The ACTUAL reason why no one knows this election was stolen.

[libertypirate]

I finally got tired of hearing this brought up and want to show everyone something that I have found out.

There are many reasons individuals are not doing more to fix our problems. The most important thing to remember is everything is questionable but you have to have the strength to actually question it.

The strength of an individual is not something that remains consistent through out their lives, nor does it dictate to us the ability to change what is wrong. It is the obstacles that must be overcome in order to create conditions for change.

It has now been 3 days and not one mention of the Bush/Blair wanting to go to Iraq without a proper justification on the AP wire. To believe that something I knew on Saturday has not made it's way onto television is crazy.

The Jeff Gannon saga brought back memories of our countries earlier obsession with blackmailing our own politicians. A practice that is more then likely still in place today.

The death of Paul Wellstone someone who we all thought was going to bring change, a person who fought the good fight.

Then I read this last week.

22. A few members of Congress, notably Senators Daschle (D-SD) and Leahy (D-VT), briefly resisted the “Patriot Act” with its many unconstitutional provisions. Messrs. Daschle and Leahy, however, were thereupon sent potentially fatal dosages of “weaponized” anthrax, from American stores. Congress has been mostly supine since.

Curiously, and little reported by the media, the first of the half-dozen fatalities in the October 2001 anthrax attacks was a tabloid newspaper photo editor from Florida, Robert Stevens. While most Americans probably believe to this day that these anthrax attacks were the deeds of radical Islamists – notwithstanding that all evidence points to domestic sources – whom had Mr. Stevens offended? The answer is that he had offended the Bush family, by selecting for
publication in the supermarket tabloid that employed him an mbarrassing photograph of the President’s daughter, Jenna Bush, appearing tipsy and holding a cigarette, while staggering across a dance floor with a female friend in a nightclub.

And this snip from the times...

Times reported:
The dry powder used in the anthrax attacks is virtually indistinguishable in critical technical respects from that produced by the United States military before it shut down its biowarfare program, according to federal scientists and military contractor documents. The similarity to the levels achieved by the United States military lends support to the idea that someone with ties to the old program may be behind the attacks that have killed five people. Its high concentration is surprising, weapon experts said, and far beyond what military analysts once judged as the likely abilities of terrorists. The anthrax sent to the Senate contained as many as one trillion spores per gram. If a lethal dose is estimated conservatively at 10,000 microscopic spores, then a gram in theory could cause about 100 million deaths. The letter sent to Tom Daschle, the Senate Democratic leader, is said to have held two grams of anthrax.

We have a press and a government that is walking around on their tiptoes. After being treated like this how would you expect act? In blatant disregard for their own lives, I don't. I am sure there is more...

The text comes from Rodriguezvs.Bush.pdf

[barbaraann]

1. The fate the BFEE has in store for us is worse than anthrax.

That's why I keep on fighting.

[libertypirate]

2. Me too

[havocmom]

7. Good point! I keep ragging on 'journalists' about 'playing it safe'.

There is NO SUCH THING AS SAFE, so why go along with the coup? Jeeze the collaborators piss me off. What a bunch of foolish pussies!

Shit, everybody is gonna die sometime. Why spend life being afraid? Might as well be dead if 'safe' is your lifestyle!

[Amaryllis]

22. BFEE?

[barbaraann]

31. Bush Family Evil Empire.

Some people call them the Bush Crime Family.

[applegrove]

3. There is no proof that it was stolen by voting machine. Stolen by

politics and stealing hearts and minds.. yes.

[Dhalgren]

6. And as long as there is no official investigation

there never will be "proof". If the election fraud suspicions were of the same caliber surrounding some other type of event, the district attorney in the jurisdiction would already have a detailed investigation underway and maybe even have it before a grand jury. You don't wait for proof to investigate, investigation is how you find proof...

[bitchkitty]

15. Hearts and minds again.

That's real purty, but it's far more likely that it was shenanigans in the counting room. Stop talking about hearts and minds, and start talking about the numbers.

[applegrove]

21. There is so much proof that hearts and minds have been stolen

in so many ways. There is no proof as of yet of the machines being played with.

There should be transparency in the voting process just like there is in the markets (or should be).

A normal president would fight for transparency and address the issue. I think the Bush WH gets far too much out of creating unasuage-able fear in the minds of many DUers.

It breaks apart the Democratic big tent.

After all - the Bush WH and the GOP political machine are all about wedging people apart and creating various tribes (that is how elites have kept power the world over).

Who says you have not been wedged - and the pot stirred by freepers to keep you from focusing on the real game.. playing one group of American off against each other?

The victim would not necessarily know it was happening. Meanwhile many moderates are afraid of the continued 'conspiracy theorists'.

[loudsue]

30. Well, looks like folks keep TRYING, even here.

"Who says you have not been wedged - and the pot stirred by freepers to keep you from focusing on the real game.. playing one group of American off against each other?"

People on this forum generally DO stay focused on the REAL game. Most here don't try "playing" one group off another. I'm NOT "wedged"...

they stole it, and I'll NEVER get over it.

:kick:

[applegrove]

34. The real game is hearts & minds. I'm not playing you off anybody.

I'm saying you may want to take your pulse and look around and see if looking for proof - when none has been found - really helps the cause.

Why not stick with the proof of the hearts and minds of the electorate having been warped. There is lots of proof of that.

Just last week we found out about talks between the Vatican and the Bush campaign to get priests to push their flock into voting on abortion (why not capital punishment - eh?) and that that included getting Kerry's Priest to refuse to give him communion.

Pretty obvious electoral bad stuff right there!

Others may be happy to put you aside but I will not give up. I would like you to grieve the loss of the election, 9/11 or whatever... and then you can take a few steps back and take in the big picture (which shows the Bush team to be just as creepy).

I just would like you to be more discerning at where you invest your time. Because your time is important to all of us.

The only people who benefit from people looking for proof of wrongdoing when none has come up.. are people who want use Democrats to be cut up into little groups.

I will not give up on you.

What will you say when Carter's Commission has no witnesses to the events you describe (the nature of an investigation is that people who are witnesses have to step forward).

Don't you think that will hurt us all.

On other boards they kick off the conspiracy theorists (usually the ones investigating something where 'proof is not available' and reordering things). The reason why they kick those people off their sites is because not a few of the people putting out the theories and stirring the pot are freepers.

[bitchkitty]

35. Pick a new mantra please.

Hearts and minds - sounds like a phrase in a Bush speech. Anyway, give me the tangibles every time. Keep the hearts and minds for those who need that tra la la shit.

[electropop]

40. You can only believe there is no 'proof'

...if you choose to willfully ignore the reams and reams of hard evidence and testimony collected by Conyers, and the brave lawyers in Ohio. Not to mention TruthIsAll's piles and piles of damning numbers. And yes, there is specific testimony that machines were tampered with. The only reason there is no 'proof' (i.e. opening the machines and looking inside) is that Blackwell has kept them locked up (which under Ohio law is presumptive evidence of election fraud).

[mod mom]

45. the Ohio election was such a mess it was unauditable, perhaps

intentionally? ask yourself, who benefitted from the election disaster? Those in charge of running it. Why isn't Blackwell in jail instead of running for governor? I wish the dems would be more vocal.

[Chi]

44. oooh oooh, I got one...

Manipulating the people through hate, lies, and fear.

More accurate as well.

[marions ghost]

39. NGU

:boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring:

[Dhalgren]

4. This is important stuff.

It is the kind of series of events that bring investigations and indictments. This isn't tin-foil-hat stuff, this is evidence. There is simply no way to get at the criminals...even though we know who at least some of them are.

[Last Lemming]

5. This is a very important point

We've had a coup Ordinary election policies are not available to us any longer--
it's no longer a matter of just voting the suckers out--

never forget how these guys came to power, election fraud and targetted asassination.

[Amy6627]

9. Posts like these always remind me of what Mark Crispin Miller

said in his documentary, A Patriot Act, "These guys are in power, and they are NOT leaving".

[glitch]

37. Thanks for this post. I knew he had a stage presentation, but I didn't

know there was a dvd, so I googled. Guess what?
http://www.patriotnation.us/main.html

[Roland99]

8. Salon - Nov. 21, 2001 - Why Daschle and Leahy?

http://dir.salon.com/politics/feature/2001/11/21/anthrax/index.html

November 21, 2001 | The anthrax story returned to the front pages last week, when it was revealed that another leading Democratic senator was mailed a letter containing the deadly bacteria. Sen. Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., was the second prominent Democrat to be targeted, following Senate Majority Leader Tom Daschle. But so far, no Washington officials or media commentators seem willing to publicly ask the question that is quietly nagging many people on Capitol Hill: Were Democrats specifically targeted for anthrax attacks? And given growing evidence that they were, why is no one talking about it?

On Tuesday traces of anthrax were also found in the Senate offices of Ted Kennedy, D-Mass., and Christopher Dodd, D-Conn. But the Associated Press reported that officials suspect the anthrax got into Dodd and Kennedy's offices through contact with either the Leahy or Daschle letters. To date, there's no evidence that either Dodd or Kennedy was directly targeted.

So far anthrax traces have been found in 13 senators' offices -- both Democrats and Republicans -- besides Daschle's suite, the only place on Capitol Hill where an anthrax letter was actually opened. But the only two senators who have actually been sent letters containing anthrax are prominent Democrats; to date, no Republican politicians have been directly targeted. (Traces of anthrax were discovered at an off-site White House mail screening facility in October. The bacteria were found on a mechanical mail-opening device, but no anthrax was found on any of the mail itself.) And there's been a remarkable silence about that fact -- from the media, from investigators, and even from the Democratic senators themselves.

While there has been much media speculation that the letter to Leahy increases the odds that the letters were sent by a domestic terrorist, media reports all tiptoe around exactly what makes that more likely: The fact that the anthrax letters were sent to Democratic leaders and the media, groups that right-wing extremists tend to have a grudge against. The inclusion of the conservative New York Post on that list could be used to undercut the notion that the anthrax letters represent an assault against liberals, but there's been almost no analysis of the possible political motives behind the attacks.

[libertypirate]

10. The last line

They make themselves a victum, so they don't seem like the perp.

[blueheeler]

11. Eerie!!!

I looked up his sight and clicked a link to operation northwoods and got an eyefull. If anyone is not aware of what that is, it was an attempt to orchestrate a war with Cuba by possibly faking an attack on Americans!! Sound familiar? Cuba, Bay of Pigs, CIA, Kennedy, Bush Sr., 9-11........... :tinfoilhat:

[impeachthescoundrel]

12. Do you have a link to the Bush/Blair letter

and shouldn't we be blasting it to the media? I am sorry to say I don't know how to do that, but if there is a link, It will be my pleasure to learn.

By the way I have read Rodriguez vs. Bush. Especially the part that begins on page 137. Haven't exactly been the same since that day.

[libertypirate]

13. It does suck I know...

The best thing we can do as a group is get the true 911 story into peoples faces, make them face the truth.

I actually apologize to people when I give them information.

Your better off printing up the news stories that don't end up on the wire. Handing them to people who won't see it for days and asking them if they know why our press isn't covering it?

I don't have a link...

[impeachthescoundrel]

14. Thanks anyway

[fooj]

16. What's really frightening is that it is happening everywhere!

I, personally, would take it a step further. They talk about Dems having their tin-foil hats on too tight...LOOK AROUND!!! It's not JUST the Dems! Talk about a conspiracy! The press and the government are in this together. IMO- there is no accountability from either one! I was just talking to a friend about the Blair situation and I am so PISSED OFF that not ONE MSM REPORTED THE STORY!!! WTF? It is the function of the "free" press to protect us from government propaganda and lies. IMO, the press has helped create this madness! Whatever happens to this country...I hold the press accountable- every bit as much as the government! What has happened to our beloved country? My heart weeps!!!

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

[KoKo]

18. Spitzer is pushing for E-Voting in New York? The DRE's or Optiscan?

If it's DRE's that's not good news. But, we still have Dems here in NC trying to stop our efforts for paper ballots/Opti-Scan. Accusing us of being in the Dark Ages for not supporting "Touch Screens."

[Bill Bored]

17. Couple of questions for the experts on this subj:

Haven't read the whole lawsuit yet, but in your opinions:

1. Who is Philip J. Berg and why is he saying such terrible things about the Bush Family, any why in Penn. of all places?

2. What if any complicity, knowingly or unknowingly, do the Democrats have?

3. Why did the Kerry campaign apparently give Bush a pass on 9/11, even with the declassification and public availability of the Aug 6, 2001 PDB which, if nothing else, implicated Bush as being negligent and indifferent by failing to protect the likely targets of Al Qaida attacks in this country or even to convene a meeting about it?

4. How does this suit fit into the one against the Saudis, in which James Baker III has been retained to defend them?

5. What is or will be Eliot Spitzer's role in prosecuting any 9/11-related crimes and why has he been pushing for new votin' machines in NY, which will possibly be used to keep the "enterprise" in control and keep Spitzer himself from becoming Governor?

[libertypirate]

19. Some answers 2,3 to the best of my mellon.

2. What if any complicity, knowingly or unknowingly, do the Democrats have?

I am sure there are "in" democrats this isn't just Republicans, what is worse is that our military brass have to be involved.

3. Why did the Kerry campaign apparently give Bush a pass on 9/11, even with the declassification and public availability of the Aug 6, 2001 PDB which, if nothing else, implicated Bush as being negligent and indifferent by failing to protect the likely targets of Al Qaida attacks in this country or even to convene a meeting about it?

Two reasons blackmail and threats; BTW they just don't threaten because they feel like it, it's about leverage. In the first year if you even thought that 911 wasn't caused by muslim terrorists you were labeled a nut and writen off. I am sure the Kerry campaign new this.

[Bill Bored]

25. You are missing the point.

Kerry's campaign and the media had the Aug 6 PDB. I assume you know exactly what that says. If not, please read it. It also said it was for Shrub's eyes only (you need the PDF version to see that). Hence, there was no opportunity for Shrub to duck responsibility. It's where the buck should have stopped.

Now, if you are going to run against Shrub, in 2004 - not 2001, 2 or 3, you should be holding the administration accountable for their actions and inactions during the time they were in office. This is basic campaigning. Richard Clarke didn't have much trouble doing that, and he wasn't even running for office. So why not Kerry?

I'm not saying he had to file a RICO claim, just blame 9/11 on the negligence of the Shrub and hold him accountable in the eyes of the voters. The Shrubies blame 9/11 and all our other problems on Clinton to this day which is ludicrous. And still, the Dems are kissing Shrub's ass when it comes to 9/11. Only the RESPONSE to 9/11 i.e., Iraq, has been criticized, but not the fact that 9/11 happened on Shrub's watch in the first place, amid numerous warnings. I find this fascinating and somewhat troubling and yet I don't think Kerry is the kind of guy who would keep overt threats and blackmail to himself.

[libertypirate]

27. One funny point to that....

They guy who ran Kerry's campaign was partners with the guy that ran the Bush campaign.

I always thought that Bush, made it possible to run against Kerry, someone he had something on. Bonesmen

I often land somewhere outside the point.

[libertypirate]

20. Blackmail

Here is something you might not have thought about blackmail is a one on one act of suppression. So you can't know who else has been blackmailed, so you can't band together, so you can't win. Do you think people who are blackmailed like to be?

If they didn't feel so powerless and alone they might fight.

[Amaryllis]

23. This is SO depressing. I am slumping.

[Amaryllis]

24. But they can't kill off ALL of us.

[libertypirate]

26. No they can't...

burn your best 911 or election information on CD and start passing it out.

[chrisclub]

29. They can't kill all of us?

"a gram in theory could cause about 100 million deaths. The letter sent to Tom Daschle, the Senate Democratic leader, is said to have held two grams of anthrax."

[libertypirate]

32. How would they deliver such a dose?

As soon as it hits air and sunlight it dies that is why you need so much.

Chemical weapons are gruesome not efficient.

[electropop]

41. Physically, they could kill us by spraying a few tons over cities...

but then who would shine their shoes and manicure their gardens?

[byronius]

28. What aren't we saying? What are we really feeling?

What do pure-hearted, well-intentioned goodpeoples do when an antidemocratic cadre decides to go for broke? When they spend their life's energy organizing for power, and never once look up to see the true effects of their actions, or the illogic of their base philosophy? What can't we say?

They called it. We must respond.

[libertypirate]

33. We are not insisting our position.

That is when we turn this on them.

[Peace Patriot]

36. I would say that fear is more the "behind the scenes" reason why many...

...Americans don't know that the election was stolen, and that the "actual reason" is very simple and obvious: The TV networks changed the exit polls on everybody's TV screens late on election day--they "altered" the exit polls (which showed a Kerry win) to fit the official result (a Bush win), thus denying the American people strong evidence of election fraud.

They didn't do this out of fear. They did this out of greed. They are benefiting from Bush's tax cuts for the rich, and they are war profiteers.

Also, to expose the election fraud is to expose their baldfaced lie to the American people about who won the exit polls.

If the true exit poll result had been revealed--as it was in the Ukraine, for instance--there would have been a huge outcry and demands for an investigation. The TV networks, AP and all the other news organizations involved in "reporting" the election smothered that outcry and those calls for investigation.

I do agree that Paul Wellstone's death was highly suspicious (and David Kelly's as well, the British weapons inspector, who supposedly committed suicide just after he began to whistleblow on Iraq WMDs--in July 2003). I also strongly suspect that the viciousness and murderousness of the Bush Cartel is most definitely a factor in Democratic leadership circles. The Bush Cartel undoubtedly has many ways that they are controlling potential opposition--outright corruption, secret dossiers, threats of various kinds, and examples of what will befall you if you stand in their way. They do not in any way represent the majority of Americans--that has become very clear--and they are the most corrupt gang that has ever held sway in Washington DC (or perhaps any nation, ever), so that they MUST retain power--or see in the inside of a jail. And we should most certainly bear these things in mind when we find ourselves hoping for a "White Knight" to lead the charge against them, or just for ordinary leadership and patriotism.

We have to empower our leaders, rather than the other way around.

[autorank]

38. Extremely well stated! But we have all sorts of time for "Febble"

The stakes are high, the time is short. Election fraud is at the center of it all. And they're not even good at hiding it. The smell of elitist contempt os overwhelming.

libertypirate:yourock:

[jen4clark]

42. No matter

how futile it all seems, we must never stop spreading the truth.

After reading your post I once again sank down (as happens so often these days). But the fact that there are SO MANY of us who know what's going on is encouraging. There are many intelligent, honest, true hearts fighting the good fight with us and we take turns inspiring and encouraging each other to keep on keepin' on. We're all we've got now and we CAN do this.

Amazingly enough, C-Span is re-airing David Griffin's speech this Saturday. Make sure everyone knows it will be on!

C-SPAN2, Saturday, May 7 @ 02:30 PM EDT
Speech
The 9/11 Commission Report: Omissions And Distortions
University of Wisconsin, Madison
David Ray Griffin
Kevin Barrett , MUJCA-NET


:grouphug:

[hangloose]

43. Well, IF there is another "attack" on the US of A expect it to take

place in a community that is predominately progressive Dems and not in a bible belt cherry state that voted heavily for Bush. Got-to protect the base after all, what's a few less Dems, I'll tell ya a few less votes to the other guy. I kinda feel like one of those foster children that they tested experimental HIV medications on without their knowledge.

[rhett o rick]

46. Well written. But we well know what the problem is. To continue to discuss

isn't getting us anywhere. We need specific action. We need a Demo equivalent to Karl Rove. We, as individuals, need to make it clear to the few Demo's we have in Congress that they aren't doing us any good being silent, therefor we will try someone else. We are currently hanging on and hoping for the best. The momentum won't stop on it's own. We individuals need to wake up our representatives. We may loose some seats but it's needed. They ain't doing us no good now. We need a plan. 1. Boycott Fox news. 2. Boycott all corporate media. 3. Cancel magazines and newspapers run by corporate America.
Most of all we need a leader. Barbara Boxer for President