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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-04 08:23 AM
Original message
The threat of Robert Spencer and the danger he poses to American Muslims
Edited on Sun May-23-04 08:29 AM by ck4829
I think we should pay more attention to Robert Spencer, he is the Anti-Islamic Adjucnt Fellow of the Free Congress Foundation, sister group of the Heritage Foundation. His site Jihad Watch, be careful though, he will attempt to make you think Islam and Muslims are all conspirating to destroy everything. I don't think this man should be trusted at all, just look at his media appearances.
Television:

C-Span Book TV
C-Span, "Washington Journal"
PBS, "Religion and Ethics Newsweekly"
CNN, "Lou Dobbs Tonight"
FOX News Live
FOX News, "Weekend Live with Tony Snow"
FOX News, "Fox and Friends First"
FOX News, "The Big Story with John Gibson"
FOX News, "DaySide with Linda Vester"
FOX News, "From the Heartland with John Kasich"
CITS, "Michael Coren Live"
CBN-TV, "700 Club"
MSNBC, "Nachman"

Radio:

"Vatican Radio"
"Voice of America"
"The Michael Savage Show: The Savage Nation"
"The Michael Reagan Show"
"The Michael Medved Show"
"The Larry Elder Show"
"The Bob Grant Show"
"The G. Gordon Liddy Show"
"The Dennis Prager Show"
"NPR, The Tavis Smiley Show"
"The Jerry Doyle Show"
"The Barry Farber Show"
"The Bob Dornan Show"
"The Ken Hamblin Show"
"Daybreak USA"
"The David Brudnoy Show"
"The Rusty Humphries Show"
"Shmuley" with Shmuley Boteach
"The Diner Show"
"Rambling with Gambling" with John Gambling
"Talking Sense" with Rabbi Aryeh Spero
"Point of View" with Marlon Maddox
"The Laura Ingraham Show"
"The Tom Marr Show"
"The Don Feder Show"
"Mancow"
. . . and hundreds of other programs

Speaking Engagements:

Conservative Political Action Conference, Washington, DC
Legatus, San Francisco and Fresno, California
Eastern Christian Fellowship, Boston, Massachusetts
Ave Maria Law School, Ann Arbor, Michigan
Middle East Forum, Boston, MA
University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, NC


Florida Society for Middle East Studies, Florida Atlantic University, Boca Raton, FL Many bookstores

As you can see, he's had arrangements with a couple of outright anti-Islamic people. As you can tell, he's even met with Pat Robertson on the 700 Club and advocates him too like on Larry Elder's show for example. But Spencer doesn't want us to realize that Pat Robertson has more to do with terrorism than the average Muslim, as he has helped the Contras, the Afghani 'freedom' fighters, and has helped mass murderers such as Charles Taylor and Efrain Rios Montt.

I'll give you examples of some of the hateful people Spencer is creating through his stories, but they might not last as Spencer closely moderates because he knows people like me are watching Jihad Watch. This is all from http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/001978.php

"I know this sounds quaint, but it fits with Hugh's (Hugh is Spencer's friend) suggestion in his 'Islam for the Perplexed' that we should make Muslims uncomfortable being here, and get them to leave."

"Legally, Mosks are targets if they are being used in a military manner. The problem isn't whether we can legally target them or not, the problem is we have to balance this judgment with the thinking of a backward uneducated, brainwashed stupid people.
So to keep them happy, we have to refrain from targeting their most holy historical cult centers."

Another one of Spencer's friends are Charles Johnson at Little Green Footballs who if you google it, you will see something weird, everytime you see the word 'Muslim' you will also see the word 'seethe' 1/3 of the time. It seems as though Johnson might have an obsession with seeing Muslims seething.

And lastly there is a question at Unasnwered Questions that relates to him. By the way, I created the question about William Pierce in the general category a long time ago.

"Who exactly is Robert Spencer? He is the self proclaimed expert on Islam. Before 9/11 he was a writer for Catholic Magazines, but then after he comes talking about Islam being connected to terror. How did a little-known writer became famous in such a short time? Also after 9/11 numerous sources say he studied Islam for 20 years. Yet none of his articles before 9/11 even mention his studies in Islam or any religion at all. I know someone who used to frequent jihadwatch.org (his site). People were talking about bombing Mosques and taking the rights of Muslims (emphasis is mine), so jokingly he says 'Laszlo Pasztor', the Nazi who was/is a member of the Free Congress Foundation, which Spencer is also a member of, and he gets banned from posting on his site. Why did this happen amidst all these violent quotes, he gets banned for saying someone's name? One should also consider Weyrich's(high guy in the FCF) paper is called 'Why Islam is a threat to America and the West' and Spencer's book is called 'Onward Muslim Soldiers: How Jihad Still Threatens America and the West', what is up with the similar titles? Why is Spencer an Adjunct Fellow with the FCF, an organization in which it's founder, Weyrich is/was known to oppose Integration efforts in his book, The New Right Papers, and works with the Christian Right, did Spencer join for the sole purpose of making the hate not look like hate? Spencer says he does not hate Muslims, but most hate sites do not say they actually hate people, why is everyone promoting this guy when just about everyone else who says stuff like that would be called hateful? He continues to say this even though his site was published by Little Green Footballs which clearly shows hate of Muslims. Everyone knows that just because you say you do not hate people, does not mean that you don't hate people, so why do people say these hateful people are good?"

What do you guys think? Is Spencer just another Muslim basher with actually very little clout? Or should the spotlight be put on him so he does not create people who think it is alright to shoot up mosques?
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-04 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
1. He sounds like a member of Opus Dei, to me. And, those folks are tied
in to everything.

We live in a bizarre spy novel. Every day turn the page and a new "connection" to the "World of Crime and Sinister Activities" is revealed.

Thanks for your work on this Spencer guy. Another one we should watch out for skulking around with much influence. :nuke:
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-04 08:32 AM
Response to Original message
2. I've been driven from posting at sites
where followers of this creature have pounced upon my username and have told me I have no right to be in this country. These people are really really scary. They are out to scuttle the First Amendment, and I fear that some of their feeble minded followers will decide to start killing Muslims.

Personally, I try to keep a very low profile.
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-04 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. This is a post I wanted to edit but actually replied to it instead
Edited on Sun May-23-04 04:45 PM by ck4829
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-04 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Just curious, what is your username on Jihad Watch?
Edited on Sun May-23-04 04:48 PM by ck4829
If you have one that is.
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ayeshahaqqiqa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-04 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Never been there
sorry.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-23-04 08:45 AM
Response to Original message
3. Deleted message
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 07:57 PM
Response to Original message
7. Follow up: Jihad Watch does not like Democratic Underground
Edited on Tue May-25-04 07:57 PM by ck4829
A little more research has turned up that Jihad Watchers have a fervent dislike for both DU and Muslims:

"Listen hood, go away, you have no decency, or morality, take your hate to another place.
try DU, they will worship you like a god I'm sure, here's the Addy Democratic Underground

Take your satanic Islamic hate elsewhere.
I'm sure Robert can ban all your Ip domains, ask him. Even if your using proxy, it has limits as well as law restrictions."
jihadwatch.org/ cgi-bin/mt-comments.cgi?entry_id=1762

"I would be interested if Graham gives you a personal reply, but don't hold your breath. The Liberals are relying on the Islamic vote, and do anything to appease them.
Graham is an idiot. It makes me sick to even hear him speak. The liberals are blind to what Islam really is, and their path is to further their appeasement, as they announced this morning. The liberals MUST be turfed out this election, and for the Love of Canada, don't vote democrat, they are even dumber. Voting for Layton is akin to voting for the guy who runs Democratic Underground."
jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/001944.php

There are many more anti-DU posts on JW, I will post them when I see them.


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amber dog democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-25-04 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Well it is flattering to know they are aware of us.
As I read through the screeds that were quoted, I experimentally substituted the word Muslim for Jew. These are very scarey people.
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gatlingforme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-28-04 06:21 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. The DU must effect them if they bash us at their site.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-28-04 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Deleted message
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captainkirk Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-29-04 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. still waiting...you do not have to read much of it
what is the problem? looking for some far-fetched justification? if you can find something that gives me some hope, please let me know, because I think we are on an unavoidable collision course...and I do not beleive there is anything we can do...Iraq is a last ditch effort...nukes may be next.
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-03-04 05:02 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Sorry for the late reply
I sent an email to you but this is my post to all of DU. You can go ahead and post the content of the email I gave you to your friends. Now you try to prove the benevolence of the 'Adjunct Fellow' of the Free Congress Foundation
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amber dog democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jun-04-04 04:07 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. You can find the same kind of statements in the Book of Morman
as well as the Old Testiment. What is it you are fearing?
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screwfacecapone Donating Member (215 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-08-04 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
14. It's funny.
Even bush himself said that islam was a peaceful religion and dennounced the anti-arab muslim racism. So these people think that they're some badass conservative patriots when in reality they are just bigoted idiots.
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PeterHauer Donating Member (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-03-07 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
15. Robert Spencer: Bigot or serious scholar????
I fear I must disagree with your Sir.

Your recent posting was unfairly critical of Robert Spencer. In fact you merely called him anti-Semitic without ever justifying that label. Merely calling a person names does not refute the argument he is making.

You also challenged Spencer's qualifications to speak as an expert on Islam. However, this still fails to refute his arguments or his ideas.

I believe the reason you failed to reply to Spencer's specific criticisms of Islam is because you are unable to do so. I do not mean that as an insult. I believe that NOBODY can logically refute Mr. Spencer, because his evidence is solid and his logic is impeccable.

I have read the Koran eight times (four different translations) and I have read over thirty books about Islam, including many by Muslim historians and a few religious instructional manuals, also written by devout Muslims.

After all of my research (I have studied different religions for several years now) I conclude the following: Robert Spencer is correct in nearly all of his comments about Islam including:
1.Islam is the only religion that call for banning other religions.
2.Islam is the only religion that actually encourages rape, murder, and robbery, so long as these things are done to Non-Muslims.
3. The Koran has five verses that call for tolerating "infidels" BUT it has 109 verses that call for killing the infidels (He's right, I counted them all.) According to the Muslim theory of "Abrogation" any time the Koran gives contradictory commands, then whichever command is given more often is considered binding upon Muslims. SO the verses about killing infidels are binding upon Muslims.

I am as sophisticated and progressive as anyone else I know of. But I have given up on the absurd secular faith called "MULTICULTURALISM." It is irrational to presume that all cultures are inherently equal in value. Sorry, but the ugly TRUTH is that if we want to preserve all of the achievements of Liberal Society (Women's liberation, gay rights, freedom of speech, freedom of faith, environmentalism) then we had better end all Muslim immigration to the West. If we permit Muslims to dominate the West (as they will in four or five generations) then we can kiss good-bye every part of the Liberal civilization we have built.

I am not saying Muslims are generally evil people. Nearly all of my interactions with Muslims have been positive. However, that does not change the fact that their religion teaches them some very ANTI_SOCIAL ideas.

I recommend you at least read Spencer's book "Islam Unveiled" You can much more fairly It is not even written from a particularly conservative point of view. It won't hurt you to read Spencer's book. I have read books by Dick Army, Ann Coulter, and Robert Bork just so I could criticize those idiots from an informed point of view. If I can stomach reading biased, right wing drivel, then surely you can tolerate reading Spencer's very logical book about Islam. It always pays to know what the other side is saying!!!!!

May I give you one example of how well-informed Spencer is? I heard a debate on NPR between Spencer and a Muslim representative from the CAIR. The Muslim quoted a very obscure hadith about women being treated equally. Spencer replied that the Muslim had quoted the hadith completely out of context, and explained why this was deceptive. Spencer explained that the quoted hadith actually described the treatment of women in Paradise, not here on earth. The Muslim representative sat silently, obviously embarrassed at having been caught in a deception.

If we fail to refute this dangerous ideology of Islam, we will lose everything we stand for. Women treated like slaves, poor people having their hands cut off just for stealing, death penalty for lesbians, etc...etc... Please be open minded enough to understand that all cultures are NOT equally valuable. It is very tragic that the people who are most deterimned to be "tolerant" of Islam are the people who actually know the least about it. Such people have never read even one critical book about Islam.
The more you know about Islam the more you will fear it. But don't be afraid of the truth......... vty PeterHauer
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MrFadi Donating Member (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-28-08 08:01 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. Muslim
Dear all,

Day after day my trust is increased in the poeples those facing eveils in the west. thanks for you all.

Let me just copy a post for me i write it before not here.


"Dear,

Muslims what you and others "not only the west" needs to know about is simple, we believe in Peace, we do not support terror; we do not support Sadam and Bin Laden and other of those criminals, and as the west had attack before from Al Qaeda and others militias, we also Lived this bad experience in all Muslim countries, in Jordan the three concurrent bombing And the lose of more than 70 peoples in a wedding in Radisson Sas - Amman and others hotels,
If Mr. Spencer and others know this and they ever mentioned all of the crimes for Al Qaeda against Muslims countries, so he and others like him just want to blind you to see the true.

Lets mention some thing else, also in Jordan, the evil plan to use a very toxic chemicals to Attack the Jordanian Agency Department and the Ministry of Interior and killing in just a Few minutes more than 250,000 - 300,000 innocent peoples and we are belong the those whom Planning to made this unpleasant mega-crime to our families, they are Muslims also, some of Them from Jordan, some from many countries.

Again, in Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iraq, Algeria, and many others countries, if you just calculate how much peoples killed in 11-September, in London, in Madrid. They do not Made any comparison with the peoples who killed just in Algeria and Iraq, and that does not mean that we are not sorry for who killed in all over the world by Al Qaeda.

We Muslims are not feeling a shame for those who are calling them selves Muslims and they do not belong to any part of Islam, we are feeling so deep shame from our brothers in humanity like Robert Spencer and others.

I am not going to talk about Islam, what is Islam, but it's a common sense that if Islam religion is that bad, so why I am and others like me Muslims, we are all educated, here in Jordan, we have the most percent of Engineers and PhD degree. in all over the world, yes I am Muslim, I love my prophet Mohammad, I love all nations, I do not hate, I do not kill, I do not lie, I just want to do the best to satisfy my instinct of love and doing all the best to all.

I Am Muslim, I feel proud to be a Muslim, a part of this great nation, and a part of the world.

I do not speak for me; we all in Muslim nation say the same.

Thanks to give the space to writing, and thanks for your reading."

Thanks.
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Barenziah58 Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-15-09 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. You are badly misinform sir.
You are badly misinform and bigot against Islam, have you ever ready the old testment and some of the Paul writing in the new. I as than moslim is not allow to hunt down homosexual because they are homosexual as that is murder which I than not allow to do. Homosexual are only execute it they do they act in public, but Islam tolorate it in private like your bedroom. Donot judge Islam by the way Saudic Arabic does Islamist practive. Pakistian execute than bisexual men for not being bisexual as some Islam-hater in west want you to think, he was execute for rapeing and murdering over 100 boys and girls
the court and the state have the right to execute criminal right that.
Yesday the women orginate at our mosque have than breakfast fundraiser than I brought some valintime
cookie over to the event. The women where happy many where Islamist scholar unlike Robert Spencer than one is than Saudic woman who saw nothing wrong with that. To Robert Spencer bigot mind there is only one Islam and all muslim must follow it without thinking and detate. Muslim in the muslim world have detate about every Islamist matter in the world. There are some man born with both sex organs Islam wait untril one sex hordson is the dominate one before doing than sex change operation, afew man donot have than dominate sex hormson so no operation is done, on some day they feel more like a woman so they dress like a woman Islam tolorate that and on day they feel like a man and they dress like a man does, afew feel like a woman all the time so dress like a woman all the time an Islam tolorate that while in america than man like that will be arrest on sexual criminal charge.
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i4cassie Donating Member (1 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-30-09 05:26 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. Not True!!!!!
PeterHauer, stop lying. If you had read the Quran and studied other religions, as many time as you proclaim to have, than you would not had made these statements. You said Islam is the only religion that banns other religion and encourages violence and murder. Following quotes are from the Bible.......

Jesus says that he has come to destroy families by making family members hate each other. He has "come not to send peace, but a sword." 10:34-36

Jesus says that those that believe and are baptized will be saved, while those who don't will be damned. 16:16

Whoever isn't found listed in the book of life will be cast into the lake of fire. 20:15
All liars, as well as those who are fearful or unbelieving, will be cast into "the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." 21:8

In John 8:44 Jesus says 'Jews, you are the children of the devil' (This one quote was the justification Hitler used to kill 6 million Jews in the holocaust)

Jesus is criticized by the Pharisees for not washing his hands before eating. He defends himself by attacking them for not killing disobedient children according to the commandment: "He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death." (See Ex.21:15, Lev.20 :9, Dt.21:18-21) So, does Jesus think that children who curse their parents should be killed? It sure sounds like it. 15:4-7

Jesus explains why he speaks in parables: to confuse people so they will go to hell. 4:11-12 (Why would Jesus(god) deliberatley want to send people to hell?)

Jesus criticizes the Jews for not killing their disobedient children as required by Old Testament law. (See Ex.21:15, Lev.20 :9, Dt.21:18-21) 7 :9-10

Jesus says that God is like a slave-owner who beats his slaves "with many stripes." 12:46-47 (In the Quran God is never stated as beating up His creation)

Jesus says we must eat his flesh and drink his blood if we want to have eternal life. This idea was just too gross for "many of his disciples" and "walked no more with him." 6:53-66 (Prophet Mohammad never forced people to turn to cannibalism!)

Homosexuals (those "without natural affection") and their supporters (those "that have pleasure in them") are "worthy of death." 1:31-32 (It is not stated anywhere in the Quran to kill the homosexuals)

The bloody death of Jesus smelled good to God. 5:2 (This is not the kind of God portrayed in the Quran)


My point is that you are a liar!!!!!! You didn't studied sh*t. I could send you tons of other quotes from the Bible which are a proof that Christianity is even more violent and fearing religion than Islam. But than agian their are stuff in the Bible that teaches good morals and peace as well. The Quran is the same man. Rather than emphasizing on the bad verses presented in the Quran, how about you look and obey the goodness revealed in the Quran. Every religion has its goods and bads. And this wanna be Robert Spencer is only propaganding the bad side of Islam. Islam is the religion of peace. Majority of us Muslims resent these extremists groups and suicide bombings. It is a grave sin in my religion. Islam does not want to take over the world. This is the view of the Muslim Extremist groups, not the typical Muslims like myself. We just want to live in peace. We don't hate jews, Christians, or any other religions because that is what our religion teaches us.

"... Those who believe (in the message of Islam), and the Jews, the
Sabaeans and the Christians all those who believe in Allah and
the Last Day and act righteously no fear shall come upon them"
(5:69)

"Whoever oppresses any Dhimmi (non-Muslim citizen of the Islamic state), I shall be his prosecutor on the Day of Judgment." (This is what Prophet Mohammad said, yeah the same guy who everyone is attacking as being the antichrist and starting the most evil religon)




















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Barenziah58 Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-28-09 12:12 AM
Response to Original message
17. Robert Spencer is than threat to world peace.
Robert Spencer is than threat to the world peace as he want than war between Islam and the west than war that Islam will win. I convert to Islam after 9-11 after thinking about it fore awhile. There are between 10 and 15 million muslim in america right now. About 75% of then are people in america who convert to muslim. By 2025 30% of the world population will be muslim and 25% of the world population will be christian. Robert Spencer will snear Islam as he fear change.
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George_Bailey Donating Member (49 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-15-09 06:14 PM
Response to Original message
19. What, No Hal Turner Show?
Guys like this really, really stretch the all-inclusiveness of the first amendment.

George Bailey
http://welcomebacktopottersville.blogspot.com/2009/02/d...
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-09-10 08:42 PM
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21. Deleted message
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