You are viewing an obsolete version of the DU website which is no longer supported by the Administrators. Visit The New DU.
Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login

Reply #12: Dear Autorank, you trueheart, you patriot, it's becoming so obvious that [View All]

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform Donate to DU
Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-05 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
12. Dear Autorank, you trueheart, you patriot, it's becoming so obvious that
Edited on Thu Dec-01-05 04:54 PM by Peace Patriot
Bush couldn't have won, I'm not even sure we have to argue it that much any more. I'm sure Americans WANT to believe that we as a people didn't vote for the killers of tens of thousands of innocent people (58% opposed to it before the invasion, Feb. '03), the torture of prisoners (63% opposed to it "under any circumstances," May '04), and the looting of our treasury (90% opposed to the deficit, early '05). I think Americans are just finding out, to their surprise, that we are all pretty much in agreement about Bush and his Cartel (60% to 70% opposition to every major Bush policy, foreign and domestic, over the last two years--not to mention Bush approval ratings so low prior to the election that Zogby said he couldn't win, and really tanking now).

People are looking for answers, and they don't need all that much convincing (in my read on things). If they don't know the facts about the 2004 election, they may just be a little puzzled how anyone in their right mind could have voted for Bush, and will be glad to find out that most other Americans aren't crazy.

So, I think you can (and should) simplify this post--for general use. I would suggest that you start it off with some real simple facts:

1) As the result of the so-called "Help America Vote Act" (HAVA), and a $4 billion boondoggle funded by Congress, electronic voting companies, run by rightwing Bush donors, gained control of our election system, with voting machines that use "trade secret," proprietary software, have no or inadequate audit/recount provisions, and are known to be very insecure and hackable. Two such companies, Diebold and ES&S, tabulated 80% of the nation's votes.

2. Late on election day, 2004, with Kerry ahead in the exit polls (scientific polls of voters leaving the voting booth), the corporate news monopolies doctored their exit poll data to fit the results coming from Diebold's and ES&S's secret vote tabulation software. This was not the normal adjustment of exit polls for election demographics. It was a very unusual--indeed, impossible--falsification of the numbers. It has been verified that the real exit polls showed a Kerry win by a 3% margin.


You don't have to use my wording (but feel free to). But you get the idea. It is not the naysayers that this should be written for. If they know the facts, they can make up their minds on the basis of what they know. It should be written (at the first level) for those who are looking for answers, but DON'T know the facts, and need a quick primer with clear explanations and links to sources.

You can make it as complex (and sardonic) as you like--for those with time and interest to read down through the detail--but keep the FIRST level of information clear, for each set of facts: WHAT are you talking about? HOW would you convey it over coffee to a friend?

Avoid using shorthand. Think: 1st grade (knows almost nothing). 2nd grade (knows what exit polls are; that Kerry won, etc., but hasn't followed all the details--may be coming back to the subject after cursory look). 3rd grade (knowledgeable believers, who may want to use the info; knowledgeable naysayers, who might be coming around). (Forget Freepers and idiots--a small minority here, and in our country.)

Let me give you an example (below). First set of numbers you provide. Not explained. What are you talking about? And I am a "knowledgeable believer, who may want to use the info." I studied them for some minutes, and I still didn't know. Finally, I guessed that you were talking about various polls that Kerry won. You never say that Kerry won them. All you have to do is add this**: "The naysayers continue their relentless attempts to mask the overwhelming evidence provided by confirmation of hundreds of pre=election and exit polls **THAT KERRY WON**..."


See (your text):


"The naysayers continue their relentless attempts to mask the overwhelming evidence provided by confirmation of hundreds of pre=election and exit polls:
1) Pre-election state. Total sample: 50 polls* 600 = 30,000
2) Pre-election national. Total Sample: 18 polls *1500 = 27,000
3) Pre-election 48.5% Bush approval. Total: 11 polls*1000 = 11,000
4) 12:22am state exit polls: 73,600 respondents
5) 12:22am national exit poll: 13,047 respondents."


Also, the set of numbers is confusing--and all a jumble. It has asterisked numbers (and I can't find what the * means) which makes it visually confusing. And I still don't know what "600 = 30,000" means in item #1 (et al).

Just a very simple word or two could make it clear. That set of numbers was a showstopper (and I'm a fan!). It stopped me from reading further, and started me writing these suggestions. (But I did go back and read more.)

So, just apply this principle--is all I'm suggesting: FIRST LEVEL statement is for the uninformed (and to be nice to us believers). THEN, you can get into all the esoterica about the attempts to debunk the exit polls (which will be of interest to only a few who followed those debates, or a few newbies who may need 'talking points' on it--in essence, none of their debunkings held up; that's all most people need or want to know).

I was just going to say: TIA makes often makes the same mistake, as to reaching the mathematically-impaired (those whose minds fuzz over at jumbles of numbers)--which is MOST PEOPLE--and suddenly I got what may be the joke...

...that this IS TIA. Now I'll have to check it out...and stop channeling your 8th grade English teacher.


My dream ticket for 2008: Gore/Kerry. ("poetic justice")
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top

Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators

Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC