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trof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 05:59 AM
Original message
Sept. 11 widow sues the President
http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/local/6836362.h...
Ellen Mariani's husband was aboard Flight 175. She says government officials were negligent.
By Joseph A. Slobodzian
Inquirer Staff Writer

A New Hampshire woman whose husband died in one of the planes that hit the World Trade Center sued President Bush and other government officials yesterday, contending their negligence of airport security resulted in the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks.

In addition to President Bush, Mariani's lawsuit also names Vice President Cheney, Attorney General John Ashcroft, Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld, the Department of Defense and the Central Intelligence Agency, the National Security Agency, the Defense Intelligence Agency and the Council on Foreign Relations.



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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 06:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. Hooah!!
The widows and families of the Sept 11 victims are the BANE of the Chimpster. As a widow at one time myself, of a husband who died in an explosion at a chemical plant (It was THEIR negligence), I know the anger and pain they must be feeling, and the need for TRUTH and Honesty in such a case...
If anything forces the truth out of the Bush admin, these kind of lawsuits will force their hand.


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teryang Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 06:06 AM
Response to Original message
2. That's a lot of defendants
Edited on Wed Sep-24-03 06:07 AM by teryang
...for only one allegation of poor security at the airport. Somebody should get her complaints and publish them in their entirety.
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DemonFighterLives Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 06:37 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Yeah
Kinda touched on the whole crime network. Hopefully some answers will come forth.
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KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 06:46 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Sad To Say This Won't Do It
Unless this lady has some smoking gun this suit will end up in the trash-heap...it's just too vague from what I've read about specific charges and how these individuals were directly responsible for the death of her husband.

How I wish we could really find out what was going on that morning, but this isn't going to do the trick...we need someone with the guts within that regime to come out with documents or first-hand information of neglegence. The burden of proof, even though lower in a civil suit, just doesn't pass muster here.

Now if this woman was offered specific damages or other benefits from the government and then they failed to deliver, THAT would be an interesting suit...especially in an election season...showing how truly "compassionate" Repugnicans are. I could see a 9/11 widow and a Gulf Oil War/Iraq Invasion widow telling the nation how much "help was on the way" from this corrupt regime.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 07:36 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. Ah but one family already won a suit tying Saddam to 9/11
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KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 08:11 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. Did Saddam Testify? <G>
Kinda easy to get a conviction when the defendent doesn't show up. I don't think that's the case when you attempt to sue BushCo. I think they keep a squadron of lawyers on call to be airlifted anywhere at a moment's notice...like Florida or California.
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 08:14 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. No I don't think he was there
The judge said "barely" proved link, he was probably worried about ruling against them.
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 09:46 AM
Response to Reply #4
15. Lawsuits and research during the process
have a tendency to snowball...one firm or institution starts pointing the finger at another...and more and more information gets out...eventually, a number of agencies get smacked upside the head..
I hope this happens..and much more is revealed.
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damnraddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. There is the issue of negligence.
If she can show that security was defunded in the face of specific warnings delivered to the Administration that terrorists were planning to hijack airliners and crash them into buildings (which she very well may be able to do), that would seem to establish negligence on the part of the Administration. But look at the other side: if this gets anywhere in a court of law, even if it eventually loses or even gets thrown out, it may spark media coverage of the allegations -- that won't help the widow much, but it could hurt Dubya. Would the media show such interest? Not the media we have known for the last 3-plus years, but perhaps a media a few months from now when Dubya's popularity has dipped even lower.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Yep. Get John Ashcroft on the stand
'splain why you were flying charter please.
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KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #19
27. Don't Hold Your Breath On The Media
While I'd love to see how this regime squandered all the intelligence and other information left them by the Clinton Administration regarding terrorist threats and how there a lot of unanswered questions about this regime's actions in the run-up to 9/11, the media wouldn't touch it as it would mean they didn't do their jobs in the first place.

Unless there's some "Deep Throat"...a person or persons who the media can use as a reliable source...loaded with documents and tape recordings, this regime will skate on any critical examination of 9/11. Most have always regarded anything outside the "smoking Osama" acted alone with his 19 Iraqis as a conspiracy and would refute two years of reports.

Yes, it would be interesting should details leak on how lax this regime was about following terrorist leads and even complicity in helping Saudi flee in the hours immediately following the attack. I'd sure like to know why bunnypants kept reading "Itsy Bitsy Spider" 30 minutes after the first attack (scare the children...yeah, right) and who sent him on his cross-country plane ride...heading further from the danger, not towards it that day.

Right now all I care is that this regime is exposed for the growing laundry list of crimes and plunders of our national treasure and reputation. 9/11 is just one part of a regime that was hell-bent from the outset to push it's Neo-Con policies come hell or high water.
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Democat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 07:07 AM
Response to Original message
5. This is a ridiculous lawsuit! It's unconstitutional to sue the president!
Unless the president is a Democrat and it has to do with sex.

Off to Cuba with this woman.
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demnan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
6. The one obvious agency she left out
Edited on Wed Sep-24-03 07:27 AM by demnan
was the Department of Transportation and the FAA.

She might do better suing the FAA or Marion Blakley, or DOT and Norman Mineta. That way agency negligence could be exposed and there's where your smoking gun lies.

If the FAA was directed from above to do certain things, if NORAD were directed to not follow procedures the blame could then filter up to the top.
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dArKeR Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
7. Why has it taken so long to do this? When will the parents of a killed
soldier in Iraq file a 'Wrongful Death' suit against the same criminals?
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
9. Now THIS is a valid civil lawsuit.
*
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trof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 08:05 AM
Response to Original message
10. Naming the CFR...
A little over the top?
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 08:32 AM
Response to Original message
13. You GO ELLEN! You know I'm behind you 100%!
Ellen Mariani left a message on my answering machine on Mother's Day 2002. (I had written a letter to the Globe after reading about her and therein expressed my alarm at the situation and the government's apparent negligence, and how the victims basically should sue everyone in sight. Somehow she got a hold of the letter, and since I had not addressed it to her, the call was completely unexpected.)

The message was chilling yet also rewarding- she said: 'Thank You, Thank You so much for your support. (and now I paraphrase- to hell with the 'special master' appointed to award damages from the govt. fund) We are going to get to the bottom of this, and we are going to win.' THANK YOU!'

Like I said, I was chilled, thrilled, and in the end felt good about what I had done. soooooooooo....

YOU GO!!!
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Sick of Bullshit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Someone needs to send that woman a video
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mistertrickster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 09:46 AM
Response to Original message
16. Don't miss the point of this--the point is not to WIN the lawsuit,
it's to expose BushCo. lies in the process of discovery and just generally annoy and embarass the pResident.

That's what the Repukes did with Paula Jones, and that's what the Supremes hoped would happen when they overruled two centuries of tradition and precident by opening Clinton to nuisance civil suits.

It's time to send a message to right-wing maggots that what goes around, comes around.

BTW, let's send a few pennies to the widow. She deserves it.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. Like I said she said:
"We are going to get to the bottom of this"
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damnraddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
18. Finally putting the blame where it lies ...
(apart from the direct perpetrators). Dubya wasn't just asleep at the switch, he had disconnected the switch in the first place.
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genius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
21. I guess negligence of airport security is a good start
If she tried to allege what we all know, a jury who believes in their govenment might question the credibility of the case.
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NewYorkerfromMass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. I think "cockpit security" will be the real issue
they should never have gotten in there.
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trof Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. It's still the same old story:
"Testifying before the House Interstate and Foreign Commerce Committee in 1969, Charles Ruby (then president of the Air Line Pilots' Association) said that ALPA, along with airline industry and government agencies, had pressed for research and development of "satisfactory equipment capable of solving the hijacking problem, either by detecting weapons or other devices used by hijackers prior to their boarding an aircraft or disarming hijackers in flight. Several techniques and devices have been considered, including X-ray, radar, magnetometers, bulletproof protection, more effective cockpit door locks, anda means of surveying the passenger compartment by pilots."

"ALPAs leaders arent the only ones who took note of the unions calls for fortified cockpits and other security improvements. In October 2001, Chicago Tribune columnist Bob Greene, in a column headlined "Dont say that we werent forewarned," cited a 1970 letter from Ruby to the FAA asking for a bulletproof cockpit with electromagnetic locks and a sliding panel in the cockpit doors so pilots could use defensive devices."
https://www.alpa.org/alpa/DesktopModules/ViewDocument.a...

Isn't it sad that if these requests had been given serious consideration and study the World Trade Towers would still be standing? It's still the same old story, that of bottom line for the airlines and the government not wanting to assume the financial responsibilities for security. It's been going on for over 40 years.

There's an old saying in aviation that nothing will be changed until you kill enough people. I guess we've finally killed enough people.



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goobergunch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
23. These charges would be useful in drafting articles of impeachment (n/t)
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Pastiche423 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
24. Ellen was the 1st widow
I remember seeing on tv. In a short clip, she held out a rock and said, THIS is all I have left of my husband!

She was the feisty lady that called the government $$$ "shut-up" money.


She wants to expose the lot of them and I don't believe she will quit.

Go Ellen!
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pfitz59 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-03 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
25. I hope this sparks a torrent of lawsuits!
Ever wonder why Shrub is so hot for "tort reform"? His family is destined for bankruptcy should the truth ever get out!
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