2016 Postmortem

Agnosticsherbet

(11,619 posts)

57. Going over the cliff isn't as permanent as you seem to fear.

Reply to Drunken Irishman (Original post)

Thu Dec 20, 2012, 12:51 PM

Dec 2012

(1) Increased taxes don't hit all at once, but over the year. This means that legislation can be passed to fix problems faced by the middle class and poor that are not linked with wealth tax cuts.

(2) Cuts to programs also do no happen instantly, and they can be fixed.

(3) Programs like food stamps and unemployment are among the ones that will be hit on day one, but Republicans don't seem itching to fix these.

(4) Cuts to Social Security and Medicare negotiated away to pay for tax cuts for some of the wealthy are a real disaster that takes money from the most vulnerable and gives it as welfare to people make more than $250,000.00 a year. Giving wealthy to the effluent of the affluent is a monstrous failure in civics.

If Republicans won't deal without hurting the poor, veterans, unemployed, and middle class so their wealthy donor base doesn't have to give up a few tins caviar that is a monstrous failure of civics. The problems with taxes and programs can be fixed within the first hundred days.

If they won't act responsibly now, lets see what the next Congress will do? We do not need to disassemble the social safety net.

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Highlight:

Admit it - many of you are just as guilty as Obama... [View all] Drunken Irishman Dec 2012 OP

My job depends on other people having disposable income... Agschmid Dec 2012 #1

the cuts proposed will slaughter the old and the injured veterans. Fuck them all. roguevalley Dec 2012 #37

It amounts to about $100/mo 20 years from now taught_me_patience Dec 2012 #38

There is a much "fairer" way to deal with Social Security. Subject all income to SS tax ... Scuba Dec 2012 #42

You are right Scuba. We do not have to cut Social Security. iemitsu Dec 2012 #56

And you think the GOP will agree to removing the cap? krawhitham Dec 2012 #66

great idea.. uh.. how do you get the GOp to vote for it? nt dionysus Dec 2012 #74

hardly "slaughter"? hopemountain Dec 2012 #67

And for those who lose unemployment benefits, that will mean ZERO income this month. n/t pnwmom Dec 2012 #71

Oh No? LiberalElite Dec 2012 #78

Well said nt One of the 99 Dec 2012 #2

Loss of income due to middle class tax increases will be far higher than chained CPI... phleshdef Dec 2012 #3

Exactly. n/t Still Sensible Dec 2012 #4

How about loss of savings due to market drops? brooklynite Dec 2012 #20

And a little ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2012 #29

I got jumped on when I suggested that some of DU failed civics. I stand by that statement and will Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #48

LOL I was actually accused of being "VILE!" on here for bringing up the word civics a day or so ago. phleshdef Dec 2012 #65

Give it a rest Doctor_J Dec 2012 #5

Why don't you give it a rest? Drunken Irishman Dec 2012 #7

There is no problem the Puritans won't refuse to acknowledge if it conflicts geek tragedy Dec 2012 #9

research more about the "fiscal cliff" Skittles Dec 2012 #14

And a lot of it isn't. Drunken Irishman Dec 2012 #17

Howard knows Skittles Dec 2012 #30

This deserves its own thread! janx Dec 2012 #64

The voice of reason and sanity. eom EmeraldCityGrl Dec 2012 #76

True ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2012 #31

This isn't just to make a point PoliticalBiker Dec 2012 #63

So, the big Medicare cuts in the fiscal cliff--those are going to hurt the super rich? geek tragedy Dec 2012 #8

+10000 Myrina Dec 2012 #46

+1 forestpath Dec 2012 #16

Apologists? And are all the people who are about to lose their unemployment benefits pnwmom Dec 2012 #72

Going off the cliff means Medicare cuts and tax increases for the working poor. geek tragedy Dec 2012 #6

I admit to saying go off the cliff... TDale313 Dec 2012 #10

thank you! Voice for Peace Dec 2012 #11

Blah Hydra Dec 2012 #12

Do you honestly think that no tax deal will be done come January? n2doc Dec 2012 #13

Yep, no way... TDale313 Dec 2012 #15

We already have a tax deal. The middle class tax cuts were passed in the Senate. The ReThugs in the Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #53

So basically MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #18

Pretty much. n/t TDale313 Dec 2012 #19

Don't you get it? Drunken Irishman Dec 2012 #21

If I'm gonna get kicked in the balls anyhow, catnhatnh Dec 2012 #22

Seems like only the 99% are getting kicked in the balls MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #23

From what I've read davidpdx Dec 2012 #24

for an Irishman who is drunk lillypaddle Dec 2012 #25

+1,000,000 ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2012 #26

Either way the "shared sacrifice" STILL won't be shared by the 1%. Obama will make sure of that. MotherPetrie Dec 2012 #27

Here! Here! graham4anything Dec 2012 #28

Obama IS betraying the elderly. But you're completely missing the point. The cliff IS coming forestpath Dec 2012 #32

The Republicans are taking us over the cliff high density Dec 2012 #33

No, dear, the guilty ones are the REPUBLICANS Warpy Dec 2012 #34

They don't care about collateral damage. They have their cherished 'ideals' to keep them warm. MjolnirTime Dec 2012 #35

As long as the Republicans really believe in the fiscal cliff (it doesn't exist except in Republican JDPriestly Dec 2012 #41

Remember when liberals were up in arms when JoeyT Dec 2012 #47

We can go over the cliff, and then do a middle class tax cut the next day, limpyhobbler Dec 2012 #36

The House Republicans refuse to pass the middle class tax cut bill that was passed in the Senate. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #49

Passing a middle class tax cut is the easiest thing to do in Congress. limpyhobbler Dec 2012 #54

If it's the easiest thing to do, then why won't the House Republicans even bring the bill to the Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #55

They won't right now because it includes tax increases for the rich. limpyhobbler Dec 2012 #60

The people of whom you speak, don't care. NYC Liberal Dec 2012 #39

The fiscal cliff was a Republican campaign ploy. They were trying to scare Americans into voting JDPriestly Dec 2012 #40

One Good Reason oldcrapdealer Dec 2012 #43

He "caved" to get an extension of unemployment benefits, as well as DADT repealed and a START Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #51

So he caved zipplewrath Dec 2012 #62

It could. JoeyT Dec 2012 #44

Always the voice of reason, DI. Thank you so much. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #45

Sounds like somebody is running out of rationalizations cthulu2016 Dec 2012 #50

by this logic, there was no point to re-elect Obama Enrique Dec 2012 #52

Going over the cliff isn't as permanent as you seem to fear. Agnosticsherbet Dec 2012 #57

I tried to make a similar argument above davidpdx Dec 2012 #69

With Boehner's failure to get even a token vote for Plan b passed... Agnosticsherbet Dec 2012 #70

I want to know why SS benefits are on the table when SS doesn't contribute to the deficit? CrispyQ Dec 2012 #58

I'm trusting Obama to balance everything and do what hurts the fewest people, and protects those at Hoyt Dec 2012 #59

I'll give you one more: Unemployment Benefits expire in 9 days MessiahRp Dec 2012 #61

+1. n/t pnwmom Dec 2012 #73

Taxes. This could affect everyone. LisaL Dec 2012 #68

I maintain the prediction I made on my show a few weeks back... stevenleser Dec 2012 #75

Thanks. renie408 Dec 2012 #77