Republicans edge US nearer debt crisis

[alp227]

Source: The Guardian

A week of high brinkmanship on Capitol Hill opened today with neither side in the impasse over the US debt ceiling prepared to budge and with the US just days away from a potentially catastrophic default.

The White House called a temporary cessation of hostilities, with meetings that have been going on almost solidly for more than a week suspended over the weekend to allow tempers to cool. But despite the hiatus, there was no sign from either the Republicans or Democrats that they were preparing to compromise.

In interviews on the Sunday political shows, the White House budget director, Jack Lew, made clear that tax rises for the rich would have to be on the table – a demand that the Tea party-steeled Republicans have doggedly refused to contemplate. "Can we get a balanced package together? It's not fair to ask senior citizens to pay a price, to ask families paying for the college education of their children to pay a price, but leave the most privileged out of the equation," he told ABC's This Week.

Lew said he was confident a deal would be done but criticised right-wing Republicans, who are taking the crisis to the brink. "The debt will be extended. Notwithstanding the voices of a few who are willing to play with Armageddon, responsible leaders in Washington are not."

Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jul/17/us-budget-ceiling-standoff-default

---

Interesting how a British newspaper took the Republicans to task in the headline.

[Bozita]

1. "Brains, you know, are suspect in the Republican Party." - Walter Lippmann

Yes, Walter, we know.

[MilesColtrane]

2. Yes, that's a headline we'd never see over here.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

26. Dems need to get on TV and shout

[AndyTiedye]

32. Dems First Need to Get on TV, At All

We are practically locked out of the media. That is the problem!

[Rosa Luxemburg]

53. The people should start owning the media

[harun]

58. No we wouldn't.

[bahrbearian]

3. So now that Obama put SS and Medicare on the table the Dem's are suppose to support any proposal?

[cliffordu]

39. Ah... The Meme abides.

What fucking horseshit....


:hurts:

[Supersedeas]

62. the meme abides and every side has one

Yes, the horse excrement applies

[SpiralHawk]

4. The Republicons will be branded for this for decades in their War Against America

as they fight on stoopidly & destructively for their billionaire puppetmasters...

[Dept of Beer]

14. Really? How? At DU? Great. How about the rest of America?

America is a country filled with fat, lazy peasants who care about who is dancing, yelling or are being fired on TV than they could care or understand that the Republicans are repeatedly raping them.

A great many of the unwashed and indolent couldn't care less as long as they get their $1.50 double cheeseburger and bladder buster diabetic coma inducing soft drink to go with it.

And who are they going to hear it from even if they could clear their ears of their own overweight blubber?


The news media is owned.

The radios stations are owned.

Papers...who reads them?


Lazy fat fucking America gets exactly what it deserves until it wises up: grotesque unemployment, media lies, shitty food industry and a cadre of corrupt politicians who will repeatedly rape their ass.

[Plucketeer]

16. I like you summation.

Only when folks have to take mom, dad, or their grandparents in (because their SS and M&M are gutted) will they start to notice what's what. Of course, even at that they'll be in a fog.

[Dept of Beer]

17. Sadly it may have to get worse than that.

Such goes nations in decline, and what is worse is how they remain propped up through military control of their own citizens.

[RKP5637]

24. Well said!!! Many Americans need a mirror held up to them so hopefully

they might get a clue. I think far too many Americans think someone else is doing the job for them, that all will be fine, not to worry. Hence, they are lambs for the slaughter.

[AndyTiedye]

30. They've Got the Tee Vee Instead…

…and the Tee Vee is controlled by the likes of Murdoch. :grr:

Not clear that a mirror would actually help much here.
Lotta these people spend too much time admiring themselves anyway.

[RKP5637]

50. Good point!!! n/t

[cliffordu]

40. Shit, Bro, this is DU!!!!

Tell us how you really feel!!!!!

C

[Bragi]

47. But the McRib is back, baby! /nt

[pampango]

60. Frank Rich: Eric Cantor is positioning himself to be the tea party's speaker, and his lust for power

may well make him willing to risk default, however politically self-destructive that may seem to those who remember the Gingrich shutdown fiasco. Meanwhile, Boehner and McConnell, whatever their public praise of the tea party or Cantor, are the establishment GOP and must answer to the corporate/financial interests that bankroll the party, are frightened of right-wing populism, and want the debt ceiling raised, pronto. (Don't forget, McConnell backed the candidate opposing tea party hero Rand Paul in the 2010 Kentucky senatorial primary.)

http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2011/07/frank_rich_adam_moss_alpha.html

[The Big Vetolski]

5. Crisis? What Crisis? Really? nt

[Chan790]

6. you don't think defaulting on the national debt is a crisis?

You are aware that the US dollar will be nearly worthless and that you can expect double-digit % increases in your loan/mortgage rates and hyperinflation. Your investments suddenly worthless.

This will have a cost in human lives I'm not even ready to get into.

[harun]

52. It isn't a crisis because it isn't going to happen.

It's the shock doctrine. Create a phony crisis, get a bunch of legislation through that the majority of people do not support, profit.

It is how you game Democracy to be completely un-democratic.

[girl gone mad]

54. Someone should alert the bond markets that there's a serious crisis going on.

The 'money people' aren't buying into the hysteria at all.

[AndyTiedye]

7. If We Don't Give the Repiglickins Everything They Want The Economy Gets It

[StarsInHerHair]

19. the thing is, if the Dems GIVE IN to the GOTP the economys GUARANTEED to

be wrecked.


It was the same with the Banksters, they said crap & the reverse was true, bailing them out was dead wrong, everyone should look at Iceland & what they did with their Banksters.

[AndyTiedye]

22. It Would be Bad, Yes, But Default Would Force Far Greater Cuts Than These

and forever hamstring any further efforts to improve the economy.

[StarsInHerHair]

23. I am curious if Default would ennable a State-owned & run Bank, like 1 of

the Dakotas, I can't remember if it is North or South..........NO BANK FAILURE, still lending to small businesses, etc.

Overnight a National Bank could be created-OR State Banks, 50 of them or so.....with clawbacks enforced to all the private Banks owed immediately. Flight out of the country? I'd model something on the cell phone co. early termination fee, Termination of Country Fee.

[AndyTiedye]

29. Created Out of What? There is No Legal Authority For Such a Thing

The Supreme Court would be all over it, and they'd even have a point — those "clawbacks" amount to the seizure of private capital without compensation OR anything like due process, which our Constitution does not allow.

[StarsInHerHair]

35. well somehow FDR DID IT. They just did it with Madoff. & historically banks

DID used to be State-owned.

[AndyTiedye]

41. They Were Able to Prove that Madoff Stole the Money

Due process and all that.

It is not clear exactly what FDR did that you want Obama to emulate.

Also bear in mind that Obama faces a far more hostile Supreme Court than FDR did.

[StarsInHerHair]

55. dear Andy, while I appreciate your endless doubts they do not help, FDR

essentially did a bunch of clawbacks to the Banksters, which is why that class has hated him ever since & actually tried to kill him. Keeping in mind the questionable activities of some on the Supreme Court gives an opening for a willing leader to accomplish MUCH more than what is conventionally thought possible.

It may help you to recall the shocking acts W & Cheney committed & got away with for 8 plus years, & the fact that various judges, federal attourneys, etc all let crimes go unpunished; I had hoped Obama would be as daring as W but 180 degrees around. It is still possible, but most seem too full of doubts to even consider being so bold.

[AndyTiedye]

57. It is BECAUSE OF the Supreme Court and the Media that BushCheney Could Get Away With Anything

If Obama tried to use the 14th Amendment to get out of the debt ceiling,
what do you think the Supreme Court would do?

They would rule against him and you know it.
Same with any other FDR-like stuff he might try.

[StarsInHerHair]

59. ah you would've nixed the moonshot

[keopeli]

42. two words: eminent domain

[AndyTiedye]

44. Eminent Domain Does Not Allow Seizure of Property Without Compensation

[StarsInHerHair]

56. so W when he used eminent domain to kick people out of their homes for

his baseball team's new stadium-he had to compensate ALL those people? please gimme the links

[Volaris]

37. Its North Dakota...in addition to all of the privately owned ones,

the State runs its OWN bank, that is owned by the taxpayers/Government. Its the ONLY one in the Nation.

www.banknd.nd.gov/

I think if were onto the idea that there should be a "National" Bank set up, (that's owned by the Taxpayers) lets make that fucker a Credit Union of the Treasury instead, and see if we can start making simple interest home loans to people...why pay 250k (mostly in profit interest) for a house that only costs 175k to begin with? It would kick-start the HELL out of the housing market, as well as giving the Banksters some much-needed competition....

[AndyTiedye]

43. I Must be Missing Something

see if we can start making simple interest home loans to people...why pay 250k (mostly in profit interest) for a house that only costs 175k to begin with?

Wouldn't most home mortgages be simple interest, since you usually pay the interest (and then some) each month?
The only loans that should have compound interest are those with negative amortization, and I doubt you can even get one of those anymore.

The 75k in interest is because you are borrowing the money for such a long time.

[Volaris]

48. I was under the impression that an average home loan was issued on compound interest...

If that's incorrect, I have no idea why I would think that lol

[Oldtimeralso]

38. Regarding your cartoon...

If that is after the G(reedy) O(ligarch) P(arty} has their way and the tracks belong to Amtrak she will starve to death before anything else can happen

[fascisthunter]

8. Now the World knows about the Treasonous GOP

[RKP5637]

25. It should just be renamed, "The Terrorist Party."

[fascisthunter]

49. no joke, it should be

[Richardo]

9. Excuse me, "...no sign that the DEMOCRATS were willing to compromise?"

Total horseshit.

[Amonester]

11. In the sense of "completely cave in" to the hostage taker$ demands

ie Cuts.To.Entitlements.Only.Without.Any.Sacrifices.From.Corporate jets owners and hedge funds bonusseR$

That's how I read it.

[wordpix]

10. would be nice if US media had headlines like this that tell it like it is

[AndyTiedye]

20. It is Because of the Repiglickin Media That Dems are Usually Forced to Cave

[OmahaBlueDog]

12. My sense is that a deal is going to get done

I've thought that since the whole discussion of Boehner going back to his caucus to sell the $2T deal, after the $4T couldn't get done.

These negotiations are no different than any other tough negotiations, and I'd look for these talks to go down to the wire, with the possibility of the President eating some of his words and signing a mini-stopgap deal to allow the finishing touches on negotiations.

A lot of the posturing, walking out, and other bad behavior on both sides has been political theater designed to play to base constituencies.

My guess is that they will do a deal at around $2T, to be revisited during the next administration. The GOP will then campaign like Hell for a Balanced Budget Amendment.

[steven johnson]

13. Governors Urge Debt Deal to Avoid 'Embarrassment'

Has reality finally sunk in?

By REUTERS
Published: July 16, 2011 at 8:21 PM ET

SALT LAKE CITY (Reuters) - State governors meeting in Utah on Saturday urged a speedy resolution to the deadlock in Washington over lifting the U.S. debt ceiling to avoid what they called an embarrassing default on U.S. obligations.

"This is a dangerous and equally ridiculous situation that's playing itself out. It takes one sentence to solve this problem -- and that's to lift the debt ceiling," Connecticut Governor Dannel Malloy, a Democrat, told Reuters at a National Governors Association meeting in Salt Lake City.

Republicans in Washington are demanding deep government spending cuts as part of a deal to raise the debt limit while Obama and the Democrats want tax increases on the wealthy also to be part of the agreement. Republicans oppose tax increases.

"I really think we need more statesmen and less politicians in Washington right now because it is a situation that must be solved. And I honestly believe it will be. Everyone's posturing -- both sides," Alabama Governor Robert Bentley, a Republican, said in an interview.




Governors Urge Debt Deal to Avoid 'Embarrassment

[blank space]

15. So here are the options

The debt ceiling is raised and :

1) Obama offers cuts to social security - result : Republicans win next election. (Obama cut social security)
2) Social security cuts and tax hikes - result : Republicans win next election. (Obama cut social security AND Obama put taxes up)
3) No cuts to social security, no tax hikes. Obama just stands his ground. - result: Obama wins next election.
4) No cuts, no tax, no debt ceiling raised - result: Obama wins next election, Republicans are destroyed for two decades for their attempt to destroy the United States - they would never win another seat.


If Obama offers social security on this issue - he is the worst Democrat ever elected, President or not. Offering social security is the one and only move guaranteed to work against dems and FOR repubs.

[mia]

18. "Offering social security is the one and only move guaranteed to work against dems and FOR repubs."

I agree with you.

[alllyingwhores]

21. Hasn't Obama already talked about offering cuts in social security?

[RKP5637]

28. I agree on your options! And also if he offers up SS cuts, it will be used over and

over on him for 2012 election and future elections. The republicans will spin that to the highest level of spin possible. If this is played correctly, the R's well might lose the house.

I just hope the dems can get the messaging right. Often I think the dems do weak messaging, nothing sticks. That is one thing Bush knew how to do, short simple stupid statements that stuck.

[AndyTiedye]

34. Let's At Least Be Consistent

You assume that Obama gets all the blame in #1 and #2, but is able to deflect it to the Repigs in #3 and #4.
Let's at least be consistent. The Repigs control the media, so they probably get to control who gets the blame in all 4 scenarios, not just the first 2.

3. Would be nice, but highly unlikely. Canter and his paymasters are betting that there will be a default.
4. No deal, no debt ceiling raised. Forces massive cuts to all social programs and throws the economy into depression.
Media is on the warpath blaming Obama 24x7. Left unhappy about cuts (far bigger than anything discussed so far), everyone
unhappy about economy, Repigs sweep.

[marasinghe]

61. from where i stand, you got it right. (n/t)

[alllyingwhores]

27. So...if Obama really wanted to couldn't he just issue an executive order to extend the debt ceiling?

...and stop pretending that he has to give away social security and other supposed deficit related BS--even though, anyone looking beyond the corporate media sound bites knows that social security has nothing to do w the deficit...and that the deficit has nothing to do with extending the debt ceiling.

[buckrogers1965]

31. Even if we don't default we are damaging our ratings.

Scaring bankers is a bad idea. If we need loans to continue at the current low rates then we must make the bankers be very comfortable that we won't default in the future on the trillions in loans we already have.

We are scaring the hell out of every banker in the world right now. What are the odds that they are going to give us anymore money at the awesome current rate moving forward?

[July16th-20th]

33. "Better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven"

That seems to be the GOP's credo.

[certainot]

36. the RW radio stations are the place to protest to tell the teabaggers and the politicians who use

them as an excuse where to stick it

republicans could walk back if they weren't so afraid of team limbaugh, who police the lock stepping idiots and have fro months been telling 50mil americans that not raising the debt ceiling is no problem and will ensure that we will finally have to start cutting out some public employees and unions

[No Elephants]

45. Yes, Alp. My first thought as well.,

[Elmore Furth]

46. Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

Perhaps the majority of Republicans are not completely out of touch with reality.

Americans are unimpressed with their political leaders' handling of the debt ceiling crisis, with a new CBS News poll showing a majority disapprove of all the involved parties' conduct, but Republicans in Congress fare the worst, with just 21 percent backing their intransigent resistance to raising taxes.

President Obama earned the most generous approval ratings for his handling of the weeks-old negotiations, but still more people said they disapproved (48 percent) than approved (43 percent) of what he has done and said.

Even half of the Republican respondents (51 percent) voiced disapproval of how members of their own party in Congress are handling the talks. Far fewer Democrats expressed disapproval of their own party's handling (32 percent) or President Obama's (22 percent) of the urgent quest to raise the nation's debt limit ahead of a looming default on Aug. 2 if action isn't taken.

Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

[Evasporque]

51. The media picked up on the "B" word...Brinksmanship...from DU...

This is a direct comparison of Republicans and Kim Jong Il negotiating style.