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Does Nader = Stalin /Binary Poll

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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:19 PM
Original message
Poll question: Does Nader = Stalin /Binary Poll
In the years immediately preceding World War 2 Stalin urged the German Communist party not to cooperate with the German socialists and other center left parties thereby denying a common front against Hitler and the National Socialists..


If Nader announces his candidacy tomorrow and splits the center left vote and deprives the center left a common front against Buschco he is committing the same calumny as Stalin...

Let history judge....



Here's the pregnant question....


Does Nader=Stalin
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kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
1. Double - barrelled question
He's making the same mistake as Stalin, but that doesn't make him Stalin.

Please edit, so that it's no longer a double-barreled question.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. He Knows What He's Doing...
Edited on Sat Feb-21-04 05:25 PM by DemocratSinceBirth
Stalin wanted to maximize the contradictions by letting the Nazis comes to power....

Stalin thought that the Germans would be so disenthralled with the National Socialists that they would turn to the Communists...


The rest is history....
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kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. When Nader kills millions of Russians, then he'll be Stalin
Not before. I hate Nader with a passion, but he's no fricken Stalin.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Hitler Killed Twelve Million Cuz Stalin Assisted In Creating The
Conditions For His Rise...
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kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. You're still not addressing the point
Nader is making the same mistake Stalin did. I'm not arguing that. My point is that it doesn't make him Stalin.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. He's As Historically Culpable For Bushco's Crimes As Stalin Is For
Hitler's Crime.....


To deprive the left a common front against Bushco is a crime against humanity....
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kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Right
But even without Hitler, Stalin was an asshat. Most people on this board would not be nearly as pissed at Nader if he hadn't thrown the election to Bush.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-22-04 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #6
36. The SPD was much more responsible for those conditions than...
Stalin.

Here is an idea. Maybe if in 1919 the SPD government hadn't send right wing freikorps after the Luxembourg and Liebknecht, the KPD wouldn't have been so pissed off that their leaders were assasinated.

Here is another, maybe it was unwise of the SPD to impose democracy on a country where the vast majority of the people thought that keeping the SPD down was more important than democracy.

Finally, if the SPD wanted to play the role of centrist champion of Democracy, maybe they should have dropped the talk of class war and waving of red flags that so horrified the German middle and upper class that they would never vote for them. It is only in the late 50's and early 60's (after the renunciation of Marxism of the Bad Godesberg party program) that the SPD became a "people's party" (A party claiming to represent all Germans regardless of class) before that it was strictly a working class party and achieved maximum results of around 33%.
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dcbatlle Donating Member (3 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #1
35. If Bush is Hitler, then Nader must be Stalin

Carelessly tossing about ad hominems against your political enemies will come back and bite you in the ass.
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-22-04 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #35
37. Hi dcbatlle!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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kher-heb Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
3. is there a contest on DU
to ask the most absurd questions as possible?
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. It's Not Absurd...
I have made a historical comparison....


PM me and I'll buy you a history book...


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Tinoire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #3
23. You noticed too & in such a short time
Welcome to DU! :toast: We have a big fight on our hands to wrench & reclaim the soul of the Democratic party from the hands of the Bush-enabling DLC & its supporters.

Expect to see many more of these absurd polls because they're really in a frenzy with Nader's entry. I don't see why though. They should be jumping up for joy because Nader's entry will allow the DNC & DLC to blame their upcoming whalloping loss on everything EXCEPT the real reason they're going to lose- that voters don't like the warmed-over left-over Bush-enablers they want to serve for dinner.

I think I'll write to Nader & beg him not to run just so the DLC pukes & their supporters won't have him as a punching bag for the next 4 years & that the day we can force them to look into the mirror they will have no, ha hem, "distractions".
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:30 PM
Response to Original message
8. Holy jumping Jesus on a pogo stick
Just how stupid will DU get?
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. Instead Of Making Ad Hominem Attacks*
why don't you attack my thesis that Stalin deprived the German left of a common front against Hitler while Nader deprived the American left of a common front against Bushco....


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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. It's so pathetic a stretch as to not even be worth the time.
You have a ball though.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #14
19. Pathetic
ROTLMFAO....


It reminds me of Al Franken's book "Rush Limbaugh Is A Big Fat Idiot" where he discusses the list of words Newt Ginghrich instructed his minions to use to describe Democrats...


Weak and pathetic were at the top of the list...


You're in good company...


<kisses>


Brian
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. You Hurt My Feelings.....
I'm sorry that I lack your alacrity....


But I can do magic...


I can make you disappear....

<kisses>


Brian
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. Well thank Christ for that!
What took you so long?
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. You Like These Little Flame Wars...
<kisses>


Brian
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. I thought you were making me disappear
guess you like them too.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. I'm Just Waiting To See How Many Invectives You Can Come Up With...
<kisses>


Brian






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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #14
26. Actually I have two....
<kisses>


Brian
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Scott Lee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. Oh stick around....you aint seen nothing yet
Wait till the Draconian Free Speech Zones go into effect here after the nomination.
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
11. Nader is no Stalin--he may be Ernst Thalmann. Check your history
Here's my thread about this.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. They Aren't Mutually Exclusive...
Stalin instructed the German communists not to cooperate with other center left parties..
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. But Stalin also caused millions of people to die--not a good analogue
Nader is like Thalmann, someone who really works for leftist ideals (though Nader is a hypocrite) but has the stupidest strategy for advancing them imaginable. By comparing Nader to Stalin, you will only attract mean-spirited knee-jerk responses.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. I Can Handle The "Mean Spirited Knee Jerk Responses"
It's noting compared to the pain that four more years of Bushco will inflict on the nation and the world....


I loathe Nader and pity his followers...

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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. The Question Does Not Really Make Sense, Sir
However, the policy urged by Wrecker Nader and his supporters and apologists is the same one directed by the Comintern in last years of Weimar Germany: the left-center Social Democrat Party was attacked from the left, under the slogan "Social-Fascists" and accused of appeasement of the right, while the Communist Red Gaurd units collaborated with Storm Troop units to mob Social Democrat rallies and party members, under the slogan "Hitler is the ice-breaker of the Revolution!" The idea was that if the Social Democrats were destroyed, there would be no left competion for leadership of the workers; that Hitler when in power would quickly provoke the workers to rise in revolution; the Communists would be leaders of this revolution, and thus come to power in Germany. Subtract the clubs and guns, and you have about what passes for strategy among the usual run of Greens and other left opponents of the Democratic Party in this forum: if the Democrats are destroyed the splinterists will become the leaders; the Republicans will quickly provoke a great backlash among the voters; the splinterists will be who the people turn to for rescue from the Republicans, and thus the splinterists will be swept into government. To call it a pipe-dream is to stretch the meaning even of charitable; it is an out and out, certifiable, only a doctor can sign you out of the facility delusion.

In present circumstances, Wrecker Nader is a left-deviationist tool of reaction, and needs treating as such....

"Kill one, warn one hundred."

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. I'm Not As Eloquent As You....
The salient point is that Stalin deprived the German leftists of a common front against Hitler while Nader is depriving the American left of a common front against Bushco...
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #17
32. And There Is, Sir
A good deal to that proposition. It is simply that the fracture of Popular Front is aimed at in a different way by this wrecker. The difficulty of ultra-left splinter factionalism is an old one, and must be combated.

"Kill one, warn one hundred."

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"
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mouse7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
21. Stalin was more charismatic than Nader.
Nader is going to be a late night joke, and little else.
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mitchum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #21
34. Damn it, you read my mind!
grrr...
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fromthegroundup Donating Member (17 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 06:03 PM
Response to Original message
25. Nader
Would any of those who "hate" Nader do so if he could deliver them a Democratic party victory? Kerry lacks all the qualities that make Ralph Nader. Geez Kerry was even quoted during the prewar political mumbo jumbo as saying George Bush had the best approach to dealing with WMD in Iraq. He's a flip-flop, a sandal, a mult-millionaire ex-Yale elitist who's only going to drag the Democrats into half-Ass America. He wouldn't represent true opposition to the war until it was safe to do so politically. I'm not necessarily voting Nader, but that man deserves respect for all of his work he's done as a public citizen. He's worked incredibly hard to protect our rights as consumers, which in the end, is all we are in this system. Perhaps his desire to take back America from the corporations and deliver true democracy is what the Democrats are most upset about. Cease standing stopped at the party line.
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CabalBuster Donating Member (282 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
31. Comparing Nader to Hitler is an exaggeration....
Some Kerry supporters seem to have become so "blind" with fervor for his candidacy that will feel threatened by Nader. Repubs like to make comparisons to Hitler, it suits their nature and their propagandistic goal, but for real democrats to paint Nader (a progressive whether you like it or not) as Hitler is not only absurd by downright wrown. And I'm sorry but you steep to the level of some Republican operatives. Pissing people off is not going to move progressive voters to the Kerry camp, it only justifies our position even more, there is not a "big" difference between mainstream democratic candidates such as Kerry and Bush. Both use fearmongering and propaganda recklessly.
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HuskerDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
33. If he sees this his head is only going to get bigger.
Nutcase can't fit through a regular doorway now.
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