U.S. Doubts Iraq Rebels Can Keep It Up

[chlamor]

U.S. doubts Iraq rebels can keep it up


By Eric Schmitt The New York Times

MONDAY, MAY 9, 2005


WASHINGTON Insurgents in Iraq are drawing on dozens of stockpiled, bomb-rigged cars and groups of foreign fighters smuggled into the country in recent weeks to carry out most of the suicide attacks that have killed about 300 people in the past 10 days, senior American officers and intelligence officials say.
 
The insurgents exploded 135 car bombs in April, up from 69 in March, and more than in any other month in the two-year American occupation. For the first time last month, more than 50 percent of the car-bombings were suicide attacks, some remotely detonated, suggesting that Iraqis, who typically do not use that tactic, are being forced or duped into driving those missions, one top American general said.
 
Senior American officers predict that the insurgents, including Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the Jordanian militant whose network has claimed responsibility for the deadliest suicide bombings, will not be able to sustain the level of attacks much longer. And the attacks have not yet dented recruiting for the American-trained Iraqi security forces.
 
<snip>

"When he cranks up the propaganda campaign, it means we've probably hurt him," Brigadier General John DeFreitas 3rd, the senior military intelligence officer in Iraq, said of Zarqawi. "It's a tool in his arsenal and he has used it effectively."

http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/05/09/news/pent.php
 

[davidinalameda]

1. didn't they say the same thing about the Viet Cong?

:shrug:

[grytpype]

8. light at the end of the tunnel...

... is being seen by us.

[saigon68]

13. THE LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL

Is an 80 car coal train coming at you at 75 MPH.

ENJOY !!!!!

[soup]

49. Your post made me think of this

Title: Horse and Train, (1954)
Artist: Alex Colville
Medium: casein tempera
Size: 41.2 x 54.2 cm
Donor: Gift of Dominion Foundries and Steel, Ltd., 1957
http://www.artgalleryofhamilton.on.ca/edu/singArt.asp?artID=10

On track...

[Bigmack]

31. Racism alert!

Bush and his asshole buddies better be glad they're up against Iraqis instead of Vietnamese.

No offense to the Iraqis, but Mr. Charles was REALLY tough!

[IndianaGreen]

32. We decimated the Vietcong during Tet

Too bad no one bothered to tell North Vietnam about our "victory."

[Seabiscuit]

35. Yup. And they said the same thing last year, too.

Does anyone actually believer their crap anymore?

[leftchick]

39. yes. Plenty of them!

They are called Faux News viewers.

[jamesinca]

80. That is exactly what they said back in '66

Here is the abstract from the N.Y. Times, even the experts agreed that the war there would be over by Christmas of 1966. They misssed that one by a few days I think. The only reason I know this article is because it was a homework assignment from high school over 20 years ago. I think this is the only thing that really stuck in my head from those days.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Hope for '66 Peace Is Seen in Ottawa; 1966 PEACE HOPE SEEN IN OTTAWA
By JAY WALZ Special to The New York Times. New York Times (1857-Current file). New York, N.Y.: Jan 20, 1966. pg. 1, 2 pgs

Abstract (Document Summary)
OTTAWA, Jan. 19 Increasing hazards and hardships encountered by the Vietcong in South Vietnam could lead to peace in 1966, in the opinion of experts on Vietnam in the Canadian Department of External Affairs.

[Skink]

2. What will we say about the big one...

:nuke:

[jimshoes]

3. I agree

pretty soon they are going to run out of cars.

[LiberallyInclined]

4. "Bring. It. On........part deux

lil' boots just oughta come right out and triple-dog dare them...

[MrModerate]

5. Blowing up police recruits is one hell of a "propaganda campaign"

What planet is this DeFreitas from and how do I get off it?

[smoogatz]

6. Didn't Meyers just say the insurgency could go on for years?

These guys need to get their story straight.

[tabasco]

68. It's like riding a Tilt-A-Whirl - round and round we go !!!!

You really need to spin when you are covering up one of the greatest crimes ever committed by the United States.

They never did get their story stright on why we went to war.

But the gullible American public will only care when it is their ass on the line. That will be when we have a draft.

[Judi Lynn]

71. Obessive spinners.

If you doubt them, you're a terrorist lover, or a commie.

[GetTheRightVote]

7. This is getting out of hand, when will the American Public wake up ???

:kick:

[saigon68]

12. The SHEEP are sleeping in their Heated WATERBEDS tonight

As some other Bastard's Kid is shredded into HASH

[mermaid]

18. Yep

And why should they care? It's not THEIR kid getting shredded into hash to keep their SUV's all gassed up. One wonders if they'd be willing to gas up their SUV's with their OWN KID'S blood...hell, maybe I shouldn't ask that, some of these assholes probably WOULD, too...

[saigon68]

21. I've SEEN and lived this before.

What did 58,000 US service members die for?

Not to mention 2 1/2 million Vietnamese, Cambodians and Laotians?

I know Dow and Dupont Corporate Profits

FIGHT THE RICH--- NOT THEIR WARS.

[lildreamer316]

61. Anyone think we should make "eat the rich" our theme song?

..but I need to go look up all the lyrics first...

[Vogon_Glory]

79. I'm Sure You Did Indeed

I'm sure you did indeed. I was just young enough that I didn't have to worry about the draft. I really did not want to get drafted, then sent off to South East Asia.

Of course, for a flabby middle-aged slacker like me, not having enlisted makes it a little awkward to criticize those right-wingers who actually DID put in time in the US armed forces. Fortunately, so many of the Republicans in the US House of Representatives and the US Senate, as well as more than a few here in the Texas legislature took the O'Reilly/Limbaugh/Hannity approach to US military service (They weren't drafted and didn't choose to enlist) that I can mock their pseudo-patriotic bombast in good conscience.

While there were a very few guys in my age bracket who did enlist, most of the late Baby Boom leadership cohort obviously didn't.

[MichiganVote]

9. So far they've been wrong about everything. Why believe them now?

[Barrett808]

62. Precisely. I use this maxim all the time with the * mafia n/t

[stillcool]

10. no mention of the sucide belts?

read somewhere these are making a big come-back in Iraq. i can't even imagine living there...

[thebigidea]

11. Iraq Rebels Doubt US Can Keep it Up

[catnhatnh]

50. Exactly....

....notice anbody else (US) cranking up their propaganda...and we say that means what-desperation or somesuch...right?

[alcuno]

14. Yeah. Just as soon as they use up all those missing explosives.

How much was missing again?

[IChing]

16. 780,000 lbs at one site

One ounce can blow a hum vee to tomorrow or yesterday.

[acmavm]

15. Who's coming up with this stuff? What do they expect them to do? Decide

that they like living in an occupied country with the occupiers bleeding the country dry and the main guy who lied to justify this whole fiasco is running the oil ministry?

I'm sure I'd be believing the guys who lied to the world about why they just had to attack a country was no danger to us, or anyone else for that matter, and then got caught lying about lying.

[NNN0LHI]

17. Why? Are the Iraqis going somewhere?

Someone is losing touch with reality here. The Iraqis have two options. Death or victory. The US on the other hand has many options. The most obvious and smartest one being is to pack their shit up and head back where they came from. And try and take as few casualties as possible while loading into the transports.

Don

[Roy]

19. NO.....The insurgents can't keep this pace up.....

So they will just throw more and more kids in harms way, are they saying that the insurgents will run out of bombs before the US runs out of kids to blow up?
Yeh, that's the ticket... they will tire eventually.

Either they are dumb or think the rest of the world is..

[chlamor]

20. Square Jawed Rugged Tough Talk

From the Green Zone. I'm not going out there let's-

[pinniped]

22. More like * is cranking up the propaganda campaign.

--"When he cranks up the propaganda campaign, it means we've probably hurt him," Brigadier General John DeFreitas 3rd, the senior military intelligence officer in Iraq, said of Zarqawi.--

Funny, they always accuse others of doing what they are practicing themselves.

[NJCher]

53. typical MO for a repuke

You can set your clock by it. Whatever they accuse others of is what they're up to themselves.

Remember how they accused Democrats of tampering with the voting machines. Yeah, Feeney sitting down there in Florida, commissioning programs to "see how they'd do it."


Cher

[The_Casual_Observer]

23. I'm going to save this one and see what tune they are singing 3 years from

now.

[w4rma]

24. Everytime a life is ruined in Iraq another 'insurgent' is created.

These 'insurgents' can keep this up as long as lives are being ruined in Iraq.

[saigon68]

26. If Iraq invaded the amerika and some rustic killed my mother

I wouldn't exactly get a job kissing the Iraqi asses at Provisional headquarters.

Or licking the boots of some collaborators who threw in with the Rustics.

[IChing]

25. More deaths and violence means less war

failure is success, war is peace

democracy is fascism, or is it fascism is democracy freedom is slavery, it just goes on and on doesn't it?

[chlamor]

27. It will go quickly

“We will, in fact, be greeted as liberators. . . . I think it will go relatively quickly... (in) weeks rather than months.” – Vice President Cheney <3/16/03>

"I just want you to know that, when we talk about war, we're really talking about peace." —George W. Bush ;Washington, D.C. June 18, 2002

[muriel_volestrangler]

41. I could hardly believe Bush said something that Orwellian

so I looked it up - and he did, of course. In a speech at HUD. I suspect the webmaster at HUD thought it was an idiotic thing to say, because here's the photo he chose to illustrate Bush's speech:



http://www.hud.gov/news/speeches/presremarks.cfm

In a pathetic attempt to justify his "we're gonna get them thar killers" remarks in a speech about housing, he also came up with: "They hate the idea that somebody can go buy a home." :banghead:

[NJCher]

55. First laugh of the day award goes to you

"They hate the idea that somebody can go buy a home."


OMG! And I thought "they hate us for our freedom" was bad.

Yeah, I'm sure those Iraqis are sitting around coffee shops hating the idea that somebody can go buy a home. OMG. They don't have one 'cuz we blew it up but they hate it because somebody can go buy one.

You know, this idiot would come in last in a composition 101 course at a school that didn't pass a NCLB standard.


Cher

[wildwww2]

28. Our faux leadership still looks like the keystone cops 2 years after

the court appointed idiot went on the USS Abraham Lincoln and spouted Mission Accomplished. Who is stupid enough to swallow this bullcrap? I`m glad I don`t belong to that bunch. Must be criminally insane like Bu$h to believe that garbage.
Peace
Wildman
Al Gore is My President

[number6]

29. Iraq Rebels Doubt * Can Keep his thingy Up

chimp the limp dick

[deadparrot]

30. They're right.

Sooner or later, the insurgents will run out of people to kill.

...

[PennyLane]

33. Sure They Can.........

.....if, as I suspect, they are being funded by the Saudis.

[DoYouEverWonder]

44. Looks like the Saudis

are reassuring their Syrian friends that they can depend on them if Georgie wants to expand his little war.

[MadisonProgressive]

73. Abdullah you two-timing freak!

you were just holding hands and making kissy-face with georgie just a week or so ago1

[LynnTheDem]

34. US Cartel has been "doubting" that, declaring "back is broken", and

the insurgents & attacks are dwindling going on 3 years now.

And the on-going war in Afghanistan is in its 4th year.

[LynnTheDem]

36. "When cranks up propaganda campaign, means we've probably hurt him"

said the US, cranking up their propaganda campaign.

[Seabiscuit]

37. Dubya can't even get it up.

[oblivious]

38. Iraqi Resistance Doubts U.S. Can Keep It Up

By Oblivious, Democratic Underground

MONDAY, MAY 9, 2005

U.S. forces in Iraq are drawing on thousands of stockpiled bombs and missiles, and a dwindling number of Iraqi troops brought into service in recent weeks to carry out most of the attacks that have killed about 300 people in the past 10 days, senior resistance officials say.

The invaders dropped 135 1000 pound bombs and 267 500-pound bombs, up from 66 and 87 respectively in March, and more than in any other month since April 2003.

Senior resistance officers in Bagdad, Ramadi and Kabul predict that US forces will not be able to sustain the level of attacks much longer. And the attacks have not yet dented recruiting for the Iraqi resistance.

<snip>

"When they crank up the propaganda campaign, it means we've probably hurt them," said the one-legged formerly dead Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, Al-qaeda's new #3 man, after the capture of the organisation's top coffee boy, Abu Faraj al-Libbi, of the US forces. "It's a tool in their arsenal and they have used it effectively."

[leftchick]

40. Now That is a much more realistic scenario!

:applause:

[muriel_volestrangler]

42. Top coffee boy!

:rofl: :applause:

[DrDebug]

47. That's a more likely headline

Those precise bombings for some reason do not stop the recruitment of new insurgents. Wonder how that's possible?

[NJCher]

56. it's the same general law of physics

That causes high gas prices to have no effect on SUV sales.


Cher

[MadisonProgressive]

75. It's the old law of...

You punch me in the mouth, I kick you in the balls!

[leftchick]

43. Remember the Cut and Paste Pentagon Papers?

Sheesh, was this just last week?

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/GE05Ak04.html

Truths collide
The uncensored Pentagon report at least allows the international public to know that there were no less than 15,527 attacks on the occupation forces from July 2004 to March 2005. In Baghdad alone, from November to March 12, there were 2,404 attacks. These numbers confirm that when US Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and his minions spin that the situation in Iraq is under control they are essentially lying. In the three months since the Iraqi elections there may have been fewer American casualties, but there were countless more assassination attempts against the so-called Iraqi security forces, all of them based on precise intelligence. Every day, there are at least 20 bomb attacks in Baghdad alone, and at least 60 throughout Iraq.

[DoYouEverWonder]

45. Last time I checked

there were 25 million of them and only about 150,000 of us? Now tell me again who is going to run out resources first?

[ihelpu2see]

46. How many brave soldiers have to die for our leaders guesses?

and how much civilian suffering and how much money has been thrown at the problem for what no WMDs and only to depose a minor Dictator who has not killed as many as have been "ethnically cleansed" in Africa... a disastrous foreign policy!

[shayes51]

52. Exactly!

[Vogon_Glory]

48. The Insurgents Still Have, Cars, Bombs, Drivers

Contrary to the Bushwah coming out from Gee Dubya's Duck Soup Posse, I see no reason to believe that the Iraqi insurgents are running low on explosives, automobiles, or drivers. There were hundreds of tons of explosives left unsecured and subsequently looted after the occupation, there are hundreds of cars and trucks in Iraq (And more entering every day), and all too many fanatics more than willing to blow themselves up to kill an "infidel."

[cliss]

65. Yes, they do.

I think one of the best posts I've read here at the DU was about 2 years ago. The poster wrote (I'll paraphrase);

the Iraqis have an undisputed advantage in this conflict. It's their country. They know the terrain. They will 1 US troop, we kill 100 Iraqis. We spend $4,900,000,000 per month, they spend $100.00. We're going broke.

They have an unlimited amount of time, we don't. There is tremendous pressure for the US to deliver results to the world community. The world is watching.

The Pentagon knows that they only have a certain window of time to somehow make this a success; at some point Americans will stand up and start revolting (like VietNam in its later stages).

In fact, they got all these explosives for free. Courtesy of the US. Guess who has the upper hand in this.

[0007]

51. Behind 50 to 0 the coach tells his players, "we got gotta em

where we want em"

[symbolman]

54. There are

TONS of high grade explosives that were trundled off from bunkers by god knows who, remember this was one of the HUGE points made by Kerry during the campaign (and I, like a chump was hoping the sheeple would wake up and smell the grass) and even touted by the MSM during the pre-selection of Bush.

TONS.

Like someone else posted, an ounce of this stuff would blow a Humvee and all of it's occupants back into the stone age (which isn't that far away there, as one General quipped about Afganistan, "We won, we beat the FLINTSTONES." Making big rocks into smaller rocks)..

Let's do a little experiment. Let's ALL together lie down in our beds and IMAGINE as CLEARLY as you can that Bush has been IMPEACHED and is leaving the White HOuse in SHAME, just like Nixon.

Einstein himself proved that simply OBSERVING a physical action in the universe CHANGES that action. This is PROOF by one of our best living minds that WE can actually CHANGE the flow of matter and energy.

Maybe we should create a National, "Visualize Bush IMPEACHED" campaign and get as many people as possible worldwide to simply meditate on this image and think of nothing else ALL AT THE SAME TIME.

I truly believe that if enough minds ever got involved that there could be a flashpoint or tipping point at which the actual CHANGE would OCCUR.

And I don't even buy into any New Age crap, this is just something that appears to be valid. THey've even proven in blind tests that Prayer (another form of visualization) can actually CURE people at a distance. THe more praying the better.

Maybe we can all FIRST groupthink ANDY to good health and then IMPEACH BUSH for dessert :)

Anyone here Grok what I'm saying :)

(Maybe I should post this as a seperate thread as well..)

[DoYouEverWonder]

76. Please do

I'm willing to try anything at this point.

[leesa]

57. Oh please! The Iraqis have had thousands of years of practice fending off

marauding hordes. Plus, they have nothing to lose.

[maddezmom]

58. NYT headline: Rebels Said to Have Pool of Bomb-Rigged Cars

interesting how the IHT changed it :eyes:

[oblivious]

59. Very interesting. The American papers basically kept the NYT headline.

The IHT headline doesn't come close to matching the opening two paragraphs. The headline person was quite desperate to make a propaganda point.

Rebels Said to Have Pool of Bomb-Rigged Cars
New York Times
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/09/politics/09military.html?pagewanted=all&oref=login

Insurgents said to have pool of bomb-rigged cars
Duluth News Tribune, MN
http://www.duluthsuperior.com/mld/duluthsuperior/11600500.htm

Militants said to use stockpiled car bombs
Arkansas Democrat-Gazette
http://www.ardemgaz.com/ShowStoryTemplate.asp?Path=ArDemocrat/2005/05/09&ID=Ar00105&Section=National

[DeepModem Mom]

60. NYT: Iraq Rebels Said to Have Pool of Bomb-Rigged Cars

Rebels Said to Have Pool of Bomb-Rigged Cars
By ERIC SCHMITT
Published: May 9, 2005


WASHINGTON, May 8 - Insurgents in Iraq are drawing on dozens of stockpiled, bomb-rigged cars and groups of foreign fighters smuggled into the country in recent weeks to carry out most of the suicide attacks that have killed about 300 people in the last 10 days, senior American officers and intelligence officials say.

Insurgents exploded 135 car bombs in April, up from 69 in March and more than in any other month in the two-year American occupation.

For the first time last month, more than 50 percent of the car-bombings were suicide attacks, some remotely detonated. The officers and officials have not drawn a single conclusion from this, but one top American general said it suggested that Iraqis were being coerced or duped into driving those missions.

Senior American officers predict that the insurgents, including Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the Jordanian militant whose network has claimed responsibility for the deadliest suicide bombings, will not be able to sustain the level of attacks much longer. And the attacks have not yet dented recruiting for the American-trained Iraqi security forces.

But these officers acknowledged that the increase in suicide bombings over the last two weeks, while possibly a last-ditch effort, had won the militants important propaganda victories by gaining worldwide news media coverage. The benefits, they said, would include bolstering insurgent morale that flagged after the Jan. 30 elections, and depicting the newly formed Iraqi government as incapable of protecting its citizenry....


http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/09/politics/09military.html

[Zodiak]

69. Wishful thinking article that provides ZERO facts.

This article is terrible. There is nothing in this that is based on fact at all.

"Senior Administration Officials and Intelligence officers." is cute. No one named, and no one here that you can trust. Administration officials have proven themselves to be deliberate liars and the intelligence services have been purged completely, courteesy of Porter Goss.

Of course, watching the TV, none of these things happened, right?

Notice the last paragraph quoted on this thread? By mentioning that the media reporting the attacks would bolster the insurgents propaganda war, the officials are putting out a tacit warning to media companies that they are intensely dissatisfied that the media would portray the raping of Iraq in any terms other than that defined by the Administration.

Chilling and "in your face".

[Roland99]

63. The same administration that said we'd be greeted with kisses and flowers?

Excuse me while I

:puke:

[wallwriter]

64. How 'bout Iraq Rebels Doubt U.S. Can Keep It Up

Anyone remember the USSR in Afghanistan?

[Generator]

66. IS LBN supposed to be a source of ridiculously absurd titles?

Cause I don't know whether to laugh or cry. The hysteria is infecting me.

It's like wishful thinking. Is that all our combined, CIA, military, state department can come up with?

Scratching chin~ "They can't possibly keep this up, now can they,no sirree, Rummy!"

It's a fact because they want it to be so?????????

[kymar57]

70. what the heck has come of rummy anyway

:shrug:

[Jacobin]

78. You must have forgotten!! Rummy "Doesn't do quagmires"

When he uttered those words of ultimate hubris, I repeated them several times to myself to make sure I remembered them correctly for the inevitable.

[Javaman]

67. Perhaps if they used Viagra. Nice title.

[Rex]

72. Made a dent in U.S recruiting!

Who says they are aiming at Iraqis? THEY ARE IRAQIS! Holy Fucking Christ on a Cross...are we going to go down that road again? Goodbye mom, hello Vietnam.

[ElaineinIN]

74. You know, they've been so accurate to date about

the strength of the insurgency, they must know what they are talking about...

right???

:puke:

[Darranar]

77. See? We have them beaten. Again. n/t

[AuntiBush]

81. Insurgent Bombing UP 2 times since last month alone!

Google the news for 5/9/05. It was on MSNBC today.