FARC leaders were paid millions to free hostages: Swiss radio

[maddezmom]

Source: Thomsom Financial

PARIS (Thomson Financial) - Leaders of the Colombian FARC rebel movement were paid millions of dollars to free Colombian politician Ingrid Betancourt and 14 other hostages, Swiss radio said on Friday, quoting "a reliable source".

The 15 hostages released on Wednesday by the Colombian army "were in reality ransomed for a high price, and the whole operation afterwards was a set-up," the radio's French-language channel said.

Saying the United States, which had three of its citizens among those freed, was behind the deal, it put the price of the ransom at some $20 million.

The radio said its source was "close to the events, reliable and tested many times in recent years."

The report added said the wife of one of the hostages' guards was the go-between, having been arrested by the Colombian army. She was released to return to the guerrillas, where she persuaded her husband to change sides.

Switzerland, along with France and Spain, has been mediating with the FARC on behalf of Colombian President Alvaro Uribe.



Read more: http://www.forbes.com/afxnewslimited/feeds/afx/2008/07/04/afx5184293.html

[Warren Stupidity]

1. File under: no shit.

Every fabricated detail of this 'affair' screamed 'stage show'.

[Larkspur]

3. Reminds me of the Iraq war rescue of one of our female soldiers

Can't remember her name right now, but even she testified before Congress that she was treated well by Iraqis who held her and was in no danger but the Pentagon had to turn her rescue into a movie-of-the-week propaganda film.

[Dr.Phool]

4. Yep, first thing I thought. It had Jessica Lynch written all over it.

Especially since Hugo Chavez was stealing their thunder, by trying to negotiate for their release.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

28. Also the medical students "rescued" during the invasion of Grenada in 1983

In an interview with CBC's As It Happens during the invasion, the president of the medical school said that his school was in no danger and that he had received personal assurances from the leader of the coup that the students were welcome to stay in Grenada and that if anyone bothered them, there was a certain phone number he should call.

[ohio2007]

43. Did Bishop call that # ? nt

[Lydia Leftcoast]

72. No, but that's a straw man question, since Bishop was the guy

Reagan constantly railed against and called a Communist.

Then he used Bishop's ouster as the excuse to invade Grenada.

Go to your library or onto Amazon and get Jonathan Kwitny's Endless Enemies. Its last chapter agrees with everything I heard on Canadian radio and from people who are actually familiar with the island. By the way, the late Mr. Kwitny was a reporter for the Wall Street Journal, and if he says the invasion of Grenada was bogus, then you can be sure that it was even more bogus than he lets on.

[ohio2007]

89. Why did the Cubans allow that?

They killed him because he demanded the Cubans vacate the "housing" they built next to the airport they just finished building ? That was the deal. Cuba's Angola missions had a refueling stop over and citizens of Grenada were given free housing.

The commandant was repremanded by his overlords in Cuba and was going to be relieved of duty for that moronic move. His higher ranking replacement was airborne and bringing Cuban troops to the island

As for reading your thought provoking books I can do without since ......
Well,
LOL

Some peole write history,
some people read history,


some people live history ;)

[Lydia Leftcoast]

90. Oh, so that's what they told you

:eyes:

I wonder if they also told you about the white guys in panel trucks who went around in the middle of the night painting "God Bless America!" and "Thank you, President Reagan!" all over the island, just in time to be photographed when the U.S. press was finally let in.

Were you one of the guys in the panel trucks?

[EFerrari]

112. LOL!

I remember that story but not where from -- from Overthrow?

[Lydia Leftcoast]

124. No, I heard it from a sociologist who had done research on Grenada

He went back to check up on friends as soon as possible after the invasion and saw all these graffiti all over the island, all in the same paint and handwriting. He started asking around and no one knew where the graffiti had come from. Finally, a man told him that he had gotten up to pee in the middle of the night and had seen a bunch of white men jump out of a panel truck and spray paint a building, then get back into the panel truck and drive off.

Eight years later, after the invasion of Panama, Time and Newsweek printed photos of buildings in Panama spray painted with "God Bless America" and "Thank you, President Bush."

I just did a Google image search, and I can't find examples of either one, but I know that news magazines were displaying these photos prominently after both invasions.

[MinM]

174. BTW - Kwitny was featured in "Fear and Favor in the Newsroom (1996)"

An excellent documentary about the issues in the news business (which are much worse today than a dozen years ago when this was produced) by Studs Terkel:

Fear and Favor in the Newsroom (1996)

Terkel: The Public Broadcasting System is supposed to be immune from corporate pressure, and PBS does occasionally air hard-hitting news programs. The half-hour weekly Kwitny Report, which first aired in 1988, was such a program. Produced by former Wall Street Journal reporter Jonathan Kwitny, the show frequently exposed hidden skeletons in the closets of the powerful.

Kwitny: WETA in Washington and WNET in New York both welcomed us, invited us to come produce out of their studios, and would feed us to the system which wanted to broadcast us. The trick is that in order to do that, you have to pay them for those studios. They expect you to go out and raise the money, which means getting underwriting from corporations.

Nader: They are heavily based on local business donations, national corporate donations like AT&T and IBM, and also corporate foundations. And they have clipped their wings, and they’re as much subject to self-censorship as the commercial media.

Terkel: Shows such as this one, which examined the U.S. links to Guatemala’s dictatorship, did not endear The Kwitny Report to corporate sponsors.

Kwitny : Guatemala. Thirty-five years after we intervened in that then-peaceful and democratic country, human rights groups say Guatemala runs on state-sponsored murder, torture and pillage of property from the destitute millions. And just as American business had spearheaded the overthrow of Arbenz in 1954, it was deeply involved in the new repression.

Speaker : In all, there were more than a dozen American firms where workers attempting to organize unions were assassinated. At the Coca-Cola plant, more than a dozen workers were assassinated.

Kwitny: The public-affairs shows are funded by corporations who want certain views put forward. Take a guy like John McLaughlin — bear him no animosity — but what kind of reporting credentials? He was a kind of cantankerous editor of a conservative publication, the National Review. I don’t know of a single story he broke, or a reporting award he ever won. But the head of GE loved McLaughlin to such a degree that they gave him three — not one, which is all I ever wanted; not two; but three national television shows, because he was saying the kinds of things that the number two defense contractor and major corporation would like to have said on television. And they could spend out of their pockets as much as it took to put him on.

Terkel: After its second year, in which it won the prestigious Polk Award for investigative journalism, The Kwitny Report went off the air because it could not secure corporate funding...
http://sandiego.indymedia.org/en/2002/06/1502.shtml

http://www.consortiumnews.com/archive/story39.html

http://www.freespeech.org/videodb/index.php?action=detail&video_id=9830&browse=1

[ohio2007]

190. ..and you believed him LOL

because of his distinguished status of owning a BS degree :rofl:
always with the knee jerk after the events 20/20 reviews by "experts" ...days before your socialogist med school flunkies themselves even knew a "situation" was about to happen at their backwater school .



never mind the station wagon that crashed the gate of a Georgia golf course with a message he needed to speak urgently with somebody on the premiss's by telephone.

you don't have a need to know.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

193. And I should believe you because...

:shrug:

you argue like a right-winger?

Agent Mike, is that you? :hi:

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

145. Adios, amigo

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

148. Vaya con dios

Ta ta

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

162. Now if you knew me

You'd know I can kick your ass.

[BearSquirrel2]

76. There is no way you would burn an intelligence asset for 6 people

If you were an intelligence agency that had an asset in a position to transfer high value prisoners, you would not squander it on 6 people unless they meant a tremendous deal to the government.

Just think how many FARC operations such a mole could have compromised if they stayed on the inside. In fact, such an asset could have compromised the location of a camp and did the operations WITHOUT REVEALING THAT THERE WAS A MOLE!!!! THE FACT THAT THEY CLAIMED THERE WAS A MOLE TELLS YOU IT WAS A SETUP!!!

[Lydia Leftcoast]

183. I don't watch TV news except that my VCR channel happens to be CNN

so I caught a glimpse of some footage. The film clips they were showing of the "rescue" looked more like an exchange.

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

157. OK we get it

You don't like FARC.

But I like Switzerland. You've gone too far.

[sniffa]

2. Was part of the deal to free them during McGetoffmylawn's visit?

[maddezmom]

5. that's what I'm thinking and once again the US can't tell a lie well

~snip~

On Thursday, Col. William Costello, spokesman for the U.S. Southern Command, said the command made 3,600 intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance flights, followed up on 175 intelligence leads and spent $250 million trying.


FBI spokesman Richard Kolko said the agency sent crisis negotiators and investigators on "countless trips to Bogota" since the kidnapping.

One official said a Defense Intelligence Agency cell that primarily works to track captured or missing U.S. troops has been working on the case of the civilian contractors, who had been held by the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia since their drug-surveillance plane went down in the jungle in February 2003.

Another said it was U.S. intelligence that located the hostages.

A third said the U.S. Special Operations Command helped with surveillance that positively located the hostages within the past year using satellites, aircraft and ground reconnaissance -- and had tracked them since then.

more:http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/americas/07/04/hostage.hunt.ap/index.html?section=cnn_latest

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

150. Ain't gonna get far with that attitude

at least not here in these forums.

[Name removed]

137. Deleted message

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[Zorro]

152. You gonna get a one-way ticket to Tombstone, amigo

Can't say I'll miss you.

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

163. Oh goodie

Come by sometime for milk and cookies.

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

170. Yeah sure

Come and get me, tonto.

[sniffa]

159. Could you translate that?

:shrug:

[Zorro]

165. Translation

"Yo soy muy estupido"

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

171. And I know what you are

a fucking dumbass.

[Name removed]

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[pattmarty]

6. I didn't realize Cindy McCain had that kind of money. Really though.......

if this turns out to be true, that the US either paid or was the source of this "bribe/payoff", and McSame being conveniently over there when this occurred, AND if the MSM decides to report it, he may be in some election trouble. This fucking thing "smelled funny" when I first heard about it and that McSame "just happening" to be there at the time.

[PatSeg]

73. On TV everyone was asking

"Why did McCain go to Colombia?" I personally thought he knew about the hostage release before hand and planned to be there at the same time for the publicity.

[pattmarty]

75. Yeah, I am thinking you're right. A funny thing I saw on Buzzflash....

...was why he was going, for blow? Thought that was funny, but this is a whole other thing.

[PatSeg]

134. That IS funny

One possibility I hadn't considered! :shrug:

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

146. You are a busy little fuck, aren't you?

You aren't helping your case.

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

166. Ha ha

Suuure ya do.

[THale2]

184. Thats what I was thinking

I think McCain screwed it up...he was SUPPOSE to look as if he released the hostages you know look like an even BIGGER hero..wink wink..its all to coincidental..

[phrigndumass]

7. Another hostage "FARCe" which will probably lead to Alzheimer's.

I guess we only negotiate with rebels when we think nobody is looking. K/R

[kimmylavin]

48. That's what I was thinking.

What happened to the US policy of no negotiation with terrorists?

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

143. Now now now

Threats aren't cool.

[Gold Metal Flake]

8. So, Bushco gets to catapult the propaganda before the 7/4 weekend.

The Bush-complicit corporate conservative fascist media trumpets the lie continously on Thursday, the compliant minions laugh at the "stupid" FARC terrorists all weekend in an orgy of alcohol, race hatred and jingoism.

Wash, rinse, repeat.

The corporate media is our biggest enemy. They must be destroyed.

[ohio2007]

31. Thats not the way it plays in France

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K1q9Ntcr5g&feature=related

who knew



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_iYbEPZVVIA&feature=related

[summer borealis]

37. "Badger, badger, badger ..."

I want that avatar!

[alcibiades_mystery]

9. I even got the price right

See post 18 of this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3558544

[Judi Lynn]

21. It was wonderful seeing your thread yesterday!

They surely do take us all for fools.

It would be bliss to get _Bush to finally eat these masterful words:

"There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again."

http://z.about.com.nyud.net:8090/d/politicalhumor/1/0/j/d/1/bush_foolmeonce.jpg
Wingers, of course, as we saw here yesterday, were bouncing off the wall, claiming to be "euphoric" in their belief a _Bush-supported military group had scored a victory. I'm sure if they'd had their "druthers," they would have prayed for a massacre, first!

[fascisthunter]

34. Yup...

:thumbsup:

[ohio2007]

41. Were the bills marked or unmarked?

Who's going to get this this money cleaned and untraceable ?

When ransoms were paid in certain middle east regions, an uptick in violence soon followed.

[petgoat]

59. FARC is up to its nostrils in the cocaine trade--expert money launderers. nt

[EFerrari]

113. So is Uribe. What a skill set! n/t

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

154. Sheesh

Making yourself look like an idiot isn't the way to make your case.

[hisownpetard]

56. You were right on all counts. Very impressive!

:thumbsup: :hi:

[EFerrari]

96. You sure did call it!

:applause:

If you open a think tank, I want to work for you. lol :)

[NashVegas]

195. You Sure Did

WTG on that.

[kevinmc]

10. McCain probably brought the cash on his Jet. ,,, 8-) n/t

[Bucky]

22. Oh pu-lease. McCain just happened to be there. It's just a coincidence, like Nixon being in Dallas.

Oh, wait a minute...

[fasttense]

33. All a coincidence just like the Iranian hostage release right after

we dutifully voted in Raygun.

[L. Coyote]

53. You mean like Nixon AND Bush being in Dallas??

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

155. Hasta la pasta, tonto

Don't say you weren't warned.

[Name removed]

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[Zorro]

173. Sorry, no hablo stupido

Try again.

[Name removed]

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[truthisfreedom]

11. Aww, I wanted to believe...

[OmahaBlueDog]

12. ...well, hopefully we didn't sell them missiles

I guess the real question is who did we sell missiles to to get the money to free the hostages?

[sourmilk]

13. I knew this was coming as soon as I heard about the "rescue."

The Colombian military can't pour piss from a boot.

[Joanne98]

14. But but but... I thought they were fooled by the Che tee-shirts?

[maddezmom]

15. not to mention the helicopters

[Joanne98]

16. lol

[L. Coyote]

54. The five helicopters they never had fooled them big time!!

[BearSquirrel2]

78. It would be my impression ...

It would be my impression that living in the jungle may lead you to a wardrobe different then Che brand spanking new Che t-shirts.

If I was suddenly approached by a bunch of guys in Che t-shirts, I would think that they were a bunch of pot-smoking college sophomores who had come to abduct all my munchies.

[Name removed]

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[hobbit709]

As Gomer Pyle used to say

"Surprise, surprise, surprise!"

[goodhue]

17. FARC trying to save face

I'm not inclined to believe this

[alcibiades_mystery]

19. You're right that whatever side one comes down on, it's more a matter of inclination

Facts as reported certainly support both versions, in any case. From there, you use your judgment about what's really the plausible explanation.

[atreides1]

25. So you believe the Colombian military

For 5 years no one could pinpoint where these particular hostages were, and all of a sudden the Colombian army does it all without firing a shot!

While I agree that the FARC may be trying to "save face", I'm definitely not buying the other side of the story either.

Until the whole truth is known let's just be glad that some of the hostages were rescued, but there are at least 700 others who are still being held. I guess the Colombian commandos weren't able to "infiltrate" those other FARC units as well as they did this one.

What was that name for something like this? One trick ponies!!!

[goodhue]

36. No I'm not inclined to believe the military

I don't doubt that money was paid to individuals to facilitate infiltration/hijack. But I don't believe hostage release/rescue is a result FARC leadership was paid ransom to deliver. However it happened, the release/rescue has not helped FARC, and I don't believe it was green lighted by FARC leadership.

[EFerrari]

98. Except FARC has been trying to unload Betancourt for months

because if she died in their custody (she's got very serious liver problems), that would have been very, very very bad for them.

[EFerrari]

201. Update: Betancourt gets a clean bill of health.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080705/ts_afp/francecolombiahostagesbetancourt_080705205006

Now I have to wonder if reports of her "severe illness" weren't someone's hook to move negotiations along. :shrug:

[L. Coyote]

57. guess all the valuable hostages were together, ever so luckily eh??

What is particularly irksome is not spending the 20 million, but capitalizing on the hostages to advance the McCain campaign.

[BearSquirrel2]

79. How convenient for FARC ...

How convenient for FARC that the "mole" transferred all the prisoners away from their other prisons. See, only some dunghole outpost got compromised. If it was a smart mole, he would have pinpointed hundreds of locations so the government could launch a full out simultaneous assault and completely crush FARC.

Free Trade + Cocaine = Easy smuggling.

[EFerrari]

99. That was the first thing that I thought. Very lucky - not. n/t

[drm604]

18. The official story sounded over the top.

I give this report a lot of credibility. The official story sounded like a bad Hollywood script. And it kept changing, always a sign that something's amiss. The first stories had the US State Department claiming that the US was unaware of the operation, now the US military is claiming that they helped in the planning.

[hisownpetard]

61. The line about the t-shirts is what did it for me.

Did they have FARC baseball caps on, too?

[Bucky]

20. Wait, you mean those life long rebels are gullible shmucks?

Who knew?

[ohio2007]

51. All the thinking is left to the pointy tip of the FARC chain of command

reports over the past five months show they've gone MIA...

and took their brains with them I suppose.

[Sanity Claws]

23. Why am I not surprised?

Now with $20 million, FARC can buy a lot of weaponry from Halliburton and other merchants of death.

[Judi Lynn]

24. And this is admitted by Forbes, no less! Amazing, maddezmom!

Glad to see Larkspur and Dr. Phool point out the strange similarity to the other yarn we were fed, concerning Jessica Lynch, and the rush of media giddiness that accompanied that preposterous hoax!

[azul]

26. Any consequences for promoting fake stories without checking sources?

Time and again a false story deceives the public to elicit a timely response. And these breaking stories are passed on by the government or military and so have the air of authority and sometimes are difficult to confirm. But by the history of their deceptions are now always suspect. What is an editor to do?

Legislation for penalties for government agencies lying to the media, and for deliberate media lies? As is stands, the truth itself is suspect, and that simplifies these propaganda exercises. And there seem to be no real consequences for lying.

[Peace Patriot]

38. "...truth itself is suspect, and that simplifies these propaganda exercises..."--YES!

Great intelligence and wisdom in that observation! And welcome to DU, Azul!

[janet118]

39. The first version of the story always wins . . .

The "breaking" part of news is the problem. The media tries to be "first" rather than the "most accurate." And they are given ample cover for their lies. The Bush administration, and governments friendly to same, release a series of lies and then the media reports them as is. As long as the quotes are attributed to government sources, the press is safe from any prosecution. On the other hand, to prove that the government statements are false, it takes time and effort. There would be a real threat of prosecution if the reporter didn't get it right. (See Dan Rather) Many news organizations don't think bothering with real investigative journalism is worth it and some (e.g., Fox et al) actually enjoy telling those pretty, cinematic lies over and over (especially if there is film). So the mainstream media wait for some foreign or independent news organization to come out with the truth and then say, "Oh, everybody knew that."

Meanwhile, back in the States, the "American People" (AP) still believe the original erroneous reports. I wonder if the television-watching American public still believes that the Jessica Lynch was raped and tortured by her Iraqi captors until her rescue by the brave American forces. Ask around. Warning: You may become light-headed and nauseous.

[ohio2007]

55. It's standard "Holiday routine" at the MSM. Search Google to find out that

nobody is going to take the time to check out the Swiss radio quoted source until monday or tuesday. By that time nobody needs truth.

[L. Coyote]

60. BBC had a report on this that read like a US propaganda piece, all terror keywords

and highly suspect. It was blatantly untrue, and created more suspicions than anything.

But, that is the version most people now have, and it is always heavy lifting to undo the first impression.

[Judi Lynn]

199. You have to wonder if they're EVER going to clean up their act. It would be unbearable if they

become even more slipshod and dishonest than they have been already!

Reiterating the Mark Twain quote:

"A lie is halfway round the world while the truth is still putting its boots on."

The first version is always the one which seems to stick, isn't it?

The lies they piled on top of lies regarding Jessica Lynch were horrendous. What a colossal insult to the American public.

People should use that as a warning to wait for further information from these clowns every time!

Welcome to D.U., janet118. :hi:

[hisownpetard]

58. The only consequence of promoting fake stories w/o checking the facts: higher ratings.

[AlphaCentauri]

93. For the number of espectacular headlines I can say PROPAGANDA

everything is a official press release

[Name removed]

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[ohio2007]

27. Thats usually the way things work out.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3372716

[paparush]

29. WHAT? You mean McCain DIDN'T go down there and "light a fire under somebody's ass"?

SHOCKING :sarcasm:

You mean it was all a well timed political stunt?

SHOCKING :sarcasm:

[janet118]

30. Let me get this straight . . .

McCain just happens to be on an inexplicable visit to Colombia at exactly the moment a ransom-for-hostages, disguised as a pseudo-rescue, goes down. What are the chances!!! Yes, there he is (with his zombie wife Cindy and his ever-present toady Lieberman a/k/a Igor) posing for photo-ops alongside the Colombian President Alvaro Uribe (a favorite of the Bushies) when media suddenly turns to focus on the miraculous "rescue" of French national Ingrid Betancourt along with "three American hostages." The fact that those American hostages were Blackwater mercenaries makes the whole deal smell like another chapter in the CIA's screwing-with-our-neighbors-to-the-south playbook.

Moral of story: It is essential that John "Bush III" McCain not be our next presidential puppet.

[rucognizant]

64. And Jeb.........

Jeb Bush was in COlumbia with Mcvain & Liarman too!
MeanwhilePoppy6 & Henry Kissinger were dedicating the new American Embassy in Berlin Germany. Isn't Henry liable to arret as a war criminal if he leaves the USA? ( source Deutsch WOrld News Journal link TV)

[tekisui]

32. This fits the storyline of mcdubya's ties to funding terrorist organizations in Colombia.

[fascisthunter]

35. I Guess FARC Wasn't Fooled

who was it that kept repeating that line? hmmmmm.

[Pavulon]

40. Guy who had his grape popped, and laptop removed

has plenty to do with this IMHO.

This looks to be ongoing and involves people beyond the military in Colombia.

Glad to see my tax money well spent.

[ohio2007]

42. Chávez hails rescue of Ingrid Betancourt

snip
The ruler pointed out that the Operation Check, which freed Betancourt and 14 other hostages and was performed by the Colombian army, was carried out "without firing a single shot."
snip
Venezuelan authorities asked the Colombian guerrilla to release the rest of the hostages, according to the official note.

"Our government reiterates its request to FARC to release all the captives held by the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia".
snip


http://english.eluniversal.com/2008/07/03/en_pol_art_chavez-hails-rescue_03A1758279.shtml

Which area under FARC influence did these few hostages "escape" from ?
http://www.spiegel.de/img/0,1020,1143405,00.jpg

And in what areas will these marked bills trickle down to ?

[High Plains]

46. Your tax money well-spent. What a joke.

We've spent $5 billion in Colombia, first to eradicate the coca crop (which is at the same level it was a decade ago, and up 26% over last year, according to the UN, and then to intervene in that country's long-running civil war. I consider that a big waste of my tax dollars.

[Pavulon]

47. God knows how much we have spent killing communists

but it is the long standing policy of us administrations running back decades.

We got our people back.

Good for them.

[L. Coyote]

63. Err .. ummm. They were just liberals. We called them commies to kill them!!

Mostly, the dead were activists seeking change, social justice, and all the things ordinary liberals support.

Deja DU: Italy: Judge issues 140 arrest warrants in "Plan Condor" case. Bush NOT YET indicted.
Dec-25-07 - http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2528536

[aquart]

70. Killing communists is a good thing? Why?

They don't qualify as human?

[AlphaCentauri]

94. the problem is that communist are not sinking the ship

the other guys are

[Botany]

44. I freaking knew it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3381205&mesg_id=3381295

[Mudoria]

45. Sounds like a great job of spin to me..

I'm sure being made to look like dupes and fools is bad enough as well as being made a laughing stock around the world. I'm sure FARC provided some "reliable sources :rofl:" to try and make themselves seem less like morons. Good job by the Colombian military and intelligence units. I hope Betancourt continues in her political career in Colombia for the next elections as well.

[EFerrari]

115. Right. Forbes is in the tank for FARC!

[Blue_Tires]

194. so you find the original story that much more believable?

[ohio2007]

49. Any news sites outside of the Alps reporting this yet

Forbes link to a Swiss radio story.

?

Wonder if any Swiss bank tellers leaked it ;)

Still waiting for more lnks to verify the swiss radio other then Forbes. Google didn't turn up much of anything



http://www.conflictpics.co.uk/COLOMBIA/Farc/index.htm

[L. Coyote]

50. OH GREAT. Now we all are likelier to be kidnapped???

Let me guess the next big revelation. Hugo Chavez helped get the US hostages free?

[Judi Lynn]

52. DPA: Betancourt arrives in France as questions arise about her rescue

Paris - Former hostage Ingrid Betancourt arrived in Paris on Friday as questions arose about the official story regarding her liberation. The French online news daily MediaPart on Friday contradicted the account put forward by the Colombian government, that its agents had infiltrated the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) and freed Betancourt and 14 other hostages through a clever ploy.

MediaPart reported that it had learned that the hostages had actually been freed through an agreement between Bogota and the FARC, in exchange for political asylum for FARC members in France and the payment of a ransom.

In addition, Swiss radio station Radio Suisse Romande (RSR), citing sources close to the events, reported that Colombian and US authorities had paid 20 million dollars to the FARC guerrillas guarding Betancourt and the other hostages to obtain their freedom.

A spokesman for the French Foreign Ministry on Friday denied that Paris had paid a ransom to obtain Betancourt's release.

"The answer is no," Eric Chevallier said, adding that France had not been informed about the military action that presumably led to Betancourt's liberation.

After arriving at at Villacoublay military airport outside Paris and being greeted by President Nicolas Sarkozy and his wife, Carla, the 46-year-old Beancourt described her rescue, saying that the Colombian agents who rescued her after she had spent more than 6 years in captivity were not armed.

More:
http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/216943,betancourt-arrives-in-france-as-questions-arise-about-her-rescue.html

[L. Coyote]

65. Nail in coffin? Beancourt: the Colombian agents who rescued her were not armed.

Except, with lots of nice helicopters :rofl:

[Peace Patriot]

62. I was wondering HOW LONG the Colombian military operatives had been in disguise

in FARC camps, and to what ends? The story didn't seem right to me, either. And probably we should have smartened up, and listed all the phony accusations that Uribe has been digging out of the "miracle laptops" against Hugo Chavez and Rafael Correa--giving FARC money, providing them weapons, taking campaign contributions from them--an incoherent set of allegations--and simply projected the activities forward, as what Uribe actually had done and was going to do. Cuz that's how corporate/fascist 'news' propaganda works. What the fascists accuse of others of, they are doing, big time.

Is Saddam Hussein a mass murderer? The Bush Junta was about the slaughter one million people to get their oil.

Does Saddam Hussein possess WMDs? The Bush Junta certainly possesses them, and is now threatening Iran with nukes. Who is the blackmailer? Who seeks to dominate the Middle East? (--not to mention who sold Saddam chemical weapons, and who sold missiles to Iran, back in the Reagan junta?).

Was Saddam Hussein somehow complicit in 9/11? Well, guess who got NORAD to stand down that day, and that day only?

Are Democrats "cowards" and "unpatriotic"? Who sought 'champagne service" during the Vietnam War? Who took five deferments? Who are the chicken-hawks, sending other young people to die when they themselves are cowards? (--and, indeed, who are dismantling the Constitution, destroying the U.S. military and selling our country to China and Saudi Arabia?)

It appeared to me that this recent, very intense, fascist propaganda campaign against Hugo Chavez and Rafael Correa--with a stream of "leaks" from the "miracle laptops" (allegedly FARC laptops)--was the prelimiary to war, and there is evidence of a Bushite war plan to regain global corporate predator control of the oil in Venezuela, Ecuador and Bolivia. And it may still be pre-war psyops. But it also seems to have served another, related purpose--cover for the Bush-supported, fascist Uribe government to PAY for the release of high profile hostages, in a publicity stunt to save the Uribe government (which is in very big legal trouble). It would be important to the Bush war plan to have the Bush Cartel's go-to guy, Uribe, still in power, when it unfolds (which could be this summer).

Well, I didn't take a page from my own book of advice about how to read corporate 'news' monopoly stories: WHATEVER they are accusing others of will soon be perpetrated by corporate fascists. Did Hugo Chavez and Rafael Correa pay the FARC to get hostages released? There is no evidence for it except Bush lapdog Uribe's ravings about his secret computer files. But guess who did?

[tblue37]

66. I am thinking not just the Jessica Lynch fabrication, but also the

Reagan set-up with Iran to hold those American hostages until Reagan was sworn in.

[bronxiteforever]

67. Does this mean McCain knows how much ransom was paid?

:shrug:

[IndianaGreen]

68. The Times of London is reporting the same thing (Murdoch owns The Times)

The big airplay this got by CNN and other sycophants in the media should have been a red flag.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4270844.ece

Ingrid Betancourt returns 'home' to France - but doubts emerge about 'daring' rescue

The former Colombian hostage Ingrid Betancourt returned to what she called her "other family" in France today as doubt was cast on the apparently daring rescue that won her freedom.

Arriving to a warm embrace from Nicolas Sarkozy and his wife Carla Bruni, the 46-year-old, who was largely brought up in France as the daughter of a Colombian diplomat and also has French nationality, was welcomed at the Villacoublay military air base near Paris, where she flew in on the French presidential Airbus.

But while she was still in the air, the Swiss radio station RSR broadcast a report questioning the official version of the operation to free Ms Betancourt and 14 other hostages – saying that money, not cunning, had clinched their freedom.

According to Bogota, the hostages were freed in an elaborate ruse by Colombian intelligence agents who had infiltrated the Marxist Farc rebels holding them.

But RSR said that the 15 hostages “were in reality ransomed for a high price, and the whole operation afterwards was a set-up". Citing a source "close to the events, reliable and tested many times in recent years", it said that the United States – which had three citizens among those freed – was behind the deal and put the price at $20 million.

The Colombian Foreign Ministry furiously denied the allegations, with a spokesman calling them "completely false." He added: "They are lies".

The French Foreign Ministry denied any involvement in any deal and there was no sign that the Swiss report would sour the celebrations planned by Mr Sarkozy both at the airbase and later at the Elysee Palace.

Speaking by the steps of the aircraft, Mr Sarkozy publicly welcomed Ms Betancourt to France, telling her that "all of France" had followed her struggle in the jungle and admired the strength of her spirit.

[dipsydoodle]

71. The Colombian Foreign Ministry furiously denied the allegations,

with a spokesman calling them "completely false." He added: "They are lies".

[ohio2007]

77. Analysis: winners and losers from the Ingrid Betancourt operation

snip

Chávez had been calling on the international community to take a more benign view of Farc. Now he has changed his tune and has called on the rebels to abandon their struggle.
snip
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article4264207.ece



Speak softly but carry a big stick

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3377941

Roosevelt's gunboat diplomacy
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=686_1206042402

[Judi Lynn]

81. Just a little late with that brilliant observation, by almost a month. Timing is everything.

Chavez tells the FARC to make peace
By Chris Kraul
June 10, 2008

Chased by the U.S.-backed armed forces, this country’s largest rebel group is now under pressure to surrender from a surprising new source – President Hugo Chavez of neighboring Venezuela.

During his nine years in office, the populist Chavez has regularly expressed support for the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia, or FARC. Just months ago, he was pressing for steps that would lead to the FARC’s being recognized as a belligerent, and no longer designated a terrorist group, as it is now by the U.S.

But Chavez surprised analysts and government officials when he advised the rebels to unconditionally release more than 700 hostages, lay down their weapons and make peace after 44 years of fighting.

“At this stage in Latin America, a guerrilla movement is out of order,” Chavez told viewers of his “Alo Presidente” TV program Sunday. He called on the FARC leader known as Alfonso Cano to release hostages in a humanitarian gesture “in exchange for nothing.”

Colombian officials said Chavez’s statements might signal a change in his approach. Interior Minister Carlos Holguin told reporters he was surprised but happy to hear Chavez’s statement. The U.S. government, which often ignores Chavez’s anti-U.S. rants, quickly took note

“Those are certainly good words,” said State Department spokesman Sean McCormack. “We would encourage Venezuela to follow those good words with concrete actions.”

Under a program called Plan Colombia, this nation has received more than $5 billion in U.S. aid to fight drug trafficking, which the FARC and other armed groups are involved in.

Alejo Vargas, a political science professor at National University of Colombia in Bogota, said that while Chavez’s motives were unclear, the impact on the FARC “must be overwhelming.”

“Chavez is an icon for them. But here he is telling the FARC to forget about a negotiated deal, just surrender unconditionally,” Vargas said. “Secondly, he said that guerrilla movements make no sense in today’s world. That kind of a statement has transcendence.”

More:
http://articles.latimes.com/2008/jun/10/world/fg-farc10

[ohio2007]

91. Talk about late,

I've noticed you can always be counted on for posting 15 yr old articles when they fit the thread.


You can stop pretending, your 'revolution' is being sold down the Orinoco river valley
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3330748&mesg_id=3330748





http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=3314134&mesg_id=3314161

[Judi Lynn]

92. Would you clarify what you're attempting to say? As it is, it's gibberish.

What 15 year old article I posted are you yammering about? You're not making much sense. Take time to focus.

[EFerrari]

102. Judi Lynn: I've learned more about Latin America from you

than from anyone else ever. Thanks.

[Judi Lynn]

104. I have been fascinated by your accounts and details on Latin America, opening so many eyes.

As we're finding out, we've been WILDLY misled about the history and character of Latin America in our own U.S. culture, right?

Got a long, long way to go, too, as there's so much we need to know we're not being told.

I'm always looking out for your comments, having been amazed over and over again by your quickness, depth, and character.

Thank you! :hi:

[Judi Lynn]

95. When you find an article I've posted which is 15 years old, would you explain why it's invalid?

Is there a deadline on the truth? Does it chance sides every 10 years?

Do you even know what you're saying?

I'm interested in seeing your foundation for this line of attack on me.

[AlphaCentauri]

97. We forgot who was the leader helping to liberate the previous freed hostages?

wasn't it Chavez?

[Kip Humphrey]

69. No wonder McCain hustled down to Columbia for his $20mm US engineered photo op!

[IndianaGreen]

82. Obviously McFossil supports arms-for-hostages as in Iran Contra

Another flip flop by our brave "Maverick" that the US press lionizes.

[Doug.Goodall]

74. That $20,000,000 is coming out of McCain's publicly financed campaign account - right?

[Zorro]

80. Talk about grasping at straws

The pro-FARC sycophants are cracking me up, tripping all over themselves to declare that the rescue was staged based on some unnamed source.

Certainly money was exchanged; it was to pay off those that betrayed FARC, not to FARC leadership.

But keep up the hysterical conspiracy theories. It's very entertaining to witness the lunacy; I especially like the one where this is part of Chavez' master plan.

[ohio2007]

83. It was "some guys wife" that convinced him to sell out.

snip
The report added said the wife of one of the hostages' guards was the go-between, having been arrested by the Colombian army. She was released to return to the guerrillas, where she persuaded her husband to change sides.

Switzerland, along with France and Spain, has been mediating with the FARC on behalf of Colombian President Alvaro Uribe.
snip
http://www.forbes.com/afxnewslimited/feeds/afx/2008/07/04/afx5184293.html
the untold story;
that biatch was sick of all his "revolution" talk.
"Wheres my room air conditioner el capitan ?"

I could be wrong though

[Judi Lynn]

85. She was released after capture by the Colombian government with the understanding

"she persuaded her husband to change sides."

Not too hard to grasp, actually.

If she hadn't agreed, she'd still be in jail, or she would be looking over her shoulder for the rest of her life, expecting angry Colombian military figures to catch her and treat her far less humanely the next time.

[ohio2007]

86. Farc in disarray ( Sell outs been doing it for months )

Audacious rescue deals Farc a blow


snip

The international pressure which he endured, principally from presidents Nicolas Sarkozy of France and Hugo Chavez of Venezuela, is likely to melt away.

The rescue also vindicates his tough policy against the guerrillas who killed his father, and it will allow him to continue unhindered in his plans to defeat Farc militarily and force them to the negotiating table.

This latest incident shows, yet again, that Farc are in disarray, reeling after a series of blows.

In March this year one of their top commanders, "Raul Reyes" was killed when the Colombian air force bombed a rebel camp within Ecuador, sparking an international row that has still not been resolved.

A week later another leader, "Ivan Rios", was murdered by one of his bodyguards, who collected the bounty offered by the government.

Then the most serious of all, the death from a heart attack of Farc's 78-year-old founder and leader, "Manuel Marulanda
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7486808.stm

Even Hugo is telling them to give it up.

Some small fifth column got $20 million and, as per Hugos own words, is expected to release the 700 other captives.

the end is near

[Bacchus39]

111. here are some details the Swiss radio and Forbes left out

I already posted this yesterday. if you read the Swiss story carefully it really doesn't conflict much with the story from yesterday at all. its just spin.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080704/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/colombia_hostages;_ylt=AnhmwjQGA9WTHawI6Y0j2hK3IxIF

Colombia rescue hinged on rebel disarray, payback By FRANK BAJAK, Associated Press Writer
Fri Jul 4, 1:44 AM ET

some select quotes:





Its success hinged entirely, its planners said Thursday, on a near-total breakdown in communications between the isolated guerrilla jailers and their commanders — the net result of years of intense U.S.-Colombian military cooperation that has seriously weakened Latin America's last major rebel army.

-----------------------


The general said a disgruntled member of the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia, or FARC, had agreed to spearhead the operation. This turncoat, he said, was trusted by both the rebels' high command and by the leader of the 1st Front, which was holding the hostages.
"The FARC's communications are medieval," Padilla said. He said its command-and-control is so diminished that it sends important messages by courier. This breakdown in the chain of command has made it easier to flip disillusioned rebels to the government's side, and indeed, Padilla said more than one double agent was involved in this mission.

But the turncoat was the key. He convinced Gerardo Aguilar Ramirez, alias Cesar, the commander of the 1st Front, that top commanders wanted the 15 hostages moved to a rallying point, the general directly involved in the operation told the AP.

The turncoat was upset with the FARC because his own commander had taken a house and farm away from him, the general said. This was payback.



Aboard the helicopter that would recover the hostages were four air force crewmen in civilian disguise, seven military intelligence agents and the guerrilla turncoat, military officials said. Two of the agents were dressed as rebels, and the rest wore white, as if representing some sort of humanitarian mission. All had taken a week and a half of acting lessons, Padilla said.

Shortly after midday on Wednesday, the helicopter touched down at the rendezvous point.

---------------------
The turncoat is now free and will likely receive a sizable amount from a $100 million government reward fund, the general said.

[AlphaCentauri]

114. There are more incredible details

A U.S. military special-operations unit carried out the recent rescue of three Defense Department contractors being held by the leftist Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC), according to a source who has first-hand knowledge of the operation.

The U.S. military contractors – Marc Gonsalves, Thomas Howes and Keith Stansell – had been held captive by the FARC ever since their surveillance plane was shot down in February 2003 over the Colombian jungles. Also rescued in the mission were 11 Colombian military and police officers as well as former Colombian presidential candidate Ingrid Betancourt – who also is a French citizen.

The source of information for this report asked not to be identified, though Narco News has not been led astray by this source in the past.

The source claims the rescue mission was a U.S.-led operation with Colombian support – as opposed to the reverse, as has been widely reported in the U.S. media. The operation had been underway for some months prior to the July 2 rescue day.

In priming this pump, the U.S. team managed to plant some satellite phones with the FARC. The source declined to provide details on how that was accomplished for fear of compromising future operations of this nature. From there, the U.S. military used its technology to set up surveillance by intercepting the FARC’s communications.

The whole operation was carried out, the source claims, under the guise of being a humanitarian mission. The FARC, the source claims, believed they were dealing with a “French humanitarian group.” The communications intercepts helped to facilitate that deceit, the source adds.

http://www.narconews.com/Issue54/article3153.html

:shrug:

[EFerrari]

100. Forbes should be ashamed of its support for FARC.

:rofl:

[AlphaCentauri]

101. LOL Uribes sycophants are waiting for more money, anyone ready to pay for another killing

:bounce:

[Doctor Cynic]

84. At least it wasn't 14 million Euros!

[muriel_volestrangler]

87. George Bush was being briefed on the mediation

"The Swiss, French and Spanish are already talking to them, Mr. President. Some people are wondering if we should use Brazilians as well."

Bush waited a moment.

"Brazilians?" he asked. "Wouldn't they accept a bit less, like a few million?"

:evilgrin:

[maddezmom]

110. you bad

:spank: :D

[johnaries]

88. Bush is just following Reagan's lead.

Anyone remember the Iran-Contra affair??

[Peace Patriot]

103. In addition to propping up the criminal Uribe government, this also helps rightwing Sarkozy,

who is about to become president of the EU. He had pledged to free Betancourt as a major goal of his administration.

The outline of this whole event is finally coming into sharper focus. It possibly set in motion about a year and a half ago, with two events that got little or no news coverage in the corporate monopoly press: 1) a rehearsal, possibly perpetrated by Blackwater--unknown shooters, never identified--for killing FARC hostages in a confused "crossfire" situation, and blaming it on Hugo Chavez, whom Uribe/Bush Junta were about to set up as a FAILED hostage negotiator (12 FARC hostages were targeted and killed by these unknown shooters who stalked the group), and 2) the probable initial trigger for the whole event, exposure of an assassination plot against Chavez, hatched in the Colombian military, for which Uribe had to apologize to Chavez, in a four hour meeting. I think that this latter event--the meeting--was where Uribe asked Chavez to negotiate with the FARC for hostage releases (it was publicly announced later), and, in view of his subsequent actions, I can only think that the treacherous Uribe was in on the set up from the beginning.

The 40+ year Colombian civil war has been spilling over Venezuela's borders and sending hundreds of thousands of refugees into Venezuela, as well as posing a clear and present danger to the democratically elected, leftist, Chavez government ($5.5 BILLION in Bush/U.S. taxpayer military aid to Colombia--a highly corrupting influence, resulting in rampant rightwing paramilitary death squad activity and major drug trafficking). Chavez has many reasons for wanting peace in Colombia, and responded to Uribe's request with an intense effort to move the FARC toward a peaceful settlement by starting to release the hostages.

Days before the first two hostages were to be released--the weekend of Dec 1, 2007--negotiated by Chavez, Uribe suddenly withdrew his support, for no good reason, and the Colombian military heavily bombed the location of the hostages, as they were in route to their freedom, driving them back into the jungle on a 20 mile hike. This was also not reported in the corporate press--although the two hostages (whom Chavez got released a few weeks later by a different route) held a press conference and gave out a press release about it. Continuing to work, through the months of Dec 07-Feb 08--urged on by the hostages' families, human rights groups, many world leaders including Sarkovy, and South American leaders, some of whom joined in on the effort (including Rafael Correa, president of Ecuador, and Cristina Fernandez, president of Argentina)--Chavez got a total of six hostages released from captivity, despite continuing sabotage and treachery by Uribe and the Colombian military (no doubt in my mind, now, orchestrated in Washington DC). They set the thing up to hand Chavez a diplomatic disaster, with dead hostages. Chavez was outsmarting them, and was getting worldwide kudos for his efforts, so they had to end it. It was a "peace genii" they hadn't reckoned on.

Notably, on the very weekend of the scheduled release of the first two hostages--Dec 1, 2007--Donald Rumsfeld weighed in, with an op-ed in the Washington Post, entitled "The Smart Way to Defeat Tyrants like Chavez"*. In the first paragraph he says that Chavez's hostage release efforts were "not welcome in Colombia," though they had been days before. (Rumsfeld, of course, fails to mention that Uribe asked Chavez to negotiate with the FARC.) This ominous op-ed was what first alerted me to the direct Bushite orchestration of these events in Colombia, and to their being the possible initial ground work and psyops for a war. Within three months, war almost broke out.

They ended Chavez's negotiated hostage releases on March 1, 2008, by a Colombia/U.S. bombing and raid on the camp of the chief FARC hostage negotiator, Raul Reyes, just inside Ecuador's border, killing Reyes and 24 others in their sleep--an act that ended all hostage negotiations, all talk of peace, and almost started a war between Colombia and Ecuador (whose president, Rafael Correa, was in "very advanced negotiations" with Reyes for Ingrid Betancourt's release). A diplomatic furor ensued in South America, and it appears that Chavez was a key player in preventing war. (Brazil's president Lula da Silva called him "the great peacemaker" in that context.)

Then Uribe claimed to have retrieved Raul Reyes' laptop computer from the bomb site, and started leaking choice FARC emails to the press, implicating Chavez and Correa in various activities--for which there is no evidence but this computer (later computerS)--such as giving money to the FARC, giving them weapons, taking money from them, and being "terrorist" sympathizers. Chavez and Correa had been lured by Uribe into more frequent contact with the FARC, to negotiate hostage releases, and then those more frequent contacts were used to defame Chavez and Correa! A nice bit of treachery!

As Correa has said, his country does not border Colombia--it borders the FARC, which controls a major swath of Colombia on Ecuador's border. As head of state, it is his duty to be in contact with the FARC, for the safety of his people. That is not unusual--nor "evidence" of being a "terrorist-lover." The same with Chavez, which borders Colombia and FARC territory to the north. The FARC emails that I have read are basically FARC fantasies of getting help from these leaders. There is no evidence in the emails that Chavez or Correa gave them anything. Further, the laptopS were in Colombian military hands for two days before they were given to Interpol--and if the laptops are entirely inventions, they may have been in Rumsfeld OSP hands long before that (and the story that they were retrieved from the bombing site is a total lie). In any case, the "miracle laptops"--and Uribe's devious and even psycho behavior around them (he rushed over to the Hague to file charges of "genocide" against Chavez--and got laughed out of court)--point backwards to the outline of the plot from the beginning--to harm, defame, and destroy the popularity of Chavez (70% approval rating), Correa (80% approval rating) and other leftist leaders, to cover up massive and terrible crimes by the Uribe regime, and--in this latest stunt--to keep Uribe in power (key to other Bushite war plans), and to create favorable headlines for Uribe, Bush, McCain and (apparently) Sarkovy.

Uribe bribed legislators to vote for extending his term of office. Two legislators have been prosecuted and jailed for it. The Colombian Supreme Court is considering invalidating his election because of these bribes. And some 50 of Uribe's cohorts (including relatives) are under investigation--or in jail--for their rightwing death squad activties, and Uribe himself is under investigation for the same. Now Uribe wants an unusual referendum on his presidency--on the heels of this hostage 'triumph'--as an end-run around the legal system. He began arranging this just prior to the Betancourt release--a few weeks ago, when the legal cases against him began heating up.

It is a supreme irony that the Bushites and their corporate press--and Donald Rumsfeld--accuse Chavez of being a tyrant, and wanting to be "president for life"--charges that are patently, provably false--and it is actually their pet fascist Uribe who is guilty of such ambition, and of committing crimes to achieve it.

Rumsfeld--in his curiously timed WaPo op-ed--also urges "swift action" by the U.S. in support of "friends and allies" in South America. Keeping Uribe in power in Colombia would be a vital component of any Bushite war plan in South America, and certainly of the war plan that I have seen developing, which involves a fascist group of secessionists in the state of Zulia, Venezuela--where most of Venezuela's oil is. Zulia is adjacent to Colombia, and to the Caribbean, where the Bushites will have the 4th Fleet up and running very soon, off the Venezuela/Zulia coast. "Swift action" could be the U.S. military acting in support of Zulia's "independence," in league with local fascists--funded and armed by the Bush Junta (our tax dollars). A Bushite secessionist plot is already in progress in the gas and oil rich provinces of Bolivia (close ally of Venezuela and Ecuador). And there is also evidence of such a plot in the northwestern, oil rich provinces of Ecuador, near the U.S. air base at Manta (run by Dyncorp)--a U.S. base that Rafael Correa has pledged to evict from his country next year when the lease expires (and possibly before, if it's proven that Manta was involved in the Colombian bombing attack and raid on Ecuadoran soil). Venezuela and Ecuador control the biggest oil reserves in the western hemisphere. Both are members of OPEC. Both have leftist governments that believe in using the oil profits to benefit the poor, and have leaders who are key players in the overwhelmingly leftist trend on the continent. They are prime Bushite targets, and already have been the victims of Bushite plots of every kind (attempted coups and assassinations, dirty tricks, black ops, subversion, economic destabilization efforts, massive funding of rightwing political groups, major psyops, slander and disinformation, etc.)

If the Bushites can't get Iran's oil--and they seem to be checkmated on that one--who else can they steal oil from? I think we're looking at Oil War II: South America. And this hostage stunt may be an important preliminary to the unfolding of that war plan.

[EFerrari]

106. Excellent round up and full of information I didn't have.

Thank you very much, Peace Patriot.

:yourock:

[Judi Lynn]

108. Uribe loves control, leaves very little to chance. That's why, as you have pointed out, he chose NOT

to leave something as important as securing a change to the Colombian Constitution to the citizens of Colombia, but opted to go ahead and BRIBE legislators to ram it through. That's how much a fascist cares for maintaining a strong democracy!

So we NEVER hear a peep from our corporate media about THAT, but they rave on for days, weeks, months on end about Hugo Chavez when he put the choice of extending term limits, along with 68 OTHER issues together before the voters of Venezuela, so THEY would have the last word, then he stepped back.

One of these bids for removing term limits is considered completely above board, according to our own media, apparently. Amazing, isn't it?

Thank you for taking the time to go through these details with those of us who haven't had time to keep track. Really appreciate your work.

[Bacchus39]

109. Uribe will win

that's what pisses you off, and Chavez lost.

by the way, one of Uribe's referendums with numerous proposals was defeated several years ago.

[AlphaCentauri]

105. Update: Details of hostage rescue operation clarified by source

The source of information for the Narco News story published last night about the hostage rescue in Colombia this past Wednesday contacted us to clarify a few details about the operation.

A total of two helicopters were involved in the rescue mission; however, one of those helicopters, for logistical reasons, did not land at the meeting place where the hostages were being held, the source says. The second helicopter was held back, on the ground, at a nearby location.

The helicopter that did land at the site in Colombia where the 15 hostages were gathered under FARC guard contained a total of 13 people - one nurse, one medical doctor, and 11 crew and military personnel (all disguised as humanitarian workers). The source says some of those 13 people were Colombians.

However, the source still maintains that up to six of those 13 individuals were U.S. special-operations personnel, as reported previously, and that the entire operation was carried out with the active involvement of the U.S. military in cooperation with the Colombian government.

The source also clarifies that the cover for the rescue mission was a joint French and Swiss humanitarian group.

The source adds that for political reasons, in order to justify all the U.S. military aid now going to Colombia, the Bush administration has been steadfast in pushing a media narrative purporting that the rescue operation was carried out completely by the Colombian government.

The New York Times published a story yesterday revealing that its sources claim the Defense Intelligence Agency and the U.S. Special Operations Command did provide at least surveillance assistance in the effort to rescue the hostages. The Times story also states that the newspaper's sources requested anonymity "because they were not authorized to speak on the record and the Bush administration was adamant about giving the Colombians the credit."

http://narcosphere.narconews.com/notebook/bill-conroy/2008/07/update-details-hostage-rescue-operation-clarified-source

[Bacchus39]

107. is this the offiicial FARC version? we wanted the military to look good

funny how the FARC disciples here only only can be satisfied with the release of the hostages if it doesn't make the military or Uribe look good. the FARC seemed willing to go along with it though. yeah, sure.

[EFerrari]

116. Yes, it is. We planted the story at Forbes. n/t

[Bacchus39]

118. and I just "planted" a story that fills in some details that Swiss radio left out

why don't we ask the FARC commander who is in custody what he thinks?

[EFerrari]

121. I'm sorry that real life is not a John Wayne movie, Bacchus39. n/t

[Bacchus39]

123. how about the commander of the Front who was holding the hostages

he is in custody now you know. I guess he wasn't in on the act????

[EFerrari]

128. It will be interesting to see how he is handled, no doubt. n/t

[Judi Lynn]

117. Ingrid Betancourt: This Year's Jessica Lynch?

Ingrid Betancourt: This Year's Jessica Lynch?
China Hand Jul 4 2008 - 3:55pm
South American affairs is obviously not China Hand's bailiwick, but I had the funny feeling that the the “rescue” of Betancourt and the other hostages from the hands of FARC by the Colombian government looked, walked, and quacked more like a negotiated release than a genuine piece of special ops derring do.

It looks like I might have been right.

Swiss radio is reporting that it cost $20 million to spring the hostages.

For those of you interested in how unworthy suspicions flower in the mind of an incorrigibly cynical blogger, I will regale patient readers with a rundown of the official story's fishier elements.

First, the Betancourt story got huge—suspiciously huge—play in US papers. In my hometime paper, the LA Times, it was the big A1 right-column, banner headline lead.

Well, Ingrid Betancourt, like Jerry Lewis, might be huge in France—she holds dual Colombian-French citizenship—but, quite frankly, before July 2 I had never heard of her.

Obviously, the US press was primed to push this story.

More:
http://americanfootprints.com/drupal/node/4077

[Bacchus39]

119. ummm....three americans were rescue too

so you don't think that merits media attention either?

[AlphaCentauri]

126. El Negro Vladimir was capture again for killing Union members

how come that is not important

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3382223

[Judi Lynn]

129. Jeez, thanks for the heads up, AlphaCentauri.

I didn't see it until I saw your post.

I'm going to study it. This is the first I've heard. So thankful to see it.

[Name removed]

136. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Judi Lynn]

120. Ingrid Betancourt’s homecoming soured by claims of secret payoff

From The TimesJuly 5, 2008

Ingrid Betancourt’s homecoming soured by claims of secret payoff
Charles Bremner in Paris

Ingrid Betancourt landed to an emotional welcome in France yesterday after six years of captivity in Colombia, praising President Sarkozy for saving her from likely death in the hands of the rebel army that held her.

But as the Colombian politician arrived in her “second home country”, questions arose over the bloodless military operation that secured her freedom from the jungle, along with 14 other hostages.

According to reports that were dismissed by Colombia as lies, the apparently brilliant operation was partly stage-managed and included a US-financed ransom. A senior French expert said on state television that some of Ms Betancourt’s captors had “probably been bought”. But official sources in Washington were deeply sceptical about the ransom claim and French diplomats dismissed it as mischievous.

~snip~
French state media also raised questions about Ms Betancourt’s healthy appearance on her release, compared with the gaunt and haggard look of her last video from captivity. France Inter radio suggested that the hostages may have been given food and medicine before a planned release.

A Colombian Foreign Ministry spokesman called the allegations “completely false . . . They are lies.” The French Foreign Ministry said that it had not paid any ransom. Israeli media also reported that its intelligence service, Mossad, had helped to plan and execute the operation, naming Israel Ziv, a retired army officer.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article4272824.ece

[Bacchus39]

122. yep, its all there in the article I posted

the turncoat was definitely bought. it would seem the commander of the Front who was holding the hostages wasn't aware though since he is in custody.

[Zorro]

125. Success has a thousand fathers

and a thousand whining losers trying to diminish that success.

[AlphaCentauri]

127. Ms Betancourt’s is healthier than we have been toll

Mas propaganda para los despistados que no hablan espagnol

[Zorro]

130. Excellent diagnosis, Senator Frist

She can walk, so obviously she's in fine form.

Perhaps there's a market for a "FARC 6 Year Diet Plan to Health" book.

[Judi Lynn]

131. The photos from yesterday are NOTHING like the ones around Christmas which were distributed, right?

I know what you mean, and what other people have pointed out, as well.

[EFerrari]

132. This may be a strange comparison but in working with rescue animals,

I've noticed they tend to brighten up when there is a positive change -- only to crash later when their survival is no longer at issue.

I hope Betancourt isn't as sick as she was reported to be but it wouldn't surprise me at all if she did go through a "crash" once she's in a safe place.

[AlphaCentauri]

176. some doctors say the same about people

doctors have seen people very ill and days before they die, people start feeling full of joy to die days later.

[EFerrari]

177. It's a well known phenomenon in the kitty rescue business.

You bail out a mom and her litter and they look pretty good. After they're out a day or so, they wilt and come down with all the stuff their system was defending against while they were "in".

[Zorro]

178. I've witnessed that phenomenon

The last full day of life, and they feel great, minds sharp and witty. Then they die the next day.

Sort of a last hurrah, I guess. One day we'll all find out.

[Zorro]

179. She reportedly is suffering from Hepatitis C

Not going to be able to diagnose that readily from looking at a picture.

[AlphaCentauri]

180. well since hepatitis C is sexually transmitted

there is no change that we know until she gets the results from a clinical test

[AlphaCentauri]

203. LATEST clinical test: She is healthy no hepatitis

[dipsydoodle]

133. Video shows daring Colombian raid - BBC News

not sure if you can run it in the USA ?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7490995.stm

[AlphaCentauri]

175. Very strange quotes in all those reports the video doesn't show no raids no audacious rescue

looks more like humanitarian act than anything else

[ohio2007]

181. This video of rescue,;shots of white helicopter to vague to make out markings

to make out any country or company markings.

Anybody speak spanish ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oc4d3uZ5CRU&eurl=http://lawhawk.blogspot.com/2008/07/colombia-reveals-video-of-hostage.html

You can hear some guy was pleading his case to the cameraman...
...sounds like he is saying "I'm sick of the bulshit" or something along those lines..

[AlphaCentauri]

187. The video left many part of the audio and video sequence out

it does not show the details of the deal, like how the FARC agree to hand out the prisoners.

All this fantastic allegations of a rescue are mere propaganda everything points to a deal behind doors.

There was no raid, no audacious rescue everything resumes to a group of hostages voluntarily freed.

[ohio2007]

182. Your video has no audio.

Maybe the BBC is editing it ?

This is a better clip, not sure if it can be run in ( your country here ) ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oc4d3uZ5CRU&eurl=http://lawhawk.blogspot.com/2008/07/colombia-reveals-video-of-hostage.html

Do you speak spanish ?

on edit;

The video is from YouTube so, after the recent court ruling, that means if you go to the link...........



bu-ha ha ha haaaaaa

[dipsydoodle]

185. Beeb made it clear they had no audio

The reason I mentioned possible inability to play is because some stuff on the BBC is played using their iPlayer which cannot at present be streamed from abroad - from previous experience here on DU anyway. There's nothing insidious about that as until recently we couldn't get music on lastFM - licencing delays I guess.

Nope - no Spanish apart from odd slang but I'm not too sure the audio helps anyway. What surprised me was how well the "The three contractors" - Moe, Curly and Larry , looked too. Odd that sometimes they are refered to as Pentagon contractors ?

I've got the original film on DVD of Big Bro with Richard Burton - well worth watching if you've never seen it. :hi:

[ohio2007]

186. Thats the old media for ya, they won't offer a link so they leave it up to you

I ( and you ) can translate Spanish text into English by a simply copy/paste job ;

http://translate.google.com/translate_t?langpair=es

or @ 25 other languages from A to almost Z;

http://translate.google.com/translate_s?hl=en&clss=&q=&sl=en&tl=ar

So who really needs the olde media ?

But the audio?
I bet the audio translate technology is out there....somewhere

The MSM never makes a big story about the 700+ still held. Guess Colombians being held by Colombians isn't considered newsworthy outside of the small circle of friends and family members of those held.




Didn't do a search on the 'contractors' but I think ( I think ) they were some sort of aviation related inspectors.

The local farmers may not have liked the idea agent orange could have been part of their future but who knows. Will these three amigo's talk?
Will people dismiss what they say when they are interviewed?

MILHOP / LIHOP's are wanting to tear a new theory into why a dieing cause is happening the jungles.
btw
Even this board big bro is protecting you from certain disturbing truths;

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3382893

I read the book 'Animal Farm' the 1984 movie was based on but only so much was used and translated well into the movie.

I like this movie.

How a futuristic investagotor uncovers the truth;


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Sp-VFBbjpE

[AlphaCentauri]

188. No surprise on the 700 hundred still held but no mention of the 5000 killed by the government

that is odd, media focus more in the 20 percent crime of the guerrilla while they don't mention the 80 killing of the colombian government, we just look at the Negro Vladimir story and see how many times the big media had talk about it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3382223

[EFerrari]

189. The Uribe government is a clone of BushCo.

When they invaded Ecuador and killed those people, the Ambassadors from both countries were on Washington Journal on the same morning. The Ambassador from Colombia did a great impression of Condi Rice and framed the whole event as part of the fight against terrorists. She was followed by her colleague from Ecuador who seemed so disgusted with her, he could barely speak.

[ohio2007]

191. And they pretend funding of these groups isn't due to the US drug addictions

?
no connections there.

[AlphaCentauri]

192. The Negro Vladimir groups have three sources of income

This groups get some colombian government aid and the colombian government get some foreign aid.

The export of drugs

and the paid to murder political dissidents.

We are talking about something bigger than ideologist leaving in the jungle this is part of a government.

[Name removed]

140. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[northzax]

196. so we can now agree that FARC are common criminals?

that's the definition of people who take ransom for kidnap victims. Not hostages, kidnap victims. Once you take money, you are a common, venal kidnapper. No better than the guy who kidnaps a child from his front lawn.

By the way, the reason this report is hard to believe is that there is a reason you never pay ransoms, it encourages kidnappers. Plus really, twenty million? That's it?

[conspirator]

197. You may be right, or not. Giving the hostages back may be a way of making truce or

gaining time. Maybe the government is willing to negotiate. The money is just the cherry on top

[EFerrari]

202. FARC has been trying to release these people for years now.

Uribe is the one that has been stalling for his own political purposes.

[Duke Newcombe]

205. Wouldn't releasing them be as easy as...

well...letting them go? Why does what an external entity will or won't do make them not cut the restraints, give them a canteen of water, point them in the direction of the road and say "goodbye"?

Unless they hold hostages because they want something.

Duke

[EFerrari]

206. It's more complicated than that. And if anything happened to those people

between the time you let them go and say, their bodies were found, you would be blamed.

There is no trust lost between FARC and the government. Last time they tried to stand down, a mass of them got killed for their pains.

I still can't figure out why Betancourt was taken in the first place because the only one who benefited was Uribe.

[Duke Newcombe]

207. Yet even more incentives...

...to not take hostages in the first place.

Duke

[EFerrari]

208. FARC gets the press because they don't own the media

where the Colombian government is holding hundreds of political prisoners and its paramilitaries butcher people with impunity. I don't agree with hostage taking but there is an inherent imbalance in the reporting of this situation.

Edit to add: link to a James Petras article on political prisoners in Colombia.

http://petras.lahaine.org/articulo.php?p=1722&more=1&c=1

[opihimoimoi]

198. BAD Precedent...now, more kidnappings on the way...BIG PAYOFF....thats the message

[tabasco]

200. They were trying to make John McLame look like Ronald Reagan!!

The corrupt republicans are so desperate they will give millions of our tax dollars to kidnappers to make their tired candidate look like a hero. Puppet Reagan was a media creation but he had some acting skills which McLame lacks.

They are trying oh so hard to make us believe the fairy tale!

[KamaAina]

204. All of which begs the question, Why weren't these millions paid *five years ago*?!

Betancourt, the three mercs defense contractors, and the others languished in durance vile for years, apparently because the timing just wasn't right to buy their freedom until now. :eyes: