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Reply #15: it's not mixed on board, the press has it wrong, it's just smuggled on [View All]

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Snivi Yllom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:24 AM
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15. it's not mixed on board, the press has it wrong, it's just smuggled on
Edited on Fri Aug-11-06 09:24 AM by Snivi Yllom
I think the press has it wrong, the chemicals would not be combined on the plane, but pieces of the bomb, meaning, explosive, detonators, timers, whatever, would be combined on board.

The TATP would have been made at home or a safehouse, then combined in some kind of stabilizer gel/liquid for transportation. What I think the press is misreporting, is that various bombers would have had various compents such as individually carryring bottles with TATP, someone would have had the disposable camera, someone had other pieces of the bomb. It's not a case of someone carring acetone, someone carrying hydrogen pyroxide, and someone else carrying beakers on board. I don't think it's physically possible to mix the chemicals under the duration of a flight, but I could be wrong.

You would not need much TATP to bring down a pressurized aircraft from 37,000.

TATP is a frequently used homemade explosive used by the Palestinians and was also used in the London bombings last year. It's relatively easy to make, however very unstable and dangerous to handle. Many have been killed or maimed making TATP.

If you have the bombs go off midway across the ocean, you put the planes at their maximum distance from an emergency landing if you only managed to damage a plane. The longer a damaged plane is in the air, it gives any surviving terrorists more time to do more damage, or to actually let the plane fail catastrophically. TATP violently expands as it detonates. In a pressurized airplane at 37,000 feet, overpressure in a plane could really do substantial damage via explosive decompression.

you can get the recipe

it's the real deal

Israeli invention detects TATP explosives
By: Israel Insider staff and partners
Published: January 27, 2005

A relatively new difficult-to-detect explosive material called triacetone-triperoxide (TATP), commonly known as acetone peroxide, is one of a group of explosives based on the unstable peroxide group of
compounds. It is increasingly being utilized by terror groups, who used it in the Dolphinarium Disco massacre, several bomb attacks in downtown Jerusalem, and the failed attempt to down a passenger plane by Muslim shoe-bomber Richard Reid.

One of the most alarming attributes of TATP is that it cannot be detected by bomb-sniffing dogs, making it easier to smuggle into airports and onto airplanes. It is also very easy to synthesize in clandestine labs, using readily available chemicals.

"To our great surprise," PET's inventor, Prof. Ehud Keinan, Dean of the Technion's Faculty of Chemistry, wrote in the Journal of the American Chemical Society, "we discovered that TATP is very different from all other conventional explosives in that it does not release heat during the explosion. It explodes by rapid decomposition of every solid-state molecule to four gas-phase molecules. This rare phenomenon, scientifically known as 'Entropic Explosion', is reminiscent of the rapid reaction that produces gas in the safety air-bags of cars during accidents."

Many people have been killed or permanently injured by accidents with acetone peroxide. It is widely used by people who want to make homemade explosives because of its low cost and ease of manufacture. They often have no idea of its extreme sensitivity, or they make it anyway solely because it's cheap and can be made in a refrigerator. There is a common myth that the only "safe" acetone peroxide is the trimer, made at low temperatures: "If one is making tricycloacetone peroxide, the temperature must be less than 10 C at all times, otherwise the product formed will be dicycloacetone peroxide, which is so unstable and sensitive that it has no uses in the field of explosives: dicycloacetone peroxide has been known to explode spontaneously." In reality, the acid-catalyzed peroxidation of acetone always produces a mixture of dimeric and trimeric forms. The trimer is the more stable form, but not much more so than the dimer. All forms of acetone peroxide are very sensitive to initiation. Organic peroxides are sensitive, dangerous explosives. The military does not use them because there are many much better alternatives. Even for people who synthesize homemade explosives, there are many far safer alternatives. Even nitroglycerin is not nearly as sensitive as acetone peroxide.

It is believed that Acetone peroxide was used as the explosive in the 7 July 2005 London bombings.<2> This however is debated by some conspiracy theorists, who believe government organisations may have synthesised such a story about use of acetone peroxide to add credibility to the official report. <3> However, it cannot be proved one way or another, and the fact still remains that this chemical compound may be used for such a purpose as terrorism.<4> It is alleged that Richard Reid (shoe bomber) was found with equipment that may have been used to cause explosions using TATP.
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