Reply #10: I can partly answer that for you

[hyphenate]

though the answer I have is not very satisfactory even in the best of circumstances.

I was raised Roman Catholic, in Boston, no less. Old enough to remember the pride of the city when JFK was president. As I grew up, I became more and more disillusioned by the church, and by the time I was old enough to refuse to go to church, I had very serious misgivings about the church and faith in general.

On the other hand, my two best friends were very religious--Marje, who died in 2003, was a devout Catholic, and my friend Barb has become very evangelistic and fundamentalist. I've tried to argue the "moral" issue with both of them at different times, and both seem to insist that you can not be truly moral unless you have faith. I've told them, look at me--I have a conscience, I would never kill anyone, I'm polite and mannerly, and I sure as heck keep my opinions to myself if I'm in a room with raging RRRs. But they can not understand. They keep/kept telling me it was because I was raised with these values that I remain such today. They can not understand that most people with a secular background aren't raised to be monsters, that traits such as manners, politeness, and compassion are universal, regardless of your upbringing.

History shows us that religion and faith was used as a tool by those in control for thousands of years, whether it's been Xtianity, Islam, Greek/Roman mythology, or anyone of a thousand different beliefs. To make up for what was often a horribly painful or intolerant life, "Heaven" (or its equivalent) was created as an after-death "reward" for being good little boys and girls. As a result, religious faith is ingrained in many to explain why bad things happen, why those who are living now and who have gone through hell on earth, and why they remain "good" without any real reason. Their faith tells them that something better will eventually come, and that they will be rewarded when the time comes.

So they don't understand that people might actually be good and decent people without that punishment/reward scheme in their lives. I know one asshole freeper who said if he didn't believe in his faith, that he would not follow the tenets of goodwill. He said that it was his "faith" which contributed to his being a conscientious person.

I don't understand why so many of those in the RRR can't believe that people without faith are essentially good, regardless of their beliefs. I guess you need to clobber them over the head with a frying pan in order to dislodge that thinking from them, and even then, I doubt if they would be paying any more than lip service to the concept.