Cheney's companion at fault in shooting, White House says

[Clovis Sangrail]

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/politics/13863636.htm

White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan tried to absolve Cheney of blame for shooting wealthy Austin lawyer Harry Whittington, saying that hunting "protocol was not followed by Mr. Whittington when it came to notifying others that he was there. And so, you know, unfortunately, these types of hunting accidents happen from time to time."


--------
amazing....

[mom cat]

1. Blame the victim. Katrina, Iraq, etc

[Stephanie]

49. This is the ULTIMATE blame the victim!

Cheney SHOT A GUY IN THE FACE and he's blaming the guy for it. They are crass, dishonorable people.

[TaleWgnDg]

70. OMG! The guy jumped in front of my shotgun! I wasn't looking . . . n/t

[liberalla]

71. Yea, it's not like he had the bright orange hunter vest on!

oh, he did???

hmmmm...

[RebelOne]

81. He might not have been wearing a vest.

Hunter orange vests are not required to be worn when hunting on private property.

[bigworld]

82. He was.

The police report is up at thesmokinggun.com

[NYC]

141. Link to that report. Orange coat/vest and cap worn by victim.

Look at the human outline on the right of the report. Does that indicate where Whittington was shot?

[stickdog]

88. Guns don't kill people. People who get in front of guns kill themselves.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=410888&mesg_id=410888

[Selteri]

106. Here we go again with blaming the victim...

When I saw this I could only stare slack jawed for about 5 seconds.

[Blutodog]

129. Exactly right!

But whose surprised this is 100% classix Cheney/Bu$hCo blame the victim is their whole modus operandi. Next admit your in error never show any weakness. You shoot someone it's on them. You invade someone's country and loot it's resources it's their fault. Katrina thousands die it's on them for not being rich enough to own an SUV etc. These people are predators and they have little sympathy for the prey. Which in this case is anyone who happens to get in the way when they pull the trigger.

[Higans]

142. Well, he shouldn't have been walking there!

How can we possibly blame some one for something as simple as not looking where your shooting? I mean so what if it's Gun safety and all. We can't Blame the shooter for killing a Human. After all, Humans are not a Protected Species. In fact with the war on and all, It's pretty much Open Season on Humans. Cheney was simply doing his patriotic duty to fight Terror.

[TomInTib]

2. Total crap. There were only three shooters in the party.

When in the field with a tight party, one's utmost responsibility is to know your partners' positions at all times.

[mikeytherat]

73. That's the point that just makes me bang my head into the desk!

There were only two other people hunting with the Little Dick, and he couldn't keep track of them? Just TWO f**king people? Jesus H. Christ on a pogo stick, these guys are unbelievably shameless!!!

mikey_the_rat

[rodeodance]

3. If you hold the gun be aware of your surroundings!--hunter rule # 1.

[Bozita]

4. My guess now is ... Cheney is the VICTIM!

These people are simply unfuckingbelievable.

[Clovis Sangrail]

16. the amazing thing

is that this isn't even some political issue.

I don't believe Cheney meant to shoot this guy... but accidents happen.
(possibly very bad ones if you hunt)

It's like there's a pathological need to deny responsibility.
Even in the face of reality.... when it doesn't even score political points.

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

130. "It's like there's a pathological need to deny responsibility."

It really is amazing

[savemefromdumbya]

5. Scotty said that Bush doesn't know Jack Abramoff either

[wordpix]

90. nothing is ever the fault of Cheney or his BushCo gang

[liberalnurse]

6. Was it an attempted

suicide????????????????????? Yea, that it's...he wanted to kill himself with Cheney's gun. Now it all makes sense.:smoke:

[Judi Lynn]

38. Suicide by Vice President! What an honor!

[auagroach]

63. Grammar Point

Shouldn't that be, "Suicided...", you know like Gary Webb, Hunter S. ... oh hell sorry I started.

[tuvor]

7. If that ain't adding insult to injury. n/t

[AlCzervik]

8. That is hilarious!! Cheney shoots buddy, of course it's the buddys fault

what part of that don't we understand? It's never their fault for anything.

[LiberalFighter]

62. Why wasn't the dimwit there?? That is his neck of the woods

[varkam]

9. Utter BS according to the TFW report

According to the report on thesmokinggun.com Whittington was hit after downing a quail and going to retrieve it. Perhaps the firing of his rifle wasn't enough to announce his presence...

[Wickerman]

10. The party of personal responsibility - it all starts at the top - n/t

[Orangepeel]

he came up behind Cheney and then got shot in the face

I swear that was the story I heard. Was Cheney having a flashback from Vietnam? Oh, that's right.

[skypilot]

104. Oh, thank you!!!

I was starting to wonder if I'd imagined that. When the story was first reported it was stated that the Cheney didn't realize that the guy had come up BEHIND him. Later reports claimed that the guy was way out ahead of Cheney collecting a quail he'd shot. I heard a report last night that I couldn't make heads or tails of where it seemed as though they were trying to combine the to explanations.

[Faygo Kid]

11. Yeah, that happened with Saddam, too. "Personal Responsibility?"

Didn't follow "protocol." Why isn't Whittington in the dock with Saddam? The Party of Personal Responsibility: It's the victim's fault. Damn those horribly wounded troops. Damn those poor people in New Orleans. Damn those people who dare to grow old without wealth, or are young and poor. Damn those college students that have to take out loans. Damn those machinists who don't have jobs, or computer technicians whose jobs are outsourced to India. Damn them and thousands more examples; it's all their fault. We are the Bush Administration. We are responsible for nothing, and nobody, and if you don't believe us, tune in Rush, Hannity, Ingraham and O'Reilly. They will set you straight. Damn you.

[benburch]

12. Cheney's drinking and showing off for his bimbo had nothing to do with it!

Wow!

Who knew?

[Bozita]

20. She does look like a much younger, prettier version of Lynne

And she isn't listed on the police report.

[wordpix]

89. i guess Dickhead was distracted by the new woman--wonder if Lynn knows?

or cares?

[applegrove]

13. When you go walking with an 80 year old - you look out for them!

:banghead: Not to mention HUNTING!!

[ninkasi]

14. It's NEVER their fault, is it?

It doesn't matter what happens, somebody else is to blame. Bush or Cheney could rip the heart out of a little old lady on live TV, and it would somehow be the little old lady's fault. It must be absolutely wonderful to be so very perfect....:sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm: :sarcasm:

[Jim Sagle]

15. Next excuse: Clinton's cock pulled the trigger.

[bling bling]

87. OMG!!

That made my day. :rofl:

[geiger]

91. you mean Rush Limbaugh

hasn't said it already?

[Beausoir]

136. Clenis did it!

ROFL.

[Lefty48197]

17. Maybe Whittington "knew too much" and Cheney was trying to "off" him

Let's face it. Team Rove "thinks outside the box". I wouldn't put it past them. What did Whittington know that Cheney was tring to silence?

[Ouabache]

58. Whittington probably DOES know where a lot of the bodies are

both figurtively and literally buried, given that he was some kind of funeral commissioner in TX when the BFEE/Carlyle was having all that trouble with their funeral home/mortuary/crematory subdivision.

Ashes mixed, bodies buried multiply in the same grave, etc, etc. Every mafia has has its' scrubbers, right?

[against all enemies]

18. Whittington collected his bird and raised it over his head calling

out I've got it. Dick seeing the bird "flush" quickly raised his gun and shot it.

[NanceGreggs]

19. I agree, it WAS Whittington's fault ...

... I understand he was dressed VERY provocatively (a jacket with a bull's-eye on it), and kept winking at Cheney, while whispering, "Come on, Big Boy, BRING IT ON. You KNOW you want it!"

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

21. I am shocked!

:eyes:

[Cha]

22. scotty's pants are so on fire

that his butt is a mass of charred blubber.

[spacelady]

54. You gonna eat the fat? Not me, it smells rancid.

Charred blubber indeed--now that's funny.

[OnyxCollie]

23. If Cheney pulled the trigger,

it's his own damn fault. Not Clinton's, not the Dem's, not the insurgency. It's his own damn fault. If someone's driving a car and kills someone, it's their responsibility. Just ask Pickles.

Oh. Never mind.

[MGKrebs]

24. There wasn't much chance of me becoming a hunter anyway,

but that just tears it. If other hunters get to shoot me and it's my fault, I think I'll just let them do the hunting.

So, if the poor old guy had died, it would be a crime, right? So how is it not a crime that he just happens to be wounded?

[aquart]

42. No, it would be suicide, if he died. Suicide by veep.

[BlueManDude]

25. Question is - When will Lieberman tell everyone to lay off Uncle Dick?

[SillyGoose]

26. International Hunter Education Assoc President disagrees with Scotty...

Hunting safety experts interviewed Monday agreed it would have been a good idea for Whittington to announce himself — something he apparently didn't do, according to a witness. But they stressed that the shooter is responsible for avoiding other people.

"It's incumbent upon the shooter to assess the situation and make sure it's a safe shot," said Mark Birkhauser, president-elect of the International Hunter Education Association and hunter education coordinator in New Mexico. "Once you squeeze that trigger, you can't bring that shot back."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060214/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cheney_hunting_accident

This is so typical of this bunch...its ALWAYS someone else's fault. Pretty crass for them to go blaming the 78 year old guy laying in a freaking hospital bed full of pellets. Sheesh.

:banghead:

[fshrink]

27. Mankind won't be happy until

the last bureaucrat will have been accidentally shot by the last capitalist.

[yorkiemommie1]

28. i bet as soon as they can get whittington to take the blame

they will do it. he'll have his picture taken giving ole Deadeye a big slobbery kiss.

[Mnemosyne]

29. Cheney knew exactly where Whittington was at from

what the report states.

"Whittington downed a bird and went to retrieve it."

Weren't they hunting together? Didn't he leave the others to get his bird?

My Dad was *peppered* once when hunting squirrel with a moron. He had a few tiny beads in his shoulder. I guess he was lucky he wasn't hunting with the dick!

[auagroach]

64. In a Flash

Say Cheney knows the guy is where he is but the Veep sees the quail fly up thinks in a flash, "Dead bird or dead friend? Fuck it. I'll take the chance." Prognosis? Clinicaly insane.

[Mnemosyne]

74. You can see it in his eyes, can't you?

Anyone that kills 70 birds in a canned hunt is just plain sick, imo. Bloodlust, nothing less.

And he is running our country?! :scared:

Hopefully the house of cards truly is falling this time!

Welcome to DU auagroach! :hi: Exciting times we are living in to say the least.

In peace and hope,
V

[jamesinca]

30. The dumb SOB should not have run into the line of fire

face first. Of course it was his fault, you can't expect Cheney to look where he is shooting when with a group, or to even be aware of where the rest of the hunting party are at. Besides, Dick is perfect. Shooting your hunting partner in the face is such a rookie mistake and Dick is a seasoned veteran. <sarcasm>

[burrowowl]

31. My dad always said

if you point the gun at something or someone, make sure you want to shoot it. Or keep the damn safety on or look be you fire. Hard to understand. Cheney isn't even man enough to admit fault. Jeez, I wonder if he even feels bad about it. What a miserable excuse for a human being.

[5X]

32. attempted suicide by cheney. as opposed to by cop. n/t

[Bozita]

33. Mike Luckovich agrees --- Check this toon

[A Simple Game]

41. If Cheney had been man enough to hold a press conference

to explain what happened and to show some remorse, He may have even gotten some sympathy from the public out of it. As it is no one feels sorry for him, they just think he is a poor hunter and has no sympathy for his victim.

[f-bush]

34. IIf I was a defense attorney and my client was charged with...

negligent homicide or assault with a rifle in a hunting incident from now on, I'd just explain to the jury, just as in the VP's case, it's the victims fault!

[Endangered Specie]

35. I officially declare Scott as the "new Baghdad Bob"

:eyes:

[leesa]

36. Aren't birds in the air?

[mikeytherat]

76. Yes, and the gun barrel should not dip below 45 degrees

for obvious reasons. Cheney is a "ground sluicer" or "pot-shotter" - he just shoots whatever and wherever, disregarding all rules of gun safety and basic critical thinking.

mikey_the_rat

[dysfunctional press]

37. and O.J.'s wife kept running into his knife with her neck...

this crew is UN-FUCKING-BELIEVABLE...

the buck don't stop anywhere...it just disappears into someone's pocket.

[goforit]

39. They never know how to own up to their own errors in life!!!

[henslee]

40. Zero accountability...We are above the law and can report a shooting when

we feel like it.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

43. 5th recommendation. Sheer audacity. n/t

MKJ

[Ian David]

44. Remember what they said when Kerry went skiing...

and supposedly cussed-out a secret service guy for making him fall down?

[karynnj]

103. Even then, it was simply that kerry

said "SOB" - which was very likely a spontaneous exclamation versus a "cussing out the SS guy". I heard nothing later that Kerry requested he be replaced or the SS guy asking to be removed. I've seen the RW comments on this - that oddly seem to assume that the SS were deserving of a higher level of respect than the candidate. It always seemed a natural reaction to me. I would be more concerned that a fall could have hampered Kerry on the campaign trail if he broke a leg. The SS person should have been careful not to get in the way of the candidate who he was protecting.

I actually question the reason the NYT reported this very minor episode. Kerry, has for decades been given credit for having very good manners, a reputation he wouldn't have if he habitually cussed people out. I also have no problem believing that Kerry's language off the Senate floor is more colorful.

[Not a robought]

45. Just waiting now for Cheney to tell Whittington to go fuck himself

for getting shot. Then I'll know everything's right in the world.

[pro_blue_guy]

46. Once again, let's place the blame on someone else.

What a bunch of girly sissy cowards!

[pat_k]

47. The one who pulls the trigger is ALWAYS responsible . . .

THIS IS GREAT!!! Emblematic of the "NO Accoutabiliy" administration. They do whatever the heck they want. Blame others. Demonstrate disdain for the public. Cowardly avoidance of press. . . this incident captures it all!!

From the Ten commandments of shooting safety:

3. Be sure of your target and what is in front of and beyond your target. Before you pull the trigger you must properly identify game animals. Until your target is fully visible and in good light, do not even raise your scope to see it. Use binoculars! Know what is in front of and behind your target. Determine that you have a safe backstop or background. Since you do not know what is on the other side, never take a shot at any animals on top of ridges or hillsides. Know how far bullets, arrows and pellets can travel. Never shoot at flat, hard surfaces, such as water, rocks or steel because of ricochets.

A hunter who pulls the trigger before confirming they have a safe shot is always at fault. Sure, there are protocols and courtesies that help to ensure safety, but ultimately, it's up to the one pointing the gun to know what they are pointing at. Every hunter knows this.

Perhaps people unfamiliar with hunting will buy the "blame the victim" BS, but I can't imagine any hunters buying it.

[WePurrsevere]

55. I'm not a hunter but over the years even I've learned that much from

RESPONSIBLE hunters. Cheney reacted to a sound... he SOUND shot which is always a no no. Every hunter and x-hunter I've spoken with so far has said the same thing and a few are old style type Republicans (who hate Bush Jr btw). They all agree that it's Cheney's fault... he is responsible for knowing where he gun is pointing and at what at all times. If you can't see clearly what you're shooting at you never pull the trigger.

I've known a few people that have a real issue with admitting they're wrong or have screwed up but this bunch takes the cake. As a mother I always tried to teach my daughters to take responsibilty for their mistakes and showed them by example admitting when I was wrong and/or messing something up and apologizing to them if it needed. People were so darn concerned about the example of Clinton's getting a BJ but that pales in comparison to BushCo who have earned the distinction of being the absolute worse examples for our children of any American politician in recent history at the very least.

[NJCher]

108. apologies

As a mother I always tried to teach my daughters to take responsibilty for their mistakes and showed them by example admitting when I was wrong and/or messing something up and apologizing to them if it needed.

When a person admits a mistake and apologizes, we respect that person even more. We are all human and we all make mistakes. This group doesn't seem to be able to appreciate that fact, though.




Cher

p.s. you should see me apologize when I step on a kitty tail!

[pat_k]

138. They can't appreciate this because they Don't Make Mistakes . .

. . .or commit crimes.

A crime is LITERALLY NOT a crime to them -- UNLESS they get caught. A crime is only a crime when you are nailed for it. And since your actions weren't crimes prior to getting caught, what reason would you have for taking responsibility? The "remorse" they show has NOTHING to do with the crimes they have committed. It is ALWAYS about the consequences of getting caught -- they are "remorseful" about the way they are treated -- people rejecting them, being jailed, losing status.

If this sounds crazy, you are right. But this is the reality the fascists live in.

Cheney didn't think he had to report anything because he actually didn't view himself as being involved. Wasn't his action -- it was Whittington's. For Cheney, Whittington stepped in front of flying bird shot. That was the problem. Why should he report Whittington's accident?

[Occulus]

65. Nobody I talked to today- including nonhunters- bought that line.

EVERYONE agreed that the person firing the gun is the one with the responsibility.

This..... this could end up being biiiiig trouble for Cheney, for a variety of reasons, none of which (happily) are connected to politics in any way. This is all his baby.

[pat_k]

135. Shooting officially attributed to "hunter's judgment factor." . . .

. . .No other secondary factors were found to have played a role.

http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/13863966.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp

Yeah. Mr. Whittington's fault. Sure it was. NOT!

[MagickMuffin]

48. of course it wasn't dick's fault.

He thought he was shooting at a quail.

Quail + Man = Dan Qualye (my bad):rofl:

[Canuckistanian]

50. Classsyyy!

Nothing spells "gentleman" better than taking resposibility for one's actions.

We all now know what Cheney is NOT.

[Stand and Fight]

51. Bizarro world -- now it's the victims fault!

I didn't see this coming... :eyes:

[sellitman]

52. Funny....Whittington doesn't look like Dan Quayle?

:wtf:

[pinniped]

53. Well, yahoo has this headline:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060214/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cheney_hunting_accident

Feast on this, moran Snotty.

AP
Cheney Apparently Breaks Key Hunting Rule

By NEDRA PICKLER, Associated Press Writer 21 minutes ago

WASHINGTON - Vice President
Dick Cheney apparently broke the No. 1 rule of hunting: Be sure of what you're shooting at. He also violated Texas game law by failing to buy a hunting stamp.
-->
Hunting safety experts interviewed Monday agreed it would have been a good idea for Whittington to announce himself — something he apparently didn't do, according to a witness. But they stressed that the shooter is responsible for avoiding other people.
<--
----

Does the guy who got SHOT 'peppered' in the face still have respect for this POS knowing it was his fault all along?:silly:

[yellowcanine]

60. Armstrongs "story" doesn't quite add up, imo.

Armstrong said the accident occurred toward the end of the hunt, as darkness was encroaching and they were preparing to go inside. Whittington was retrieving from tall grass a bird he had shot.

Cheney and another hunter, Pamela Willeford, the U.S. ambassador to Switzerland, moved on to another covey of quail — Armstrong estimated it was roughly 100-150 yards away — and Cheney fired on a bird just as Whittington rejoined them. She said Whittington was in tall grass and thick brush about 30 yards away, which made it difficult for Cheney to see him, although both men were wearing bright-orange safety vests. She said Whittington made a mistake by not vocally announcing that he had walked up to rejoin the hunting line.

Armstrong said she saw Cheney's security detail running toward the scene. "The first thing that crossed my mind was he had a heart problem," she told The Associated Press.

If she saw Whittington walking up behind Cheney how come she didn't realize that it was Whittington who was in distress, not Cheney? Hmmm? And how can she be so sure Whittington didn't announce his presence? Just exactly how far away was she and was she inside or outside of the car?

Furthermore, why did the sheriff's deputies not insist on interviewing Cheney right away? Would that not be standard procedure to ascertain if the shooter was under the influence of alcohol?

[glitch]

56. Tacky, ungracious people. So what else is new? nt

[spacelady]

57. Now who here, if he or she accidentally shot somebody, would

automatically try to figure out reasons why it was the victim's fault? Wouldn't you just be totally remorseful & sorry & hope to heaven the victim would fully recover? Only W. and maybe a very few scared young children would try to deflect blame in this way.
And the children would quickly break down and feel badly.

[HuffleClaw]

59. good lord, that is just downright low, even for them

i wonder what scotty said about cheney being kept from police till the next day?

[young_at_heart]

61. Is Cheney ever guilty of ANYTHING?

Never in our history has any VP had as much power as Cheney and he's constantly being attacked by all sorts of people. We all know he's just trying to do his job (major sarcasm)!

[expatriot]

66. um... i don't know much about "hunting protocol" but...

isn't it hunter protocol to look before you shoot?

[mikeytherat]

75. Four cardinal rules of gun safety:

1. Every weapon is loaded. Even if you are certain it is unloaded and there is no round in the chamber is irrelevant. EVERY gun is to be treated as if it is loaded. ALWAYS. NO exceptions.

2. NEVER point the weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot. EVER. NO exceptions.

3. Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to fire. ALWAYS. NO exceptions.

4. Know your target and WHAT LIES BEYOND YOUR TARGET. ALWAYS. NO exceptions.

These cardinal rules come straight from the NRA, and Deadeye Dick violated every single one of them.

Remember, he's not a hunter, he's a SHOOTER (the game has to be brought to HIM, he does not go and seek it out). And, he's not much of a shooter - he's reckless and stupid with a dangerous weapon (if he were in my hunting party, I'd take his gun away and his ass would sit in the car all day).

mikey_the_rat

[NJCher]

109. well, if that's the case

Then Cheney isn't exactly a poster boy for the NRA, as he has been in the past. He has always been the champion for their nefarious cause.

Wonder what that pit of slime will have to say about this? I demand a statement from the NRA on this issue!




Cher

[Ecumenist]

67. WHAT??!!

:wtf: I see, so, Mr Whittington had the gall to intercept those pellets with his face, how dare he:sarcasm: and then to go on to have his seditious, malingering behind placed in ICU? Will wonders never cease...

[mikeytherat]

78. He also let Dick's quarry escape by intercepting the shot

with his face.

mikey_the_rat

[0rganism]

143. Whittington now owes Cheney the price of the birdshot and the bird

Ah bitter reality, how quickly you have turned the tables on parody.

[daleo]

68. Whittington's fault for impersonating a bird, I guess.

And then he selfishly steals Cheney's ammunition by absorbing it into his body. Some people.:sarcasm:

[Raine]

69. R-E-S-P-O-N-S-I-B-I-L-I-T-Y

can't they take it for anything (???) .... NO I GUESS NOT! :grr:

[demobrit]

72. Are the local Police investigating what happened here?

Has Cheney been "Helping Police with their enquiries" at the local police station ?

[dipsydoodle]

77. Cheyney's companion at fault ?

On last night's TV news here in the UK it was reported that the victim, who was no more than 30 yards away, was wearing a flouresent orange jacket!

[raccoon]

80. It'sthe victim's fault; he got in the way of the pellets. LOL nt

[NorthernSpy]

79. ah, the Party of Personal Responsibility is at it again...

Let's see, Dick Cheney fails to sight a clear path to his target. He shoots, and hits another hunter.

Is Mr. Cheney to be considered responsible for his actions? Lord, no! After all, his status in the hierachy is somewhat higher than that of the man he shot. In any given situation, the blame, er Personal Responsibility is always awarded to whichever party is deemed the lesser. Therefore, it was the victim's Personal Responsibility not to get shot.

By allowing himself to get shot by Mr. Cheney, Mr. Whittington has wronged Mr. Cheney grievously. As a penalty, Mr. Whittington will be shot by Mr. Cheney. This action, having already occurred, shall be retroactively deemed the punishment for Mr. Whittington's failure of Personal Responsibility.

So Whittington has paid his debt to society, and reportedly Mr. Cheney has graciously forgiven him.

[Buford Pusser]

83. The Blame Game? Scotty's playing it now? Hmm. n/t

[Buns_of_Fire]

84. In other news, DUCK! Cheney has filed a civil suit against Mr. Whittington

for severe mental anguish and "heart" palpitations. Also, the plaintiff demands the return of all shot that has been removed from Mr. Whittington, and compensation for that shot which remains in Mr. Whittington's body.

The federal government has also billed Mr. Whittington for the unauthorized use of federal assets (the paramedics who accompany DUCK! wherever he goes).

[izzybeans]

85. Sitting at a bar last night I heard the same from some wingnuts.

I quipped perhaps cheney would have learned to handle his gun had he not taken so many deferments.

The rest of conversation went like this.
Well, actually he should have said he was behind them.

But if he was behind them, so was the car they were traveling in. Why shoot at the car?

How do you know the car was there?

Because Ms. Manners said they got out of the car headed for a Covey which in a hunting farm wouldn't be that far away. Pure logic tells us that walking forward from the car leaves the care directly behind you. We know the car never left because Ms. Manners witnessed the whole thing.

Well he wasn't hurt that bad.

You're a hunter right? Well what do you think a .28 would do at 30 ft.

<crickets>

[janetle]

119. It was 30 yards...not ft

...but still, the report is the guy was moved out of intensive care just today. I think we will find the wound(s) were worse than the spin out of the white house.

[izzybeans]

128. Apparently the news reports are contradicting on the distance.

Local paper said 30 ft. in an AP report. I heard 30 yards but read 30 ft.

[janetle]

139. Hmmm! I'd like to know the exact distance

I wouldn't put it past these people to lie about the distance--30 feet or 30 yards. My husband, who is a former trap shooter, said if it was 30 feet, the guy would be dead. And now it looks like he has taken a turn for the worse....so maybe it was that close.

[Solly Mack]

86. The "No-Fault" administration. Motto: "We didn't do it"

Whatever it is - we didn't do it.

[truebrit71]

92. Of course it was....Anyone can confuse a human being with a quail..

....happens ALL the time... :eyes:

[gasperc]

93. stupidity that keeps on giving

they are blaming the victim or this story will run months not weeks, it'll drive him out of office if he keeps this stupidity up.

Dem reps should pounce on this comment

[Mad_Dem_X]

94. Hmmm, why am I not surprised

No one in this corrupt administration has ever truly taken responsibility for ANYTHING!

[superconnected]

101. you gotta admit - this hits the home run on irresponsibility.

now to sit and watch how stupid the people that voted for them really are.

Is the NRA going to go for this, truth is, I DON'T KNOW. They may be good for it.

This is so beyond pathetic. George and Dick are asses wearing ties. They just gave us irrefutable proof.

[TygrBright]

95. Ah, yes... the "Party of Personal Responsibility" strikes again... n/t

[superconnected]

96. George Walker Bush and Dick Cheney - you two are ASSES.

THE BIGGEST ASSES EVER TO HIT WASHINGTON.

You have proved it repeatedly but today you top yourself.

Shoot a guy in the face and blame the victim. You two belong in jail.

What sorry excuses for men you are. What major ASSES.

[go west young man]

97. some interesting Harry Whittington info available at...

http://www.bushwatch.com/gravedigger.html

[go west young man]

98. one more time...sorry about that...

http://www.bushwatch.com/gravedigger.htm

[superconnected]

99. FREEPERS YOU ARE MORONS. YES - CORRECT SPELLING

because you really are.

You're going to believe this, because you guys really are MORONS.

This is beyond pathetic.

I'm so glad I voted for Gore and Kerry. I'd rather vote for them and lose than be responsible for Dick and George. :puke:

[LaCrosseDem]

100. not surprised at all.

It's the administration that has never made a mistake.

[jeffreyi]

102. Any hunter knows this is bs

So what does the NRA say? The "look before you pull the trigger" mantra is drummed in from the first minutes of the first (required for hunting license) hunter safety course. This should put them in an interesting position.

[Deep13]

105. shooting safety rules per NRA:

"When using or storing a gun, always follow these NRA rules:

"Know your target and what is beyond.
Be absolutely sure you have identified your target beyond any doubt. Equally important, be aware of the area beyond your target. This means observing your prospective area of fire before you shoot. Never fire in a direction in which there are people or any other potential for mishap. Think first. Shoot second. (Underscore added.)

Know the difference between a small bird and a man.

"Know how to use the gun safely.
Before handling a gun, learn how it operates. Know its basic parts, how to safely open and close the action and remove any ammunition from the gun or magazine. Remember, a gun's mechanical safety device is never foolproof. Nothing can ever replace safe gun handling.

and nothing can replace the PR damage control of corporate media.

"Be sure the gun is safe to operate.
Just like other tools, guns need regular maintenance to remain operable. Regular cleaning and proper storage are a part of the gun's general upkeep. If there is any question concerning a gun's ability to function, a knowledgeable gunsmith should look at it.

As long as we do not apply those standards to the shooter!

"Use only the correct ammunition for your gun.
Only BBs, pellets, cartridges or shells designed for a particular gun can be fired safely in that gun. Most guns have the ammunition type stamped on the barrel. Ammunition can be identified by information printed on the box and sometimes stamped on the cartridge. Do not shoot the gun unless you know you have the proper ammunition.

Remember that the following shot is for use on the following game: slugs for bears, buck shot for deer and bird shot for humans.

"Wear eye and ear protection as appropriate.
Guns are loud and the noise can cause hearing damage. They can also emit debris and hot gas that could cause eye injury. For these reasons, shooting glasses and hearing protectors should be worn by shooters and spectators.

Also kevlar vests and a mask of bullet-proof glass is recommended when hunting with Dick Cheney.

"Never use alcohol or over-the-counter, prescription or other drugs before or while shooting.
Alcohol, as well as any other substance likely to impair normal mental or physical bodily functions, must not be used before or while handling or shooting guns.

Never shoot a gun if all your organs have been replaced with artificial, Frankenstein parts.

"Store guns so they are not accessible to unauthorized persons.
Many factors must be considered when deciding where and how to store guns. A person's particular situation will be a major part of the consideration. Dozens of gun storage devices, as well as locking devices that attach directly to the gun, are available. However, mechanical locking devices, like the mechanical safeties built into guns, can fail and should not be used as a substitute for safe gun handling and the observance of all gun safety rules.

Guns should be stored out or reach of children, the insane, adjudicated morons and Dick Cheney.

"Be aware that certain types of guns and many shooting activities require additional safety precautions.

For example, having a face that does not look like a grouse.

"Cleaning
Regular cleaning is important in order for your gun to operate correctly and safely. Taking proper care of it will also maintain its value and extend its life. Your gun should be cleaned every time that it is used.
A gun brought out of prolonged storage should also be cleaned before shooting. Accumulated moisture and dirt, or solidified grease and oil, can prevent the gun from operating properly.

Same goes for you arteries.

"Before cleaning your gun, make absolutely sure that it is unloaded. The gun's action should be open during the cleaning process. Also, be sure that no ammunition is present in the cleaning area."

Before allowing Dick Cheney to shoot, make sure he isn't loaded.

[NorthernSpy]

140. LOL!

:rofl:

[Megahurtz]

107. LIES, LIES, LIES!

Do they expect us to believe that it's not the fault of the shooter that pulled the trigger?
I suppose the guy twisted Cheney's arm to fire at him?

This is BULLSHIT!!!:argh:

:grr:

[Mrspeeker]

110. They can write laws but they cant follow them

Cheney has billions of dollars but he couldn't find it within his heart that is 50 times to small, to pay 7 dollars to hunt legal.

[urizenxvii]

111. still nada on the NRA website

one would expect a statement from them, like "the gun wasn't at fault" or something.

[longship]

112. Rubbish! It's the shooter's responsibility

and *ONLY* the shooter's responsibility. With his friend not in sight it was up to Crashcart, and only Crashcart, to make sure that his shot was clear. This is one of the primary rules of gun safety. In the situation as presented by the witness, Quail, or no quail, Crashcart should not have shot at all.

As usual, the White House bends, twists, and lies.

[Chalco]

113. If he can't admit a forgiveable offense how in the world

could he admit unforgiveable ones: pre-emptive war, poor disaster response that results in hundreds of lives lost, etc.

[occuserpens]

114. Watergate looks like peanuts compared with this

Nixon and Ford never hurt anybody physically. In the 1970-ies, the whole idea looked like an absurdity from a cheesy triller.

[Up2Late]

115. O.K.! I admit it, I was NOT expecting this...

Why I did not expect this, I don't know. :banghead:

I guess this is my fault too.

If any of you missed The Daily Show last night, It was a MUST SEE on this subject! <http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x409983>

You can see the first other 3 part "report" on line at:
<http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/the_daily_show/videos/most_recent/index.jhtml>

I'm sure they'll have the rest on line at Comedy Central later, or you can see it at Can-O-Fun: <http://www.canofun.com/cof/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=16707>

<http://www.canofun.com/blog/default.asp>

[HughBeaumont]

116. Lord Snot McClellan is a restaurant quality piece of SHIT.

=

And that's all I got to say about THAT.

[Nickster]

132. What restaurants do you eat at? LMAO....

[Ian_rd]

117. Right-wing Radio doing its part: "Idiot" "Liberal" "Yankee"

Central Texas AM Radio is doing its part in making Cheney look Virgin-Mary-like in his tender innocence and maybe even a victim. I heard right-wingers on Texas Radio call Wittington "Yankee", "Liberal", and "Idiot" in less than a minute. They also said that Wittington walked right in front of Cheney - something I had not heard in news reports, probably meaning that it is made-up bullshit.

Edit: Commonly missing from these discussions is that the person actually aiming and firing the goddamn weapon might bear some semblance of responsibility. Poor Cheney, a victim of Liberal Wittington's Yankee Idiocy.

[Spiffarino]

118. It's ALWAYS the shooter's responsibility

It's been said often in this thread but I feel I have to add my two cents.

I love shooting. It's a great sport that requires skill, concentration, speed...and GREAT RESPONSIBILITY. If you're holding the gun you had better be damn sure you know what you're pointing at. If you're pointing the barrel at something you must expect to destroy it, whatever it may be. If it's a person, you expect he/she will die. It is a tremendous responsibility and not one ever to be taken lightly.

Cheney is a coward. There is no other way to describe him. He held the gun; it's his duty to know what's in front of his barrel before he pulls the trigger.

What
An
Asshole.

[MellowOne]

120. Since it's several days later

It's obvious it's pure spin, spin, and more spin.

[jfkraus]

121. Why is the press soooo outraged about this incident?

From a post on Slate.com/Discuss/Bushisms...a very good point

"Amazing. There is some 2-bit accident on some ranch involving a vp on a hunting trip...and the press is in a frenzy about the timeline/timliness of the press releases. In the greater scheme of things happening...who really cares...other than make a few jokes.

They have truly lost perspective.

Wish they got as riled about:

...the leadup bs to the war in Iraq
...the preparedness before 9/11
...the Katrina disaster
...Homeland security effectiveness
...the budget deficit
...wiretapping
...trophy hunting

Anyone ever walk out of a press briefing. If the WH press corps had any self respect they should walk out en masse (on camera)...telling Scotty that they wont take it any more (his evasive answers)."

[raccoon]

125. When you consider how worked up the press hos got about

Dan Quayle's spelling of "potato".....

[0rganism]

144. operative phrase: "If the WH press corps had any self respect"

Oh how different things would be.

Bottom line: this is a scandal whose premise is so simple even an idiot can understand it, so it gets plenty of coverage.

[screembloodymurder]

122. Hunting with Cheney and he forgot his body armor?

Must be his fault.

[alarcojon]

123. I can only add another outraged voice

I asked about this a couple of days ago..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=396694&mesg_id=396694

[Joey Liberal]

124. The Buck Never Stops Here for this White House

Cheney shot the guy. And he blames the guy.

[Ganja Ninja]

126. The shooting wasn't a crime. Preventing the deputies from ...

interviewing him by shielding himself with his secret service contingent most likely was a crime of some sort.

[leftofthedial]

127. this coming from the same people who take aim on "evil"

and bomb schools and hospitals

[ClintonTyree]

131. What else would you expect from the "responsibility presidency"?

These assholes never take responsibility for anything, it's their MO. The rich lawyer, wanting to have souvenir buckshot from his hero, Darth Cheney, embedded in his face for the rest of his life, JUMPED in front of Cheney, thus achieving his lifelong dream. :rofl:
This administration is shooting itself in the feet, if you ask me. People are going to read this and say, :wtf: they CAN'T be serious! The hunter is supposed to have control of his weapon and be sure of his target at ALL TIMES. Period. Cheney didn't. They can try to cast blame on the other asshole Republican al they want, IT'S CHENEY'S FAULT! :rofl:

[pinniped]

133. We need a new headline--> "c*'s companion at fault in heart attack"

He's got some nerve letting that birdshot migrate to his heart.

[demo dutch]

134. I bet that they were drinking .. it explains the delay!

[goodhue]

137. collateral damage, friendly fire, protocol shomotocal, blah, blah, blah

[AndyA]

145. Ultimately, the person with the gun bears the responsibility...

In spite of "sneaking up" on Cheney, the responsibility of carrying and operating a fire arm of any kind ultimately rests solely on the person with the weapon in their hands. Period. No excuses.

If you don't know what the hell you're doing, you shouldn't have a gun, regardless of what the friggin' NRA says!