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Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
43. OK, but the responsibility to prevent non-voting goes both ways:
Tue Sep 20, 2016, 05:20 PM
Sep 2016

Obviously, you're not always going to get what you want(nobody expects to instantly get everything), but there are more effective ways to help people want to stay in the game than the way we usually handle it as a party...the activists get stopped and disregarded, and they get told "you HAVE to vote for us anyway".

How about finding ways to say "we didn't do what you wanted this time, but if you stay with us, we will NEXT time"? or "After this election, we will listen to your ideas, treat them with respect immediately put you to work using those ideas to registering new to improve our showing next time, because you matter to us and winning matters to us and we can't win without you"?

How about, when legislation gets badly watered-down(like the healthcare bill)or abandoned(like card-check for unions), using that to spur people to fight for making things better, telling them "now, you can get to work and organize public support and effective electoral efforts so we can pass what you wanted this time in the NEXT Congress". Taking that attitude(rather than just screaming "you should have voted&quot would have made a massive difference in 2010-as would NOT conceding defeat in 2010 in the middle of August and NOT running national ads defending the programs Obama passed and featuring people who had benefited from those programs-and would make a massive difference in all future midterms especially. Winning midterms is about firing up the activists to activate the base...that is the ONLY thing that works. We can't win midterms if the party doesn't try to keep people stoked.

Finally, how about NOT treating activists, especially young activists, as if they owe it to us to shut up and know their place? Maybe actually listening to them and treating their ideas with respect, even if we can't always get everything they want done? It's not as though there was anything the Obama activists wanted in 2008(or the Sanders activists wanted and still want in 2016)that would harm anyone else in this party or would have been in any significant way unpopular.

I don't care what you think about me...I'm in for the long-haul...but it looks as if a lot of the people who run this party still care more about being the ones in charge than about things like expanding this party and making it more vibrant and more electable at all levels.
We are always going to lose if we look like a party of jaded middle-aged insiders who keep talking about "you meddling kids" like we're the unmasked villain at the end of every episode of "Scooby Doo".

Idealism and activism are not the enemy. The young are not the enemy. Change isn't the enemy. We need the demanding and the unsatisfied in our party. Having high standards and having people who care about those standards are the only things that make political work worthwhile.

This seems like a overreaction, no offense Charles Bukowski Sep 2016 #1
I hope you are right. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #2
+1 demmiblue Sep 2016 #18
The truth is ... NanceGreggs Sep 2016 #27
Don't know how it is, Burch, but every time I read one Hortensis Sep 2016 #62
+1! BobbyDrake Sep 2016 #63
Well said. I feel the same way. Condescended to. yardwork Sep 2016 #64
:) SO misguided. We are a magnificently diverse coalition Hortensis Sep 2016 #65
I agree with you wholeheartedly, Ken. NanceGreggs Sep 2016 #3
I don't want to go to that site. And there's nothing that would win over people Ken Burch Sep 2016 #4
And again it comes down to ... NanceGreggs Sep 2016 #6
Not coddled-and-placated...approached on the level of reason and respect. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #7
We saw this in 2000 Gothmog Sep 2016 #12
This year is different. This year, we have a much better platform Ken Burch Sep 2016 #20
Those who are planning to vote for a third party candidate or Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #30
By that logic, there's no point in even mentioning them. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #41
Those who are voting third party hate Hillary mostly. Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #49
There is no way to reason with some of these folks...and they don't belong here so we can't win Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #14
If you can't reason with them, you can't win them over through abuse, either. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #24
I don't give a damn about them. Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #29
I have actually never called out any supporter of a third party candidate although they deserve it. Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #31
Win them over? How about they grow up and support the D nominee stopbush Sep 2016 #19
"Why not try it" NastyRiffraff Sep 2016 #21
Actually, we've never tried it. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #23
That will never happen and Stein Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #32
Ok. Then point out that Stein said that. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #39
Here you go: Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #58
I meant use it as part of the argument for voting Clinton-Kaine. n/t. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #61
The primaries are over. JTFrog Sep 2016 #34
This has nothing to do with the primaries. The primaries are the past. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #40
Reason and respect? NanceGreggs Sep 2016 #25
!!! zappaman Sep 2016 #26
Agree 100%. Fuck that noise. NT JTFrog Sep 2016 #36
Amen NastyRiffraff Sep 2016 #45
Well said. nt JTFrog Sep 2016 #8
Brava! SticksnStones Sep 2016 #9
Wonderful Post as always. nt Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #16
You don't want to go to that site ANY MORE, I think you mean. BobbyDrake Sep 2016 #50
They wanted me to join(I knew some of them here), but I never did. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #53
So I'm supposed to take you at your word? Despite the content of your posts? BobbyDrake Sep 2016 #54
Yes, you are supposed to take me at your word. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #55
Sure, you don't HAVE to prove anything. It just leaves the evidence I have that you participated BobbyDrake Sep 2016 #56
I never participated in anything on JPR. I opposed HRC in the primaries, but never hated her. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #60
Another Great Post by Nance Gothmog Sep 2016 #11
I will say Armstead is doing just that at JPR...making the the case why one should vote for Hillary Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #57
And taking a lot of flack for doing so. NanceGreggs Sep 2016 #59
In danger of the Grifter-in-Chief rethug candidate. ffr Sep 2016 #5
A vote for stein or Johnson is a vote for trump Gothmog Sep 2016 #10
If just repeating that phrase worked, the Stein and Johnson numbers would be dropping Ken Burch Sep 2016 #44
People who are supporting third party candidates are Trump supporters Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #13
On this we can agree - K&R CajunBlazer Sep 2016 #15
I would also like to bring up the "hold her feet" comment..." Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #17
Progressives weren't to blame for that at all. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #22
"No one on the left was allowed anywhere near the Oval Office ... NanceGreggs Sep 2016 #28
It isn't about me. Stop always personalizing and trivializing. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #37
Uh, Ken ... NanceGreggs Sep 2016 #46
Nancy your posts rock. Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #48
The lesson is support your president. Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #35
I don't defend not voting. Ken Burch Sep 2016 #38
how do you expect anything to get done Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #42
OK, but the responsibility to prevent non-voting goes both ways: Ken Burch Sep 2016 #43
I don't give a damn about blaming. Demsrule86 Sep 2016 #47
Those who are thinking of voting third party this fall.... NCTraveler Sep 2016 #33
Your first complete sentence and last complete sentence really does say it all. tonyt53 Sep 2016 #51
Thanks Ken. If for nothing else the Supreme Court will be determined for the next still_one Sep 2016 #52
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