization
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 09:31 PM
Response to Original message
4. my nuke info
The Bush administration's nuclear program is a shell game with their ambitions hidden within the Energy and Defense bills, most under the guise of research. Their proposals originated in a position paper which is referenced in the Energy Policy Act of 2003, entitled, "A Roadmap to Deploy New Nuclear Power Plants in the United States by 2010". http://gif.inel.gov/roadmap/pdfs/gen_iv_roadmap.pdf

The nuclear industry, along with government supporters, developed a roadmap for the realization of these goals. They intend to portray nukes as a safe, clean alternative to CO2 based plants. The bill references the "Generation IV Nuclear Energy Systems Program." http://gif.inel.gov/roadmap/

This is a determined, deliberate hard sell to get the nation back in the nuclear game. The nuclear provisions in the Energy bill, now in congressional conference are a tough read but they are designed to confuse. http://energy.senate.gov/

The legislation designates INEEL, The Idaho Engineering and Environmental Laboratories, as the lead facility for nuclear R&D. This has been the nation's primary lab for all of the nuclear madness since 1952. INEEL's primary function since the mid 70's was the clean-up of their own toxic waste. This clean-up is still going on. There is money allocated in this bill for that.

At the end of the decade support for nuclear energy was on the decline because of waste and safety issues and disarmament. Right before Bush II got in office, the industry, still fat from clean-up money sought to bolster their flagging industry. (INEEL gets 70% of their funding for waste disposal)

Waste storage had become so controversial that it had soured the public to the idea of more nukes and more nuke plants. (Yucca Mountain, storage sites in New Mexico, transportation, safety issues, etc.).

So, they began promoting the view that the 'spent' nuclear fuel from decommissioned weapons and nuclear power plants could be broken down and reconstituted for weapons (depleted uranium) and a new generation of nuclear plants which would accommodate (recycle) and use the waste instead of immobilizing it in glass and storing it. http://www.nci.org/../../0new/wpu-immob-dp52001.htm

The industry makes the dubious claim that the recycled waste keeps it out of the hands of terrorists and makes proliferation more difficult. It will more likely disperse the waste and create more opportunity for abuse or mishap. http://www.sierraclub.org/nuclearwaste/briefs/0004.asp

We import the spent fuel from Russian nukes and process it for the remaining uranium powered electric plants in the U.S. and abroad.

The program has been successful in the elimination of some 4,000 Russian warheads, but has created a dependence on the Russian uranium to power the U.S. plants; prompting the Energy Dept. to explore and pursue new sources of nuclear fuel for these plants.

New plants are contemplated in the Energy and Defense legislation which would utilize the new generation of recycled nuclear fuels (MOX mixed-oxide, hydrogen based, depleted uranium, etc.). These centers will almost certainly be formatted to accommodate the next generation of nuclear weapons, such as, mini tactical nukes and bunker- busters. http://www.greenpeace.org/~comms/nukes/nukes.html

INEEL will undoubtably be at the center of this effort.

The INEEL is operated for the DOE by Bechtel BWXT Idaho, LLC. Members of the LLC are Bechtel National, Inc., BWX Technologies Co. and INRA. INRA is a consortium of eight regional universities. The DOE field office is the Idaho Operations Office.

Raytheon is the nation's producer of the Tomahawk cruise missile. Each one costs $2 million. The company also makes the Paveway series of laser-guided bombs which are used in Afghanistan, and the 5,000-pound GBU-28 "Bunker Buster, " the Pentagon's newest modified nuclear weapon. http://www.clw.org/milspend/gbu28.html

Reuters, in October, reported that the Bush administration is proceeding with their plans to promote and push for the expansion of the nation's nuclear arsenal with the unveiling of an initiative produced by the ‘Defense Science Board'. http://www.acq.osd.mil/dsb

The supporting document, named the “Future Strategic Strike Force”, outlines a reconfigured nuclear arsenal made up of smaller-scale missiles which could be targeted at smaller countries and other lower-scale targets. The report is a retreat from decades of understanding that these destructive weapons were to be used as a deterrent only; as a last resort. http://www.csbaonline.org/4Publications/Archive/R.20010300.The_Transformation/R.20010300.The_Transformation.htm http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422/14mar20010800/edocket.access.gpo.gov/2003/03-15039.htm

In September the Senate went along with a White House push to reduce the preparation time required for nuclear testing in Nevada; clearing the way for a resumption of nuclear test explosions which have been banned since 1992. It seeks to cut the time it would take to restart testing nuclear weapons in the Nevada desert from three years to two years. The Bush administration wants the period cut to 18 months. http://www.cndyorks.gn.apc.org/news/articles/testingtoresume.htm

Congress plans to build the first permanent U.S. nuclear waste repository in the desert northwest of Las Vegas, scheduled to open in 2010 and would hold up to 77,000 tons of radioactive waste. http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/weekly/aa071002a.htm

The Energy bill that has emerged from the recent Congress would provide $580 million for the Yucca Mountain nuclear waste disposal project in 2004 — around $11 million less than Bush had requested but far above a $425 million limit earlier endorsed by the Senate. http://rpc.senate.gov/_files/CRap111803.pdf

The bill would also provide $11 million for a new factory to make plutonium "pits" for the next generation of nuclear weapons. The last U.S. facility for manufacturing nuclear triggers closed in 1989.

President Bush recently signed into law a Defense bill for 2004 which includes $9 billion in funding for research on the next generation of nuclear weaponry. http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/11/20031124-2.html

"It's an important signal we're sending," President Bush remarked at the signing of the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2004, "because, you see, the war on terror is different than any war America has ever fought."

"Our enemies seek to inflict mass casualties, without fielding mass armies," he cautioned. "They hide in the shadows, and they're often hard to strike. The terrorists are cunning and ruthless and dangerous, as the world saw on September the 11th, 2001. Yet these killers are now facing the United States of America, and a great coalition of responsible nations, and this threat to civilization will be defeated." http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/03_37/b3849012.htm

This is a posture usually reserved for nation-states who initiate or sponsor terrorists. The devastating neighboring effect of a potential nuclear engagement would contaminate innocent millions with the resulting radioactive fallout, and would not deter individuals with no known base of operations.

Yet, this administration, for the first time in our nation’s history, contemplates using nuclear weapons on countries which themselves have no nuclear capability, or pose no nuclear threat.

$8,933,847,000 has been provided in the 2004 Defense bill to the Department of Energy for the activities of the National Nuclear Security Administration, to be allocated as follows:
-For weapons activities, $6,457,272,000.
-For defense nuclear non-proliferation activities, $1,340,195,000.
-For naval reactors, $788,400,000.
-For the Office of the Administrator for Nuclear Security, $347,980,000.
-Test capabilities revitalization, phase I, Sandia National Laboratories, Albuquerque, New Mexico, $36,450,000.
-Exterior communications infrastructure modernization, Sandia National Laboratories, Albuquerque, New Mexico, $20,000,000.
-Project engineering and design, various locations, $2,000,000.
-Chemistry and metallurgy research (CMR) facility replacement, Los Alamos National Laboratory, New Mexico, $20,500,000.
-Building 12-44 production cells upgrade, Pantex Plant, Amarillo, Texas, $8,780,000.
-Cleaning and loading modifications (CALM), Savannah River Site, Aiken, South Carolina, $2,750,000.
-Mission relocation project, Los Alamos National Laboratory, Los Alamos, New Mexico, $8,820,000.
-Project engineering and design, facilities and infrastructure recapitalization program, various locations, $3,719,000.
-$360,000,000 for defense nuclear waste disposal.

Section 3136 of the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1994 is repealed. (Law prohibiting nuclear tests) The bill states that nothing in the repeal is intended to be construed as authorizing the testing, acquisition, or deployment of a low-yield nuclear weapon.

"The Secretary of Energy is not to commence the engineering development phase, or any subsequent phase, of a low-yield nuclear weapon unless specifically authorized by Congress," it says.

But, not later than March 1, 2004, the Secretary of State, the Secretary of Defense and the Secretary of Energy is required in the bill to jointly submit to Congress a report assessing whether or not the repeal of section 3136 of the National Defense

Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1994 will affect the ability of the United States to achieve its non-proliferation objectives and whether or not any changes in programs and activities would be required to achieve those objectives.

In other words, if nothing catastrophic has occurred as a result of the repeal of the testing ban, and if there is no challenging escalation of nuclear tests by other nations, a resumption of testing of these low-yield nuclear weapons may be considered.

The act states that: "If as a result of the review the Secretary, in consultation with the Administrator for Nuclear Security, determines that the optimal, advisable, and preferred readiness posture for resumption by the United States of underground nuclear tests is a number of months other than 18 months, the Secretary may, and is encouraged to, achieve and thereafter maintain such optimal, advisable, and preferred readiness posture instead of the readiness posture of 18 months.

This is authorization for the Defense Secretary to ignore the congressional approval process and manipulate the schedule for underground nuclear tests at his discretion.

The nuclear hawks are stepping out from behind their Trojan Horses of nuclear space travel and ‘safe', new nuclear fuels and are revealing a frightening ambition to yoke the nation to a new legacy of imperialism. President Bush has decided that America's image around the globe is to be one of an oppressive nuclear bully bent on world domination.

Me Book

(If you search bigtree and nukes or nuclear in the archives, you are sure to get the full chapter, if you are interested)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Snoggera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Best synopsis and group of links
I've seen in some time. Congratulations!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. I did the search and didn't find the chapter
I also noticed you didn't have a star, no search capability.

I made a page with the full chapter on my site. Hope it helps. Follow the numbered references with linked ref along the side of the article. Cheers.

http://www.returningsoldiers.us/nukes.htm
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. The Lost World War
And the commodities connection? President Pretzel's relentless hissy-fit for war on Iraq has of course goosed the price of gold enormously--and that's set Bush Family coffers a-clinking. How so? In the waning days of his failed presidency, Bush I invoked an obscure 1872 statute to give a Canadian firm, Barrick Corporation, the right to mine $10 billion in gold from U.S. public lands. (U.S. taxpayers got a whopping $10,000 fee in return.) Bush then joined Barrick as a highly-paid "international consultant," brokering deals with various dictators of his close acquaintance. Barrick reciprocated with big bucks for Junior's presidential run. And in another quid for the old pro quo, last year Junior dutifully approved Barrick's controversial acquisition of a major rival. (Barrick is also one of the biggest polluters in America, by the way.)

http://www.counterpunch.org/floyd02152003.html

Billions of Dollars at Stake

American Mineral Fields (AMFI), a consortium based originally in Hope, Ark.--yes, Bill Clinton's hometown--is a big player in exploiting Congo's mineral wealth. In 1997, just a month before Mobutu fell, it signed contracts with the Kabila-Rwanda-Uganda alliance forces for almost a billion dollars investment in copper, cobalt and zinc mines and processing plants in Kolwezi and Kipushi.

The industrial enterprises that set up AMFI, according to Baracyetse, "are interested in the contract for the construction of the orbital platform around the world that is destined to replace the Russian station MIR."

This project is part of the $60-billion so-called National Missile Defense system that George W. Bush, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of State Colin Powell and Vice President Richard Cheney are pushing so vigorously. Building the space station will require many of the rare metals found in eastern Congo.

Another big player in the eastern Congo is Barrick Gold Corp., headquartered in Canada. It is the world's second- largest gold producer after Anglo-American of South Africa.

This company was able in 1996 to get the Mobutu regime's Gold Office of Kilomoto, a government monopoly, to transfer mining rights over almost all its 82,000 square kilometers of land to Barrick. The land is estimated to have 100 tons of gold in reserve.

George Bush Sr. sat on the board of directors of Barrick, according to Baracyetse.

http://www.minesandcommunities.org/Company/kabila1.htm

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Lost War
Consumer demand for coltan fueling war in the Congo


The Lost World War

The war on Iraq is not the only war in the world and it is not the only war being fought for our material benefit. Western consumers’ seemingly insatiable demand for mobile phones, laptops, games consoles and other luxury electronic goods has been fuelling violent conflict and killing millions in the Democratic Republic of Congo (formerly Zaire). By Erik Vilwar.

Either side of an 1800 mile front-line, a country the size of western Europe with a population no larger than England’s has been carved up by warring factions and foreign armies from nine different countries, leaving millions dead or homeless. What little infrastructure dictator Mobutu Sese Seko did not wreck during his three decades of misrule has mostly been destroyed by fighting, or has finally succumbed to neglect.

The Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) is possibly the most mineral rich place on earth – though this has proved a curse to the people of the Congo. The Congo holds millions of tons of diamonds, copper, cobalt, zinc, manganese, uranium (the atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were built using Congolese uranium), and coltan. Coltan, a substance made up of columbium and tantalum, is a particularly valuable resource – used to make mobile phones, night vision goggles, fiber optics, and micro-capacitors.

What is Coltan?
Coltan looks like black mud, but is three times heavier than iron and only slightly lighter than gold. It is found in abundance in eastern Congo and can be mined with minimal equipment. Coltan is vital to the high tech economy. Wireless electronic communication would not exist without it. The ‘mud’ is refined into tantalum – a metallic element that is both a superb conductor of electricity and extremely heat-resistant. Tantalum powder is a vital component in capacitors, for the control of the flow of current in miniature circuit boards. Capacitors made of tantalum are found inside every laptop, pager, personal digital assistant, and mobile phone.1 Tantalum is also used in the aviation and atomic energy industries. A very small group of companies in the world process coltan. These include H.C.Starck (Germany, a subsidiary ot Bayer), Cabott Inc. (US), Ningxia (China), and Ulba (Kazakhstan). The world’s biggest coltan mines are in Australia and they account for about 60% of world production. It is generally believed, however, that 80% of the world’s reserves are in Africa, with DRC accounting for 80% of the African reserves.2

At the end of 2000, there was an unprecedented ‘gold rush for coltan’. Over a few months the price rose tenfold. In January 2000, an international trader would have paid between US$30 and US$40 for a pound (lb) of unprocessed coltan. By December 2000 the price has risen to US$380/lb. This dramatic price increase was driven by a sudden and steep rise in the demand for tantalum powder, caused by an overvaluation of the technology market triggered by a new generation of mobile phones and the consumer rush following the launch of the Sony Playstation 2.

At the height of the demand for coltan, it is known that Rwandan soldiers and other affiliated criminal groups were making roughly US$20 million a month solely from the trade in coltan.3 However, the coltan boom was short-lived and prices rapidly fell as more and more coltan came on to the market. By October 2001, coltan prices were back to where they started. In the meantime, thousands of destitute Congolese people had gone digging for the precious ore, a few international traders had made a fortune and millions of dollars had flowed to the parties waging war. Prices have fallen from the late 2000 peak, but the trade in coltan is still fuelling the war.

The human costs of this conflict have been horrific. According to the UN, up until last September, in the five Eastern provinces of DRC alone, between 3 and 3.5 million people had died directly because of the war. 4 Many were killed and tortured but most died of starvation and disease. The destruction of farms has resulted in malnutrition and starvation. Millions of people have been forced from their homes. Years of war have led to a social environment in which men abuse women on a staggering scale and children become instruments of war, forced to work in mines and conscripted into armed forces. Surveys in Butembo found that 90% of people were living on less than 20 cents a day and only one meal. 5
http://www.corporatewatch.org.uk/newsletter/issue13/issue13_part3.htm

With Rwanda making a $250 million profit in 1999-2000, this message will be hard to
hear from companies like Barrick Gold, America Mining Fields, and Bechtel. The DRC’s
child soldiers will find little support from Western companies whose interests are not
seriously threatened by the war, so the pillaging for Coltan will continue unchecked.
Unlike diamonds, which can be traced back to their country and mine of origin, Coltan is processed and melted before it is used in capacitors, so tracking it is impossible. This is great news for countries illegally mining Coltan in the DRC as well as for companies using the mineral in their product. Coltan changes several hands before ever reaching a known company, like Motorola. All of this plays into the favor of large corporations who claim not to know where the Coltan they use is mined.

Motorola responded to pressure from fans of Leonardo DiCaprio, who bombarded the company with demands to obtain Coltan legally. Motorola, whose motto is “Intelligence Everywhere,” claims

We believe we have done as much as any reasonable company could do by mandating compliance from our suppliers on this important issue. Should we learn of non-compliance, we would immediately investigate, work with the supplier to remedy the situation or, if necessary, terminate our relationship with the supplier.

Their major two Coltan processors are Cabot and Starck, but both these companies admit that during times of shortage which happen routinely, they buy their Coltan from unreliable sources.

Amnesty International has been working tirelessly to bring the plight of the Congolese people to the forefront. Press releases, like those from Motorola, are a slap in the face of their efforts. “Statements of goodwill are an important step by companies, but in order to address the impact that their business can have on the rights and well being of ordinary people, legal mechanisms of accountability are needed beyond commitments to voluntary approaches.”

Until the American public pressures these companies to ensure that the Coltan powering their PC’s did not come at the cost of the innocent in the DRC, the horror of the immorality of Western Companies in Africa will continue.

http://www.interactorg.com/Coltan%20vs%20King%20Kong.htm



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-26-04 10:49 PM
Response to Original message
8. Thank you for the article Mari333
Folks like you are the reason I have such optimism for the future.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
maggrwaggr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-27-04 01:03 AM
Response to Original message
9. a kick for the new day
:kick:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mattforclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-27-04 01:05 AM
Response to Original message
10. If I controlled the DOD budget
that nuclear weapons/SDI funding that we don't need would go to something that we do, like more troops, and better conditions for the troops that we already have, for example.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-27-04 08:04 AM
Response to Original message
11. Most likely the reason the Bush family are in the SCOTUS
on the 28th. attempting to sequester Cheney's "sensitive" Energy papers from public scrutiny while diligently labeling anything pertaining to nuclear warheads as "sensitive", (rather than spelling it out) top secret classified information, necessary for national security using Executive Privilege as the foil.

When in reality, the above mentioned program's special funding need the go ahead from the Appropriation's and Defense Committees, who I assume, (giving them the benefit of the doubt) go along blindly satisfied with just a smattering of knowledge of Bush's actual plan.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-27-04 08:32 AM
Response to Original message
12. This Administration is a danger to ALL humanity and should be removed..
Edited on Tue Apr-27-04 08:33 AM by Tellurian
immediately. They are going to opt for Marshal law as soon as the polls reflect no hope of Bush being elected and Kerry's election for the presidency is assured. Reading the above, they have drastically moved up their timetable to 18 mos rather than the original proposal of 2-3 yrs, which means by the end of this year they will be in full implementation mode, thereby becoming the greatest threat to humanity, the world has ever known.

No wonder Bush's answer, wrt Freudian slip, when asked: "How will history view his arbitrary invasion into Iraq," he answered, "We'll All Be Dead!"

The obsessive paranoid 'get them' before they 'get us', mentality, is what is running this country. We cannot afford to wait and hope an election will be the solution to the danger facing all of us. We should be thinking of erring on the side of caution, asking questions later.

“The necessity of the times, more than ever, calls for our utmost circumspection” (Samuel Adams).

This dilemma has to be taken seriously, our very lives depend on it.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
truthspeaker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-27-04 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
13. "Free nations don't develop weapons of mass destruction" - Bush
Edited on Tue Apr-27-04 08:35 AM by truthspeaker
He said it in a speech in Wisconsin last year( http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/10/20031003-4.html">WH Press Release). Short memory.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tellurian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-27-04 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Say one thing and Do Another...is there Modus Operandi-
Once their nuclear programs are complete, they will rule the world with an Iron Fist. They will expect absolute subjugation from every country and every human being on the planet. All great and small will be subject to their pecuniary motives one way or another. You'll be given a choice, work with them or for them. If you choose neither, you will be sent to a detention facility wrt Wakenhut, as an enemy(combatant)of the state until you come to your senses, or worse executed, because of spacial limitations.

Maybe the above paragraph sounds a little bit over the top but if it's any consolation, I have consistently underestimated their resolve in creating an Imperialist Totalitarian regime.

Reading the information so kindly posted by Mari, bigtree and seemslikeadream is the reality slap, we need daily to maintain our focus of the megalith we are really up against.


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
maggrwaggr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-27-04 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. HA! I say HA!
what a fucking lying sack of shit.

THESE ARE THE CAMPAIGN ADS WE CAN MAKE.

Or somebody should be making them.

Bush is his own worst enemy goddamnit!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Apr 24th 2024, 07:37 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC