NYT: Justice Deputy Resisted Parts of Spy Program

[seafan]

Justice Deputy Resisted Parts of Spy Program

By ERIC LICHTBLAU and JAMES RISEN

WASHINGTON, Dec. 31 - The top deputy to then-Attorney General John Ashcroft refused two years ago to approve important parts of the secret program that allows domestic eavesdropping without warrants, prompting two leading White House aides to try to win the needed approval from Mr. Ashcroft himself while he was hospitalized after a gall bladder operation, according to officials knowledgeable about the episode.

With Mr. Ashcroft recuperating from gall bladder surgery in March 2004, his deputy, James B. Comey, who was then acting as attorney general, was unwilling to give his certification to crucial aspects of the classified program, as required under the procedures set up by the White House, said the officials, who asked for anonymity because the program is classified and they are not authorized to discuss it publicly.

That prompted two of President Bush's top aides - Andrew H. Card Jr., his chief of staff, and Alberto R. Gonzales, then White House counsel and now the attorney general - to make an emergency visit to George Washington University Hospital to review the program with Mr. Ashcroft during what aides have described as a difficult recovery, the officials said.

The White House and Mr. Ashcroft, through spokesmen, declined to comment Saturday on the emergency meeting. "As the president has stated, the intelligence activities that have been under way to prevent future terrorist attacks have been approved at the highest levels of the Justice Department," said Jeannie Mamo, a White House spokeswoman.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/01/politics/01spy.html?ei=5088&en=bb5519c0752494c0&ex=1293771600&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&pagewanted=print

[RamboLiberal]

1. NYT: Justice Deputy Resisted Parts of Spy Program

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/01/politics/01spy.html?hp&ex=1136091600&en=51dcd73cfc5cb1a6&ei=5094&partner=homepage

The top deputy to then-Attorney General John Ashcroft refused two years ago to approve important parts of the secret program that allows domestic eavesdropping without warrants, prompting two leading White House aides to try to win the needed approval from Mr. Ashcroft himself while he was hospitalized after a gall bladder operation, according to officials knowledgeable about the episode.

With Mr. Ashcroft recuperating from gall bladder surgery in March 2004, his deputy, James B. Comey, who was then acting as attorney general, was unwilling to give his certification to crucial aspects of the classified program, as required under the procedures set up by the White House, said the officials, who asked for anonymity because the program is classified and they are not authorized to discuss it publicly.

That prompted two of President Bush's top aides - Andrew H. Card Jr., his chief of staff, and Alberto R. Gonzales, then White House counsel and now the attorney general - to make an emergency visit to George Washington University Hospital to review the program with Mr. Ashcroft during what aides have described as a difficult recovery, the officials said.

The White House and Mr. Ashcroft, through spokesmen, declined to comment Saturday on the emergency meeting. "As the president has stated, the intelligence activities that have been under way to prevent future terrorist attacks have been approved at the highest levels of the Justice Department," said Jeannie Mamo, a White House spokeswoman.

[lovuian]

9. This shows Comey knew it was against the law...

and then Gonzales and Card went around him to get Aschcroft on his sick bed high on drugs... to get approval ...when they KNEW it was against the law!!!

This just shows Bush was the instigator to the whole spy eavesdropping shebang!!!

[journalist3072]

22. Exactly my thoughts!!! Kicked and nominated!

[hootinholler]

26. Listen John and listen good...

Sign off on this or your eagle might just soar!

-Hoot

[hang a left]

34. Yes it sure does...

It also shows us that Gonzales should recuse himself from any involvement in the investigation of the leaker of the story.

Jesuz H Crist!!

Unfreakingbelievable!!

[Demeter]

55. I'm Sure Ashcroft Didn't Need To Be Drugged To Sign Up

This kind of illegality is right up his narrow, twisty, right-wing alley.

[jazzjunkysue]

58. They wrote it to infer that he wanted security in the hospital from Bush

That's how I read it, anyway. He was hiding from them in the hospital, and they broke down the door to put the screws to him.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

69. Precisely. Ashcroft is one of the American Christian fascists

He's always ready to break the law for this religion (the GOP)

[jazzjunkysue]

62. Typical stupid crook story. This gang that couldn't shoot straight

always confesses publicly to their crimes, right before they accuse Clinton of starting it all.

Their methods and excuses never change.

[cantstandbush]

37. Gonzales should be forced to step down now!!! n/t

[DainBramaged]

44. Agreed, Gonzales should be forced to step down now

They ALL knew this was illegal. And everyone in the NY Times should be tarred and feathered for allowing this to fester till now. Imagine if they had disclosed this before the election in 2004? Imagine how many of this criminal nisAdministration would be in jail now if Kerry and the Senate were ours.

[wordpix2]

64. Alberto, Hispanic token of BushCo, deserved a promotion for that one

and became AG.

[KittyWampus]

97. If The NYTimes Had Printed This Last Year It Would've SUNK

like a stone.

Papers hold stories all the time... til they can get traction.

Their timing ended up helping Democrats and MOderate Republicans withstand the permanent renewal of the Patriot Act.

If this story had come out last year, it would have been buried under a still functioning WH/Rove strangle hold on ALL Media spin.

Katrina and Libby's indictment happened and finally gave the opening this story deserved.

DU'ers need to wake up and realise that there ARE some people in high places in Intelligence & Government doing their best to overthrow these dangerous morons.

[baby_bear]

2. I think this is big

The NYTimes seems to be trying to make up for its dreadful decisions over the past few years to carry the Bush administration's water, and without transparency to its readers.

I will be their cheerleader as long as they try to do the right thing from now on, because, let's face it, we need that paper to be out in front on this.

This is some good reporting. I'm sure I'll get flamed for patting the NYTimes on the head, but so be it.

b_b

P.S. Thanks for the post, seafan.

[seafan]

8. I think this is BIG as well. Dare we hope the NYT is *getting* it?

None of us regular folks have the NYT's platform for truthtelling to the masses. For the love of the planet, I hope they finally get serious about investigative reporting.

And KEEP. IT. UP.

(And y're welcome, by the way!)

[aquart]

23. So how long have they been sitting on THIS story?

And I'll call it good reporting when they also provide the dates of the hospital visit, Ashcroft's resignation, Gonzales' appointment, and the Justice Department's study. All that seems a bit fuzzy.

[hang a left]

35. Tis fuzzy, isn't it.

Also this struck me as strange:

With Mr. Comey unwilling to sign off on the program, the White House went to Mr. Ashcroft - who had been in the intensive care unit at George Washington University Hospital with pancreatitis and was housed under unusually tight security - because "they needed him for certification," according to an official briefed on the episode. The official, like others who discussed the issue, spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the classified nature of the program.

Why was he housed under unusually tight security? :tinfoilhat:

[aquart]

36. I missed that.

But with Ashcroft, maybe he was simply afraid someone would steal his virginity.

[baby_bear]

38. Oh, puh-LEEEEZE!!!

That is too gross to contemplate.

However, remember that stuff (whether or not it actually worked out that way)
about how he didn't want to fly commercial airlines the couple
months before 9/1l? I think the guy may simply be paranoid, i.e., heightened security
at the hospital may have been his own idea.

Still, this shouldn't take away from the article. I'm sure, given his condition, that
he truly was in massive pain and really should not have been prevailed upon when there
was a competent person (and a polital appointee at that)
with full authority in his absence. The White House goons just
wanted the answer they were looking for.

b_b

[Missy Vixen]

50. Colin Powell was also not flying commercially

>about how he didn't want to fly commercial airlines the couple
months before 9/1l?<

Colin Powell had also instructed his entire family to not fly commercially, either.

To get back to the subject of this thread, good on Mr. Comey. He did a great thing.

Julie
president for life of the PFEB

[Andrea]

79. I seem to remember that

Comey is the guy who appointed Pat Fitzgerald. Is that correct?

[Missy Vixen]

80. Yes. n/t

[psychopomp]

86. "The White House goons just wanted the answer they were looking for""

Just so!

[AllyCat]

103. I agree with the second part

They didn't like the answer they got from Comey. So they decided to move up the food chain and pester some guy in horrible pain (pancreatits is excruciating!) to get what they wanted.

Ashcroft is a weirdo, but I can't discount my intuition and some disturbing, isolated facts (like the ignored PDB from early August, 2001) that seem to point to this group knowing an attack using airliners was coming. I still think he knew.

Nonetheless, they are all murderers, liars, and torture-freaks. Like the bumper sticker says: if these people are Christian, I'm the virgin Mary.

[jazzjunkysue]

59. Right. Security away from Bush.

[bostonbabs]

63. "PANCREATITIS" CODE WORD FOR "STRESS"

[AllyCat]

106. ...or chronic alcoholism... n/t

[ClintonTyree]

74. The axis of evil...............

wanted to clip the eagle's wings I guess? Asscrack needed that tight security, we wouldn't want anyone to keep the eagle form soaring now, would we? :eyes: Asscrack is one paranoid son of a bitch to begin with, everyone is out to get him, didn't you know? All of those demon calico cats, just waiting for the hospital staff to turn their backs, then WHAM! Calico cat black-ops, keeping Asscrack from soaring anymore! :rofl: And this guy was AG? :wtf: He's a fucking mental case.

[Thor_MN]

91. If you were in the BFEE, would you want a doped up Asscrack sitting in a

semi-private room with visitors to the other patient in and out? No telling what truths he might have let out while under the influence of drugs. You need unusually tight security around BFEE members when they are taking drugs to limit the chances of secrets leaking out. One could say a tight security bubble is needed, kind of like the bubble that is always around George...

[druidity33]

43. Risen...

he seems to be spot on. The NYT coverage is only as good as the reporter covering.


...little bathroom stickers...

[OKNancy]

3. even Ashcroft was reluctant

the article goes on to say ( may have been, they aren't sure, but the program was "revamped")

[Straight Shooter]

4. Comey is the one who appointed Fitzgerald, right?

Can you just imagine if Clinton's chief of staff and counsel had gone to the hospital bedside of a recuperating AG to coerce him into approving domestic eavesdropping?

Shame, shame.

[Rose Siding]

7. I think that's right. This "former senior Bush administration official",

sure sounds like Richard Clarke. But the reporter uses the attribution of "several senior government officials" a couple of times. I hope there's a slew of them and that more are joining to leak about the program. That could be a way to protect each other from the upcoming whistleblowers-as-witches hunt.

Several senior government officials say that when the special operation first began, there were few controls on it. Some N.S.A. officials wanted nothing to do with it, apparently fearful of participating in an illegal operation, according to a former senior Bush administration official.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

28. Bingo! That should tell us all that Fitz is the right guy for the job,...

...because Comey, his appointer, knows the law very well.

[marylanddem]

5. I see this NYT article as a kind of gutsy "screw you" to the White House

after the hoopla about prosecuting people for leaking. Good. Apparently they're still getting leaks and are going to press on with their reporting. Sounds like a lot of names are getting dragged in here too which will make for real interesting hearings.

[RamboLiberal]

12. Raw is reporting this - NYT Website doesn't have yet

http://rawstory.com/news/2005/New_York_Times_public_editor_says_1231.html

Internal scuffle at the Times as editor, publisher refuse questions on withholding NSA story

An internal faceoff at the New York Times is set to go public in Sunday editions when the public editor accuses his bosses of 'stonewalling' him in his attempts to understand the decision to report on NSA eavesdropping after at least a year's delay, RAW STORY has learned.

In his bi-weekly column slated for Sunday's edition, Byron Calame says the paper's response has been "woefully inadequate" and reveals that he e-mailed a list of 28 questions to the executive editor and publisher who declined to answer, the first time that's happened since he became the paper's ombudsman.

Executive editor Bill Keller's only response was one line: "There is really no way to have a full discussion of the back story without talking about when and how we knew what we knew, and we can't do that."

To Calame, the "most obvious and troublesome omission" is the failure to adequately address whether the story was ready to publish before the Nov. 2, 2004 election. The few public explanations given by Keller haven't been clear about the exact timing and leaves the public editor with "uncomfortable doubts."

Many critics on the right and left have speculated that a forthcoming book, "State of War: The Secret History of the CIA and the Bush Administration," written by James Risen, one of the article's writers, may have sparked the Times' decision to finally publish. Calame reveals that the Times' Washington bureau chief talked to the book's publisher at least twice in the last month. The book is set to hit shelves on Tuesday.

[seafan]

15. Thanks for adding this information. The pot's starting to boil at the NYT

It'll be a spectacle.

[marylanddem]

16. Yep, thanks - sounds like the Times

ombudsman's doing his job. Good for him, good for us. Good for democracy.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

31. I bet he got so many letters, emails, and phonecalls, that he decided....

...just to let everyone know at one time what he was thinking on this issue.

Heh-heh-heh! Did he ever!! :-))

[hootinholler]

27. WOW taking the 5th with the ombudsman...

"There is really no way to have a full discussion of the back story without talking about when and how we knew what we knew, and we can't do that."

Because if you did it would be admissable in your trial for misprison of a felony.

I want to see the Poodle Press hung out to dry almost as badly as I want the PNAC hung out.

-Hoot

[sabra]

6. it's getting juicy...

:popcorn:

[Eugene]

10. "without clear probable cause guidelines"

No rules. Completely above the law.

BushCo claims that domestic spying is legal but
they even went around their own Justice Department.
Their attempt to armtwist John Ashcroft on his sickbed
is just beyond bizarre, even in this administration.

Now that Alberto Gonzales runs the Justice Department
the lunatics are fully in charge of the asylum. :scared:

This is big. Recommended.

[BeHereNow]

19. And they concealed their illegal actions under the "Classified" cloak

of unaccountability.
To me, that is the REAL crime.
Abusing their power to conceal their illegal actions
against the citizens of this country.
May be the NYT came forth with the information
because they heard the BFEE was preparing to
round up citizens based on ill gotten
evidence against them?
Nothing would surprise me at this point.
BHN

[mom cat]

11. Even too despicable for Ashcroft! Now that is bad!

:kick:

[seafan]

13. Senior gov't officials: "There were few controls on it."

snip (Emphasis added)

Several senior government officials say that when the special operation first began, there were few controls on it. Some N.S.A. officials wanted nothing to do with it, apparently fearful of participating in an illegal operation, according to a former senior Bush administration official.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/01/politics/01spy.html?ei=5088&en=bb5519c0752494c0&ex=1293771600&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&pagewanted=print

[CoffeeCat]

14. Could this be why Ashcroft left?

I'm sorry that I don't remember exactly when Ashcroft left.

This article says that Comey was acting as attorney general. I assume this was because Ashcroft was hospitalized.

Ashcroft must have remained on after this....so he must have quit soon after.

Maybe Ashcroft thought this stunt was just a bit way over the top?

[seafan]

17. Didn't Ashcroft leave in the fall of 2003, about the time Rove

had already been interviewed by the FBI re: Plame, thinking he was gonna be *OK* since Ashcroft would head off any problems for Karl.... then, oops.

Their main man quit. Please correct me, somebody, but this seems the right time frame for Ashy leaving.


On edit:

In September 2003, the CIA requested that the Justice Department investigate the disclosure of a covert CIA officer’s identity. Then-Attorney General John Ashcroft recused himself and named Deputy Attorney General James B. Comey, to be "acting attorney general" for the case. Comey in turn named U.S. Attorney for the Northern District of Illinois Patrick Fitzgerald to the case on December 30, 2003.<1>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_leak_grand_jury_investigation

[CoffeeCat]

24. Interesting stuff....

Ashcroft wrote a resignation letter to Junior and submitted it on Nov 2, 2004---according to MSNBC.

Ashcroft's gall-bladder surgery---and when he was pressured to approve the domestic spying--happened in March 04.

Eight months between these events.

I really would like to know what happened in Ashcroft's hospital room. That is really important. According to the
NYTimes article, it is unknown if Ashcroft gave in to them--or if BushCo went around everyone.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm. Maybe Ashcroft refused to give BushCo the go-ahead. Maybe that's why he quit--or was forced to leave.

As quoted in this NYTimes article, "It was unclear whether the White House ultimately persuaded Mr. Ashcroft to approve the program or whether the White House moved ahead without his concurrence."

[cornermouse]

89. Yeah, ever since this came out I've been wondering if this is

the real reason why Ashcroft left. Not that I think he has many scruples, but it is possible Bush violated even the few that he had. Then again, maybe it was fear of prosecution or being caught up in scandal if the whole stinking deal ever came to light.

[xxqqqzme]

25. asscrack is a end-times fundie

he satisfied the RW base during the 1st term. The neocons needed someone closer 2 home...who 'understood' the sticky Constitutional problems likely 2 B revealed during the 2nd term. We got alberto cuz he's a good little ass kissin' neo-con buddy.

[aquart]

18. Comey again. The man who gave us Fitzgerald.

I'm starting to really like this guy.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

30. Yes...it's becoming clear that this man is a real patriot! :-)

[CoffeeCat]

20. This article is VERY telling....look at all of the quoted anon sources...

...if you look at who is being quoted--anonymously--it's riveting because many appear to be singing like giant pterodactyls.

(note--these snips are not in order, as they appear in the NYTimes article)

"Several senior government officials say that when the special operation first began, there were few controls on it. Some N.S.A. officials wanted nothing to do with it, apparently fearful of participating in an illegal operation, according to a former senior Bush administration official."

Interesting, "A FORMER SENIOR BUSH ADMINISTRATION OFFICIAL." Someone who worked there--has turned.

"Officials with knowledge of the hospital meeting said it marked a critical juncture in the N.S.A. program and underscored questions about its operations, how it was overseen and what its future would be. Those questions are likely to be central to a Congressional hearing planned by Sen. Arlen Specter, the Pennsylvania Republican who heads the Judiciary Committee."

Interesting again..."OFFICIALS WITH KNOWLEDGE OF THE HOSPITAL MEETING..." Only Andrew Card, Gonzo and Ashcroft were present at the hospital meeting--according to this article. Obviously some very senior Bush officials are singing.

Also interesting...In the first few paragraphs, starting in the first paragraph--the NYTimes quotes "officials knowledgeable about the episode." Then in the fourth paragraph, the article begins quoting "other officials"--which clearly distinguishes two groups of "officials."

It appears that many are squealing on this administration!

I'm sorry if this is confusing. I thought what these people said--as well as the large number of people---was important.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

29. That's an excellent analysis, TwoSparkles! Just excellent! :-)....

...It was just a matter of time before the NeoCon Junta unravelled, and it looks like it's getting close to the final stages.

Good work! :-)

[wordpix2]

65. maybe Asscroft is the leaker of this info, esp. if he did not give the go-

ahead in the hospital.

[Tigress DEM]

21. Thanks for reporting this. NT

[nradisic]

Gonzo, Asscrack and the Shrub are all Liars!

This could be a great breaking story.....Ashcroft being visited in the hospital after gall baldder surgery by Andy Card and Gonzales to push for approval of the "Spying by the NSA", because Ashcroft's #2 at the time refused to do it. The guys are stupid, corrupt and they have been caught time and again lying their ass off. To boot, it prooves that our Attorney General is a liar and really corrupt. They all deserve a fair trial.

http://dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/12/31/22520/443

[babylonsister]

32. I do believe it's allowable to copy 4 paragraphs, so I'll help this

out.

http://dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/12/31/22520/443

The top deputy to then-Attorney General John Ashcroft refused two years ago to approve important parts of the secret program that allows domestic eavesdropping without warrants, prompting two leading White House aides to try to win the needed approval from Mr. Ashcroft himself while he was hospitalized after a gall bladder operation, according to officials knowledgeable about the episode.

With Mr. Ashcroft recuperating from gall bladder surgery in March 2004, his deputy, James B. Comey, who was then acting as attorney general, was unwilling to give his certification to crucial aspects of the classified program, as required under the procedures set up by the White House. . .

That prompted two of President Bush's top aides - Andrew H. Card Jr., his chief of staff, and Alberto R. Gonzales, then White House counsel and now the attorney general - to make an emergency visit to George Washington University Hospital to review the program with Mr. Ashcroft during what aides have described as a difficult recovery, the officials said.

. . . It was unclear whether the White House ultimately persuaded Mr. Ashcroft to approve the program or whether the White House moved ahead without his concurrence. What is known is that in early 2004, about the time of the hospital meeting, the White House suspended parts of the surveillance program for several months and moved ahead with more stringent requirements on the National Security Agency on how the program was used, in part to guard against possible abuses.
more

[Hubert Flottz]

88. Not the big picture but the big dot...

"March 2004" The Bush mob, were gearing up to spy on the democrats running for president in 04? Everything, the cons have done so far, has had two motives behind them.

Motive # 1 POLITICS & GRABBING MORE POWER

Motive # 2 MONEY

I have to believe, that this was every bit as political as Nixon's caper only a much bigger operation.

I'll bet you Bush was even spying on republicans like Specter, who had balked at the neocon's shredding of the Constitution. As I recall the RNC was not sure that they wanted to back Specter in his bid for reelection in 04. The GOP even admitted that they were afraid Specter would turn on some of the unconstitutional tricks Bush was wanting to pull off, and Specter might not back some of the federal judges, SC appointees and maybe even the new neocon AG.

Edit...The neocons needed to monitor anyone who could tamper with their electronic fixing of the 04 election.

[truthisfreedom]

33. i bilieve the title is actually "Justice Refused To Sign Off On Bush's...

Justice Refused To Sign Off On Bush's Domestic Surveillance Scheme

[usregimechange]

39. Kick!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

40. Kick!!

[EC]

41. Okay, wait a minute,

if Ashcroft was on painkillers, it wouldn't be binding anyway since he wasn't of staple mind...also, if painkillers were withheld to get his signature, he was probably under duress and pissed...

[juajen]

53. Yeah, I would be, too

If my mind was stapled!!! LOL

[Thor_MN]

93. Staple mind? LOL!!! Asscrack was a pinhead!!!

Dr. Freud, your slip is showing. I don't mean to poke fun at your typo, but it is funny...

[fujiyama]

42. One thing worth noting

is that when Ashcroft was in the senate, he was actually a proponent of privacy rights (well except of course in abortion). I remember him making statements of concern over things like Echelon, several years ago.

I think this shows that the administration didn't find him to be quite the rubber stamp they needed and wanted. Sure 99% of the time he probably did their bidding, but still...I looks like Gonzoles was perfect for that.

[wordpix2]

66. oh, yeah, Gonzales, Hispanic water boy

[rodeodance]

45. (NYT) Justice Deputy Resisted Parts of Spy Program

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/01/politics/01spy.html?th&emc=th

January 1, 2006
Justice Deputy Resisted Parts of Spy Program
By ERIC LICHTBLAU and JAMES RISEN

WASHINGTON, Dec. 31 - A top Justice Department official objected in 2004 to aspects of the National Security Agency's domestic surveillance program and refused to sign on to its continued use amid concerns about its legality and oversight, according to officials with knowledge of the tense internal debate. The concerns appear to have played a part in the temporary suspension of the secret program.

The concerns prompted two of President Bush's most senior aides - Andrew H. Card Jr., his chief of staff, and Alberto R. Gonzales, then White House counsel and now attorney general - to make an emergency visit to a Washington hospital in March 2004 to discuss the program's future and try to win the needed approval from Attorney General John Ashcroft, who was hospitalized for gallbladder surgery, the officials said.

The unusual meeting was prompted because Mr. Ashcroft's top deputy, James B. Comey, who was acting as attorney general in his absence, had indicated he was unwilling to give his approval to certifying central aspects of the program, as required under the White House procedures set up to oversee it.

With Mr. Comey unwilling to sign off on the program, the White House went to Mr. Ashcroft - who had been in the intensive care unit at George Washington University Hospital with pancreatitis and was housed under unusually tight security - because "they needed him for certification," according to an official briefed on the episode. The official, like others who discussed the issue, spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the classified nature of the program....................

[billybob537]

46. SOOOOO is that why

Asscrack had to bail out in 04?
The official spoke on condition of anonimity becouse of the secret nature of the CRIME.

[matcom]

47. FUCK The NY Times

how fucking DARE they even TRY and report on this story anymore!

[stepnw1f]

52. heh? (nt)

[KoKo]

48. "Justice Deputy Resisted Parts of Spy Program" NYT's Breaking...

January 1, 2006
Justice Deputy Resisted Parts of Spy Program
By ERIC LICHTBLAU and JAMES RISEN

WASHINGTON, Dec. 31 - A top Justice Department official objected in 2004 to aspects of the National Security Agency's domestic surveillance program and refused to sign on to its continued use amid concerns about its legality and oversight, according to officials with knowledge of the tense internal debate. The concerns appear to have played a part in the temporary suspension of the secret program.

The concerns prompted two of President Bush's most senior aides - Andrew H. Card Jr., his chief of staff, and Alberto R. Gonzales, then White House counsel and now attorney general - to make an emergency visit to a Washington hospital in March 2004 to discuss the program's future and try to win the needed approval from Attorney General John Ashcroft, who was hospitalized for gallbladder surgery, the officials said.

The unusual meeting was prompted because Mr. Ashcroft's top deputy, James B. Comey, who was acting as attorney general in his absence, had indicated he was unwilling to give his approval to certifying central aspects of the program, as required under the White House procedures set up to oversee it.

With Mr. Comey unwilling to sign off on the program, the White House went to Mr. Ashcroft - who had been in the intensive care unit at George Washington University Hospital with pancreatitis and was housed under unusually tight security - because "they needed him for certification," according to an official briefed on the episode. The official, like others who discussed the issue, spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the classified nature of the program.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/01/politics/01spy.html?ei=5094&en=ec5c0349b8ec6bc6&hp=&ex=1136178000&partner=homepage&pagewanted=print

[LizW]

49. Here are some dates of interest

The NSA spying domestic spying program was started by Bush soon after Sept. 11, 2001. It was so secret that even Larry Thompson, Ashcroft's deputy, was not told. As the article says, the program "quickly expanded" and some in the NSA didn't want anything to do with it. This "expanded" domestic spying program apparently continued in great secrecy until around March, 2004. For almost 2 1/2 years, Bushco was secretly spying on American citizens. How many people were imprisoned during that time based on this secret spying program? We don't know.

In early August, 2003, Larry Thompson resigned and took a job in the private sector with PepsiCo. Thompson was an up-and-comer, the highest ranking black man in the Justice Department. His name had been mentioned for both Attorney General and Supreme Court. Why would he bail on public service? Did he resign because he found out about the secret spying, and that they had not trusted him enough to let him in on it?

James Comey was appointed to replace Thompson in the late summer or early fall of 2003. He was told, at some point, about the domestic spying program. Around March, 2004, the White House suspended parts of the program because of Justice Department concerns about its legality. That sounds like Comey's doing, but we don't know for sure. The Justice Dept. did an audit of "a selection of cases" and found no instances of abuses. (Who do you suppose selected the cases to be audited?)

Ashcroft had surgery on March 9, and was still in intensive care on March 12.

Card and Gonzalez went to the hospital to get Ashcroft to sign off on the program because they knew Comey (who was acting Attorney General during Ashcroft's illness) would not. They either got his approval, or didn't and Bushco went ahead with the spying anyway.

All this raises more questions than it answers.

For instance, did Ashcroft know about the spying program before the March, 2004 hospital visit? It would be remarkable if he did not.

And more important, why was it so necessary to get Ashcroft to sign off on the program in March of 2003? The search for OBL had been pretty much abandoned by then, and Bushco had something much bigger on their plate -- they were relentlessly selling the Iraq war to the American people and badgering the U.N. Security Council to authorize it.

Interestingly, the U.S. Resolution asking for U.N. authorization for military intervention in Iraq was dated March 7, and the negative responses by France and Germany came around March 17.

This was right around when Bushco was spying on the U.N. Security council members to see how they were going to vote. http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/6045

Was that why it was so important to get the program okayed by Ashcroft?

[KoKo]

51. Very interesting points.

And, one wonders who else has made this very interesting connection? Who else knows "behind the scenes?" And, could Fitzgerald in some way be pursuing this since Comey gave him "wide ranging authority."

What if in some way this spying was used on Joe Wilson and his wife, and others. Many have speculated that Bolton's refusal to release the NSA information when he was interviewed for UN job might have been because Wilson and others were in those NSA intercepts.

Thanks for pointing out this Timeline. So much is hard to follow in our memories these days.

So much hangs on Fitzgerald. But, I'm glad Comey is also involved. There may be others, hopefully who are providing info to "connect the dots" the way you have.

[baby_bear]

60. I agree, KoKo01, but....

We need to know whether Wilson and others who were clearly not links to terrorism were tapped.

However, I'm not sure how Fitzgerald's authority could extend to this, in terms of the potential crimes he is investigating. Are you thinking that the outing of Ms. Plame Wilson could have been indirectly related to NSA wiretapping? Help me out here.

b_b

[wordpix2]

67. ACLU FOIA filings confirm PETA, Greenpeace, ACLU subject of FBI spying

http://www.aclu.org/safefree/spying/23150prs20051220.html

<snip> To expose FBI monitoring of political and religious groups in the United States, the ACLU filed FOIAs in 20 states on behalf of over 150 organizations and individuals. Today the ACLU made public the latest documents obtained in the project which confirm that the FBI is using counterterrorism resources to monitor and infiltrate advocacy groups including PETA, Greenpeace, the American Arab Anti Defamation Committee the ACLU itself. www.aclu.org/safefree/spying/23124prs20051220.html

[KoKo]

73. If Bolton was discussing anything he found out in his NSA

wiretaps which might have brought up Wilson or Plames name (or what she was investigating with WMD)when he possible wiretapped his own co-workers, it could mean that Fitzgerald would be able to go off into the issue of the illegal wiretaps themselves. It would seem to me that if Bolton or anyone else had info on Plame/Wilson because of wiretaps or the results of wiretaps then Fitz would be within his rights to call more people in and branch off into that area. :shrug:

Here's a coupld of links about what Bolton was doing with the NSA wiretaps. One from former CIA officer Larry Johnson and the other from Steve Clemmons who wrote alot about it.

--------------


http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:nwmaGnSlLDcJ:www.tpmcafe.com/story/2005/12/16/142620/20+John+Bolton,+NSA+intercepts&hl=en

Spying on Americans and John Bolton

By Larry Johnson | bio

From: Politics

Then last Thursday afternoon, I received a tip that the real story may not be the export ban angle after all, but rather something more damaging to Bolton: he requested the NSA intercepts <u>to spy on his co-workers. Aside from the gross misuse of national security assets for personal political purposes, any attempt by Bolton to use the national security apparatus to spy on coworkers, even if done under the veneer of his regular assignments would presumedly have been known to those above his pay grade, since we are talking about cross-jurisdictional lines here. And if in fact Bolton was spying on coworkers, this would be at least as damaging to the White House as it would to Bolton personally because it would show an out-of-control Administration steeped in a Nixonian paranoia, which isn t that far-fetched given Rummy and Cheney s tours of duty now and then.



--------------------------------------------------------
Monday :: Jun 6, 2005
Who Else Was John Bolton Spying Upon?

Today Steve Clemons gets another shoe to drop when he reports that Bolton in fact requested at least one NSA intercept on Libya, in an effort to spy on a fellow State Department appointee, Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs William Burns. But at the time Bolton made the special request from the NSA for this intercept, he had already been removed from working on Libyan WMD issues at the direct request of the British. I am not sure but I would think that requesting an NSA intercept on a country that isn t in your need-to-know portfolio of responsibilities would have to be approved by your superiors at State (Richard Armitage and Colin Powell), the NSA itself, and even possibly the White House. That the national security information would be used to spy upon coworkers for your own political purposes would of course be something that these layers of review would question themselves, when they would ask why you need this information when you are no longer working on the Libya WMD issue for the Administration. I mean, why would Armitage and Powell approve Bolton s fishing expedition on Libya after he had been removed from the assignment?

Then last Thursday afternoon, I received a tip that the real story may not be the export ban angle after all, but rather something more damaging to Bolton: he requested the NSA intercepts <u>to spy on his co-workers. Aside from the gross misuse of national security assets for personal political purposes, any attempt by Bolton to use the national security apparatus to spy on coworkers, even if done under the veneer of his regular assignments would presumedly have been known to those above his pay grade, since we are talking about cross-jurisdictional lines here. And if in fact Bolton was spying on coworkers, this would be at least as damaging to the White House as it would to Bolton personally because it would show an out-of-control Administration steeped in a Nixonian paranoia, which isn t that far-fetched given Rummy and Cheney s tours of duty now and then.

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:LivaFljooaAJ:www.theleftcoaster.com/archives/004569.php+John+Bolton,+NSA+intercepts&hl=en

[baby_bear]

76. Good stuff there, KoKo01

I worry that if Fitzgerald can't get to this, no one will, given the current Congress. We need more whistle blowers to report on the facts of thisi criminal administration.

b_b

[KoKo]

81. I'm still thinking that Fitz with Comey appointing him

is our BIG HOPE.. If Fitz gets corrupted then I have to hope the "back up guys" come into play. :shrug:

There's enough info out there on the Internet...that we know our Dems know also...that if they don't ROLL OUT ON THIS...well...what can one say?

If a Party is given the "Golden Goose" and fails to act...then...how many more "ELECTIONS" do we have to go DOWN ON before we know there's a prblem.

:shrug:

[carolinalady]

54. It makes sense to me that the leaker is none other than

Ashcroft himself, perhaps to clear himself in fear of certain criminal prosecution.

[Patsy Stone]

56. Scariest bit, for me...

"But even after the imposition of the new restrictions last year, the agency maintained the authority to choose its eavesdropping targets and did not have to get specific approval from the Justice Department or other Bush officials before it began surveillance on phone calls or e-mail messages. The decision on whether someone is believed to be linked to Al Qaeda and should be monitored is left to a shift supervisor at the agency, the White House has said."

Yes, a shift supervisor is the final decision-maker.

Here's a great thread by Rose Siding about the DoJ suddenly leaking like a sieve on many issues and what it all may mean. :)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5726571

[seafan]

70. Thanks for posting Rose Siding's thread. Good info there.

I posted this info below in that thread as well. It ties into what was also going on in March, 2003, with the "leak" in the UK about the US spying on UN members, in the run-up to their voting for war intervention.


UN launches inquiry into American spying

Martin Bright, Ed Vulliamy in New York and Peter Beaumont
Sunday March 9, 2003
The Observer

The United Nations has begun a top-level investigation into the bugging of its delegations by the United States, first revealed in The Observer last week.

Sources in the office of UN Secretary General Kofi Annan confirmed last night that the spying operation had already been discussed at the UN's counter-terrorism committee and will be further investigated.

The news comes as British police confirmed the arrest of a 28-year-old woman working at the top secret Government Communications Headquarters (GCHQ) on suspicion of contravening the Official Secrets Act.

Last week The Observer published details of a memo sent by Frank Koza, Defence Chief of Staff (Regional Targets) at the US National Security Agency, which monitors international communications. The memo ordered an intelligence 'surge' directed against Angola, Cameroon, Chile, Bulgaria and Guinea with 'extra focus on Pakistan UN matters'. The 'dirty tricks' operation was designed to win votes in favour of intervention in Iraq.

The Observer reported that the memo was sent to a friendly foreign intelligence agency asking for help in the operation. It has been known for some time that elements within the British security services were unhappy with the Government's use of intelligence information.

The leak was described as 'more timely and potentially more important than the Pentagon Papers' by Daniel Ellsberg, the most celebrated whistleblower in recent American history.

snip

The operation is thought to have been authorised by US National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, but American intelligence experts told The Observer that a decision of this kind would also have involved Donald Rumsfeld, CIA director George Tenet and NSA chief General Michael Hayden.

President Bush himself would have been informed at one of the daily intelligence briefings held every morning at the White House.

Attention has now turned to the foreign intelligence agency responsible for the leak. It is now believed the memo was sent out via Echelon, an international surveillance network set up by the NSA with the cooperation of GCHQ in Britain and similar organisations in Australia, New Zealand and Canada.

snip

While the bugging of foreign diplomats at the UN is permissible under the US Foreign Intelligence Services Act, it is a breach of the Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations, according to one of America's leading experts on international law, Professor John Quigley of Ohio University.

He says the convention stipulates that: 'The receiving state shall permit and protect free communication on the part of the mission for all official purposes... The official correspondence of the mission shall be inviolable.'


(Emphasis added)

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/iraq/story/0,12239,91065...



And yet, the American "liberal media" completely ignored/blacked out this story. Why do these people not think an informed US populace is critically important?

We will continue to do their jobs for them.

[seafan]

83. More on the British translator charged w/ leaking the UN spying memo

in March, 2003.

British translator arrested after leak of alleged U.S. note
By Associated Press
Published November 14, 2003

LONDON - Police charged a former British intelligence employee with breaking state secrecy laws Thursday, after she was linked to the disclosure of a memo in which U.S. officials allegedly asked for British help in eavesdropping on U.N. envoys.

Katharine Gun, 29, who worked as a translator for the Government Communications Headquarters, was arrested in March after a British newspaper published the memo, which came as the United States still hoped to win U.N. backing for the war in Iraq.

In the memo allegedly from U.S. officials, the intelligence agency was asked for help bugging the home and office telephones of delegates of key countries on the U.N. Security Council. The agency in Cheltenham, western England, uses high-tech equipment to monitor international communications.

Gun, who was fired in June, was charged under a section of Britain's Official Secrets Act, which bars the unauthorized disclosure of security and intelligence information.

snip

The Jan. 31 memo sent to the Observer newspaper reportedly originated from the U.S. National Security Agency. It said that the NSA had begun a "surge" of extra eavesdropping on officials from Angola, Cameroon, Chile, Bulgaria, Guinea and Pakistan - then all members of the Security Council.

snip

Gun, who is free on bail pending a hearing Nov. 27, said that the disclosures were justified because they "exposed serious illegality and wrongdoing on the part of the U.S. government who attempted to subvert our own security services." She also defended the disclosures as an attempt to prevent the deaths of Iraqi civilians and British troops in a war.

http://www.sptimes.com/2003/11/14/Worldandnation/British_translator_ar.shtml

(Thanks to the St. Pete Times for reporting on this.)

[seafan]

84. Another important piece re: the UN spying by the NSA

Don't mean to stray from the thread main topic, but wanted to add this related info before it disappears.


Alleged NSA memo details U.S. eavesdropping at U.N.
(Originally in the Baltimore Sun)
By Scott Shane and Ariel Sabar
Sun Staff

March 4, 2003

snip

Intelligence experts say the memo, dated Jan. 31, marked "Top Secret" and printed Sunday in The Observer, appears genuine. While no surprise to those familiar with the global eavesdropping the NSA conducts from Fort Meade, the memo may complicate U.S. diplomacy by underscoring that the intelligence agency routinely monitors phone calls, faxes and e-mail not only of hostile countries but of allies and neutral nations.

snip

"As you've likely heard by now, the Agency is mounting a surge particularly directed at the UN Security Council members (minus US and GBR of course) for insights as to membership is reacting to the on-going debate RE:Iraq," says the memo, from Frank Koza, described as NSA's chief of staff for "Regional Targets."

It asks the unnamed eavesdroppers who got the memo - apparently NSA staff members or their British counterparts at Government Communications Headquarters - to report "the whole gamut of information that could give US policymakers an edge in obtaining results favorable to US goals or to head off surprises."

Specifically, it asks the recipients to target Angola, Cameroon, Chile, Bulgaria and Guinea, while putting "extra focus" on Pakistan.

snip

The leaked memo was dated five days before Secretary of State Colin L. Powell's dramatic presentation to the U.N. General Assembly at which he played NSA intercepts of Iraqi officers and showed satellite photos of efforts to hide banned weapons. The memo says the eavesdropping push "will probably peak" after Powell's speech.

snip

What is a surprise, experts say, is the apparent leak, which political analysts speculated may have come from someone at the British eavesdropping agency who opposes the push for war.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/iraq/bal-te.md.nsa04mar04,0,6966721,print.story

[ItsTheMediaStupid]

95. Your link doesn't work anymore.

Could you fix it please?

[seafan]

100. Try this one.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=1191

[msanthrope]

57. Comey is a Patriot. And he gave us Fitzy, too... n/t

[jazzjunkysue]

61. "The White House said that the program was "reviewed regularly

and approved by top officials including those at the Justice Department."

Yeah: Approved while sedated in the hospital. Wow.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,180318,00.html

[Sarah Ibarruri]

68. I KNOW the NYT didn't just come up with this. What else do they KNOW?

Oh my GOD this administration is so criminal!

[gatorboy]

71. It's nice to see how Gonzales really got his job..

Gotta have those "Yes Men" in the high positions, y'know?

PLus Bush'd push of Miers makes more sense now. He probably knew he couldn't keep this sevret forever and to have a few extra buddies on the Supreme Court when the shit hit the fan couldn't hurt...

[ClintonTyree]

72. This makes Gonzo's "investigation" a bit of a farce, doesn't it?

Since Gonzo was the one who was initially pushing for it, that makes his promise of a "thorough investigation" a laugher! :rofl: These miscreants never cease to amaze me. There's not a shred of doubt now that an independent investigation is called for. This shit that they're going to investigate themselves isn't going to cut it.

But do we really need an investigation at all? :shrug: #43 has said that the domestic spying was very limited in scale, and we can trust #43, right? WRONG! I don't trust that sorry sack of shit farther than I can throw him. If he says it was a very limited scale you can bet it was widespread and overly invasive. :mad: It's time for these criminals to pay the price for their unconstitutional lawbreaking. Impeach, NOW! :grr:

[kentuck]

75. The first 3 witnesses that Specter should call before his committee...

should be Card, Gonzalez, and Ashcroft. This is starting to unravel. We would see if all three refuse to answer questions because of national security or "executive privilege"? But, there is a glimmer of light slipping into this dark, secretive White House. We can only hope Arlen Specter and the Democrats on his committee are serious about this investigation.

[Justice Is Comin]

77. I think the first witness should be Comey,

then we'll know exactly what Card and Gonzalez wanted the back door to.

[Warren DeMontague]

78. That doesn't sound like the 'unproblematic exercise of executive power'

they keep telling us this deal is, now, does it?

[demgrrrll]

82. I wonder if this was done to keep Gonzales out of the "leak" investigation

Wasn't Gonzales the person who came forward with all the bully bluster about who "leaked" the information to the NYT or am I not remembering this correctly? If so then it might be in the Times best interest to put Gonzales on the sideline. THey are such a pack of criminals. Sometimes it is difficult to figure out all of their Byzantine maneuvering.

[nolabels]

85. Oh yea, now you, you NYT guys come forward, now that your ass might be....

on the line. Or is this just more faux pa, smoke up the rear, as it were? Do we need to review? Every step of the way the rag that is NYT was on the wagon with bushco (even when it seemed maybe they fell off a little). Now we have this little story to mull over. The whole thing sounds too convenient. The fact that maybe the feds have been spying on the domestics illegally for the last few decades sounds more like it.

It just seems with advent and explosion of the Internet across the globe that it's just too plain and obvious for everyone and they can't hide it anymore. So this is a nice place to say for them, that in effect we have been just been doing it for a just little while but really didn't put too much into it. Really though this too is is just another big hairy lie. I am skeptical to say the least

There are other forces working here with much bigger shadows, bushco is just another fish on the line for them. Bushco could have never invaded Iraq without the Corporate Americas tacit approval. The corporate world seems to be having one of glacial movements in their divorce with bushco. Must be the bottom line is not looking too good for ANY of them anymore?

[psychopomp]

87. Bush flailing defensively about wiretaps (video)

http://www.canofun.com/blog/videos/bushdefensiveaboutillegalspyingjan106.wmv

Notice, he can't say "civil liberties" ha ha...back on the bottle, Dubya? Little doubt in my mind!

[nolabels]

90. Like the joke is deep and all but being civil is like tying your own hands

To tie your own hands behind your back and capitulate the words "do what you want". They know the rules and we know the rules yet they seem to think the rest of us will follow them why the ones set to enforce them do not. This is already anarchy with no relief in sight.


When the time comes short and the abandonment of what is known comes, where will you be and what will you be prepared to do about it :shrug:

NSA DOMESTIC SPYING USES WEST VIRGINIA FACILITY
(snip)
Pike said the top-secret program probably has intercepted millions of e-mail, fax and voice communications. The Bush plan likely started out as a search for "sleeper cells" of unknown terrorists, making it impossible to get a warrant in an ordinary fashion, Pike added.

Instead, he said he believes millions of communications were intercepted and then sifted through by computers run by the NSA. They look for key words, or patterns of speech, he said. "If you say 'send money' and the reply is 'the quick gray fox jumped through the loop,' it could come in for further review." . . .

How many messages are intercepted is not known, though in 1992 a former NSA director said that 2 million messages were being intercepted hourly. Data processing speed and storage capacity since then have mushroomed.

Pike said that before Sept. 11 parts of intercepted conversations originating from Americans were blanked out. It is the procedure, or at least part of it, that he believes was switched off after the attacks. He said he bases his reasoning on a careful reading of White House statements about the technical means used and the reasons given for not going to a special secret federal court to get warrants. If Pike is right, then the government's spy operations have been far larger than previously disclosed. . .
(snip)
http://prorev.com/2005/12/nsa-domestic-spying-uses-west-virginia.htm

[psychopomp]

92. I meant literally

He flubs the term in his pr stunt at the hospital on 1 January.

I think the time *has* become short and the "known" has been abandoned so I guess I can say that I am right where I am just now ; )

[nolabels]

99. His lying smirk face tells it all don't it?

The most honest role he ever played was being a cheerleader at Yale, strictly down hill from there.

Those big block parties where everybody knows something bad about that certain someone but nobody is giving a peep on how they found out it are kind of fun. * is slowly losing grip on his composure and most of reality to the point of wigging out altogether but I do just kind of wonder if the rest of us can hold out

[wordpix]

101. Note * doesn't mention spying on ACLU, Greenpeace and PETA

[nolabels]

105. The news is that anybody and everybody was the target

The potential of millions upon millions of felonies were committed willfully, brazenly with real disregard for standing law is about as flagrant as it comes. To boast of it like it is a present and ongoing process and policy is an affront to everyone no matter who they are.

The talking point of "I don't care if they spy on me, I have nothing to hide" is irrelevant. The abridgment or taking away to anyones rights, no matter what the right or liberty is as backward as it can get for a government that is sworn to uphold and secure them rights and liberties.

What they have done here is no different than if they rounding up fire arms or closing down newspapers

[seafan]

94. Thanks for this clip. Two things struck me...

One was the constant inappropriate smiling as he was defending his actions that violate private citizens' Constitutional rights to privacy, against unlawful search and seizure.

The second was the noticeable left-sided lower facial droop.


The lies he was telling made no further impression.

[greiner3]

96. Where will it all end? I don't see impeachment;

Anytime soon that is. The sheeple have cheap gas now. Rumors of a troop reduction have surfaced. We're pretty much stuck with the half dozen, or so, criminal indictments coming up. Call me a pessimist (ok, so I am), but the crooks may get away with this and retain power in the legislature in Nov.

BTW, good info in this thread!

[wordpix]

102. but our highest gov official broke a major law and it didn't involve a BJ

[Supersedeas]

98. Shopping for Cronyies--don't like what the acting cronie has to say--try

another until the King gets the 'approval' he needs.

This Program is go arbitrary all the way round.

[bettyellen]

104. Newsweek says ASHCROFT REFUSED TO OK IT from his hospital bed....

can't find any other sources, but it's a good detailed report .....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2016782

[Th1onein]

107. Maybe this is why Ashcroft resigned not long after the hospital stay?

n/t