2016 Postmortem

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)

177. I think many are missing this: "What say DU. Campaign issue or not? Positive or negative?"

Tue Dec 29, 2015, 09:39 PM

Dec 2015

Dunno why, maybe because the indent doesn't show up on phones? Anyway my take is that it won't be an issue in the primary and will only be an issue in the general if the GOP candidate has done mil service but I can't think of any who have.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

235 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Sanders' stance on Vietnam continues to disappoint [View all] NCTraveler Dec 2015 OP

As a Viet vet myself, I'm happy to support a candidate who won't send troops .... Scuba Dec 2015 #1

Please show where I reference my feelings.. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #5

You wrote "I authored a column ..." with no excerpt tags. If you excerpted that then you .... Scuba Dec 2015 #8

Seriously? Now that's funny. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #15

The well-funded GOP attack-machine would crush him with this ... NurseJackie Dec 2015 #2

War monger Dick Cheney had five deferments. RDANGELO Dec 2015 #25

The well-funded GOP attack-machine did not attack him on it. NurseJackie Dec 2015 #31

Cheney had "other priorities," the shitstain. - nt KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #176

This will hit home with many Vets. leftofcool Dec 2015 #65

It raises questions that may change voters' minds ... NurseJackie Dec 2015 #72

Rather have a guy who stood against the war and didnt want others to have to go than randys1 Dec 2015 #108

Doesn't bother this vet. hobbit709 Dec 2015 #179

Right, cuz everybody want's war!! AgingAmerican Dec 2015 #213

That's an odd leap of logic. Whatever. Go with that. NurseJackie Dec 2015 #215

dissenters worked to end the war, bring troops home bigtree Dec 2015 #3

The hippie bashing op wasn't successful so now you're using the draft dodger smear? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #4

I punch no hippies and attack no draft dodgers. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #6

No you just post the articles and ask loaded questions. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #7

You now take issue.... NCTraveler Dec 2015 #11

And I've seen you rec threads with links to racist and anti-Semitic websites. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #12

You believe The Des Moines Register is... NCTraveler Dec 2015 #14

Nice attempt at deflection. Do you not remember rec'ing those threads? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #16

I'm not going to take part in your obvious attempt... NCTraveler Dec 2015 #17

Replying to you isn't "hijacking" the op just because you don't like what I'm asking. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #20

Facts are not right wing talking points. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #24

Fact: the author called Bernie a draft dodger in an op-ed beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #26

The fallout. Lol. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #30

Bernie called himself a draft dodger? Link? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #32

Big time fallout!!! Lol NCTraveler Dec 2015 #34

OMG. Bernie didn't run for President sooner R B Garr Dec 2015 #33

False claim/non sequitur/red herring/straw man beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #35

Ah, cartoon time. How typical. R B Garr Dec 2015 #37

It's your claim so it's your responsibility to prove it. Better get busy! beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #39

Explain why Bernie sat out 11 national elections R B Garr Dec 2015 #42

Nice try, you made the claim, it's not my job to disprove it. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #43

You're the Bernie fan who was on the attack R B Garr Dec 2015 #55

The burden of proof is on the person who made the claim: beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #57

You attacked NCTraveler and you hid behind R B Garr Dec 2015 #58

So no proof of your claim then? Very well, just as I thought. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #60

So you admit that your attack was false R B Garr Dec 2015 #61

"the one who asserts has a burden of proof to justify or substantiate that claim" beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #63

You attacked NCTraveler and you can't explain R B Garr Dec 2015 #64

Proof please: "Bernie didn't run for President sooner because of how the draft dodger status" beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #66

Explain why Bernie didn't challenge Clinton in 1992 R B Garr Dec 2015 #68

Proof please: "Bernie didn't run for President sooner because of how the draft dodger status" beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #70

Explain why Bernie didn't challenge Clinton in 1992 R B Garr Dec 2015 #71

Proof please: "Bernie didn't run for President sooner because of how the draft dodger status" beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #73

So you have no answer as to why you attacked NCTraveler R B Garr Dec 2015 #75

Bzzzt! That was your last chance. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #77

You can do it. Just explain why Bernie didn't challenge R B Garr Dec 2015 #78

Burden of proof is on you, but it's too late now. Thanks for playing. :) beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #81

Face it. This was over at your cartoon post way back. R B Garr Dec 2015 #87

No it was over when you made a claim you couldn't back up. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #89

My claim that you can't answer why Bernie didn't R B Garr Dec 2015 #95

Word salad-your claim:"Bernie didn't run for President sooner because of how the draft dodger status beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #98

Word salad yourself. You made a bogus claim R B Garr Dec 2015 #115

Wow. You really believe the right wing didn't smear Bill as a draft dodger? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #121

Laughable. You claimed that another poster was smearing R B Garr Dec 2015 #131

ARGLE BARGLE!!! beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #132

Cartoons!! Personal insults! Weird noises! R B Garr Dec 2015 #136

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2015 #206

2) is ad hominem treestar Dec 2015 #80

No it's not, she brought up questionable sources in post #11. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #83

Why did HILLARY sit out 2004, when she was NEEDED? John Poet Dec 2015 #225

Explain why there have been no female Presidents. R B Garr Dec 2015 #234

Maybe, like some of us, he believed What the Democratic candidates said during the campaigns. hobbit709 Dec 2015 #41

I agree. The Big Dog is great!!!! Nt NCTraveler Dec 2015 #38

surprise, surprise TheSarcastinator Dec 2015 #148

Nice sarcastinating. Nt NCTraveler Dec 2015 #149

going back to previous threads and keeping track of who recd what treestar Dec 2015 #76

Wrong, the op brought up sources first in post #11, that makes it relevant to the topic at hand: beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #79

Keeping enemy-lists, enemy-links, holding-grudges and doing deep searches, off-site strategizing ... NurseJackie Dec 2015 #86

Agreed. It is rather mean to make it personal and treestar Dec 2015 #96

It indicates a position of weakness ... NurseJackie Dec 2015 #129

Sure you do. Regular conservadem stuff from you. cali Dec 2015 #10

I'm pretty left for the party. NCTraveler Dec 2015 #13

When you wrote: guillaumeb Dec 2015 #92

I'd like to think that's true. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #94

Agreed. guillaumeb Dec 2015 #101

Don't forget the 'Liberals promise free stuff to buy votes' talking point. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #105

obvious because of the closer proximity on the ideological spectrum stupidicus Dec 2015 #137

Precisely. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #138

Maybe.... John Poet Dec 2015 #224

Some of them certainly are. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #232

I want a CIC who cares enough about our armed forces not to send Vattel Dec 2015 #9

That's my bottom line, right there. djean111 Dec 2015 #18

Everyone I knew was against the Vietnam War - BECAUSE OUR FRIENDS WERE BEING DRAFTED FOR A WAR in_cog_ni_to Dec 2015 #19

^^^ thank you, in_cog_ni_to ^^^ Hiraeth Dec 2015 #54

He got a college deferment, Sanders did also, Sanders got a marriage deferment, Clinton Thinkingabout Dec 2015 #178

Another poster calling him a draft dodger. Link to Bernie getting a "child deferment"? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #193

I don't think Sanders was ever really a conscientious objecter. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #21

Of course you would. n/t zalinda Dec 2015 #22

What a shock, so do Republicans when they call Bill Clinton the same thing. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #23

Quit hiding behind Bill Clinton to benefit Bernie. R B Garr Dec 2015 #118

What a bizarre post. Who would argue that Republicans don't call Bill a draft dodger? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #122

You said it was a smear on Clinton. R B Garr Dec 2015 #125

And it gets even more absurd. Buckle up, we're in bizarro world! beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #126

Face it. This was over at your cartoon way back. R B Garr Dec 2015 #133

"Exilain (sic) why Bernie didn't challenge Clinton in 1992 and 1996"? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #135

Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2015 #207

Your argument- if one can call it that- here makes less than zero sense. Warren DeMontague Dec 2015 #194

Right? They claimed Bernie didn't run against Bill Clinton because of his "draft dodger status". beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #198

Maybe not making any sense is trendy in some circles. Warren DeMontague Dec 2015 #200

Well calling liberals draft dodgers seems to be in vogue again, maybe it's a retro thing? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #201

There was an article from an Iowa Vietnam Vet. R B Garr Dec 2015 #204

"Hmmm. Wonder why........" Why don't you enlighten us? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #208

Tell you why an Iowa Vietnam Vet wrote an article R B Garr Dec 2015 #209

So you made it all up? Good to know, at least you're admitting it. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #210

You posted about 500 times in these threads. R B Garr Dec 2015 #211

More logic fail! beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #212

Ah on to cartoons I see. R B Garr Dec 2015 #214

I think you should just admit what it is about Sanders that is bothering you. Warren DeMontague Dec 2015 #219

My bets would be that this is about getting posts R B Garr Dec 2015 #220

Yeah, well, any time we get the old gang together Warren DeMontague Dec 2015 #223

Nope, still not making sense. Warren DeMontague Dec 2015 #218

take a wrong turn somewhere? G_j Dec 2015 #36

The cognitive dissonance is powerful in this one. earthside Dec 2015 #46

Stupid post: comparing us to TeaPartiers redstateblues Dec 2015 #228

Purity has nothing to do with it. earthside Dec 2015 #233

Cool story. n/t bvf Dec 2015 #48

Whenever I hear someone say "draft dodger" this is the image that pops into my mind: beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #50

Ni-i-ice... n/t bvf Dec 2015 #59

Grave dancer. DisgustipatedinCA Dec 2015 #109

Oh lookie! I have another stalker! MohRokTah Dec 2015 #113

"stalker" is a term self-pitying people use on discussion boards, grave dancer. DisgustipatedinCA Dec 2015 #114

More stalker talk from my stalker!!! MohRokTah Dec 2015 #116

says the guy who grave dances. DisgustipatedinCA Dec 2015 #117

And the stalking stalker stalks. MohRokTah Dec 2015 #120

just like Hillary's husband eh stupidicus Dec 2015 #139

Better to object to war than have the blood of innocents on your hands. nt RedCappedBandit Dec 2015 #199

Every day a new smear attempt. Some days more than one. hobbit709 Dec 2015 #27

I am sorry for your loss. - nt KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #175

Yep-Because VN Is THE fredamae Dec 2015 #28

Do you feel the same way about bill Clinton ? JI7 Dec 2015 #29

I wonder why the op won't answer your questions. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #40

A truly scurillous OP, a true profile in utter KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #186

Yes it was, but it backfired on her. The greatest page shows the backlash was swift and fierce. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #190

Vietnam was a useless and immoral War. wilsonbooks Dec 2015 #44

So he can't be president because he isn't a warmonger? AgingAmerican Dec 2015 #45

Aging, do you not realize there is something in between conscientious objector and... Nitram Dec 2015 #67

The Supreme Court may not recognize selective conscientious objection... Orsino Dec 2015 #130

I'm not talking about the Supreme Court. Nitram Dec 2015 #156

There are nuances to almost anything. Orsino Dec 2015 #158

Has Bernie ever clarified his particular brand of conscientious objection during... Nitram Dec 2015 #159

His statement in the story linked above is specific. Orsino Dec 2015 #161

Clearly Bernie objected to service in the Vietnam War. Nitram Dec 2015 #171

Interesting OP. Koinos Dec 2015 #47

yet another reason to support Bernie! Hillary is hawk, no thanks, we don't need to rush to war. bowens43 Dec 2015 #49

Fundamentally wrong premise of the article. earthside Dec 2015 #51

As a Millenials , I want a commander in chief that will not create more Vets simple Truprogressive85 Dec 2015 #52

Just playing devil's advocate, it could be argued that because Viet Nam was not a declared war, that still_one Dec 2015 #53

horn tooting goodness. Hiraeth Dec 2015 #56

The war in Nam was an immoral piece of shit nolabels Dec 2015 #62

I buried two friends in Arlington Cemetary Ichingcarpenter Dec 2015 #97

I'm a VN era vet. dgibby Dec 2015 #150

I broke my arm really bad as a teenager and stayed at Walter Reed Ichingcarpenter Dec 2015 #151

After three years in the Army they medically retired me nolabels Dec 2015 #217

I am so sorry for your loss - nt KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #187

It's a fair question to ask. ShrimpPoboy Dec 2015 #69

The right would of course make something of it treestar Dec 2015 #74

Fortunately we don't need the far right to win an election. kenfrequed Dec 2015 #84

The main reason I like Bernie is that I think he is far less likely to send to troops to war. Tierra_y_Libertad Dec 2015 #82

He should have tried unsuccessfully to join the marines, like Hillary did Doctor_J Dec 2015 #85

Yep, he was honest and didn't make up a story like she did. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #91

I admire your tenacity senz Dec 2015 #104

Thank you, senz! beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #112

Good to know senz Dec 2015 #123

Yeah that does come in handy. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #124

What your parents don't teach you, senz Dec 2015 #127

Can you believe that people are still calling liberals draft dodgers? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #128

Tax&spend, hippies, free stuff, freeloaders, commie/socialists, and now ... senz Dec 2015 #140

And the 90's! Remember how they tried to smear Bill Clinton using the same talking points? beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #144

You're awesome! ybbor Dec 2015 #164

Aw, thank you! beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #165

Then I'll keep posting ybbor Dec 2015 #167

hahaha!! 840high Dec 2015 #230

Desperate again, NCTraveler? Bernie was NOT a "draft dodger." What happened: senz Dec 2015 #88

I had no problem supporting Bill Clinton over the same issue in 1992 Proud Liberal Dem Dec 2015 #90

One of the reasons I support Bernie Bjornsdotter Dec 2015 #93

Vietnam was a glaring example of murdering people on both sides of the pond. daybranch Dec 2015 #99

Good to hear from someone who was there. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #100

The author is a female Ichingcarpenter Dec 2015 #106

I meant the right winger who wrote the op-ed. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #107

Beautifully stated, daybranch. So much truth in what you wrote. senz Dec 2015 #110

Your post brought tears to my eyes for the raw pathos and honesty of its KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #188

The 1950's called. They want their scare tactics and buzzcuts back. DisgustipatedinCA Dec 2015 #102

I am a Vietnam ERA vet... catnhatnh Dec 2015 #103

I don't see how amnesty undercuts the validity of taking refuge in Canada. Nitram Dec 2015 #160

Yeah-I follow your point.... catnhatnh Dec 2015 #172

Well I registered for the draft on my 18th birthday in 1970. Nitram Dec 2015 #216

Truly despicable and desperate. Good luck washing away that slime you have covered yourself in... AzDar Dec 2015 #111

Total agreement. senz Dec 2015 #141

FTW ! - nt KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #189

Like many young American men, Bernie knew the war was bullshit. jalan48 Dec 2015 #119

who's disappointed - warmongers and their supporters? stupidicus Dec 2015 #134

We had warhawks a pleanty in the the Bush Admin who never went to war. Agnosticsherbet Dec 2015 #142

Not sure if you were around during the Vietnam War but I was and democrank Dec 2015 #143

being a concientious mgmaggiemg Dec 2015 #145

so just to be clear TheSarcastinator Dec 2015 #146

Well, LWolf Dec 2015 #147

and the results are in! yuiyoshida Dec 2015 #152

Snopes documents Slick Willie's YEARS of deception/manipulation to dodge the draft. Divernan Dec 2015 #153

you might want to sit down for this, but most people consider Vietnam a bad move MisterP Dec 2015 #154

Hey! What division did you serve in during Vietnam, NCTraveler???? Romulox Dec 2015 #155

I have no problem with what Bernie did. Nor with what Bill did. But I suspect some people will. onenote Dec 2015 #157

Kick for those claiming they can't find this thread cali Dec 2015 #162

And the excerpt from the op-ed accusing Bernie of draft dodging beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #163

And another kick for the evening crowd beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #168

Second that kick and thanks for your help earlier! - nt KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #185

You're welcome! They are alerting on posts that link to threads so I didn't want to risk it. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #192

Turns out I already had the OP on Ignore, which explains KingCharlemagne Dec 2015 #195

Ah, that explains it. You are a wise person. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #196

K&R! stonecutter357 Dec 2015 #166

As a Vietnam combat vet I have no trouble with supporting Sanders. 4bucksagallon Dec 2015 #169

Being opposed to fighting stupid, destructive wars is a feature, not a bug. backscatter712 Dec 2015 #170

Ah the irony, I remember the attacks on Bill Clinton's avoidance of service. John Kerry said this at Bluenorthwest Dec 2015 #173

More words from John Kerry for the OP to digest: Bluenorthwest Dec 2015 #174

Thanks for the reminder, Blue, although I doubt the op will read them. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #191

Always happy to offer the information, the OP can't bear the facts and will never Bluenorthwest Dec 2015 #221

I think many are missing this: "What say DU. Campaign issue or not? Positive or negative?" ucrdem Dec 2015 #177

Any Clinton supporter posting this without mention of Bill and what he faced is either ill informed Bluenorthwest Dec 2015 #180

Okay but the question is how it will play in Iowa. ucrdem Dec 2015 #181

No, the question is as John Kerry asked it: Bluenorthwest Dec 2015 #182

A quote from Pat Buchanan at the '92 GOP convention regarding Bill Clinton: Bluenorthwest Dec 2015 #183

I look at it this way Depaysement Dec 2015 #184

What a bunch of crap. RedCappedBandit Dec 2015 #197

As if you were going to vote for him anyway. djean111 Dec 2015 #202

Oh come on, the op just wants to discuss the issue. beam me up scottie Dec 2015 #203

On the cusp of Gen Y and Millennials Tien1985 Dec 2015 #205

I encourage Team Clinton to run on a pro-Vietnam war platform. frylock Dec 2015 #222

LMFAO!!!! John Poet Dec 2015 #227

Honestly, incredibly sad post NC, just f'ing sad! 7wo7rees Dec 2015 #226

My primary vote goes to HRC but this shouldn't matter underthematrix Dec 2015 #229

Yeah my millennial daughters don't care about Vietnam in the slightest that war was long over Kalidurga Dec 2015 #231

Are people okay with…. ImaPolitico Feb 2016 #235