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Bjorn Against Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 09:38 PM
Original message
We are Wisconsin HQ destroyed in Fire
Edited on Sat Jul-30-11 09:48 PM by Bjorn Against
Source: Daily Kos

The We Are Wisconsin headquarters in La Crosse, Wisconsin, was totally destroyed in a fire that started at 9:30 a.m. today and is still burning. There were staff in the building when the fire started, but all were evacuated and are safe. At this time, there is no indication of the cause of the fire.

An article in the La Crosse Tribune has photos showing the extent of the fire that spread to adjoining buildings.

State Representative Jennifer Shilling, who is running against Republican Senator Dan Kapanke in one of the state's recall elections, is going to need assistance following this fire. The recall election is less than two weeks away and this is going to seriously impact her get-out-the-vote effort.

Read more: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/30/1000880/-We-Ar...



We need to demand a very thorough investigation into this fire, it is more than a bit suspicious that something like this would happen just days before the recall elections.
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CelticThunder Donating Member (460 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. EXTREMELY suspicious. No doubt in my mind it was arson.
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #1
22. Let's wait for the evidence, OK?
Still, as you say, very suspicious.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #22
46. That's fine - you should do that
the rest of us will settle for the obvious conclusion.
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joeglow3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 08:08 AM
Response to Reply #46
138. Ahhh. The "progressive" value of guilty until proved innocent
Ain't hypocrisy fun?

Yeah, I think I will stick to my core convictions and not sell them out the second it benefits me.
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RedCloud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 08:23 AM
Response to Reply #138
139. Have you checked the assassination and accidental death scoreboard for the past 50 years?
Once you do that, then tell me which side has a lot of renegades in its base. Then go to the BBC for the RFK murder and watch how many CIA killers are actually in the crowd that fateful day.
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joeglow3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #139
144. What does that prove?
Your "statistics" are the same attempts used by the right to assume guilt. Gas station robbed? Must be a black man. Woman mugged? Must be a black man.

Sorry, but your attempt to a justification is not enough for me to sell out my core convictions.
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-03-11 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #138
148. Hmm...
This sort of reminds me of the people that shouted at those of us claiming election fraud in Ohio in 2004 to "wait for the evidence." Oddly enough those same people were utterly silent or absent after the evidence mounted.
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sulphurdunn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #22
71. Sure.
By the way, how did the Prosser selection by the Waukesha County ballot scandal and cluster fuck recount work for you?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 09:47 PM
Response to Original message
2. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
IthinkThereforeIAM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
26. Yep...

... those were my first thoughts, too. All it would take is a known malfunctioning 4'x4' space heater plugged in some where "out of the way", like say where paper products are stored...?

You can fill in the blanks with words from the OP news clip.
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durablend Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #26
49. A space heater in July?!? n/t
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villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 09:51 PM
Response to Original message
3. There will be no investigation, and the message from the other side is becoming clearer by the day.
The only remaining political question left is "what are we going to do about it?"
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patrice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
18. Join in the work of their fight, I hope. In any way possible, even just friending their FB page
and sharing it even though they aren't posting often.

Supportive commenting articles about them on the internet. Twittering and any other social software.

There's the other usual stuff to do, same as in any election cycle. I know some people, teachers, who went up there to help them out.
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
4. More evil fuckers in that corner.
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Merlot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 10:21 PM
Response to Original message
5. We're seeing what lengths they will go to to stay in power.
they used to be more covert.
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. They do not care. It is ALL IN.
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Sportsguy Donating Member (389 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
14. They Will Kill To Stay In Power
Makes me wonder about Prosser's assault of Ann Walsh Bradley. If that room would have been empty . . . :scared:
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dogmoma56 Donating Member (329 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #14
41. watch this... new BBC Documentary on RFK .. >>>Link>>>
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1monster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #41
105. Thank you for the link. Saved to watch later.
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lunasun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #14
52. They Will Kill To Stay In Power
Yes and endless examples of this ......how many plane crashes/ assassinations and of course headquarters being messed with in the past????

Im sure there was some laughs at a bar somewhere after told the dirty deed was done by someone else in the name of freedom
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #5
83. they do it...
because no one calls them on it.
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Politicalboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 10:28 PM
Response to Original message
6. It's time to have
Surveillance camera's around political figures buildings. Or hopefully there were camera's somewhere to catch the arsonist.
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sakabatou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
7. I would like to see the report before pointing fingers.
Edited on Sat Jul-30-11 10:43 PM by sakabatou
But it is suspicious.
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Sportsguy Donating Member (389 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
8. These Dems (& Others) Need 24-Hour Protection, Ay Least Until AFTER The Elections
This is not a joke!
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. 500% agreement!
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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #8
39. Maybe even AFTER the elections if a Dem wins.
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:00 AM
Response to Reply #8
60. We need a worker's militia...........
For a LOT of protective purposes. Not only candidates, but for demonstrations, strikes, really anywhere leftish people are going to gather to challenge the power structure especially the proto fascists. THIS time I want the new Brown Shirts to have a REAL fight.

And lest anybody misreads this, THIS IS FOR SELF DEFENSE ONLY!
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #60
89. And your proposal is different from other "militias"... how? n/t
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #89
92. Because I know whose side I'm on
and left wing militias would be for self defense only. After all THEY are attacking us.
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #92
98. That's the same claim the others make.
Just sayin'....
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #98
99. And your point is?
This is a left centrist web site, or so I was told. Because the fascists are out there, I don't want what passes for the left in this country to be caught by surpirse and undefended by the new American Brown Shirts. Because I certainly don't expect the government to protect me from those Brown Shirts. Whose side are you on?
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #99
104. I'm saying that your reasoning/reasons are identical to the claims made....
by the other side of the political spectrum.

Both sides consider theirs to be the side of truth, justice and the American way. Neither side is, of course, wholly correct or incorrect on their assumptions.

And having militias organised along purely political ideologies strikes me as a particularly bad/dangerous idea. I may be wrong, but I really don't like the idea of internally Balkanizing ourselves.
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #104
117. As another poster in this sub thread intimated
I'm not a member of the "Equivalency Brigade". Just because I defend myself when you take a poke at me, that doesn't make me equivalent to you who took the poke. Extrapolating from that analogy, if a left militia defends our bodies and ideals against Brown Shirt aggression, then I'm all for it and I DON'T consider that equivalent to burning out a union organization HQ. Or shooting a House member in the head. Or killing almost a hundred kids at a left political youth camp in Norway. If you think that we're just all the same, then that your privilege, but I consider that a false equivalence.

What I think is a bad idea is to leave the proto fascists with all the guns and organization. I'd rather have Balkanization than genocide.
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-03-11 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #104
149. Yeah...
It was a good thing that most leftists in Germany in the 1930's didn't form militias to defend themselves. Sure some did, but thankfully most decided not to band together for mutual protection. I mean things worked out ok there... didn't they?
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #99
106. P.S. I'm on the side of the United States and the U.S. Constitution.
Seems like a pretty progressive/liberal/Democrat position to me. YMMV
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #106
118. Well I'm on the side of the working class
Period.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #98
113. Really? How many Repuke HQ have been torched recently?
How many Repuke reps have been shot in the head?

Are you of the "both sides are equally guilty" brigade?
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 11:58 PM
Response to Reply #113
134. I have seen no evidence that any of these actions were deliberately
ochestrated political violence.

Unless I've missed some breaking news (been out of the house for the last 8 hours), I've seen no evidence that the fire was even arson, for any reason.

If you have evidence, please cite it. Until then, this is simply hysterical fear-mongering... and that's supposed to be the other side's job.
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U4ikLefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-03-11 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #134
151. You didn't answer the questions.
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #60
90. Deleted double-post. n/t
Edited on Sun Jul-31-11 01:38 PM by PavePusher
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Grassy Knoll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
11. Can't beat em, Burn em........
This Walker Fauker needs to be in prison.
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postulater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:01 PM
Response to Original message
12. Just drove by Walker's house in Wauwatosa.
Recall Walker signs on nearby lawns.

And he has a 24 hour police car posted just across the street.
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Sportsguy Donating Member (389 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. I LIke That:)
Thanks!
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jellen Donating Member (300 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #13
132. sports guy- who is that pic? n/t
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Sportsguy Donating Member (389 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #132
142. Paul Wellstone
And I miss him.
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. It is awesome to see!
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dogmoma56 Donating Member (329 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #12
42. take a picture.. dont let em see you do it or you'll be arrested as a terrorist
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Stumbler Donating Member (599 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:09 PM
Response to Original message
15. Must've been Muslim extremists...
Edited on Sat Jul-30-11 11:10 PM by Stumbler
Right? I mean we all know there's absolutely no chance a white 'Christian' conservative or group of them would do anything like this, right? Right?
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
16. What kind of help will she need to overcome this? If anyone can get
specifics it will help. I am assuming that all her campaign literature was in that building? Voter lists? What else?


I want to be careful about pointing fingers but I want am immediate investigation before the election. We deserve to know what happened here.
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sybylla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. We Are Wisconsin is a union organization.
By law, they cannot coordinate with the Democratic Party, whose office was two doors down from We Are Wisconsin. The La Crosse Dems had to close their office today because of smoke coming in through the ventilation system. They took it in stride and moved operations to a nearby park. Thank goodness the weather cooperated.

At any rate, the candidate for senate, Jennifer Shilling, is doing fine. She had her GOTV kickoff today. John "Bowzer" Bauman will be there tomorrow to rally the troops.

This fire does not affect the campaign. It only affects any union support she might get in these final days.

My guess is that We Are Wisconsin will be back up and running in another building soon. I believe you can find them on Act Blue if you want to contribute to help their efforts.

The same is true for Jen Shilling - Why not give to the candidate directly?

http://www.jennifershilling.com

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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Thank you. And I am glad the campaign is okay. If I know anything
about unions - they will be up and going again in not time. Especially if this was deliberate. Keep the fight up.
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Frank Cannon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:55 AM
Response to Reply #19
48. Didn't know Bowzer was a Dem, but I shouldn't be surprised.
I've always liked that guy. He's been instrumental in getting the "Truth in Musical Advertising Act" passed in most of the country. That's the law that says (among other things) that in order to perform as a group under the name that the group recorded under, that band has to have at least one original recording member in it--preventing, for instance, a bunch of different Badfingers with no connection to any of the hits from working the motel lounge scene and ripping people off.
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sybylla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #48
77. This is his second GOTV tour through the state to help out all the recall candidates
He came through the week before the primary to get volunteers out. Now that we're 9 days from the general, he's coming through again.

It's awesome.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #19
62. Maybe this should be it's own thread
Contribute to Jennifer Shilling.
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bkkyosemite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jul-30-11 11:46 PM
Response to Original message
21. Read a report today about RNC's
and how they are going to do their best to stop the recalls and protect Walker...hmmmm who is responsible..since both stories this one and that one come out today...hmmm just wondering
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SoapBox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:03 AM
Response to Original message
23. K & R
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krispos42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:14 AM
Response to Original message
24. Well, isn't this convenient.
This could only be more convenient if the fire was caused by a light plane carrying Russ Feingold and his senior staff crashing in to the building.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:46 AM
Response to Original message
25. Agree this is supicious, indeed --
the rise of the right can only happen via violence -- !!

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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:54 AM
Response to Original message
27. this will not stop an angry badger
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Fokker Trip Donating Member (222 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #27
100. Off topic...
That Badgers's gums look very sore. Gingivitis? His/her teeth Need a good cleaning, going by my experience with cat gums. Who wants to hold the badger while I clean? lol.

On topic, I'll lay some money on arson.
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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #100
111. Some on the right will do anything .... this is war to them
1) I have my money on the people of Wisconsin they are really pissed.

b) Do not google the definition of the term "Angry Badger" :rofl:

iii) As far as the badger's hygiene you are on your own.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RqJFza3sbE&feature=rela...
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:54 AM
Response to Original message
28. Rep. Darrell Issa
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Scuba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:56 AM
Response to Original message
29. K & R Buildings in this location are ancient, but plenty suspicious. As we've seen...
...on both Federal and State fronts, there is no action beneath the Republican party. I agree that they are "all in".
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jerseyjack Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 07:07 AM
Response to Original message
30. There is no need for a thorough investigation into the fire's cause.
It was the same people who burned the Reichstag in 1933. They bought a new home in Wisconsin.
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #30
66. Yep, it definitely has the smell of a Brown Shirt
Proto fascist for now, but getting more and more fascist each day. We need a worker's militia. Even more so now that I read this is a union org.

Welcome to DU.
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tcaudilllg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 07:25 AM
Response to Original message
31. Arson. Most definitely.
It's something Walker would do.
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DFW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 07:48 AM
Response to Original message
32. Wisconsin Republicans must REALLY be worried (Rove and the Kochs, too)
To resort to this kind of drastic measure. It won't (I hope) escape the citizens
of Wisconsin just who it is that was supposed to benefit from this arson, and
what the timing of the fire signifies.

I just sent Shilling $1000. I usually don't get heavily involved in local stuff
like this, but this kind of KKK-like thuggery went on long enough in the South.
I recognize it for what it is, and it burns me up today the same way it did in
the sixties, when I was too young and helpless to do anything about it.
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classof56 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #32
47. Kudos!
While Rove and the Kochs must be worried, I am becoming more and more concerned about what they might do next. Gotta keep singing the battle hymn of the sixties--We Shall Overcome!

Tired Old Cynic
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Deep13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
33. You've GOT to be kidding.
This is what it has come to, then.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #33
67. Yes, unfortunately only one side is fighting
and that doesn't bode well for the other side.
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barbtries Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 07:59 AM
Response to Original message
34. anyone here doubting
whether the republicans in WI would stoop to burning down a building to get their way? not me.
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Yon_Yonson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:15 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. Sorry to hear this and my first though was also evil doings
After what I witnessed in Ft. Atkinson with the Herr Walker's convoy nothing would surprise me anymore about these NEOCON rat turds.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

:nuke:
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #34
65. Vacant warehouses are frequent targets of arson fires
Both by fire bugs, and by owners wishing to cash in on insurance.
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #65
72. just a coincidence,
move along, nothing to see here. . .
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #72
73. I invented something once
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #65
114. Are campaign HQ?
I am missing the point
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #114
123. I think it's possible that the warehouse was the actual target of an arson, if there was one
The campaign HQ could be collateral damage.

I don't know, I don't have enough information, blah blah blah woof woof meow.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:11 AM
Response to Original message
35. Jennifer Shilling act blue-
https://secure.actblue.com/directory/query?query=Jennif...

sent some, you should too.
even if it wasn't her office, she will need the extra help.

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bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #35
107. Thanks for the link. I contributed and left a 20% tip for ActBlue. nt
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bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #107
108. Suggest that every democrat reading this thread contribute. nt
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #108
112. even if it is only $5-10.
every dollar counts in a rush like this.
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Yon_Yonson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 05:18 AM
Response to Reply #35
135. Consider it done
Lets get these fine people up and running fast ... they got honest elections to run
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marions ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:18 AM
Response to Original message
37. Not unusual around election time in the old South
maybe something new for Wisconsin.
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Yon_Yonson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:18 AM
Response to Original message
38. How can we donate to get them up and running again?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #38
45. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #38
109. Donate to ActBlue. Admin gave the link above. nt
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Yon_Yonson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #109
129. Thanks -already done
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PuffedMica Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
40. Probably just some crazy, mixed up, lonewolf, vigilante


    Must have just picked up the idea to go after a campaign headquarters from some innocent article they saw on the internet


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Frank Cannon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #40
50. These lone nuts are becoming so numerous, they should start a support group.
Since they seem to repeatedly and almost exclusively target Dems and progressives and anyone else who might be against a fundamentalist or fascist agenda, I suggest they start meeting at their local Republican headquarters for coffee, donuts, and "sharing".
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
43. Same MO as the Nazis.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:44 AM
Response to Original message
44. I guess the polls weren't going well for the Repukes
and I'm pretty sure we'll "fight back" by signing some petitions.

Let me know when were going to start hitting back.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #44
51. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
53. This may have a reverse effect on election Like Caenahan
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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:23 AM
Response to Original message
54. And even if it is determined not to be arson
There will undoubtedly be some in here who will flat out not believe it. Glad no one was hurt. And knowing several Wisconsinites, I have little doubt that Ms. Shilling will recieve enormous amounts of help in her gotv efforts. They have come too far to stop now.

I also wish to say that since I have no idea whether or not this was an arson fire, I am not going to debate it. The police and fire officials will do their jobs and determine what happened and then, and only then, will I make any judgement as to what happened.
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #54
63. If it's determined not to be arson, that would be a cover-up
In fact, anyone who believes it wasn't is a hard-core Didiot. Be meek and timid if you want, but please try to maintain a grasp on reality - that Republicans are murderous psychopaths
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Marnie Donating Member (706 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
55. I have been callig the RepoCons Nazi and the Brown Shirts
since DeLay sent thugs to stop the recount in 2000.

Now will everybody please take their blinders off.

This sounds like a serious fire. Not the garden variety overheated overloaded socket or fried old Xerox that over indulged in paper.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
56. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #56
58. I do care about civility.
You are soo sooo soooooooooooooo far fucking out of line it isn't funny.



Tansy Gold
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #58
64. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #58
69. Just curious. Are you a pacifist?
Does you civility extend to not fighting back when attacked? Not a shot because I'm honestly curious.
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Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:01 PM
Response to Reply #69
79. I am not opposed to self-defense but I am most
definitely opposed to the kind of pre-emptive "defense" measures that appear to be advocated by some posters on this thread.

We do not know for sure yet just what caused this fire, but we have people already posting on this thread (fortunately now deleted) that we go out and start killing people on the basis of speculation. If being opposed to this kind of violent over reaction makes me a pacifist, then yes, I am.

This is the kind of reaction we saw from the rightwing after the OKC bombing and after 9/11. We saw a Sikh murdered here in Arizona because he was wearing a turban and some ignorant nutcase decided all persons wearing turbans must be murderers so he took the "law" into his own hands and killed an innocent person.

We are not yet Libya. We are not yet Yemen. We are not yet Egypt.

Some people here need to read -- or at least watch, if their attention spans are too short -- "The Ox-Bow Incident." Or "To Kill a Mockingbird."



Tansy Gold
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #79
81. Sometimes self defense extends to an entire class
nm
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Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #81
85. "Self-defense" implies an immediate and/or imminent threat
against an identified assailant. Going around setting fire to buildings or killing people simply because they might be thinking about doing something is merely looking for an excuse. I don't condone that for one single second.

Look, I lost virtually every real-life friend I have a couple weeks ago because an asshole Republican called me a liar in front of these "friends" and when I spoke of for myself, NO ONE, not one single person out of the two dozen with whom I socialized on an almost daily basis, would come to my defense. Many of them were lifelong Democrats, some had even held elective office as Democrats, but not one would so much as tell the fat bald stupid asshole that he was out of line accusing me -- out loud, in a very public place, as well as in broadcast e-mails -- of lying and of practicing law without a license. He threatened to have me arrested on that latter charge.

What had I done to merit this? I had told someone that it is illegal in the state of Arizona to write someone a post-dated check when you know full well there are insufficient funds in the account and that the bank on which the check is drawn will not cover your overdraft. Of the ten or twelve people who were together when this happen, all of whom had been my "friends," not one single person said a word in my defense. People I had been friends with for several years, people I had done business with, people who later told me yes, the fat bald puke was wrong, he should never have said what he said, BUT they would not come to my defense because they would rather put up with his bullshit than make a scene. They would rather let him do whatever he wanted, say whatever he wanted to or about me than defend me..

I have no love for those who refuse to stand up for their principles; if you won't stand up for them, you don't have them. But as repulsed as I was by the fat bald old puke's actions, as much as it hurt me both financially and emotionally to stand by my principles and not have anything to do with people who won't stand by theirs, I would never contemplate any kind of violence against the fat bald old asshole or anyone like him, unless and until I saw him as an immediate threat to someone's physical well-being.

Do I advocate we all become martyrs and let the rightwing walk all over us? If you've read any of my posts here on DU you know damn well that's not what I advocate. But there are lots of avenues between rolling (or bending) over and targeting random suspects for vigilante justice.



Tansy Gold
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:47 PM
Response to Reply #85
95. Who said anything about "targeting random suspects
Edited on Sun Jul-31-11 01:49 PM by socialist_n_TN
for viglante justice."? I didn't. But when it comes to my class being destroyed by the capitalist power structure, that means myself, my family, all my friends, and indeed everybody who thinks politically the way I do, then I believe in self defense for this, MY, class. Because I KNOW whose side I'm on. It comes down to whether you believe that the working class is under attack. I do.

Now don't mistake this for some sort of random violence. If you know anything about the tendencies in Marxism, you would know that the Trotskyist tendency is (and always has been) against random, anarchistic acts of terrorism and violence. Because it does no good. For every stooge who dies is replaced by another stooge.

But yes I do believe in self defense personally and for my class.
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Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #95
103. I do not believe in unprovoked violence
If you are suggesting that you have personally selected individuals as targets for your "class defense," then I believe you are still advocating violence as an appropriate response in class warfare.

Do I consider people like Scott Walker, Rand Paul, Eric Cantor, Michele Bachmann, et alia, enemies of my class? Yes, of course I do. Do I think that they mean immediate or imminent physical harm to individuals of my class? No, I do not.

The point is, are you or are you not advocating violence against your (perceived) enemies? Do you believe it is justified to begin killing people who you claim -- on whatever evidence you choose to provide -- are enemies of your class? And if you are NOT advocating violence against them, what ARE you advocating?


Tansy Gold
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #103
115. Violence has now been provoked
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Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #115
119. No, it has not.
All you know at this point is that there has been a fire. You have no fucking clue how it started, whether it was arson or fucking paint rags and spontaneous combustion. Even if it was arson, you don't know who did it or why. Yet you're ready to go out and start shooting people, setting other fires, causing who know how much damage and possibly loss of life to completely innocent people?

You don't have to answer to me. You can bluster and strut here on DU all you fucking want. But just as we've all pretty much agreed that the blowhards like Limbaugh and Hannity and Palin and so on can incite violence, you're doing the same damn thing.

If that's what you want, if you really want all-out civil war, then I suggest you turn off your computer and go out there and do whatever it is you think needs to be done. Otherwise, try being a little more reasonable for a change.



TG
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #103
120. How many working class and poor are going to die
because of the policies enacted by the ruling class against us? Does it have to strike you as an individual? By then will it be too late?

There are 4 things that have to be in place for myself to consider it a "revolutionary situation". None of them apply yet. But when they DO apply, then it WILL be a matter or life and death for the rest of us and a matter of self defense.
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Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #120
127. Bluster and bravado.
Pretty much as I figured.





TG
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #127
133. Why? Do you think I want to run out in the streets
by myself and start shooting people? I've said SEVERAL times that's not what I'm about. I'm NOT an anarchist. But I'm not a coward either.

When I said that there need to be 4 things happening for it to be a revolutionary situation, I meant it. There IS a plan based on history. However that doesn't mean that I can't support some transitional things while the 4 conditions are building. One of those transitional needs is for a worker's militia.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
57. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
KansDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:55 AM
Response to Original message
59. Some of Walker's "troublemakers" he told the faux-Koch brother about? (nt)
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mzteris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:01 AM
Response to Original message
61. Can we bring in someone from outside WI
to investigate? I don't trust the State Police considering.


And why is it this story is buried down in "local" new in Google News? This should be national news. You know and I know that this was no accident. No matter how much the "evidence" may show otherwise. I'm pretty damn sure this was intentional. Those mfers will stop at nothing.

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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:36 AM
Response to Original message
68. What a coinky-dink!
Rampaging freikorps and burning buildings.
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Zambero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 10:48 AM
Response to Original message
70. Was the local fire station shut down just prior to this incident?
Walker recently took steps to shut down motor vehicles offices in predominatly Democratic areas, in order to make it more difficult for voters to obtain requisite "voter ID's". Nothing out of Wisconsin surprises me any more. Today's Republican party is all about the end justifying the means.
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October Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 11:17 AM
Response to Original message
74. I hope and pray they had everything backed-up on other computers, papers, etc. /nt
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theaocp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
75. Didn't Walker leave firefighters out of his union-stripping bill?
I'm not saying anything, I'm just sayin'...
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dragonlady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #75
86. Yes. The firefighters were awesome
They came to the demonstrations in Madison and marched their bagpipe band through the rotunda several times. They played the opening music at the state Democratic convention this year. They're on our side.
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WatchWhatISay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
76. No doubt that dirty deeds have already been done, but
do you want to look like freepers declaring that it must have been a Muslim responsible for the recent events in Norway????

Lets keep a cool head until the facts come out. Thats what liberals do.
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Aerows Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 11:50 AM
Response to Original message
78. Well now, this is as un-suspicious as
a suicide that needed 8 bullets.

Folks are playing for keeps. No one doubted it, and now it's time to start acting like we know they are playing for keeps.

We are head long into the damn Weimar Republic guys, and I'm not godwin-ing this thread - I'm stating a fact.
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santamargarita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
80. Arson by Teabagger Republican Terrorists!
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
82. i know there will be a thorough investigation....
this fire did more damage than just the office of a democrat. to say this is the work of those who oppose her is really stupid.
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Aerows Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #82
84. Some will take a loss
for a better pay off in the end. To not realize that is naive. Not saying you are, just pointing out that there is a reason why there are three sides to every story - yours, mine, and ... the truth.
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #84
122. yup.....
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #82
116. To say that this is a coincidence or random is stupider
But perhaps you share the president's view that "both sides are guilty"

It's really no wonder that we get clobbered day after day, year after year
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Ohio Joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
87. I'll tell you the cause
Violent, racist teabaggers.
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colsohlibgal Donating Member (670 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:24 PM
Response to Original message
88. I Have Litlle Doubt It Was Arson Via Wingnuts
These people are ruthless "the ends justify the means" types. They have the morality of pond scum and I hope they get nailed for this big time.
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idrahaje Donating Member (143 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
91. Don't jump to conclusions
make things worse. Looks to have started in an empty warehouse. whether that was easy to get to I have no idea. Shillings office took a hit, but wasn't destroyed according to the story.
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sybylla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 07:46 AM
Response to Reply #91
136. Not exactly a warehouse
This fire took place in one building in an old 1900's vintage block of buildings - all adjoining.

My understanding is that We are Wisconsin was in one building. Next door there is an empty building used for storage. Then the Shilling for Senate HQ. (This from memory as I haven't been to campaign headquarters for some time.)

Though La Crosse has one of the most beautiful and vital downtowns I've ever seen, there is still a tendency to use these old block buildings for storage when they can't be rented for office space (usually because the owner doesn't want to spend any money on updating the building).

Having witnessed the damage in a block building in my own home town, I know these are hard fires to put out, but because these buildings aren't always up to date on electrical and heating codes, they are also more prone to accidental fire.

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caseymoz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
93. Need a private investigator on this.

I can't trust police.

It seems that an arsonist wouldn't set the fire when he's likely to be caught: during business hours. If he did, it might be attempted murder, too.

Not only that, there's no reason to think a suspect will do the brightest or most expected things.
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sybylla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 07:49 AM
Response to Reply #93
137. I can trust them.
La Crosse is fairly liberal, has union fire and police, all of whom aren't happy with the state of affairs in Wisconsin politics.

I have no worries about this being investigated as thoroughly as local resources will allow.
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Sportsguy Donating Member (389 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
94. It's Been REAL Quiet Here About This
Just like when Prosser assaulted Ann Walsh Bradley. It's like the story comes out, and then it dies.
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SteveM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
96. Wow, folks. Let's at least see if this was arson or accident!...
Everyone cock-strutting around, ready to do battle on da keyboards. Wait until some kind of investigation is complete.

And you hear this from a strong defender of 2A. Sheesh.
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bluestate10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #96
110. If the firs was started on purpose, it does not help who started it. But until an investigation
proves arson, judgment must be reserved.
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SteveM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #110
143. I should hope so.
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socialist_n_TN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #96
121. Oh I don't know. Times like this allow people to
imagine exactly whose side they're on and how far they're willing to go to defend it.
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Lint Head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
97. This is obviously subversive arson.
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #97
125. Or insurance fraud
Or a result of human error.
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Paladin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #125
128. Or Anything You Can Offer Up, Other Than Right Wing Terrorism. (n/t)
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #125
145. Were it fraud...
Were it fraud, one would imagine they either have a history of unforeseen and catastrophic occurrences at their offices, or that their general accounts fund is below, or on its way towards getting below safe level-- neither of which appears to be the case.
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Imajika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
101. Obviously the teabaggers attacked us!
Oh wait, there's no proof of that yet. Oh well, I can still make the claim without any evidence - I'm an anonymous poster on the internet afterall!
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
102. If this is proven as Arson then it has really begun
Actions like this smell of desperation and fear. Expect more situations of physical attacks and property attacks.
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #102
124. What will you say if it turns out to be arson for the purpose of insurance fraud?
That is a very common reason for commercial building fires.
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #124
131. If that is the case then the law will remedy it.
You are correct it is a common reason for commercial building fires.

Outside of that, there is a very dangerous undercurrent of violence coming from the Right Wing. Running people off the road because of a President Obama sticker, Womens healthcare clinics getting fire bombed, more gays getting attacked...

I am not a paranoid person and I am a huge consumer of historical trends and this is not a good trend. If Murdoch goes down and with him Faux be prepared for more catstrophic violence.
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AllyCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:34 PM
Response to Original message
126. Hoooowwww conveeeeeenient.
Glad all are safe. Not sure the people of that district are safe, but at least the people in the building escaped unharmed. This is really suspicious. Really...do liberals/progressives/Democrats pull this kind of crap? I hope it's just an accident but knowing how things are going here and how desperate and mean people have become, I would put money on it that it's arson.
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nikto Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #126
130. Of course it's ARSON
Today, GOP OPERATIVES
burn buildings.

Some day, maybe soon, GOP Operatives
will burn Americans.

Do you get it yet?

GOP are Nazis.
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Yon_Yonson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 09:39 AM
Response to Original message
140. Help me out here .. what is constrution equipment doing in fire site ruins?
These photos are from LaCrosse Tribune

http://lacrossetribune.com/news/local/article_b5828580-...

and I am sure wondering what heavy equipment is doing in the fire ruin site? Is the police/fire department done with their investigation?

http://lacrossetribune.com/news/local/article_b5828580-...





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PuffedMica Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #140
146. Republican evidence control n/t
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Yon_Yonson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #146
147. These pictures were taken on the same day of the fire ~ yesterday
It seems odd that they would be clearing rubble when the investigation has even commenced and the ashes are still warm. How many heavy equipment operators are on Sunday call? I smell a NEOCON rat turd!
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-01-11 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
141. K&R n/t
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BNJMN Donating Member (461 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-03-11 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
150. This should be on MessNbc every hour on the hour, wtf, Rach? Chris? Al? Wtf? [nt]
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BNJMN Donating Member (461 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-04-11 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
152. Kick.nt
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