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PHIMG Donating Member (814 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:06 AM
Original message
Health care activists disrupt Senate Finance Committee hearing
Source: Politico

Health care activists disrupted a Senate Finance Committee hearing Tuesday, standing up one after the other as Chairman Max Baucus (D-Mont.) tried to restore order.

As soon as police escorted one protester out of the room, another would stand up, criticizing the committee for convening a panel of 15 experts and excluding witnesses who support creating a Medicare system for all Americans. About eight were led out of the hearing.

...

The mini-protest was organized by Healthcare Now, Physicians for a National Health Program and Single Payer Action, all of whom support a single-payer, government-run health care system.

Single-payer needs to be on the table, one of the protesters yelled. This is political theater.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0509/22114.html



Bought-off politicians have done everything possible to keep single payer from being discussed. Why? Because it would finally fix health care for everyone -- comprehensive coverage for every American from cradle to grave with no out of pocket expenses. It can do this because by eliminating the private insurer middlemen, and thier waste it would save up to $300 billion per year.

Americans support single-payer. Physicians support single payer.

It's time for Americans to unite around the real PROGRESSIVE healthcare reform and DEMAND IT from D.C.

Single Payer in 2009. YES WE CAN!
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:12 AM
Response to Original message
1. At the very least, the time needed to deal with protestors could have been used
Edited on Tue May-05-09 11:12 AM by Bolo Boffin
to discuss single-payer. Good on them!

Why is single-payer only an option in the private sector? Walmart gets to act as a single-payer to drive down prices -- why can't we?
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mikelgb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
2. We need more police, Baucus said.
My kind of Dem.

:sarcasm:
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Lugnut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. I disagree.
We need more real Democrats in Congress.
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
56. Lol.
Well played.
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geckosfeet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #4
63. I disagree -
Edited on Tue May-05-09 04:52 PM by geckosfeet
- sort of.

Yes we need more real democrats - real democrats who are not afraid of the storm troopers who are ordered to arrest you for speaking out at congressional hearings.

This is disgraceful.

Citizens, appearing at a congressional forum being ARRESTED FOR EXERCISING THEIR RIGHTS OF FREE SPEECH AND REPRESENTATION!

It's like citizens have ONLY a right to vote and the tortuous venues for free speech that congress allows them.

WHY can't citizens speak out at congressional hearing? Granted - they are a grassroots political action group, but they have just as much right to access as the insurance companies and 'panel of experts' who probably paid big $$$'s to get in.

Buying access is called bribery whether it's one on one or a whole committee.

on edit: added bit about 'sort of' and free speech and representation.
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #63
78. Back in the days of democracy some of those citizens would have been
asked to testify. Now we have the so called experts lobby their way to more money.
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bjobotts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #2
77. He meant "Get rid of the citizens. They don't know their place...kneeling before us"
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bjobotts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #77
79. There is no health care reform without a public option. Ins comp will...
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bjobotts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #79
80. will spend millions on lobbyists and the MSM to prevent it.They know it would be successful
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 08:20 AM
Response to Reply #77
120. And all the little lobbyists laughed and mocked
As those silly protesters were dragged from the room.

"Who are these so-called citizens? They must be crazy people to stand up and defy us."

WE ARE THE GOVERNMENT and WE know what's best for you (which is more money for us, and nothing for you).
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
95. Only if their truncheons are aimed at your head, Baucus.
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Froward69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
3. Baucus said
I want you to know I care deeply about your views, Baucus said.

Well asshole if you did then Single payer would be discussed. Brought to the table. At least dismissed with discussion.

Bacus you are in the pharmaceutical and insurance pockets.
and I call you out. You cannot bullshit a bullshitter... fuck stick!!!

pharmaceutical and insurance creampuff!
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #3
66. We need the President to start caring deeply abt Single Payer Universal Health Care
As well.

And to get Rahm Emmanuel's bought out brother out of the loop.

Single Payer Universal Health Care NOW!
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Dragonfli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #66
71. Agreed. The leadership would be most helpful right now.
He used to know that. Looking the other way as congress is allowed to be purchased is most disappointing.
The issue is really a simple one and the people want a solution that works for the people rather than one to make insurers rich.

Who will stand up to the lobby bought congress people if not our president?
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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #71
129. It is obvious Pres. Obama is not leading toward single-payer. I would expect
at least he would make a public statement saying these hearings are a democratic process and ALL players need to be heard. I am waiting.
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Beth in VT Donating Member (224 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:33 PM
Response to Reply #66
96. He's right in there with them, he just has a smoother demeanor than Max.
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #96
102. Are you old enough to remember that old song?
Edited on Tue May-05-09 11:27 PM by truedelphi
Smiling faces, by the Temptations.

That has become my theme song for this Administration

-- Let me tell ya.
Smiling faces, smiling faces sometimes,
They don't tell the truth.
Smiling faces, smiling faces, tell lies,
And I got proof.

<snip>Temptations:] Yo'r enemy
Won't do you no harm, 'cause you'll know where he's
Coming from,
Don't let the handshake and
that Smile fool ya,
Take my advice I'm only try' to school ya.



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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #66
103. We need Obama on-board and leading the parade for single payer.
This is the plan that America both deeply needs and wants.
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pberq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
5. Kick and nominated
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
6. List of witnesses...
http://finance.senate.gov/sitepages/hearing050509.html

Witness Statements:

Stuart M. Butler, Ph.D., Vice President, Domestic and Economic Policy Studies, The Heritage Foundation, Washington, DC

John Castellani, President, Business Roundtable, Washington, DC

Gary Claxton, Vice President and Director of the Health Care Marketplace Project, Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation, Washington, DC

Donald A. Danner, President and CEO, National Federation of Independent Business, Washington, DC

Jennie Chin Hansen, R.N., M.S., F.A.A.N., President, AARP, Washington, DC

Karen Ignagni, President and CEO, Americas Health Insurance Plan, Washington, DC

R. Bruce Josten, Executive Vice President, Government Affairs, U.S. Chamber of Commerce, Washington, DC

Len Nichols, Ph.D, Director, Health Policy Program, New America Foundation, Washington, DC

Ron Pollack, J.D., Executive Director, Families USA, Washington, DC

Sandy Praeger, Chair of the Health Insurance and Managed Care Committee, National Association of Insurance Commissioners, Washington, DC

Sara Rosenbaum, J.D., Chair of the Department of Health Policy, George Washington School of Public Health and Health Services, Washington, DC

Diane Rowland, Sc.D., Executive Vice President, Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation, Washington, DC

Raymond C. Scheppach, Ph.D., Executive Director, National Governors Association, Washington, DC

Scott Serota, President and Chief Executive Officer, Blue Cross and Blue Shield Association, Washington, DC

Andy Stern, President, Service Employees International Union, Washington, DC





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droidamus2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. If I didn't know better
I would say this looks like a list of people that would have been called if the Republicans were still in charge. If some of these old line Democrats want to get stuck in the past just like the Republicans I say we do the same thing we did to the Republicans and that is vote them out of office (preferably in the primaries).
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. With the exception of the union guy, yes
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destes Donating Member (246 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 04:54 AM
Response to Reply #19
107. If there is a truly free discussion .........
........it will come out that unions and the health insurance industry are joined in a convoluted competition for relevance.

Unions fathered the health insurance industry and the delivery room was contract negotiations. Now it has outgrown parental discipline.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 06:35 AM
Response to Reply #107
110. I disagree
Unions take care of their members. Health insurance is a necessity of life. Without unions, many employers would not provide it. I am thankful my union sits at the negotiating table with my employer when it is time to sign a new contract with our health insurance company.
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druidity33 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #110
111. Here! Here! (or is it 'Hear! Hear!'?)
If there is a single payer advocate on that witness panel, it would certainly be Stern. Unions understand we'd all be better off without the Health Insurance companies.

:shrug:

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destes Donating Member (246 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #111
121. "Unions understand we'd all be better off without................
...............the Health Insurance companies. "

To be clear. I am 100% about collective bargaining, unions and single payer, universal health care. But can anyone cite a major union leader claim, publicly, to be in favor of a single payer system acknowledging that it would mean the end of the health insurance industry? I'm all ears on this.

I'm not saying they're friends but they HAVE met at the table a lot over the years. You may recall union negotiations wherein salary increases were off the table but increases in health benefits were not. There were even years when compensation for premium increases were the ONLY thing on the table. Where both sides simply caved to the insurance companies. The health insurance industry played the union against the employer and beat them both.

Surely at some point union leaders could see that the insurance industry was using the threat of higher health care costs(costs they have substantial control over)to set aside real wage, working conditions, employee profit sharing and other issues which would have benefited both the employees and, ultimately, the employers. Were they impotent or too lazy and too comfortable to shine a light that might have rectified the situation? Some unions overtly jumped in bed with the insurance companies by rolling their group/union membership into not-so-autonomous health care plans administered and underwritten by "health care insurance specialists."

I don't think employers have been proactive on this issue either. They're, for the most part, stuck in a reactionary anti-union rut. Spending way too much energy on union prevention while paying off the health care goons as if they were helpless to do anything about it.

If employers had drawn a line in the sand and said "no more health care benefits", effectively putting wages and working conditions back on the table and raising real wages across the board, who would have screamed the loudest, unions or the health insurance industry? Just asking.
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druidity33 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 08:50 AM
Response to Reply #121
122. my wife was a Union President
Her membership was about 3,000 workers. All of the people i met that she worked with were fully aware of the differences between health 'care' and health 'insurance'. They were of course forced to work within the system to get the best results they could for their members... health benefits included. But i don't think that limits their ability to recognize that it would be better if we didn't have an insurance based health care system.

:shrug:

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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #19
136. Not the "Union" guy either
the fucking SEIU has been playing cozy with Hospital corporations to serve as a "company union" to keep the CNA/NNOC, the REAL nurse's union, which is 100% behind single-payer, OUT of the hospitals.

So, no there are NO representatives of the people on that list.

AND WHO THE FUCK LISTENS TO THE FUCKING HERITAGE FOUNDATION ANY MORE.

:wtf: DID WE VOTE FOR ANYWAY?
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #12
26. Agree, they are too afraid of even letting SP representatives
speak.



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newfie11 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #12
112. You got that right!!
Blue Cross, Kaiser, etc.Unbelievable!
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. What the hell kind of a clown show is this? Bullshit, all bullshit. Why can't
we get single payer like civilized countries do?????
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mvd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. Two words: insurance lobby
But we have the power to stand up to them now - I can't believe that once again, there were no single payer advocates there. I say good for the protestors - their words can't hurt anyone.
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Andy823 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. You got that right.
Insurance lobbyists are pumping billions into the pockets of democrats now that they are in charge, just like they did with the republicans, and those in congress that want to line their pockets instead of working to help the people, are taking that money had over fist! We need to get rid of the "good old boys" club no matter what party they belong to. This is the best chance we have had in ages to do what is right for the people of this country instead of what works for the big corporations that have been running things for way to long! We need to get the message out that if they don't do something for the people, then they will be voted out of office! Problems is to many voters will stick with the incumbent instead of voting for someone else in the primaries. Also it's a lot like with Spector and the republicans, if he didn't vote the way the party wanted him to, they were going to give all the money come primary time to another guy who "would" vote the way they wanted, same thin in the democratic party, vote the way the leadership wants, or forget getting re-elected because they will back someone who will vote their way! It needs to stop, but I think the only way is to get rid of the leadership, and that is not an easy thing to do!
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mvd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #24
46. Get people who want real health care change in, and..
then the leadership should change. Getting a viable public option in is the least that can be done. Single payer is still the goal.
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #20
45. but we bailed out one of the worst - AIG - why not let them die?
why did we "save" AIG who won't "save" us?
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droidamus2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #18
49. Framing
Right now the framing for this is 'health insurance reform' when it really should be 'health care reform'. Until we can get them to acknowledge that one solution (I believe the best solution) for 'health care' reform is cutting the insurance companies out of it altogether and going single payer then we have no chance. So the thing is, I get real tired of having to play word games but..., when we talk about this we must always emphasize 'health care' not 'health insurance'. In the end what 'added value' does the insurance industry give us that 'single payer' wouldn't. The only people besides the insurance companies and their lackeys in the Congress I see arguing against single payer are those that seem to think they have an advantage under the current system i.e. they can buy and get better care than anybody else.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #6
22. Talk about inviting the foxes into the hen house and shutting the door
before those who protect the hens can get in. This is disgusting.
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Triana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #6
23. ALL Insurance companies and their allies and nothing else
Where is OUR seat at the table?

'Swot I thought: NONEXISTENT

We weren't even allowed in the ROOM.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #6
91. Right . . . all the corporates --- !!!
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #6
100. Only one nurse?
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #6
124. The Heritage Foundation . . . ??? A right wing neo-con think tank . . .????
I can see they're always interested in control of the public -- but what in the
hell would be the excuse for having these people atthe table????

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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:01 AM
Response to Reply #6
128. and if you go to the Link--each has a STATEMENT FOR THE RECORD (clickable)
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #6
135. not ONE fucking voice from the people
Business as usual!!!

2009 - Same old SHIT, Different Container... :grr: :grr:
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
7. List of Committee members to call or write and ask why
no witnesses of SP were invited.

http://finance.senate.gov/sitepages/committee.htm

http://senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

Democrats

MAX BAUCUS, MT
JOHN D. ROCKEFELLER IV, WV
KENT CONRAD, ND
JEFF BINGAMAN, NM
JOHN F. KERRY, MA
BLANCHE L. LINCOLN, AR
RON WYDEN, OR
CHARLES E. SCHUMER, NY
DEBBIE STABENOW, MI
MARIA CANTWELL, WA
BILL NELSON, FL
ROBERT MENENDEZ, NJ
THOMAS CARPER, DE

Republicans

CHUCK GRASSLEY, IA
ORRIN G. HATCH, UT
OLYMPIA J. SNOWE, ME
JON KYL, AZ
JIM BUNNING, KY
MIKE CRAPO, ID
PAT ROBERTS, KS
JOHN ENSIGN, NV
MIKE ENZI, WY
JOHN CORNYN, TX





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dmosh42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Yep, all whores for pharma & insurance rackets! n/t
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mvd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. Even..
John Kerry? I thought he was good on this issue.
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #17
59. No, he was always for "insurance reform," not "health reform"
He hasn't changed, just your perception.
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sazemisery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #7
41. write them and ask them for no better plan than they have.
Congress has the best health plan. We just want what they already have.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #41
50. "We just want what they already have." At the very least!
Good enough for them but not for the rest of us. x( I want members of Congress to tell us why we can't have what they have, at the very least.
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Speciesamused Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:59 PM
Response to Reply #7
54. This is a great comment with links to contact your
local senators. Thank you.

Dear Senator Nelson,

As a resident of Florida for 22 years, I support a National Health Program and Single Payer Action. Most Americans and Physicians support single payer. Who knows better than the physicians? No one, it is their job. Listen, please.


Thank you for your time,




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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #7
92. Thank you --
http://finance.senate.gov/sitepages/committee.htm

Democrats ---

MAX BAUCUS, MT
JOHN D. ROCKEFELLER IV, WV
KENT CONRAD, ND
JEFF BINGAMAN, NM
JOHN F. KERRY, MA
BLANCHE L. LINCOLN, AR
RON WYDEN, OR
CHARLES E. SCHUMER, NY
DEBBIE STABENOW, MI
MARIA CANTWELL, WA
BILL NELSON, FL
ROBERT MENENDEZ, NJ
THOMAS CARPER, DE

Repugs ---

CHUCK GRASSLEY, IA
ORRIN G. HATCH, UT
OLYMPIA J. SNOWE, ME
JON KYL, AZ
JIM BUNNING, KY
MIKE CRAPO, ID
PAT ROBERTS, KS
JOHN ENSIGN, NV
MIKE ENZI, WY
JOHN CORNYN, TX

Hope everyone will get on the phones and call them out on this -- and try to move their

own senators!

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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #7
114. And FREE faxes to these dittos--here. ...
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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 07:36 AM
Response to Reply #7
115. Other than Baucus -who said OFF THE TABLE- I do not
know what the position of these committee members (if support or not). Be sure to ask the person you speak to and post.
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tabbycat31 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 09:28 AM
Response to Reply #7
126. I have a senator on that list
and I will be calling his office and writing him. I hope everyone here with senators on that list do so.
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SlingBlade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
9. Good for them. All of America should thank them
for speaking America's mind on this subject.

These phoney meetings should be disrupted in every way possible whenever these corporate whores
try to pass this off as the "Will" of the American people.

They spoke for me

Thank you K&R
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JimWis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
10. K&R
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bluestateboomer Donating Member (313 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
11. KK&RR!
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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
13. K&R -- I emailed my senators again
to let them know I support Single Payer Now !

Told my congressional rep too for good measure.

Suggested that they could point out to the poor corporations who are having some of their tax havens shut down that the government will take on the healthcare costs, like our competitors' governments do, so that should offset things somewhat.
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omega minimo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
14. The Swine flu scare is a good reminder of the need for health care for all.
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #14
104. Indeed it is.
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DesertFlower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:13 PM
Response to Original message
15. K&R
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
16. Thank you so much.
:applause:
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
21. Thanks. I wrote to my Congress critters. nt
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
25. see it works like this...
Edited on Tue May-05-09 01:50 PM by Javaman
the auto industry, the steel industry and what ever union based industry in this country can go twist in the wind, but the insurance corps, the pharma corps and the financial corps, well, they are too big to fail.

didn't someone say that about GM and Chrysler as well?

They stopped the "to big to fail" talk for the auto industry once the unions were effectively neutered.

if the insurance, pharma and financial corps were allowed to fail, the people would actually be in charge, don't you see? The J.P. Moneybags of the US would no longer have a say in how they make their money off the sweat of the worker. Can't have that now, you know, the white collars mixing with the hordes of the great unwashed, now, do we?

We have given rise to a section of society that are the children of the blue collar generation of years gone by that feel that they are now entitled to something. What that something is, I haven't the foggiest idea.
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truedelphi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #25
87. What that something is, happens to be the demise of the middle class.
Edited on Tue May-05-09 08:20 PM by truedelphi
Today was Bernanke's day of "Mission Accomplished." (These remarks in answer to your last sentence's question.)

See. We gave the banking and investment class (Actually the top one percent or less) some twelve trillion bucks. And not to worry - the stock market is now up a few hundred points and all is well.

Anyway I agree with everything you say. I no longer plan on voting for any Presidential candidates unless they are third party. Have had it with the Money Party, as I am sick unto death of hearing how I need to inform Obama or Pelosi or whoever.

They know who is buttering their bread, and now that they have my vote (Pelosi in 2006, and Obama in 2008) they could care less about me.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
27. I wonder how many Senators changed their mind due to this protest
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Towlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #27
35. I wonder how many Senators changed their minds due to this issue being brought to our attention.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #35
40. I'm sure that none of them have ever heard of single payer
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Towlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #40
57. Of course they have, but thanks to the protest and its coverage more of their constituents have too.
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #40
117. Of course...
Yeah that is a BS argument. Anyone that has even cracked a book on healthcare reform or did even the vaugest websearch knows what single payer is. Don't gimme that spinsane nonsense that somehow these protestors spoiled single payer in the eyes of congressmen that were actively trying to pretend that it did not exist as an option.

That kind of argumentation makes you look like you are either ill informed or lying.
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #27
53. I wonder how many people even know that single payer is off the table
and that even a public health insurance program option is in peril?

If even one person learns what is going on here, then that is justification enough for the HORRORS of speaking out of turn at a public meeting where you will never get a turn to speak.

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mbperrin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #53
60. Hear! Hear! You said it well. Public meetings have not been open to
public comment in ages. The whole Potemkin system in place is an illusion.

Single payer and now!
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #27
137. You don't understand
The protest wasn't aimed at changing those fossil's minds -- they meant to raise the issue with the public -- and they succeeded!

Now we need 100 protesters at EVERY committee hearing until the people are heard...
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
28. Max Baucus - opensecrets.org
Max Baucus
SENATOR (D - MT)

Committee Assignments:

* Agriculture, Nutrition and Forestry
* Environment and Public Works
* Finance, Chairman

Leadership PAC: Glacier PAC

Top 5 Contributors, 2003-2008, Campaign Cmte
Contributor Total Indivs PACs
Schering-Plough Corp $72,200 $64,200 $8,000
New York Life Insurance $52,900 $43,900 $9,000
KKR & Co $50,500 $47,000 $3,500
Goldman Sachs $48,900 $48,900 $0
DaVita Inc $48,350 $39,600 $8,750


Top 5 Industries, 2003-2008, Campaign Cmte
Industry Total Indivs PACs
Securities & Investment $838,418 $686,200 $152,218
Lawyers/Law Firms $667,754 $454,312 $213,442
Insurance $592,185 $266,885 $325,300
Health Professionals $537,141 $139,141 $398,000
Pharmaceuticals/Health Products $524,813 $206,464 $318,349

http://www.opensecrets.org/politicians/summary.php?cid=N00004643&cycle=2008
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dcsmart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. great site, i never knew about it...TY
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wolfgangmo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
30. To be clear
Our clinic strongly supports single payer.

That is 2 docs, 5 therapists, and support personnel. Plus their families. AND we all stand to lose income if it happens, so there is no financial incentive there.

Politicians reading this should note that we are a primary care clinic and that many of our colleagues,, like us, refuse to bill insurance. We have removed ourselves from the scam. Many more of my colleagues are removing themselves from the country. And there are fewer and fewer docs coming up who are choosing to enter into primary care. A huge crisis is heading your way unless you fix this problem - the problem is private insurance companies. They make our lives a living hell. Fix it or pay the price. The US medical system is already an international joke. Do something, like your jobs.
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dcsmart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:05 PM
Response to Original message
31. direct action, protests, and other "monkey wrenching"
is are only option to fight the power structures that are in place. only a coalition of citizens have enough strength to turn the tide. arm-chair revolutionaries are useless

thanks for the post

:headbang:
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riderinthestorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:07 PM
Response to Original message
32. I'm not in Washington but just emailed my Senators and Rep as well in solidarity.
Single payer in 2009. We must get this done! It's our best chance.
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Lasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
33. You're new around here.
You've got a lot more sense than many of us old timers. Thanks for this excellent contribution. Hope you stick around.

:fistbump:
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PHIMG Donating Member (814 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
34. VIDEOS of all EIGHT disruptions are here
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #34
43. Thank you! And GOOD for them for standing up for us!
K&R
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
36. Thanks for this informative post
What we are seeing now is the great Washington DC betrayal machine at its worst.

A government (and not one but two parties) owned by big business interests, controlled by lobbyists and donations.

This is what Obama campaigned against.

But my sense is that he is in the tank with this.

How sad.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #36
51. Ya think?
But my sense is that he is in the tank with this. :thumbsup:

Say one thing to get elected and then do the opposite. Nothing new.
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #51
88. In case you didn't notice -Obama never said he was for single payer.
He was not even for mandated UHC during the primary. Now he is because the insurance lobby got to him. Mandated clients = more profits.

Why does anyone think he cares about this issue or will spend one dime of political capital on it?
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 08:13 AM
Response to Reply #88
116. You are right. Obama is NOT with the people on this issue
And you are right, he never has been, at least since he began running for Pres.

The most he said was that "if we could start from scratch" he would prefer single-payer, but that now he thinks we have to stick to the established employer-provided insurance "system."

I think he has been, and remains, totally wrong about this. (And this is also why I was reluctant to support him until very late in the primary process.)

The employer-based system is responsible for the huge health costs that are contributing to the demise of the american auto industry.

It is also to blame for the fact so many WORKING Americans are unprotected, because businesses either cannot afford or do not wish to cover them.

Obama is standing in door, right next to Baucus, blocking TRUE health care reform.

I wish he would wake up and do the right thing.

But I am not optimistic.

Corporate ownership of our government goes all the way up the chain, I'm afraid.

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kaygore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
37. On the conf call with Dean last night, we were told that Kerry would
represent our interests today and read comments that we were urged to send to MoveOn to be delivered to Kerry early this morning. Did that ever happen?
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kaygore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
38. We need to call Baucus out as the whore he is and we need to take to the streets
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MasonJar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:28 PM
Response to Original message
39. I do not suppose it dawned on our elected officials to pay attention to
what the citizens were saying, especially since they represent doctors, the front line of medical health and treatment! That would be too much to expect.
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asp64064 Donating Member (47 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
42. Please Forward To U.S. Attorney General Mr. Eric H. Holder Jr.
May 4, 2009

Mr. Eric H. Holder Jr.
U.S. Attorney General
U.S. Department of Justice
950 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20530-0001

Dear Mr. Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr.,

Due to my belief in the rule of law, I requested your assistance on February 14, 2009. That request has been met with the same result as the past eight years; a lawless power that is more sinister than anything I could have ever imagined.

As a youngster during church, I sat on the lap of the former FBI Director Clearance Kelly who continues to be remembered as a very close and dear friend of my family. My family and I are convinced that if Clearance were alive today there would be enforcement of our laws and justice would prevail. My family, friends and associated are horrified by the lawless results over these past eight years, not to mention the economic devastation and loss of life caused by runaway health care costs. Regardless of my continued hardships, I personally find strength in doing the right thing and pursuing a just outcome.

After eight years of research and presenting evidence, the courts have not made one decision based on publicly known facts or the law. As a result, my research and legal representations have been twisted and misrepresented to accommodate the defendants with lawless outcomes. How does this happen?

The following link is an evidentiary conversation with Mr. Rick Sharp outlining what has happened to our Healthcare system. Mr. Sharp is a Kansas attorney employed by former Kansas Governor and newly appointed HHS director Mrs. Kathleen Sibelius.

http://www.medicalsupplychain.com/pdf%5CRex%20Sharp%20Conversion.wav

Again, I know you are extremely busy with the clean up of the previous administration but could you, would you, look into these matters and advise me as a person, a family man, a U.S. Citizen, and my Attorney General what I can do to help resolve these issues. For eight years I have desperately tried to enter the U.S. Healthcare market and provide lower healthcare cost for the citizens of this great country only to be interfered with at every juncture.

Thank you for your attention to these matters.

Sincerely, Samuel K. Lipari
http://www.medicalsupplychain.com/news.htm
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
44. hell yeh, I love the smell of a protest in the morning
and to heck with private insurance companies making profit off of health care.

We are one of a very few of developed countries where you have to pay for
private insurance to see a doctor.

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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 06:00 AM
Response to Reply #44
109. And the reason private insurance has
a seat at the table? Legal bribery.
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
47. K&R
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
48. Tear the fuggin walls down if they won't listen to us!!! n/t
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Lena inRI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 03:55 PM
Response to Original message
52. Bravissimo protesters . . .sic 'em . . .shine the light on 'em!


"U.S. Senate of Trusts"( Corporations as in Health Insurers) by Joseph Keppler of British Puck magazine circa 1880.

Top caption says: This is a Senate, of the Monopolists, by the Monopolists, for the Monopolists.
*************




"They hate the light, but they can't escape it." again by Joseph Keppler Puck Cartoon circa 1880.

Only change I'd have to suggest is the woman shining the light is NOT the puny, pathetic press we have today. . .so she's the single-payer GRASSROOTS ACTIVISTS today.

*************

My only hope is that, though these cartoons prove Congressional secret corruption/corporate privilege have always existed,

today's technology (television and the net-roots) will really be what empowers the people for the first time. . .short of street revolts!



And, President Obama, enough with the St.Patrick's luncheons. . .the Jewish seder dinners. . .and the Mexican Cinco de Mayo celebrations. Instead, how about saying you support these dedicated grassroots health care activists in your next PR moment. . .

JUST SAYIN'

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug:
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #52
55. Hear Hear! Time for a revolution OF the people BY the people and FOR the people! n/t
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dpbrown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
58. Yes, we can!

But we have to force them to accept it. Remember, FDR didn't buy into Social Security until it was forced on him.

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Delphinus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
61. Yea!!
I am very happy they got to disrupt this.

Single Payer - YES WE CAN!
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
62. Error: you have already recommended that thread
:kick:
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INdemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:51 PM
Response to Original message
64. The chance of having single payer health coverage has about the same
chance of us having $.25 a gallon gas...The insurance companies are too rich and powerful ...And yes they own the politicians so they might go through the motions but Congress will never pass real health care reform.
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 08:15 AM
Response to Reply #64
118. Only real presidential leadership could challenge this
... and that is NOT what we are getting on this issue.

Baucus was "just following orders" here, and the orders came straight from the top.
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INdemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 04:51 PM
Response to Original message
65. The chance of having single payer health coverage has about the same
chance of us having $.25 a gallon gas...The insurance companies are too rich and powerful ...And yes they own the politicians so they might go through the motions but Congress will never pass real health care reform.
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Eyerish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
67. K&R
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EndElectoral Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
68. Good post. The media just will not get behind this and it's a damn shame!
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EndElectoral Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
69. Good post. The media just will not get behind this and it's a damn shame!
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
70. We have Health care activists now?
I didn't know we had health care activists
When did we get health care activists?
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creeksneakers2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:09 PM
Response to Original message
72. The far left trying to kill off health care reform for another 20 years
What's new?

All the talk about piety and corruption is all BS. If the far left cared a bit about anybody, they'd care about the millions who might get health care but won't if the present plan is derailed. If they cared, the far left would set aside their hopeless ego trip crusade.

Obama is fighting hard just to get a government alternative included in the health care plan. He's even way ahead of reality, as big cuts in Medicare and Medicaid are likely to be considered soon. There isn't enough money for what we have now. There isn't anything like enough money for what Obama has proposed. The far left wants 10 times that.

Its also an avoidance of reality to ignore the fact that 157 million Americans get their health care from employer provided plans. Those people won't be happy giving up what they've got without proof that they'll be given something that is at least as good. Even is single payer was instantly established, it would take years to work out all the bugs. Who will get the blame?

As long as Obama is able to keep the government health care alternative in place, it will lead to single payer. Government care would have the advantage of subsidies and economies of scale. Private insurance could not compete in the long run, or if it can then it is truly the better alternative. The insurance companies know what the government alternative would lead to. That's why they are working so hard to stop it. The far left believed in a public alternative to single payer transition when John Edwards said it would happen. An effective public alternative would establish that government insurance can work. It would allow time to work out the bugs. Then the people who are now under employer provided wouldn't be so frightened to make the switch.

The Obama plan makes sense. That's why Democrats are circulating it. Its just as much self serving piety for the far left to say everybody who doesn't agree with them is corrupt as it is for the far right to say everybody who doesn't agree with them is a traitor.
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brentspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #72
75. Your check from the DLC is in the mail
:thumbsdown:
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Dragonfli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #75
82. .
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #75
84. LOL
:rofl:
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #75
99. hahaha
Good one.
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Raksha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #72
89. 66% of Americans are "the far left"?
You couldn't be more transparent if you tried.
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rhiannon55 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #72
98. Your post makes excellent sense
I was reading through this thread and getting really depressed and then I read your post and immediately felt some hope again. Thank you for giving me a more nuanced perspective and reminding me that every time I second-guess President Obama, he proves me wrong. He knows what it will take to get to SP, but like many things, it's a process.

:thumbsup:
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #72
125. Nonsense
If the far left really cared about healthcare they would go along with a massively corrupt private-public corporate welfare scheme?? I suppose it is egotistical to suggest that we actually provide healthcare for the most citizens we can.

In the very next breath you advocate the inevitability of cutting medicare and Medicaid. I dont know how you can be for healthcare reform and suggest that this would be a good move. I also dont know how throwing old people and the sick and poor to the wolves ought to be considered ahead of reality. In my mind corporate crook insurance goons that kill people by depriving them of care ought to be up for manslaughter. That seems far more ahead of reality to me.

I also dont know where the hell you get your numbers. Healthcare reform that uses existing insurance companies as a conduit will cost many times more than just a direct plan. Why? Well profits of course. Maximizing quarterly return on rate of investment you know capitalism. And given healthcares track record in profitability in the market there will be an aggravated pressure to maintaining the absurd gouging rates we have had so far?

Result? Medicare and Medicaid recipients will experience vastly decreased benefit at drastically increased cost. And you thought old people were having trouble affording their medications now? Wait and see what happens next.

As someone that works in a clinic and sees some of the wonderful insurance that 157 million Americans get I have to tell you that most people would ecstatically trade up for a nationalized healthcare program. And honestly I deal mostly with HMOs that are a damn sight better than the private insurance jackals that are trying to make as much money as possible.

Any program would take time to perfect but I suppose using that logic we should never have bothered with the polio vaccine, space travel, social security, the internet, or any legislation of any kind. Gods what a ridiculous argument that is.

Ok now after this point your argument jumps wholly and completely off the damned rails. You gave me some kind of pie-in-the-sky we will get to single payer some day nonsense when in your first paragraph you seemed to suggest nuking the only public programs that exited. This makes no damned sense.

How about sound economics? How about reasonable expectations? This castigate the left malarkey may make you popular at the insurance company rubber chicken circuit and the do-nothing DLC crowd, but gimme a break. People are suffering and dying and losing their homes and having to sit around and choose between medications and food. Never mind the hordes of people that are becoming unemployed while you fiddle about insurance company friendly options.

In short

Give. Me. A. Break.
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #72
127. Yeah, that "Far Left," they must be nuts...
Promoting a single-payer system which is what every other industrial nation in the world has already.

Much better to preserve a for-profit system that can NEVER provide universal health care at a reasonable cost.

Heck, even the worst far-right politicians in Europe support their national systems.

Because they work.
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kenfrequed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #127
130. Agreed
For profit will always need to make more money. That is the flaw in that system.
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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #72
133. Your post is sad, very sad.
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #72
138. Typical weaselmouth straw man construction from the ignorant "center"
Edited on Wed May-06-09 11:58 PM by ProudDad
There's NOTHING "far left" about single-payer health care.

Every civilized democracy in the WORLD has determined that it's the only way to handle health care.

You're the one who's in the lunatic right-wing fringe.

And if you think the corporations and Obama and Baucus and the spineless corporate owned dems are going to allow a "public option" you're smoking much stronger shit than the "far left" does...
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nikto Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:10 PM
Response to Original message
73. Democrats...
Who are really Repugnicans.


It pays.

Simple as that.






:mad: :grr:
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brentspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:14 PM
Response to Original message
74. I want you to know I care deeply about your views, Baucus said
referring to the health industry lobbyists assembled for the hearing, the article forgot to mention
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 12:29 AM
Response to Reply #74
105. and after they spent minutes LAUGHING at the SP advocates in the audience.
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Dragonfli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
76. K&R
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Kaleko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 07:03 PM
Response to Original message
81. "Americans support single-payer. Physicians support single payer."
Enough said. K & R.
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ArcticFox Donating Member (654 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 07:28 PM
Response to Original message
83. An ounce of prevention
is worth a pound of cure. This is a true statement, but is almost completely overlooked.

Preventive care provided to all would reduce emergency room visits, keep people more productive and, and would lead to even further savings to the health care system in the long term.

So, I agree with your comment that the private insurance system is full of waste. However, single-payer would lead to even more drastic cost savings.
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Dragonfli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #83
85. Self delete
Edited on Tue May-05-09 08:02 PM by Dragonfli
I thought I was responding to something else
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debbierlus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:11 PM
Response to Original message
86. Bravo to them! Now, THESE people have the right idea!
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maryf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
90. Its a sure sign how scared they are of people who speak out, and
How important they know universal healthcare is! K&R
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #90
93. Correct . . . but they also know that Democrats have no place else to go --- !!!!
The know Dems aren't going to vote for Repugs --

Democrats therefore have no leverage over those they elect -- !!!

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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
94. There will be some sort of health care reform, but I won't be everything you want.
The name of the game is compromise.
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eagertolearn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
97. If Obama doesn't make this one of his primary goals then as much as I love him
he will need to go the next term. I am a home health/hospice nurse and my husband is a doctor and we both strongly believe in the single-payer health care system. The current one is not working and people (our neighbors, our relatives people young and old) are the ones that are suffering because of our current system. We can't let the insurance companies "buy out" progress. Everyone deserves health care!
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freddie mertz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 08:17 AM
Response to Reply #97
119. Then get ready, because he WON"T, unless
"We the people" demand it.

Right now his policy is owned by the insurance companies, the for-profit healthcare lobby, and big pharma.

"We the people" aren't even on the list.
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farmboxer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-05-09 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
101. America is a plutocracy
with bought and paid for politicians. Why can't "We The People" have health care like our politicians?!
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NJCher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 04:20 AM
Response to Original message
106. Obama willing to spend 60 billion globally
But not here in the states:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090505/hl_nm/us_obama_globalhealth

snip:

WASHINGTON (Reuters) U.S. President Barack Obama on Tuesday announced a $63 billion, six-year health initiative to help people in the world's poorest countries, most of it to bolster existing programs.

"We cannot simply confront individual preventable illnesses in isolation. The world is interconnected, and that demands an integrated approach to global health," Obama said in a statement.

Obama will request the money in his budget for the 2010 fiscal year that begins on October 1. The White House has already released the main elements of that budget, but plans to offer greater details on Thursday.

The money will go toward efforts to fight AIDS, tropical diseases and other illness and to help improve maternal health. The initiative will be aimed at addressing "some of the biggest global health challenges," said Deputy Secretary of State Jack Lew.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 05:55 AM
Response to Original message
108. Recommended! nt
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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 07:31 AM
Response to Original message
113. SEND A FREE FAX TO MEMBERS OF THE COMMITEE HERE...

AND TO PELOSI--LETS GET IT ON THE TABLE.

http://www.1payer.net/about-us/whats-next.html


Send Your Free Fax
Choose from the following list to send your free fax to congress members:
Finance Committee: Let SIngle Payer In
Open The White House Comment Line
Pelosi - Put Single Payer on the Agenda
Improve and Expand Medicare
Stop Obstructing Health Care Reform
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 09:01 AM
Response to Original message
123. Reminder that calls and website e-mail might be helpful if you want Single Payer . . .!!!
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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #123
132. **SEND A FREE FAX ......


:wub:


Send a free fax to senators on the Finance Committee - tell them America needs single payer!


**YOU CAN SEND TO EACH OF THESE PERSONS***********



http://www.1payer.net/action-alerts/257-success2.html
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snowdays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 01:15 PM
Response to Original message
131. ***Here are the folks who were arrested--Single Payer Heros



Toast






http://www.1payer.net/action-alerts/260-heroes.html



Single Payer Heros

Tuesday, 05 May 2009 11:46 Clark Newhall
E-mail Print PDF

Dr. Margaret Flowers and other single payer advocates took direct action this morning and got carted off to jail. Fifteen of our allies demanded to know why single payer ws not even allowed a seat at the table yesterday during 'Mad Max" Baucus's Senate Finance Committee sham hearing on insurance-company-friendly fake 'reform." Look at the video here.

Notably, Baucus made mouth noises about the 'respect' he has for single payer advocates. Apparently , his respect does not extend to allowing our ideas to be heard in Congress. Meantime, his Senatorial colleagues were joking and laughing about the protest, paying it no attention. Yet, the clowns at the testimony table, including Karen Ignoble Ignani, were accorded the greatest respect by the clowns at the hearing table.


Margaret and those who were with you -- you are HEROES. You make us proud. Each of us can take a lesson from you and each of us must do what we feel is the most we can do. Without all of us acting together, more millions will die through the mis-managed and neglectful health insurance driven non-system.

Baucus, your hypocrisy makes me ill. Obama, you are complicit in this crap.Journalists, your silence on single payer shows where your real professional allegiance lies -- in your pockets with the big business money that lines them.

Here are the folks who were arrested this morning:

Katie Robbins
Russell Mokhiber
Kevin Zeese
Carol Paris
Margaret Flowers
Mark Dudzic
Jean Fox (?)
Adam Schneider


Last Updated ( Tuesday, 05 May 2009 12:46 ) :fistbump: :fistbump: :fistbump: :fistbump: :fistbump: :yourock: :yourock:
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-06-09 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #131
134. We need to have government reassert the right to citizen protest . . .
being arrested for pointing out how wrong the government is in not including

Single Payer shouldn't be met with such drastic reaction!

Where is the change?

Repugs could have done this--!!!



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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
139. Doctors Protest Exclusion of Single-Payer at Senate Finance Committee
Source: ProsperityAgenda.us

WASHINGTON - Doctors and other advocates of a national single-payer health system - also known as an improved Medicare for All - directly confronted senators at a Senate Finance Committee "roundtable" on health reform today.

One-by-one, eight single-payer advocates in the audience stood up during the opening comments of the hearing and asked why single-payer experts were being excluded from the proceedings. They each spoke out in turn until they were removed from the committee hearing room, one-by-one, by U.S. Capitol police....

Today's round table, the second of three, consisted of 15 witnesses with no single-payer advocates among them. By contrast, several witnesses have direct ties to the for-profit, private health insurance industry....

"It's a pretty spectacular display of raw political power," said Russell Mokhiber of Single Payer Action. "The health insurance industry demands that not one of the 15 people who testified today shall be a single-payer advocate. And the industry gets what it wants. It's time for the American people to storm the gates and demand - put single payer on the table."



Read more: http://www.prosperityagenda.us/node/67
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mbperrin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #139
140. Oh, those wacky doctors! SO dangerous to politicos that they merit
removal by police!

I somehow think none of the single payer advocates ever thought while training that this sort of thing could ever happen.

We need single payer, and we need it now! Once the leeches who scrape off at least 1/3 of all health dollars are removed, we can actually treat sick people while paying those who treat them! What a concept!
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salguine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #139
141. This is the ONLY WAY we will get any kind of health care reform:
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #141
142. or economic justice. +1
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #141
144. Coalitions need to be built to organize protests
Edited on Thu May-07-09 10:16 AM by clear eye
Our last major era of political protests took coalitions of organizations to mobilize their memberships into a unified concerted action. Is it possible that the constant surveillance of telephone, email, and online activists has inhibited this? Is essential political protest the first casualty of disabling FISA? Or are the natural constituent NGO's still too optimistic about mere political negotiating, to get together and bring their membership out to the streets.

I would encourage everyone who belongs to economic justice and/or single-payer healthcare organizations to encourage coalition-building and national protest. Younger people are more likely to be open than older, since many older leaders of organizations have spent years in turf and position wars and gotten habitually wary of other activists. "Break on through to the other side."

For the most part Americans want a wholesale redirection of public revenue to rescue it from the looters, saving life on earth through serious environmental programs, remaking our country as a world advocate for peace, and restoration of election integrity. Many groups have responded by working for little bits and pieces that fall under those general categories.

The question for the leadership of these seed groups is,"Wouldn't you be more effective as a small group, if rather than trying to tackle such an ambitious agenda as one group, even with the help of other local NGO's, you reinvented yourselves specifically as an umbrella organization whose main job would be defining a unifying set of priorities from within your main issues, and getting large organizations to sign on for mass actions demanding action on those priorities?" The coalition could be called something like United for Democracy (UFD?). It would probably help if the intiators sent a survey to a slew of NGOs and better labor unions w/ 3 - 5 possible priorities listed under each general area and asked which they see as coming first. That way groups would feel that they had input in the agenda for the first mass action. For example, under the heading "Getting our Voice Back" which could be defined as removing the de facto amendments that the Bush administration made to the constitution with their "signing statements", their corporatization of elections, and their institutionalization of domestic spying, you could list (1)a law specifiying open source code for all election machines and tabulators to be made available to qualified representatives of each candidate in real time and a prohibition against sending results to county boards over any sort of lines--a la Minnesota, (2) a memorandum of understanding that when an administration stonewalls reasonable subpoenas from Congress, that Congress is obligated by the Constitution to defend the rights of the people by acknowledging this violation of Constitutional powers and appointing a special prosecutor to investigate whether an impeachable offense is being committed, and (3)undoing some of the Patriot Act provisions that make it possible to arrest leaders of legitimate political dissension as "terrorists". The same sorts of lists could be made for the economic "Just Use of Public Revenue" (health care, mortgage rescue and reregulation of the banks, fall within this area), environmental "Saving Our Planet", and world peace "Peace in Our Time" issue areas.

Once the groups were on board, this could be started as a petition campaign including deadlines with the understanding that when Obama, following the advice of his reactionary advisors, inevitably ignored the demands except rhetorically, the coalition would progress to the weekend mass demonstration, and then, as outrage over inaction built, toward a one-day General Strike. The time is overdue for the federal government to be made to remember that this is a representative democracy, and that we, the people, can hold their feet to the fire.

While of course the interactions among the principals has to be more extensive than the survey I suggested, that was the beginning, for example, of the People's Party platform in 1971-2. While the group was a dismal failure as a political party (3rd parties have an almost unsurmontable challenge under our system), the platform did affect how the political debate was framed that year and the positions taken by Congressional Democrats on a number of issues. Just as our recent political history was derailed by the theft of the Presidential election in 2000, politics in 1972 was trying to recover from the deformation caused by the assassination of then-Presidential candidate Robert F. Kennedy in 1968. I believe that Nixon's unconstitutional behavior was seen against the backdrop of the populist goals of the People's Party platform by many politically active people, and the contrast helped fuel the call for impeachment. Of course it didn't hurt that the Fairness Doctrine was in force then and TV news was forced to air pro-impeachment opinions even if only in 90 second or less slots at the end of the program.

The bottom line for me is that I don't see real political recovery for democracy from the damaging effects of the Bush administration without such a coalition and explicit agenda. Nothing worth doing in this enormous country of ours is ever quick and easy. Some group will, eventually, get the ball rolling. How 'bout your group?
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #139
143. They must include single payer in the discussion. Or we can
have discussions where no insurance co. are allowed.
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dmosh42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #139
145. Any doubt that the "corporate oligarchy" has arrived? n/t
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eagertolearn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #139
146. if Obama doesn't take care of this and help us get single payer
then he must leave in four years. I love Obama but this is probably the most important issue on his table and if he gets bought out by the insurance companies then he does not have guts! Everyone deserves health care. It's just as important as food, water and shelter. It is a basic need. I'm a nurse and my husband a doctor. How can we help. We live in a small town but would go someplace else if needed to be part of a big protest!
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SpiralHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #139
147. Corporate media: "z-z-z-z-z-z. Move along. Nothing to see here."
Edited on Thu May-07-09 09:35 AM by SpiralHawk
"We serve the corporate borg, not the citizens or the truth."

- Corporate media
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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-07-09 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #139
148. For a healthy counrty vote SINGLE PAYER NOT-FOR-PROFIT health care
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