Secret police force to be set up in Iraq

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

Nine months after the end of Saddam Hussein's regime and his feared intelligence force, Iraq is to get a secret police force again - courtesy of Washington.

The Bush Administration will fund the agency in its latest bid to root out the Baathist loyalists behind the insurgency in parts of Iraq. The force will cost up to $US3 billion ($A4 billion) over the next three years.

Its ranks will comprise Iraqi exile groups, Kurdish and Shiite forces - and former agents who are now working for the Americans. CIA officers in Baghdad will play a leading role in directing their operations.

A former US intelligence officer said: "If successfully set up, the group would work in tandem with American forces but would have its own structure and relative independence. It could be expected to be fairly ruthless in dealing with the remnants of Saddam."

more: http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/01/04/1073151210964.html

Boy, that's what every "liberated" country wants... Their very own Gestapo!

[kalian]

1. I'm sure that torture will be rampant....

just like under Saddam and his sons.... :eyes:
And you know what else, Iraq will be the new gitmo where "terrorists"
and other "undesirables" will be sent off too.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

2. Yes, but it will be in Freedom prisons. n/t

[kalian]

9. Ahh yes...silly me...thank you fellow citizen...

:eyes:

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

11. It's all double-plus good! n/t

[kalian]

15. But of course!

:toast:

[MysticMind]

3. I don't see how this constitues a secret police...

Was the Truth and Reconciliation commission in South Africa that arrested and punished ex-apartheid a secret police?

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

4. A 10,000 man force run and paid by the CIA...

I wouldn't call them crossing guards.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

7. I wonder how long our tax dollars are going to be paying for 10,000

Iraqi SS?

Damn, what deficit?

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[kalian]

17. So....

your point is? :shrug:

[MysticMind]

19. my point is...

It's not a secret police force.

[kalian]

22. Of course not! Geez...how silly of me to believe such a thing!

Thank you...





























Unfortunately...you are WRONG! Most news sources are utilizing the
term in their articles. Care to explain it...?

[pinto]

26. I've never heard of a "not secret" CIA run op, unless you count Ms Plame

[MysticMind]

28. it's not much of a covert op

If we're talking about it.

[pinto]

35. how will we know? 10,000 force paid for from CIA funds....

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

20. Should I draw YOUR conclusions from a story?

I didn't write the article. But there are several other sources for confirmation if you would care to check.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=X&oi=news&start=0&num=2&q=http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/01/04/1073151210964.html (The Age)

http://www.google.com/url?sa=X&oi=news&start=1&num=2&q=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml%3Fxml%3D/news/2004/01/04/wirq04.xml%26sSheet%3D/news/2004/01/04/ixnewstop.html (Telegraph)

http://www.albawaba.com/news/index.php3?sid=267140&lang=e&dir=news (Albawaba ME Neews)


On edit: They ALL use the term "Secret Police."

Now, it's your turn. Give links prooving your argument that they are NOT going to be "secret police."

[MysticMind]

23. the story is unobjective and offers no proof that this

Constitutes a secret police.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

36. Which of the FOUR stories do you find "unobjective?"

Like I said, back up your argument with some attributions as I did (even though I did not write the articles and am curious as to why you feel that I "Jump to my own conclusions" about the story).

It's a personal attack to call someone down by name as you did, and I really don't appreciate it.

[qanda]

34. Why attack Billy?

If you have some other information to share that refutes this story, then please don't hold back. However, you have a lot of nerve accusing Billy of drawing his own conclusions.

[pinto]

5. "fairly ruthless" sure sounds like an oxymoron, but that aside,

"Although officially banned by the ruling Coalition Provisional Authority, militia groups are already patrolling in Iraq, resulting in an increasing death toll of top former Baathists.

The US hopes to organise the various groups into one force with the local knowledge, motivation and authority to hunt down resistance fighters. According to Washington, the new agency could number 10,000. Initially, salaries will be paid by the CIA, which has 275 officers in Iraq. The force is intended to have a crucial role in post-Saddam Iraq."

spells trouble. Local knowledge = CIA info,
plus motivation = revenge,
plus authority = military cover.


"To begin with, the new Iraqi government will reign but not rule."

Global Security quote says it all

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

68. You bring up a good point here...

With Militia groups "oficially" banned they seem to operate with relative impunity from coalition forces.

There may be a lot between the lines here.

[Guaranteed]

6. And this is better than the Baathists, WHY?? nt

[kalian]

10. Because...and as Foster Dulles once said....

"They are OUR bastards..." :eyes:


Saddam was one of our bastards as well...until he no longer served
them...

[pinto]

40. ipso facto n/t

[GRClarkesq]

41. I thought that was Jeanne Kirkpatrick

maybe she saw a good line and used it later

[daleo]

8. Sickening hypocrisy

Everyone who talked about how U.S./U.K. were in this for human rights should just shut their mouths now. Let's see:

- stop dangerous weapons of mass destruction - No
- stop human rights abuses - No

Which leaves:

- steal oil - Yes, if possible

P.S. I know there will still be apologists who will ignore this latest development, or say that the new secret police are better than the old secret police.

[kalian]

13. This kind of crap has been going on for over 50 years....

and then some... Empires have a tendency of doing such things.

[Vitruvius]

29. And what Empires do abroad, they do at home. Sooner or later.

Whether it's secret police, political assassinations, stealing elections, setting up a tame propaganda media (a "Mighty Wurlitzer" in CIA parlance) or the looting of the people for the benefit of the BFEE that is the motivation behind it all.

We're all peons to be suppressed & exploited -- as far as the BFEE is concerned.

[kalian]

32. That's right! And I was expecting somebody to make that connection....

exactly true...and it will be only a matter of time before the US
falls into an authoritarian rule.
Think about it: how long can they continue to spew these lies on
the TV? How long can the sheeple continue to "move along" before
one of them raises his head and asks.. "But...."

Folks...2004 won't be pretty...

[aquart]

66. I will cherish an explanation of the differences.

Be they ever so minute.

[lumpy]

12. Saddam's way.

Secret police. It worked for Saddam. Strange how history repeats.

[daleo]

16. What is this supposed to mean anyway?

"The presence of a powerful secret police ... will mean that the new Iraqi political regime will not stray outside the parameters that the US wants to set," said John Pike, an expert on classified military budgets at the Global Security organisation. "To begin with, the new Iraqi government will reign but not rule."

- Telegraph

[kalian]

18. It means...."RULE BY PROXY"....

very imperialistic....

[MysticMind]

21. how is the police force imperialistic if

Its members are native Iraqis? Or is any non-Baathist Iraqi an imperialist in your opinion?

[kalian]

24. Do you understand what the term...."rule by proxy"...means...?

[MysticMind]

27. yes it means you think..

Any Iraqi governmment that's anti-Saddam or non-Baathist is a tool of America.

[kalian]

30. Pffftt....no, its going to be a tool for France....

:eyes:

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

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[kalian]

38. Excuse me...?

Clarify your remark pal.
And just who in blazes are you? Hmm...?

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

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[kalian]

43. Buh-bye....

:hi:

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

25. The fact that they are run and paid for by the CIA might make one

think that they would be run by the CIA...

They're ours, aren't they?

[MysticMind]

31. run by the CIA or trained by them...

Two different things.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

39. I'd suggest you read the available information on the subject.

The project is slated to cost appx. $3B and the CIA will be overseeing it.

I posted links to the story above.

[pinto]

44. "CIA officers in Baghdad will play a leading role in directing"

Operative word seems to be "directing".

[MysticMind]

48. need more information..

This story is just bad reporting.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

49. Which one? There are FIVE on the subject linked to in this thread

as of now.

So, which one is bad reporting? And why do you consider it so?

[tom_paine]

72. Yeah, you're right

:silly: :crazy: :crazy: :silly:

I guess you've never heard of SAVAK, eh?

http://reference.allrefer.com/country-guide-study/iran/iran183.html

How interesting it is to live in an Imperial-Orwellian Age where history is gradually being erased in order to serve the Empire. Yesterday's Pravda and Today's Corproate Pravda don;t even have to agree

Yeah, SAVAK never existed. It was a liberal invention to discredit the Wise and Noble Shah.

Oh right, and we've always been at war with Eastasia, too.

(why do I think you won't "get" that line?)

[Just Me]

37. This is NOT positive news,...

,...so, is this secret police force what the administration plans to spend that $4B it is now holding back?

[enough]

45. A fairly long article on the subject

http://www.prospect.org/print/V15/1/dreyfuss-r.html

The American Prospect
Phoenix Rising
Tucked away in the recent Iraqi appropriation was $3 billlion for a new paramilitary unit. Close students of Vietnam may see similarities.

By Robert Dreyfuss
Issue Date: 1.1.04

With the 2004 electoral clock ticking amid growing public concern about U.S. casualties and chaos in Iraq, the Bush administration's hawks are upping the ante militarily. To those familiar with the CIA's Phoenix assassination program in Vietnam, Latin America's death squads or Israel's official policy of targeted murders of Palestinian activists, the results are likely to look chillingly familiar.

The Prospect has learned that part of a secret $3 billion in new funds—tucked away in the $87 billion Iraq appropriation that Congress approved in early November—will go toward the creation of a paramilitary unit manned by militiamen associated with former Iraqi exile groups. Experts say it could lead to a wave of extrajudicial killings, not only of armed rebels but of nationalists, other opponents of the U.S. occupation and thousands of civilian Baathists—up to 120,000 of the estimated 2.5 million former Baath Party members in Iraq.

"They're clearly cooking up joint teams to do Phoenix-like things, like they did in Vietnam," says Vincent Cannistraro, former CIA chief of counterterrorism. Ironically, he says, the U.S. forces in Iraq are working with key members of Saddam Hussein's now-defunct intelligence agency to set the program in motion. "They're setting up little teams of Seals and Special Forces with teams of Iraqis, working with people who were former senior Iraqi intelligence people, to do these things," Cannistraro says.

snip>

The hidden $3 billion will fund covert ("black") operations disguised as an Air Force classified program. According to John Pike, an expert on classified military budgets at globalsecurity.org, the cash, spread over three years, is likely being funneled directly to the CIA, boosting that agency's estimated $4 billion a year budget by fully 25 percent. Operations in Iraq will get the bulk of it, with some money going to Afghanistan. The number of CIA officers in Iraq, now 275, will increase significantly, supplemented by large numbers of the U.S. military's elite counterinsurgency forces. A chunk of those secret funds, according to Mel Goodman, a former CIA analyst, will to go to restive tribal sheikhs, especially in Sunni-dominated central Iraq. "I assume there are CIA people going around with bags of cash," says Goodman.

more

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

47. Frightening article. Worth the read, people.

Thanks for posting it.

[MysticMind]

50. I trust this article alot more...

However this still isn't imperialist, it's more like allowing anarchy to rule in Iraq. I objective to allowing private militias to police Iraq. But if we just leave Iraq these private militias would still roam Iraq attacking their enemies.

[Just Me]

52. It IS imperialist,...

because it is U.S. setting it up in another nation and controlling it. It would be anarchist if the neo-cons were setting up a similar arrangement here in the U.S. (can't really say one way or the other that it hasn't already happened to some degree though).

[Just Me]

51. Oh, God,...is anyone passing this on,...

I mean, doesn't something like this justify a major letter-writing campaign with the caveat (within the letter), "You have now been officially notified in writing and will be held accountable", along with "Copies of this letter are being sent to other members of Congress, constituents and various media outlets"?

[pinto]

53. great article, thks.

[number6]

54. yep, liberation

liberation my ass :eyes:

[Just Me]

55. Wouldn't ya love to pin the neo-cons down,...

,...on how they define "liberation" *LOL*!!! Oh, talk about scrambling!!!

[pinto]

56. in the big picture, that is really our job, B*shco has to answer 4 neocons

implementation of foriegn policy IN OUR NAME...
sorry, pet peeve.

[mike_c]

57. pay attention, this is the model of "democracy" the neo-cons...

envision for America as well. The next operation Iron Grip is likely to occur here.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

58. If you couple this with the news of the largest US "embassy" that

one Arab news source described as staffed by "2999 CIA agents and an Ambassador," the Iraqis have as much chance of operating their own government as I do of talking Sean Hannity into voting a straight Democratic ticket.

[Just Me]

59. That is a very logical conclusion,...

,...in my humble view :D

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

60. LOL... There I go, drawing my own conclusions again.

Big Brother Bush and the Repugs don't like people drawing their own conclusions.

[Just Me]

63. That kind of independence WILL NOT BE TOLERATED!!!

*giggle*

Personally, I am REALLY refreshed by logical conclusions.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

65. There has been an influx of RW illogical talking points of late

that can't get past the idea of a talking point statement is sufficient in a discussion and should not be questioned. Logic has nothing to do with it. *sigh*

All we can do is alert on them.

(Thanks, Just Me)

:toast:

[Robb]

61. I don't see why everyone is so concerned about this

I mean, name me one instance in history where "secret police" have ever caused problems?






The captain has advised the red sarcasm light is illuminated. Please feel free to not take me seriously, but keep your seatbelts fastened just in case.

[pinto]

62. look man, we just can't connect the dots, OK? what secet? police? wah?

:freak:

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

67. I'm sure these will be the Secret Crossing Guards

for all the Secret Schools opened in the Secret Land of Chalabi.

[Rex]

64. fairly ruthless?

drat...I was expecting the full monty!

[AtTheEndOfTheDay]

69. Perhaps they can call it SAVAK

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

70. ?? That one went over my head...

SAVAK?

[daleo]

71. The shah of Iran's old secret police

If I remember correctly, pre 1979. I think the CIA were on pretty friendly terms with these fellows. I am quite sure they used torture, but I don't know about rape rooms.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

73. Thanks, daleo. Makes sense now.

[bvar22]

74. Looks like the Sunnis are about to become...

...the undesirables in the new Iraqi Police State.

"Its ranks will comprise Iraqi exile groups, Kurdish and Shiite forces "