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Amerigo Vespucci Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:06 PM
Original message
Obama backers urge Clinton exit if she loses
Source: MSNBC

WASHINGTON - Top supporters of Senator Barack Obama, joined by at least one prominent Democrat yet to endorse a candidate, put pressure on Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton on Sunday to bow out of the presidential race unless she scores clear victories in the crucial big-state primary contests on Tuesday.

“I just think that D-Day is Tuesday,” said Gov. Bill Richardson of New Mexico, a former Democratic presidential candidate who has yet to throw his support behind either candidate.

And two Obama supporters, Senators John Kerry and Dick Durbin, pushed for Mrs. Clinton to withdraw if she does poorly at the polls on Tuesday.

Texas, Ohio, Rhode Island and Vermont hold primary contests that day, and the Clinton campaign, trailing in the delegates needed for nomination and having lost the last 11 straight contests, has acknowledged that the New York senator needs to win at least Ohio or Texas. Both candidates were campaigning Sunday in Ohio.

Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23437753/
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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. For what it's worth, I agree
And I LOVE your JLH pic and signature line.
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Amerigo Vespucci Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Thanks...
:toast:
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #1
34. she must have total vote lead (inc FL/MICH)to have right to ask supers for votes
she loses Ohio it is all over.

Ohio does not have GOP game playing to defeat her with crossover votes - and the AA population is not above average in size.
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NashVegas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:22 PM
Response to Original message
2. Attempts to Disenfranchise Voters Really Suck
Hard.
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brooklynite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #2
26. So you think Dodd, Biden, Kucinich, Richardson, Edwards
should also still be campaigning?
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #26
30. I would have liked to have a chance to vote for them
I am SICK of the front-runners being picked by a minority of the nation
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 12:33 AM
Response to Reply #30
33. Me too!
And I am also nearly as sick of these constant calls for Clinton to drop out. It's not like she is in Huckabee's situation, far behind McCain.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
3. I've been watching this with great amusement
because I no longer have a horse in the race. I'll vote for whomever is left standing.

Forcing Edwards out seems to have been a serious DLC miscalculation. I think they expected his voters to fall in line behind Clinton. Oops.

They should have realized that people who voted for Edwards were voting for an economic sea change. The candidate using the word "change" is Obama.

Double oops.

Every nail in the DLC coffin is a good thing.
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
4. therefore if obama loses them, HE should exit, correct? nt
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earthlover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. I think it should be clear that Hillary needs over 60%+ of ALL REMAINING CONTESTS
If she doesnt get 60% Tuesday, she will need an even higher percentage in the remaining contests....just to TIE Obama's pledge delegate total and the popular vote total.

I seriously doubt if Hillary wins either state by 60%, not even Rhode Island. She will move on from Tuesday with a gain of perhaps a handful of delegates....if she is lucky.

Now, if Hillary wins each state convincingly, she can move on and perhaps make a case for the super delegates that the tide has turned yadayada. But so far, nothing in the polls indicates that she is going to win anything convincingly except maybe Rhode Island.

It is inconceivable for Obama to lose enough delegates Tuesday to jeapardize his campaign. Dream on.
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #10
20. Hillary will never quit. She will end up suing to get Florida and
Michigan. Watch.
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Kittycat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #20
27. but that still won't pull her ahead.
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #27
37. Tell her that.
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Claire Beth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #20
40. I disagree..She will do what is best for the party
and that will be to step aside since she won't be able to win.
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Windy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
15. Obama won the last eleven contests. No he should not leave the race
even if he loses them all on Tuesday.
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Diane R Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #4
21. You do know that he's far ahead of Hillary, don't you?
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:26 PM
Response to Original message
5. Obama backers urge Clinton exit whether or not she loses.
Seriously; why is this LBN?
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:30 PM
Response to Original message
7. What's been wrong with this entire primary season
Only 6 states out of 50 had voted when Edwards was urged to get out of the race. The amount of time those who dropped out before Edwards were "allowed" to campaign should be a scandal.

Only 36 states out of 50 have voted to date. By trying to force Clinton out of the race, you are nullifying the vote of those who live in the last 15 states.

Something is wrong with this picture.
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earthlover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:49 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. If it is obvious Hillary cannot win, it would hurt the party's nominee to continue
The money should be saved to defeat McCain, and there is no longer any point in savaging our nominee's name, something that would only help McCain as well. November is the most important contest....
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. You're disrespecting the people in the states who have not
yet voted. You are, in effect, telling that they should not have a choice in the primaries. Indeed, anyone after the first 6 states voted was told they had two choices. They could vote for either Hillary or Obama. That is wrong.
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Pastiche423 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Uh, where have you been for the past several presidential campaigns?
I've not been able to have my vote count due to late primaries in the last two elections (00/04). And this year, my state's primary is May 20.

This primary ain't nuthin new. :eyes:
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
8. Did anyone of Obama Supporters realize that "dancing on
Hillary's grave just might encourage all the undecided voters to
break for Hillary???

Keep it up. Oh yes Obama was supposed to win California by 17 points.
Keep dancing on her grave, I beg of you.

Buyers remorse may set in.
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. that's exactly what it is going to do
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
29. I Wonder That Myself
Good post OHdem10:patriot:
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jannyk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 07:45 PM
Response to Original message
9. LBN - Clinton Supporters say "No Fucking Way!"
Latest Breaking News a bit of a reach there don't ya think?
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Thats what I say too!
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Sadie5 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. this is a puny attempt to smear
Edited on Sun Mar-02-08 08:28 PM by Demo5
Hillary yet again. The other states have not yet spoken.What a loser that Kerry is.
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Hillary ALL THE WAY TO THE WHITE HOUSE.....Madame President!
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 08:46 PM
Response to Original message
19. The gall.
That is piss poor on so many levels.

Tell them to go to hell, Hillary.
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #19
28. My Thoughts Too.
What wtmusic said.:patriot:
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yaelbelle Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 10:08 PM
Response to Original message
22. We can't afford for her to exit!
The Obama campaign gives Sen. Obama credit for every bill he introduced or signed on as a co-sponsor, whether or not they became law.

In her time in the Senate, Hillary has sponsored 21 bills that have become law including:

— a bill that extended the availability of unemployment assistance.

— a bill which established a program to assist family caregivers.

— a bill that provided benefits to public safety officers who were killed or injured during the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

But Hillary’s accomplishments in the Senate are not limited to bill sponsorships. Among her many other legislative accomplishments:

— Hillary worked with Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC) to expand access to health care for the National Guard and Reserve.

— Hillary passed an amendment that created a national program for teacher and principal training and recruitment.

— Hillary used Senate rules to force the Bush administration to make emergency contraception, also known as Plan B, available

The reality is, since Sen. Obama joined the Senate (applying the same standard the Obama campaign applies to Hillary) he has sponsored two bills that have become law:

— a bill that sought to promote democracy in the Democratic Republic of Congo.

— a bill that named a post office.

~~~~~~

Sen. Obama and Hillary have almost identical voting records on Iraq:

In fact, Obama’s Senate voting record on Iraq is nearly identical to Clinton’s. Over the two years Obama has been in the Senate, the only Iraq-related vote on which they differed was the confirmation earlier this year of General George Casey to be Chief of Staff of the Army, which Obama voted for and Clinton voted against.
As a Senate candidate in November 2003, Sen. Obama said he would have ‘unequivocally’ voted against war funding because it was the only way to oppose Bush on Iraq:

“Just this week, when I was asked, would I have voted for the $87 billion dollars, I said ‘no.’ I said no unequivocally because, at a certain point, we have to say no to George Bush. If we keep on getting steamrolled, we are not going to stand a chance.”
But until he ran for president, Sen. Obama supported every funding bill for Iraq. <2005 Vote # 117, HR1268, 5/10/05; 2005 Vote # 326, S1042, 11/15/05; 2006 Vote # 112, HR4939, 5/4/06; 2006 Vote # 239; 2006 Vote # 186, S2766, 6/22/06, HR5631, 9/7/06>

Obama campaign advisor Susan Rice falsely claimed that Sen. Obama and Hillary have voted differently on Iraq since joining the Senate. Rice claimed these vote differences reflected Sen. Obama’s “different position” on the war:

JANSING: Bill Clinton made the point that in the senate Barack Obama voted exactly the same way that senator Hillary Clinton has on Iraq, and is there a vote where they took different positions?

RICE: Yes, they have taken different positions from the beginning…Since coming to the senate, he has been very clear in pushing every year 2005, 2006, and 2007 for a withdrawal of our forces. Senator Clinton took the view for a good part of that period that it would be premature and unwise to signal that the U.S. was prepared to withdraw, to set a timeline or a deadline.

Actually, with the exception of Sen. Obama’s vote to promote Gen. Casey, one of the chief architects of the war, his voting record is exactly the same as Hillary. Hillary and Sen. Obama have never voted differently on troop withdrawals, timelines or deadlines.

Full list of votes available here.

~~~~~~

Sen. Obama blasted the energy policy developed in secret by Vice President Cheney:

Washington’s failure is the failure of a president who spent most of his time in office denying the very existence of global warming – of a Vice President who developed America’s energy policy with a secret task force that opened the door to oil lobbyists and then shut it to every other point of view.
Sen. Obama failed to mention that he voted for Dick Cheney’s energy policy, the 2005 Energy Bill.

~~~~~~

Sen. Obama claimed he voted against the amendment on the 2005 Bankruptcy bill because he thought that a ceiling of 30 percent interest for loans on credit cards was too high:

Absolutely. It is a fact because I thought 30% potentially was too high of a ceiling. So we had no hearings on that bill, it had not gone through the banking committee.
The Chicago Tribune reported that Sen. Obama was planning on voting for the measure until a colleague noted, ‘thirty percent is sort of a random number’:

To some liberals, the proposal was a no-brainer: a ceiling of 30 percent on interest rates for credit cards and other consumer debt. And as he left his office to vote on it, Obama planned to support the measure, which was being considered as an amendment to a major overhaul of the nation’s bankruptcy laws. But when the amendment came up for a vote, Obama was standing next to Sen. Paul Sarbanes (D-Md.), the senior Democrat on the banking committee and the leader of those opposing the landmark bill, which would make it harder for Americans to get rid of debt. ‘You know, this is probably not a smart amendment for us to vote for,’ Obama recalled Sarbanes telling him. ‘Thirty percent is sort of a random number.’ Obama joined Sarbanes in voting against the amendment, but they lost the larger battle when the new bankruptcy law passed by a lopsided 74-25. There remains no federal ceiling on credit card interest rates. Obama’s deferral to Sarbanes was just one example of the freshman senator learning to navigate a chamber famous for its egos.
Sen. Obama did end up voting against a ceiling of 30 percent interest for loans or credit cards:

Obama voted against and Hillary voted for a Dayton, D-Minn., amendment that would set a 30 percent ceiling on interest rates for loans or credit cards.

~~~~~~

In 2003, Sen. Obama said that he would support a repeal of the U.S. PATRIOT Act:

Q4. Would you vote to repeal the U.S. Patriot Act?” A. “Yes, I would vote to repeal the U.S. Patriot Act, although I would consider replacing that shoddy and dangerous law with a new, carefully crafted proposal…
In 2006, Sen. Obama to extend the PATRIOT Act:

The Washington Post said of the reauthorization, “he Patriot Act fight started with promises of major changes and ended largely with the status quo.” Obama himself said the bill only “modestly” improved the PATRIOT Act and failed to do enough to protect civil liberties.

~~~~~~

Sen. Obama suggested he made his opposition to Kyl-Lieberman clear ‘at the time of the vote.’ From the debate:

Blitzer : This was an important vote you missed the, you weren’t present in the senate when that vote occurred.

Obama: This is true and it was a mistake - one of the hazards of running for president. What I have consistently said and what I said at the time of the vote was that we should not take steps that would increase two presences inside Iraq with an eye towards blunting the impact of Iran. I always think that’s a mistake.

Sen. Obama missed the vote and said nothing at the time the vote occurred. His campaign didn’t release a statement until 9 hours after the vote. The vote occurred at 12:44PM. Sen. Obama didn’t issue a statement until after 10PM.

The issue also came up at a presidential debate that night, and Sen. Obama didn’t mention it.

Sen. Obama voted present 129 times on a wide array of issues, including choice, privacy for victims of sexual assault, and school violence. In fact, the Obama campaign claimed that Sen. Obama’s present votes were part of a legislative strategy but failed to mention that Sen. Obama was the lone present vote on a number of key issues.

~~~~~~

THE ABUNDANCE OF NON-VOTES:

Sen. Obama’s Present Votes By The Numbers

Sen. Obama voted ‘present’ 129 times while in the State Senate.

In 1999, Sen. Obama voted ‘present’ more often than he voted ‘no’: According to state records, Obama voted ‘present’ 43 times in 1999, while voting ‘no’ just 29 times.

At least 36 times, Sen. Obama was either the only State Senator to vote present or was part of a group of six or fewer to vote that way.

Other Present Votes of Interest:

Sen. Obama was the only State Senator to vote ‘present’ on a bill that sought to protect the privacy of sex-abuse victims, and the only state senator to not support the bill.

Sen. Obama was the only State Senator to vote ‘present’ on an adoption bill that imposed stricter requirements for parental fitness, and the only State Senator to not support the bill.

Sen. Obama voted ‘present’ on a bill that would increase penalties for the use of a firearm within 1,000 feet of a school. The bill called for the mandatory adult persecution of a minor at least 15 years of age being tried for using a firearm within 1,000 feet of a school.

Sen. Obama voted ‘present’ on a bill to prohibit the presence of adult sex shops near schools, places of worship, and day care facilities; bill allows local governments to regulate the presence of adult sex shops.

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Amonester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 10:17 PM
Response to Original message
23. All primaries should happen the same day.
Otherwise, the whole thing makes no sense (my opinion).

We have the technology... it's not the nineteenth century any more.

Just sayin'
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wisteria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 10:26 PM
Response to Original message
24. I agree, if she doesn't win at least two states by a big margin, she should do what is right
for the party and the country and drop out. The longer this goes on the more time the Repubs have to gain on us. Money being raised now should be going to our general election candidate.
I liked that both of these candidates had to fight for the right to be our nominee. But, at this point enough is enough.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
25. When.
NT!

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mysteryman2 Donating Member (159 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 12:27 AM
Response to Original message
31. why doesn't he do what the people want
make her running mate. thats what people want.
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 12:28 AM
Response to Original message
32. I think the Clinton backers should urge Obama to exit when he loses
Edited on Mon Mar-03-08 12:37 AM by barb162
or doesn't get 70% vote margins on 3-4-08. Let him get out of the race with whatever artificial standards her campaign chooses to impose on him, and I hope they're just as stupid as the ones the Obama campaign backers impose for Clinton.
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Drunken Irishman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 04:16 AM
Response to Reply #32
35. C'mon, stop with this.
Edited on Mon Mar-03-08 04:17 AM by Drunken Irishman
Clinton is down over 100 delegates and most likely will still be down over 100 delegates come Wednesday. If Obama were down that much after Tuesday, I'd want him to drop out. In fact, I think he would drop out, because it would become very clear he's done.

70% of the delegates have already been allocated and Clinton is trailing by 7 percentage points in the delegate count. That's a big number for her to overcome, whether her fans want to admit it or not. Now I'll say this: If Clinton wins Texas and Ohio Tuesday, she should stay in and go on to PA. However, if she loses either one, she needs to call it quits, because there is no possible scenario, outside of Obama dying, that will give her the nomination without a total riot in Denver during the convention.
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #35
38. Imagine: Giants are up by 21 in the fourth quarter; coach Coughlin
asks Patriots coach Bill Belichick to forfeit. What's wrong with this picture?
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 05:47 AM
Response to Original message
36. Well, at least the number one expert on giving up has spoken.
So I guess Hillary should follow his example.
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Ordr Donating Member (699 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
39. Let me get this straight:
From what I've gathered, if Clinton doesn't receive the nomination, her supporters will not vote for Obama? Sounds like great news for McCain.
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #39
41. But it's OK for Obama folks not to vote for Hillary?
Hello pot, have a good day, kettle.
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PinkTiger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 05:47 PM
Response to Original message
42. I have lost all respect for John Kerry over this. nt
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