Stephen Hawking defends UK's 'Orwellian' healthcare after attack by U.S. politicians

[sabra]

Source: UK Daily Mail

Professor Stephen Hawking has spoken out in defence of the NHS after high-level U.S. politicians have branded the National Health Service 'evil' and 'Orwellian'.

The British professor, who has suffered from Lou Gehrig's disease for 40 years, insisted that he 'would not be here' were it not for the NHS.

He spoke after an editorial in Investor's Business Daily, a national financial newspaper in the U.S. that also runs articles by columnists on the Left and the Right, launched a misinformed attack on the NHS.

In an editorial commenting on the healthcare debate that has gripped America this summer, the newspaper claimed: ' People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn't have a chance in the UK, where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless.'

However Professor Hawking- who as recently as April was treated in an NHS hospital, Addenbrooke's hospital in Cambridge - quickly rubbished the claim.

'I wouldn’t be here today if it were not for the NHS,' he told the Guardian. I have received a large amount of high-quality treatment without which I would not have survived.'




Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1205953/NHS-branded-evil-Orwellian-high-level-US-politicians.html

[Octafish]

1. Investor's Business Daily makes Attila the Hun look reasonable.

And they're proud of it.

Good on you, Dr. Hawking, for standing up to the bullying liars.

[tjwash]

33. delete--wrong place

nt

[SCantiGOP]

54. Jon Stewart covered this earlier

Said the guy was mistaken since Hawking's computer generated voice didn't have a British accent.

[lsewpershad]

73. This should be sent

to every repukes mail boxes in cluding the blue DOGS

[Xipe Totec]

2. Funny how facts never get in the way of a vigorous debate for the repugs n/t

[Grinchie]

66. Most Maerican's have been taught that facts and indpendant thought are a bad thing.

Taking the time to do research, verify the validity of indpedant sources, and question the motives of those that are supposedly expert or trustworthy is off the table.

That's how the Propaganda machine works. These facts, along with a Lemming like nature to compulsively go along with the Social Group out of fear of being alienated, produces a crop of easily influenced citizens that react instinctively to the loudest, most often repeated Propaganda.

These people do not know what the word Socialism means. They don't know how a trillion cells in their own body manage to get along without killing each other.

[No Elephants]

121. "Most Maericans have been taught that facts and indpendant thought are a bad thing." {sic} Really?

[RaleighNCDUer]

126. If you don't think so, you probably never attended school in the US.

I don't think I met more than a half dozen teachers from grade school to graduation who REALLY valued independent thought. They liked discipline. Order. Conformity. Facts were what THEY gave YOU, and not anything that contradicted anything THEY said. The only worse thing you could do than ask a question the teacher couldn't answer, was to prove the teacher's answer was wrong.

And I'm NOT knocking teachers, here. Both of my parents and one of my sisters are or were teachers. I considered it myself, but decided I could not do it - too hard a job for my temperament.

But the simple fact is, the system is set up to reward those who do NOT question, and those who accept their programming.

[jhrobbins]

115. Yes, and you'll pardon me if I listen to the greatest mind since Einstein

(I would think) and not Glen Beck and Sean Hannity who are not fit to push Stepehn Hawking

[rurallib]

3. And he didn't go bankrupt. And he didn't lose his insurance. And he

didn't hit a donut hole. And he probably has had to pay a hundred pounds or so for medication.

[NJCher]

9. and look what he's given us

What he has added to our knowledge base.

I shudder to think how he'd have been treated in the U.S.


Cher

[Grinchie]

68. Probably the same way as Wilhelm Reich was.

[On the Road]

81. Wilhelm Reich?

He couldn't get coverage for his orgone box? :D

[Grinchie]

131. Nah, they threw him in Jail and burned his books.

Strangely enough, the books actually desribed the Social plague affecting society, and that's the true reason they went after him.

The FDA has done this quite often through history, and the Media obligingly forgets all about it so people won't be inclined to remember that some techniques, cures and innovative thinking have been around and suppressed for 60 years or more.

Try reading his books, you might be surprised about the many decades of research, expiriments and thought processes that led him to discover "Life Energy" or orgone, which stands for Organic Energy from what I have read.

To think that his books were Burned and basically forgotten from 1957 till just recently is pretty scary, especially when they contain such insight into the human condition.

He directly challenged the Mechanists and the Oligarchs with his discoveries, as was punished severely for it.

[JDPriestly]

136. Have you watched the videos of Century of the Self.

Available on Google videos, I believe. They explain the role of the Freud family in selling selfishness (my language) to Americans. The last video I believe discusses Wilhelm Reich.

[Grinchie]

137. I have indeed. Everyone should take the time to see Century of the Self

I had read Reich's "The Function of the Orgasm", and it it he describes how he was working very closely with Freud, and apparently they were good friends, but when he discovered that Society was using sexual repression to control the masses, and they were becoming ill because of it, he focused more time on studying this phenomena. Freud was unable to support Reichs work, because it conflicted with many of Freuds published works, so Freud distanced himself from Reich.

It was not until I discovered that Edward Bernays, was related to Freud, and was responsible for much of the Propaganda techniques that America is subjected to. Even today. In the Century of the Self, I found it interesting that Eva Freuds experiment of taking a dysfunctional family and making them conform, turned out to be an utter failure, 20 years down the line, as the subjects reverted into self destructive neurosis. They didn't discover this until they had mandated conformity for all for decades, which is kind of frightening when you think of it.

The Century of the Self is such an important documentary, because it actually explains where the Corporations sold out on quality and durability, and started down the path of planned obsolescence and a new, slightly different model every year in order to force consumption. The documentary reinforced my desire for old hand tools, and devices from an era where they were designed to last, or at least be repaired easily. I've even gone so far as to making my own radio tubes! or Valves. It's funny, because one can actually make radio tube by hand with a minimum shop, while handcrafting a transistor or a diode is next to impossible. I care not if they run hot, use more electricity, or may drift a bit, as long as I can repair or replace them when they blow.

So finally to connection is made. Freud was close in his analysis of human behavior, but he was to afraid to actually go as far as Reich, who was more driven by Scientific honesty than Freud was. Bernays picked up on Freuds works and used it to manipulate people for Government and corporations alike, and I wouldn't doubt that Bernays was using his influence to lean on Reich and demonize him through propaganda.

Check out Edward Bernays' book "Propaganda" written in 1928 I believe. http://www.historyisaweapon.org/defcon1/bernprop.html

[nashville_brook]

12. imagine all the brilliant minds who've been silenced by death or marginalized b/c of bankruptcy

and therefore unable to contribute to society. what these "me-firsters" don't understand is that it's not so much that healthcare should be an "individual right" -- it's more like we as a society have a *responsibility* to maintain a high-functioning civic body.

to do otherwise is to invite natural selection of economic status. survival of the richest. imagine if the only brains left to steer our ship were those of the idle rich. talk about Idiocracy.

[kestrel91316]

14. "Imagine if the only brains left to steer our ship were those of the idle rich."

Indeed.

But that is exactly what the RW wants.

[moonbatmax]

99. What do you mean, "IMAGINE"???

Maybe you slept through the last eight years???
(Lord, how many of us wished we could?)

HAH!! Kidding, I know we had better brains available.
It just seemed they were mostly kept off the bridge.

I just hope enough have learned not to make that mistake again.

Hey, we can only hope, can't we?

[nashville_brook]

133. you said a mouthful -- and I didn't realize this when i wrote it, but

we do almost everything we can to silence great minds in our public education system. if you're not from the right side of the school district, or the right color, or mono-lingual/english first, or perhaps most importantly, if you're bright. That's in childhood. Later, if you're lucky enough to go to college, the only people who make it to any kind of "greatness" are people who already have an Ivy League pedigree. You don't get into big media or big science or big anything unless you have big parents or a big name or some other sort of pre-existing bigness.

all that on top of the fact that OUR health care system is exactly the sort that pre-screens the undesirables for death panels, aka, bean counters.

[Cleita]

64. We had that with the previous Bush administration. Will the idiots never

learn? And they still want more of it.

[Odin2005]

78. As a "gifted-and-disabled" high-functioning autistic I know exactly what you are saying.

Us "eccentrics" are dangerous to the corporate order.

[dotymed]

109. EVERYONE KNOWS

They are pro-life.........and pro death penalty?

[brentspeak]

129. Precisely. Hawking would not have survived if he had to endure the U.S. health-cost system

[JDPriestly]

138. Nikolas Tesla being one example

Tesla died of heart failure alone in room 3327 of the New Yorker Hotel, on 7 January 1943.<100> Despite having sold his AC electricity patents, Tesla was destitute and died with significant debts. Later that year the US Supreme Court upheld Tesla's patent number,<101> in effect recognizing him as the inventor of radio.
Bust of Tesla by Ivan Meštrović, 1952, in Zagreb, Croatia

Immediately after Tesla's death became known, the government's Alien Property Custodian office took possession of his papers and property, despite his US citizenship. His safe at the hotel was also opened. At the time of his death, Tesla had been continuing his work on the teleforce weapon, or death ray, that he had unsuccessfully marketed to the US War Department. It appears that his proposed death ray was related to his research into ball lightning and plasma, and was imagined as a particle beam weapon. The US government did not find a prototype of the device in the safe. After the FBI was contacted by the War Department, his papers were declared to be top secret. The personal effects were seized on the advice of presidential advisers; J. Edgar Hoover declared the case most secret, because of the nature of Tesla's inventions and patents.<102> One document stated that " is reported to have some 80 trunks in different places containing transcripts and plans having to do with his experiments <...>".

Tesla's family and the Yugoslav embassy struggled with the American authorities to gain these items after his death due to the potential significance of some of his research. Eventually, his nephew, Sava Kosanoviċ, won possession of some of his personal effects, which are now housed in the Nikola Tesla Museum.<103>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla

[Prophet 451]

92. I just tried working it out

Assuming his meds get topped up every month for the roughly 45 years since he was diagnosed, he'd have paid about £3500 over the course of his life in prescription fees. However, the prescription fee is inflation linked, so it was much less in years past (it's currently £7) and for much of that time, he'd have been exempt as a student and/or disabled person.

[xultar]

4. BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath BUHWAWAWAWA...

:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath
:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath

OH. SHIT. WET. MAI. FUCKIN. PANTS.

:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath
:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath

can't. Breathe.

:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath
:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath

seriously. can't. Breathe.

:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath
:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath

OMG I'm gonna shit myself

:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath
:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath

Please. god. make. it. stop.

:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath
:rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath :rofl:BUHWAWAWAWA.... breath

[kentauros]

38. LoL!!!

:D

Of course, the irony-impaired simply will not get it ;)

[Triana]

5. Stephen Hawking. . .

One of the greatest minds on the planet. You tell 'em dude! :applause:

[Richd506]

6. And he scores!

STEPHEN HAWKING: 1
U.S. POLITICIANS: 0

[kestrel91316]

15. Nah, he scored THREE POINTS with that one.

[Hugabear]

7. Who does that dumbfuck think he is?

:sarcasm:

[Kermitt Gribble]

8. Sad thing is

the right thinks scientists are evil too, so this won't sway them one bit. 'Evil' healthcare - how can anyone take these people seriously?

[Moonwalk]

22. Yes, the Repugs think Scientists are 'evil' but even people who distrust scientists--

--seem to love Stephen Hawking. The reason people often hate scientists is because said people are insecure about their smarts and hate anyone who makes them feel dumb, specially when that smart person, in proving how smart he is, appears to them as "smug." But Hawking can't appear "smug" sitting there in his wheelchair, and they can't hate on him because he's so obviously worse off then they are for all his smarts. So they tend to give him a pass that they don't give other scientists.

Which means I think his words will have more impact than if they'd come from, say, Richard Dawkins talking about how UK health care fixed this or that problem he was having.

[ImOnlySleeping]

26. I know

How would they believe a lunatic that believes in evolution.

[NorCalDem]

10. Yep! Well said Stephen!

In this country, we would have let the smartest and one of the most important man of a generation die just because insurance companies couldn't profit from him.

That's the god's honest truth, no one can argue this.

[earthboundmisfit]

11. K&R from the sister of a Lou Gehrig's victim

(My wonderful, brilliant brother's now in his eighth year of ALS.) So glad Professor Hawking responded to this absurd statement!

[JDPriestly]

13. Read the letters to the editor following the article.

Here is one:

My elderly neighbour had a painful knee, her GP referred her to a specialist, she was seen a week later and had the op the following week, that is how bad it is for health in the UK. My mum is 87 and has just been told she can have an operation to improve her sight so she will not need glasses, same GP. When mum had a stroke, she was seen by a specialist stroke unit and thanks to them has fully recovered.

Meanwhile in the US, my elderly aunt had parkinson's, ran out of insurance and my uncle sold everything. My cousin's partner broke his back in a skiing accident, insurance ran out and they have lost everything.

The NHS may have some serious faults, (Adenbrooks have a Director for "Customer Experience"!) but I have seen both and know which I choose.

- Helena, lincolnshire, 12/8/2009 3:18

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1205953/NHS-branded-evil-Orwellian-high-level-US-politicians.html#ixzz0Nz2iciNT

How about

What a load of rubbish. It is disgusting that in the 21st century a wealthy developed country such as the USA does not provide a healthcare service for its citizens. As for the wild claims made by the US politicians, they are obviously not being treated for their psychiatric problems! What do you expect from a nation of people who depend on Psychiatrists to survive - a nation of psychiatrics!

Do they know what the words truth and fact mean?

- Mark Amy, England, 12/8/2009 4:21

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1205953/NHS-branded-evil-Orwellian-high-level-US-politicians.html#ixzz0Nz3OKcQb

The letters show that some British do not like their system. A couple of letters complain that the system is inundated by foreigners who take advantage of the fact that the care is free. But most of the letter-writers defend the UK system. As one writer points out, they have two systems, one that is free to the public with no frills and one that is private and expensive with the best everything. If you are really sick, you get good care in the UK. Here, if you are on Medicare, the VA, really rich or have a really good employer-paid insurance plan, you get good care.

[ejpoeta]

18. i like the one that says the politicians aren't being treated for their psychiatric problems....

LOL! so true. too bad my fellow US folks don't bother to talk to people from canada and the UK and other countries with universal healthcare and find out from THEM.... and i don't mean the cherry picked ones the reform opponents put out there.... but REAL folks from these countries... most wouldn't trade with us for anything.

[Prophet 451]

94. And that's from The Daily Mail

Explanation for Americans: Newspapers here usually (with a couple of exceptions) have a political slant running through their entire publication. The Independent (my daily of choice) is centre-left (by British standards, radical left revolutionary by American ones). By British standards, The Mail is on the far-right fringe (by American standards, they're a normal Republican publication).

[Fedja]

120. Giggles

Over here in Slovenia, the furthest right wing party is equivalent to the Democratic party, with everyone else scaling into the left from there.

A few years ago, a politician from the furthest right wing party served as Minister of Health. He suggested that women may need to contribute financially toward their abortions in some cases. He was tared and feathered by his own party and asked to resign. When he failed to resign in a few days, he was literally kicked out of office and forgotten overnight.

[Prophet 451]

128. We're in a weird position right now

Of the three major parties, Labour took a hard swing to the right under Blair, the Tories tried to compete by going further to the right and my beloved LibDems are now alone on the mid-left. Now the Tories are campaigning for the next election by pretending they're kinder and gentler than Thatcher despite promoting the exact same policies. It's all very odd.

[Fedja]

119. Complaining is a national sport in the UK

When have you ever, and I mean ever, heard a British person comment on a topic with nothing but positive feedback? It simply doesn't happen.

Now, before you jump on me for the (minimally exaggerated) stereotyping, here's why this is a good thing. You'll also never hear the British say they're number one. They realize there's something bad in everything that's good and vice versa, which is the first requirement of improving the system you live in. If you're the best at everything, there's no need to improve.

Bottom line, the British NHS healthcare system is just one of some 18 different nationalized healthcare systems in use in Europe. Some 18 systems which vary slightly in their application, all of which work. Not only do they all work, they also all go MUCH further in socializing healthcare than the currently discussed proposals in the US.

[Prophet 451]

127. I'll affirm this

Everyone gets the wrong idea about the NHS because we bitch about it so much but we bitch about everything. We're a dour people and whinging is our national passtime. I've lived here all my life and the only unreserved praise I've ever heard is always for someone who just died.

[JDPriestly]

135. I lived in four European countries myself (due to my husband's work as an

English teacher) and found all the health care systems to work wonderfully well. So I agree with you on that.

[ejpoeta]

16. glad he's not standing by and letting them lie like that.... i didn't even know he was from

the UK.... until I found out on here after the article. I am glad he's being vocal. and he's probably right... had he been here in the US.... in our system.... he probably would not be here now.

[KakistocracyHater]

108. Christopher Reeve was abandoned by his insurance co. & was raising

money for himself & commented that he was also helping others who were in the same position, just not famous. His story is tragic yet he did speak out & I remember, I was horrified.

[Cha]

17. The US republicons are so gawddamn dumb..

they bring it international with lies that can be easily refuted by Stephen Hawking who is getting the Medal of Freedom Award from President Obama..today,in fact, along with Harvey Milk, Desmond Tutu, Edward Kennedy, etc, etc..

http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/world/stephen-hawking-sen-kennedy-among-16-recipients-of-presidential-medal-of-freedom_100225406.html

[BlancheSplanchnik]

76. oh cool!

bit off topic, but it feels GREAT to see the Medal of Freedom being given to people who really deserve it! (unlike the reflexive retching I experienced every time the reich wing propaganda mills trumpeted commander codpiece's picks.) :puke:

[No Elephants]

123. I can't imagine the kind of recipient to whom you are referring.

See also: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A63623-2004Dec14.html

Great see the diversity at yesterday's ceremony, too. People (including women) of various backgrounds. God Bless America.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

134. *snortle*

ah thanks....

I ate something that upset my tum-tum a little, but this worked better than ipecac!

:evilgrin:

[democrank]

19. Steven Hawking has more value in his little finger

than the combined offerings of the entire cesspool of rightwing politicians and their media enablers. The idiots highlighted in Investor`s Business Daily should sit down, shut up and for one solid day research Hawking`s courage and contributions. While they`re at it, they could pen a letter of apology.

Bless Steven Hawking for all he is and all he has contributed to our world.

[NashVegas]

20. Investors' Business Daily Backtracks - With Yet Another Lie

Editor's Note: This version corrects the original editorial which implied that physicist Stephen Hawking, a professor at the University of Cambridge, did not live in the UK.

I thought the original editorial stated that Hawking would get offed by NHS. Oh, wait - it did.

[Prophet 451]

95. And it ignores the other major error

The implcation that Prof Hawking would not survive under the NHS is ignored now that he's pointed out that he's survived very well for about 45 years because of the NHS.

[oldironside]

21. It's ironic...

... that one of the major works that underpinned the creation of the welfare state was Orwell's Road To Wigan Pier. Yes, the NHS is Orwellian - it conforms to every good left wing value he held so dear and he would be as proud of it as any of us if he were alive today.

[Better Believe It]

23. K & R Thanks for the find

[florida08]

24. thanks for posting

I guess Stephen likes his death panels just fine since he's still alive.

[abq e streeter]

37. Damn, beat me by a half hour--was just wondering how he evaded the death panels

[florida08]

42. LoL

[Oldtimeralso]

67. He Out Ran Them

With his electric wheelchair provided by the NHS.:rofl:

[Posteritatis]

59. Even the death panels are incompetent under Socialized Healthcare(tm)!

They find a guy given six months to live and forty years later they still haven't finished him off! That's government efficiency for you! :P

[jmowreader]

60. It's not quite like that

They give Professor Hawking six months to live. He doesn't pay his copays on his meds, so they give him another six months.

[florida08]

61. oh lordy

LoL..sounds like something Dick Morris would say :hi:

[PVnRT]

25. Fucking PWNED

This is just too beautiful for words, even if it is from the Daily Fail.

[mnhtnbb]

27. Good on Stephen Hawking for putting IBD in its place: I hoped he'd make a statement.

[tocqueville]

28. Stephen has demonstrated the existence of the private insurances blackhole nt

[Better Believe It]

29. This should go on the DU Front Page

[wundermaus]

30. Genius schools village idiots...

Thank you, Mr. Stephen Hawking.

[go west young man]

31. A big kick and bump to get this to the greatest page.

[Kingofalldems]

32. Blue Dog repubs will not like this one

[tocqueville]

39. it's beyond their event horizon.... nt

[Eric J in MN]

34. The US should switch to the British system. NT

NT

[mwooldri]

63. At least the principles behind the UK system should be applied.

which is simply this: healthcare that is free at the point of delivery, paid for through a national insurance scheme which is income relative. The UK gets savings in scale since they pretty much own all the hospitals, clinics, etc - though the doctors generally are "independent contractors". The NHS is the worlds' fifth largest employer... so you get savings in scale there. And yes, there are unions too.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

35. Heh. That's the hospital that treated me...

...when I had a rapidly spreading infection in my foot. My only complaint was the goddamn students trying to find my vein to insert the IV. (It's a teaching hospital :-) )

[Prophet 451]

96. Gotta train 'em somewhere n/t

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

130. Correction: gotta train 'em on someone.

I didn't really mind, though. Just had bruises all over my arm for the next week :-)

[Prophet 451]

132. Sorry, yeah

They train on corpses and models most of the time but eventually, you gotta turn them loose on the live ones :)

[tjwash]

36. What pisses me off, is that it doesn't matter what he says.

What's truly fucked up in this country, is that these loudmouthed, bussed in, conserva-nazi, assholes, just plain don't give a shit what anyone else says.

No amount of enthusiastic endorsements from actual citizens of countries benefiting from a proven, working, nationalized-health care system, will ever convince these right-wing zealots that "socialism" (like any one of these motherfuckers could actually tell you the correct definition of that word to begin with), isn't pure evil.

Nor will it prevent the insurance companies from pouring their fortunes into these massive disinformation campaigns (OMG tehy are gonna execute teh old folks!!!11! forward tihs to everyone u know!!!11!1!), designed solely to keep these zealots whipped into their collective frenzies.

[AlbertCat]

89. just plain don't give a shit what anyone else says.

That's because their protests are as much about Health Care as the tea bagging protests were about taxes.... which is nada, nicht, nyet, not one bit. The issue is unimportant compared to the REAL problem.... which is:

a black man in the White House.

I am not playing the "race card". It is obvious by the unfocused, absurd and immovable opposition and fear being displayed. That's why these are the same people who are "Birthers" and "Socialism" is brandied about like they'd recognize it if they saw it (They don't...Medicare anyone?) A mere liberal would be bad enough (another kind of bigotry) but a BLACK liberal!!!!!!

GOD HELP US ALL!


"Bigotry straight up."

"But some of these people have real concerns" you may say. True...but not the mobs yelling. Those with real concerns about health care are not the ones disrupting the meetings.

The smart people leading these bigots by the nose are only concerned about money.... and some of them are bigots too. But their gun toting, Nazi sign waving minions are just racists.

[iverglas]

40. I'm really glad to hear this

I've often cited Hawking as an example of the wonders of universal healthcare. ;)

Diversity is important to species success.

Access to healthcare increases diversity, by enabling individuals like Hawking to survive.

Hawking may not have qualified as "the fittest" a few millennia ago, but for our species' purposes today, Hawkings are exactly what we need.

And to ensure that the species has the best chance at reaping the benefits provided by individual like Hawkings, we need universal healthcare, everywhere.

[Joey Liberal]

41. The republicans have gone wild nt

[kentauros]

43. They've been feral for a long time

:)

[Amonester]

45. And what's sad is the fact that they`ll always be.

No matter what.

Tragic.

[kentauros]

47. Feral animals don't live as long as domesticated ones.

The encouraging outlook though is that the feral RWs will get hit by the Truck of Change and the Prius of Progress and be put out of our misery :D

More may take their places, but education does work to lessen the feral populations ;)

[AlbertCat]

90. RWs will get hit by the Truck of Change and the Prius of Progress

And then they'll blithely use the new universal health care options they so vehemently opposed without a second thought. :eyes:



BTW...love Eddie Izzard. But everyone forgets (or doesn't know) that Engelbert Humperdinck was a 19th century composer, follower of Wagner who wrote the still oft performed opera "Hansel and Gretel" which has the famous "Evening prayer" in it. The pop singer stole his name....for some unknown reason.

[kentauros]

104. I didn't know that about the original Engelbert Humperdinck

but would guess Prof. Peter Schickele does. Ever heard or seen Hansel and Gretel and Ted and Alice by P.D.Q. Bach? :D

"I tell you, it takes a lot less time to perform the opera than tell you the plot."


Yeah Gerry Dorsey should have gone with Slut Bunwalla :P

[JHB]

48. "Feral" may not be the word, but "barkers" fits nicely.

:toast:

[kentauros]

52. Although "projectile vomiting" might fit, too

[Crunchy Frog]

44. I guess this is the definition of pwnd.

[oldironside]

46. The Mail is a fascist rag.

Could I ask my fellow DUers to refrain from posting links to the Daily Mail and Mail on Sunday in future? This is a small minded, right wing propaganda pamphlet specifically aimed at people who have had an empathy bypass. It's fully of lies about asylum seekers, insults about bloody foreigners and endless celebrity bullshit. The last time it supported a progressive politician was in the mid 1930s. Maybe I should google their friend Herr Hitler to find out what happened to him.

If you must post from a British newspaper please choose The Guardian or The Independent. If there are too many long words in either of those try the Daily Mirror. But for Christ's sake not The Sun or The Express.

[Mark Baker]

75. Quoting a right wing rag may be a good thing here

It shows that almost everyone in Britain, even Mail readers, is strongly in favour of the NHS.

If it had been the Graun people could dismiss it as a load of loony lefties.

[oldironside]

79. that's a fair point...

... in this context, but doesn't alter the fact that there is far too much Daily Mail on this site. I would also direct you to the comments on this article posted by Mail readers themselves. They do not make pleasant reading.

[No Elephants]

122. "Too many long words?" Could your fellow DUers ask you to refrain from insulting them?

.

[Hugin]

49. Way to go Stephen Hawking!

:wow:

:D

[rocktivity]

50. Hawking IS British!!!!

How does such a level of ignorance get into an alleged piece of national media? No wonder Jon Stewart is the most trusted newsman in America!

Investor's Business Daily: Your retraction is due...

:rofl:
rocktivity

[Orsino]

51. Hawking is freer to speak than are most of our politicians...

...and makes the simple, relevant points we should be hearing about single-payer.

[kevsters]

53. Take that Glenn Beck!!!

This is the video of Glenn Beck's show from last night (8-11-09) condensed into 10 minutes.

I have never seen so many health care scare tactics and talk about eugenics in such a short period of time.

You have to watch.

http://progressnotcongress.org/?p=2505

[DollyM]

69. Glen Beck is a Rush Limbaugh wanna be . . .

Way back when, I used to listen to Beck, sometimes he made some good points. But it seems like he is actually trying to be an ass like Limbaugh and O'Reilly with his non sensical ramblings on health care. I just wonder if he feels this is his big moment to rise up in the ranks and has taken a page from the Limbaugh/O'Reilly play book and decided to give up all good sense in favor of making a name for himself. In other words, he want to be an S.O.B. because that is where the money and fame is.

[BolivarianHero]

55. Funny how the smartest people in the world don't rant about "evul sociaelist big guvurnmint"...

Do the likes of Einstein, Chomsky, and Hawking know something that Tom DeLay, Sarah Palin, and their limbaught followers don't?

[kentauros]

56. Yes.

It's called "higher education" :P

[Libertas1776]

57. You just got served

by motherfucking Stephen Hawking bitches!

[pattmarty]

58. When in the fuck are some of the more reasonable "pundits" going.........

...........to start calling all this crap exactly what it is, LIES!!!! I probably have heard only 5 or 6 times when someone actually called it a "lie", which is what 90% of this shit is that is being thrown about.

[tclambert]

62. The Republicans and the health insurance industry won't listen because Stephen Hawking is a cyborg

who wasn't even "born" in America.

[samsingh]

65. no surprise that another repug talking point is a complete lie

why can't repugs stop lieing?

[Jack Rabbit]

70. Beeeee-autiful!!

Now, will that worthless right wing rag print a retraction?

Live long, Professor.

[Zorra]

71. His IQ is like 160. Who ya gonna believe? Stupid, ignorant, illiterate, lying republicans,

or Professor Hawking?

I'll take my chances with the smart guy.

[irislake]

72. Boy are those "for profit" vultures ever desperate

as well as being utterly immoral! What a spectacle. God I hope the insurance companies lose!

[jakeXT]

74. Isn't the debate about NICE?

The National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence or NICE is a special health authority of the National Health Service (NHS) in England and Wales. <1> It was set up as the National Institute for Clinical Excellence in 1999, and on 1 April 2005 joined with the Health Development Agency to become the new National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (still abbreviated as NICE).<2><3>

NICE publishes clinical appraisals of whether particular treatments should be considered worthwhile by the NHS. These appraisals are based primarily on evaluations of efficacy and cost-effectiveness in various cirmcumstances.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Institute_for_Health_and_Clinical_Excellence

[BlancheSplanchnik]

77. K,R and bookmarked --and Love to Stephen Hawking.

:loveya:

[sasquatch]

80. Me too

[BlancheSplanchnik]

82. ...

:)

makes me glad to be a member of the same species. I'm really not a deep science-head, but I just love him. There's a goodness about him, along with his amazing mind....

He's one of the treasures of humanity.

[AlbertCat]

93. Y'all should catch the film "A Brief History of Time"

It's not new.... and some new ideas on the origins of the Universe have come up since it was made, but it's also about Hawkins' life and is very entertaining. Check it out.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103882/


It was of course a book 1st. short, easy to read and fun.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Brief_History_of_Time

[PATRICK]

83. Your insurance premium(and any other nickel not nailed down)

goes partly to pay for propaganda to deny health care, deny access to government plans, insure that whatever the remaining coverage is it is as expensive and limited as possible. This is besides those nifty corporate jets, mere baubles on the necklace of doom people that Americans wear.

Whatever our little squeaks are, outside the box of MSM and corporate corrupt institutions you can rest assured enough is gleaned from your wages, taxes, premiums and out of pocket medical expenses to pay for the means to shout down logic, compassion, law and order.

Whenever I talk about this phony "debate" I mention that your own money is financing this and the goons are hired with your money to browbeat your supposed representatives with pseudo issue tactics amplified by media corporate self interest in making lies look more real than the obvious exit to a burning building.

[myrna minx]

84. K&R n/t

[Douglas Carpenter]

85. KICK AND RECOMMEND!!!

[RetiredTrotskyite]

86. This Country Is Fucked UP!

My spouse and I are considering moving to Canada. Whilst there getting married we mentioned emigrating there. The person said that the first thing you are given once you have your visa is a national health card.

Over here, my spouse got her foot cut in a Walmart (of course their insurance refuses to pay) and the hospital wants $1400.00 for some nurse to look at it, take an x-ray (unnecessary since glass will not show up in x-ray unless it has lead or mercury). Of course, we were told to go to a podiatrist, which we cannot afford. In Canada the problem would have been dealt with and us not socked with a ridiculous hospital bill.

Whatever the faults of the NHS, at least you get care if you need it!

All these people squawking about HRC probably have good insurance or they have Medicare/Medicaid. Yeah, guess what you rightwing idiots? Medicaid/Medicare IS socialised medicine! The level of ignorance amongst the American public is appalling!

[and-justice-for-all]

87. He should add..."Now go fuck yourself." nt

[WoodyD]

88. ZOMG! You can't believe this so-called "professor"

Hawking! Where's his birth certificate? He wasn't even born in the US!

And lucky for him, too. And for the world in general.

And he played himself on Star Trek: TNG. Sending you some love, Professor Hawking, and thanks for pwning that idiot.

ETA the YouTube link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5O31qRH3O6c

[BrklynLiberal]

98. LOL.....

:thumbsup:

[Prophet 451]

91. Thank you, Professor

And let's note that Prof Hawking is not especially rich either. He's better off than most university lecturers due to his numerous TV appearences and popular science books but he's by no means ultra-wealthy.

One of the most brilliant minds in history (and the inspiration for nerdcore hip-hop) and he believes in socialised medicine. Any chance the Freeptards will shut up now?

[BrklynLiberal]

97. K&R. Glad to hear that Prof. Hawking is giving UK Health Care credit it deserves.

[fascisthunter]

100. and what a loss that would have been if he were in America while sick

If America keeps going in the fascist direction we will lose all our brilliant people.

[Dead_Parrot]

101. Shit, I just recc'd a Daily Mail article

We live in strange and disturbing times....

[JayMusgrove]

102. Unfortunately the people who believe the nonsense about healthcare in the UK

probably never heard of Hawking.

They are just too stupid to know facts about ANY thing.

[orpupilofnature57]

103. Trickie Dick and Kaiser Permenete also against NHS.

[Best_man23]

105. WORD from MC Hawking

Way to go, Professor.

[ozone_man]

106. But is the universe expanding or contracting?

Universal, single payer health care is the obvious solution to our health care mess. And clearly it's being obfuscated by the for profit insurance companies. I wish we could instead talk about more imaginative things like... the universe expansion, string theory/M-theory... existence of extraterrestrial life... or more earthly sustainable economics and ecology.

Thank you Stephen.

[ScottLand]

107. American politicians don't seem to know

any more about British healthcare than they do about American health care!

[lonestarnot]

110. Congratulations Stephen! You are one amazing man who gives credit where credit is due!

:applause: M of Freedom! woot :bounce:

[sudopod]

111. Physicist to Republicans

[Bluenorthwest]

112. Hawking as usual, makes excellent points

I have a dear friend who was born with major disabilities. Thankfully she was born in the UK, where she got endless vital care, without cost to her family or later to her. What would have been staggeringly expensive here, was simply hers from birth, as her right.

[Union Yes]

113. The brilliance of humanity emerges once people cast down religion.

Hawking is an Atheist and one of the brightest minds to ever grace planet earth.

[marshall]

114. Rich or poor, everyone treated alike, pays the same, gets the same treatment

Who could argue with that?

[burrowowl]

116. K&R

How can Hawking's comment get printed in The Investor's Business Daily?
They aren't going to print a retraction are they?

[GivePeaceAchance]

117. Yep, exactly in any system there are quibble but universal care saves millions of lives in most...

industrial nations every year. The added bonus it also saves families falling into bankruptcy and business going into collapse. The public option is the first step and we've got to take it robustly.

[Learning Nomad]

118. FWLIW, IBD's response

snip:

....

"We accept this testimony and good fortune. We will note, however, that in talking about his disability on his own Web site, Hawking makes no mention of NHS and instead says that since 1985, when he had a tracheotomy, he has had "24-hour nursing care ... made possible by several foundations."

Many other Britons may not be as fortunate, and we wonder how they might fare under similar circumstances in their later years. For example, many British women — whose breast cancer mortality rate is nearly twice that of American women — have been denied care in relative obscurity.

We suspect the concern in the U.K. (and the U.S.) over our editorial is similar to a diversionary tactic used here in the Colonies. When you don't want to talk about some of the realities of government-run medical care, you change the subject. You may call elderly town hall protestors a coached mob."

[No Elephants]

124. I would guess most Americans with ALS do not survive thatt long.

I had a relative with ALS. He was a doctor, as were his two sons and his nephew. While he and his own wife lived comfortably, but modestly, he had supported his two sons and his nephew (along with wives and kids--six in his nephew's case) through college, medical school, internship and years of residency, stinting on nothing for them.

In his will, Doc had set up a scholarship to go each year to a graduate of his public high school who was on his or her way to pre-med. After Doc could not longer speak, he sobbed as he had to communicate to his lawyer to reduce the scholarship fund bequest drastically to pay for his medical expenses. Who knows what the profession may have lost as a result of that? At least, though, Doc did not have to lose his home and could provide in his will for his elderly wife, who had not worked outside the home since they had married, about forty years earlier.

Hawking looks as though he manages a lot better than my family member did; and Hawking has certainly lived a lot longer.

[mackerel]

125. I just wanted to bump this...I see twitter has finally been put

to good and effective use by those of us from my generation!