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Going Dutch - How an American in Holland learned to love the European welfare state.

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groovedaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 12:03 PM
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Going Dutch - How an American in Holland learned to love the European welfare state.
PICTURE ME, IF YOU WILL, as I settle at my desk to begin my workday, and feel free to use a Vermeer image as your template. The pale-yellow light that gives Dutch paintings their special glow suffuses the room. The interior is simple, with high walls and beams across the ceiling. The view through the windows of the 17th-century house in which I have my apartment is of similarly gabled buildings lining the other side of one of Amsterdam’s oldest canals. Only instead of a plump maid or a raffish soldier at the center of the canvas, you should substitute a sleep-rumpled writer squinting at a laptop.

For 18 months now I’ve been playing the part of the American in Holland, alternately settling into or bristling against the European way of life. Many of the features of that life are enriching. History echoes from every edifice as you move through your day. The bicycle is not a means of recreation but a genuine form of transportation. A nearby movie house sells not popcorn but demitasses of espresso and glasses of Dutch gin from behind a wood-paneled bar, which somehow makes you feel sane and adult and enfolded in civilization.

Then there are the features of European life that grate on an American sensibility, like the three-inch leeway that drivers deign to grant you on the highway, or the cling film you get from the supermarket, which clings only to itself. But such annoyances pale in comparison to one other. For the first few months I was haunted by a number: 52. It reverberated in my head; I felt myself a prisoner trying to escape its bars. For it represents the rate at which the income I earn, as a writer and as the director of an institute, is to be taxed. To be plain: more than half of my modest haul, I learned on arrival, was to be swallowed by the Dutch welfare state. Nothing in my time here has made me feel so much like an American as my reaction to this number. I am politically left of center in most ways, but from the time 52 entered my brain, I felt a chorus of voices rise up within my soul, none of which I knew I had internalized, each a ghostly simulacrum of a right-wing, supply-side icon: Ronald Reagan, Jack Kemp, Rush Limbaugh. The grim words this chorus chanted in defense of my hard-earned income I recognized as copied from Charlton Heston’s N.R.A. rallying cry about prying his gun from his cold, dead hands.

And yet as the months rolled along, I found the defiant anger softening by intervals, thanks to a succession of little events and awarenesses. One came not long ago. Logging into my bank account, I noted with fleeting but pleasant confusion the arrival of two mysterious payments of 316 euros (about $410) each. The remarks line said “accommodation schoolbooks.” My confusion was not total. On looking at the payor — the Sociale Verzekeringsbank, or Social Insurance Bank — I nodded with sage if partial understanding. Our paths had crossed several times before. I have two daughters, you see. Every quarter, the SVB quietly drops $665 into my account with the one-word explanation kinderbijslag, or child benefit. As the SVB’s Web site cheerily informed me when I went there in bewilderment after the first deposit: “Babies are expensive. Nappies, clothes, the pram . . . all these things cost money. The Dutch government provides for child benefit to help you with the costs of bringing up your child.” Any parents living in the country receive quarterly payments until their children turn 18. And thanks to a recently passed law, the state now gives parents a hand in paying for school materials.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/03/magazine/03european-t.html?th&emc=th
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dipsydoodle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 12:16 PM
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1. You'd get roughly the same child benefit
for two children up to age 16 in the UK. You'd also only pay 20% standard tax up c. £35000 and 40% on the margin thereafter although addtional NH payments may bring that up to the Dutch level.
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/childbenefit/introduction.htm

You'd also have our UK National Health Service - not sure how the equivalent functions in Holland.
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MISSDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 12:50 PM
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2. Fascinating article. He learned to love it except for....
The reasons that he did not love it were actually kinda small compared to the good side. It is a long article but well worth it.
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Blue_Tires Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 01:01 PM
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3. k+r
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comtec Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 02:46 PM
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4. 52%? DAMN you make a fair ammount
IIRC that's around 50/60k Euros... that goes a long way here.
I think I'm under the 30% ruling, or maybe it's just that I only make 32k€ dunno.
But it's not exactly true that you pay 52% of your income to tax - weird tax system.
How it has been explained to me you pay 32% on everything, then you pay an additional 10% between 36k and 46/50k, then you pay another 10% on the rest...
so it's 32% till 36k, then 42% between 36k and the next amount (54k?) then 52% on the rest...

so instead of loosing over half off the bat you end up loosing something like 46% total...

mind you that is N O T an insignificant amount, and i have SERIOUS issues with the ENTIRE BULK of the tax code being on the breaking spines of the middle class...

but you can live, rather well here on that.

there are also many tax tricks... so many in fact that my wife and I just pay our accountant. whatever it is, it's worth it, our tax returns average 8k every year between the two of us. partially because of all the money we get back because we have a mortgage on our house. ironically that's worth more than actually owning it outright, because of the massive tax deduction on the interest we pay (and our interest is low at 4+%).

but for the rest...

ik heb absoluut GEEN houden for dit rot land. niks, niet het klienste stukje!

I will say this.. all that "holland is so open and accepting" crap is utter bullshit!

it was better, and the people who were here before rita ver donk (think newt with tits and a complexion) and wilders (think.... hitler youth... NOT i'm NOT joking), say holland was a great place for free thinkers. I don't know how much I exactly believe the free thinker part, NL is about as homogenized as it gets.... but at the same time the dutch leze faire attitude has it's advantages.

all my assorted bitching aside... much as i have complaints about my new home, i really don't see a place for me in california anymore.

kut taal, kut land, maar, waar anders mag ik gaan?
Ik heb geen land meer, geen echte thuis.
Ik heb niks, dus.. ik blijf.

don't be fooled, living here is hard, just plain hard.
The expectations you have, all the bs you hear about it, actually makes it harder when you realize the reality. The Netherlands is no better (or worse) than any other european country. If there was more honestly about how hollad really was, I think i would have adjusted better... even though I will never be rid of the title allochtonen.

that aside... YAY Lidl's open on sundays now! no more scurrying around on saturday! LOL :)
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southernyankeebelle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 03:08 PM
Response to Original message
5. IN GERMANY THEY HAVE WHAT IS CALLED A KINDERGALD ALSO =
THEY WANT THE LOCAL GERMANS TO HAVE MORE CHILDREN BECAUSE THEIR POPULATION IS DROPPING. THE PROBLEM IS THAT THE IMMGRANTS ARE TAKING ADVANTAGE OF IT. SO ITS GOOD ON ONE HAND AND BAD ON THE OTHER.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #5
15. Uninformed, ignorant and racist post.
:puke:
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barbtries Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 03:20 PM
Response to Original message
6. that was a terrific article
i wonder if there's a dutch family who would like to adopt a 53-year-old girl from the states?
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ihavenobias Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
7. K & R, I'm intrigued by this and look forward to reading it. n/t
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groovedaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-04-09 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
8. There is a huge amount of ignorance in this country about what goes on in Europe (or
Edited on Mon May-04-09 04:49 PM by groovedaddy
in most other countries, for that matter).
People here see that tax rate and go balistic. But what do they get for their money? Quite a lot, it seems.
There was another article in our local paper today about the "swine flue" recommendations - i.e., don't go to work. The article said that 48% of working Americans have no sick leave, sick days, at all. I don't get sick days. I've gone to work sick. I'd rather not, but necessity motivates me to go to work and plug my way to a paycheck.
Europeans are big on not burning out their workforce, making people take vacations, typically, at least 4 weeks a year.
Our working class in this country has a severe lack of organizing capacity to push for our wants and needs. I'm sick of it!
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Blue_Tires Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:24 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. excellent points
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BridgeTheGap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:08 AM
Response to Original message
9. Is it the nanny state or is it taking care of people's basic needs?
I think it's the latter. But there is definately a different mindset in this country. I think it's the result of a "divide and conquer" strategy on the part of those who don't want unions, don't want their applecart upset in any way.
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comtec Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Nanny state is a BS term the reich wingers in the UK came up with to discredit their own system!!!
The idea of setting up a state system that takes care of people and children's basic needs is anathema to them.
You get gits like clarkson, and the torries saying how horrible it is, while it keeps their sorry asses protected if anything were to happen to them.

but that's my two cents.

I like the idea of taking care of those less than desirable, keeping them out of the work force, yet just taken care of enough they don't go on crime sprees.

There is no reason to become a major criminal when the government takes care of your health, housing, and basic food needs.
it's not a great lifestyle by any means, but its one you can live with dignity on.

yes we pay VERY high taxes (in Holland sales tax is 19%) and I could easily rant about that.

But the train system is reasonably reliable (unless it rains, or you look at it slant ways) and mostly on time (unless you fart n the wrong direction), the buses are usually on time(mine is reliably 2 fucking minutes early every damn day... except when it matters - THEN it's late), and the medical system is fairly modern (just the doctors are fucking lazy.... and over worked)

Overall the infrastructure is very solid (actually it is, bitching aside, it is solid)
i don't worry about bridges collapsing, or my trains de-railing.
we don't have high speed rail, because the runs are way too short, but we do have fast-ish rail that is direct and reliable.

Tax €uros at work =]
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groovedaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. In the U.S., the overwhelming majority of people who ever receive welfare, do so
for only a short period of time. The number of people who stay on welfare here is fairly small. But that's who gets focused on and why "welform reform" became such a big deal.
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BridgeTheGap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #9
17. A Nanny is someone who takes care of someone else...but you're right, the term is loaded
toward evoking a reaction in people. Looks like it still works too!
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LittleGirl Donating Member (377 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 09:39 AM
Response to Original message
12. thanks for posting
I've lived in Germany for 2.5 yrs now and it's much longer than I planned and we're hoping to leave soon. Many of the author's points I've discovered on my own too. The no-sunday shopping is one to get used to but germans/europeans spend their sundays relaxing, reading, or taking bike rides with the family. Not such a bad idea for those American family values. 30 days of vacation time is nothing to sneeze at.

Germans are a peaceful people and all of them just want a good quality of life. They don't work when they are on vacation. They don't pry into your private life and ask you about your religious faith. They show up to work everyday and on time. When they party, they party hard - oktoberfest anyone? To see them stomp their feet while they stand on the tables would be forbidden in America. They are sometimes gruff and rude but if you ask for help, they will oblige. I really wish more Americans would learn what socialism is and how it can be a decent life. I guess they too would have to live in europe to get the big picture.
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Blue_Tires Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. welcome to the site!
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groovedaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. American's have been thoroughly propagandized against socialism, though, with a little
education, that can change. In my college days, I belonged to a trotskyite party. I also worked in a factory, was a union member and organized around socialist politics. There was a negative reaction at first, but because I stuck around and did good work in the union, people would give a listen to explanations of what socialism was. It really surprised me how many people came around.

Most Americans view socialism as "statist" - everything is done for the sake of the state. The individual's ONLY purpose is to serve the state. While there is no doubt that this can happen - whether from the left or right (fascism)- my view was that, ultimately, if socialism came to be, there would also be civil liberties. I have adjusted my views considerably, i.e. I am not entirely opposed to private property.

Still, if we have a truly democratic society, I believe it will trend toward some form of socialism, much as it has happened in Europe.

Ultimately, we have to answer the question: what is the truth worth of human being? And how do we construct a society that honors that instrinsic worth? I also believe that any society should foster a sense of responsibility in the individual. But that has to be balanced with the good of society as a whole.
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