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paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:29 AM
Original message
The 9/11 Story That Got Away
Judith Miller (of all people!) talks about the 9/11 warning story from the summer of 2001 that the New York Times considered putting on the front page but ultimately failed to report on at all. It also involves the NSA, which is interesting given the new CIA Director nominee Michael Hayden was the head of the NSA at the time.

http://www.alternet.org/story/36388 /

Here's the crux of it, IMHO, from Miller's mouth, talking about the July 4th weekend before 9/11:

"But I did manage to have a conversation with a source that weekend. The person told me that there was some concern about an intercept that had been picked up. The incident that had gotten everyone's attention was a conversation between two members of Al Qaida. And they had been talking to one another, supposedly expressing disappointment that the United States had not chosen to retaliate more seriously against what had happened to the Cole. And one Al Qaida operative was overheard saying to the other, 'Don't worry; we're planning something so big now that the U.S. will have to respond.'

"And I was obviously floored by that information. I thought it was a very good story: (1) the source was impeccable; (2) the information was specific, tying Al Qaida operatives to, at least, knowledge of the attack on the Cole; and (3) they were warning that something big was coming, to which the United States would have to respond. This struck me as a major page one-potential story.

---

I should also point out that it's not that surprising to see Judith Miller's name pop up here, because she was the New York Times' most prominent reporter on terrorism related issues for years. She wrote a series on al-Qaeda in January 2001 that later won her a Pulitzer Prize. She had a good reputation then, and believe it or not, she actually worked for liberal outlets like the Progressive and NPR for years before going all neocon.

What's interesting is why didn't she reveal this almost story until now? Obviously, she and the New York Times were protecting the Bush administration's reputation. In fact, the New York Times even went so far as to remove an interesting story about al-Qaeda they'd published on September 9, 2001 immediately after 9/11. Until this day, if you try to access this story through their web archive you are sent to another story by the same article written shortly after 9/11.

So, if that's so, why is she coming out with this information now? Given that it knocks the NSA and Hayden is up for confirmation as head of the CIA, I don't think that's just a coincidence. Why she would be against his nomination I don't know, maybe the power faction she's allied with these days doesn't like him for some reason.
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paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:31 AM
Response to Original message
1. Here's my entry about the article the NYT "forgot"
Edited on Thu May-18-06 05:48 AM by paulthompson
September 9, 2001: New York Times Reports bin Laden ‘Promises More Attacks’; Article Will Be Removed Shortly After 9/11

Just two days before 9/11, the New York Times publishes an article on their website examining the threat of an al-Qaeda attack on US interests. The article focuses on a videotape made by bin Laden which was released in June 2001 (see June 19, 2001). The article notes that “When the two-hour videotape surfaced last June, it attracted little attention, partly because much of it was spliced from previous bin Laden interviews and tapes. But since then the tape has proliferated on Islamic Web sites and in mosques and bazaars across the Muslim world.” It further notes that in the video, bin Laden “promises more attacks.” Referring to the bombing of the USS Cole in Yemen, he says, “The victory of Yemen will continue.” He promises to aid Palestinians fighting Israel, an important shift in emphasis from previous pronouncements. He also praises the Taliban, suggesting that previous reports of a split between bin Laden and the Taliban were a ruse. The article comments, “With his mockery of American power, Mr. bin Laden seems to be almost taunting the United States.” (New York Times, 9/9/01) Curiously, shortly after 9/11, the New York Times will remove the article from their website archive and redirect all links from the article’s web address, http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/09/international/asia/09OSAM.html, to the address of another article written by the same author shortly after 9/11, http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/12/international/12OSAM.html. (Note the dates contained within the addresses.)

---

By the way, you can still try the top link and watch your browser get redirected to the story in the second link. Talk about a cowardly newspaper!

I'd also point out that if Miller's latest account is true, what does that tell us about how hard the 9/11 Commission tried to find the truth? Why didn't they uncover this NSA warning after 9/11? Miller says "everyone" in power was talking about it. So that means pretty much "everyone" has been lying their asses off about just how much warning they'd been given before 9/11. But that shouldn't be a big surprise.

Also, there was already a thread on a Raw Story article about this article coming up, but I'm starting a new thread so people can go directly to the new article instead of an article about the article. Kudos to Raw Story, though, for bringing this story to wider attention.
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Cooley Hurd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:58 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Kudos to you, Paul...
Great catch, and a tidy synopsis of the compliant media.:thumbsup:
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eek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:53 AM
Response to Reply #1
9. I *knew* there had been such an article! Thanks
for this link.

I have looked for this for years now, to no avail.

I so clearly recall walking West on East 29th street, just off Park Avenue South and pointing out the article to my S.O.*

The article had an above-the-fold photo of OBL. We were laughing (cynically) that the Administration obviously needed a new Bogie Man and they must have got this guy from
Central Casting.
We thought he looked like some actor wearing a terrorist costume.

I looked for the article right after the attacksbut we'd recycled the paper and I never could find the article online.


Thanks. for posting this.

*(only pointing out the specifics to illustrate how clearly I recall the event)
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Festivito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:35 AM
Response to Reply #9
18. And to think that libraries dropped keeping paper as too expensive.
We need a better Internet method of retention.

ASIDE: Another, now locked, DU thread on today's revelation:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2291666#2291966
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stop the bleeding Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:14 AM
Response to Reply #1
12. this is very interesting
the research at DU and on the internets never ceases to amaze me.

Thank you, lets see what comes out of this.
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #12
96. this is why I troll
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ColonelTom Donating Member (415 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:47 AM
Response to Reply #1
25. Text of the article is archived here
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FighttheFuture Donating Member (748 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #25
58. How curious... can't connect! Is it down because of traffic or NSA?
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #58
93. no connection...hmmmm
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Faryn Balyncd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #25
83. Working link to Sept 9 story the NYT scrubbed - in Google cache
For some reason the link in Comment # 25 --- http://archive.democrats.com/view.cfm?id=5942 link to a Democrats.com archived copy of the original September 9, 2001 New York Times article (which the New York Times scrubbed from their archives) --- is a dead link (and leads to a "This page can not be displayed" notice).

But the Google cache of this democrats.com page, containing the original September 9, 2001 article by John F. Burns for the New York Times (entitled, "On Videotape, Bin Laden Charts a Violent Future") can still be accessed at http://72.14.209.104/search?q=cache:eNg7X0fJQzcJ:democrats.com/view.cfm%3Fid%3D5942+%22By+JOHN+F.+BURNS+%22++++%22september+9,+2001%22&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1 .

At the present time, you can still get this (from Google cache) by Googling the following query:

"By JOHN F. BURNS " "september 9, 2001"

and then clicking "Cached" on the following democrats.com page, (which is currently the first item displaed for this query):

"Democrats.com Exclusive: To Protect Top Bureaucrats, NY Times ...September 9, 2001 On Videotape, Bin Laden Charts a Violent Future By JOHN F. BURNS The image on the grainy videotape is mesmerizing: a tall, slim, ...
democrats.com/view.cfm?id=5942 - 21k - Cached - Similar pages"


* * * *


You might want to archive this Google cached page (which contains the original scrubbed article), so a record of this article will still exist in the event that the original article becomes unavailable on the net.



* * * *

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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #83
88. Thanks!!!!
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cynthia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #25
131. unbelievable
Bush & Co should have been on this guy's case for months, all summer at the very least. What an incompetent boob! IMPEACH him!
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:17 AM
Response to Reply #1
34. Ashcroft Flying High

They got out of DC, they stayed away from commercial jets - they knew something was coming. But they didn't try to stop it.

___________________________________________________


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/main303601.shtml

Ashcroft Flying High

WASHINGTON, July 26, 2001

Fishing rod in hand, Attorney General John Ashcroft left on a weekend trip to Missouri Thursday afternoon aboard a chartered government jet, reports CBS News Correspondent Jim Stewart.

In response to inquiries from CBS News over why Ashcroft was traveling exclusively by leased jet aircraft instead of commercial airlines, the Justice Department cited what it called a "threat assessment" by the FBI, and said Ashcroft has been advised to travel only by private jet for the remainder of his term.

"There was a threat assessment and there are guidelines. He is acting under the guidelines," an FBI spokesman said. Neither the FBI nor the Justice Department, however, would identify what the threat was, when it was detected or who made it.

A senior official at the CIA said he was unaware of specific threats against any Cabinet member, and Ashcroft himself, in a speech in California, seemed unsure of the nature of the threat.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

www.msnbc.com/news/907379.asp?0cv=KA01

The Secrets of September 11
The White House is battling to keep a report on the terror attacks secret. Does the 2004 election have anything to do with it?

April 30 Even as White House political aides plot a 2004 campaign plan designed to capitalize on the emotions and issues raised by the September 11 terror attacks, administration officials are waging a behind-the-scenes battle to restrict public disclosure of key events relating to the attacks.

****

Some sources who have read the still-secret congressional report say some sections would not play quite so neatly into White House plans. One portion deals extensively with the stream of U.S. intelligence-agency reports in the summer of 2001 suggesting that Al Qaeda was planning an upcoming attack against the United Statesand implicitly raises questions about how Bush and his top aides responded. One such CIA briefing, in July 2001, was particularly chilling and prophetic. It predicted that Osama bin Laden was about to launch a terrorist strike in the coming weeks, the congressional investigators found. The intelligence briefing went on to say: The attack will be spectacular and designed to inflict mass casualties against U.S. facilities or interests. Attack preparations have been made. Attack will occur with little or no warning.

The substance of that intelligence report was first disclosed at a public hearing last September by staff director Hill. But at the last minute, Hill was blocked from saying precisely who within the Bush White House got the briefing when CIA director Tenet classified the names of the recipients. (One source says the recipients of the briefing included Bush himself.) As a result, Hill was only able to say the briefing was given to senior government officials.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&node...

Summer Spinning
To GOP, Vacation Boosted Bush Agenda; To Democrats, Voters See a Shirk Ethic
Aug 29, <2001>

<snip>The White House had announced that Bush would stay at his 1,600-acre ranch in Crawford from Aug. 4 through Labor Day on Sept. 3, a 31-day stretch that would have broken a modern record for a presidential vacation, held by Richard M. Nixon for a 30-day trip to San Clemente, Calif., in 1969. News reports played up the record, and a Gallup Poll found that 55 percent of respondents thought Bush's vacation was too long.

The length of the trip revived old questions about Bush's work ethic, and the poll and the news coverage caused consternation in the White House. Aides said they had planned an ambitious schedule for Bush as long ago as late June, but reporters were not told about it, even after they landed here. The White House, suddenly defensive, took every opportunity to show Bush on the go and even created a "Western White House" logo for the briefing room at Crawford Elementary School. Bush revealed that his ranch had new video conferencing equipment for keeping in touch with his national security team.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

www.jacksonholenews.com/Archives/NewsArchive/2001/01081...

News story - Aug. 15, 2001
A Working Vacation
Vice President Cheney plans to fish, travel during month-long valley sojourn.
By Angus M. Thuermer Jr.

Vice President Dick Cheney took time off from his month-long working vacation Monday to outline his plans for August in Jackson Hole and to reflect on "an amazing year."

Cheney, who will live at his Teton Pines home about six miles west of Jackson until Labor Day, defended his energy policy, supported a local decision to limit drilling around the Gros Ventre Wilderness, recalled a life of service in Washington and said his health problems are not affecting his ability to fish for trout on his favorite Western waters.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Bridget Burke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #34
70. About the same time that pilots were banned from carrying guns...
Back in the days of common, relatively "peaceful" hijackings, pilots were allowed to carry guns in the cockpit. Not many ever did.

Personally, I'd rather hire armed guards, if necessary, & let the crews concentrate on flying.

However, I wonder why guns in the cockpit were banned in July 2001?

For decades, up through the 1980s, some pilots carried guns on board--at first to protect the U.S. mail and then to combat hijackings. Although the practice petered out, the government did not formally ban it until July 2001.

http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/08/26/time.pilots/index.html

(I'd never heard about "protecting the mail." But I remembered this rather odd little "coincidence.")



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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:52 AM
Response to Original message
2. The bu$h regime LET 9/11 happen
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:39 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. LIHOP, for sure if this was indeed going on...
I'll take that thought to my grave.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #8
17. LIHOP, at a minimum, IMHO.
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Peter Frank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #17
104. Assisted LI(E)HOP...

...heavily assisted.



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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #17
122. Certainly, They Knew!
It's obvious! Sadly, sadly so...
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #8
124. ...
You're not alone with that thought. Many I know do, self-included.
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anotherdrew Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #2
62. that is exactly what this story strongly supports
why else did bush have his FBI squelching investigations, refusing to even take things to FISA? Bush needs to be impeached, convicted and jailed for life (if he makes it to jail in one piece).
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anotherdrew Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #62
64. so say nothing of the clearly CIA linked huffman aviation and Rudy Deckers
this is all so fucked up
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #2
95. yes, they 'let it roll'-I remember an old interview w/Richard
Clarke (after he left the WH)he basically said re: 9-11 (paraphrase)"The Saudi's got a freebee".
The inference was financial, that the bush cartel & associates had screwed them on some major $ deals over the years.
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papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:59 AM
Response to Original message
4. the media self censorship (or control by the RW?) is a stain on journalism
Edited on Thu May-18-06 06:00 AM by papau
But they will never admit that fact.

Caro's (Carolyn Kay MakeThemAccountable.com) point on this is well taken -

"Was it due to incompetence, or was it purposeful? It could only have been one or the other. If it was purposeful, the administration was providing itself the new Pearl Harbor that the Project for the New American Century said would be necessary to scare the American people into becoming militaristic. And giving up our freedoms."

I'd love to see a media discussion on that paragraph - but I am not holding my breath.


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deminks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:06 AM
Response to Original message
5. Judy is up to her eyeballs in this. K&R nt
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:23 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. one weird thing I noticed about her
In my research, I came across a mention that in 1993, she personally witnessed the torture of a Hamas suspect in an Israeli prison. She wrote about what the suspect confessed in a New York Times article at the time, but failed to mention her direct presence there. She happened to mention it years later, though. Very strange. Obviously this supports your suggestion of her having close Israeli ties.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #13
21. It's no secret that she was close to Gilon
Edited on Thu May-18-06 07:42 AM by leveymg
-- they shared a common interest in an Israeli Archeological Institute, which they discussed as the FBI taped their conversation that ended up in the Franklin indictment -- and that may have other implications that haven't been revealed.

Her role with Libby on Plame was much more proactive than it's been portrayed by either of them. She was a strategist for WHIG and had a direct line to elements within Mossad that were fabricating evidence of Iran and Iran WMDs. That's why Fitz had her jailed - the CIA and FBI wanted more details that only she and her handlers knew about.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:43 AM
Response to Reply #11
22. I suspect that she may also be part of the NeoCon,...
...Pentagon-based intell group known as OSI/OSP. Too many connections between her stories in the NY Times and what the OSI/OSP was doing to to make everyone think that Iraq had WMDs.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:18 AM
Response to Original message
6. "Why is she coming out with this information now? " Warrantless domestic
Edited on Thu May-18-06 06:43 AM by leveymg
surveillance was being conducted by NSA before 9/11, and the CIA was running a domestic counter-terrorism operation involving the principal 9/11 hijackers, whom they had tracked as they entered the U.S., intentionally keeping the FBI national security unit out of the loop. All of this was (is) illegal. The main contours are coming out now because 1) the Bush-Cheney gang are going out the door; and 2) a lot of intelligence people are tired of the lies that only protect the Bush-Cheney gang and a few Congressional leaders, who also knew in general terms that the Agency was running high-risk warrantless domestic operations.

The Flt. 77 hijackers and Atta's roommate were also involved in planning the Cole attack, and the CIA and NSA tracked the former as they entered the US on 1/15/00 after the planning summit. The FBI liasison at CIA Counterterrorism Center was ordered to hold back a cable to the FBI national security unit in NY.

By running a domestic operation without the FBI and without FISA warrants, the CIA and NSA broke the law, and the whole operation went bad after Bush refused to roll up the al-Qaida cells, as Tenet was urging. That's why they covered it up, and everyone responsible wrapped themselves in the lie that there was no warning of an attack plot. These facts are all on the official record, which makes the truth sort of an open secret.

See, Scoop: UQ Wire: THE CRIMES OF 9/11 (Part 4)
In early summer 2001 , US officials received numerous warnings from domestic and foreign intelligence agencies that al-Qaeda terrorists planned ...

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0310/S00257.htm

Hi, Paul.
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phoebe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #6
75. Berlusconi/Bush helicopter deal has the same people all over it.
Deal was used as a possible payoff for fake yellow cake story. Go to GD politics and read up on that story - it's an eye opener..
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FloridaPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:22 AM
Response to Original message
7. More attacks - plural. Remember the DC sniper? They had DC in
total panic and most of the rest of America in a small panic. It's easy to cross the borders. If bin Ladin really wanted to bring this country to it's knees, it would be very easy. A bomb here. A bomb there. Something smells.
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Olney Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:00 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. At first I thought you meant that the sniper attacks were occurring
at the time right before 9/11 (the sniper attacks started 10/2002)- then
I understood that you were using them as an example of how vulnerable we are.
You are so right- I live in Maryland and we were all walking around looking over
our shoulders while the killers were on a rampage.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:09 AM
Response to Reply #10
32. ''Caught like a duck in a noose.''
Once the Sheriff had Corporate McPravda play that line, the killers fell asleep at some rest area and got busted.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/24/national/main526811.shtml
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Caution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:27 AM
Response to Original message
14. But I thought that 9/11 was MIHOP??? You mean MIHOP is fantasy???
Gee, I'm shocked. :sarcasm:
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:39 AM
Response to Reply #14
20. Knowing what we now know about the NeoCon Junta,....
...why would anyone automatically discount MIHOP?

IMHO, if true, this article proves LIHOP at the very least.
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wordpix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:28 AM
Response to Reply #20
38. "LIHOP at the very least" OR total incompetence & dereliction of duty:
snip:
"Even that weekend, there was lot else going on. There was always a lot going on at the White House, so to a certain extent, there was that kind of 'cry wolf' problem. But I got the sense that part of the reason that I was being told of what was going on was that the people in counter-terrorism were trying to get the word to the president or the senior officials through the press, because they were not able to get listened to themselves. :puke:
snip

Friggin *Admin was too busy vacationing to heed warnings from the likes of professional Richard Clarke and an August 2001 PDB entitled, "Bin Laden Determined to Strike Within the US." The incompetence and dereliction of duty is enough to impeach this whole dumbass BushCo Admin, with or without LIHOP/MIHOP.
:grr:

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Maven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:13 AM
Response to Reply #38
82. "Incompetence" implies failure to act.
In this case, there was action to obstruct the efforts of officials and institutions to prevent the attacks.

LIHOP at the very least.
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MetaTrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #20
44. For me, MIHOP doesn't mean covert ops in dozens of govt agencies
But rather just a little under-the-table deal involving airline tickets and box cutters between the Bush family and their good business partners the bin Ladens...
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goforit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #20
129. This was sloppy planning! It had to been premeditated only by PNACrs
Every piece of evidence points to MIHOP!!!

And of all the people that could of prevented the planes
from hitting the WTC was the Airforce.

And with leaders like Hayden, premeditation/mihop is their
only motive.

They committed mass murder...bottom line!
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nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #129
148. Understanding the psychology, or mindset if you will.................
It occurs to me that these freaks, should say control freaks, would never have done a LIHOP. The laws a probability are not in that favor at any rate. With all the other things we are now finding out about and have found out about in the near past, like doesn't occur to anybody we are just catching glimpses of the slithering large funk that is plodding about. A MIHOP in the very least You can also bet by the denial of bushco on the not listening into any conversation on any phone system, that is exactly what they were doing.
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maxrandb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #14
68. It's not LIHOP, or MIHOP...it's BIAITH
Pronounced "by-athe".

Bush's Incompetance Allowed It To Happen
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #68
116. I like TITSI
Too Incompetent to Stop It
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m0nkeyneck Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #68
120. HILOS
His Incompetence Assisted Osamas Strike..



:toast:





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file83 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #120
134. LOL -...wait, there is no "L", don't you mean "HIAOS"???
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m0nkeyneck Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #134
140. whoops
HILOS

His Incompetence Let Osama Strike..




:silly:
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file83 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #140
145. LOL - how about TAAFT:
They Are All Fucking Terrorists
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m0nkeyneck Donating Member (274 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #145
158. nice ;-P
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:28 AM
Response to Original message
15. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Uben Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:30 AM
Response to Original message
16. NSA leak?
Why isn't the Bush administration persuing the source of this leak like they are the one today?
Thye should put Miller in jail until she gives up her source. No?
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:50 AM
Response to Reply #16
27. Because they don't want to acknowledge that the NSA, FBI, and CIA had....
...solid information of a planned Al Qaeda attack on the U. S. If the NeoCon Junta admits that they hard concrete evidence that an attack was coming, then their whole defense about being "surprised" on 911 goes straight out the window.

That's why the NeoCons are scrambling to suppress the knowledge that the NSA was conducting widespread domestic intelligence gathering PRIOR to 911.
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:38 AM
Response to Original message
19. They knew.
The evidence is overwhelming. It's a trail a mile long. From flight school to Bush in elementary school.

But Americans don't want to believe it. Well believe it.

They not only knew, they wanted it.

They made it happen just as surely as they made JFK dead.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #19
92. Yes. I knew it the moment I saw that second plane hit the WTC...
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Nostradammit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #92
102. Yep
and yep. The line between MIHOP and LIHOP is mighty fuzzy, methinks.

The names "Bush" and "Cheney" and every one of the other PNAC slimeballs will someday live in infamy.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #102
110. Great photo. I just used that quote in a post.
Edited on Thu May-18-06 02:30 PM by BrklynLiberal
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Nostradammit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #110
138. Thanks
I keep clicking my slippers but I'm still in Oz.

Someday we'll get back to Kansas...
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Nostradammit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #110
139. Dupe
Edited on Thu May-18-06 09:59 PM by Nostradammit
Whoops.
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UpInArms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:44 AM
Response to Original message
23. July 21, 2001: FBI has Ashcroft cease flying commercial
Ashcroft Flying High

(CBS) Fishing rod in hand, Attorney General John Ashcroft left on a weekend trip to Missouri Thursday afternoon aboard a chartered government jet, reports CBS News Correspondent Jim Stewart.

In response to inquiries from CBS News over why Ashcroft was traveling exclusively by leased jet aircraft instead of commercial airlines, the Justice Department cited what it called a "threat assessment" by the FBI, and said Ashcroft has been advised to travel only by private jet for the remainder of his term.

"There was a threat assessment and there are guidelines. He is acting under the guidelines," an FBI spokesman said. Neither the FBI nor the Justice Department, however, would identify what the threat was, when it was detected or who made it.

A senior official at the CIA said he was unaware of specific threats against any Cabinet member, and Ashcroft himself, in a speech in California, seemed unsure of the nature of the threat.

<snip>

Earlier this week, the Justice Department leased a NASA-owned G-3 Gulfstream for a 6-day trip to Western states. Such aircraft cost the government more than $1,600 an hour to fly. When asked whether Ashcroft was paying for any portion of the trips devoted to personal business, a Justice Department spokeswoman declined to respond.

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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #23
28. Another solid indicator that they knew what was coming and when.
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nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #28
71. Enough pieces to prove they were actively planning to make it happen?
They keep on coming out with these flaky movies and news stories, tidbits of selective information they want to use as propaganda but all the information was long ago debunked. The corporate media seems to think they can bring about a public impetus to get the public to go in some direction but have failing for the last two or three years to an ever increasing degree.

All of this hardware and tools these establishment GOP groups have in the forms of laws, organization, agencies, policy implementation and having the corporate media megaphone at their behest yet still they have got no real traction on completion their agenda. The republicans are now doing everything they ever accused democrats of doing and so much more. I say let them continue their plan, they are doing so well with it :evilgrin:

The USA PATRIOT Act Was Planned Before 9/11
by Jennifer Van Bergen
t r u t h o u t | 20 May, 2002

Many people do not know that the USA PATRIOT Act was already written and ready to go long before September 11th. Recent criticism of Bush's admission that he had received warnings only weeks before September 11th has made it more important to understand the origins of the USAPA.

The USA PATRIOT Act - the so-called "Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism Act of 2001," a.k.a. the USAPA -- was enacted in the immediate wake of 9/11, riding a wave of fear that spread over the nation. This Act has caused much concern amongst civil rights advocates. The Administration, however, responded to such concerns by calling critics unpatriotic. Now, the White House has had a similar response to critics of Bush's recent admission of early warnings.

White House spokesman Ari Fleischer said Friday: "I think that any time anybody suggests or implies to the American people that this president had specific information that could have prevented the attacks on our country on September 11, that crosses the lines."
(snip)
http://www.truthout.org/docs_02/05.21B.jvb.usapa.911.htm
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #23
43. Willy Brown got an anonymous phone call to cancel a flight.
I believe it was Sept. 10th.

He never knew who called.

Everyone should see this video- Everyody's Gotta Learn Sometime

It's absolutely damning. Sibel Edmond's has more gag orders than any person ever. Why? What is it they don't want us to know?
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Southsideirish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #43
79. I wonder how many others received calls - we only know about his because
he came forward and told people.
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Tuesday_Morning Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #23
56. FBI knew
<snip>

July 14, 1999: Pakistani ISI Agent Promises Attack on WTC in Recorded Conversation


US government informant Randy Glass records a conversation at a dinner attended by him, illegal arms dealers Diaa Mohsen, Mohammed Malik, a former Egyptian judge named Shireen Shawky, and ISI agent Rajaa Gulum Abbas, held at a restaurant within view of the WTC. FBI agents pretending to be restaurant customers sit at nearby tables. Abbas says he wants to buy a whole shipload of weapons stolen from the US military to give to bin Laden. Abbas points to the WTC and says, Those towers are coming down. This ISI agent later makes two other references to an attack on the WTC. Abbas also says, Americans the enemy, and We would have no problem with blowing up this entire restaurant because it is full of Americans. The meeting is secretly recorded, and parts are shown on television in 2003.


<snip>

more and links to original articles at:
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/entity.jsp?id=1521846767-993
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #56
63. Some FBI were cut out of the loop, while others knew quite a lot.
Edited on Thu May-18-06 10:08 AM by leveymg
Colleen Rowley and her colleagues tried desperately to get FISA warrants -- had the CIA cooperated, 9/11 would likely have never happened. John O'Neill and those under him at the NY National Security Unit office also pressed the CIA for information about al-Midhar and al-Hazmi during the spring and summer of 2001, but to little avail. Again, they were thwarted in getting warrants to track down the al-Qaeda cell members they knew were inside the U.S. O'Neill made so much of a fuss that he was set up and forced out of the Bureau - there's a reason he took the job of head of security at the WTC just weeks before the attack, and died there on 9/11.

Those who were in charge of the office at FBI headquarters that actually seeks warrants seemed to be actively stalling the efforts of agents on the ground who had become aware of UBL cells. Very little has been made known about the role and knowledge of the FBI Directors Freed and Mueller, but it seems implausible that they were kept entirely in the dark by Tenet, DoD and the WH.
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reprobate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #63
89. Why is it that every time something goes wrong and US is harmed, the


CIA seems to be involved armpit deep in the plot? They were tied to the mafia in the JFK and RFK assassinations. They were responsible for the Bay of Pigs fiasco going bad. Then there was Operation Northwoods. etc. etc. etc.

And every time, the wants and needs of the citizens of the United States are not just ignored, but actively harmed. If I ran a company that had one division that created such chaos, that division would be toast and all it's employees and operations replaced. But then I'm just a citizen, and not privy to the machinations of those that run this country.

Of course, that begs the question as to just who is directing the shadow government that is the Central Intelligence Agency?

No one seems to know.
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pauldp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #89
106. Who controls the CIA? That's easy.
The people who control the energy and defense industries. Check out "Confessions of an Economic Hit Man"
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pauldp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #56
80. Times of India reported the ISI paid Atta right before 911
Porter Goss and Senator Graham, chairmen of the House and Senate intell
committees were meeting with General Ahmad on 911. Ahmad according
to Indian intelligence was the ISI operative who
paid Mohamed Atta $100,000 in the days leading up
to 911. Goss and Graham had also met with the ISI
in Pakistan in the summer of 2001. This information was ignored
by the 911 Commission Report. Goss and Graham
headed up the first congressional inquiry into 911.

Just a coincidence?

Last I checked we invaded Iraq not Pakistan

I will try to find the original Times of India link.

This can also be found at cooperativeresearch.org
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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #80
149. Seems like 9/11 was a joint venture
between * and his "allies".

The "allies" did the neocons a favour by providing the "new Pearl Harbor" needed for their pre-emptive war policy against Iraq. In return the "allies" get extra resources for the "war on terror".
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pauldp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 07:28 AM
Response to Reply #149
151. It's a win win situation.
You provide us with an enemy and we'll cut you in on the war profiteering.
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:46 AM
Response to Original message
24. Monster lies and unmasterful shams and betrayals.
Edited on Thu May-18-06 07:47 AM by higher class
For now, I accuse prominent lawyers who sat on the what-went-wrong Commission with fraud - including Richard Ben-Veniste and a couple of others who I thought were trustworty.

We can't put it past this woman, Judith Miller, to lie to us. But, it may be proven that she is a national traitor. She and her paper certainly operated on behalf of PNAC and Israel, not us.

No matter what the truth, our country is a living sham. We appear to be citizens that are payiing and will be paying heavily for shams and deceptions perpetrated on us.

It appears many Democrats are complicit.

Sidepoint - observe how long it is going to take for this episode to be reported and 'explained' on PNAC tv and radio. Then observe how thick the smoke is and how the mirrors are arranged.

We are fools in their hands. They hold nothing but contempt for us.

Yes, the lies are slinking through, wrapping around, and twisting so tightly that our nation is suffocating with lies.

The citizens of this country, as ignorant and distracted as are, do not deserve PNAC and the barons who rule us and rob us blind.
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reprobate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #24
91. HC, I feel your pain. But it's been true almost since the beginning of


the country. Read Zinn and Chomsky. There's nothing new about what's going on. The one thing that makes it so effective I believe, is the fascistic entwinement of government and media.

This is due to only one thing in my mind. That is the control of government by the corporations, thru the criminal use of campaign contribution bribery of elected officials. And the control of government by corporations is another key landmark in the slide toward fascism.

Unless something can be done about our campaign financing mess, I'm afraid its RIP for our once proud nation.

What a shame for us and the world.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #24
135. I knew it was gamed as soon as Lee Hamilton was named to head
the panel as the deignated Democratic leader. He's been whitewashing for the Bush administration for 25 years.

Remember how the panel was obstructed, underfunded, slow walked, and stonewalled? If Bush was surprised, why didn't he immediate call for an investigation and put the full resources of the US government into getting to the root cause.

Remember that Kissinger was Bush's 1st choice. Remember that Kean was business partners with bin Moufaz. The only 9/11 Commission was a joke designed not to investigate the root cause of 9/11. What happened to gittin' OBL and why weren't those financial swamps drained?

They knew and they let it happen.

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pberq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:47 AM
Response to Original message
26. Kick & Nominated - thanks Paul
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:06 AM
Response to Original message
29. that would explain the month-long VACATIONS George & Dick took
I still maintain they got out of town because they knew something was about to come down. The month-long vacations were unplanned, unprecedented, and politically risky. I think their sole purpose was to get themselves out of harm's way.
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FighttheFuture Donating Member (748 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #29
61. Yup, even then, Jeb activates National Guard in FL few days before...
in case Martial Law is required. Little George still does not come back to Washington. Instead, he goes to his remedial reading class in FL!

Yeah, no doubt, they, at the very least, let it happen. I suspect they aided and abetted, also. Remember, Bin Laden was a CIA asset all through the 80's.

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NoFederales Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:07 AM
Response to Original message
30. Story That Got Away, or Another Miller Lie?
I'm going fishing for the real thing; minnow, meet crappie, say hello to skillet.

I do not believe anything Miller baits us with.

NoFederales
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Lib Grrrrl Donating Member (801 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:08 AM
Response to Original message
31. Hmmm...Seems To Me
that standard library practice is to keep newspapers for a while, then send them to be microfilmed. Anyone here in the NYC area got a chance to go to the NY Public Library, and confirm this?

Would be nice to see someone get a printout of that story from a microfilm machine...and then scan that into their computer...and post it...and publicly ask the NY Times why their archive conveniently won't show this story anymore!

Could embarrass the shit outta the NY Times...and, just lately, the partisan bastards deserve it, too.

Liberal media, my ass!!
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #31
35. anyone with a NYPL library card can access NY Times archives online
Paul PM me and I'll give you my card number.
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paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #35
45. If you're talking about the article I mention in reply #1...
I believe it was a web-only article. Democrats.com had a big back and forth with the New York Times over them making it disappear. Copies of that discussion are floating around the web. I have access to the complete New York Times archive and it's not there, either.
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Lib Grrrrl Donating Member (801 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #45
115. Crap! Spinless Bastards!! I Wish That Had Seen Actual Print!!
We'd have the fuckers over a barrel then!

Goddamned liberal media!
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yodermon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:10 AM
Response to Original message
33. hmm.. is this retaliation against Libby (et. al)
for trying to subpoena all her records? see her response here: http://talkleft.com/Millerreply.pdf (pdf link).

Methinks the aspens have a case of root-rot.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:21 AM
Response to Reply #33
36. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
bigscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:21 AM
Response to Reply #33
37. stupid question
and I apologize - but what is MIHOP?
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wordpix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #37
39. made it happen on purpose and LIHOP= let it happen on purpose
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CrazyOrangeCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #37
42. Made It Happen On Purpose
PNAC wanted a "Pearl Harbor"event.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:34 AM
Response to Original message
40. Re: The Cole Attack and Able Danger
Edited on Thu May-18-06 08:40 AM by leveymg
The following extract is from the Alternet article. Bear in mind two things about the Cole attack. 1) That operation was planned in January 2000 in Kuala Lumpur by a group that included the Flt. 77 hiajckers and Atta's roommate. The CIA learned about it when the NSA intercepted calls from Nawaf Al-Hazmi and Khalid al-Midahar as they prepared to travel to Kuala Lumpur -- that pair would go on to hijack Flt. 77 that crashed into the Pentagon. 2) Al-Hazmi and Al-Midhar entered the US at LAX on 1/15/00 - the CIA noted that entry, and the FBI liason at CTC was ordered to withhold a cable to the FBI national security office in NY commanded by John O'Neill.

Despite the fact that CIA knew the pair were in the US, the Agency never requested FISA warrants to intercept their calls. Al-Hazmi, a Yemeni, left that summer and went on to play an active role in the Cole operation,returning to the US in March 2001. His partner, al-Midhar, stayed in the US and met up with the other main hijackers on several occasions, and received money from sources including the Saudi embassy and a Indonesian businessman who also gave $40,000 to Moussaoui. Zakaria had stayed at the same house in Kuala Lumpur owned by the businessman where the al-Qaeda planning summit had occurred in January 2000, a meeting the CIA had monitored along with "a half dozen allied agencies".

How did Able Danger learn about the so-called Brooklyn Cell? Able Danger had access to classified DoD files, which presumably included the NSA intercepts of al-Hazmi and al-Midhar. Quite clearly, if surveillance on the the Flt. 77 hijackers (and there's no plausible reason that monitoring wouldn't have continued), the Able Danger project had advance warning of the attack operations on U.S. military targets -- the USS Cole, and likely also the Pentagon. Under the force protection exception, NSA could have conducted warrantless taps on the al-Qaeda cell inside the U.S., and that would be in the domestic NSA intercept files available to Able Danger.

Despite the fact that the intended attacks on U.S. military targets would be well-understood, for some reason that still hasn't been explained, President George W. Bush refused to have the pair and their al-Qaeda cellmates inside the US -- known to Able Danger as the "Brooklyn Cell" -- arrested during the summer of 2001. See, http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/9/28/121022/933

Bear that in mind when you read the following: http://www.alternet.org/story/36388/

On Oct. 12, 2000, the guided missile destroyer USS Cole pulled into harbor for refueling in Aden, Yemen. Less than two hours later, suicide bombers Ibrahim al-Thawr and Abdullah al-Misawa approached the ship's port side in a small inflatable craft laden with explosives and blew a 40-by-40-foot gash in it, killing 17 sailors and injuring 39 others. The attack on the Cole, organized and carried out by Osama bin Laden's Al Qaida terrorist group, was a seminal but still murky and largely misunderstood event in America's ongoing "Long War."

Two weeks prior, military analysts associated with an experimental intelligence program known as ABLE DANGER had warned top officials of the existence of an active Al Qaida cell in Aden, Yemen. And two days before the attack, they had conveyed "actionable intelligence" of possible terrorist activity in and around the port of Aden to Gen. Pete Schoomaker, then commander in chief of the U.S. Special Operation Command (SOCOM).

The same information was also conveyed to a top intelligence officer at the U.S. Central Command (CENTCOM), headed by the newly appointed Gen. Tommy Franks. As CENTCOM commander, Franks oversaw all U.S. armed forces operations in a 25-country region that included Yemen, as well as the Fifth Fleet, to which the Cole was tasked. It remains unclear what action, if any, top officials at SOCOM and CENTCOM took in response to the ABLE DANGER warnings about planned Al Qaida activities in Aden harbor.

None of the officials involved has ever spoken about the pre-attack warnings, and a post-attack forensic analysis of the episode remains highly classified and off-limits within the bowels of the Pentagon. Subsequent investigations exonerated the Cole's commander, Kirk Lippold, but Lippold's career has been ruined nonetheless. He remains in legal and professional limbo, with a recommended promotion and new command held up for the past four years by political concerns and maneuvering.

Meanwhile, no disciplinary action was ever taken against any SOCOM or CENTCOM officials. Schoomaker was later promoted out of retirement to chief of staff, U.S. Army, and Franks went on to lead the combat operations in Afghanistan and Iraq.



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phoebe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:39 AM
Response to Reply #40
76. The Cole attack was also very good for the Bush election if u recall
Edited on Thu May-18-06 11:07 AM by phoebe
Overseas military votes were held back or "misplaced" etc., etc. as a result of this attack.

On edit, these ballots were missing postmarks and were thrown out. A lot of fuss was made by the Republicans screaming bloody murder that the "Democrats were trying to steal the election" - the old wag-the-dog scenario we have all become so familiar with.

There was a strange remark made by Bush on this matter but it quickly disappeared from the MSM - will try to locate.

Just as a reminder - here's an article about the military ballots

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=15589

Isn't it interesting that DOD's Kenneth Bacon appears to be so sorry about the mix up, denies a conspiracy and yet he is described as being Monica Lewinsky's boss who (if you follow the links) was the man who "leaked" the Linda Tripp tapes about the Clinton/Lewinsky affair. He was slated for criminal prosecution for doing so but was simply reprimanded..

Anyway - back to looking for Bush remark..
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #40
136. USS Cole attack, 10/12/00-
4 weeks before the election. I wonder how many votes got swayed by that event? Reminds me of the Iranian hostage situation.
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Rude Horner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:36 AM
Response to Original message
41. I thought this part was kinda interesting too
***And they had been talking to one another, supposedly expressing disappointment that the United States had not chosen to retaliate more seriously against what had happened to the Cole. And one Al Qaida operative was overheard saying to the other, 'Don't worry; we're planning something so big now that the U.S. will have to respond.***

So essentially this is confirmation that the Bush administration played right into their hands by their actions after 9/11, right?
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lonecentrist Donating Member (26 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #41
46. You know people. This is a big country.
Even if the government absolutley knew that a attack of unknown means was planned for the first weeks of September how could they stop it? I'm not a terrorist but if I were to attack us I can think of 100 ways in 1000 places that this attack could be successfull. Even if they suspected planes were to be hijacked the only recourse would be to basically shut down the airline industry or profile every Muslim getting on a plane in the United States. How would this board have reacted to that. All this LIHOP and MIHOP stuff is counterproductive to moving forward. Let us not forget that in 2001 we had control of the some of the intel committies and our representitives didnt help us much either.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #46
50. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #46
72. Deleted message
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #72
78. Enough with "little lemming head", please.
Maybe you blame a 5 post newbie for getting in your way. Fine. Pick on me instead. Can flame me all you want. But this person said nothing that warrants biting his or her head off and using the words "little lemming". You replied rudely to a polite post and that is not cool.
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FighttheFuture Donating Member (748 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:32 PM
Response to Reply #78
132. I am simply pointing out that ignoring the evidence at hand is...
counterproductive, not pointing it out. "Conspiracy, like "liberal" has become a negative word, when it should not be.

Main Entry: conspiracy
Pronunciation: k&n-'spir-&-sE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -cies
Etymology: Middle English conspiracie, from Latin conspirare
1 : the act of conspiring together
2 a : an agreement among conspirators b : a group of conspirators

synonym see PLOT

and to clarify conspiring:

Main Entry: conspire
Pronunciation: k&n-'spIr
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): conspired; conspiring
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French conspirer, from Latin conspirare to be in harmony, conspire, from com- + spirare to breathe
transitive senses : PLOT, CONTRIVE
intransitive senses
1 a : to join in a secret agreement to do an unlawful or wrongful act or an act which becomes unlawful as a result of the secret agreement b : SCHEME
2 : to act in harmony toward a common end <circumstances conspired to defeat his efforts>


Still, to make you happy so we can all hold hands and sing Kumbaya at the end of the day while this world approaches a man-made Armageddon, I removed the lemming allusions.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #46
86. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Amonester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:14 PM
Response to Reply #46
125. Maybe by first going to the FBI and ask (even "email to all" )...
Edited on Thu May-18-06 06:23 PM by Amonester
...if anyone "who connects into the network" had any information pending somewhere, and formally welcome them to come forward and "reply to this (or these) emails" in order to check if there was "weird" stories known to some agents out there. I am certain the Moussaoui (sp?) case would have been quickly "connected" (you know, that lazy Pilot student with a $25,000 bond that wants to learn how to fly commercial Boeing's, but absolutely refuses to take any lessons about "how to take off, and how to land" such an airplane!! Then? Eazy... Raid all flight schools, or/and connect the dots about everything "Able Danger")...

I have no doubt whatsoever that President Al Gore would have READ the August 6, 2001 PDB (unlike little king George wannabee) and that he would have acted intelligently on it, with his staff (see hint above), and that thousands upon thousands of victims would still be alive and well today... Not to mention all the other good things the real President would have accomplished (particularly, about Global Warming, and about the levees in New Orleans also).

Welcome to DU! :hi:
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FighttheFuture Donating Member (748 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #46
130. Ignoring the facts of the reality before you is counterproductive...
Conspiracies happen ALL THE TIME. Most of the time they are minor and never found out. Some do come out, however. A few off the top of my head...

  • Plan to overthrow FDR by Rich Fascists in this country
  • Bush's Granddaddy's bank trading whit the Nazi's until FDR shut them down
  • Watergate
  • "October Surprise", Reagan's team illegally negotiating with Ir anion hostage takers behind President Jimmy Carter's back to help throw the 1980 election.
  • Destruction of Labor movement started under Reagan and continued under every Republican House, Senate and now Bu$hitCo.
  • Supply Side Economics as a means of robbing from the poor and giving to the rich. David Stockholm admitted as much.
  • Greenspan -- pushing to shore up Social Security, a regressive tax on the backs of the poor and middle class; then using the surplus to hide record deficits starting under Regean on to this day; then being for raiding this real prepaid money via "privatization" (i.e. steal from the commons and give to the few). Conspiracy? You decide, I already have.
  • Personal Destruction of Bill Clinton documented in so many ways, even a book/movie "Hunting of the President"
  • Iraq War Lies
  • Swiftboating of John Kerry. Perhaps not illegal, but a conspiracy all the same.
  • Phone Jamming scandal with links right to the White House.
  • Destruction of Government as a viable tool of promoting social good and stability under Bu$hitCo
  • Agenda of creating a ruling elite over the last 40 years by Right Wing ultra conservatives through systematic weakening of laws, media ownership rules, etc.
  • Enron, Tyco, Adelphia, Goldman Sachs, etc.
  • Jack Abromoff
  • Randy Duke Cunningham
  • Tom Delay
  • Many more Repuglican criminals to come.
  • Valerie Plame
  • Our crappy, controlled corporate newsmedia. Is it criminal? If not, it should be!
  • Covering up Cheney's drunken binge and the SS preventing local Police from questioning him that night when he shot that guys face!
  • Electronic Voting -- let's face it, exit polls, once a gold standard of measuring fair elections have been wrong in the last several elections. What's the big difference? Electronic voting and compromised optical scan machines.


    Imagine what isn't known....!

    All facts and "investigations" thus far can easily support the worst possibilities and do nothing to absolve these criminals of Bu$hitCo.
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    CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 07:26 AM
    Response to Reply #46
    150. You got a lot of reading to do.
    Start with David Ray Griffin's "New Pearl Harbor".
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    leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:52 AM
    Response to Reply #41
    47. Apparently, the Cole was allowed to sail into harm's way.
    Edited on Thu May-18-06 08:54 AM by leveymg
    That isn't really so shocking when you realize that has always been the essential mission of U.S. Navy destroyers.

    What's really shocking is that the Pentagon attack and other 9/11 suicide hijackings actually occurred, given all that was known about the "Planes Operation" at the White House and at the highest levels of military and civilian intelligence.
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    sofa king Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:13 AM
    Response to Reply #41
    54. Yes, we're fighting them on ground of their own choosing.
    And by keeping George W. Bush in power, they are doing more to destroy America than any attack on our soil could achieve.
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    leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:55 AM
    Response to Original message
    48. Sounds fishy to me...sounds like more propaganda to make the phony WH 9-11
    version sound real. I think they are worried about folks catching on to the WH 9-11 conspiracy. AlQaeda, right, that's the ticket!
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    Mr. Mojo Risin Donating Member (107 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:58 AM
    Response to Original message
    49. How do we get this info out to the General Public
    The info in this post a refreshing break from all the wild eyed conspiracy theories permeating DU.

    I think this post sheds light about information, timing, culpability that history should note and never forget.

    Our country has been hijacked. MSM has failed us miserably.

    If this story could be told in a simple logical fashion somewhere big....The details are very credible. It just might get legs again.

    John Q Public is not happy. Defectors within the intel community would jump. The time is right.
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    leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:09 AM
    Response to Reply #49
    52. As Orson Wells used to say about selling wine, not "until its time"
    Most of this stuff about prior warnings has been on the public record since the Joint Intelligence Committee hearings and report published way back in October 2002. See Paul's Cooperative Research site; also, GOOGLE: Mark G. Levey

    Paul and some others have been devoting themselves to getting the facts out to the public. Some editors and writes in the MSM are well aware of what actually happened, but until recently, everyone was just plain scared shitless of Bush-Cheney and a Rovian counter-attack. Nobody wants to get fired from their cushy jobs, so it's been left to those of us who are already fired or retired to get the word out.
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    NJ_Lib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:09 AM
    Response to Original message
    51. All you have to do is look at the Chimp's face during...

    ... the reading of "My Pet Goat", when Card whispers in his ear... Does that look like the face of a shocked and wounded leader...? HA! Remember what happened when Michael Moore tried to tell everybody that the Chimp knew? He was just about leveled to the status of a madman...
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    QuettaKid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:12 AM
    Response to Reply #51
    53. not to mention the FACT that he just sat there.
    No secret service swooping in to get him out of harms way. As far as MIHOP, LIHOP at this point in time they are basically the same thing.
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    Amonester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:34 PM
    Response to Reply #53
    128. And that by staying there, he was literally endangering the ...
    the lives and well being of all the kids there!

    Imagine that, imagine that... Unless, he "knew" they were not at risk??

    That's it.
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    SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:04 PM
    Response to Reply #51
    98. i don't recall Michael Moore telling everybody the Chimp knew.
    Edited on Thu May-18-06 01:05 PM by SlavesandBulldozers
    I think you drew that conclusion yourself. I think Moore was pretty much pointing out that Bush had ties to OBL etc.

    Also the only people who thought Moore was a madman were. . .uh. . Freeper madmen.
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    RCinBrooklyn Donating Member (421 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:15 AM
    Response to Original message
    55. Oh, if Judith Miller writes it, then it must be true. CIA Asset Bi-otch.
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    thereismore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:29 AM
    Response to Original message
    57. Two words: Judith Miller. nt
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    AzDar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:40 AM
    Response to Original message
    59. Without 9/11 Bush was dead in the water. I hope America gets the
    REAL story someday....
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    Greylyn58 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:42 AM
    Response to Original message
    60. As each new story and each new outrage
    comes out about Bushco and the people who have bolstered and supported this mis-administration, I find I'm at a loss for words. I know I shouldn't be surprised any more at anything that is reported, but I think what bothers me the most is that America as a whole hasn't stood up and in one loud voice screamed ENOUGH!!! Maybe they are and it's not being reported since the majority of the MSM is still kissing Bush's ass. At this point, I guess the only thing that would boot him out would be a BJ in the WH and catching it on film.

    Seems that's the only thing that causes any outrage with the general public anymore--at least according to the MSM.





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    smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:57 AM
    Response to Original message
    65. What it all means--maybe.
    I think the fact that she's coming out with this story now is indicative of two things--neither of which have much to do with the elevation of Hayden to CIA director. First, it's a swipe at the NYT for failing to print an important story that might have lit a fire under Bushco re the al Qaida threat, which, at the time, they weren't taking seriously. Second, I think it's further evidence of a major rift between the Bushco/neocon lobes of the Republican power structure. Miller's clear message here is that Bush/Cheney weren't paying attention--and were therefore dangerously incompetent.
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    grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:58 AM
    Response to Original message
    66. thank you, Paul
    You are a true American hero and patriot.
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    No DUplicitous DUpe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:03 AM
    Response to Original message
    67. Wow, Another incredible thread on DU. Thanks to Paul.
    :kick:
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    beardown Donating Member (193 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:08 AM
    Response to Original message
    69. So Bush does listen to God.
    But as most of the results of his talking with God seem to help the terrorists he must be talking with Allah. Hold your flames, I was in Colbert mode.
    I've thrown back at the cultists that I could play their verbal games and claim that the terrorists waited until they had the right pasty in office until they unleashed their big attack so as to maximize their return on the attack. Hyperbole, meet reality.
    So why do we need to have illegal domestic spying if they don't listen to the intel they have on known terrorists? Just more evidence that the domestic spying is in the best tradition of the republican party's Nixon mold and they are spying on the people they need to spy on in order to monitor and suppress their political opponents and whistle blowers.
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    Tuesday_Morning Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:11 PM
    Response to Reply #69
    119. Nice Colbert mold
    Welcome to DU
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    robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:26 AM
    Response to Original message
    73. "Now it can be told" . Another peek in the MSM manipulating perception
    For those of you who can't believe they'd sit on Rove's indictment.
    Of course this happened - I noticed the 180 degree in the NYT coverage in day 4 after 911 - from "You a*hole" to "our wartime preznit, supported by 90% of population, bigger than Churchill, FDR + Napoleon rolled into one.
    And it worked. And emboldened them further.
    Never fprget this revelation:


    ''We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And
    while you're studying that reality -- judiciously, as you will -- we'll
    act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and
    that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors . . . and you,
    all of you, will be left to just study what we do.''
    Bush aide to Ron Suskind

    It'll keep you sane.
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    Up2Late Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:32 AM
    Response to Original message
    74. She must be part that "some of the people" Bush lost as he passed 30%
    ...on the way down. Judith Miller definitely "Jumped the Shark" a while ago.
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    Che_Nuevara Donating Member (517 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:46 AM
    Response to Original message
    77. Actually, information of this type also came down from Clinton.
    I've read several times (although I don't have sources on hand) that Clinton's advisors specifically warned Bush's that they were worried about an al Qaeda attack in the not-too-distant future. Furthermore, the planes-as-bombs theory had also already been discussed by the NSA.
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    EVDebs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:05 AM
    Response to Original message
    81. So, How Did Miller evade NSA's Operation FirstFruits spying program
    Edited on Thu May-18-06 11:07 AM by EVDebs
    on journalists ? A FOIA may be necessary, huh ? Discrimination lawsuit liberal journalists vs. conservative/neocon-shills...

    Firstfruits was instituted pre-9/11 btw.
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    SlavesandBulldozers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:31 AM
    Response to Original message
    84. Props to Paul Thompson
    Edited on Thu May-18-06 11:35 AM by SlavesandBulldozers
    long time fan. you do great work. Thanks for pointing out this update. And thanks Alternet.
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    luke_nichols Donating Member (6 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:50 AM
    Response to Original message
    85. NSA Domestic Spying
    I compiled a list of NSA Domestic Spying Articles, and hosting them on my Server here. (You know Internet News: Here one minute, and gone the next.)

    http://truth4you.no-ip.org/special/nsa.html

    I love you all! Vote DEMS!

    Luke Nichols
    Princeton, WV
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    EVDebs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:36 PM
    Response to Reply #85
    101. Miller: NSA/CIA 'Sanitized' for your protection. She is a toilet seat .
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    BuyingThyme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:21 PM
    Response to Original message
    87. She's providing cover for something or somebody.
    Never forget: Judith Miller is a terrorist. She was hired to create war against innocent people. She wouldn't hesitate to murder any one or all of you under the command of Cheney or Rumsfeld. In addition to participating in mass murder, she is also known for participating in torture and espionage.

    Judith Miller is your enemy. Don't ever forget it.
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    BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:38 PM
    Response to Original message
    90. kicking to get to the truth!
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    JPZenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 12:58 PM
    Response to Original message
    94. One Commentator Said
    Edited on Thu May-18-06 12:59 PM by JPZenger
    I heard an author of a new book about the media and 9-11 talk about the NYTimes. He said the editor was bending over backwards to try to prove that the NYTimes was not a liberal paper. He also said that the Administration loved to use Judith Miller. They would leak a false story to her, she would get it published on the front page, and then the Administration officials would go onto Meet the pPess, hold up the New York Times and say: "See, this is what the authoritative New York Times is saying."
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    Mr_Spock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:03 PM
    Response to Original message
    97. No wonder they brought her in the fold!!!!!!!!!!
    She was given preferential access to the Bush administration in an effort to SILENCE her about this information!!

    OMG!!

    This explains why she went from being a decent reporter to being a RW shill for the Iraq war!!

    She thought she was a hot shit getting direct information from the propaganda machine and sleeping with important men!

    This woman was taken advantage of and bought into a fantasy that she was somehow "special".

    This is creepy. :yoiks:
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    robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:30 PM
    Response to Reply #97
    99. You got it! She then slept with pigs and became slop.
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    Mr_Spock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:34 PM
    Response to Reply #99
    100. Did she ever
    Sleep with dogs...

    This story is very representative of the pushers of hate and those who get caught up in the web.
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    TheLeftyMom Donating Member (178 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 01:55 PM
    Response to Original message
    103. LIHOP/MIHOP Help!?!
    I don't remember ever learning what these mean. Help someone?
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    Peter Frank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:21 PM
    Response to Reply #103
    107. LIHOP - Let it happen on purpose, MIHOP - Make it happen on purpose... n/t
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    pauldp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:24 PM
    Response to Reply #103
    108. Let it happen on purpose. Made it happen on purpose.
    Its actually a false dichotomy because if they felt secure and in control
    of the outcome enough to let it happen, they in essence made it happen.
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    Peter Frank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:24 PM
    Response to Reply #103
    109. ...and

    Welcome to the DU TheLeftyMom :hi:



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    McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:18 PM
    Response to Original message
    105. A woman scorned....
    Edited on Thu May-18-06 02:19 PM by McCamy Taylor
    needs to keep in front of the media eye if she is to fuel her career, just like everybody else. Plus, she is pissed off at the Bush Administration.
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    robbedvoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:29 PM
    Response to Reply #105
    111. All true, but not the important story here.
    Edited on Thu May-18-06 02:30 PM by robbedvoter
    Not even the fact that Bushco had warning is the important story - it somehow filtered to us anyway.
    The story is the magnitude of the control over the media - the complete lack of accountability this administration has.
    Can you imagine? Remember those days? To sit on a story like this?
    Rove's indictmet is peanuts compared to that.
    So, not only they kept the fuck-up from us, they made 911 into a W virtue. a feather in his cap! behold, the war preznit!
    I remember comments when Clinton was shown at that religious pageant W staged to celebrate 911 how the commentator s said "Clinton must be jealous - he never had a glorious moment like W did to raise up to" (I think it was Saphire)
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    Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:42 PM
    Response to Original message
    112. Deleted message
    Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
     
    Texaroo Donating Member (155 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 02:51 PM
    Response to Original message
    113. My Helter Skelter Theory on Osama
    I am NOT a MIHOP/LIHOP conspiracist, but I have a theory on Osama that this seems to support. If you read Helter Skelter about Charles Manson, you may remember that Chuckie killed in order to pin it on blacks to foment what he thought was an inevitable race war, and that he would be on the winning side.

    I really, truly think this was Osama's intent as well - he wanted to start a crusade so that the Muslim world would rise up and whup the Westerners. So how did Bush respond? By giving al Qaeda PRECISELY what they wanted - an invasion to "prove" intent. Not only that, but we invaded a secularist country and essentially turned it over to fundamentalists as a "democracy." AND we have little hope of improving the view of the US in the Muslim world REGARDLESS of the outcome of Iraq.

    This shows what an incompetent bunch of arrogant dickheads can do for foreign policy - allow a terrorist's actions to have exactly the intended result. THAT'S why they haven't attacked us again - they met their objective.

    Funny thing, but notice this story says the terrorists were "disappointed" that the response wasn't larger?
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    nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 03:35 PM
    Response to Reply #113
    117. Just mark it up as one more parable lesson on "The boy who cried wolf"
    I keep on finding the ridiculous debate about some dude living in a cave on a dialysis machine conducting war on a cell phone just too much. The dude is or was obviously a freaking magician sending 20 or some guys undercover for months and years getting this rudimentary pilots lessons that made them superhuman flying them large commercial planes which they probably had on sat foot on just a few times before. Yea, I believe. So much of the the whole thing is so implausible how could anyone really reason with any of it


    Remember tinfoilers, that hat works both ways :tinfoilhat:
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    young_at_heart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 03:03 PM
    Response to Original message
    114. If a reporter knew all this in July what on earth did the Big Boys know?
    This is just now coming out? What a complete mess our country is in when a reporter seems to know more than the government.
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    reprehensor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 03:41 PM
    Response to Original message
    118. Good to see you posting, Paul.
    Let the good times roll.
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    AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 05:56 PM
    Response to Original message
    121. A Lot of Nerve!
    Traitors, everyone of them.
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    AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:01 PM
    Response to Original message
    123. Paul! Are you the "1" That Wrote that Book?
    Bought it last year. If it was you great job.
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    paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 08:06 PM
    Response to Reply #123
    133. That would be me
    Thanks! Glad you like.
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    TexasLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:18 PM
    Response to Original message
    126. WANTING US retaliation?
    Why would al Qaeda people be "expressing disappointment that the United States had not chosen to retaliate more seriously against what had happened to the Cole."

    And why should they be gleefully looking forward to the day when the US has no choice but to retaliate against them?

    That just doesn't make sense to me, and makes me think Ms. Miller was either making this up or was on the receiving end (again!) of another Curveball-style piece of information garbage.

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    Martin Eden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 06:29 PM
    Response to Reply #126
    127. It makes perfect sense.
    For al Qaeda to be successful at rallying Muslims to their cause, they need an enemy to inspire popular rage. The "Great Satan" America spilling Muslim blood on Arab soil is exactly what they needed. The invasion of Iraq is almost more than they could have hoped for. That's why retired generals like Zinni and Odom call the invasion of Iraq a colossal strategic blunder. Michael Scheurer (former al Qaeda specialist at the CIA) called it the best possible gift we could have given to bin Laden. The CIA's National Intelligence Council says Iraq has become the training and recruiting ground for the next generation of professional terrorists.

    Bin Laden's purpose on 9/11 went beyond the immediate death and destruction. He needed an ill-considered US response to jump-start a more widespread jihad. It takes two to tango in the "war on terror" and Bush is doing more to perpetuate it than to quell it.
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    Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 09:53 PM
    Response to Reply #127
    137. It really is a war on moderation.
    The radical mullah's are no different then our radical Christofundies. They both preach extremism and hate. Bush and Osama needed each other to increase their power and marginalize moderation. Boy, did Bush accommodate the radical Islamic fundies. He even took out the most progressive, secular society in the ME.
    People need to wake up and see how the only beneficiaries on the WOT are the religious RW fundies on bothe sides of the coin. The people who want to live in peace and harmony are the ones that are getting killed.

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    Martin Eden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 12:13 PM
    Response to Reply #137
    156. Crusade, Jihad, all the same.
    Different methods, similiar goals. The foot soldiers on both sides are useful idiots for the real perpetrators whose underlying motivations (whether they admit it or not) are power, wealth, and control.
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    CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 07:29 AM
    Response to Reply #127
    152. The war on Iraq
    is not a strategic blunder if you're a neocon with backdoor connections to Saudi fundamenatlists.
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    kerry-is-my-prez Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:31 PM
    Response to Original message
    141. Guess since it was from a GOOD source - Judith wouldn't want it published.
    She only wants stories with info from QUESTIONABLE sources to be published. :crazy:
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    Tiggeroshii Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:54 PM
    Response to Original message
    142. wow. n/t
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    Skip Intro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 10:57 PM
    Response to Original message
    143. careful - this smells funny
    this now, and the newly released video of the Pentagon "plane" - an effort to change the subject, if you ask me.
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    Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:12 PM
    Response to Original message
    144. Deleted message
    Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
     
    file83 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-18-06 11:52 PM
    Response to Reply #144
    146. Cool - thanks for posting those links!
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    Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 01:57 AM
    Response to Original message
    147. Deleted message
    Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
     
    DemonFighterLives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 07:59 AM
    Response to Original message
    153. This thread Rocks!
    :yourock:
    :dem:
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    Rockholm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 08:13 AM
    Response to Original message
    154. Nothing on the MSM? Suprise. Morning kick!
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    paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 09:04 AM
    Response to Original message
    155. The only other coverage of this story so far:
    According to a search on Google News, the only other coverage of this is from Editor and Publisher magazine:

    Miller and 'NYT' Had a 9/11 Warning Tip

    http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1002538963

    Editor and Publisher is getting to be better known because of the way they've highlighted news other outlets missed. For instance, they were one of the first and only to highlight the Steve Colbert roast of Bush.
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    paulthompson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 12:23 PM
    Response to Reply #155
    157. bump
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    Blue State Bandit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-19-06 12:36 PM
    Response to Reply #157
    159. War of Attrition? (Population Control)
    Following the premise of Texaroos Helter Skelter theorem, Id like to offer my thoughts on this.

    In the Seventies, Dr. Kissinger was bouncing around the idea of population control via family planning, sterilization, and even the promotion of natural disasters such as drought and famine (by dragging their feet on emergency aid), in third world countries, including the African continent. But, as it turned out, the growing strength of the Southern Baptists and Evangelical fundamentalists who became what Kevin Phillips called The Emerging Republican Majority derailed that scheme.

    Since the Republican Partys capitulation to the fundamentalist false profiteering Bush cabal, a new modus-operandi became necessary to control world population. Stripped of the ability to control world population thru such an immorally benevolent, hands off approach due to their alliance with religious factions that believe contraception and abortion to be an affront to God, they sought to accomplish it in a more cynical way (right to life ends at birth :banghead:).

    Now, I dont profess to know for sure whether this is the true purpose for the War on Terror (Terra) but, it makes sense to me. The problem is, by initiating such a war of attrition for the purpose of massively reducing the population in the third world, they may cause the destruction of the very environmental support system that they originally desired to hoard for themselves. Its like hiring an arsonist to seize a strategic building. The fundies within the Bush administrations power base believe that the Rapture is at hand. So what if the building burns, we wont need it in heaven.

    The only questions left in my mind are, to what degree is the Bush/Neo-Con/SBC working in concert with the Jihadists? Who is using who? What is their endgame? How do we, as Americans, regain our good name? And back to the subject of population control, should we incarcerate the Bush Fundies and the Muslim Jihadies together, or in separate buildings at Gitmo?

    P.S. I'd like to personaly thank you Paul, for all of your work.
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