Ten Commandment debate may arise in Ohio

[sasquatch]

Ten Commandment debate may arise
by Laura Birchoff
Dayton Daily News

Ohio may be the next state where the religous right and civil libertarions debate what place the Ten Commandments have in goverment.

<snip>

But Gilb noted James Madison reffered to the commandments in the context of self governance and that 12 of the 13 colonies incorperated them in their civil codes. He said they address fundamental moral truths and establish the pillars of "all just societies" including respect for God and family, and the recognition of the sanctity of human life and the right to own property.

here's the link
http://www.daytondailynews.com/localnews/content/localnews/daily/1008ten.html


Hey Ohio DUers keep your powder dry the Snakehandlers and Fundamentalist are coming:mad:

[Cloud]

1. Not again.

I am sure the constitution prohibits favoring one religion over others. Might as well put up a momument to the 5 pillars of Islam. I wonder what the fundies would have to say to that.

I think this paragraph from the story sums my views up nicely.

"Dave Silverman, national spokesman for American Atheists, said the Bill of Rights specifically contradicts the Ten Commandments in several places. The Constitution guarantees freedom of religion and speech; the commandments dictate worship of one God and prohibit taking God's name in vain, he said."

[sasquatch]

2. They're fucking with the wrong state this time though

:kick:

We ain't the south we'll throw you out on your asses.

[Cloud]

3. Oh yeah that's right

They are a lot more liberal in the north than they are in the south. I can't wait to see what happens later.

[sasquatch]

4. Hopefully a northern ass kicking

:evilgrin:

[WoodrowFan]

14. Adams County

I think some of the counties involved include Adams country, along the river to the East of Conconnati. That's pretty conservative fundy Christian down there....

[theHandpuppet]

22. Findlay is in NW Ohio!

The Repuke rep involved in this is from Findlay, which is in NW Ohio, not the rural southern counties along the Ohio.

Looks like the Buckeyes in the north will have to clean up their own house before pointing the finger again at Appalachian Ohio.

--- A DUer Buckeye native from Scioto County

[T Bone]

35. That Findlay district stretches eastward from FIndlay

across a section of farm country in North Central Ohio, if it is the one I am thinking about. Farming, smaller towns. Maybe includes Marion, home of Warren Harding---but it's not like he was a strict follower of the Ten Commandments. He was the worst president ever until he got posthumously lucky in 2000.

[starroute]

5. Right to own property? They've got to be kidding

Since when does a warning not to covet your neighbor's maidservent constitute a statement of the right to own property?

I know they say the devil can quote scripture, but this is getting ridiculous.

It sounds to me like this particular piece of religion has gotten far too corrupted by the greedheads to be of any use as moral or practical guidance. Far better to toss it out and start over with something sounder.

[drscm]

7. Thow shalt not covet your neighbor's maidservant,

but you may grope her against her will.

[expatriot]

10. Thou Shall Not Steal...

...is probably the commandment they are thinking of...

[starroute]

29. You may be correct, but there's no right to private property there either

In a totally socialist state, stealing would mean stealing from the government.

In a tribal society, it could mean stealing from the community.

In an environmentally-based society, where the land and the air and the water are considered to be the common endowment of all beings on the planet and all their future generations, any attempt to cordon off some of those resources and use them for private profit is also theft.

I thought the person quoted was pointing to the "shalt not covet" commandment because that one at least implies a society where people can own things -- like houses and asses and women -- whereas the "shalt not steal" one doesn't even go that far.

But it doesn't really matter which commandment is being referenced. The larger point is that (despite everything in the New Testament that says differently) Christianity has never doubted the right of rich folk to be rich, and Protestant Christianity in particular has evolved hand in hand with capitalism over the last 500 years, to the point where it has become completely useless as a source of resistance to the horrors of capitalism.

The blurring of the distinction between church and state isn't just a threat to the state. It's also a way of undermining and corrupting the moral authority of the church, and that's even scarier.

[no_arbusto]

6. You can vote more than once!

The poll is not restricted :evilgrin:

[PennyLane]

13. That complaint.........

........is voiced a lot in regards to the Dayton Daily's polls!
Very easy to manipulate! :smoke:

[VolcanoJen]

8. Whew!! At first, I thought they were talking about Dayton.

Dayton's not a bad town, honestly. And I was worried when I saw that the article was from the Dayton Daily News.

But, apparently, the wacky state rep is from Findlay, also knows as Flag City USA.

Time for my southern-stateside Buckeyes to show Findlay what's up.

}(

[sasquatch]

11. I think we should just have a in state civil war

and force our freepers to move back into the hills of Kentucky. Then Ohio will get back on track.

[expatriot]

9. The 10 Commandments are anti-everything America stand for

Commandment #2 (Exo. 20:4)

You shall make for yourself no graven image, or any likeness of anything that is the heaven above or that is in the earth beneath or that is in the water beneath the earth, you shall not bow down to them or serve them; for I am the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing steadfast love to the thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments.


Is this the ideal of American justice, punishing the children for the crimes of the father?

[Bandit]

23. "am a jealous God,"

This has always baffled me. What could God possibly be jealous of if he/she is the one and only God. :crazy:

[TreasonousBastard]

12. The colonies????

Well, we did fight a war to stop being colonies, didn't we? And weren't a number of colonies specifically started in the name of religious freedom? A religious freedom that often became intolerant in its own right?

One of the colonies that got away from sticking God in the law was Virginia. Jefferson wrote the Virginia Statute of Religious Freedom while it was a colony, and that became the basis of the Establishment Clause.

Jefferson considered that statute to be the crowning achievement of his life, even above his Presidency or the Declaration, and many agree.

[Lexingtonian]

15. They should do it.

The Democrats should hold a swearing in ceremony in which they individually declare themselves personally bound by the Ten Commandments.

Then the Republicans will have to follow suite. This has to get videotaped. And then put to good use in the campaign to follow. "Republican John Smith swore to uphold the Ten Commandments. We all saw it. Now John Smith has lied to you and violated a total of six of the Ten Commandments. He lied about X. He lied about Y. He voted for Bill Z, even though that steals from elderly people like his parents. He voted to let Company W bilk people like you.
Republican John Smith: He calls himself a Christian. He breaks the Ten Commandments more often than you go to the gas station. Why does anyone vote for him?"

[sasquatch]

30. They already have the market on religous crazies

They'll just bring up abortion and that he isn't snake handling enough.

[lucky777]

16. This Figures . . . Ohio is a Backwards Place

Just moved here from Portland, Oregon. I had no choice, I am a professor. What a terrible state! It is full of the most unimaginative people you could ever find; not many new ideas coming out of here. The problem is that there is virtually zero alternative culture and no big cities to create a critical mass of different cultures. So this doesn't surprise me at all.

[cmd]

17. Welcome to the backwoods

You must be stuck in the southwestern part of the state. It gets a
little bit better in the Cleveland area. I wish I lived there.

[theHandpuppet]

24. I hope you don't teach math or geography!

No large cities? Portland ranks 28th among this country's 50 largest cities (by population); Columbus is ranked 15th and Cleveland 33rd. Just off the list is Cincinnati, located in a heavily populated area which extends from N. Kentucky to Dayton.

As the saying goes, "Seek and Ye shall find". Become part of the solution and not the problem.

[Jack The Tab]

27. In addition to the "smaller cities"...

Toledo, Akron, Dayton, Canton, ...

Although diversity seems to be a bit lacking in the Southern part of the state, overall the state is a pretty harmonious one.

As for the person stating that there is little innovation...Do you know that ohio ranks 6 in most patents this year? Oregon wasn't in the top 10. Not to get provincial or anything, but you should look some stuff up before you make a blanket statement about a state, particularly on this board.

[Jack The Tab]

28. Where do you live?

I could understand your fustration if you are in the Rural south, where maybe there is little in the way of diversity, but try to refrain from framing the entire state based on where you live.

Travel around the state and visit our cities. Cleveland Heights is perhaps one of the most integrated communities in America, and that is no exageration.

[sasquatch]

31. Come to our gathering sometime.

The state in whole is a moderate state. Remember this is the same state where Dennis Kucinich, Howard Metzanbaum and John Glenn hail from. You must live near Cincinnati?

[booksenkatz]

18. Do y'all mind if

we folks up in Michigan mosey on down to help out? Anything y'all need -- iced tea, lawn chairs, burning effigies -- just give us a holler.

[demdave]

19. Bring it on down, we might be able to teach you a little football

While you are here, I hear you folks up in Michigan are going to try to put a team together if you can figure out the rules. :evilgrin:

[booksenkatz]

21. Urgh

I grew up with waaaaaay too much football in Texas, so I'm probably living in the right state now, since I don't give a rat's ass about it, LOL!

[sasquatch]

32. Bring your Axhandle's

;)

[theHandpuppet]

20. There is a poll along with the article....

... so make sure y'all drop by and vote! So far the Bible-thumpers are winning.

[davidinalameda]

25. don't they have more important things to do

instead of wasting money on meaningless resolutions?

If I lived in Ohio, I'd start writing some nasty assed letters complaining about these people wasting tax dollars to hold meaningless debates and to take meaningless votes

[sasquatch]

33. No they don't

The Republicans have destroyed our economy, national security, trust in the world, military and schools. Now they've got to destroy religous barriers in goverment as well.

[hyphenate]

26. I think I managed

to put the poll on the "nay" side by a few extra couple of hundred points. You just need to check off the "no" and then continually press the vote button. You will see votes being tallied in the status bar, but as long as you keep pressing, votes will go up without switching to the results page. Then just hit "back" and continue on some more. :)

P.S. Freepers are the ones I find notorious at busting polls. I've seen it so much, it's nice to reciprocate once in a great while.

[sasquatch]

34. Fight Fire with Fire

:)