Award-winning Cuban blogger says she was beaten, detained

[demoleft]

Source: afp/france24

AFP - Secret police agents abducted and beat award-winning blogger Yoani Sanchez, whose online reports chronicle the dark side of everyday life in communist Cuba, on her way to a march for non-violence, she said Saturday.

Three agents in street clothes snatched her and friend Orlando Luis Pardo off the street in the Havana district of Vedado.

"They beat me and then they shoved me into a car head first. They did not give me any explanation at any time, but it is clear their goal was to stop us from taking part in the march," Sanchez, who writes the blog "Generation Y," told AFP.
...
The advocacy group Human Rights Watch condemned the attack in a statement that said "Cuban authorities should cease all attacks on human rights defenders, journalists, bloggers and civic activists.

Read more: http://www.france24.com/en/node/4920209

---

kidnap and beating - pure fascist style.

go on talking, girl. whatever you have to say.
her blog: http://www.desdecuba.com/generaciony/

[Kurska]

1. Don't ever bother, there are people here who call Cuba a democracy, but say israel isn't.

I'm sure we'll hear about how she is a CIA plant or that the CIA infact did it themselves, or that the CIA killed Santa claus.

[demoleft]

2. haha ;) no doubt. cuba is paradise by definition, but nobody wants to move there. n/t

[proud2BlibKansan]

40. I would if I could

Just watched SiCKO again today and I'd move to Cuba for health care.

[demoleft]

50. hehe, you can't just get health care. you get the whole package there. n/t

[proteus_lives]

125. You'll free speech speech and the right to vote for someone not named Castro for health care?

Yeesh.

[Duende azul]

51. What´s your obsession with Cuba? You'd better care for Guantanamo.

There are lots of people that surely didn´t want to move there.

[demoleft]

64. i posted an obsession? i thought i had posted "news"...

...and as soon as i have about guantanamo i'll post them, stay sure.

i've got this vice of hating places where freedom is crashed to pieces.

[TiredOldMan]

4. Well said. If people on this board lived in Cuba and dared

to write what is commonly written here about their government Fidel's agents would make them disappear.

[AlphaCentauri]

74. 11 million cubans, thats too many people to think alike

[edwardian]

176. 280 million

Americans that allowed BFEE to destroy their freedom and demolish their rights...seems like too many people to think alike...but the posts from the right are just proof of the inability to think for themselves. Flame on.

[struggle4progress]

127. Do you have a link for recent disappearances in Cuba?

For definiteness, stick to (say) the last decade -- I don't know what conditions were like in 1959

Since the US maintains diplomatic personnel on the Island, and there is some traffic back and forth, it should be possible to document if dissidents are disappearing there. I'm not expert, but i'm not aware of any recent reports

Enforced disappearances: Annual Report 2008
http://www.amnesty.org/en/enforced-disappearances/annual-report-2008

[Judi Lynn]

137. They should as the US Government or the Miami "exiles" who have detailed photos

taken by satellite of every inch of the island.

Knight Ridder Newspapers March 30, 2001

First commercial satellite photo of Cuba is released

By Warren P. Strobel


WASHINGTON -- A private satellite firm has released the first commercially available picture of Cuba as seen from outer space, depicting in crisp detail ships in Havana harbor, railroad tracks and even the lettering on the roof of a huge warehouse.

The image, snapped in January by a spacecraft orbiting 423 miles overhead, is the latest example of how "spy" satellites, once the exclusive domain of defense and intelligence agencies, have gone private. And the impact of that shift is just beginning to be felt, say experts on the technology.

In the case of Cuba, the effect could be both political and economic. Some Cuban exiles in the Miami area say satellite photographs could be used to inspect and map properties they still claim on the island.

"Many of these people have not seen their properties for 40 years," said Nick Gutierrez, a Miami-area lawyer with about 100 clients who have claims. "We are not going to get these properties back until Fidel Castro is gone. But there are certain steps we can take to prepare for that day."

More:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/org/news/2001/010330-ikonos.htm

http://www.zonu.com/cuba_maps/Cubas_Old_Havana_Satellite_Photo.htm

http://farm1.static.flickr.com.nyud.net:8090/35/119943764_d946f86198.jpg

http://pics2.city-data.com.nyud.net:8090/city/tmap/tr12333.png

http://pics2.city-data.com.nyud.net:8090/city/tmap/tr17238.png

http://pics2.city-data.com.nyud.net:8090/city/tmap/tr21664.png

http://pics2.city-data.com.nyud.net:8090/tertn/tnt9053.png

http://cache1.asset-cache.net.nyud.net:8090/xc/73035741.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF19364A19ADEE617E8A824C85BF834799F7A6081D12CC429ECC3

http://pics2.city-data.com.nyud.net:8090/city/tmapf/trf11290.png

http://www.cayolargo.net.nyud.net:8090/images/hotel_villacoral_aerien_en.jpg

http://www.cayolargo.net.nyud.net:8090/images/hotel_villasoledad_aerien_en.jpg

ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC.

http://expat21.files.wordpress.com.nyud.net:8090/2008/12/havana-photo-by-rosemary-stasek.jpg

[AlphaCentauri]

139. Oh look there is an empty lot there by the beach

we can buy it for a couple hundred dollars when Castro is gone and build my new mansion..

:sarcasm:

[EFerrari]

131. Send them to secret torture prisons, maybe?

Like this guy?

WASHINGTON–An American federal court has ruled Canadian Maher Arar cannot sue the U.S. government for sending him to Syria seven years ago, where he was tortured and held for a year without charge on suspicions he was an Al Qaeda terrorist.

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/720142--u-s-court-rejects-maher-arar-s-right-to-sue-washington

[EFerrari]

7. Or you might hear how we fund her blog but, pft, why bother to know that?

:)

[Dreamer Tatum]

25. So you don't dispute what happened, but instead you provide a rationale for it

Once again, you expose your demagoguery for all to see.

"LOL"

[Duende azul]

58. Hey, where are all those "bad apple" cop defenders in this case?

Please give the agents the benefit of the doubt would you?

[EFerrari]

81. Nope. And once again, you make yoursef into a pretzel twisting.

Chubby Checkers, is that you?

lol

[Dreamer Tatum]

84. Neither of us is twisting logic at all.

Your post implies that she had it coming because you think her blog is U.S. funded. I'm calling you on your implication.

You can clarify your post, or not.

"LOL"

[EFerrari]

86. If my posts were really paid for by a foreign government

you'd be the first to scream conflict of interest.

And yet here you are, defending this one.

Classic Tatum.

[Dreamer Tatum]

92. Now who's the pretzel?

There is conflict of interest, and there is government harassment. You do not dispute that this woman was harassed by the Cuban government, but instead you point to where you think her funding comes from. The strong implication is that she had it coming. I'm not defending her at all, but you're defending the Cuban government's harassment.

Again, feel free to clarify your post anytime. You seem to be indicating that she had it coming.


"LOL"

[EFerrari]

97. I do dispute that this woman was harmed in any way

by the Cuban government who isn't stupid enough to do such a thing but my point was that even before you get there, she isn't credible.

Too bad that advanced degree of yours didn't come with an English proficiency requirement. :eyes:

[Dreamer Tatum]

101. Hey, Beth? Your entire post is on the subject line.

And my advanced degree is good for getting people like yourself to clarify their meaning. Your post, unexplained, would lead many reasonable people to assume that you condone government harassment of dissidents.

In your case, I believe the preponderance of the evidence is that you think the Cubans were too easy on her, but that's just my opinion.

[EFerrari]

107. And more garbage.

But an A for effort.

[Judi Lynn]

114. People really concerned about the terrifying abuse going on should encourage the U.S. gummint

to let ordinary people go to Cuba so we can see for ourselves, not just sit like witless a-holes 90 miles away, gobbling up anything a person we can't see decides to tell us!

If she told us Fidel Castro masturbates in public, you can be sure there are quite enough breathless tools who would run off to post in on someone's message board.

That would erase all our doubts, clear up any fantastically stupid beliefs we have based on pure crap, and allow us to get right to the heart of the matter on just how tragic this young martyr's life is, after all!

[AlphaCentauri]

116. Bingo!

[Dreamer Tatum]

119. Wait...."gobbling up anything a person we can't see decides to tell us?" That's rich.

ANY news story critical of ANY aspect of Chavez, Cuba, or any other authoritarian Central or South American regime is IMMEDIATELY called into question by you, and anything that could possibly be construed as supportive of those regimes is held up by you to be Gospel. And when the facts finally seem to be catching up with you, you play the Moral Equivalence Card by pointing out some misdeed done to some person in the United States by the "gummint."

In short, your protests ring entirely hollow because you are, as they say, IN THE TANK for the authoritarians.

[chrisa]

157. lmao

I love this sort of rationalization based on senseless conspiracy theories, that certain countries that the US has screwed over in the past can do no wrong.

[AlphaCentauri]

21. I was thinking it was a dictatorship form of government

until I read that they have elections

[hack89]

44. Just like the Soviet Union, China and North Korea. nt

[pattmarty]

117. And, quickly coming to the USA, I might add.

[DissedByBush]

45. Like other nations they are a democracy in name only

North Korea and Iraq under Saddam held elections too. The result was always 100% turnout with 100% voting for the incumbent.

Technically, Cuba has free and secret election. In reality no party is allowed to campaign for their members, but the communist party directly controls the media so it is de facto the only party that can campaign -- they just don't call it that. Nominees have to be approved by the election committees, and guess who runs those.

Other small parties have been allowed to exist since the 90s, but they have absolutely no power and no effective say in government policy. I feel sorry for their members if they ever do manage to threaten the communist party's power.

This girl got off light. It's a miracle she is out and around and able to talk about her experience of what happens when you challenge Castro.

Democracy. Yeah, right.

[AlphaCentauri]

61. seems like democracy in the US

There are small parties but they have to be aproved by corporate money so they have no change to win elections, for more than 200 hundred years there have been only two parties in charge of government and I guess that those two parties are the ones who supervise the elections. Now to challenge those parties someone has to be able to spend 20 millions or more from their own packet like Ross Perot, it would be imposible for a citizen without money to be president then the media is in bed with those parties, having dedicated talk shows to spread their ideology.

God there are too many similarities between those two democracies.

[pattmarty]

118. Oh, you noticed too?

:sarcasm:

[Joe Chi Minh]

156. Then there's the privatized voting machines and counting......

[boppers]

196. History FAIL

"for more than 200 hundred years there have been only two parties in charge of government".... sorry, no.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_the_United_States

There are two major parties *now*. Wasn't always two parties, and it wasn't always these two.

[jasi2006]

66. And the proof of this attack is....???

Her blog???? Just asking.

[AlphaCentauri]

75. street clothes n/t

[JackRiddler]

151. Is Cuba bombing hospitals, the UN and civilians trapped inside an open-air prison?

If you're going to jump in with very, very stupid and off-topic comparisons...

[Taverner]

3. She would know - the Democracy Movement in Cuba is a very lonely place

Seriously. On one side you have Castro, who does suppress freedoms big time. Dissenters are not shot, but aren't treated well either. Rapes, beatings - all of these are the case.

But then take the CANF - the "other side" to the Cuban Coin. They are outright Right-Wing Dictators. They want someone like Batista, or Somosa or Strossner in power. They liked Pinochet and consider him a hero.

So in the middle you have folks like Yoani Sanchez

[demoleft]

6. ...and hopefully a new generation of anti-castrists...

...or maybe no - not "anti" - but "for" - for a new cuba, a new "third way" between the extremes.
thanx for the comment. agreed.

[Duende azul]

69. Third way - my ass.

Do you in your wildest dreams believe the US would not want to have their way imposed?

Ask Salvador Allende. Oops, he didn´t survive the US-treatment. But I'm sure you will be able to find other successful "third ways", especially in Latin America. If so would you please let us know? Thank you in advance.

[demoleft]

93. that's why i rejoiced in Obama's election. 40 years have gone since allende. things change. n/t

[Duende azul]

140. Things change? But no "third way" country to come up with?

Try Honduras for a start? Zelaya was very moderate for a start. And you see where even that got him.

Sorry, until you can convince me there's one place where the US let go and abstained from enforcing corporate rule, I'll stay with "no third way".

All you goodhearted people never realize, that in geopolitics "democracy" is a code word for good old capitalism. If the basis of all social interaction is competition on every level there is no chance for the less wealthy to survive.
Unfortunately economic power translates in dominance. That's antithetic to real democracy.

[Duende azul]

141. Things change? But Kissinger still in business as envoy for Obama?

[EFerrari]

8. Sanchez is not the middle by any stretch of the imagination. n/t

[demoleft]

11. did the "pentagon babe" deserve the beating - is this the point?

because this is the news.
she may be a total rightist to me - i do not care. i want her blog to exist and her right to manifest her opinion granted.
see the point?

[EFerrari]

13. I want pictures and I hope you don't mind that

because I try to be careful not to take the word of paid liars as gospel. :shrug:

[Taverner]

16. It's only Americans that take pictures of torture

The rest of the world learned long ago that's a bad idea

[EFerrari]

20. Well, aren't you married to your American exceptionalism?

What will you do when this turns out to be cr@p? :)

[Taverner]

30. What? Look - keep this civil. No reason not to.

What exactly is going to turn out to be cr@p?

I spent time in Cuba - several times. The country is an enigma. There is no starvation. None. As one Argentinian put it "These are the richest poor folks I've ever seen"

At the same time, for what little social mobility there is - folks will claw each other to pieces for it. Whether its American $$$$ and/or access to a source outside of Cuba to send items to (send a Cuban National a care package and you've made a friend for life.)

It's the classic struggle of human nature vs ideology. For the most part, Cubans are comfortable, but being humans they do want more than what they have.

After seeing Cuba I understand one is not better than the other (Capitalism v Communism.) I also understand its damn near impossible to bottle up human nature.

One thing about Cuba I understood too - the folks who leave, who go to Miami or elsewhere, are not looked highly upon. The term was (and probably still is) gusanos which means worms. And it means exactly what it means here. Family who deserts Cuba for the US is usually not spoken to again.

[DissedByBush]

53. I think you just summarized communism perfectly

Communism bottles up human nature. Communism suppresses human nature.

By definition communism is a violation of human rights.

Capitalism is human nature in practice, although left unchecked the darker side of human nature will cause damage.

Communism left unchecked, well, we've seen the horrible results.

[Taverner]

60. Thing is Capitlaism unchecked is just as bad as Communism Unchecked

Capitalism Unchecked? Well - ever read Oliver Twist? Consider EVERYTHING the British Dutch East India Company was doing in the name of profit - genocide, assassinations, you name it. NAZI Germany was a corporate state, as was Italy - look at what that shit did.

Both systems in extremes, are fucking WRONG!

[DissedByBush]

120. Not good examples

The British and Dutch East India Companies (two different companies) had government-granted monopolies, no capitalist competition allowed. In Nazi Germany and Italy the government controlled the larger aspects of the economy, not capitalist, more corporatist but with all corporations subservient to the goals of the state.

[Taverner]

148. But those are both examples of Classical Imperial Capitalism

In both cases...and that is Capitalism run amok

Think Blackwater's bad? The Dutch East India company had its own army, and they plain out eliminated locals. Think Iraq on steroids

[DissedByBush]

152. Capitalism requires a level playing field

A government monopoly immediately cancels out capitalism because it eliminates competition, which is the essential element of capitalism.

Before the British and Dutch East India Companies, companies were set up for just the one voyage. Investors paid for the ship and crew in hopes of it paying off in the end with a boatload of spices. That's capitalism, individual investors, individual companies, all competing to keep the spices flowing.

Then the governments became involved and gave monopoly and practically unlimited powers to these companies.

Basically, these governments used these companies as arms of government in the European race to strip Asia of its riches.

That's not capitalism. That's plain-old government imperialism.

[Taverner]

153. Huh? Capitalism does not "Require" a level playing field

Partly because the level playing field is a goal, not a destination. And partly because we have Never had a level playing field anywhere in this world, especially here.

[DissedByBush]

164. Capitalism needs to be open for all to compete, level

When you make a monopoly you eliminate competition, an essential element of capitalism.

These were in effect government entities, not regular capitalist corporations. They couldn't have amassed the power they had if they hadn't had government charters.

Of course we don't have pure capitalism. The government interferes to a large extent for non-economic goals, corporations use their influence to buy privilege to hamper competition, etc.

[Taverner]

165. By that purist definition, you could very rightly say there has never been capitalism in the world

But you'd be wrong

[JackRiddler]

185. So wait a minute, if the British East India Company...

had had "competitors" (it did, from other countries and even other colonial projects based in Britain) then... what are you saying? That the genocidal conquest of the new world would have been more efficient?

One problem is you're working from the myth that capitalism was ever, ever a "free market," when in fact capitalist industries were always predicated on state subsidies and protections.

[EFerrari]

87. No need to be unpleasant, agreed. And this will turn out to be crap.

Cuba is not an enigma to me or to a lot of people. Especially the people who are paid to bad rap it in the American press. They know exactly what they're doing.

[caseymoz]

29. Sorry, that is just wrong, but at least you do call it torture.

The government is just trusting that the people are so ignorant about the rest of the world that they'll think that.

[demoleft]

19. no, i do not mind. in that you're right. though you sound overly suspicious...

...because she is (in your opinion) a "paid liar".

you would admit that the "treat" described by her is not uncommon against anti-castro voices anyway, wouldn't you?
so i incline to believe her - and yes, i wait for pics we'll never have probably.

[EFerrari]

22. This person has been making a living as a Pentagon PR hack

and you're inclined to believe her? That's surprising.

I don't wish any harm to her and for more than one reason hope that she's just blowing it out of her ass louder than usual.

[Taverner]

31. I would take $$ from the Pentagon if it meant I could say what I wanted

I am not saying she does or doesn't, but if she does - I don't blame her a bit

You've never been to, or lived in a Communist Country have you?

I have done both - USSR (lived) and visited many

It's not better or worse, but a trade-off. You learn to do less with more, but at the same time there are a bunch of people to help you do just that.

[Downwinder]

35. A better question is, have you been in the military?

They have ways of seeing that you say what they desire.

[Taverner]

36. I've been in the Peace Corps

I have no desire to shoot people; so I stayed clear of the military

[Downwinder]

37. The Peace Corp showed in Bolivia, that they could refuse the CIA.

The military has not shown that in the Middle East.

[AlphaCentauri]

41. how anyone in America who would get paid by the Russians

would be portrait?

[EFerrari]

82. I studied Shakespeare and I've never been to Elizabethan England either.

That argument is a nonstarter.

[roody]

89. If you take money from the Pentagon, you certainly cannot

say anything that you want.

[demoleft]

33. if she's a "pentagon babe" her story of beating is even more credible...

...she already tells stories of abuses in cuba.

so why should she create this one and be targeted even more by police?
what's the use? not so smart, for a pentagon babe.

anti-castrists do not need this news to be confirmed.
this kind of violent treats are a system, in a country where DU would just be impossible.

i know that you do not wish any harm to her. of course you don't.
my previous was not meant to put it in doubt.

[EFerrari]

78. She's paid to fill space, not to think, as far as I can tell.

And the rightwing base work 24/7 on these stories as McClatchy has learned since they bought the Miami "we'll print anything" Herald.

[demoleft]

90. ok, i see. i hope the next man/woman beaten in cuba for his/her opinions is just a poor devil...

...with no presumed connection at all with pentagon and such, possibly never sentenced and not even fined for trifles.
at least he/she has some chances to be believed.
provided he/she can tell some way.

and does it really matter? what happened to her has happened and will happen.
this is a fact, and is not produced by any rightist media.

ciao ;)

[EFerrari]

98. You don't even know if it happened.

lol

[demoleft]

102. hehe. that makes it even more suggestive ;) n/t

[EFerrari]

105. Tell you what. If this turns out to be true

I will apologize to you in any public way you'd like. That's only fair. :)

[demoleft]

108. haha :) - no apologies in that case, a drink will do. n/t

[EFerrari]

111. Done deal.

lol

[Mika]

201. "in a country where DU would just be impossible". Bullshit.

Obviously, you've never been to a candidate nomination session, nor attended any Cuban town hall political debates.
Obviously, you've never been seen the Cuban nightly 'The Round Table" TV discussion show (its like DU TV, with less uninformed flamewars).


To bad that the US government oppresses /suppresses Americans in that they can't travel to Cuba (except Cuban-Americans who've been granted full US constitutional rights and can go to Cuba, while the rest of us are relegated to travel banned 2nd class citizens).
Because if Americans could see Cuba for themselves, then most of the uninformed "in a country where DU would just be impossible" bullshit would be dispelled for those willing to look.

---

[Judi Lynn]

204. First photo I've seen of Barbara Lee with him. Great!

She's made trips there since the '70's. Good for her.

Saw Camilo Cienfuegos in the crowd in the first photo!

http://upload.wikimedia.org.nyud.net:8090/wikipedia/wa/thumb/3/30/Camilo_Cienfuegos.jpg/180px-Camilo_Cienfuegos.jpg http://www.elrivalinterior.com.nyud.net:8090/actitud/Biografias/El.Che/Camilo-cienfuegos-2.png
He always looked like a US cowboy from the 1800's!

http://www.nationalparksociety.com.nyud.net:8090/images/black_hills_wild_bill_hickok1.jpg http://trianglecranch.com.nyud.net:8090/catalog/images/wild_bill_port001.jpg

Wild Bill Hickok

[naaman fletcher]

54. Do you have a source that she is paid by the pentagon?

Or do you just assume it because she does not agree with you?

[Taverner]

62. Good question....

[AlphaCentauri]

72. indeed

if she is not a CIA operative then she could be Cuban operative

[Taverner]

14. Also a good point

Since when has torture been a good policy?

[Taverner]

12. I disagree - she is not part of the US-based CANF "Restore Batistaism" movement by any means

Yes, she takes Pentagon dollars. The Pentagon funds any resistance to Castro. Even militant Islamists.

[EFerrari]

5. Yeah, right. Yoani Sanchez, Pentagon Babe.

Rosa Miriam Elizalde has finally pointed out what never occurs to Time magazine or Grupo Prisa. Or maybe it has occurred to them – they just can’t bring themselves to admit it. That blog by the blocked Cuban blogger/whiner ain’t no ordinary blog. Lots o’ cash behind it.

http://machetera.wordpress.com/2009/05/08/yoani-sanchez-pentagon-babe/

[Taverner]

10. I have heard otherwise

She is part of the non-CANF Democracy movement for Cuba

Yes, she took Pentagon dollars. The Pentagon will fund ANY resistance to the Castro regime, even militant Islamists.

[EFerrari]

15. And there you go. n/t

[Taverner]

17. Your point?

Trust me - she is not of the "Jorge Mascanosa" movement based in Miami.

She's all for Democracy (real Democracy) in Cuba. Yes, she's not liked by Castro. But Castro came of age in a time when you could only trust the guy right next to you.

[EFerrari]

23. She's a paid hack.

[Taverner]

26. Um, yeah. How do you think she can afford to access the internet?

I've been there - regular Cubans can't just walk into the Western Hotels and fire up a laptop. You need permission, and that costs $$$. You need a laptop, which aren't exactly being handed out at Libraries.

This costs money. Now I'm sure the Pentagon sent her, as well as al Queda, Havana a check, as well as anyone who has any beef against Castro. Shit, they probably sent Maosits for Cuba a check.

But in that kind of situation, you have to do what you gotta do.

[Downwinder]

28. I'm in rural America, can I just send my Internet access bill to the Pentagon? n/t

[Taverner]

32. Are you in a job that pays you $2 a day?

And lets just say that $2 a day will cover housing, food and necessities quite well

But lets also say that $2 a day doesn't stack up to ways to do anything outside your local sphere...and definitely could not pay for any access outside of your local sphere.

[Downwinder]

39. I'm paid $30.00 a day to stay out of jail. In other words, SS. n/t

[Taverner]

52. Huh?

[DissedByBush]

57. You have it backwards

Our government finds people who are actively fighting for democracy in Cuba, and then supports them.

You just have a love for Latin American dictators and wannabe dictators, don't you?

[EFerrari]

80. Oh, yeah. I have a big thing for dictators!

lol

And the Pentagon only supports freedom fighters.

And Santa sees you when you're sleeping!

[DissedByBush]

121. It's been obvious for a while n/t

[EFerrari]

130. You're confusing your thing for right wing spin with me. n/t

[DissedByBush]

142. It's just a pattern I see

Whenever a power-hungry, rights-violating dictator or wanna-be dictator in Latin America comes up, you are always there to defend him as long as he's thrown the word "socialist" somewhere in his policy.

[EFerrari]

166. I'm so sorry you're seeing things. Healthcare reform can't come fast enough.

:)

[DissedByBush]

168. I could be wrong

Please point to any of your criticism of Chavez, the Castro brothers or Zelaya.

[Taverner]

155. Both of you - - this cannot be reduced to a binary 'yes/no' answer

This is more complicated than "Communism=bad(good)"

[AlphaCentauri]

24. I don't understand your definition of democracy?

[demoleft]

180. one might be: the right to disagree. which cuba is short of. :) n/t

[ngant17]

27. if something similar happened here in the US

it might have ended up as "suicide by cop" or shot while attempted to escape, or any number of familiar scenarios which commonly take place.

Her skull was not the least bit fractured from a night stick, no limbs were broken, she wasn't even tasered. All in all, I'd say she received rather light treatment compared to what could have happened here from a dissenter.

In this particular incident, she sounds more like a frightened little child from what I can read in her blog at Generation Y, <http://www.desdecuba.com/generationy/>

[Taverner]

34. Good point - there was no permanent damage

Take any US prisoner, and ask them to see their bruises.

Ever been tasered?

Ever "fell down the stairs" on your way to somewhere while escorted by the cops?

-------------------

[AlphaCentauri]

43. ever been at a protest in may day?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaJapSwYLcc

[DissedByBush]

59. Do you really think DU could have lasted under Bush?

If this were Cuba most DU members would have been rounded up, brutally beaten and sent to prison for "counter-revolutionary activities" years ago.

The government does appear to be getting soft lately.

A decade or so ago it would have been rapes, beatings and a decade in jail for her.

Back in Che's day she would have just been shot.

[Taverner]

63. Correct about Che

Thing is, its a dictatorship. It may have some level of benevolence, but in the end it is still a dictatorship

Which means, all dissent is suppressed.

[AlphaCentauri]

67. and who say DU is not under surveillance

[Dreamer Tatum]

76. Give me a break already

We pointed out, pointedly, the bullshittery and criminality of the Bush regime every single say and no one got disappeared. In fact, NOTHING happened under what many consider the be the most repressive admininstration in US history. So now, after 8 years, DU is under surveillance? By whom? Obama? REALLY?

:eyes:

[AlphaCentauri]

83. common fear do more to control people than disappearing them

we had a lot of it in the last years

[Dreamer Tatum]

85. You have 4800 posts in 4 years.

Doesn't look like you were afraid of squat.

[AlphaCentauri]

91. out of the 350 millions people? I'm in the small minority who post in DU

[Dreamer Tatum]

96. You started this by wondering whether DU is under surveillance

not the entire US. Stay on point.

[AlphaCentauri]

99. OK so what makes you think DU is not?

[Dreamer Tatum]

103. Maybe it is. Maybe scores of computers have been confiscated,

DUers have been jailed without due process, and the actual DU was shut down in 2001, and this is a DU that actually runs on government servers, with stand-ins for all the people who have been disappeared.

Somehow I doubt that.

[AlphaCentauri]

115. surveillance doesn't mean to take away computers or jail posters

it could be used to assist in propaganda or psychological wars

[DissedByBush]

122. We probably are

But we're still here.

In Cuba we'd have been shut down a while ago, after the Government got several thousand people to tag for future surveillance. Then at its convenience we'd be tried for counter-revolutionary activities and thrown in jail. That is if they are smart. Maybe they would have shut down the servers as soon as DU got popular and arrested everybody.

In any case, we have it easy here. With what I write here I am more afraid of offending a big corporation and getting sued than I am of hearing the jackboots at my door.

In Cuba or any other non-free state I would just be afraid.

No, I wouldn't be afraid. I have a wife and little kids so I would probably be keeping my mouth shut.

Call me chicken for that. I admit it.

[AlphaCentauri]

136. in DU we don't see people trying to overthrow the government

in Cuba and outside Cuba there is a small group who wants to overthrow the government, we don't see that in DU other wise everybody here would be in jail like the man who was sentenced for Obama threats

[DissedByBush]

143. People in Cuba can be jailed and tortured just for criticism

Criticism far less than what we had here when Bush was in office.

Weren't we talking about "Regime change at home"? That would get you thrown in jail in Cuba.

We wanted a complete change for the path this country was going down. We wanted a change in the power structure that runs this country.

Such desires are illegal to voice in Cuba.

Threats are a different matter altogether.

[AlphaCentauri]

147. The Montana Militia is the only thing that can be compare to the Cuban government critics

and we know where are the Montana Militia members for not paying their taxes.

[DissedByBush]

149. Those are the extreme here

You don't have to be extreme in Cuba to go to jail.

You don't have to be any more radical in criticizing the government than we are here.

Try criticizing the state labor union and start one yourself to bargain for better working conditions. Have fun in jail if you persist.

If you're a doctor and criticize the government first you'll lose your license to practice. Keep doing it, maybe organize a couple peaceful protests, and you'll find yourself in jail.

Despite claims of democracy and equality, Cuba is an autocratic repressive government where the people have no freedom of speech and assembly.

Oh, yes, I know there abuses here. But that's what they are here, abuses.

In Cuba it's normal policy and there is no recourse if you get jailed, tortured and raped for speaking your mind.

[Joe Chi Minh]

158. I'll bet if DU chiefs came down hard on the trolls, it would be closed down

in rag-time. An unspoken 'entente', I should think.

[ngant17]

134. If this were a Cuban DU

all the Repug trolls would have their internet access shut down!

[divineorder]

203. Is what she is saying the truth?

Regardless of what pittance she may get from whoever-it doesn't have to be the Pentagon. It can be private citizens or some other public group.

As what we've seen with East Germany forty years ago, the Eastern Block, and China, Communism-once its reached a certain stage, reveals all of the repression and puritanism inherent in its rigid ideology. It kills its young-the Cultural Revolution, Tiannamen Square, young dissidents in the 1980's. Not to mention it's long war against intellectuals, creative artists, anyone with spirit and independent ideas, small religions. Joanie, born and raised after the Revolution-it's third generation-has seen sloganeering that has done nothing to elevate the well being of the Cuban people, the endless surveillance, the lack of living standards compared to the tourists that have come over to be on the beaches. And she writes and sends her documents to be published on a blog. She's accused of being a tool for having a blog that is paid for. Blogging isn't really expensive. Hosting can be free or immensely cheap if you don't need a lot of storage space.

It was the third generation that took down the Berlin Wall, that brought in Glasnost, that fought Cheaucesu (sp) in the streets, that had Tiannamen Square. They were not fueled by nostalgia for a world they never knew and could no longer be recreated. They were fueled because Communism at its core, at its most institutionally corrupt and controlling, never really trusted (trusts) the people.

[naaman fletcher]

55. BWAHAHAHA

Your source offers zero proof that she is paid, but does offer up gems like this:

"The technical support for this site, which is dedicated practically exclusively to her blog is a custom configuration, that at current market prices costs hundreds of thousands of dollars."

Hundreds of thousands of dollars? lol.

[boppers]

197. LOL, to host a blog?

That's like, oh, 3 bucks a month.

Looks like the source is propaganda.

[Mudoria]

132. That's your source?

:rofl:

[Downwinder]

9. Sounds like Pittsburgh or St. Paul. The whole world is going to hell. n/t

[AlphaCentauri]

18. From Miami with love

every time a crime is committed in Cuba or Venezuela is the government fault like there are no criminals in those countries, so how did she identified the secret agents?

I know, I know they were in street clothes so thats how she knew they were secret agents.

May be she is right they were secret agents but from where? we have to ask Juanita
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/oct/26/juanita-fidel-castro-sister-cia-book

:eyes:

[robcon]

38. The part I don't understand is the surprise. Fasist states arrest protesters.

It's what they do. Cuba is a fascist state, and it does what fascist states do.

[AlphaCentauri]

42. if Cuba were full of corporations it would be a free country n/t

[demoleft]

46. no, maybe not. who would not prefer a dictator with his bunch of villains instead? :) n/t

[AlphaCentauri]

71. like Pinochet ?

[demoleft]

77. indeed, some "socialist" leader took lesson from pinochet's methods ;)

castro among them.

i'm all for allende, as you can imagine. i know what you mean with pinochet.
but as to cuba - the fact is that castrists here always defend cuba in comparative terms, never in absolute terms.
which i understand - hehe.

and i accuse castrists in absolute terms, instead.

the news is about beating anyway.

and beating is not socialist.
i assume you agree on this.

[AlphaCentauri]

88. I see but the blogger doesn't provide any proof of the governments involvement

beatings happen all the time everywhere by criminals also we have to make an evaluation of the blogger to see if she doesn't suffer from schizophrenia or paranoia where she thinks everything that happened to her is the government fault.

[demoleft]

100. no evidence, you're right there. and we won't ever have probably.

unless someone was there with a camera.
on the other hand - does it make sense that she makes up a story like this, which would push her more in the target of police?
would it not make more sense to just go on writing on the blog, without stirring more control over herself?

as to her psychic state - hehe, well, a schizofrenic paranoid pentagon babe in cuba? sounds more like woody allen than else.
;) but of course, everything's possible.

the woman was prized, she's internationally known.

[EFerrari]

104. So is Ollie North. n/t

[demoleft]

106. my fault. i should know better that everything's fine in cuba, before posting these news. :) n/t

[EFerrari]

109. I don't think Cuba is the re-discovered Garden.

But Sanchez trades on the goodwill of people who sincerely feel outrage at human rights abuses to pull down her check, afaik.

[demoleft]

112. i know you don't. n/t

[AlphaCentauri]

113. a story like this would push her into more media exposure

that's what she wants after all, about the prizes it all depend who is giving the prizes away what are the political motives.
A prize doesn't mean she is mentally stable, Roman Polanski comes to mind.

[Duende azul]

128. And she knows, whatever she does she is perfectly safe.

She can be sure that Cuba will not do what the US or their allies in Honduras, Colombia and elsewhere are willing to do to stifle dissent.

No death squads in Cuba. Nonetheless the country is constantly harassed by the US and to a smaller amount by the EU.
Have you ever heard about a ban on Chiquita or other US corporations punished for their actions? Anyone in jail for the killing of union members through paramilitary? No? Oops.
But there are five Cubans in prison in the US for "spying" on terrorists. And you expect a Pentagon paid writer to go totally unchecked in Cuba?
For good measure Luis Posada Cariles is still free to do what he's pleased.

From a non US perspective, the hypocrisy of US Americans ranting about Cuba is difficult to stand.

[Downwinder]

47. How can you combine Fascist and Socialism. They are mutually exclusive. n/t

[DissedByBush]

150. NSDAP

Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei

a.k.a.

National Socialist German Worker's Party

a.k.a.

Nazi fascists.

It's easy to combine elements of fascism and socialism. Most systems in most countries aren't purely one kind of system.

It helps in this case that the fascists never really got down a solid fascist economic theory of their own. Fascism was mostly related to the political realm.

[struggle4progress]

172. Word games don't shed any useful light on history. In 1920, when the then-tiny DAP stuck

"Nationalsozialistische" on the front of its name, the Sozialdemokratische Partei Deutschlands and the Unabhängige Sozialdemokratische Partei Deutschlands (a splinter from the SPD) were the two largest parties in the Reichstag. The SPD was a party we would call "socialist" -- it was reformist, not anti-capitalist, and had strong trade-union support. The USPD was somewhat more Marxist in orientation but still reformist (rather than revolutionary); the Kommunistische Partei Deutschlands eventually split from the USPD, and the rest of the USPD rejoined the SPD in 1922

The third largest party in 1920 was the rightwing Deutschnationale Volkspartei

Note that the "socialist" parties named themselves "Sozial," not "Sozialistische." Streicher's rightwing group, the Deutschsozialistische Partei, had the idea of using "Sozialistische" in hopes of siphoning supporters from the SPD. Streicher's DSP was anti-semitic and anti-communist: it propagandized that Jews and Bolsheviks were conspiring to turn Germany Communist

The DAP name-change, to include "Nationalsozialistische," was intended to siphon support from rightwing nationalist parties (like the DNVP), competing tiny rightwing parties (like Streicher's DSP, which in 1922 dissolved in favor of the NSDAP), and the social democratic parties (SPD and USPD)

[Ignis]

182. Badly, and without a dictionary at hand?

We see this same mixing-up of political ideologies all the time by Wingnuts: Obama is, amazingly, a Nazi, a Socialist, a Fascist, a Communist, and Muslim...all at the same time!

:dunce:

[Judi Lynn]

48. Nearly 300 protestors arrested in GOP convention protests

Nearly 300 protestors arrested in GOP convention protests
By Bea Chang
Updated: 14 months ago

ST. PAUL, Minn. -- Anti-government protesters marked the first day of the Republican National Convention by roaming through downtown St. Paul.

The individuals, who described themselves at anarchists, anti-authoritarians and anti-capitalists, spent most of Monday engaging, and at times running from, police. They were separate from a peaceful antiwar protest that wound through nearby streets.

Police estimates of the marchers shifted several times, ranging from 2,000 to 10,000.

Police arrested at least 283 people, of which 129 were felonies, 51 gross misdemeanors and 103 misdemeanor arrests.

St. Paul Police Chief John Harrington says about 180 protesters who weren't part of the main anti-war march caused the trouble.

Authorities say more arrests are expected.

http://www.kare11.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=523533

~~~~~~~~~~~
Port protest left physical, mental scar

Oakland Tribune, May 25, 2003 | by Cecily Burt, STAFF WRITER

OAKLAND -- Willow Rosenthal would surely rather talk about peas and cabbage than stinger grenades and beanbag projectiles.

But the West Oakland woman, owner of City Slicker Farms community garden and a program manager with the Women's Initiative for Self Employment, has put talk of organic vegetables on hold since being severely injured on April 7, when police shot at anti-war protesters at the Port of Oakland.

The Oakland police officers used less-lethal ammunition, not bullets. But the impact -- both emotional and physical -- is nearly as bad, she said.

Rosenthal was leaving the intersection of Seventh and Maritime streets, in a group of 100 or more people trying to find their way back to the West Oakland BART station, when police started shooting and she was struck in the back of the right calf.

The ammo ricocheted off the trucks in the intersection and panicked people didn't know which way to go, Rosenthal said.

Even as they fled, police fired at their backs. The impact knocked her down, and she could not walk.

Others helped her up as the police bore down. She said it was the most terrifying moment of her life, thinking she would be shot again.

She never heard a warning. She does not know if she will ever feel comfortable attending a protest again.

"There's part of me that is afraid to go, which is what these (types of actions) are calculated to do," she said.

More:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4176/is_20030525/ai_n14546950/

~~~~~~~~~~~~

April 07, 2003

Oakland Police Fire Wooden Bullets at Protesters; At Least 12 Injured, Including Dockworkers
Protesters pelted with wooden bullets at Port of Oakland (4/07/03 - San Jose Mercury News)

http://www.subliminalnews.com.nyud.net:8090/assets/OaklandWound_4.7.03.jpg

Protester wounded by Oakland police assault.

Police in Oakland, CA fired wooden dowels, rubber bullets, tear gas "stingers" and concussion grenades at protesters in front of the Port of Oakland on April 7. Protesters as well as longshoremen employed by the Port were injured in the assault, according to victims, witnesses and reporters on the scene. It is believed to be the most violent confrontation between police and protesters to date since the March 19 invasion of Iraq.

Initial reports indicate that about a dozen were injured. Six injured dockworkers were treated by paramedics, but "it is unclear" if protesters were treated. Press reports still coming in at this writing indicate at least one longshoreman has been hospitalized.
About 500 picketing activists gathered at the Port early in the morning to protest shipping companies profiting from DOD contracts to ship war materiel to Iraq. Most of the crowd had been dispersed, but police opened fire on a group of about 150 who refused to leave the gates.

Deputy Police Chief Patrick Haw claimed protesters had attacked first, telling reporters, "Police moved aggressively against crowds because some people threw rocks and big iron bolts at officers."

However, at least one protester had a different version. "I was marching in a circle when the police lowered their guns at us," said Oakland resident Scott Fleming, 29, a criminal defense attorney. "I started to run and kept getting hit in the back."

A group of longshoremen pinned against a fence was caught in the cross fire and several of them were injured. Trent Willis, a business agent for the International Longshore and Warehouse Union (ILWU), told AP that enraged dockworkers were leaving the docks after the incident.

"They shot my guys. We're not going to work today," Willis said. "The cops had no reason to open up on them."

Another longshoreman was also openly angered by the police action. "I was standing as far back as I could," Kevin Wilson told AP. "It was very scary. All of that force wasn't necessary."

At this writing, Reuters has omitted any mention of the wooden bullets in its reporting so far, emphasizing instead the less dangerous rubber and tear gas projectiles. However, both the San Jose Mercury News and the Associated Press quote Oakland Police spokeswoman Danielle Ashford as confirming their use.

Although officially classified as "non-lethal" weapons, wooden bullets can be quite dangerous. They are one-inch diameter dowels about one-and-a-half inches long. Dealers who sell such ammunition make a point to note that "Special care must be taken when firing this ammo. Wooden bullets can penetrate" the body, causing potentially serious injury, including broken bones.

Even rubber and plastic bullets can cause injury and even death. A post to a US Navy medical message board states, "Both rubber and plastic bullets have resulted in deaths from skull fractures or closed head injuries, and permanent blindness for those struck in the eye."

More:
http://www.subliminalnews.com/archives/000042.php

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC., ETC.

[naaman fletcher]

49. yes but they have universal healthcare.

Have you ever been to Cuba? Why the obsession? Maybe if you spent more time worrying about your own country, it would be better. And stop assuming that news from the corpro-fascist media is true.

/sarcasm off

[demoleft]

56. in italy, when someone accused fascist dictator mussolini, some replied that...

...since he was ruling the train arrived in time and many lands in the region lazio had been turned from swamps to agricoltural use.

:) as if this changed something in the matter: would you trade your freedom for a train that comes in time?
i would not. not even for health care.

[AlphaCentauri]

65. Corporations were in charge of those trains

facist is about corporate control over government nothing to do with socialism

[demoleft]

68. i never compared fascism to socialism. indeed, cuba is all but socialist. n/t

[AlphaCentauri]

70. What is socialism then?

[demoleft]

73. you mean the label on the cuban governmental parades? or on the chinese ones?

...or you mean the french socialism of the early reformers, those whose books taught marx some basics?
or you mean marx himself?

i'd pick engels pages on the workers neighborhoods in england.
and answer yur question like this: socialism is pity, as well. feeling. sharing. compassion.

and castrists have no pity for the people.

that's not socialism. if not in a label.

[AlphaCentauri]

79. So how Cubans are not taking care of their people?

we don not have access to their country or their media, we can end in jail if we go there.

[roody]

94. She has not posted a photo of herself beaten.

Nor of her companions whom were beaten. According to her story, they were rogue cops. That is not unique to Cuba.

[Joe Chi Minh]

159. That reminds me of the Clint Eastwood film of the young psychopath kidnapper,

who paid a heavy to beat him up, so he could blame it on Eastwood! Watch out for some photo-shopped snaps!

[EFerrari]

95. I have one more thing to add to this thread. Human Rights Watch

should stop hiring talking heads for Pinochet like Jose Vivanco to head up their Latin America unit.

And here he is defending Pinochet on the pretext of trying him at home. What a disgusting whore.


http://www.nytimes.com/1999/10/14/opinion/ready-for-justice.html

[DissedByBush]

123. HRW is only one of many

Cuba is low on the human rights lists from organizations like Amnesty International, Reporters Without Borders and the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights.

Many rights we take for granted do not exist there.

Want to unionize? There is only the state union where you must swear allegiance to the state. No independent unions allowed. Want to strike over your working conditions? Illegal.

Are you gay? Well these days you're lucky because it has gotten a little better. Before you'd have been sent to a "re-education camp."

Want to talk to your doctor in private? Don't worry, by policy he's informing on you to the government.

Want to send your kid to a school more in line with your beliefs? Nope, only the state-run indoctrination programs are legal.

Want to write something critical of the government? Wow, they have gotten lax. Before she could have been like the gay writer and poet Reinaldo Arenas who was tortured and imprisoned for publishing something without permission. That he was gay only made it worse for him.

[EFerrari]

129. Right. Too bad Cubans don't have the freedom to be snatched off the street

and to be tortured in Syria!

[DissedByBush]

144. Of course the Cuban government doesn't send their people to Syria

They do it right at home all the time for voicing criticism of the government.

We were able to openly criticize our own government for what it did, and we were able to elect a new leader who promised to stop it.

Try that in Cuba.

[EFerrari]

154. Evidence? Even las madres de la plaza de mayo

have repudiated the so called "Ladies in White".

And, btw, Leon Panetta has said rendition is a good tool. They have no intention of stopping it.

[DissedByBush]

167. I already gave a good example

Reinaldo Arenas. There's also Jorge Pérez, jailed for 17 years, which included regular beatings. Among his crimes were disrespect to Castro and criticizing communism.

Wow, imagine the state of DU members if criticizing Bush had been a crime worthy of years in prison.

"And, btw, Leon Panetta has said rendition is a good tool. They have no intention of stopping it."

We at least had the option of voting in someone who promised to stop it. We can openly protest, too. What are the options for Cubans who don't like their home-grown torture machine? They have two options: shut up or endure it themselves.

[Joe Chi Minh]

160. Somebody posted on here quite recently that someone who'd voiced a threat

against Bush was never seen again. No-one who knew him knows what's become of him. Disappeared.

[DissedByBush]

169. Evidence

Seriously, this requires a lot of evidence.

Our government doesn't need to "disappear" someone who voices a threat.

The Secret Service openly arrests and the government publicly prosecutes people who voice threats against a sitting president.

[roody]

173. Our government throws them off of buildings--

or has them commit suicide.

[Joe Chi Minh]

177. I'm sure people were busily snapping away at the arresting officers,

fully anticipating that that would be the last they saw if him! And, strange to relate, obtaining photos or video clips of disappeared people in custody, is not as easy as it evidently sounds to you

Anyway, where did you get the idea that "disappearing" people required secrecy? Do you really think the Argentinian "desaparecidos" were all spirited away in the dead of night. The more visible the arrests, the greater the fear/terror.

And how is it that the cretin who visibly carried a pistol and a placard about the tree of democracy needing to be periodically watered, was not prosecuted? Or the dim young hoods with the weapons and ammo on the way to an Obama meeting?

Evidence! I'm not a court of law, you nut. I was solely purveying hear-say - the purport of a post on DU. If you choose not to believe it, it's entirely up to you. I just thought it odd to read on here by someone who seemed rational, and that no-one commented on it.

On the other hand, bearing in mind that it was/is? perfectly legal under the bizarrely-named Patriot Act, and the extremely authoritarian nature of that regime, I'm rather surprised not to have read more of such allegations.

[DissedByBush]

179. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence

It's about basic motivation. Why should the government use extralegal means to do that which it can do openly and legally?

It's not believable.

[Joe Chi Minh]

181. You are simply not paying attention. I pointed out that it was perfectly legal

by reason of the Patriot Act. Such a person would not be allowed to contact either family or any legal representative. Absolutely incommunicado, as I expect applies to the subjects of a rendition. And it would all be legal on the part of the panoply of state.

Moreover, the whole context of the Bush years was extraordinary in any number of particulars - not least, the Patriot Act and Executive Orders. Your username is beginning to sound a little anomalous.

[DissedByBush]

183. I'm talking about your basic idiot making a threat

We've dealt with them pretty much the same way for years.

Now have any connection, real or imagined, to a terrorist group and your constitutional rights go out the Window.

BTW, for this example you have to go back to the president who started the practice, Ronald Reagan. It was then continued by subsequent presidents including Clinton. But at least through Clinton we always did it to known terrorists. Bush didn't seem to care who it happened to.

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

110. Democracy in Cuba is as possible as democracy in the USA.

Need I say more?

[struggle4progress]

124. It seems some dickheads detained her briefly and weren't particularly gentle in their

treatment -- which (of course) is really unacceptable, whether or not she was seriously injured. But it would be much easier to have a definite and informed opinion if Sanchez didn't have a tendency to tell her stories in an incoherent and over-blown manner. Apparently this incident occurred Friday; she asserts it was "very violent" and a "Sicilian-style kidnapping." But she also says that she was in custody only about 20 minutes and that she was the only one injured; it is only on Saturday -- after talking to press -- that Sanchez says she will head off to hospital. The minor details that she emphasizes (a rap on the knuckles and pulled hair) and her larger claims (kicked, beaten, kneed in the back) seem somewhat incongruous to me. And -- she brags about grabbing someone by the testicles. I was frequently harassed by police in my hippy days, and I'm rather sure today I'd be long dead had I grabbed any of those cops by the balls back then. So my guess might be that some dickheads harassed her; she responded like a jackass herself; and the situation escalated a bit before the dickheads quit

San Jose police officers caught on video using baton, Taser gun on suspect
By Sean Webby
Updated: 10/26/2009 03:06:29 PM PDT
A cell phone video shows San Jose police officers repeatedly using batons and a Taser gun on an unarmed San Jose State student, including at least one baton strike that appears to come after the man is handcuffed, as they took him into custody inside his home last month ... http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_13635707?source=most_emailed

Fresno Police Kill 2 Unarmed Men this Week
The Fresno police have killed 3 unarmed men in the last 5 weeks ... http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2009/10/28/18627051.php

Cuban Blogger Yoani Sanchez Says She Was Detained, Struck by Cops
HAVANA – Cuban blogger Yoani Sanchez, winner of several international prizes, said that she was detained for 20 minutes and mistreated by police ... http://www.laht.com/article.asp?ArticleId=346973&CategoryId=14510

... The agents ordered her and one of her friends to get into their car and pulled her hair and kicked her when she initially refused, Sanchez said. "It was very violent," she said ... http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation-world/sns-ap-cb-cuba-blogger-detained,0,5703233.story

... Pardo was released with her and had no injuries, she said. Another blogger, Claudia Cadelo, was taken away in a separate police car and released unharmed at a different location ... http://www.reuters.com/article/mediaNews/idUSN0620636520091107

... Sanchez said she planned to admit herself to a hospital Saturday night ... http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americas/11/07/cuba.blogger.detained/

Secuestro estilo camorra
... Yoani, móntate en el auto” me dijo uno mientras me aguantaba fuertemente por la muñeca ... Me aguanté de la puerta ... golpes en los nudillos ... Sólo acerté a agarrarle a éste – a través del pantalón – los testículos ...
http://www.desdecuba.com/generaciony/

[DissedByBush]

145. This was just a warning

She is now on notice as to what could happen to her should she continue her criticism of the government.

[struggle4progress]

170. I'll say again: anyone anywhere who grabs a cop by the nuts is asking for trouble.

[Joe Chi Minh]

161. Don't be nasty! There are some vey tender soul on here who would

evidently believe whatever Fox News or CNN put out. New York Times, for that matter.

[roody]

174. I'm glad she has health care!!!

[proteus_lives]

126. Ahhhh, Cuba.

The communist eden that people build boats made of tires, port-a-potties and old Buicks to escape from.

Via la revolution! :rofl:

[Mudoria]

133. Ain't that the truth...

if they could all get access to boats Raul and Fidel would be the only residents left.

[AlphaCentauri]

135. Mariel

:yoiks:

[Judi Lynn]

138. From whom are the Lat. Am. people who die in the desert in the hundreds each year trying to escape?

He must be one scary guy who has millions of people struggling through deserts, over mountains, across rivers, many dying mercilessly, scattered across the landscape helplessly from California to Texas.

[Psephos]

171. They are trying to escape poverty and corruption.

Hmmm.

You wouldn't think that the Cubans are...ummm...oh never mind. ;)

[Joe Chi Minh]

162. And are now sleeping in the streets! Ruing the day.

[MellowDem]

146. I think you mean...

"pure communist style". Castro's Cuba is not fascist, but it is authoritarian in many ways and quite restrictive.

[Liberation Angel]

163. I just spent about an hour or so researching this story and...she's Cuba's Michelle Malkin

it seems she has been warned by the government to tone down her statements in the past, that her blog is financed from abroad and is a very popular anti-communist and while there is no proof she is financed by the Pentagon I could find there is plenty of evidence that she MAY be a propagandist on the intel community's payroll (Blackwater style?)

In a blog post referring to "Night if the Long Knives" she claims Cubans are waiting with knives under their beds to get back at the bureaucrats who oppressed them.

Nice.

No one reads her in Cuba (probably totally blocked).

But the fact that she is not under the jail given what she writes actually is a refute to the claims of horrible oppression there.

They tolerate her the way we tolerate a lot of right wing nonsense on DU.

Sounds like she may have been roughed up and held for 20-30 minutes but the NY Times says she was not harmed.

WHY she was picked up and who really picked her up is another question.

Could it have been faked?

I think it might have been.

But having spent time with those arrested in Denver and at the Republican National Convention last summer it sounds like she was handled with kid gloves by comparison. The Cubans KNOW that she is a propaganda machine for Capitalism (not real democracy) but they still let her go.

Speaks volumes to me.

BTW - the reason Cubans can't get the bandwidth and share in the global info revolution seems to be the US blockade of the internet and not necessarily the other way around.

She is also an advocate of tweeting their procapitalist revolution.

Soon to be in a Fox faux-news show with Michelle Malkin???

[Joe Chi Minh]

178. They're so authoritarian, I wonder why they don't kick her out?

[David__77]

175. This is such nonsense.

So she has her blog and is lauded by the state media of the US. She is part of parcel of the US-supported "civil society" pro-neoliberal penetration attempts. She says she was beaten, but there is no evidence of this, no witnesses other than her fellow activist. I doubt any of this even happened. If she is colluding with a foreign power though, she could be prosecuted.

[Psephos]

184. Blaming the victim, pretending the beating and kidnap are fabrications.

It says a lot about you. None of it is good.

US State Dept (yeah, the one under the Obama Administration), thinks differently.

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/prs/ps/2009/nov/131703.htm

[David__77]

186. Ha...

How wonderful that the US government made a pronouncement. And we know the US government is always truthful and correct lol

[Psephos]

187. The "pronouncement" that matters already came from the person who matters. n/t

[EFerrari]

190. Oh, please. Where do you think the funds come from for people

in the destabilization business? The State Department.

[Psephos]

191. Do you doubt Sanchez' account?

I can find no way to justify that kind of brutal treatment of a woman. I couldn't care less what the political angle is.

The State Dept. commentary is significant given Obama's clear intentions and actions to lessen tension between the US and Cuba.

[EFerrari]

192. Of course I doubt her. She's a right wing spinner. That's what she does.

And the State Department is not a credible source of information on Cuba or anything related to Cuba.

[Psephos]

193. Can't go there with you on this one.

Whether or not she's right-wing, she should be able to express her opinions and observations without being subject to intimidation and violence.

A difference of politics does not erase one's human rights.

[EFerrari]

194. Of course it doesn't. But in order to go there, you have to take her word

for it in the absence of any credible witness.

[rayofreason]

188. The national...

...doesn't seem to be too far from the socialist around here.

And regarding all those "disappeared DUers" under the evil US government referred to upthread - I'm one.....

...well, I got better.

She's a witch anyway!! Burn her! (apologies to John Cleese)

[ItNerd4life]

189. But, but, but she has great healthcare and great education!

I mean it's the best in the world!

(I wonder how many people won't understand that this is sarcasm?)

[Mika]

195. What a useless thread this is.

How many posters posting here have actually been there?

One or two? (Strangely, the DUers who have actually been to Cuba seem to have a more rational and less paranoia based opinion of the place.)


FYI, Yoani is a very wealthy Cuban in Cuba. She used to reside in Spain. Then she moved back to Cuba. She is a supporter of Oswaldo Paya and the staunchly RW anti abortion Christian Democratic Party of Cuba (one of the many political parties in Cuba).




-

[demoleft]

199. yes, of course we're all paranoid. and cuba is a paradise.

already discussed this. we agree to disagree on it.

as to the blogger, she might be the richest girl in the world, she might be the most rightist person in whole cuba.
it does not matter.

what matters is that the method of beating/threatening disagreeing voices is practise in that country. and this is simply hateful.
period.

[Mika]

200. Some people say.

And if some people say .. it must be true.

---

[demoleft]

202. hehe. some people have the truth (you and the ones you mean)...

...and some people don't - the ones who feel "uneasy" in cuba.

:)

[murdoch]

198. American bloggers beaten, detained

She was going to a march in Cuba, and then the "secret police" detained and arrested her.

Well, I know of dozens of cases of that happening in this country over the past few years of people going to protest the RNC, or the DNC, or World Bank or whatever. Just ask the people who were tear gassed and beaten in Seattle in 1999. Or many times since.

A month ago the FBI ("the secret police") raided the home of someone a mile from where I live, Elliot Madison, because he was protesting the G-20 ( http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/05/nyregion/05txt.html ). Where are the statements from the leaders of the world in defense of the Elliot Madisons of the world?

And of course, the US military is occupying Guantanamo Bay in Cuba despite the Cubans asking the US for the past half century to leave. With the US doing the real beating and torturing of prisoners within that piece of land.

But let's just have the parade of middle class white Americans here launch invective all over the place over what those brown skins who reject US dominance are doing down south. With terrorists who blew up civilians in Cuban airlines walking around Miami as heroes.

[demoleft]

205. never said west is paradise. some hint that cuba is. which is grotesque.

the idea of cuba as last frontier against the US capitalism and imperialism is a western passion.
wish the cubans could choose if to fight the anti-imperialist battle against US. maybe they're tired. maybe they want something different. hard to tell. let's try to ask them?

you know: the right to disagree. such a wonderful thing.

dictatorships - be it "socialist" or "fascist" - the methods and propaganda are just the same.
my hatred for such methods comes from the guts, you know...maybe because my family had fascists and nazi soldiers at home, seeking my grandfather.

oh and as to me - i'm a poor-class white european and the only parades i see are those dictators are so fond of.
i prefer rallies. and i can have.