Witnesses say US forces killed unarmed civilians

[DoYouEverWonder]

24 November 2004

Allegations of widespread abuse by US forces in Fallujah, including the killing of unarmed civilians and the targeting of a hospital in an attack, have been made by people who have escaped from the city.

They said, in interviews with The Independent, that as well as deaths from bombs and artillery shells, a large number of people including children were killed by American snipers. US forces refused repeated calls for medical aid for injured civilians, they said.

Some of the killings took place in the build-up to the assault on the rebel stronghold, and at least in one case - that of the death of a family of seven, including a three-month baby - the American authorities have admitted responsibility and offered compensation.

The refugees from Fallujah describe a situation of extreme violence in which remaining civilians in the city, who have been told by the Americans to leave, appeared to have been seen as complicit in the insurgency. Men of military age were particularly vulnerable. But there are accounts of children as young as four, and women and old men being killed.

more...

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/story.jsp?story=586045

[cassiepriam]

1. The public will not care........

nothing seems to matter to them anymore.
They have no conscience.

[DoYouEverWonder]

8. The majority of Americans only care about

What the media tells them to care about. Since the MSM, doesn't cover the war crimes and atrocities that are being committed by US troops in Iraq, then they don't exist.

[radwriter0555]

24. The correct names are "GENOCIDE" and "HOLOCAUST"... seeing as

we're now under the new Uhmurrikkkan nazi regime.

[JohnyCanuck]

27. The public will not know.........

Because the US corporate whore media will not have time to report on this seeing as how they have much more important things to cover like celebrity murder trials.

[Magleetis]

2. I feel so comforted

that I live in the land of moral values.

[salin]

3. Good Morning, Vietnam

:cry:

[booksenkatz]

4. Ah, compensation!

And how much is an Iraqi life worth? Buck, buck-fifty?

Yeah, as long as we're throwing a little cash their way (once in awhile) for the slaughter, I don't see a problem.
:puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke::puke:

[ebayfool]

7. offered compensation...yeah, that'll make them feel better!

Of course 'compensation' is hard to spend when you're dead. This is nuts.

[leftchick]

5. US Snipers Shooting kids!

I don't know how the troops that do this can live with themselves...

~snip~

The doctor said that the attack took place despite assurances from American officers that they were aware of its location and would ensure that it was spared military action.

Dr Abbas, 28, said: "We had five people under treatment and they were killed. We do not know why the clinic was hit. Our colleagues from the Fallujah General Hospital, which was further out in the city, had talked to the Americans and had told us that they would avoid attacking us.

"Afterwards myself and other members of staff went from house to house when we could to help people who had been hurt. Many of them died in front of us because we did not have the medicine or the facilities to carry out operations. We contacted the doctors at the Fallujah hospital and said how bad the situation was. We wanted them to evacuate the more badly injured and send drugs and more doctors. They tried to do that, but they said the Americans stopped them.

"One of things we noticed the most were the numbers of people killed by American snipers. They were not just men but women and some children as well. The youngest one I saw was a four-year-old boy. Almost all these people had been shot in the head, chest or neck."

[Junkdrawer]

14. Some don't. Some come home and commit suicide. Some commit...

suicide if the field.

And I just shudder to think about some of the others if and when they finally do come home.

Support the troops. Bring them home.

[DoYouEverWonder]

18. And some come home and are 'suicided'

I heard a story that the rash of suicides at Ft. Bragg right after Tora Bora, were all in the same group of Special Ops guys who saw bin Laden go on his free helicopter ride.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

44. love that sig pic

does someone make stickers like that?

that is pretty clever :D

[JNelson6563]

6. We promote a culture of life!

At least until people are out of the womb. Then we kill you.

Truly horrifying.

Julie

[bones_7672]

9. Ah, a report from a British Newspaper! Now I believe it (not)! nt

[DoYouEverWonder]

10. Since you think you know so much

Maybe you could tell us what is really going on in Iraq? Maybe they're just having a flower shortage?

[bunkerbuster1]

11. And chocolate. Don't forget the chocolate.

Where'd they wind up putting "George W. Bush Plaza", again?

[NNN0LHI]

12. Where do you go for news that you believe? Fox news maybe? n/t

[Englander]

13. What's not to believe? One of the first targets was a hospital...

Shooting at children is a minor crime after that...

[Bridget Burke]

28. But Britain is our ally!

They're part of the grand coalition formed by Our Leader to bring freedom & democracy to Iraq.

And don't forget Poland.

[leftchick]

37. oh I know, I know....

If you did not see it on your TV, it is not true! Right?

:eyes:

[Just Me]

42. If it's not US corporate/government manipulated,...

,...it's not reliable news?

:eyes:

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

15. To the nay sayers, please notice that the report includes instances

where we have admitted the "error."

Bad planning and a moronic belief in "precision bombing" in densly populated areas added to the paranoia that must be rampant in our troops because of the type of fighting they are being forced to do pretty much assures that we will be very efficient as a recruiter for people who will "want to kill an American yesterday."

*sigh*

[maddezmom]

17. this is only the begining...

Some of the killings took place in the build-up to the assault on the rebel stronghold, and at least in one case - that of the death of a family of seven, including a three-month baby - the American authorities have admitted responsibility and offered compensation
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Mr Tellaib, 33, a merchant, said: "We were stopped, in a line of cars, by some Humvees which had overtaken us. One soldier waved us forward, but as I drove up there was firing from another Humvee. I was shot in the side of the head, and my wife and elder son were shot in the chest. I think they must have died then. There was blood all over my eyes. I lost control of the car which fell into the river. I managed to get out, and then tried to get the others out, but I could not and the car sank.

"The Americans told the police that it was all a mistake, and I could get compensation. But what about my family? My life has gone. They might as well have killed me as well."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[izzie]

16. As Bush would say, people will die.

As long as it is not your son it is OK I guess.

[Minimus]

19. Well they were told to leave, it even says so in the article...

"told by the Americans to leave,.."

so that means it's not our fault. /sarcasm off

[DoYouEverWonder]

20. Who needs gas chambers

when you can just kill them in cold blood on their way out of town?

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Sideways]

22. Missteps????Fucking Missteps? F You Asshat

Go away.

[maddezmom]

23. it's not the savages this article is talking about, it's CIVILIANS

edited to add: "savages" is your word not mine.

[peekaloo]

25. Dahr Jamail has a good site for eyewitness accounts, too

http://www.dahrjamailiraq.com

[Bragi]

26. Americans will deny these atrocities

Americans will either never know of these atrocities, or will only hear about them being denied and rationalized by US militarist media outlets. The rest of the world will know about them, and be properly appalled not just because these war crimes happened, but because Americans don't care.

And so it goes. Eventually some in the US media will notice that hostility toward Americans hasn't been written about in a while, and will once again pen articles searching for reasons behind the mystery of why it is that foreigners hate the US.

I know that for many outside the US, me included, it's becoming more and more difficult to claim that we are anti-Bush, while denying being anti-American.

I'm finding that the complex and thoughtful reasons that I think explain the moral and political corruption of America are now being eclipsed by the real effects of that moral and political corruption on innocent people abroad.

The old excuses for the stupidity and callousness of Americans towards the world seem increasingly irrelevent given the outrageous and muderous behaviour by their representatives abroad that most Americans now support. Americans are foolish to think that there won't be a price to be paid for this.

- B

[LynnTheDem]

29. Most excellently well said.

And very true.

The blowback from bushCartel & the 51% Incredibly Ignorant is really gonna be a total bitch.

[RedSock]

30. tinfoil

before we know it, these stories will be described as "tinfoil" and "wacky conspiracy theories" among the sheeple. they will be derided as fiction.

[Bragi]

32. Absolutely true

The US media will provide enough rationalizing "context" such that when even the most obvious war crime shows up accidentally on TV -- like last week's execution in Falluja -- it can be construed by the population not as murder, but as just another confirmation that war involves violence.

Far as I can tell, there is no functional political demand whatsoever in the US right now for any accountability for what American troops do in Iraq. Most Americans care about American troop losses, and pretend to care about Iraqis killed by insurgents, but they seem quite open about not caring one way or another about the murder of innocent Iraqis by US troops.

Someone here noted that if another hijacked plane downed another US building, the world would celebrate. I honestly don't think that's true. I think most people would be sad, amd mourn the tragedy of it all, but this time, people outside the US would conclude that the US truly brought it on themselves.

That will be the big difference when the next 9/11 happens. Unlike with 9/11, there will be no post-event rally for America.

- B

[donkeyotay]

31. You are so right

The old excuses for the stupidity and callousness of Americans towards the world seem increasingly irrelevent given the outrageous and muderous behaviour by their representatives abroad that most Americans now support. Americans are foolish to think that there won't be a price to be paid for this.

If Sept 11th happened today, there'd be mute celebration around the world. And why not? America the bully. America the ugly. Where are the morons running around waving their "we're number one" fingers now? America is a fascist state, and it's increasingly hard to split the hair of being against that but for the people who support it. We will all pay the price for this administration's stupidy and arrogance, and the people who voted for it deserve it. The rest of us will pay the price anyway.

[Minstrel Boy]

33. "Sorry, but the chick got in the way."

Remember, a year and a half ago?

One of the more chilling quotes to date was from a US soldier, explaining the death of an Iraqi woman: "The chick got in the way."

I think we should be well beyond questioning whether the US is killing unarmed civilians.

[Gayla]

36. We Shouldn't Impeach Bush...

He should be tried for murder.

[peacebird]

38. oh gawd... i had finally blocked that quote from memory...

i think it was about the time abu ghraib hit the press... "the chick got in the way"
:grr:
and now we offer to pay the Iraqi's for the murder of their families... tell me, how much money would it take to appease you after witnessing the murder of your wife and child?
:wtf:

[ekhunter]

34. civilian casualties in an unfortunate part of war.

i hate to say it but their will never be a war without civilian casualties. it's part of war unfortunately. so sad innocent people have died and will continue to die in this time of war.

[maddezmom]

35. true, but the US has said repeatedly there were no civilian casualties

in Falluhjah.

[Bragi]

39. This is the mantra for Bush

War is hell, innocents do suffer, etc. etc.

First this was used just to justify inavoidable civilian "collateral damage" in war. Now it's become a dumbed-down, all-purpose justification for targeting and killing innocent people in whatever way trurns your crank.

The sad thing is that this rationale can and will be accepted by most Americans as an excuse for just about any war crime. One suspects that the ugly truth behind this acceptance is the fact that most Americans truly couldn't give a shit about war crimes committed in their name.

These will be same clueless ones who will ask "why do they hate us so?" when America is next attacked.

- B

[NickB79]

40. You miss the entire point

The point is that we shouldn't be fighting a war in Iraq in the first place! The entire war is based on claims now shown to be lies: WMD, connections to Al Queda, harboring terrorists, etc. These innocent people wouldn't have died if we had not intentionally put ourselves there.

At the very least, even if you think the invasion was the right thing to do, we should have put at least twice as many soldiers on the ground to prevent the looting and civil unrest that arose immediately after the fall of Baghdad. We shouldn't have disbanded the Iraqi police and military. We should have maintained order and guarded hospitals rather than guard the oil wells. These moves MIGHT have truly won the hearts and minds of the Iraqi people a year and a half ago. Now, its too late for that anymore.

[ekhunter]

41. we maybe shouldn't be fighting a war in iraq

, but lets face the reality we are. we need to deal with it whether we like it or not. we can not pull out of iraq now, we must finish what we started.

[Bragi]

46. Soon as the US leaves Iraq

Soon as the US leaves, what it started will end.

[TrustingDog]

43. Bushie Retardette says: Let Them Eat Lead.

huh huh huh (shoulder action included).

[riverwalker]

45. I do not support this.

I do not support people who commit these acts.
Snipers do not shoot anyone by accident. He sighted the 4 year old in his scope, and he chose to fire.
Yellow ribbons my ass.

"One of things we noticed the most were the numbers of people killed by American snipers. They were not just men but women and some children as well. The youngest one I saw was a four-year-old boy. Almost all these people had been shot in the head, chest or neck."

[struggle4progress]

47. kick

:kick: