Source: Pentagon Rejects Speaker Pelosi's Request for Military Aircraft

[RamboLiberal]

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=2858225&page=1

A source close to the controversy over the request made by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., for use of a military plane that can fly to and from her home district in San Francisco, Calif., without having to stop to refuel, tells ABC News that the Pentagon has rebuffed Pelosi's request.

The source says that Pentagon officials and the Bush administration have instead offered Pelosi use of the same plane made available to former Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Illinois: a C-20, which seats about 12 passengers and five crew members.

A C-20 can make the 700-mile flight to Hastert's Aurora, Ill., district easily but would generally have to stop to refuel to complete the 2,800-mile trip from Washington D.C. to the San Francisco Bay Area, depending on the headwinds.

Pelosi has expressed concern about having to stop and refuel, primarily for security reasons, her office says. Since 9/11, the Speaker of the House — second in line behind the Vice President in the line of presidential succession — has been able to use a military plane for travel, for security reasons.

In response to the Pentagon offer, Pelosi spokesman Brendan Daly tells ABC News, "We appreciate the Defense Department's continuing concern for the Speaker's security. We are reviewing their letter."

Bet this order came down straight from Chimpy or Darth Vader.

[EV_Ares]

1. The dems need to quite trying to make nice-nice to the republicans

or they will get screwed again; and again; and again. They need to do as Cink says and just take them up on filibustering on the surge. Also, just don't have any recesses where Bush can appoint more judges.

[Hotler]

5. Let her corporate sponsors supply her a plane.

I'd bet she has some. Stay on the hill madam speaker, no recesses like EV_ said.

[saigon68]

2. She wants a 757

She doesn't need a 757 (Its amazing how some people think they are "Royalty", when they ascend to positions of power)

[Straight Shooter]

4. What can they offer her that will accommodate the need for security?

I don't know much about airplanes. Is there an alternative, and why hasn't it been mentioned? :shrug:

[RamboLiberal]

6. She claims she just wants a plane that doesn't need to refuel

"I want an aircraft that will reach California," Pelosi told reporters Wednesday afternoon, insisting that she doesn't care what kind of plane it is as long as it can fly nonstop to her home district.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=2857672&page=1

I haven't been following this too closely - but it seems the RW noise machine has managed to blow this out of proportion. You can bet if Hastert had lived in CA they'd have quietly made available a plane that can go from DC to CA w/o refueling.

Wish they'd ground AF1 and AF2 for all those useless trips * and Cheney take for campaigning, flying to the pig farm or going to duck/pheasant slaughters.

[atreides1]

17. An Alternative

If it's a plane provided by the military, then it should be able to refuel at any USAF base between Washington D.C. and California, and the last time I checked most military bases with airfields were
secure areas.

[saigon68]

25. Military bases ARE SECURE AREAS

Even basic training bases are OFF LIMITS to civilians.

a pimply faced 18 year old recruit can't get a visit from "mommy" without lots of paperwork and permission.

It's the islamics who might blow up the latrine doncha know.

LOL

[sanskritwarrior]

30. Actually most bases were open bases

until 9/11........I went to Fort Leonard Wood in the mid 90's for basic. One of the recruits in my platoon was from Florida, his mom came and saw him several times when we were on the ranges, gas chamber, etc......The drills were less than thrilled, but she wasn't breaking any laws. Fort Hood was an open post until Sept. 12th 2001......Anyone could come and go with no ID and no gate guards before that day......Now every post is a closed post, back then only places like Fort huachuca and other sensitve sites were closed posts.

[RC]

7. CNN Champions Pelosi Smear, Covers False Washington Times Story Six Days Straight

I wish people would get their facts straight. Do you forget all the lies and smears of the last six years?

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/02/07/pelosi-smear


1) Dobbs: Pelosi “wants the U.S. Air Force for personal accommodation.”

FACT: Pelosi’s use of a military aircraft is about security, not “personal accomodation.” It was House Sergeant at Arms Wilson Livingood who initiated inquiries into the aircraft. “I advised Speaker Pelosi that the US Air Force had made an airplane available to Speaker Hastert” following 9/11, Livingood wrote, and “I offered to call the U.S. Air Force and Department of Defense to seek clarification of the guidelines .”

4) Dobbs: Pelosi “wants a plane that accommodates 42 people, private stateroom. … She could take a circus with her.”

FACT: Pelosi’s office says “it is up to the Air Force to decide what type and size of plane will be required,” and that “she has never asked for a plane or space on a plane to accommodate ’supporters.’”

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/02/05/pelosi-military-aircraft/

FACT CHECK: Washington Times Publishes False Report On Pelosi’s Use Of Military Aircraft

1) The House Sergeant at Arms, not Pelosi, initiated inquiries into the use of military aircraft. House Sergeant at Arms Wilson Livingood, who has served in his position since 1995, released a statement today clarifying the facts. He writes, “In December 2006, I advised Speaker Pelosi that the US Air Force had made an airplane available to Speaker Hastert for security and communications purposes following September 11, 2001.” Additionally, Livingood writes, “I offered to call the U.S. Air Force and Department of Defense to seek clarification of the guidelines .”

2) A larger plane was requested because Hastert’s plane required refueling to travel cross-country. The Washington Times says a larger plane was requested to accomodate Pelosi, “her staff, other Members and supporters.” That’s not true. In fact, the plane used by Speaker Hastert was too small for Pelosi since it “needs to refuel every 2,000 miles and could not make the nonstop haul to California. ‘The Air Force determined that safety would be best ensured by using a plane that has the fuel capacity to go coast-to-coast,’” a Pelosi spokesperson said.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Google is your friend.

[underpants]

19. This is a non-issue and it is outrageous that the Pentagon would even think about saying no

Your post has all the pertinent information.

I saw CNN's tease on the update on this story this morning. Complete BS.

[Straight Shooter]

3. Cost to provide security at airport while refueling vs. cost to provide the military plane?

The bush administration is trying to make a point that they can push Speaker Pelosis around. I suspect when push comes to shove, they'll find themselves on their asses.

Give her the damn plane and protect her.

[Frances]

9. I think part of the reason the Repubs are pushing her around

is that she is a woman. The Repubs want to make her look less powerful.

[rodeodance]

16. yes, I think that is a factor.

[classysassy]

8. Speaker Pelosa

those are grounds for impeachment.Don't forget to impeach,the snarling Dickhead.Hello Madam President.( I am just daydreaming)

[Vidar]

10. Stupid & petty on both sides.

[Tempest]

24. It's stupid and petty on only one side, the administration's side

Pelosi's not even involved.

The request was made by the Senate's Sergeant at Arms, not by anyone from Pelosi's office.

[anotherdrew]

11. if Hastert had a plane to make it home without refueling, she should get one too

do we REALLY want her landing and taking off 4 or 5 times each trip? that is the most dangerous part of flying.

maybe a private charter would be best?

[goclark]

14. She needs exactly what Hastart the Bastart gets!

[atreides1]

18. No, she'll just have to refuel

If it's a military plane then she can refuel at any military base with an airfield, and with the maximum range on the type of aircraft that Hastert was assigned, it would only have to refuel once
not 4 or 5 times!

And she can take off and land at military airfields, which are one of the most secure areas on a military base.

[Psephos]

12. The plane she wants emits 50 tons of CO2 per SF/DC roundtrip

WTF?

She can't make do with the one that only emits 20 tons per roundtrip?

Is she tone-deaf on the symbolism here?

Peace.

[Rose Siding]

21. stopping along the way to refuel poses unnecessary security risks

snip>
She said reports filtering out into the media regarding inquiries about the use of a military plane nearly the size of Air Force One for her travel to and from Washington, D.C., shows a "misrepresentation that could only be coming from the administration ... one would wonder why the practice deemed to be necessary from a security standpoint would be mischaracterized in the press."
...
House Sergeant at Arms Bill Livingood, who is responsible for the speaker's security,....suggested Pelosi, who is second in the line of presidential succession, inquire about the use of a military plane. According to sources involved in the talks with Pentagon officials and Livingood, Pelosi needs a large enough aircraft to fly directly from Washington, D.C., to her home in San Francisco since stopping along the way to refuel poses unnecessary security risks.
...
Pelosi said Wednesday her inquiry about taking members of Congress and others along for the ride had "nothing to do with family and friends and everything to do with security."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3100566&mesg_id=3100566

[Psephos]

26. Riiiiiiiigggggghhhhttt.

If you think this is about security, you are in for a string of disappointments.

IMO, of course. :-)

Peace.

[wakeme2008]

13. Am I missing something

http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=87

General Characteristics
Primary Function: C-20B/H, special air and operational support airlift missions
Builder: Gulfstream Aerospace Corp.
Power Plant: C-20B, two Rolls-Royce Spey Mark 511-8 turbofan engines;C-20H, two Rolls-Royce Tay Mark 611-8 turbofan engines
Thrust: C-20B, 11,400 pounds each engine; C-20H, 13,850 pounds each engine
Length: C-20B, 83 feet, 2 inches (25.4 meters); C-20H, 88 feet, 4 inches (26.9 meters)
Height: 24 feet, 6 inches (7.5 meters)
Wingspan: 77 feet, 10 inches (23.7 meters)
Speed: 576 mph (501 nautical miles per hour) maximum
Maximum Takeoff Weight: C-20B, 69,700 pounds (31,610 kilograms); C-20H, 74,600 pounds (33,832 kilograms)
Range: C-20B, 4,250 miles (3,698 nautical miles) long-range; C-20H, 4,850 miles (4,220 nautical miles) long range
Ceiling: 45,000 feet (13,716 meters)
Load: 12 passengers
Unit Cost: All models, $29.4 (fiscal 1998 constant dollars)
Crew: Five (pilot, copilot, flight engineer, communication system operator, flight attendant)
Date Deployed: C-20B, 1988; C-20H, 1992
Inventory: C-20B, Active force, 5; ANG, 0; Reserve, 0
C-20H, Active force, 2; ANG, 0; Reserve, 0

[Taoschick]

15. It will only hold 12 passengers

This isn't a non-stop fuel issue. After Sept 11th, Congress set aside a C20-B specifically for the Speaker of the House.

[slackmaster]

20. What about Global Warming? Shouldn't we all be encouraging telecommuting?

I'm just asking.

[Tempest]

22. Pelosi DID NOT make the request

The request came from the Senate's Sergeant at Arms.

[happyslug]

23. Could the problem be the Air Force do NOT have one to spare?

Remember the C-20 used by former Speaker Hastert was a short range aircraft NOT capable of going across the Atlantic (Except with stops in Newfound land, Iceland and Scotland). Pelosi has to traval across the WHOLE length of the US, which means if she want a aircraft that can go non-stop on such a trip. The problem is that such a plane is also capable of flying non-stop across the Atlantic.

Remember we are fighting a war in Iraq, which is being supported by massive air shipment (Basically to avoid hostile ground fire in Iraq itself, but also to speed up personnel and flight transport between the US and Iraq). While most such transport is being performed by traditional Air Force Cargo Planes (C-130s, C-5s, C-17s etc) some of the transport needs are being performed by converted civilian planes (Mostly larger Trans-Continental capable planes like the Boeing 757 etc).

Once you think about it and HOW strain our military is to support Bush's mis-advantage in Iraq, it is perfectly possible that the Air Force just does NOT have any large transcontinental Civilian Type plane to provide transportation for Polosi. Remember such a plane would have to be reserved for the personal use of Polosi, on call 24 hour per day if needed. While on hold for Pelosi the plane could be used for short range transport within the US, but could NOT be used to ship Personnel or equipment to Iraq for such a trip would take it away from Pelosi for days on end. As to the C-20, its range was so limited it is useless as a supply/flight/personnel plane for Iraq thus supplying such a plane to Hastert was not a problem, but I have my doubts if the Air Force has a larger plane to spare from its Air-lift mission to provide a plane for Polos.

[ShortnFiery]

27. She should get the EXACT jet ole Denny Hastert was given - refuel at an USAF base 1x each trip. n/t

[happyslug]

28. I would accept that if the AIr Force would admit it has a large plane shortage.

But the Air Force is saying it has all the Civilian type planes its needs, but just does NOT WANT to provide Pelosi a Plane that can take her home in one flight.

Remember when Hastert had his plane, it was capable of flying him to his home district WITHOUT STOPPING, why should Pelosi not get the same treatment. If it was impossible (Do to a lack of Planes) I would accept it, but that is NOT want the Aid Force is saying. The Administration is saying Pelosi has to make do with the same plane as Hastert, knowing that given her district, the plane is NO LONGER CAPABLE OF DOING WHAT IT IS SUPPOSE TO BE DOING (i.e. providing security and time on task to the Speaker of the House). That is WRONG without justification.

I suspect that this administration is doing this Deliberately, so punish Pelosi for being Speaker (And to punish the Democrats for winning Congress). This is the small spiteful thing I expect from over-aged teenagers that Bush and Company have shown themselves to be since the election of 2000.

[Taoschick]

29. They only have

3 planes larger than the Gulfstream III. Those planes are used by members of Congress, administration officials and cabinet members. The Speaker will not be inconvenienced by getting a free trip home for her, family members and a few staff by having to possibly stop and refuel.